Mikeneko major label debut / vsinger project cancelled

[Anonymous No.]

https://p2y.jp/mikeneko-major-label-debut-under-the-name-koito-ria-on-pony-canyon-is-canceled/

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
do a flip

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Who?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
>wedding dress

[Anonymous No.]

I'm so tired with her that I don't even know how the fuck to react to mike news anymore.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Lol her whore and cat murderer behavior cost her the role

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790334
At this point she might actually do one (for real this time tho)

[Anonymous No.]

How the hell did Cover keep her in line for as long as they did? Loose cannon doesn't even come close to describing how unstable she is

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

It's not like she was a good singer or anything

[Anonymous No.]

she just can't find happiness bros...

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790435
Cover has some SSS tier tardwranglers

[Anonymous No.]

If Miguel kills herself, Pekora will fall into a spiraling depression.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790486
honestly me neither but this is kinda "embracing the allegations" levels of depressing

[Anonymous No.]

I was Reading Oyasumi Punpun and I had a dream where I was Punpun and Mike was Aiko... and the ending was quite similar

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
To the surprise of absolutely nobody

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
She can use this against mafu, Isn't it?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
bitch stole rushia's design too

[Anonymous No.]

they should just leave her alone, really
how can she not leave the internet after all this shits?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790752
half agree at the same time i do want her to take some meds which is painful coming from a anon that can't get an appointment with a therapist

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790752
Same reason Chris Chan never left.
Attention.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790752
Leave the internet and do what? You know why almost nobody's graduation is a real graduation? Because nobody has any ability to do anything else other than be cute online.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790592
I'm going to make sure that doesn't happen.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790945
Say it ain't so...

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790752
Looking at her latest cover, I think she'll be fine.
She already got her revenge lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791025
revenge for what? against who?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790752
First off, she’s never going to want to get a real job after all this shit so she’ll keep being a lolcow as long as simps keep paying. If DSP can keep kicking on then a cute Japanese bitch will be fine. Secondly she’s hot enough that dudes will still fuck her despite being batshit insane so she doesn’t have to even try to be normal.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791076
Mafu lol
No proof, I'm just basing it on both of their latest songs

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790697
She can't because they're saying it's not because of him.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
>Please note that the decision to cancel was not due to reports in some weekly magazines, or any disputes in the person's personal life.
DYRBI?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790435
The termination might have sent her spiraling in all honesty. She might have been manageable in 2022, but at this point no wrangler can tangle with this tard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790945
Anyone can do low skill manual labor.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791226
I think the court will decide that, not them

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791375
The court won't be deciding shit because she is not going to go against this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791284
ayo who's cookin copium around here?..

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Honestly massive respect for Cover, their management must be actually the best if they can deal with this girl for that long

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791401
Aren't they in the middle of legal battle?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790435
S-tier managers

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790435
They didn't. They just tolerated her shit and didn't let too much of it show in public. In the event of mental episodes they could just delay or even cancel most things silently because they don't typically announce things before they're ready.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791582
Her legal battle with mafumafu has no effect on her record deal getting cancelled.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790752
She still makes insane money as an indie believe it or not.
Her career as a serious vtuber might be forever over, but her indie gig still more than pays the bills

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791226
the alien still has connections with the music industry, so it's certainly him trying to "talk" Pony Canyon out of the deal because he's dead set in ruining Mike's career.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791748
He's not trying to do anything. She doesn't have any deal anymore.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
https://twitter.com/95rn16/status/1785234995055120767
WHITE TEXT
BLACK BACKGROUND

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791743
It doesn't fund the kind of lifestyle she wants to live though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
>>74791830
IT'S OVER
>IT'S OVER
IT'S OVER
>IT'S OVER

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791830
It's over

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791830
hahayai that was fast i just woke up to this

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791845
It does but she keeps funneling money into a legal black hole of suing her antis. Remember when she hired an army of lawyers for a lawsuit that ultimately led to nothing?

[Anonymous No.]

annoucement on may 1st

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRldyu2N-SY

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791707
What I'm saying is, If she uses it against him.
The court will decide if its valid not them

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791830
>>74792165
She will cry, claim her dream has been ruined and then next week she’ll do a stream where she shows off her thighs and acts like nothing happened. There may be another round of suicide baiting in the middle.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791748
Just like the time she tried to get into that Apex tournament a lot of Mafu’s friends were involved with, even Soraru was there only for her team to be kicked out less than a day after being announced.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791707
It does though, this deal doesn’t get cancelled if not for the Mafu shit storm. Mafu is significantly more connected than she is. It’s just a question of whether or not she can prove it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792407
You don't know that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791342
Half of these girls would die attempting to lift a 12pc display of soup cans on to a shelf.

[Anonymous No.]

shrug

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792536
Manual labor isn't just heavy lifting. She has claimed she was washing dishes at a cafe before so she can just go back to doing that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790486
She should've just retired after 2022 and married one of her richer gachis or something but she just can't let it go

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792576
She makes way more money from her paypigs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792858
For now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790381
she can't keep getting away with this

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792935
She will. I don't know how she does it, but she's some kind of semen demon who miraculously escapes with her audience no matter what happens.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792976
Sunken cost

[Anonymous No.]

As long as she keeps showing her sexy body I will keep giving her money.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793052
This part actually baffled me. She pulled off the "NOT PETTAN" gag so well for so long, that since I never bothered to look deeper, I thought she actually was flat.
Instead she's fucking stacked like a goddess.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790404
Mike never kill cat but Mfmf killed her old cat by accident.

>>74790519
That was Coco and she became out of control after Coco graduated.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793171
god gave her the nicest body with a price of her sanity.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793343
>That was Coco
This is possible. But Coco was a westerner with the exact same mindset of many westerners that she would push the envelope of what was acceptable as much as possible. When Cover put their foot down finally she couldn't handle the pushback and bailed. Her being friends with Rushia outside of a forced genmate relationship shows her bad character more than anything.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792789
She wouldn't settle for anyone below the alien. Which means she will be alone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793484
Emotionally, maybe. She sure didn't have problems getting one night stands and side pieces.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793379
The most unfortunate part is her face. Bitch looks like a fucking rodent.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793477
cry more bugboi

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793613
Nijishojo faggots aren't welcome anymore on this board, cry moar.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
>most fucking loyal audience in the world
>insanely talented
>great looks
>banger of a voice
>was considered the strongest GFE vtuber in the world
>was one of the richest vtubers ever
>was in best vtuber company in the industry
>was even offered a 2nd chance by another smaller company despite her self sabotaging herself so bad
>was given a 3rd chance by a voice acting agency despite her being blacklisted now by every japanese company
HOW THE FUCK DO YOU FUCK THINGS UP SO BADLY DESPITE GIVEN SO MANY TALENTS AND OPPORTUNITIES

[Anonymous No.]

JAV debut when?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793639
ching chong to you too

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793639
Some people still think it is 2021 and the yellow menace shit works on people still. It is cute they still try to defend their whore though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793685
Hopefully soon, or at least gravure.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793343
>Coco
Nope. She was definitely one of her tardwranglers though but not the only one. You basically have hags like Mio and FBK plus Marine to keep her in line. Also, the fame and money definitely went a long way in keeping her out of trouble. Don't get me wrong though, she was definitely a ticking time bomb and, in hindsight, no amount of tardwrangling would've prevented the incoming explosion of the Mafumafu marriage. Maybe they could've kept a lid on it a bit longer but there was too many moving parts to keep it sealed forever. Worst case scenario would've been Rushia doing an oopsie AFTER Cover's push to expand their IP ala typemoon (TCG, games, Holoearth) which would've made delisting all of her associated media all but impossible.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793649
Undiagnosed mental illness

[Anonymous No.]

She needs a patient caring wealthy husband.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Vwhorefags seem to be quite angry with mike for bringing shame on Vshojo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793649
at this point even orca gave up on her
even the biggest if unicorns and saviorfags cannot help her anymore

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793649
>insanely talented
>great looks
>banger of a voice
I don't know who you're describing, but it sure as hell isn't Miguel.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793845
>Vwhorefags seem to be quite angry with mike for bringing shame on Vshojo.
They are currently trying to deflect from the doxxing problem in western vtubing that vshitshow pioneered.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793879
What are you talking about?
https://twitter.com/orca_fandead
Even sakana who people thought got tired of her still liked the tweet announcing her latest cover.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793845
Honestly no we did try to save her as we always do with stray talents but she never really did truly interact with the girls outside of kson and she streamed NOTHiNG but APEX. Vshojo is full of controversial mentally ill women but she is on another level. Nothing against Nazuna and so is most of /vsj+/ they still want her to succeed after leaving but she was really quite unsaveable even Henya wasnt able to reach her. You cannot save someone who refuses to be saved

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793939
i didn't know depressed NOUSAGI and HOLOLIVE historian are vkekjououou fans

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791341
She's just a single hot jap menhera hag. You severely underestimate the sheerwillpower of the average tardwrangler.
>t. ex-unionist from a hospital union that had to tardwrangle affiliates during the pandemic.
Do you have any idea how it feels to have to wrangle a whole damned department that's currently going insane out of overworking and paranoia?!
>I've literally seen affiliates climb into a partner's desk and scream at her like giant toddlers.
>Half the time you had to go full drill sergeant stereotype from the films just to be HEARD much less listened to.
>more often than not you had to do this while you yourself were about to break down for probably the same reason, because don't think we weren't overworked, scared and locked up just like they were, but SOMEONE HAD TO FUCKING STOP THE RIOT AND THAT SOMEONE WAS YOU.
Do you understand how hard it is to stand in front of dozens of nurse techs who are well past an average human's breaking point and have to explain that no, we don't have masks today because the civil guard came and sent them to madrid because we're not a priority since we don't have a peak going, so they're gonna have to do their job maskless in the middle of a pandemic, and yes we know its fucking awful but no we can't do shit about it so suck it up buttercup?!

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794219
No one pretends that what those faggots do is right. The current trend with vshojo is to claim that the vtubers themselves want PL posting to occur.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794293
>No one pretends that what those faggots do is right
doxxagi has like 100k subscribers

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794356
And?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794385
that's not "nobody", that's 100k holofans who are ok with him selling holomembers' personal information

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794423
Where's the proof that his subs are "holofans"?
Here's a vshojofaggot that was seething on this board about "holofans" not PL posting on twitter https://twitter.com/search?q=from%3AInsertCoin57848+holo+OR+cover+OR+hololive&src=typed_query&f=live

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794423
>every single doxxsagi subscriber is a holofan
May I remind you where a large chunk of fucking nijiEN fans hang out

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794423
how did that faggot come back anyways didn’t he have a meltdown because people turned on him when be doxxed gura and locked it behind a paywall?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794468
I didn't realize this faggot had been posted about on this board before
https://archive.palanq.win/vt/thread/70061731/#70062340
https://twitter.com/keklord1256/status/1762074645107261592

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794468
>entire identity is based around being a holofan
>posts videos about how hololive is the best and le vshoujou sucks
gee i wonder who watches his videos

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794681
tourists and dramamongers from the "commentary" and documentary community, actually

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794681
Yeah POKA was also totally a hololive fan because he said he was.

[Anonymous No.]

all of this wouldn’t have happened if she just Shut up and avoid yabs after her first major yab

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794733
sounds like the average thirdie from /#/
>>74794765
who

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794829
>vshojofaggot is a newfag
lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794850
sorry i'm not up to date on your bvtm twitter drama

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794931
You vshojo faggots are the ones who love bvtm though. The guy I pointed out earlier was always replying to him but deleted all proof of it and changed his @ after I pointed it out to him https://archive.palanq.win/vt/thread/71739214/#q71772217

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794850
not everyone knows or cares about mikey to know her whales and personal antis you dumbfuck

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793879
Proof he gave up on her?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795019
You're so fucking new it's getting almost sad. Just tell me, when did you come here?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793649
BPD is a hell of a personality disorder

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793746
This is pretty correct. One thing to remeber is that with her mental problems, it's manageable, if the stress is kept in check.
With her termination and what followed stress levels were high, which sent her onto a uncontrollable self destructive path. Add to that the failing mariage, and other stuff (defamation by antis). You have an uncontrollable monster, because she created an environment of constant stressfactors that lead her to do more stupid shit and thus create new stressfactors.

She needs help, but at this point she likely has lost a lot of goodwill from the people who'd help her (Holomem, kson, etc.). This is the point where only intensive professional help in a controlled environment can do something.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793649
Her right move imo is just to lay low and marry one of her few remaining retards start a family and try not to kill her child like what she did to her cat

[Anonymous No.]

I still can't believe there are people fucking stupid enough to enable her bullshit even after everything came to light. You could fuck their GF in front of them and cum inside. Then with it rolling down her leg she would say she didn't cheat and they would say "of course not"

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795203
That's not going to happen because she loves her audience too much. Unironically.
Or to put it another way, she loves the attention from them too much.
I think it's pretty clear by now after years that there was no 'shrewd calculation', no 'milking paypigs for some other goal', she is just like this. This is who she is. A sane mastermind would not throw away huge swathes of her audience and then come back to them like nothing happened.
It's refreshing, in a way.
Well, surely at least the anti-unicorns who promised they'll support her even if she's attached are giving her their utmost, right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791748
>>74792338
EOPs don't understand the kind of cancer Mafu is.
He is pretty much the femboy bussy version of trainwrecks. He has loads of connections and enough small-dog syndrom to use them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795466
>to not throw away hordes of her audience
Did they not mind her joining an apex tourney on a team with guys?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791284
Her ex-husband is involved with Pony, so it probably was.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790435
>How the hell did Cover keep her in line
They didn't. All the shit she did was when she was under cover contracts. Cover are good at covering things that's why you'll never know why mel was terminated and why it happened in the first place.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795466
She's not milking paypigs for a goal, she just milking them straight up. That was the plan from the very start. She just wants money and attention.
Don't mistake her being afraid of other female streamers as love for her fans.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795574
And mike is the female version.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793649
>was even offered a 2nd chance by another smaller company
Vshojo is not a small company.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795768
Yes they are.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793845
inventing scenarios in your head

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795768
Voice Ore is though

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793707
do zhangs really?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795768
Vshojo is small, but for their size their success is comparatively huge.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795768
smallER

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794285
I was just doing catalog tourism, but then I saw this post and, goddamn, solidarity fist to you brother/sister.
We had to stand workers up in front of hostile reporters and say, "No, our union members are not abandoning sick, mentally disabled people to die. They're being told not to show up to work while they literally test positive for COVID-19. The other 50% are in there working without masks because they took them all for the old-age homes."

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795045
I heard he is not her biggest paypig now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795719
Yeah, she doesn't give 2 shits about them and never has. She just loves the money for doing next to nothing and more so the attention. The only possible way to rehab her is to work at McDonalds on the night shift

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796186
that would be quix

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790435
they have top tier hags that constantly control her and sometimes they took advantage of her menhera state and fuck her

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796186
He oshihenned to Chloe, but still throws some pity toward Mikeneko.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796212
She can do JAV. There are lots of JAV with old women.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793343
>by accident
dyrbi? the guy has been actively trying to ruin her life. i believe mike is probably just a nice girl who's mindbroken after being abused.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796740
>i believe mike is probably just a nice girl
So you haven't seen the old clip where she's getting told that she's promoting a potentially illegal app.

[Anonymous No.]

I actually feel a bit bad for her now.
I... I can... maybe.. maybe I can fix her?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796740
she married the man, told him to buy her an apartment for herself, and told him he couldn't live with her

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796883
No, that one is too broken. We don't need another needless casualty.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796740
She's nice... If she can do everything her way and however she wants to without any sort of resistance or consequence no matter how far everyone else sees it coming. Then you're immediately a hanten and the gloves are off

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795635
How does that freaky alien nigga even have connections everywhere

[Anonymous No.]

>>74797146
he's actually successful, unlike Mike

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796740
Someone who does GFE while getting married behind her fans' back is peak scumbag behavior. If she's actually nice then she should've been honest with her fans and dropped the GFE before she got married. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74797146
He's japanese-youtube old blood.
He's equivalent to guys like JackSepticeye or Markiplier and co. in the west.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795768
he meant smaller than holo ESL-kun

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796910
He bought the apartment out of his own volition according to himself so that they could live together and she wouldn't have to worry about him cheating, but once she moved in she didn't want him there.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796883
nah shes a total wreck I suggest you just get a better newer vtuber

[Anonymous No.]

>>74797483
Gfe fags can’t be this delusional can they?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74798080
Just look at >>74795045. Some are that delusional.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796443
He's still very active when it comes to her even if he gives her money.
I would only consider it oshihen when his attention is divided in the similar proportion to sakana.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74798283
>even if he gives her money.
*less money

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796883
It's over, we can't fix that damage.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791136
>Attractive
Wut? The only picture I know of was a heavily photoshoped photo from her social media that looks like a skinwalker wearing synthetic human skin. I would rather go dating monsters in Silent Hill than this thing

[Anonymous No.]

>>74798283
i'd argue that other fans are more involved than he is

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Next stop is a jav career.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74796740
bait used to be believable

[Anonymous No.]

>>74798457
His twitter activity is pretty much half and half between the mike account and chloe account and he still watches all of her streams. He's still doing the exact same thing he has always done but with lower superchat amounts.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74798570
that's what i meant, there are other people more into her now, various jp's, various eop's, whatever quix counts as

[Anonymous No.]

>>74799020
He was never the most dedicated one. He just stood out due to writing a wall of text akasupa every single stream. I think meganewakame was the top donor in her twitcasting while she was still in holo and he bailed pretty soon after her firing if not even before it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74799411
megane is still around i think, just very very subdued

[Anonymous No.]

>>74797483
Technically she did; she stopped saying I love yous on stream for a period of time. Then the marriage went to shit and she went back to it

>>74799411
He lasted until around early 2023 before dipping

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Who could have seen this coming?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74799655
>>74799773
Really? He deleted his account pretty early on but I guess he reactivated and changed his @ so I just assumed he was forever gone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792299
Don't forget Apex collab with some sexpests.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74799882
He heraru'd multiple times and deleted the account then, but left for good after a public on-stream argument about something I don't remember what, probably when she promised to gift something for the top 20 donators and never delivered I think

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800170
>heraru
I saw someone mentioned someone called SirHeraru or something. Did he leave for good?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800170
i remember when quix was smugly talking about what he had won over the japanese winners. the japanese winners got donuts or starbucks giftcards, where as the kaigai got pics of her. this was the first instance of him admitting to her dming him frequently.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800170
I see.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800320
that is the one known in public as vegeta

[Anonymous No.]

>>74799655
Megane had a massive falling out with her last year over her failing to send a new year's card to her top 5 donors after he went all in on paypigging to take the top spot. He fought with her about it during a stream and then immediately dropped her. He was replaced by Akhevan, who left back in December due to her sending him psycho DMs and accusing him of things he didn't do by name on stream. Quix has been the biggest paypig ever since Akhevan left.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800674
i remember akhevan. she leaked his dms more than once. first on her nazuna account, blamed him for something if i remember. then leaked that she had been dming him in secret and that he was at fault for something she had done.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800320
He's gone. Her response to the mafu news confirming the marriage made him feel betrayed so he made a few tweets shitting on mike and then got blocked by her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800674
>sending him psycho DMs
What the hell? Qrd?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800802
Was he one of her top paypigs?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795574
Bro its 2024, trainwrecks aint got shit. Wake up grandpa.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800867
I never kept up with her or her fans that much so I don't know. I only know of what little I looked up and came across here.
I know that he was definitely one of her biggest defenders here though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800823
she blamed him for her lack of success, and some other stuff

>>74801000
he wasn't one of her biggest paypigs, but he was one of her biggest defenders

[Anonymous No.]

>>74791342
She has a heart condition which is part of the reason all the choreography in Fan Fun Island was so shit so no she can’t

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801000
>>74801034
>one of her biggest defenders
How did you know he was /here/?
>>74801093
Can she do JAV with her heart condition?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801132
he posted a screenshot of his tweet from his account, showing the statistics. since it showed the stats, we knew it was him

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801093
her heart condition just gives her anemia anon, she's not victorian romance novel protag dying of consumption

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801132
https://archive.palanq.win/vt/thread/64182125/#64195631

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801269
was he related in some way to that one nekofami, arigathanks?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74797780
awright, I'll go fix kyOresu instead

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801389
You have a chance to fuck her if you do it right.
Mikeneko is impossible unless you look like twink aliens.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801132
Her heart condition didn't stop her from cucking him on his wedding night and fucking other males

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800823
She accused him of cheating on her, blamed him for her declining numbers, and openly speculated about him being responsible for anti posts on 4chan and twitter during her streams. The worst was saying he sent threatening DMs just after Henya raided her during a Nazuna stream. She apologized and admitted it was a lie the same day during a members only twitcast while crying and begging him to not leave her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801439
All you need to get inside of her pants is Money that's it.

[Anonymous No.]

did she really kill her cat?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801643
Easier than becoming a twink alien, right? Just work and save money for her pussy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790519
yagoo told her to close facebook because it was a liability, she did like a good girl.

[Anonymous No.]

or OR OR OR maybe just MAYBE COVER was in the WRONG!

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801598
NTR theme JAV when? She has talent and expereince to do it rumao
>>74801609
Kek, she deserves it.
>>74801996
If only Yagoo was there when she had that Discord yab.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802040
Ok, how?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801378
I have no idea.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802040
Great, now simply prove it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801439
>>74801643
nah she looks even more closed-off than ever these days, she barely talks now which is sad
probably paranoid over stalkers which is fair

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800120
Anon SHE is the sexpest.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802086
Reminder that the Discord yab is her fault, because SHE demanded mfmf update her all the time because of how paranoid and jealous she was

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795768
12 talents and probably twice as many staff, at best, is objectively a small company

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Mega based

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802506
The 24/7 messaging was mafu's idea but he came up with it because she wouldn't stop accusing him of cheating.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802506
Reminder that it was his suggestion and that he got jealous of her listening to Eve's - another utaite's - songs. They're two peas in a pod

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795071
This. BPDs will destroy everything good in their life, and anyone around them, to avoid addressing that core wound.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802506
>>74801598
Mafu sent her text "Mike-chan, I'm coming home~"
Mike was fucking her boyfriend then replied "NO YOU CAN'T COME HERE!!!"

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802337
I thought that was Matsuri

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
i unironically hope she kills herself

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802506
>>74802724
>>74802797
Reminder that these are people in their 30's imagine that right now

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Complete and utter victory for karma once again

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802724
Mafu wanted to come clean with the fans too but rushia was adamant on keeping their marriage a secret because she had broken a record of merch sales with her engagement rings that she sold to unicorns and gachikois and that would only spell disaster for her career. I wonder if cover knew and if they knew why did they okay something as unethical as this? Like you think they would be aware of who her audience consisted of. But I guess making money out of impotent fools was more important.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804110
>engagement rings
Did Cover offer a refund after that yab? She was not wrong, they were forever engaged to her because she had a husband at that time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804190
They did I bought her nendo with the money

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802724
Which he was, think she caught him with another girl at his house or something

[Anonymous No.]

>people being surprised at girls fucking up everything served to them on a silver plate
I mean, how long have you all been on /vt/ now? Come on.
If anything, it just proves that Ru..., I mean A... I mean Mike got away with everything.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804190
yeah they offered a general refund on rushia merch

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802834
So true, anon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804386
She said he raw dogged both aqua and shion at the sametime but considering who Mike is everytime she has said something it always been a confession, she likes to project a lot. So I'm going to guess she had a threesome with 2 e celebs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804515
She was accused of hanging out with "Guy C" or whatever so that may be the truth after all

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804110
>Mafu wanted to come clean with the fans too
I don't necessarily trust him when he says that because she said the exact same thing and they both had a clear motive to keep it hidden, but him saying that isn't a totally obvious lie as it is when she said it since he at least attempted to stabilize the relationship.
>I wonder if cover knew
They already said they don't care about personal relationships. Gachikoi pandering doesn't mean that someone is not in a relationship.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804190
Cover didn’t offer refunds until Rushia got the boot if I recall right, none of this information about marriage to someone else was known at the time. They also offered refunds for Sana and Mel’s merch that was on sale at the time, so I don’t think Rushia’s situation was unique. Hell, I think Coco was the only one with a unique situation where she and Cover agreed to sell her limited merch again one last time to screw over scalpers before she left.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804824
His fake acting of "surprise" in korekore revealing mike's name is pretty obvious, though whether that's because he's a liar or because he's just so done with her bullshit he doesn't care anymore is anyone's guess

[Anonymous No.]

>>74805006
Or maybe he knew deep inside that it was mike doing this. So he really wasn't phased after having his suspicions validated. When you marry someone as volatile and crazy as Mike you have to assume that the person would do just about anything to get what she wants. The truth behind this is. Mike married him because of his fame and money he to her was just a trophy husband she knew a lot of women wanted him and would even kill themselves for him but she was the one he married and the one he comes home to at night and that would make a lot of kpop fujos seethe which is what she wanted. Mafu isn't a Saint either because just like rushia he was also taking advantage of mentally ill women and also sold them engagement rings around the same time rushia had announced her rings. He was cucked and cheated on but they both deserve each of other both are pieces of lying shit.

[Anonymous No.]

I have a friend with BPD like mikeneko. Something I realized about these people is deep down they enjoy being a mess. BPD people will say "ohh I hate my life" all the time, but you will never see them take the steps to genuinely change themselves because they just like being a trainwreck. Their brains are so cooked that they'd rather become homeless, a drug addict, prostitute, hated, etc. than to take pills & try to control their emotions

[Anonymous No.]

>>74802583
Hololive is smaller than Nijisanji then

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795705
you already post this on twitter sister

[Anonymous No.]

>>74805994
>talking about VShojo
>starts comparing Hololive and Nijisanji for no reason
???

[Anonymous No.]

>>74805994
NTA, but yes? I doubt anyone would argue that Cover isn't smaller than AnyColor (lower networth at the very least, and perhaps fewer staffs too although I will need to look this up). The affiliated groups (namely Hololive and Nijisanji) and their popularities, on the other hand, are different things altogether.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74807696
Cover definitely had less employees than Anycolor for a long time but the development of Holo Earth might have changed that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790334
fpbp

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804495
except Doki is getting treated, while michael isn't.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74794293
you're a massive retard. Ironmouse thinks that PL being automatically treated as a taboo is bad, and she wants to leave it up to the talent to either reference it or not. or do you see her "out" Henya any time soon? yes, it's an open secret, and no, she still doesn't want the PL association to be there

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810620
You're a massive retard. Your fellow vshojofaggots constantly claim that ackshually all vtubers want their PL to be talked about.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74798449
put a paper bag on her head and start doing it doggie style

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800792
qrd why flare hates her

[Anonymous No.]

>>74801734
yes. don't let her remaining simps convince you otherwise

[Anonymous No.]

>>74804515
fuck thats giving me a boner ngl

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810929
t. Mafumafu simp

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810710
then why are all pikamee references automodded in Henya's chat? inb4 you start sperging, it was a rhetorical question.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810992
the only JP music I listen to is Sigh (the black metal band), so try again keyfag

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811059
I don't know or care. Your fellow faggots talk about her PL and everyone else's on this board all the time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811130
>EOP dramamonkey
drink cyanide

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811159
it's also banned in the unofficial discord, so try again.
>>74811176
a seggbe baszott kurva anyád az EOP

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
I hope she's on suicide watch

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790435
She lost all reason to be subtle about it after the cat (heh) got out of the bag.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811230
Again, don't give a fuck. You faggots talk about wevery vtuber's PL HERE.

[Anonymous No.]

Oh wow it's the homosexual that thinks zentranny is not a man.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811277
bring it up with the j-words then. as long as /999/ is allowed to exist in its current form it's fine.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
She may be a train wreck but no one will be lower than her rabid antis

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811230
>dramamonkey and a Europoor
keep embarrassing yourself

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811334
I do it all the time and your fellow vshojocucks say it's allowed because their jannies allow it.

[Anonymous No.]

Is amazing how Mike cucks turned this topic from shitting on Mike to seething about poor henya that has done absolutely nothing to anybody

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811476
>seething about poor henya
schizo retard

[Anonymous No.]

honestly if she started going JAV i would give her money again

[Anonymous No.]

>>74807696
no, Cover has had more employess than anycolor for a couple years now, 500 to anycolor's 300 something

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811476
You made it about henya, retard. Literally nobody was talking about her until you showed up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811575
>Paying money for porn
Do you really?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811376
>Europoor
go outside and have a walk, amerifat
>>74811412
>because their jannies allow it.
yet /vsj+/ is completely unmoderated... almost as if you were full of shit. hint: you are
>>74811476
and now you know why we despise keyfags.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810929
>>74810992
Mafu didn't claim she killed her cat. It was an old cat that died from an accumulation of fluid in the lungs.
Some brown SEAfriend, as usual, TLd Mafu's statement wrong. They read the part where Mafu says "she accused me of killing her cat" and presumably fucked up the subjects so it was TLd as "Mafu accused her of killing his cat"

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811676
>not paying for things you want to see
this is how your hobbies die out poorfag

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811681
vshojo jannies exist outside of your echo chamber, retard.
You know this very well since you're always raging hard in the catalog while trying to bait for reportable posts but keep failing and make yourself look like an utter clown.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74800802
I would say that's a bit over the top, but when I realise that the original Discord message was Feb 22, it means that she had been lying to her fans for 2 years straight about being married.
Considering that, you really can't blame anyone for shitting on her on the way out

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811681
>go outside and have a walk
as opposed to you, shitposting /here/? lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811799
Oh I don't blame the guy at all. I fully support anyone that wakes up from that nightmare.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811796
>your echo chamber
I haven't been in /vsj+/ for quite a long while BECAUSE it's unmoderated, retard. and if you're posting Ironmouse doxx, that's on you.
>>74811819
I already had my rounds, "sorry" to disappoint.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811926
Your buddies are posting doxx (PL) of other vtubers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810815
put a picture of a beautiful girl at the back of her head and start doing it doggie style

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811926
yet you decided to come back to seethe about a Japanese woman you don't watch

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810986
>he raw dogged both aqua and shion at the sametime
>she had a threesome with 2 e celebs
which part gave you a boner?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
I can save and fix her. I know I can

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795705
lol

[Anonymous No.]

>https://twitter.com/nemuisanw/status/1785290384773632267
Someone must have DMed her to mock her

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Her very definition is fall from grace. Used to be one of the biggest Vtubers in a great company, also being the most superchatted. And once shit hit the fan, there was no stopping the domino effect.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74812093
PL isn't doxx, otherwise it'd be banned from the board, simple as.
>>74812198
maybe you shouldn't've shit on my oshi then, keyfag.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74810873
she knew what we at the time didn't

[Anonymous No.]

>>74812951
Not the guy you're responding to, but you are legitimtely insufferable and are going to cause far more problems than you solve with your bull headed arguing.
Also, I'd advise not making it so blatantly obvious that you spend too much time shitting up /vsj/+, kek

[Anonymous No.]

>>74812951
PL is doxx according to a lot of people. In any case it doesn't matter what you call it, you still post it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74812951
Discussing Mike being a whore isn't even doxx is public knowledge and easy information anybody can search lol. They acting like people are dropping actual doxx shit like her home address date of birth or her social security numbers. They can only call people shitting on Mike doxxfags because they still can't swallow the bitter pill Mike left on their mouth. And that pills is the reality of them being fucking cucks.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813070
>but you are legitimtely insufferable
you're still seething at me lmao
talk about rent free
>>74813140
well then, go on IRC and ask the staff to have the rules changed.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813243
This isn't about board rules. It's about you claiming that you operate according to ironmouse's beliefs but you just post every vtuber's PLs without actually knowing what they think.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813219
This PL discussion isn't about mike. It's about vshojo fans claiming that "holofans" absolutely love DN and other faggots like him because he says he's a hololive fan.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813390
>but you just post every vtuber's PLs
I'm pretty sure you mean plural you here, but I personally don't.
>>74813459
oh, so someone trolled you and you took it personally. unironically touch grass, anon, 4chan isn't as serious as you think it is.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813540
>oh, so someone trolled you and you took it personally
LOL
This all started with YOU taking >>74793845 personally

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793649
Honestly her story should always be told, but people are missing a point. Because it's a good reminder to every vtuber, everyone that depends on a public image, all it takes is one message, one steam notification, and it's over, all will come tumbling down. Mentally Ill or not she was making it, her fault or not it's over.

Do your OPSEC, keep your private life separated from your professional.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813597
that's not me, actually. I won't post a screenshot because I have 4chanX installed so it'd be easy to toggle either way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813730
You're part of the argument that started from that post. This has been all about vshojo fan butthurt from the very first reply from your side.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74795768
only vshojofans think it's big, the average twitch indie is bigger than most vshojo girls

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813686
The notification doesn't do anything. It has happened to several holos and they didn't even need to do anything about it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814021
ah, guilty by association. a classic.
I accept your concession.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814225
It's not just by association when you're part of the butthurt vshojo fan side. You have made several posts seething about "keyfags" because >>7479384 is absolutely correct.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814318
I wasn't even /here/ in 2021 lmao. Henya (not even her PL) was my entry to the scene. I suggest you find other windmills to tilt at.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814509
That was a misquote. >>74793845 was right and you really ARE mad that mike made vshojo look bad.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813730
hi mr thanks.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814621
I don't care about VShojo, only Henya.
>Verification not required.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74811476
good job, fancuck defense force! half of the discussion here is not related to me at all. don't forget to send me more money. i love you muah

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
No more AV then

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814722
You do care about vshojo because you keep going to vshojo catalog threads.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814888
no, I only came ITT to laugh at michael's expense, and I'd've been content just reading, but you faggots absolutely HAD TO drag Henya into this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814981
You're in vshojo threads all the time.
>you faggots absolutely HAD TO drag Henya into this
Literally what are you talking about? Nobody talked about henya until YOU brought her up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
>matome site
So speculation... wonder who makes these blatant posts...
>>74814751
Meanwhile, the notice reads:

also vshojo out of nowhere...

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815030
Mikeneko and her fans lie as naturally as they breath.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815030
>You're in vshojo threads all the time.
nope.
>until YOU brought her up.
also nope.
I'll say this one last time: leave my cute genius wife alone you sick fucks!

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815102
I'm not her fan, schizo. I've disliked her before you even knew what a vtuber was.
Also, where's the lie? There's not a SINGLE POST in this thread that has said anything negative about henya. Please quote the post to prove that I'm lying.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815151
Are you LARPing or just a retard? I'm pretty sure the guy arguing with you isn't even one of her fans, which you'd realise if you had two braincells to rub together, dipshit.
Her fans basically don't post here anymore

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815151
>this nigga thinks Marineschizo is a Nazuna fan
I'd recommend putting your head down on the sofa and resting a bit, child

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815151
You are the one who brought her her.
>>74794213
>>74801609
>>74810620
>>74811059
Posts before you started complaining about "seething about poor henya" and finally >>74811476 the post where you claim that someone dragged henya into the discussion despite EVERY SINGLE POST before that one being from you faggots.
Why do you henyaturds lie so much?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815280
There's a nazuna fan right here >>74815323

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815415
Knowing who Marineschizo is doesn't make someone a Nazuna fan. It's just about not being a newfag

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815488
Calling me the marineschizo does make you a nazuna fan. The only reason you would call me that is because you like her and desperately want her to still be friends with Marine.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815369
2 out of the 5 are me, including the one where I inb4'd your sperging. I accept your surrender.
>>74815488
I just don't watch corpo slop with shit rigging (holo, niji or phase), so ofc I have no idea what you're talking about. I don't even watch other VShojos, just Henya, plus a couple indies.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815544
I don't give a shit who she does or doesn't talk to because I don't watch lying whores. It's just that you're also insanely autistic
It's funny watching you go full schizo on the Henyafag though, but you're both retarded.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815612
You brought henya into the discussion but you're claiming that other people did it. You're the one surrendering.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74814212
huh, what non-holo related male celebrity appeared in notifications for other talents?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815650
proof next thread?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815683
I just proved it by quoting all of the posts that mentioned henya before one of you started moaning about "seething at poor henya" despite there being zero posts doing that.

[Anonymous No.]

These threads are as unironically autistic as always

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815621
Why do you hate Marine?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792789
she married someone who had way more money than her gachis would and used his connections to get her set up with a music deal and she still managed to tank it by being completely psychotic
>>74790443
an idol doesn't have to be a good singer, the "I want to support you as you grow and take your dream further!" angle is more important than individual skill

[Anonymous No.]

>>74793477
Coco is a known saviorfag, she just couldnt handle miguel anylonger.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815721
>despite there being zero posts doing that.
except all the ones above doing just that. no, I'm not gonna tag them, I'll let you seethe in utter defeat instead, grasping at straws and not knowing what to throw at me next.
>>74815734
welcome to 4chan.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815867
>I'm not gonna tag them
NTA, but this is just you admitting you have no argument

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813686
When notification happened to other holos they law low for a bit, Rushia kept adding fuel to the fire and it exploded on her face

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815867
There are zero posts "seething about poor henya". Concession accepted. Cope and seethe henyatard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74792299
I'm just waiting for the day she finally gets desperate enough for attention and success that she starts to do lewd ASMR

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815911
It's him being le ebin 4chan trolemaster.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815867
I mean you by the way, fuck Henya in her ass with my dick unlubed and immediately go for a deep throat after

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815911
>nta
suuuuure
>>74815917
even if that was true beforehand (it wasn't), you're seething at Henya right now. I know, it sucks not to have the doxxsite for backup anymore, but still, you're hopeless.
>74816074
*yawn*

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816113
It's true and I proved that it is. Keep watching your TTS tranny.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74813686
>OPSEC
Or, and this might be a controversial argument, don't date/marry while you're trying to attract gachikoi and you're the most superchatted Vtuber to ever exist.
Why teach people to be better liars instead of teaching them to be decent people

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816285
Nothing controversial about that. The truth is that it will just keep happening because it's easy money.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74815789
>someone who had way more money than her gachis would
easy, just marry 10 of her riches gachis. they are cucks and willing to share.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816197
>your TTS tranny.
so THIS is why you keep seething at me.
lol. lmao even.
I don't even watch Zen outside collabs kek

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816410
You're actually mentally ill.

[Anonymous No.]

I can't say I feel sorry for her or her cuck fans. No worries, she won't die and they'll keep funding her lifestyle.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816012
she will do jav

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816509
They are meant for each other.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816285
The human being do not work like this, people want to fuck and find partners for life, money, sucess, glory, nothing can really stop this

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816457
no, it's a triggered russian who used to beat it to Zen until "finding out"... he's so deranged as to fake voice reveal "oopsies" despite Zen always using STTS, and he's been seething at me ever since I called him out.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74816958
>still seething about the russian from your imagination
Zentranny is a man.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74817071
oh, it's you again. hooooly rent free...

[Anonymous No.]

>>74817272
You have russian simon keyfag seething about poor henya rent free in your head.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74817364
>simon
who?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74817402
You tell me, schizo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74790238
Oh, is that what happened. Then I'm going to assume the announcement that's on her channel in approximately 13 hours is just going to be her crying about it

[Anonymous No.]

>>74817436
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Anonymous No.]

>>74817468
Prepare your wallet. Send her akasupa to make her happy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74818069
No

[Anonymous No.]

Are you reading this thread right now, then?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74818236
DO IT!!!!!!!

[Anonymous No.]

God I hate trannies. Neck yourselves Vshotards.

[Anonymous No.]

https://twitter.com/ahsithadt386717/status/1785396296641134820
She's here. Say something nice about her

[Anonymous No.]

>>74819485
What's her DM? I saw it's about this thread (match the first 4 numbers 7479).

[Anonymous No.]

>>74819729
The first part is claiming she can sue people overseas (lol)
Then mocking him for saying that she betrayed her gachikoi before finally egging him on to make more accounts to harass her, followed by presumably blocking him.
All of those www are basically "lols", she types like a 5ch shitposter.

[Anonymous No.]

>>74819891
Arigathanks

[Anonymous No.]

>>74819729

[Anonymous No.]

>>74820030
Her DM is open to everyone?

[Anonymous No.]

>>74820225
no, she literally has to dm you for you to be able to dm her back