NDAs

[Anonymous No.]

>Work for a company for a year+ as a VA+Mascot
>Same for every vtuber corpo
>Can't publicly say who you were and get credit without fear of being sued.

[Anonymous No.]

Yes that is how NDAs work good job

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
Well no shit. OP has never worked a job in their life.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
u wot m8

[Anonymous No.]

you are not llowed to say what characterr you were so just write
Voice Acting and Entertainment Talent for Nijisanji.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499778
>>73499825
I know how a nda works you idiot.That's not my point. My job doesn't have an nda for basic credit. I can say I worked there and what my job was. Do you think voice actors for every character in a game or anime should have an nda. It's the opposite they get credit at the end scene. Do you not think it's not scummy that they try to hide the talent from fans who want to follow them?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500090
>t. retard
OP continues to prove that he's underage

[Anonymous No.]

It's like if keannu reeves wasn't allowed to tell people he played neo, these corpos only get away with it because vtubers don't know any better

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500190
>Shill who has no argument
VAs get credits at the end of every episode. Vtubers get threatened with a lawsuit.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500279
Exactly! If a company didn't credit the VA/Actor it would be ripped apart normally. But vtubers have an air of anonymity to them and companies were able to use it to set this norm where they try to horde the fans.

[Anonymous No.]

>73500281
>company doesn't want you to doxx yourself or others inside the company as vtubing is a business ran on anonymity for talents
crazy right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500678
It's definitely for security! This information that everyone already knows (Past Life) is super critical for the safety of our talents!
It's most definitely not a way to hold talents hostage in abuse contracts.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500090
Yes, because VA work is contract work. You're expected to work for other companies too and not have your entire portfolio be tied to a single IP.
The reason why NDAs exist for big corpos is very simple - one of the biggest reasons people strangle each other to join big corpos is because those corpo brands themselves give you power. AKA the "box". Even before your debut and before anyone even knows who you are, a new holo for instance can be expected to instantly hit hundreds of thousand of subs and debut to thousands of viewers. Cover (and Niji, and even Phase) are incentivized to make sure a talent don't just join, leave after a month or two, and take portions of their box with them.
It's notable that VShojo is the only big corpo in the space that doesn't do this, and they ended up having to change their hiring structure as well. Unlike other big corpos, VShojo doesn't onboard new talents; instead they hire talents with pre-existing fanbases as-is so the "people join to take a portion of the box with them" isn't an issue anymore. There are advantages to this, but not every corpo can or will take this strategy.
Letting talents keep their IPs when they leave (or connect them by speaking about it) is almost entirely the purview of smaller corpos who want a competitive edge when they don't have a pre-existing "box".

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500678
You aren't doxxing yourself if you say it on your new vtuber account or PL you returned to. Also I guess every VA doxxes herself. lmao. Dox isn't on purpose.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500678
>being credited for your work is dox
do corpokeks really

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500860
>Yes, because VA work is contract work
VTubers are also contractors. Well in reality most VTubers in Japanese-style agencies with exclusivity clauses are in a false-employment situation.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500860
>leave after a month or two, and take portions of their box with them.
Did you even read my message? "Work for a company for a year+" This doesn't say if the contract is terminated early. There is no date. This is indefinite.
>VShojo
They're not really a corpo. They're more accurately described as an agency.
>keep their IPs
This is just corpos trying to strawman. It would be ridiculous to say a VA or actor needs to buy the IP of the entire character they voiced to get credit for their work.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73501000
Vtubers have the worst of both worlds. The contract is an employee contract and has power over them as an employee contract but the vtuber is treated as a contractor.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73501095
There's no way for me to know that the post I responded to is the same poster as OP. The board's anonymous, you can't expect me to find every post you made somehow. But sure, let me respond to the other stuff.
>It would be ridiculous to say a VA or actor needs to buy the IP of the entire character they voiced to get credit for their work.
Obviously. A VA's job and future salary isn't tied to the game's brand. Some of them may choose to leverage that brand for additional internet fame, but for the most part they are a cog in a game that many people worked on. It's also why VAs can and do change in game, while Kizuna Ai's company trying this caused such a shitstorm that no vtuber agency will ever do it again.
Think about it as incentive structures. The entire value of a vtuber is tied to their online brand, so both they and the company have an incentive to retain as much of that brand for themselves. If a fan knew that vtuber PL B is the same as corpo vtuber A (and especially if corpo vtuber A tells her fans to watch PL B instead), a fan might leave the corpo box and watch PL B exclusively, which is a loss for the company. If you let a talent under you advertise their PL channels freely before they graduate, that's going to be a net negative for your company, hence the NDA.
There is no such incentive structure for VAs. If you know Matt Mercer voiced Guy McMahon of Ubisoft Game #90210 you're not going to be incentivized to not play the game in favor of watching Critical Role or something. There is zero conflict of interest between revealing a VA and maintaining a game's popularity. In fact, a popular VA might actually boost the sale and reputation of a game. So, game companies are incentivized to reveal the VA instead, as well as the names of all of the game devs since there's no conflict of interest there either.
>They're not really a corpo. They're more accurately described as an agency.
Of course they are, and that's not relevant. I brought up vshojo to illustrate the extent that a corpo needs to go in order to make up for not having an NDA for talent IP.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500190
Did you work at CIA, NSA or something? This isn't a normal NDA you fucking retard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
this your first time working kid?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
>You must be over the age of 18 to post on this board

[Anonymous No.]

>>73501891
Hell, even ex-CIA agents can say they worked at CIA unless they were undercover agents or something.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
If you don't like the terms of the contract then don't sign?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
The big question would be how enforceable it would be. Because NDA's cannot prevent you from saying information that is already public/common knowledge.

So - likely - if the person who plays the VTuber says they did play that VTuber. It could not be an enforceable breech of NDA, if the public is already certain that she is playing that VTuber.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73501288
How long are they gonna get away with it? Even people with overwhelming cause just don't want the hassle or stress of taking their company to court

>>73501840
>If a fan knew that vtuber PL B is the same as corpo vtuber A (and especially if corpo vtuber A tells her fans to watch PL B instead), a fan might leave the corpo box and watch PL B exclusively, which is a loss for the company.
I don't think people have a problem with vtubers being contractually obligated to avoid linking themselves with activity outside the company, or even forbid outside activity (though this part should really make them employees, not contractors).
>If you let a talent under you advertise their PL channels freely before they graduate, that's going to be a net negative for your company
They don't have to do it before. And even if they did, what is the company losing? They're already down a talent and the revenue they brought in. If their fans leave the company's audience entirely because of this talent's departure, then they were never going to stick around anyway.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500795
>This information that everyone already knows
I thought your problem was the vtuber couldn't say it was them and so the fans didn't know and couldn't find them after they leave? If everyone already knows (which post-corporate debuts suggest is true) then it seems like a non-issue in practice.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73501840
Actors and movie squeals break your point. Making a squeal with a different actor, especially if an actor has a following will see less of a turnout. I understand that the company has incentive to not give credit but you don't really explain why that is not a scummy thing to prevent credit after a substantial amount of time has passed. They are going beyond not giving credit they are suppressing credit.
>before they graduate
Again this is indefinite. It applies even after they leave. It's no problem for them to stop all talks about other personas during the company. My major gripe is after.
>>73502057
The entire contract can be a net positive for the vtuber but that doesn't mean it doesn't have parts that should be called out as scummy. But also Vtubers can be young and dumb.
>>73502066
A lawsuit even if a stupid one is expensive to fight. The problem is if you're small you probably don't have the support. If you're big it's probably common knowledge enough that it's not worth fighting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73502098
>I don't think people have a problem with vtubers being contractually obligated to avoid linking themselves with activity outside the company, or even forbid outside activity (though this part should really make them employees, not contractors).
That is the big thing that the NDA prevents though. Corpos won't have as much issue if some person not working in entertainment revealed they used to be a corpo vtuber. They just don't want PL B to do that to siphon viewers.
Also, I agree that the corpo vtubers should be salaried employees instead of contractors. I think the big corpos basically do this (Hololive talents get a full salary for instance).
>They don't have to do it before.
The NDAs prevent talents from doing it before and after. You can't, for instance, put "Indie VTuber B, formerly Corpo Vtuber A" in every video you make. Without the NDA, you know that there will be people who do this.
>And even if they did, what is the company losing? They're already down a talent and the revenue they brought in. If their fans leave the company's audience entirely because of this talent's departure, then they were never going to stick around anyway.
A lot. Not every fan that follows someone to their indie account (and especially so if they are allowed to cross-advertise) is a fan that will naturally leave in protest of a talent leaving. In fact, many fans in the "box" that these corpos found follow multiple vtubers instead of exclusively a single one.
Either way, though, I don't think you can deny that there is a huge conflict of interest if one of the big draws of a large corpo is the pre-existing viewer base, but you are allowed to advertise and try to siphon this viewer base anytime after you leave. We could debate the morality of the NDAs, of course, but from a conflict of interest perspective every big corpo is incentivized to have them, to protect their overall brand.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73502562
Firstly, movies get cast with different actors all the time. You can argue that a movie will have less of a turnout if it subs in an actor with a lower following, but it's a well-accepted practice in the acting industry. TV shows, especially, have to find new actors all the time; and it has never led to a shitstorm as big as Kizuna Ai.
Second, I'm not arguing whether it's scummy or not. That's extremely subjective and can open up some political/economics wormholes I don't want to get into. I'm just explaining why big corpos do the NDA thing in the first place, explaining it in terms of conflict of interest and branding conflicts.
>Again this is indefinite. It applies even after they leave. It's no problem for them to stop all talks about other personas during the company. My major gripe is after.
Because people can siphon viewers from your box after they leave, too. If PL B takes out adds and starts advertising themselves as "former corpo talent A, watch me instead!" it's effectively the same thing. It's a conflict of interest in both cases.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73502929
Ok. I am calling that scummy. I already understood the incentive but thanks for explaining it to anybody that didn't. They want to horde fans. To suppress credit after a substantial amount of time after they leave the company is scummy for anyone that believes people should be credited.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73502626
>They just don't want PL B to do that to siphon viewers.
That just doesn't make sense and they have no way of demonstrating this to be true. Dokibird is probably the only case where you can demonstrate a loss beyond that expected from a departing talent, and that's definitely not due to people identifying her as the same person.
And like, if they're a big-enough name or have a distinct-enough voice, people find them anyway. People who loved Pikamee found her anyway, same with Rushia. Did those of them who were fans of other VOMS and Hololive talents drop them completely? Doubtful.
>I think the big corpos basically do this (Hololive talents get a full salary for instance).
I believe they're still considered contractors which robs them of employee rights and protections (this is a problem even if the company does nothing wrong).

>Without the NDA, you know that there will be people who do this.
And what's wrong with that? This is especially valuable if they've decided to start over with a brand-new identity.

The only defense for these clauses is that the company will take some kind of loss, but that loss is undefinable and undemonstrated, and therefore worthless.

>A lot. Not every fan that follows someone to their indie account (and especially so if they are allowed to cross-advertise) is a fan that will naturally leave in protest of a talent leaving. In fact, many fans in the "box" that these corpos found follow multiple vtubers instead of exclusively a single one.
I'm not understanding you. You're telling me that most fans will not stop supporting the company in "protest," and that they also watch other vtubers within the company. Of course I agree to that, but how does that translate to "a lot" to lose for the company...?
Those fans are staying. In fact, we have numerous examples of vtubers LOSING fans when moving companies or going indie.
Some of this can be attributed to those fans being unaware of their new activities, but as we can readily see on this board, many people think that "it's different" now that they've left, and choose not to follow the talent outside of the company.
Even extremely visible and popular talents like Dokibird, Kson or Henya have failed to recapture their previous audience in totality.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
I agree that it's kind of screwed up. I do hope that the vtubing industry gets some regulation.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500090
You know this isn't exclusive to vtubers, right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
I don't want vtubers (or people commenting on their content) to talk about other identities of theirs, but they should get credit at the latest after they leave.
Like film actors who play a role throughout the movie without breaking character, but get listed in the credits.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73504110
The closest thing to this job is VAs and actors which the default is getting credit and I'm not even asking for that just not suppressing it. I understand certain jobs will have NDA of even mentioning it but that's more so for security. I don't know about racers? but I would still say it's scummy. Can you be more specific about what jobs you're referring to and an example?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
It doesn't work because the fans are not under a NDA.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
>say it in a job interview
>get hired
>shittysanji won't find out
oh nyo

[Anonymous No.]

>>73504438
>he doesn't know about the Stig
Read up on it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73503584
>That just doesn't make sense and they have no way of demonstrating this to be true.
Because every large corpo has a NDA (except VShojo who literally has an alternate hiring structure to compensate). There's no case demonstrating it to be false either, and I'm sure no company wants to be the first to test the waters and find out.
Yes, there are 3pp channels that will connect them. This is a massive difference from a talent being able to publicly advertise themselves that way. I hope you don't think that every person in the Holobox is a frequenter of sites like 2channel and knows about all the inner happenings of the vtuber world. There are even a sizable group of people right now who don't know Mori's PL, for instance, despite it being technically the most public thing in the vtuber space.
>I believe they're still considered contractors which robs them of employee rights and protections (this is a problem even if the company does nothing wrong).
You don't know this and I don't know this. Let's not speculate on stuff we have zero information about.
>And what's wrong with that? This is especially valuable if they've decided to start over with a brand-new identity.
Nothing wrong with that objectively, but if you are a large corpo who built your foundations on brand power, this is not going to sit well with you. That's why they do it.
You can argue the morality of it all you want, and heck, I myself am neutral on this issue. But there is a very real reason why a large corpo would not want it.
>Those fans are staying. In fact, we have numerous examples of vtubers LOSING fans when moving companies or going indie.
I'm going to stop you here. EVERY single example we have is with the NDAs active. We don't know what sorts of damages, say, Mikeneko actually advertising against her Rushia identity would cause because it simply has never happened due to NDAs. The most that actually happened was her hiring the same artist for her models. And corporations are extremely adverse to changing something and finding out for good reason.
And I don't know why a vtuber failing to recapture their previous audience in totality (under NDA) disproves any of this. Even Sayu, who leaks stuff constantly, had to respect the NDA. Heck, Nijisanji in particular would not want to find out what would happen if they open the floodgates and REALLY let their former livers say anything they want about their PLs.
As I said before, I'm not arguing whether it's scummy or not. I'm trying to explain why big corpos do it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500090
You act like people don’t instantly know who they are after they leave

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
>hmm yes, let's be like china and have everyone reveal their real identities
nijisisters are truly the bane of this community

[Anonymous No.]

>>73504521
No. Not all vtubers want to be linked to their PL So fans might be hesitant to spread the info. PL talk is also banned almost everywhere including /here/ even if they do. Only certain cases that are extremely obvious of certain big vtubers have the janny's give it a pass. And if you're small you might not have enough hard core fans to spread the word to casual fans.
So the fans is not that good of an spreader. And companies know this which is why they have an NDA in the first place. The info is also harder to find as time passes.
>>73504756
Read above. Not everybody is a huge vtuber.
>>73504844
faggot. They can do it on their other vtuber persona.

[Anonymous No.]

why is there an assblasted nijifag writing essays in the thread lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>73504657
>every large corpo has a NDA (except VShojo
VShojo has NDAs. Of course they do. Every company does.

>EVERY single example we have is with the NDAs active.
Not true, as there are many vtubers formerly of companies which have since closed down, making all contractual obligations null and void. Some of these former talents became and are still indie, which means they are free to speak on their time and place at that company, and some do. I personally don't have enough knowledge to speak on these examples though.

>And I don't know why a vtuber failing to recapture their previous audience in totality (under NDA) disproves any of this.
I mentioned very high-profile cases because they render the NDA's secrecy clauses irrelevant. Sure, they can't say they were who they were, but we all know anyway.
>say anything they want about their PLs.
At this point I think you're conflating the entirety of the NDA with the singular clause preventing the talent from bridging identities.
Nobody cares that they can't talk about typical inside business shit. That's normal. Being unable to properly claim credit for your work is the part that isn't normal.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73505108
>VShojo has NDAs. Of course they do. Every company does.
Fair. I excepted VShojo since they don't have the IP restriction, which seems to be the biggest issue in contention. You're right, though - they probably have NDAs elsewhere.
>Not true, as there are many vtubers formerly of companies which have since closed down, making all contractual obligations null and void. Some of these former talents became and are still indie, which means they are free to speak on their time and place at that company, and some do. I personally don't have enough knowledge to speak on these examples though.
You're right, though those don't really prove what happens if you removed those NDAs either. If a corporate went under, there's no reputation or "box" that the talent might advertise against. It's a different case from an active big corpo removing the NDA.
>At this point I think you're conflating the entirety of the NDA with the singular clause preventing the talent from bridging identities.
My apologies, I veered off-topic there.
My point is still that even the highest profile cases are not quite "we all know". Even Mori's PL, which should be public knowledge to most of the people here, is not actually that public knowledge when you consider the entirety of the Holo fanbase. Doki might be the only case where a PL-Corpo link legitimately broke into the mainstream, but that's also not going to inspire any corpos to relax the IP NDA, either, even if the cause of the backlash is Niji's own fuckups.

[Anonymous No.]

>Corpo doesn't want talents to say they're X vtuber during and after their time there
>Talent happily agrees with the terms of the corpo
>Anon: "NOOOOOOOOO I DON'T AGREE WITH THIS!! THIS NEEDS TO CHANGE!!!"
Your indie shitter will never be relevant

[Anonymous No.]

>>73505565
>there's no reputation or "box" that the talent might advertise against
You keep saying against, which implies competition, but... their old identity is dead. There's nothing to compete with. They aren't saying "hey, watch me instead," they're saying "hey, please keep watching me."

Let's do a hypothetical. Let's say that Subaru graduates and goes indie. But Hololive lets her say that she was Subaru. Subaru does some campaigning identifying herself as "formerly Oozora Subaru."
Do you truly think this is a threat to Hololive? Subaru fans will likely attach to her in some capacity, but do you think this means they stop watching other Hololive talents? Why would they?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73505715
>Talent happily agrees
kek. I bet you also think the entirety of Niji's contract should be upheld. Or that other vtuber should pay 450k for quitting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73505988
If nobody likes their contracts why didn't everyone in hololive quit along with kson since they're all such good buddies?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506107
obsessed chimp

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506170
Why can't you answer the question, kshart? Just skip to the part where you throw out racial slurs and spam monkey images like the true obsessed chimp you are so we can get you on your deserved month long vacation.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506107
>mention niji contract.
>replies with hololive
kek nijisister
1 part of a contract can be scummy while still be a net benefit. I can criticize a company for doing something scummy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73500795
Interesting that vtubing is the only entertainment industry in the world where complete anonymity for the performers is expected.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506230
idk you weren't arguing with me, i just looked in this thread and saw you being an obsessed chimp

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506231
>>mention niji contract.
Where? OP said
>Same for every vtuber corpo
You don't get to retroactively limit the entire thread to niji just because that's what's convenient to you. The thread is about talents not being allowed to disclose their identity and that applies to hololive.
Now answer the question and quit obsessing over niji.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73505892
>Let's do a hypothetical. Let's say that Subaru graduates and goes indie. But Hololive lets her say that she was Subaru. Subaru does some campaigning identifying herself as "formerly Oozora Subaru."
>Do you truly think this is a threat to Hololive? Subaru fans will likely attach to her in some capacity, but do you think this means they stop watching other Hololive talents? Why would they?
Ultimately, we don't know. And we also don't know how far that a former talent (especially one as influential as Subaru) can take such a thing, either, especially when emotions get involved. There is no corpo that wants to be the first to test the waters and find out for themselves.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506342
>i just looked in this thread
So you're an obsessed chimp that has chimpouts anytime someone mentions kson.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506397
>Where
here >>73505988 I didn't limit it just pointed it out.
>answer the question
I did that already.
>>73506231
>1 part of a contract can be scummy while still be a net benefit. I can criticize a company for doing something scummy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506464
>And we also don't know how far that a former talent (especially one as influential as Subaru) can take such a thing
You know this can be controlled by the contract/NDA, right?
They can very easily allow the talent to take credit while stipulating that they cannot speak on behind-the-scenes information or to make statements which damage the company's reputation.

As a matter of fact, I'm almost 100% confident that this is the logic inside VShojo's NDA. IP rights aside, none of those who have left have really spoken out against VShojo or discussed BTS conditions or incidents (whether or not any such thing happened is of course unknowable as a result). This is something that's pretty typical of company NDAs. I'm positive whatever company you work for had you sign a similar agreement.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506575
>I didn't limit it
Yes you did. You started chimping out because I brought up hololive which went against your desire to limit the discussion to niji.
> I can criticize a company for doing something scummy.
Your "criticism" is you posing as the rightful white knight that's on the side of the talents despite the talents not giving a single fuck about the thing you're shitting on their group for. That's what my entire post was about, you're the person going
>"NOOOOOOOOO I DON'T AGREE WITH THIS!! THIS NEEDS TO CHANGE!!!"

[Anonymous No.]

Are you being paid under minimal wage to write these?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506833
The indie white knights do it for free.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
My country may be a shithole but eternal NDAs are not enforceable and can be terminated simply with a written statement by Party B. Same goes for indefinite non-competes (which are also void if without compensation, and can be challenged)

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506763
This is a fair argument. I concede to your point.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73501894
>>73499825
What kind of job doesn't let you use previous experience as a reference, and makes it so you can never tell anyone you worked there? The fucking CIA?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506107
they like the pay. that doesn't mean they like the contract. coco said they thought the new one was crazy before she graduated.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507203
So why don't they also graduate? They're wasting their time, money. sanity, health and effort building something that's not even theirs. Cover is a black company and nobody should work there just like every other nip corpo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507327
>So why don't they also graduate?
read the first four words in my post

[Anonymous No.]

>>73506807
retard. It's not limited when I mention every company has this. It's just funny you mentioned hololive specifically after Niji mentioned. Why not mention every company?
>talents despite the talents not giving a single fuck
Didn't know I was talking to every vtuber, You don't get to say what they give a fuck about. My criticism is pointing to how almost every VA and actor gets credit at the end of every episode but a vtuber who worked at the company for over a year would get threatened with a lawsuit if they mentioned their corpo PL after they left.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507369
I answered that already. The money isn't worth it because they're actually making less that it's costing them their health and any real chance to succeed in the future.
We need to campaign to get them all to quit for their own sake. It's the right thing to do.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507461
ok good luck

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507430
I brought up hololive because I knew you would lose your shit. Everyone in these threads always tries to dance around calling hololive a black company.
Again, the talents are happy with their contracts since they're not quitting and you're here going "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO YOU'RE BEING EXPLOITEEED!!!"

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
in most of these large corpo’s, the girls are basically interchangeable. especially in hololive, where the brand and IP is doing 75% of the heavy lifting. The vtuber is the consumer facing part of the business, but it’s really only a small part of the whole. It makes sense that they aren’t allowed to take credit for everything.
Of course, when small corpo’s do this it’s a LARP, mostly

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507461
>sarcastic strawman
faggot who doesn't understand net benefit.
>>73507652
2 words is me losing my shit lol
Do you really not understand net benefit, anon? Something can suck but not enough to quit.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507652
Just because they're signing the contract doesn't mean that they like every single clause and stipulation.
It just means that they consider the terms a net benefit, and whatever they lose (if anything), they consider to be worth for what they gain.

This happens with actual black companies, too. We all saw that joke Nijisanji calls a contract. But people sign it because
a) they don't know any better
b) they consider it worth dealing with to "make it"

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507808
There's no net benefit to being corpo if you can't say who you were. The vtuber industry NEEDS to change.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507918
most people are more motivated by $$$ than the social clout associated with being worshipped by a small army of schizophrenic manchildren irl, anon

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507887
they could also hate literally all the terms and only like the compensation.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507887
Everyone that left hololive already showed that it's better to leave.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507988
that’s still a valid contract between consenting parties. welcome to show biz, kid

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508008
The only one who's potentially made more money after leaving is Kson.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507918
most corpos are dying off if that helps

[Anonymous No.]

>>73507981
Anyone that pays for expensive music videos and other projects does so for the social clout. There's no profit to made from spending all that money.
Why do they do that if they hate the fact that they are not allowed to say who they were?

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508145
I’m pretty sure most of them are just genuinely deluded that they have music talent (at least enough to compete with boy bands and kpop tier shit) and think that they have a chance of recouping the money at least some of the time, but it’s hard to make a blanket statement

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
>>Can't publicly say who you were and get credit without fear of being sued.
Don't worry reddit is on the case.

[Anonymous No.]

We can't have it getting out into the public that vtuber agencies are working on nuclear weaponry, that's why we need NDAs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508285
well if this isn’t the pot calling the kettle black

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508258
Literally nobody believes that they will ever make their money back from a Youtube video that can only make money through ads. Note that I'm specifically talking about music videos and other projects that result in a video and not music itself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508145
I don't think those expensive videos make their money back. But understand the social clout is literally marketing. They do make some, not a lot but some money by basically being a giant ad.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508558
It's a giant ad that will never break even and nobody believes that it will. The fact that the talents are willing to put their own money towards marketing a character that they are not allowed to mention after leaving clearly shows that they don't hate they don't hate that part of their contract.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508447
I didn't call you black I called you a nigger.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508303
>AKB48? I have no AKB48. Hunted, despised, living like a comedy talent agency! The mocap studio is my home. And I will show the world that I can be its master! I will perfect my own race of vutbers. A race of atomic super-oshis which will conquer the world!

[Anonymous No.]

The funny thing is that even current talents could demand Niji to disclose their name or chosen pseudonym on YouTube videos in jurisdictions with strong laws on authorship.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73508687
Nah. That's jumping to a conclusion. I do agree that some don't hate it, I'm not talking for every vtuber. Still a scummy thing to do when you compare it to VAs, actors, and believe in crediting people.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73509525
>"NOOOOOOOOO I DON'T AGREE WITH THIS!! THIS NEEDS TO CHANGE!!!"

[Anonymous No.]

>>73504915
That's not the case.
Fans are very good spreader.
They will spread it through twitter and youtube comments.
Even the vtuber themselves do it just by following an account.

4Chan is a heavily censored shithole now that's the same as reddit but it shouldn't be this way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73509995
I might be underestimating fans in the short term but long term that info is buried. Also I think you are overestimating casual fans. People are npcs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73499610
>>73509525
You do understand that you saying this stuff here is useless right? We have no idea about bts stuff, most of it is speculation. It's all up to the talents to get together and protest internally before signing a new contract if they actually want to change something like that. Together they should have enough leverage to negotiate the contracts with the company. Negotiations like that probably even happened but we outsiders just don't know.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73511738
This is literally from the leaked niji contract template. Even if it wasn't, the fact that no vtuber clearly states their corpo PL unless the contracted is null and void or the company is collapsed should be enough. I'm not saying every corpo contract is bad but this clause is.
>probably even happened but we outsiders just don't know.
Unlikely.

[Anonymous No.]

Ultimately, there's an interesting parallel with professional wrestling here. Fans of an actor/actress usually want to follow them through their careers and changes of mask, but in this case instead of generally physically fit and theoretically combat capable grown men and women most vtubers are physically anemic and weak and as such have more to fear from the less savory elements of their fanbase. Protecting their identities keeps them safe, but it also reduces their freedom to go elsewhere with the fanbase they cultivated unless the fanbase is proactive in marketing the move as Dokibird's was. Ideally, the decision to announce prior identities should be up to the talent. But we're probably headed to a future where it becomes more acceptable to openly announce when someone has migrated to a new form.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73511738
>>73512289
There's pretty much only one known case of collective bargaining in vtubing (kawaii gen 3) and they got "graduated" effective immediately with the rest of the talents saying they were bad for the companies future. They were totally erased with even the Minecraft server getting rolled back to before they joined.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73511738
>>73512600
Very few vtubers actually have the value to be hard to replace. "Talent is a dime a dozen" There's plenty of people jumping for joy to join a corpo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73512600
Keyword there being "known". It is known because it went badly otherwise people wouldn't know about it either. This seems like a weird case because the new talents protested but the older ones with the actual leverage didn't and stood by the company's side. As a new hire you obviously don't have much leverage. It could be that what they wanted was unreasonable for this agency.

[Anonymous No.]

>>73514404
Maybe but also as a talent who's still in the company and maybe even with friends, you aren't going to shit talk the company because that's going to hurt you and your friends. In house unions are a lot of assumption on the "things are fine" side.