/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

[Anonymous No.]

Why is Haachama depressed? Shouldn't she be really happy to be a super star as a teen?

[Anonymous No.]

She can't balance uni with her streaming personality
also her parents are typical Japanese parents, which means you are a worthless NEET with no future if you don't have a decent office job

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621061
>uni
What for? She has a career already

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
Dude lmao why are you depressed just go outside, lmao, eat better and think happy thoughts lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621079
>vtubing
>career

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621061
Lmao he really believes she's in college

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
This but unironically

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621110
>be millionaire teenager with enormous fanbase
>not real job lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
She was happy when in Australia. Only she didn't realise it at the time. Then her depression kicked in when she returned to glorious nippon, where her uptight parents pretty much made her feel bad for not focusing more on college in order become the typical white-collar drone. Then there's all VOD deleting stuff that probably pushed her over the edge.

She should move back to an anglo country and things will be daijoubu again. But it's not going to happen.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621154
It's not a stable job. She may be doing well right now but one day hololive will decline and her well of paypig money will dry up eventually

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621154
You said "career." Career lasts longer than just a few years. There's no guarantee that vtubing will be relevant 2 years from now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
She's getting mocked by her sister now that she's back in Japan.

[Anonymous No.]

DEPLESSED? WHAT YOU MEAN DEPLESSED HELLOOOOOO

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621182
At which point she'll have plenty of money to pursue her studies and pick up where she left off. You don't magically go from having a decent amount of money to losing it all, just because the vtube well goes dry.

[Anonymous No.]

She's not depressed, just disillusioned with being a Vtuber at the moment.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621259
It's still not a career, it's basically a side hustle so she can earn some money while going to university

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621154
No vtuber last more than 5 years anon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621182
That’s why you milk it till you’re stable enough to make work optional.

Having a stable job as a badge of honor is a just cope to justify working for a boss 40 hours a week, the goal is the same, so why pretend otherwise.

Face it, 80% of service white collar jobs add nothing but busywork anyway.

t. wagie

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621251
stupit~ stupit~

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
She's an unwanted child and a misfit hapa. Hence the boarding schools. They just wanted her out of the way. She knows how to act but she's never even learned to be happy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621189
>>6621293
Has any of the popular online personalities from pre 2010 stopped existing and become no one? No, she can be online entertainer forever

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
don't be depressed, watch oni!

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621438
She has awful personality and backstabs hers colleges all the time

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621171
>She was happy when in Australia.
she probably got abused for looking asian

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621512
By who? White people are the least racist people on earth

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621286
>"side hustle"
ask me how I know you're poor.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
She has to pick between vtubing and her stalker boyfriend

[Anonymous No.]

Vtubing is just an extension of streaming and streaming isn't going anywhere. Streaming for a living is just a natural progression of making money from creating content on the internet. Which probably went something like this:

Uploading skits on video hosting sites > Vlogging about your life on YouTube > Uploading Let's Play gaming series > Streaming video games live

I've seen so many ""internet personalities"" follow this route, and they're all pretty much still around. Streaming with an anime avatar is a gimmick, but it's hardly going to get boring unless people simply become uninterested in the medium. Which obviously isn't the case because it's fucking booming everywhere right now, even to the point where the most turbo of normalfags watch anime on Netflix these days.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621375
A lot of them ceased to be relevant. Case in point, Smosh (the original duo)

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621620
Smosh cashed out, not the same as having 0 audience

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621464
Based oni pissing off ESLs

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621512
More like for having the english skills of a toddler. No matter which country you live in, if you can't speak the local language you're going to get ostracized. Especially in school.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621512
what by a fucking abbo? Imagine being the one in 100,000,000 australians that have a problem with Japanese. Seriously it's hard to get them to say gamer words on /pol/ about the rama ramas.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621667
https://youtube.com/watch?v=vbTizG5bFmA

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621620
Even so a lot of them reinvented themselves to continue careers in entertainment. For example, Smosh is no more but both of it's members have gone on to have decently successful singular channels. Mystery guitarman also went into filmmaking and has made critically successful films, and nigahiga still makes YouTube videos to this day. They aren't as successful as they were, but still successful enough to sustain themselves. You can't have the high forever but if you're smart you can still keep going.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621586
ask me how I know your a faggot

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621438
ok, I will
when she actually streams

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621742
No u

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621755
she's gonna stream in 2 minutes

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621341
I'm like 90% sure that if she put half her sc earnings into a ETF she wouldn't need to work in a couple of years

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621061
>She can't balance uni with her streaming personality
>Goes on hiatus during summer when theres no uni

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621512
She was abused by the other asian girls in the asian girl clique that inevitably forms in every school in oz.
The whites would have either ignored her or tried to befriend her only for her to cower away back to the safety of the asian girl group.
Saw this all the time.
Especially since this was a private school and not some commie public shit school.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621727
People always link to this, and that one other clip of her speaking in a deeper voice. Thinking she can secretly speak English perfectly. All she's really doing is changing her tone. She's still slurring her words and stuttering in these clips.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621727
that's fucking precious

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621061
>buying into the cover rrats
she's depressed because she's the next

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621769
mhm, tell me more

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621728
There is also the chance that you pull a Pewds and actually catch a second wind like he did with his minecraft streams.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621154
>vtuber
>millionaire
lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622615
>Be in hololive
>Be consistently in the top 20 super chatted on YouTube
>Youtube takes 30%, Cover takes 30%, Taxes takes 20%
>That 20% you have left is still 200k USA of a year if you're a million subscriber chubba
>Do this for 5 years, each year getting more and more money
>Graduate if you start to recline instead
>Retire in 10 years, s4w0m
>35k USA a year from age 20-80 is 2.1 mil
>You can live a comfy middle class life tax free for the rest of your life.
Getting a couple million very quickly is how you retire for life. Being a 20yo million are is the strategy to being perma-comfy. Not rich in the long run, but comfy

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622615
Stacking bank early and learning how to compound it is how you make it. Falling for the education cuck, chasing credentials, constantly trying to prove yourself to employers and then getting dumped in the future perma crisis economy is what normies look forward to now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622897
The idea that the hologravytrain will run for five years is optimistic.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621825
Summer vacations starts in August anonchama...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6623713
Streaming became big in 2011 or so and has exploded into a billion dollar business that continues to make more and more money each year. Vtubing on its own is becoming recognized as a legitimate form of fame and is enjoying the same amount of growth. Why would you ever think it has a hard five year limit?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622615
Coco's roommate is a millionaire with Ad rev, members, SCs and merch all combined.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621061
>hey haato
>yeah mom
>y'know that company you work for that threw you under the bus and made you cry every night for weeks? The one that then unpersoned you and gave you anxiety attacks?
>yeah
>I think you should consider not working for them any more
thos damn anti parents!

[Anonymous No.]

>>6623877
When the 4-kings+oyabun era ended, it wasn't great for vtubers compared to the height of that era. This current high trend could still end.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6624158
So what exactly is your reasoning for thinking this era is going to end anytime soon when we have dozens of vtubers that have far surpassed the popularity of the 4 kings?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6624092
Your level of understanding how Asian parenting works really shows. They don't give a fuck.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621873
as someone who went to a semi-private all girls highschool in aus, this is true and i can confirm.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
don't worry, as soon as she get admitted into uni she will announce her graduation and leave Hololive forever. she will be finally free and won't suffer anymore

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
She's not a star. All the fame is owned by cover and will stay with them once they kick her out. She'll be left with nothing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622897
JP tax rates are killer. I doubt they're only taking 20% from her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6627446
https://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2206.html

[Anonymous No.]

>>6625429
Like half the holos family members watch their streams daily. A bunch of them have even appeared on stream. Haatos father even wanted to stream with her.
But I'm sure your based takes override reality.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
>Why is Haachama depressed?
she is a MKultra victim

welp now a day anyone can become a MKu victim by becoming a gacha-consoomer

[Anonymous No.]

i still think that her biggest mistake was going back to japan

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
>shouldn't she be really happy to be a super star as a teen
simple google search of teens who became superstars will tell you that fame (even semi-anonymous fame) fucks up young people

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
Give me five happy thoughts.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6624092
Even before the dark times she told her parents she wanted to be a VA her parents told her "fuck that shit, you are studying a proper carrer", they also sent her and her sister to study abroad because her dad just wants trophy daughters.

You are fucking retarded and never cared about Haachama before the schizo arc

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622897
>Do this for 5 years
the absolute state of this board

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629136
This
I don't know why this thread opens up with this question, she's young and her main gimmick is being a fucking schizo degenerate to thousands of people, no amount of money is going to make her ignore that

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
That’s not how depression works anon

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621125
Why are you on this board then?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629638
Don't try to fit in newfag

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629239
>schizo arc
way to out yourself faggot

[Anonymous No.]

People here actually think that streaming/vtubing is a job lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629844
>earn insane money
>not a job because an autist says so

[Anonymous No.]

>>6630025
faggot, winning in lottery can also get you a lot of money. it's still not a job.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6632590
winning in lottery doesn't give you a loyal fanbase that last forever.

[Anonymous No.]

I really fucking miss her man.
I hopped on the haachama train late 2019 and by early 2020 I was already really into her but I didn't go all in until late 2020 where I'd be there for every single stream.
I wish I had done that sooner. Great times.
Then 2021 happend and it's been nothing but despair.
Where is my cute autistic virtual daughter now....will she ever come back.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
>Super star as a teen.
When has that ever worked out without ending in a crippling drug addiction and performing cringy shock content like twerking on a microphone stand?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621110
Let's be honest, if this pandemic has taught us anything they probably have better job security than you do

[Anonymous No.]

Did Haachama private the collaboration with Oiran Yuugiri or why can't I find it anymore?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6632759
wtf does fanbase have to do with something being a job?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629209
tits
boobs
mammaries
milkers
honka honka

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621079
>implying she could do this indefinitely

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622615
>Parents can afford overseas high school
>not rich

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
Add excersize and actually having a job instead of watching streamers for the ''best friend'' experience.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6634647
Fanbase gives you security to be forever a streamer

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621375
What’s ray william Johnson doing these days?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621293
VAs play the same character for twenty years. There so reason a vtuber can't do the same.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6636594
nothing lasts forever. people grow up, change interests, find new hobbies. Or you may just one day say the t-word and get kicked out without any compensation.

and getting a fanbase in the first place is just lottery, most sit in front of a camera for years and never get the spotlight. Others gain tens of thousands of subs before even streaming once. It's not based on skill and it's not reliable.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6633270
your genes are calling for you to make an autistic daughter of your own

[Anonymous No.]

She will be back, right my lads?
She was one of the most interesting Cover girls with her schizo story.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6637232
Unironically this. Haachama awakens a paternal instinct in some people after they realize how retarded she is. She will mature and move on, so the viewers might as well take those feelings, find a life partner, and raise their own problem child.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621341
this
It's surprising that is has to be explained to drones

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629844
cope wagecuck, they earn your yearly income in less than 1 month.
But keep flipping those burgers, you tool.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
This, but with a kind hug and "you can always talk to me, bro"

[Anonymous No.]

Why is Robin Williams depressed? Shouldn't he be really happy to be a super star as a man?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
Anon, do you know fuck all about depression?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621341
poorfags always say this

[Anonymous No.]

>>6637232
Yes, but the hard part is finding an autistic gf to make said autistic daughter

[Anonymous No.]

>>6643973
>Universally loved by everyone
>Rich
>No major demons in his closet as far as we know
>Kills himself anyways

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
>Shouldn't she be really happy to be a super star as a teen?
Gee I dunno, ask the dozens and dozens of fucked up child actors and stars

[Anonymous No.]

>>6636675
YOUR MOM__________________________________________

[Anonymous No.]

>>6644355
It was auto-erotic asphyxiation gone wrong.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621372
>unwanted child and a misfit hapa
Why can’t I have one of these to groom and marry. It’s all I really want in life.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621586
Incredibly based observation. This nigger slang needs to die.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6625557
>semi-private all girls highschool
show bobs and vagene plz

[Anonymous No.]

>>6633516
plenty of times outside of pedowood, the jew is the only reason why american childstars are fucked

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621293
VTuber as a term is basically 4 years old no shit no one has lasted that long

[Anonymous No.]

>>6622897
>Youtube takes 30%, Cover takes 30%, Taxes takes 20%
You fags never understand the break down on this despite coco explain it to you. Youtube takes 30%, Cover takes 30% of the remaining amount not the original amount, which means you keep 49% of the original value, then you the 20% tax on the remaining amount.
You are not keeping 20% you keeping around 40% of the original value.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6646311
People shouldn't be allowed to earn money playing video games. Perhaps China had it right all along.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621512
>>6621873
This is true, she talked about the one friend she had was a Vietnamese girl who had to go back to Vietnam. That friend defended her against Thai girls bullying her. Those Thai girls went as far as forcing Haacham to warm up their food in the microwave.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6645067
Holywood kids are being molested.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621727
>She has an Aussie accent
Fuck that's sexy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621079
You can't be a streamer for your whole life anon.

[Anonymous No.]

what makes you think she's depressed? her fake excuse to spend the summer with her friends?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6646811
>"everyone should stay poor unless I say otherwise"
Thank god you're a useless sack of shitchama

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621742
poor confirmed
>verification not required

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621512
Imagine thinking this is real.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6634647
You can equate fanbase to clients who will buy your products and services.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
I think she is just bored with the antis, censorship, no creative liberties. Maybe she will graduate by the end of the year.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6648435
most fans aren't paypigs though, what really matters is the few paypigs sending her money and she loses a decent chunk of revenue if a couple of the leave

[Anonymous No.]

>>6646811
Ogey zhang

[Anonymous No.]

>>6646811
Communist swine
AWAY

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621171
>She was happy when in Australia
Do the people who type this shit watch her for longer than a few months?
She literally cried on stream about having to get her shit together a year ago because she was going to fail, she had like 2 or 3 friends who all moved away, spent her lunches browsing twitter and spent her freetime streaming until around a year ago. That was not what a happy person fucking looks like.
>where her uptight parents pretty much made her feel bad for not focusing more on college
God I fucking hate you retarded EOPs. Yea her parents fucking hate her streaming career so much, that's why her dad wanted to stream with her and that's why her mom watches her streams. Not to mention going to college was something Haachama has always looked forward to every time she mentioned it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629239
Haachama is probably constantly compared to her oneechan. Her sister also has a posh, English accent compared to Haachama's busted bogan accent.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6649082
>Haachanama's sister was sent to the UK
>meanwhile Haachama was sent to the Philippines and fucking Australia
You can clearly see who's the favorite...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6649462
Haachama chose to go to Australia

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621259
>goes with your idea
>haachama drops college and does streaming full time
>still only does random streams
>only lasts 5 more years
>goes back to college around age 25
>doesn't graduate until 29
>applies for ENTRY level jobs at age 29 with nothing other than "HAACHAMA CHAMA~~" listed on her resume
Tell me how I know you're a worthless neet mooching off his parents wealth. She's doing fine now, if anything she can do a monthly stream assuming her contract allows that. That's assuming she even wants to do that. Stupid JSL.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6650082
>only lasts 5 more years
Blow it out of your ass

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
she's pregnant

[Anonymous No.]

>>6649687
who chooses to go to boganland?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6649021
Yea from what I understand streaming was her escapism from Australian reality of social isolation and some bullying, Cover's growing restrictions probably didn't help but she doesn't have to stream to speak Japanese anymore so it seems she would rather just focus on real life shit for now. Hard to believe she would walk out from a million+ subbed channel but might just turn into a part-timer like Ayame or Shion, something like that wouldn't be uncommon in nijisanji.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621293
Kizuna...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6658116
Not this shit again

[Anonymous No.]

>>6659514
i know, i didn't think she would get pregnant again so quickly

[Anonymous No.]

>>6658216
A naïve Japanese girl who thinks cute koalas and kangaroos are everywhere.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
This is good advice, but some people kget too comfortable with their depression that they don't want to take it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
Unironically this
I know some people who get depressed, find a girlfriend/boyfriend, remain depressed, change jobs every other year, remain depressed, move to a different apartment every year for a "change of pace", and yet still remain depressed
I just can't relate and really don't know what to tell them

[Anonymous No.]

>>6658216
i'd fucking pick boganland over bongland anyday thanks for asking

[Anonymous No.]

>>6658216

This >>6659588 and I'm pretty sure she has also mentioned the timezone closeness too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
watch nijisanji you faggot,
sara said haachama is happy

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629239
>>6649082
>>6649462
How to out yourself as a clipwatching EOP faggot who's never watched a single stream pre-schizo arc.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6658503
Shion was never a part timer. She's always had health related reasons for not streaming.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6658116
Yeah, with me.

>>6646811
What are your opinions on CEOs making 300% times what their employees make while running companies into the ground, star athletes and famous actors?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621283
>disillusioned with being a Vtuber at the moment.
>Takes more than one month of hiatus
Make sense

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629239
t.clipfag

[Anonymous No.]

>>6661792
99% of the faggots in here never watched anything outside of her schizo crap yet claim to know her. EOPs never cease to impress with their retardation.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6661926
it's no different than employers earning more than employees in any other branch
obviously everyone expects returns on investments and wagies work for wages

[Anonymous No.]

Ever since Haachama put all her money in Doge, she lost the will to stream anything that wasn't just crazy fun.
Then Cover cracked down on that, and now she just has to live with her millions.

[Anonymous No.]

god i miss my chama

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621094
I believe that advice no longer applies to most places especially Japan thanks to the Chinese flu
>>6621171
>she was happy in australia
She posted a clip of her clearly stating in english I WANT TO GO HOME, and I know back when she was *here* we were being racist as fuck, to the point where bogan cunts looked at any asian and thought FOOKIN' CHINGA CUNTS FOOK OFF even myself and I ain't even chinese or japanese for fucks sake, she also had a hard time because her english was dog shit hence the peperloni meme

>Only she didn't realise it at the time
Good chance she has depression bad and things got worse, or perhaps a new set of challenges, whatever the case australia isn't the solution, especially with the constant fucking lockdowns we've been having, japan has shit too with covid but depending on where she is they might be less restricted because fuck the rules businesses are dying and the government is inept like any other

I say let the girl take time off, but least in a place where she doesn't sound like a retard that's funny on stream but irl people will get all racial because humans are fucking cunts

[Anonymous No.]

>>6662269
She is not coming back

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621110
lol Coco made enough to live her whole life eating steak every day in less than 2 years

[Anonymous No.]

>>6662270
based racists

[Anonymous No.]

>>6663499
She'll live comfortably but she didn't make THAT much

[Anonymous No.]

>>6662270
She was bullied by fellow asians.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621293
because it wasn't a thing 5 years ago basically

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621341
I would add stable work don't exist in 2K21, idk where these retard come from, but the only safe carreer right now is Streamer entertainer

[Anonymous No.]

>>6666852
Congratulations in making the dumbest fucking post on the entire site today.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6667272
Wagie cope

[Anonymous No.]

>>6668976
you don't really believe that being a streamer is the only safe job in 2021, right?

[Anonymous No.]

She had lunch recently with Hoshikawa, she's fine.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621286
>some money
She could have already made enough money to be set for life if she manages it wisely, why the fuck would she need a traditional "career"? And this is even without her pivoting into voice acting, production, management etc., which shouldn't be a problem either.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6669045
It's the most stable job his mental stability would be able to manage

[Anonymous No.]

>>6674164
> set for life
if she kills herself within the next few years maybe

[Anonymous No.]

Living in this shit country would make anyone depressed

[Anonymous No.]

>>6663441
chama does what chama wants, she'll be back as soon as she has new stuff she wants to do

[Anonymous No.]

>>6674382
Well, how much money do you think you need right now to cover at the very least the basic necessities? Also, the meme about Japan being expensive hasn't been true for like 30 years.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629844
>>6632759
holos get paid salaries too so

[Anonymous No.]

>>6677891
Doubt they even pay taxes

[Anonymous No.]

>>6648238
>>6621873
>>6621701
>>6621539
whites in full damage control mode
aussies are a bunch of petty cunts
see: tall poppy syndrome

[Anonymous No.]

>>6644355
>>6645168
at least keep up with the gossip if you're gonna rrat post. He killed himself because he was seriously ill and was misdiagnosed with parkinsons.
Imagine these people trying to speculate about haachama.

[Anonymous No.]

I will wait for the Chama.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6646811
Go kill yourself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6646811
this, but also adults shouldn't spend money on v*deo g*mes

[Anonymous No.]

>>6634711
>no ass
>no booty
>no butt
>no badonkadonk
>no culo
cringe

[Anonymous No.]

>>6682246

[Anonymous No.]

>>6621011
It's postpartum depression after giving birth to my child, she'll feel better once she's pregnant with my next one

[Anonymous No.]

>>6629239
That sounds like they're being assholes but really it's not bad advice if you're thinking long-term. Tomino said the same thing
https://altjapan.typepad.com/my_weblog/2011/01/dream-cleaver.html