/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

[Anonymous No.]

How did Idol and Phase become the rising stars of the EN startup world, while most other small corpos have either floundered or largely failed to garner a sizable audience? What did they do right and what should other vtuber corpos learn from them?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Buying ads, unironically

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>Kawaii
Based in japan. Which means they have perms autism despite offering no benefits compared to other corporations.
>Prism
The few people who had a chance to elevate the company out of 'literal who' status were incredibly fucking lazy and pissed it away. Shiki and Luto had a chance to go viral but instead they went afk.
>EIEN
Surprisingly had a chance since the debut, somehow, made waves. They should be a lesson to any future companies: Even if you are starting small you still need to vet your talents. You CAN afford to be moderately picky. Maybe not with numbers, but certainly with personalities and obvious warning signs.

I'm not familiar enough with any of the other small corps to make any comments on them. I will say it's probably a terrible fucking business plan to pay for models and give talents full rights to them if they decide to leave. Because people are just gonna grab the model and be on their way instead of having an incentive to make sure the company succeeds.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700403
>Kawaii
Debuted their first and shortly after their second gen almost a year after Hololive's boom in the west.
Wanted to ride that hype by just debuting girls and just kinda letting them exist.
There was almost no marketing campaign even for their 3D and even for their "long awaited" concert.
They started off as a non idol corpo, until they figured out that they can use the idol gimmick to scam their fans for overpriced 3D for the idol concert that took almost 2 years to put together.
Most talents can't even sing for shit, only Isla and (maybe) Nami can sing. So fake idol corpo.
>Prism
Similar situation. They debuted their girls and just kinda let them exist in the vtuber space, while trying to figure things out on their own.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
They invested money instead of hoping the talents would do everything and strike gold by themselves.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Phase is literally Pippa. Idol has hired suspected HoloEN candidates, hired talents that the audience asks for.

There's nothing more to it. It's not that deep

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
The actually know how to promote themselves, and at least with Pippa, she knows how to grift properly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701226
>suspected holoen candidates
>they're all whores
More like holorejects, imagine being the trashcan of the industry
Buy an ad

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Have enough money to spend on things and not immediately go broke within the first year. The lesson from small corpos like Tsunderia and Cyberlive is if you don't even have enough money to hire staff or do promotions all the talents will leave when their contract is up or even before.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701217
Phase was the same at first. Even their girls admit it. They had nothing at the start and had to make things for streams themselves.
Pippa is the only one that inclined because she actually put in work to exploit the algo. Lia just copied what Pippa did and became "Pipa lite" starting with her Chris Chan stream.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700909
Kawaii deserves to die after they let an entire generation walk out.

>b-but they're entitled zoomer bitches
Your corpo isn't a family, cucktomo, they can walk out if the terms they work under aren't acceptable.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701532
My post is literally shitting on Kawaii and you are calling me a cucktomo?
Why are all /vt/ posters mentally ill like that? Do you just go around and randomly accuse people of being this or that?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701226
10ma is a regular 4view.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701532
>let an entire generation walk out
Let me guess, if they kept them in the company while threatening with lawsuits or whatever, you would call them a "black" company? That is all you redditor faggots can even do these days. You just screech that every company is a black company and how all the girls (that would step over your dead body for a supa) need to be "saved".

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700403
>>55700909
It's also funny that after the Prism CEO sold them off to Sony, he started another vtuber company, just starring an AI vtuber this time. The dude basically started it with minimal investment, did nothing of note for the entire time he owned the company, then bailed when it wasn't making him money.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701858
I wasn't referring to you bro, I was referring to the cucktomo defense force that has a script prepared for their oshi's black company.

>>55702065
No one knows why it happen, just speculation. What is known is that there was a smear campaign to make Kawaii seem blameless while their coworkers enabled Kawaii's fanbase to harass them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Buy an ad

[Anonymous No.]

>>55702661
This isn't a holoboard anymore after Yagoo decided to focus on homos and delay girls for a year lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701532
Holofag-sama please. No one's falling for your consistent anti-Nene diatribes.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55702850
It's a joke that the only people who care about Kawaii are cucktomos because no one else in the corpo has enough fans to defend it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55702505
>there was a smear campaign to make Kawaii seem blameless
Yeah a smear campaign on Kawaii from Sava's Menace clique that sucks Idols dick.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55703120
And you're a schizo, now fuck off. Kawaii has stayed true to its ethos longer than Holoshit ever could.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55703320
>>55703198
kek, why do you cucktomo faggots make it so obvious

[Anonymous No.]

>>55703549
Because, Holofag-sama, you've been seething at Nene for absolutely no reason for about a whole year now. Even though she's singlehandedly carrying Kawaii on her back sometimes and you do nothing but believe rrats that come from schizoboards because it's not your precious Holoshit

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
you need at least one talent with a strong unique personality. phase has at least three, idol also has at least two (maybe more but I don't watch idol often). the rest of the roster can cater to other tastes but you need that backbone to build off of

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>What did they do right and what should other vtuber corpos learn from them?
Get lucky with a breakout talent like Rin or Pippa. Once you have your cash cow try to take a hands-off approach and give them what they want, or they might leave for greener pastures like Pikamee.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>Idol
Started out as one of the worst performing corpos, but unlike other startups that fail, Jew yagoo was able to see the potential for going full in on EN and went above and beyond in scouting, commissioning,and advertising for EN.

Its why the Israel government funding rrat is believable to me, I can't see any other way to explain the sheer amount of money put into Idol EN.

>Phase Connect
For better or worse, Pippa. She is unique in being one of the first vtubers to appeal to a demographic that would never watch vtubers otherwise. That same demographic spread to the corpo overall and got them animations. Despite the "NEET fujo" image, she is also extremely good at networking, and was able to bring other vtuber/youtuber fanbases to phase.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701226
Idol is basically just the Rin company as well.
Roco doesn't have the streaming chops to be a 1k streamer outside of karaoke streams and the rest of gen 2 wasn't the success that jewfags expected. Now it looks like they're ACCELERATING since they're already looking for their 3rd gen, ES branch and restructuring their HE branch at the same time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55705619
At least they're actually doing something instead of just sitting on their ass with no plan for the future in sight, like some other small corpos did.

[Anonymous No.]

Actually scouting talents, for starters.

[Anonymous No.]

High average talent quality, second (and third) only to Hololive. Even the girls nobody watches are good.
And Idol advertises.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55706098
So do you think they have much less viewers compared to Niji EN and Vshojo due to weaker brand power then?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700909
The CEO started Kawaii to mirror Hololive and his Holo oshi and he's an idolfag. Idol is not about always having the best singers. You are just an idol fag LARP. Isla is the best singer but most girls are solid with singing after their vocal/singing lesson. None are as bad as the weakest singers in Holo EN like Fauna. I guess having 3d, concert prep, singing/dancing lesson, and performining concert is not a REAL idol vtuber experience unless you buy the ads.

[Anonymous No.]

JP>EN>ID>JP

[Anonymous No.]

>>55703805
> she's singlehandedly carrying Kawaii on her back sometimes
because competitors were terminated
Remaining girls need new outfits and shit too. family, huh?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701226
To be fair to Phase, it's not JUST that they got lucky with Pippa. They also actually utilized Pippa's success to invest in management, promotion, merch, etc. and elevate the other talents. Plenty of other corpos would have squandered it if they were in that position.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55714705
Phase do seem to be playing things smart, the mahjong collab they're having rn is huge for them

[Anonymous No.]

>>55714519
>because competitors were terminated
Funny how when Lua does GFE and ASMR and gets mid 3view numbers she is not considered Nene's competitor but others for some reason were. lol You dramafags will look for any kind of exuse to shit on Kawaii.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55707649
>Idol is not about always having the best singers
>None are as bad as the weakest singers in Holo EN like Fauna
NTA but while I agree that idol culture isn't about having the best singers, you can surely see how this comes across the wrong way right? You are saying one thing and then targeting low hanging fruit(heh) for being a bad singer.

Idol culture is about taking rough gems and polishing them so they shine. Watching someone's journey as they start out... frankly kinda shit, and slowly turn into something amazing as their dreams come true. That's the essence of idol culture. Oshi literally means push; Fan support is pushing them towards greatness. If they started there they wouldn't be idols to begin with. That said, I agree that Isla is a great idol, and it's a shame she wasn't allowed the center spot because someone's ego wouldn't allow being second place.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55702493
He selected pretty good talents, that's about it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55715555
she's way behind Nene
for her, vtubing is a hobby and side income unlike Nene and some girls from gen3
(still has no new outfit tho)

[Anonymous No.]

>>55716128
I have nothing against the weak singers of Holo neither. I'm just saying that both company have their share of good and bad singers but girls in both company are doing their reps to get better like a real idol journey.
I'm just calling out that anon's idol LARP because he called kawaii "not a real idol" because they just don't try to father the best singers and pay for ads for the biggest number or w/e which is not
Idol about (and underground/indie idols culture exist for a reason as well)
Isla is really talented though. Her lack of growth in number is more due to her busy schedule leading to inconsistent streaming and ESL debuff and somewhat stream mental block. She is still making a lot of call regarding the idol project and basically the de facto leader for it, even if she's not the "center" gimmick or w/e. I think she was on stage more than any other girls during the concert as well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701226
>literally feeding off the scraps of hololive
Ngmi

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
idol is the one other corpos should learn from, crazy how doing the bare minimum of investing in your talents actually manages to breed an enviroment where they will feel comfortable enough to elevate the company they're in with their content, them creating their own models is a big bonus too and makes sense why so many are interested in joining nowadays

[Anonymous No.]

idol are Jewish and Phase are fucking scum.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55718445
> bare minimum
> doesn't know that they spend more on ads that big corpo
They are just have really big pocket and brute force their way in with money

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Phase has the yabbit and idol has the funni purple shorts guy, also yuko is fun and gets me fucking pent up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55718787
/thread

[Anonymous No.]

how many times do you need to make this thread?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700909
>There was almost no marketing campaign even for their 3D and even for their "long awaited" concert.
it was weird they do the whole "kawaii concert is the very first en vtuber concert!" for selling point but i see no promotion anywhere except certain reina's friend mentioning it once

[Anonymous No.]

>>55720585
They've learned from their mistakes and will buy an ad for incoming Nene's solo concert (probably, lol)

[Anonymous No.]

>>55720585
They lost the budget for the concert ads because they had to refund for both sava and Letti's donothon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55720585
Kawaii management unironically doesn't believe in online marketing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55720585
The best part? Come concert time, the entire thing was locked behind a paywall. So not only did they not advertise it, people who might have been curious enough to check it the day of, didn't even have a way to watch it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55721970
but enough about Hololive

[Anonymous No.]

>>55718445
>>55699622
>>55701226
Idol also seems to target the niche Holo is not. For all the people asking for a HoloEU (other than Kiara), Idol is mostly EU-friendly candidates.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55721012
so only nene gets advertising for her stuff?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Fish stumbled on women who are parasocial and use their chat to determine their self worth (tenma excluded).
Mossad bought ads.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
I think if you take your starter gen as like your starter Pokemon, if you have a really good talent or two in the starting lineup that gets people to get over their doubts and prejudices about unknowns, and that means everything for growth. They need a headliner, someone who gets really-noticed to get the foot in the door and hold it open until they can recruit more talents and get a better spread and increased odds of getting more talents that wind up a hit. If they don't have that anchor talent, they don't last long enough to expand.

Pippa is what got Phase established as a thing, and for Idol it was actually Katta and Nikki who held the fort until their ENs came and then Yuuko has held the for since and now they have several strong new talents to spread out.

The one where this did not hold out was Kawaii where Nene is their big anchor ... But Kawaii did expand and their recent gen was pretty good.. but they literally fucking all quit for some reason so they are back to square one basically, unless they got Beryl. but I suspect idol/phase are gunning for Beryl and are more attractive/well known corpos so basically the gravity of corpos starts to naturally pull in more ambitious talents and more options and they snowball. Phase's top-end of viewership is bigger than Idol but I feel like idol has a larger spread of even attention over their girls vs some Phases being rather small in statues next to their big ones. I really dunno which one will be bigger in a year but it could be either and I think it is possible we will soon see a """small""" corpo with mostly similar or better stats than NijiEN by then. In which case they are small only because they don't have like 200 JP tubers bringing in millions but on the EN side are very competitive. Aviel and Fishman are both proactive and aggressive in trying to scope out new high talents and if they can convince any nijiEN last or present to join that might be a watershed for whoever gets one first.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722197
she isn't either

[Anonymous No.]

It's kinda amazing how hard this board jerk off to paying (((online ads))) as soon as the jew enter the market though

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722520
Lastly I forgot to say Pixel is kinda neat and has not fucked up too bad yet and their anchor chuuba Raki is very cute and a natural. But they are right now like how Phase was when they were new, but because they are so young (u-uoh) as a corpo they have not had time to prove themselves yet and clearly do not have the money to just buy an ad like idol did. The ads fucking worked though. That and the very positive reception they got including here. Idol got a good foothold because for a long time holoEN looked tired and misled and only declining, so had a good while to build up before Advent came and blew away those mounting doubts about the branch. Pixel was not so lucky in this regard and I think will be lucky to survive next to Advent and several other way-more established names, brand newcomers these days are like.. smaller than small corpo. Babby corpo, is what Pixel is.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>Phase
Not being retards and Pippa being surprisingly good at networking

>Idol
Money

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Phase did it by being relatively unique and Idol scammed the Israeli government

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722520
Anon... Beryl was part of Kawaii already, that's why you got cucktomos crying about how she jumps companies when she probably walked away for the same reason their entire Gen 3 did. No chance in hell she's going back, considering Nene deleted her channel out of jealousy too.

[Anonymous No.]

It's a certain hour in a certain county so you'll naturally see more posts praising phase while shit talking idol, both are great despite what threadshitters might say

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723096
They really need to unite forces. Imagine what a partnership would look like.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
both are one talent company - Pippa and Rin.
problem that Idol has is that there is no other talents to support them (like Tenma does) - Yuko had a chance but I don't think she has a motivation; rest of EN1 is just there, while EN2 is underperforming (maybe they get better but I'm not sure about that).

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723142
They should do a power move and unite their companies to become the strongest western en corpo

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701226
numbers seem pretty healthy across the board for them though, Pippa and Tenma are the standouts but the rest are easy three views with slow inclines.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723039
> Nene deleted her channel out of jealousy
didn't happen

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723338
They won't overtake Vshojo as long as Ironmouse is in it. She has more viewers than all of Idol combined.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723482
Where is Hana’s channel then?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723606
Who?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>It's january 2024
>Both idol and Phase Connect have been dropping cryptic messages for a few days
>They announce it out of nowhere
>Idol Connect, all the positives of both agencies in one new bigger and upgraded big corpo
Thoughts?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722813
>Pippa being surprisingly good at networking
Not DMing people back for 5 months is good?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723039
>when she probably walked away for the same reason their entire Gen 3 did.
So you don't even know why she left you are just making up shit because you're a catalog thread reader?
>Hana joins Kawaii, a Japanese company in an attempt to get a Japanese visa
>Doesn't get the Japanese visa
>Leaves
It was as simple as that. She didn't even spend a few months in a company and when she reincarnated again, she barely streamed. Who's fault was that? Kawaii's fault again...somehow...magically?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723482
>>55723688
Cucktomos trying to rewrite history once again kek, no wonder nobody likes you faggots

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723749
>Idol Connect
Retarded, I like it

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723776
Vtubers really like her for some reason

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723790
>and when she reincarnated again, she barely streamed
You're correct on all your points except this. Stop saying that she barely streamed when she rarely missed her schedule and frequently streamed 6 days a week.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723749
> Thoughts?
Buy an ad

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722194
>Idol also seems to target the niche Holo is not. For all the people asking for a HoloEU (other than Kiara), Idol is mostly EU-friendly candidates.
Same goes with Nijisanji, I think, because arent all their UK/EU talents males?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723922
I think idol will be buying some by the end of this month so just wait

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723749
Their forces combined would be pretty immense honestly but I don't know if it would really cause instant growth for either batch of talents. Phases collabing with Rin or Idols collabing with Pippa would cross pollinate viewerships sure - but is there any reason you can't just have Rin and Pippa collab without having to merge?

In any case I do think a more formal idol/phase alliance would be better than one purposefully or not causing bad blood with the other in the long run. If you get into a fight with someone, even if you win, you might still get bruised and a bloodied broken nose in the process so why do that when you could just choose not to.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Advertising and having breakout stars that offered something different with Pippa and Rin respectively.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723790
Of course we don't know because corpos love to shut talents up with NDAs. But you read between the lines and you see her basically saying "I told you so". But again, could mean anything because that's how they operate. Pretty sure Nene thought the same, hence her sperging out at her fanart and having management delete her channel.

>Japanese visa
You know how I can call out that you're full of shit with your own retard rrat? Because she was in Kawaii in the middle of the pandemic, Japan literally did not allow foreigners back in after kicking them out. Star Ring, a corpo she had nothing bad to say about, managed to snag her while providing a visa AFTER Japan had started allowing foreigners back in. And unlike the time she left Kawaii, she didn't return to streaming on her indie account after Beryl, so she got poached, probably by Phase. Whoever poached her helped her pay the contract termination fee too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722520
>Yuuko
Boobro pls, we all know Rin is the main girl for Idol, no matter how many times you seethe about it

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723894
He's talking about that time she streamed as the Pear. He neglects to say she streamed on discord for her groomers almost daily, probably to avoid the stream ban that Star Ring implemented after she was selected to be Beryl.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Two words: Untapped markets

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700403
I'd honestly more argue that the problem with prism is that there's been next to no actual activity in the company for close to 2 years. Half the talents still don't have 2nd outfits, events are pretty much non existent, merchandise is usually only done for birthdays and anniversaries, Sony hasn't bought any ads whatsoever supporting them.
Everyone in prism hated the dude who ran it and celebrated sonys buyout but literally Sony has done just slightly more than he did.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722520
>Aviel and Fishman are both proactive and aggressive in trying to scope out new high talents and if they can convince any nijiEN last or present to join that might be a watershed for whoever gets one first.
If the rumors are to be believed, there are going to be a bunch of ex-Nijis out there in a couple of months/year, but are Fish and Aviel really that interested in picking up several sx-Nijis?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55704878
>She is unique in being one of the first vtubers to appeal to a demographic that would never watch vtubers otherwise.
Which one is that?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55714705
Ehhh honestly if Pippa were to yab hard enough to get fired or graduate I don't honestly think the company would survive. Even with tenma. Pippa is quite literally the only thing their company is known for. Go to twitter and you'll see 99% of phase connects fans are just pink rabbit fans who give the others scraps when she's not streaming

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724553
A mix of the kiwi/IBS crowd which is alot bigger than you'd think and the general normie youtube crowd, from her youtube shorts blowing up

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723887
Because she's popular.
That's literally it.

Vtubers will collab with pretty much anyone if they can hit high 3view -low 4view status

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722726
Nothing about V&U? They just debut their third Generation: Oracle.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724533
Currently there's only 2 potential ex-Nijis they can hire since their agencies are all-female and I don't really see either of them wanting to try another agency this soon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700909
>no one can sing
>this makes it a fake idol corpo
This faggot does not know anything about idols

[Anonymous No.]

Idol is being smart by exploring the demographics that Hololive, for some reason, refuses to touch (Europeans and now Spanish), alongside an aggresive advertising.
Phase offers a strong and unique niche of crazy women that no other company has.
These, plus having a breakout star (Rin and Pippa, respectively) made these two companies evolve from small into middle-sized corpos
>>55722726
Those guys REALLY got unlucky with Advent debuting so close to their first gen. It will be a miracle if they get any substancial growth in the future.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724533
Depends if they can get girls to reform and be more holo-like. Like for example I cannot see Nina in either of those whatsoever, Zaion maybe. If more nijiEN girls quit many have had their names kind of dirtied by being made such blatant arm candy for the dudes and playing second-fiddle. If like Rosemi or Pomu leave I think both of those would probably hold out for Hololive or bust, but if Holo staff say they are specifically barred or NijiEN had a non-compete specifically for just Holo etc, if there was a scenario where it was either be indie or join phase or idol I suspect -maybe- they could get a Niji girl.

Funny thing is I think it is possible NijiEN girls are all a kind of poisoned well at this point and would have serious pros and cons. A small corpo picking up one of them surely would be getting her just to have one, just to say they are if that caliber and hoping the giant sub counts those girls have would translate over to buff their companies. But I think even though nijiEN girls have way bigger subs than small corpos they seem far more dead in % if many of them are 3views in the modern-day. And it is hard to think of girl-only corpos taking in someone like Reimu who relentlessly rode Vox's dick or Finana with her educate yourselves/parasocial fucks type gaffes.

Perhaps the funny irony is even though nijiEN girls are in large corpo they only work as they are pretty much exactly into that one corpo and would be hated most anywhere else (besides vshojo, that is the one singular similar level). The ones who are liked so much people would be willing to overlook some male collabs like Pomu like I said just really do not feel like they would settle for small corpos, Pomu would totally make it fine as an indie I think. Rosemi in.. Phase or Idol? Would be really really amusing to see but I just don't feel like she would do that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724714
>all-female
3 ex-Nijis then

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724978
>BUT WHAT ABOUT THE PENIS?!
/vt/ will always find a way to shove penis into convos...

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723749
It’s so funny how some phase girls want to jump ship.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55725081
I don't see Unnamed or whatever her name is now ever wanting to play a female role.

[Anonymous No.]

Kawaii anti posting started shortly after idolEN was announced

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724978
Cover right now has nothing to gain from getting Niji-scraps. Luna was a one time thing over 3 years ago when they were still growing but right now it's way more interesting for them to hire people who have interesting qualities but haven't proven themselves yet than picking up someone who already had their chance and have a considerable public baggage, not to mention if any of the Niji girls jump ship to Holo they WILL be harassed by the sisters. Zaion/Sayu got her entire life doxxed because Anycolor painted a target on her back, so thinking a similar thing won't happen with someone who "betrays" the rainbow company is stupidity.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55725421
They gathered antis after the Holostars EN debut when people shilled them as a no-males alternative. That was the NijiEN type fan on the board, and they particularly hate Nene's type of content.
Then the company, like it or not, was critically damaged by the Gen3 debacle and probably won't ever recover. Anti posting ramped up even more after that from fans of those girls, and that's to be expected. For many people, if a girl is their oshi they don't want to accept any criticism of her, and that's easy to do when the details and proof are opaque as is usually the case with behind the scenes corporate stuff. So they can comfortably attribute all blame to the company and the remaining talents, turning them into a villain worth attacking, and mentally absolve the girl they like of any wrongdoing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55725842
>Anti posting ramped up even more after that from fans of those girls
Their fans dont really care and some of them still watch Kawaii. But even if they cared enough to antipost, it wouldnt matter. There aren't that many of them here, they cant even keep their own thread alive
the no male shilling is also from the antis btw, most shill threads in the catalogs are thinly veiled antiposts

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723749
It wont be the worse thing to happen

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724710
I like all the girls. Their debuts were also successful, ranging from 1.2K to 1.6K viewers live.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724710
They are okay
Some of the girls are a bit too western and zoomers for my taste, but still tolerable and they don't male collab.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55727994
>they don't male collab
You'll be disappointed. I will still watch them, though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Most corpos are run by retards who at best believe that all they have to do is throw some models at girls and then they'll magically be profitable/hololive huge in a month. They have no idea how to run a business, let alone anything about the market itself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55726217
I know that at least one guys camps /pkg/ and anti-posts because he replied in our thread to something what was supposed to be in some other corpo threads and it seems that he is shitting up some other generals too. Some people are just pathetic and do nothing but troll generals all day.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55728164
most corpos just want to do their own thing and have a niche audience instead of trying to be the next hololive
kawaii girls straight up said don't join us if you want to be big

[Anonymous No.]

>>55728408
They do want to be big but none of the girls expect to be big by the brand name and want to build up their audience and appreciate the ones they already have.
It's sad that small corpo scenes and small corpo audience judge a corpo by how much they "pay for ads". The small corpo scene did grow, but at some cost of the values of small corpo as well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55728408
>don't join us if you want to be big
They said don't expect instant success. Some people see Idol and expect 500-600 ccv right off the bat which is unrealistic. Not even all Idol members have those numbers I know because I watch Fuyo sometimes ToT. And not even all of phase have those numbers. I watch Wemi. Uruka and Airi and depending on the stream they are usually around 200-300 ccv unless they get raided.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55728640
And also, they are more concern with people just applying to join for number boost, but is not comfortable working in a corpo. If they just join for the number and see the corpo aspect as inferences and restriction against them, it's not really a good environment to be in.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701331
sweet sweet holotears

[Anonymous No.]

What's wrong with all of these Kawaii fans. With how crazy they are defending Kawaii and how many thread are there in the catalogue (they even pick a fight with Holofans), you though they're pretty big.
But no, some of them talent doesn't even reach 3 digit average viewers.
Are they really just some of the loudest fans here?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55729487
Maybe they just like their Kawaii oshi.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55729487
falseflag by idolfags

[Anonymous No.]

>>55729487
Like it usually is, at least half of the answer is "dramaniggers falseflagging". Defending a questionable corpo is good bait.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723749
Nice, nice... very interesting. But how about this....

>Hololive acquires Idol Corp and renames it Hololive EU

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>Phase
They got pretty lucky with their Gen 1 talent, and no, I don't just mean Pippa becoming their breakout girl and funneling people into their "vtuber rabbit hole". Despite their lax early recruitment and questionable priorities, they landed themselves a good mix of professionalism, outreach, industry knowledge and willingness to grind among the talent - and despite the meme about all Phase girls being menheras, they didn't get much of the kind of menhera that rots the company culture and poisons relationships. In many ways, their talent compensated for poor management early on, and helped the company find its footing.

They are now trying to convert that "footing" into long term success. Management and business decision making may remain questionable, but I see no obvious red flags, and them getting more sponsorships now is a good sign.

>Idol
Went for a tech startup model of "burn investor cash early on for the sake of growth, reinvest everything into growth, hope to convert growth into profits down the line". Mix of good luck and good scouting landed them some solid talent, and they aren't afraid of sinking money into supporting their talent. Probably the most growth-oriented of all small corpos.

Them trying for an ES branch is a red flag, in my eyes. IMO a very poor decision, but they obviously are willing to take a risk for a chance of cracking open what they see as a new market worth pursuing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55730059
>Them trying for an ES branch is a red flag, in my eyes. IMO a very poor decision, but they obviously are willing to take a risk for a chance of cracking open what they see as a new market worth pursuing.

To be fair, investing in Indonesia did work out for Cover. They should fucking drop Tempus though. Along with HoloEarth. If Indonesia could bring about a return, maybe there might be something in Spanish vtubers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55730159
>investing in Indonesia did work out for Cover
and it completely ruined the whole vtubing community

[Anonymous No.]

>>55730189
Oh yeah because Vshojo and it's orbiter turned out so great for Vtubing community.
Thanks, america

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722073
Are you seriously comparing it with Hololive concert?
HAHAHAHAHAHA

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724710
I enjoy most of them, theres also Vreverie thats fairly successful and has some decent chuubas

[Anonymous No.]

>>55730159
HoloID is actually one of the big reasons why I think IdolES is a bad idea. Another big reason is Nijisanji IN.

HoloID shows that even Indonesia market is almost too small to subsist of - which is why so many of their Indonesia girls end up tapping EN to some degree. And Nijisanji IN goes to show how "it has lots of people, so it must be a market worth pursuing" can easily go wrong.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55730774
Considering that Hololive ID had turned out more of a profit than Tempus, I prefer to be skeptical. You are right that it's a smaller market, but I think its too easy to think "any market is too small". This isn't the same case as Nijisanji with India, where they didn't do their research. And Nijisandi Indonesia not working out is ultimately because, well, it's Nijisanji - Riku will just accelerate. The tech seems to cover first before the talent.

Cover has made it clear that focus should be on international growth over just specific regions, which is why Idol's Spanish decision is interesting - they could go for a specific Spanish demographic (which is a red flag, yes), or go for a more diverse and widespread Spanish-speaking diaspora (maybe get a Mexican, get an EU Spaniard, and so on). I think the latter would be a more interesting option.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700403
qrd on Luto? I occasionally watch Prism but don't know why she went on break

[Anonymous No.]

To all the kawaii antis with their "black company" nonsense, explain how the big bad kawaii let Gen 3 out of a 12-month contract months early, when a black company would force them to stay and stream,
how they had been open and transparent about previous graduations and terminations,
and how if they're so bad, why experienced members like Lua, or ones who take no shit like Charzu and Nami, are still there. Riddle me this, Batman.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55729487
>antis attack a small corp and its talents
>fans defend them
>"why are these fans so crazy?"
I very rarely see them shilled in the catalog these days (and even less so as a genuine shill post rather than baiting), most discussion is instigated by antis.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55700403
>They should be a lesson to any future companies: Even if you are starting small you still need to vet your talents. You CAN afford to be moderately picky. Maybe not with numbers, but certainly with personalities and obvious warning signs.
(You) don't get it. Eri WANTED talents with those personalities.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701331
>o-other fans are all unicorns just like me!
seethe moar incel

[Anonymous No.]

>>55702850
>>55703320
Sure thing, Nene.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>garner a sizable audience
Both companies have one or two breakouts and everyone else is varying levels of "who?"

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
I really hope Idol corp can put out a concert someday.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255

[Anonymous No.]

>>55734864
Second wave of invaders is so forgetable.I already forgot that Ember exists.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55699622
This they bought ads and generally have good management.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55735573
Weirdly, even PRISM beat Phase on Invaders 2.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723983
>Males
Anon...

[Anonymous No.]

I will never watch your irrelevant chuubas no matter how many threads you make

[Anonymous No.]

>>55736614
Thanks for the bump!

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
They made their talents happy

[Anonymous No.]

>Catalog post featuring Idol and Phase
>People malding over Kawaii
We've done it. Rent free.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55735573
Jelly is great. Also the only EN cunny streaming on SEA hours.
Her Saya no Uta streams have been hilarious.
t. idolbro

[Anonymous No.]

>>55735819
Who?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55731534
> Charzu
almost got fired too

[Anonymous No.]

>>55730059
seeing how few company owners decided to set up a basic support structure and were able to admit they're bad at something was a sobering experience. some seemed to have no business sense at all

[Anonymous No.]

>>55737198
> Her Saya no Uta streams
interesting. will watch

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Jew money and Jew money

[Anonymous No.]

They're just a 99 on the scale of retardation when all the other small corpos are a 100. That's why.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55735819
>Emma
Ewwwww gross. ESL SEA hag voice and cheap coombaiting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55737868
while it may seem small the difference between really stupid and full retard is an important one

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722387
You don't watch Tenma

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724978
Zaion's current personality highly likely fits in Phase.
But Zaion joining the Jew corp would be kino. Would be a coming home to Zaion moment

[Anonymous No.]

>>55729487
A decent contingent of Kawaii fans are former (probably now current after Advent) hololive fans that left due to Tempus in 2022 and tend to.be on the vocal extremist side. Like a group of Puritans, in the classical sense, leaving and joining a colony tailor-made for them.

[Anonymous No.]

I enjoy both Fuyo and Panko, they're great

[Anonymous No.]

>>55714705
For what i heard Phase is a special case, succes didnt got into Pippa's head so she probably allowed herself to be low balled while, and this is the really surprising part, her CEO actually reinvested the money on the company instead of buying a yatch.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Idol Corp used Jewish money for advertisements. Phase Connect got lucky with good talents.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Simple, they have management that aren't schizos (Cyberlive, WACTOR, MyHolo, Amberglow), and management that actually gives a shit about running a company (Tsunderia, Cyberlive), and they aren't plagued with psycho mean girl talents (Cyberlive, Project Kawaii, Amberglow, WACTOR)

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722709
I mean, if wasnt for their 2nd gen ads i would know Phase Connect existed

[Anonymous No.]

>>55739183
>Good talents
>Small corpo
Choose one, the only good talents are the ones chosen by Hololive let's not get ahead of ourselves here

[Anonymous No.]

>>55723749
Don't the ex-CyberLive girls hate each other?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724553
Right-wing chuds who think anime is stupid

[Anonymous No.]

>>55739530
Nah, the only ones holding a grudge are the untalented ones who became vtweeters

[Anonymous No.]

>>55739395
He obviously means 'good enough to potentially be chosen by hololive' anon; exceptional talents that if bestowed the blue dorito could maybe transform into becoming good. It goes without saying that no talent can be good on their own without the magical triangle.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724469
Not really, its more of "ads in a time in which people were leaving HoloEN because only Kiara, Bae, Yris and Fauna bothered to stream."

[Anonymous No.]

>>55729487
I mean Kawaii is no WACTOR so it is kinda sad seeing them get fucked over, specially when they provide a niche.

[Anonymous No.]

Pippa fly's way too close to the sun and her management is getting worse at tard wrangling her. She's also a terrible judge of character. I think she'll eventually get wrapped up in a controversy that they can't weasel her out of. And, no, I don't mean getting teenagers on twitter pissy because she played a Harry Potter game.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55739935
It's a little funny and a little sad thinking about the Jap boomers that had no idea what they were getting into when they decided to hire westerners

[Anonymous No.]

>>55730774
Dude ID has turned 2/3 of the profits of EN

[Anonymous No.]

>>55739669
>Unironically believes some phase connect girls could get into Hololive
My fucking sides

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Jew man treats the company of trying to raise interest as much as possible. He doesn't mind if he's in minimum profits cos he comes from a marketing background.

Chinese fish Jew man is treating phase as a start up and therefore knows how to be clever and tech savvy.

other corpos focused on the smaller picture while phase and Idol focus on the company. Unironically by not putting content creation first these two have succeeded. By trying to solely be the most entertaining you've already failed Vtuber 101

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740028
Kawaii's CEO and management are like in their 20 and early 30's
KAOLIN IS CUTE CUTE
But it is true that they don't know what western zoomers are like. In fact, all kawaii girls hired before gen 3 are like 25 + and 2 are already used to working as jp OL so they fit in easily.

[Anonymous No.]

I just want her to have a good ending

[Anonymous No.]

>>55729242
why would they cry, even le "based" pippa admit on stream to be a holoreject and unicorn of holo lmao said by herself not speculation

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724553
I think she did two YT analytic so far over and its shown that over half of her fanbase just simply doesnt consume vtubers

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740120
Nah it's impossible for them now, the black mark of Phase is a stain that can never be washed away. If thing had gone a different way and they never joined they might have been saved tho.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740178
PLAP PLAP PLAP

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740178
Indisputable one of best chuubas in the small corpo space right now. You can't prove me wrong sorry

[Anonymous No.]

>>55739395
yeah just like the dogs or bijou or shiori right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724191
NTA, but are you saying she ditched kawaii to go indie, got picked up by a native japanese agency to fulfill her nipponese dreams, and now she's ditched that as well for some unkown reason that's assumed a poach from a larger company? This girl is worse than Rosemi.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740120
It's just vt that hates Phase.
There are a few Phase girls I could see joining Hololive.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724710
I got fished by youtube ads for their 3rd gen debuts while not even knowing they existed before, so I gave them a chance.
I rate the debuts 6/10, positive for technical competence and models, negative for talent vocals and personality.

Maybe they're nice people but they weren't very good entertainers. And for some reason all of them speak in a odd or stiff way like B-tier anime EN dub voice actors. I got enough chuubas on my plate already so I won't be following them further unless they have some meme go viral or loosen up their vocals.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
One lesson that always stuck out to me was:

Don't join a company that was originally based in Japan, like Prism or Kawaii - you only get all the negatives like games permissions autism and buerocratic bullshit, with none of the benefits of Hololive, i.e. the massive fanbase that guarantees every talent a six-figgy subcount and a five-figgy monthly income just for showing up, which can tide over a lot of frustration when dealing with Hololive's restrictions. But if you're only streaming to around 100 viewers and only make three fiddy, there's no point in having to also deal with the limiting game perms and overbearing buerocracy of a JP small corpo, just stick to western (or at least non-JP) corpos, or hell even just stay indie and spare yourself the headache for no gain.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724978
>cannot see Nina in phase
are you deaf dumb and blind? she'd be a shoo-in at phase. She'd be a perfect foil for pippa if they did phase weekly or some other short form talk show together.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55741290
So your gauge of a VTuber's quality is when they get turned into memes? I guess that's the reason hololive and Niji are boring as fuck. They serve people with shit taste.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Well, Phase only got "big" due to Pippa appealing to 4chan and KFers. the rest of the girls are pretty much literal who low 3views.

Idol has jew money/tactics. They managed to abuse the shorts algo perfectly, which caused their meteoric rise.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55741458
The idea is to get those 100 viewers, which is a fucking lot if you are a complete nobody, and assure half of them to follow you after you leave the company a year later.

[Anonymous No.]

I don't trust Jews, that's the only reason I will not watch idol, phase is fine I guess

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740178
Ami...

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740990
She went back mto her indie PL but didn't even stream. Apparently It seems like she only would do vtuber as a mean to an end (jp visa, or a lot of money) instead of enjoying it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55741979
>the rest of the girls are pretty much literal who low 3views.
False.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
PixelLink is following in their footsteps and doing it well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55737198
awawawawa

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
phase panders to edgy viewers/4channers which has enough of an audience to make them decently successful. Plus the trickle down effect from Pippa/Tenma and to a lesser degree Lumi. Idol panders to the vshojo type audience with onlyfans tier members streams. The head idol jew putting the company into the red to buy ads has definetely helped as well. I'd say trickle down effect from Rin. But I don't think there is any overlap with her fanbase and the rest of them. Could be wrong. There also shitting out gens like nijisanji now. So that has kept up the hype around the company. Think there doing 3 gens this year alone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55743174
yeah

[Anonymous No.]

>Idol
>Carried hard by Rin
>Phase
>Carried hard by Pippa
Not that that is bad, the carries have been slowly shilling the rest of their company, which shows the benefits of joining a corpo, free exposure. Eventually, someone else would/may catch on, allowing the company to grow and thrive.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55743251
All the girls have been entertaining. Hopefully they can get a new gen out soon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
They both are far right reactionary corporations that pander terminally online crypto fascist virgins.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55744028
Surely you could have added a few more buzzwords.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55743931
You do know that saying the word "Carry" will get you permabanned.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55735819
Why do they all look the same

[Anonymous No.]

>>55743251
Pixellink is still too young to say anything. We know that they aren't giving their talents proper hardware given that Raki is still streaming from a shit laptop.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55741759
My gague of a vtuber's quality is how they present themselves on debut and V&U Gen 3 failed on that part. What I actually meant is I would give them a second chance if they made THEMSELVES into memes, like Rin Penrose or Miori Celestia.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55743251
>>55744491
They also have shitty two year contracts and the kuro threads were certainly juicy....
Nothing against the girls but I can't have any faith supporting the corpo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55738073
she loves her chat and all, but she's more capable of telling people to fuck off in a serious way. I exclude tenma from "determines their slef worth from chat" as a compliment.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55744583
Do you actually believe anything in the kuro threads? They're just full of people making shit up and arguing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
holoen fucked up council. thats it. the timing phase and idol fits perfectly

[Anonymous No.]

>>55744583
Nigga, the kuro threads are just schizos amplifying and cataloguing what people make up for catalogbaiting threads.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55743931
>>55745340
Honestly, I like competition. Hololive being the "only" good idol vtuber company would lead to stagnation. Competition helps companies to not grow complacent and to improve on their strengths and talents. Its why I believe in Idol corp, even if its literally jidf-grade Hololive. AT least its better than Nijisanji

And of course, I like it when different companies do come together and collab too. I really appreciate the collabs between Hololive and Nijisanji & Vshojo, and hope that Holo will collab with Idol corp someday.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55741458
well, still better than SEA corpos and WACTOR

[Anonymous No.]

>>55745340
Council did fine, releasing Tempus 2 is what really drove a bunch of people off

[Anonymous No.]

>>55701226
>Running a business
>Get lucky
>It's not that deep
Anon has legitimately 0 experience running a business.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55705619
>roco
nigga you don't even know their names, stop talking as if you know anything. yuko is huge and both roca and coni have had 1k+ viewers on multiple streams and they've been streaming for a month. they're on a much stronger trajectory than phase and pretending otherwise is retarded.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55747905
Roca only passes 1k on karaoke streams, Coni has one stream above that.
You might not like her but Idol is Rin's company, Yuko is doing fine but she has fallen off recently.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55742161
>The idea is to get those 100 viewers, which is a fucking lot if you are a complete nobody, and assure half of them to follow you after you leave the company a year later.
Sure, but did that ever reliably work in practice?
I can't think of many success stories of people leaving small corpos, most I saw were just floundering again as indies and have not really moved on to greater and better things.
Only obvious exceptions are the few people from sinking ship trashfire companies like Cyberlive or Tsunderia who were eventually picked up by better companies like Phase or Idol, where you can argue that yeah that's obviously an upgrade.
Kawaii's gen 3 also didn't prove this point, so far they're hardly doing as well, or rather even worse, on their own and for all the gripes you can have with the company it's arguable the structure (of any established company) does in fact do provide some intangible "box pushing" benefit to the branding, group identity and fandom attachment of otherwise isolated unremarkable vtubers in a sea of others, that's very hard to replicate or build from the ground up on your own again.

[Anonymous No.]

Funny how this thread was shitting on Kawaii earlier and today they got acquired by a larger JP media group

[Anonymous No.]

>>55748166
>coni
8+ streams at 1k+
>roca
11+ streams at 1k+

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749242
yeah, because that worked out so well for Prism before.
Kawaii is gonna become a real contender now... lmao

[Anonymous No.]

This thread has made me realize I need to step out of the Holo / Niji bubble and actually watch smaller corpos.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749146
Miori?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55746287
That’s not a very high standard though

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749342
this is Coni, so where are all those streams?

[Anonymous No.]

https://twitter.com/Prodkawaii/status/1689637729485963264

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749746
you think she only did 14 streams? there are 41 on her youtube channel, obviously excluding ones that were privated and unarchived. stop using playboard, it's garbage.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Lack of internal yabs. To date NO vtuber company has ever been taken down by external drama, only internal menhara implosions. Pippa may be yabbing every other day, but it's all external drama that doesn't matter. She's not shit talking the other girls in the company or stealing money or anything. She may not be best friends with fishman, but she can legitimately interview him on stream and everything is fine.
Just the basic foundation of no one in the company hating anyone else goes a long way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749802
If the company doesn't have any clear goals for the vtuber company, then its fucking over, the girls might as well start bailing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749242
will they buy an ad?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55724553
mostly over 25 year olds with disposable incomes that normally don't watch vtubers and are starved for content all while being more likely to spend a lot of money on a single streamer and are usually very loyal but need sheparding before entering the fanbase, they are the reason that Pippa can become one of the most superchated on youtube while being a tenth the size of most corpo tubers
a lot of other corpos aim for 15-20 year olds (for sponsorships) and rest on the back of a much smaller whale audience to keep the train running

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749440
Same. I've been enjoying Idol content lately. I'm still msotly a Holobrony, and the twins are gonna be my oshi, but I definitely enjoy the /jidf/ community and content.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55750770
Phase had an internal yab with Yuri. No details known, rrats abound. But they did flat out fire Yuri - and given the amount of yab, controversy and delinquency Phase tolerates in their talent, some serious shit must have went down for that to happen.

It was a far cry from being something that kills the corpo though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749440
You should, really.

Big corpos have no monopoly on great talent. There's plenty of vtubers in small corpos and in indie space that you may find worth watching.

Can't really shill anyone cause everyone's tastes are different, but confining yourself to a single corpo is pretty stupid.

[Anonymous No.]

I'm fairly new to the small corpo scene. Even after HoloEN Gen 3 finally came out I'm still just loving the small corpos. If it weren't for the long drought that HoloEN had I would have never branched out. I first got interested in IdolEN gen1 and watched a lot of that group. I also watched a lot of Pippa/Phase and the Kawaii girls before the 3rd gen walked out. However after some time I think about how much fun it is to be a part of these groups.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
Idol is doing great because they actually invest in their talents, but Phase literally has only 2 people carrying it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55722813
>>55704878
>Pippa is good at networking
This is the answer, I know alot of people who only know Pippa and phase overall from a fleshtuber or random vtuber collab she did. anyone who doesn't believe that she is an extrovert who knows the youtube game like the back of her hand fell for the kayefabe.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55753003
To be a yab that actually damages the company in any significant way, the talent in question must either be internally popular (to cause factionalism because some talents are with her and some aren't) or externally popular (to have a large enough fanbase that would turn against the company).
Yuri was neither. Internally she seemed pretty isolated and no one stuck their neck out for her. The news of her firing were either ignored or just got a curt "yeah well, she kinda deserved it, anyway moving on..." response from the other talents, suggesting she was not well liked or connected enough to let it spark a larger company-threatening civil war.

Same story externally, it's not like her fans (all five of them, lmao) were up in arms brigading the company, everyone just kinda moved on as if nothing happened (because let's face it, she really was that insignificant in the grand scheme of things) and the company didn't lose any significant audience over this. It'd be different if that happened with someone the stature of say Pippa, who basically IS half of PC's popularity in the first place.

[Anonymous No.]

I think if these two small corpos *Idol/Phase* wanted to get serious they should combine forces. Not merge or anything retarded like that but kind of just intermingle talents with collabs and mentions for events. Business side of things a lot of small companies in the same field give each other a shout out to keep up with the giants like Holo and Niji in this case. NijiEN is on it's deathbed and someone is in line to take it's place soon.

[Anonymous No.]

Besides Rin, Idol's EN Gen1 has been either stagnant or declining since ENGen2 came in. Yuko hit the wall hard and has fallen off.

>>55754076
>2
Only 1. Pippa.
Tenma is much much much much closer to Shiina, Lumi and Lia. But at least Tenma and Lia are hustlers and great at networking. They both have scored every major collab outside for Phase.

[Anonymous No.]

phase's newest gen was DoA and while idolEN gen2 were doing good at first their viewers are plummeting following the debut of advent. i'm not seeing this massive success that others are talking about except for pippa who is the sole exception because she's entirely her own thing

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754278
Phase had no new gen. What the fuck are you talking about?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754381
>pretending to be retarded
whatever floats your boat. i'm sure you know what i mean, anon

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754381
>>55754444
I'm sure he knows what he meant. Invaders 2 were really that insignificant.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754278
You're not seeing any "massive" success because it's a slow process. If you watch strictly numbers I would argue both of their boxes are growing. You have to understand it's very competitive and saturated market as is with two giants in the room. The audience is there. It just needs time to get big enough to get bandwagon effect tourists to feel comfortable enough to integrate and pretend they were always fans.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55741592
Pippa would be physically incapable of interacting with her. She has a menhera meltdown the instant any of the "high tier" vtubers she admires as much as says hi to her, and Nina happens to be her Niji oshi.

If you forced the two together in the same stream Pippa would straight up vomit.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754444
>>55754542
Invaders should be compared to Invaders. Idol has an Invader gen.
Ember, Jelly, and Dizzy destroy Riro Ron.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754542
Yeah the fish dropped the ball. Invaders 2 was basically 2 obvious Nepo hires and a decent SEA indie. They could have just debuted Jelly and nothing would have changed desu

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754103
The talents of the two do collab at times, so the "big small corpos" clearly don't see each other as all out enemies. But I agree that more small corpo joint action would be pretty cool.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754572
Of course, you need to make your own rules to make Phase cool. What a cuck.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754381
He either mistook the new Invader hires for a gen, or is a shizo or some kind.

[Anonymous No.]

Phase is collabing with Pomu soon and it isn't Tenma or Pippa doing it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55753003
>But they did flat out fire Yuri
Her contract was not renewed which is way off from "fired".

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754572
>Ember, Jelly, and Dizzy destroy Riro Ron.
Give me one stream that they did thats better than this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4-2BRBENdk

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754774
She was terminated with cause. You can cope all you want. Bitch was fired.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754789
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1qsB0yNe-U

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754572
Riro Ron went under a lot of self healing to even consider making a comeback. Being a solo project on top of disappearing for almost a year it's a miracle she is where she is today. I don't know much about the Phase Invader girls but if they didn't stream or do any content for a year like Riro did then it's hardly a comparison. Her following dwindled into nothing and had to start fresh.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754767
Yep, it's Lia!

Some overlook Tenma and Lia because they seem to stand in Pippa's shadow, but both are good talent on their own, and both were damn good hires for Phase to get early on.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754278
>phase's newest gen was DoA
jelly best girl

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754664
Also it creates a familiar box. They shoul do a tournament amongst each other or something to bring eyeballs to new talents. Say your only a Phase fan but was introduced to the Idol girls vise versa.

[Anonymous No.]

Both are willing to poach talents from other companies, while other companies are poorly run and lack competitive spirit.

Eventually both will probably implode when the lumi orbiters clash with the former-cyberlive orbiters and both companies die from drama but the ride until then will be kosher.

[Anonymous No.]

Break it down
>Phase Gen1 murders Idols actual Gen1 so hard it got memoryholed as if it never existed
>Idol Gen2 murders Phase's Gen2
>Phase's Invader's destroys Idol's Invader
>Idols Gen3 is super strong so Phase Gen3 is gonna have to bring it

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755070
This isn't hololive...gen 3 for small corpos typically spells doom for the whole company...

[Anonymous No.]

>>55742760
Kawaii, the blacked company probably sucked the life out of her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55753762
This.
Once you get out of the magic spell that the blue dorito had over you as being the "only" place in vtubing worth watching (and their horrid stagnation and lack of momentum in '22, with talents being bitchy or on break plus the whole Tempiss disaster, gave everyone plenty of opportunity to look around elsewhere), you realize the landscape is bigger and includes other offerings that you might even like better instead of just sticking slavishly to the limited HoloEN selection like a braindead brand drone.

Don't misunderstand this as hating, there's still some value in things that only Hololive can really provide, for example if you're enjoying big hype events then yeah obviously HL is the unrivaled place to be. Or the sheer size of their fan community which provides a mass of people to connect and talk to about the talents, and produces a steady stream of quality fan content to enjoy, so you're always getting fed something at least.

But as far as pure basics, regular talent, "am I really enjoying this random gaming stream #8342 anymore?" goes, most of the HoloEN girls aren't really all THAT special, and arguably hard-carried by the brand buff and would just be unremarkable 2views in a sea of thousand others without it. Case in point, many HoloEN talents WERE unremarkable 2views before receiving the golden ticket which suddenly transformed them into the greatest things since sliced bread, while they are doing pretty much the same boring stuff as before as far as regular streams go, and the only difference is just access to the HL ecosystem and resulting "prestige" that rubs off from it.
But for basic qualities like regular "entertainment quality", being able to carry a stream on your own merits, being funny, cute, charming or having good community engagement, there are talents in the smallcorpo/indie sphere that do these things just as well or arguably even better. I don't even need to list them, because everyone's taste is different, but that's exactly the point - the selection of possible talents that fit your specific tastes better than the limited selection offered by HoloEN is just so much wider outside the box, so if you shop around you probably won't take long to find someone or more to like.

Of course, disregard all that if you're perfectly happy with HL's current offerings. No point in trying to change your opinion, and I hope you continue enjoying yourself. But if you're at all unhappy, bored or unfulfilled with it, you don't HAVE to stay married to a big corpo out of some misplaced emotional investment sense of "obligation", if you aren't really enjoying it fully anymore. They don't really care about you, so why should you care about them? It's all just entertainment in the end, and just like you change the channel if you're not enjoying a TV show anymore, you can look around for other vtubers instead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55728068
There's no male collabs, unless you count being in a group of multiple women where there also happens to be a dude within as well, like... twice, at best.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55739530
most of them pilled on to try and get Lumi cancelled and rumors are that Yuri graduated because they tried to get to Lumi through her afterwards

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755011
rrat: Fishman only hired Jelly to give Lumi a "morality pet", so that Lumi wouldn't just burn everything into the ground and walk off into sunset the day she gets bored. He might have bought Phase-Connect a few years with that little move.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755795
I always felt like Yuri was Lumi's "look I'm not a psycho :)" crutch, until they fell out

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755373
There's only a few talents in hololive who aren't 2view territory. They're neither remarkable nor talented, and nowadays they never stream.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755373
Weirdly, I got into watching VTubers because of Tempus and their brotubers, I checked out the HoloEN girls but they were either boring or insufferable like Kronii. I got an ad for idol Corp, watched the Hebrew branch and I have been watching small corpos ever since. Right now, I watch idol, PIxel LInk and V&U, and I only went back to hololive because of FuwaMoco. I even give micro-corpos a chance when I have time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754987
I have to agree, fishman has crazy gacha luck to have gotten jelly to join phase

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756145
You sound based. Who do you like in V&U?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754976
Sakana is doing a big disservice to girls like Tenma, Lia, Shiina by not advertising them more (In Tenma and Lia's case, advertising them at all they have never had a single ad of any kind, yet they have grown and find themselves in big collabs and big situations on their own)

continually throwing money away advertising Hime and Lumi (Lumi has stagnated this year. She hit the wall like Yuko)

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756318
I am watching all of Gen 3 Oracle atm. My oshi is Echo, though, because I was a fan before she turned into a robot.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755795
Lumi isn't that smart otherwise she wouldn't be the classic psycho woman who makes a million enemies being a bitch and then can't figure out why people who are not on the same mental wavelength as Pippa and Lia would be leery of her.

>>55756110
Yuri is a retarded bitch in the same way. So are all the cyberlive girls not named Chapipi, especially Menace. Lumi isn't special, she just got put in a position where she could fuck things up, because she was being managed by a woman.

Eien project is another example of this. Don't' have women run things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55702505
LMAO there is no excuse for what gen 3 did, they were straight up traitors and gave no reason

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756341
>advertise lia
>she cucks 3000 people when a fat guy calls in and talks about how much he wants to groom her
>another lia yab but even bigger than last time
Yeah that'll go swell.
Vtubers have to be mentally stable to handle that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740990
>ditch kawaii because black company
>ditch 2view JP corpo because fishman himself poached her to be the star of his next gen
>implying loyalty to corpos is a good thing

>>55742760
She did stream, but stopped a few months after with a handful of special event streams, again because of the corpo stream ban.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756514
The company and the girls have never given the whole truth of the matter.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756521
she literally has inclined on every metric since that point. subs up 80% viewership up 150% and scoring dream collabs. you have to move on with your life anon. lia won.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756514
Good way to prove their point.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55754278
invaders don't work like that, you have to imagine that it's about bringing in an already existing audience to your own, fishman wants to get all the best bits of tsunderia and also hired of the best talent managers in dizzy even if she says she doesn't stream, having the one that helped build so many talents that went on to be major names in the space and that built the first collaborations between EN and JP corpos in meetings with you is absolutely massive

[Anonymous No.]

The Yuri debacle exposed that Phase Invaders is not like VShojo where you own your IP. It is a fraud and Yuri got taken away of the IP she LEGALLY owned. But then again that's what you expect from the Chinese.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756815
Yuri should have never signed away her model, the entire situation is fucked. Glad they ditched it with the next invaders.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756766
where did they say who ember and dizzy were before?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55744583
>>55744904
>>55746089
I posted some real screencaps of Discord stuff in there

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756815
you don't know what you're talking about, Lumi laid it out right after the graduation, invaders got a choice, take a payout and sell the rights to their name to phase early on, or keep their IP but have to shoulder some of costs, she took the payout because she's always had low impulse control and Lumi is very careful with that stuff and wanted an out to avoid another CL

[Anonymous No.]

Seeing lots of Jelly love in this thread for some reason, so I'm going to add some. Jelly love.

>>55737198
Whatever were the unlikely circumstances that led to her streaming Saya no Uta of all things, I'm so glad it happened.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757041
Dizzy takes out the urara model all the time to make fun of it with her old fans,
ember on her end doesn't talk about it too much but invaders overall don't really care about mentioning past lives, jelly is actually the one that sort of tries to keep both seperate

[Anonymous No.]

>>55735819
I didn't really get this decision, they all got similar viewership to some of Prism anyway so I don't know why they bothered since now they're taking a pay cut. Nana Asteria kinda makes sense since since she wants to pursue music and I could see Prism supporting that, I don't know why the other ones joined though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756815
Are you antiing Yuri with this shit? Because this quickly went from "a post that raises a legitimate concern" to "yet another retarded ritualpost that does nothing other than show that someone is retarded".

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756667
Her CCV is down though lol.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756960
Her PL seems happy about ditching it anyway. She seems to be doing well on her own. She even got merch now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757187
if they wanted to bring in their old audiences, they should have marketed who they were, no? otherwise it's a really shitty deal. no new gen hype, no old audience. they get literally nothing. no wonder they're doing so poorly then

[Anonymous No.]

>>55740120
About half of them could, yeah.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757228
Emma said she mainly joined for management assistance and song perms.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756145
>Tempus
>brotubers
roru. rumao even.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757292
why aren't they in hololive then?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757254
they did market it, hell dizzy started her debut showing herself imprisoning urara, also talents like purin are still very close to dizzy andshe has maintained the main tsun fancord as a link between both fanbases after tsunX died

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756960
>>55757099
>yellow hands are rewriting history

[Anonymous No.]

>>55698255
>Idol
Unironically carried by Rin Penrose figuring out how to use Shorts for free advertising
>Phase
Shit, I dunno, maybe the dirty rabbit missing six teeth had something to do with it, but I can't be sure

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757410
none of that is marketing. phase as a company should've marketed in their official channels

[Anonymous No.]

>>55756815
>>55756815

Here's a rrat that nobody has really considered, that has substantial of proof to back it up from my research.
When cyberlive went under, none of the talents were officially given ownership of their models, they simply became free use after the company dissolved. The only exceptions were yuri and lumi, who both were purchased by sakana from CL's CEO while they were still in the company. This explains how so many of the talents abandoned their CL persona shortly after CL went under, and how Lumi was able to use Hylo's model without any legal repercussions.

TL;DR Despite being "Invaders", Yuri and Lumi at no point ever actually owned their models, they just operated under a new rights holder. As fucked up as it is, Yuri chose that route from the beginning.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757250
>her ccv is down
her ccv was 200ish when it happened.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757384
It worked at the time. They got boring fast, though. Girls are just more entertaining but HoloEN had nothing to offer at the time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757438
I'm just going off what lumi herself said man, she talked about yuri's model rights and said that yuri just negotiated her rights differently, then dizzy said after debut that she had the choice and asked to go back to zero since she didn't want her old IP around anymore

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757496
nice graph. natural progression natural climb.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757453
they didn't need to spend cash when all they had to do was give the old fans an in into PC, it was all about maintaining a single fancord and getting the word out in the right places, there's always speculation about which of them will get in next and it's pretty much a given at this point that tsun will be absorbed almost completely next year

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757251
The only reason she has the hoodie is because Pandora has hooked up a lot of indies with that artist. It's not like she randomly got it. I know this because the same happened with another indie I watched that got the hoodie - they flat out said who was responsible for the connection.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757776
but again anon, because they didn't market them they didn't get as big as they could've been. they were tiny before, so why would they be happy with just those viewers? i dunno, i just don't get it i suppose. if you're gonna take on new talents you should introduce them to as many people as possible otherwise i don't see the point

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757460
If they were free use, anyone should have been able to use their IP, and the models are included in the IP. Lumi technically broke the law with her woman moment, but no legal repercussions came because none of the girls would want to spend money on legal fees for a minor infraction. If Lumi had started to use the models a lot more often, then it's an issue but it seems Phase put their foot down even though neither publicly apologized.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757460
> so many of the talents abandoned their CL persona shortly after CL went under
literally no one
> Lumi was able to use Hylo's model without any legal repercussions.
legal actions weren't worth it. still, she's a bitch

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757251
numbers say other wise. She has only streams 4 times this month and 10 times in July. Twitch ccv is about 150 and dropping. If she would have stayed in Phase, she would likely be in the 400-500 range.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757593
> lumi herself said
oh. you are a retard

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757496
the ccv is way inflated, but the point still stands Lia has been improving and doing well.
she has been making moves and been a part of some once in a lifetime collab type shit most small indie level vtubers only dream of being apart of.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758074
True. What that stream revealed is that Lumi is a petty bitch.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55757940
I do agree that they could've put more ads out there, but I personally think these invaders were more important for what they bring to the corpo, Jelly for example is the reason they've released more covers than ever in the last few months, but I also do remember that they did experiment a little with getting more promotion for the gen but I think they're keeping the good stuff for gen 3 soon, especially after the flop of gen 2 not getting any ads because of youtube

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758433
Gen2 got ads. Gen2 has gotten ads for covers and donothons all year too.
They have gotten way more advertisement than Gen1 has ever had.
Gen1's advertisements are themselves and the collabs they set up for themselves.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758183
well I trust the other invaders like Dizzy saying the same thing, also it lines up with what's been floated around, it's not because you hate lumi that simple contract negotiations have to be this foreign thing all of a sudden

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758518
yeah now, what i mean is that gen 2's debuts didn't get ads, panko mentionned the fact that youtube banned their ads because of airi's fat tits

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758598
well then she is telling stories because I saw gentoo ads with my own two eyes last year.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758158
I don't think Yuri cared about the numbers, especially if she is not getting along with Phase staff and talents. She is happier now, at least.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758074
Lumi had gotten the rights to these models, she had, all the other girls were too retarded to actually buy out their rights from the corpo to be safe and bitched when they realized there was a reason you don't just shake on that stuff, grow the fuck up women

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755373
You know, I'm getting sick of "totally-not-indie" corpo stans finding new fangled ways to further cope about the Golden Ticket somehow not being deserved by the talents who get in. Every time someone speaks of the mythical prestige Hololive allegedly has, they neglect to respond when someone inevitably asks "Okay, so why didn't *your* 2view oshi get in, instead of her?" It's funny that this post is framed as being calm critique when there's a boiling current underneath. Here's the harsh truth: If you start as a nobody and get into Hololive, that's not just proof of your ability, or a sign of good luck, but a chance to become the elusive "digital anime girl" that normalfags reduce vtubing to. It's not that people are incapable of writing verbose character studies of the no-names in Invaders or whatever other new gen just debuted last week and was immediately forgotten - it's that there's no narrative to ascribe to the smaller chuubas's career, no "arc" so to speak. See where I'm going with this? Blue Dorito isn't just liked because it's the biggest, it's liked because the kayfabe is so strong (everyone is playing a character, like it or not) and it actually feels like watching a SHOW instead of a STREAM. You can point to 1000 indies who do this same thing but it doesn't matter, because like it or not there is no illusion to it, you're just watching streamers with avatars doing Discord calls and playing slightly more unique games than Holos, or saying slightly more provocative things than Holos, or trying to seem like they totally don't wish they were Holos and have to instead act like they're above it all.

>It's all just entertainment in the end, and just like you change the channel if you're not enjoying a TV show anymore, you can look around for other vtubers instead.
The point is that Hololive is the only channel with stakes and actual programming, the rest are varying level of public access. Yeah, you might come across a Tom Green now and again, but why bother?

[Anonymous No.]

>>55749440
Once you get a taste of the chuuba actually semi-reliably reading your chat comments it's hard to go back to 4/5 view ccv streams where you might as well be in a stadium arena watching a concert from 200 feet away.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758518
i'm neutral on lia, but she has hustled and gotten phase the 2 biggest 1on1 collabs the company has ever had (manlybadasshero and neurosama) and sakana couldn't be bothered to buy a single fucking ad for them yet they did huge fucking numbers. yet lets run ads for dime a dozen covers that are white noise.

hes also the same guy that does have stock ads made for the girls to have on hand in case of a huge stream to where you can show it to the audience (pippa during feet stream had to take it upon herself to show the phase website and show the talents)

when you have new guests and new eyes watching you, have something to shill. or if you know something is gonna be big, put some more money behind to try to make it even bigger.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758845
Sorry, anon. I only watch FuwaMoco, but the rest of hololive EN is boring. I don't see anything that I can already watch from smaller streamers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55759309
>that does*
doen't. that changes the whole context of the sentence

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758519
Dizzy's case and lumi shittalking other girl isn't the same thing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55759368
As a fellow ruffian, I can respect that, but I like to view the dogs along with their entire gen and also place them within the wider context of Hololive; something that is nigh impossible with any other company.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55755373
This is not just mental gymnastic, this is the whole athletic event!

[Anonymous No.]

>>55759475
Go do that, then. I want the girls I watch to succeed in their own terms, regardless if they are in hololive or not.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55758963
small chuubas are more schizo-inducing though with groomer orbiters, secret clubs, getting lots of attention one day and then none the next etc. it's more of a mental game than just relaxing with a beer watching your 5view chuuba sing her heart out. you don't have the same worries with them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55759309
Neuro I'm fine with no advertisement. Would be weird
Agree that they missed the boat not advertising the manlybadasshero interview. Not every day you get to interview an OG lets player with 2m subs in his first interview ever. Oh well, Lia made the most of it and did very well proud of her.

[Anonymous No.]

I can't believe I bought cyberlive coins. Scam.

[Anonymous No.]

>>55760629
Vera...