How did everyone involved in making HoloEN happen let it die?

[Anonymous No.]

>Release HoloEN
>Become *the* hottest thing of the entire 2020 internet
>Consistently pull highest CCVs out of all online streamers across your whole branch
>Set up to print money, easy 1M+ revenue per member per year
Fast forward two years
>Every single talent is disinterested or burnt out
>Half the branch regularly dodging work for no reason
>CCV for Myth has dropped by almost 90%
>Branch viewership nearly comparable to IDs and Nijis (and closing the gap)
>Almost zero new content for an entire year
>Stopped debuting gens long ago
>Public earnings down 50% YoY

It's not as if Cover's managers are completely clueless and don't see the branch reclining. Content creation is a numbers business, and everyone working on HoloEN, talents, managers, and executives alike, MUST realize that:

>Their numbers are down
>Their income is down
>The trend is accelerating

So what the FUCK are they doing, and why is everyone involved with this branch seemingly totally apathetic?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>The lowest number still in 6 digits
>HOW DID THEY FAIL GUYS?!?!?!?!!?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
inb4s
>Tempiss
Doesn't stop the girls from streaming or making money
>Coof over
JP actually INCLINED despite being a carbon copy of EN in every possible way

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000674
>go from being kings of the world to kings of shit mountain
>"heh... we're still kings..."

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>CCV for Myth has dropped by almost 90%
There's nothing special about Myth. They only got the big numbers they did because they were the first. That's it. Once they got actual competition it's inevitable they would bleed to them.
>Branch viewership nearly comparable to IDs and Nijis (and closing the gap)
Not accurate, IDs and Nijis are also tanking in views too so ironically the gap isn't being closed much.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Gura and Ina make a crap ton in merch sales.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
En management believes that if holoen's quality is made worse the fans will start watching their homos. Hasn't worked that well thus far

[Anonymous No.]

and yet Cover was willing to give the branch an in-person concert in the US. they can't be doing too badly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
It's Mori's fault. Kiara and Gura's random collab had twice the viewers than the entire myth TTRPG collab had.
Pic also related. People fuck off when Mori is on other people's streams and then come back.
Mori is destroying the brand.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000837
I used to be an avid trinity watcher (Gura, Ina, Ame), Mori is the only one from Myth I can watch nowadays.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
niji black company deflection thread

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Why is Kiara second if she made more?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000793
Not sure what this proves, but yeah god damn.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Subversion didn't go as well as expected.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001217
They're in 2021 order you dumdum

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
hired the fags
get shit results who knew these people are just shit at doing anything.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000674
Ina also having over 10k active members... not to mention the millions in Takodachi merch.

[Anonymous No.]

The problem is that there is not much interesting going on anymore and too many vtubers. New gens are also boring (especially the holostars en) where some of the couldn’t even get 100,000 subs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001406
>who knew these people are just shit at doing anything.
This isn't true, as someone who was there, 2020 Myth isn't even comparable to what it's like now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>another HoloEn seethe thread

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>kusoge
>JRPG/nintendo game
>minecraft
>superchat reading
Whenever I check the teamup these are the only things any EN girl seems to be doing, no wonder I don't want to watch them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
As long as the talents who put in the least effort into their career in Hololive are the most popular ones and vice versa, you won't see change. The top talents have no incentive to work hard because they are already popular and nothing will change that, whereas the underdogs can sweat out all those streams, collabs, music videos and sponsorships, they don't become more popular no matter how hard they try.

[Anonymous No.]

They're still making money us wagecucks and NEETs can only dream about. Numberfags are the ultimate losers in the end.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
COVID boost is gone, and the VTuber fad is dying.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001580
then suddenly what changed?
like some fag got hired for council.
suddenly unity, tempiss 8 homos came out, Gura pissed.
collabs for days on end needed a proof or leech to justify tempiss
i'm 100% sure some of the tempiss were nepotism hires.
i mean what THE ACTUAL FUCK, where's the fucking talent ?????? apart from Axel guy who's decent at singing other 3 are jokes, where's music guitar? piano??? gamer? really not one out of the millions of people out there but 3 wait make it 8 no talent faggots?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001780
>They're still making money
You know how a majority of retired NFL players (something ridiculous like 80%) go broke after their career end?
Now imagine that with a shorter career and less money, and you're also a woman.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002025
>guy goes on an autistic rant about tempiss
>he actually starts listing their shortcomings, expressing disappointment they couldn't be better
ahahahahahahahah based based based

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000837
How did Takamori mind break so many people on this board?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001724
Tell me what exciting games jp plays please

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002029
The only one burning money like a black athlete/rapper is Mori.
Kiara is incredibly frugal like most germoids.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000674
>>The lowest number still in 6 digits

i have a friend who now earns 130k USA dollars per year after doing a two weeks python coding camp.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000837
So you can't do anything about then?
Well I guess it is over.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
The lack of activity from HoloEN is worrying, but it makes sense that superchat earnings would go down since you can now buy merch/tickets instead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000779
/thread
Now KYS OP

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>no more covid buff
>no one actually did anything revolutionary in their time in hololive
maaaaaaaaybe mori for furthering her music career
compare them to holo JP
>multiple 1m+ talents with high CCVs that streams REGULARLY
>multiple collab projects every month or so

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002304
>CCV is down because Youtube is hiding the real numbers!
>Visible income is down because it all went into income we can't see!
You're honestly starting to sound like the retards over at /pol/.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>stream less
>get less stream revenue
>sell more merch, get more outside collabs and sponsors
>make more money doing less work
Weird

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>SC comparison
Would’ve mattered if EN hasn’t been getting more and more merchs over the past year(s). When Gura’s merch broke all Hololive records, among which was Pekora 1M+ US$ wave, you know SC no longer means anything for Holo.
That’s why several HoloENs have been turning off SC now and then. They can’t be bothered with SC baiting and prefer their generous cuts from merch instead (fans will get something, too, win-win option)

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002252
You mean two months?
I've never heard of any coding bootcamps that were that short

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002494
Please explain why JP didn't have the same collapse and regularly has 30k+ non-event streams

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002252
And here we have girls who earned ten times that doing zero weeks.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002536
>Gura’s merch broke all Hololive records
In 2040 when Ame's gonna be scrubbing toilets and Gura will be a Walmart greeter, you'll still be talking about the legendary Dino plush merch figures.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>the west has fallen
>cover stops pandering to the west
shrimple as

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
1. Go and apologize to your parents for being such a waste of oxygen
2. Grab the closest sharp object and plunge it into your throat until you bleed out
Simple as

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002667
>earned ten times that

that's 7 digits, then. in north america, 6 digits salary is common.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002646
Because anime and idols are mainstream in Japan

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000793
What happened in January that pushed JP back up to its ATH?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002749
Have you #cutforhex yet, sister?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>dont stream enough
>retarded omegay who was supposed to bring in fresh blood to cover for them instead releases homos and a fuckload of homobegging

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002646
Japan is full of incels and it's getting worst year after year; they didn't need covid to stay at home.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>Vshojo in it's death bed
>NijiEN dead and buried
>HoloEN terminally ill
EN vtubing is over, time to close /vt/ and go back to /jp/

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002818
i precise that by "north america", i don't include mexico.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003010
>holoEN concert tickets sold out instantly
>Gura still making six figures every merch cycle
yeah, sure. it's TOTALLY dead because casual fans left.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003078
Lol, you can see Gura's CCV tank with every successive comeback stream, but you somehow believe the merch numbers we can't see magically aren't affected?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003167
Yes.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Simple. HoloJP = Idol culture, EN = streamer (Twitch) culture.

EN just streams with anime png's, no big goals and no kayfabe. The only one I feel bad for is Kiara who should have gotten more access to 3D technology so she could do her idol shows, IRyS too. The rest don't matter since there are now lots of other vtubers who just stream with anime avatars.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003167
Yes, it doesn't matter if her viewers decrease, because Gura still has around 2000 hardcore fans that buy everything with her name on it
She can go on hiatuses and it won't effect her much since she captured that incredibly dedicated audience.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003225
And I believe that nijien/tempiss merch sells like hot cakes which is why both exist still despite shit ccv.
Can't explain their existence through shit ccv so it's the magical imaginary numbers no one but management can see.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003167
not who you're replying to, but yea.

i don't think the casual tourist would be buying merch to begin with. CCV doesn't translate to $, which is why Kiara and Mori get big SC numbers but shit ccv compared to the other three

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003246
This is why Yagoo should take from Riku and hire jap ESLs for en3.
Yes I know I'm praising niji ceo but its a fucking smart move unless Yagoo gets more zaions that don't fit in with the company. But riku got 2/3 correct.

[Anonymous No.]

>no one watches HoloEN anymore!!!
>HoloEN concert tickets sell out in a picosecond

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002646
Coof in different cultures.
>westoids momentarily held in place and made to watch, but only biding their time until they could resume their outside degeneracies again
>nips discovered another reason to never go outside again

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000681
>JP actually INCLINED despite being a carbon copy of EN
The thing is vtubers in the west are a dying fad. The fact that a lot of people were forced to stay home and the novelty of it gave it some boost but in half a decade most of the western vtuber scene will be dead.
Japan on the other hand is no stranger to virtual idols so unless there is some major trend shift there this will continue its steady grow or at the bear minimum stagnate but maintain their numbers for a while

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002029
Even a 1k ccv like roboco can buy a house in tokyo. Only retard would believe they make nothing when they got merch sale and profit sharing to everything that have their name on it. Unlike nijisanji which most likely they got 10-0% profit according to kuzuha.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003464
how many tickets were there?
because it's kinda meaningless to say some thing sold out instantly when we don't even know how many of said thing were there

[Anonymous No.]

It's EN vtubing you absolute retards. EN vtubers is more than just HoloEN. It was always just a fad in the west. Meanwhile it's part of their culture over at japan.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000681
Many westerners went back to having an irl social life after the coof was over, Japanese people continue staying inside.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49005123
6000 tickets for first stage.

[Anonymous No.]

Nijishitji cope, deflection, and dilation thread

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
The girls want to get paid more whie doing less and the managers can't convince them otherwise, which caused them to lose the drive to manage them at all because they just keep ignoring advice and warnings.

Replace the lazy whores with new voices. It cannot possibly get any worse than this as long as the new voices aren't lazy whores too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000793
Holy fuck this graph is insane. I didn't realize it was so grim.

[Anonymous No.]

Vtubing in the West was a fad, when the novelty wore off, there's less people to watch
Of course not having EN3 and having shitty management doesn't help, but they were never going to continue to beat JPs, the interest just isn't there

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001939
>the VTuber fad is dying
>>49004770
>The thing is vtubers in the west are a dying fad
>>49005237
>It was always just a fad in the west.
>>49006415
>Vtubing in the West was a fad

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006502
Yep, even the consistent streamers in EN don't get the same numbers they did in 2020
If you think things would be different if Ame streamed you're an idiot

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006541
nigga I was just pointing out you're saying the same thing over and over

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000793
This graph goes to show how influential Gura is. July 2022 is when she started acting weird in Rust and also started taking long breaks without reason.
Gura is the gateway to vtubers for all the EOP audience, the moment she became inactive they stopped having interest in hololive and vtubers in general.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006668
Maybe that's because it's true

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000681
>JP actually [...] a carbon copy of EN in every possible way
What the FUCK did he mean by this?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006811
>Same business
>Same company
>Same activities (minus 3d)
>Same 20-something girls with the same background
Literally the only difference between JP and EN is a cultural one. That and the language barrier.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000681
Tempus didnt directly kill them, it was Kronii and management putting out a statement against fans that killed them.
Not many people are unicorns but lots of people are sick and tired of companies attacking their fans

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006950
but JP came first...

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
The holoEn debut. Gura is the only one in the team who knows the character the company has created for her, the others are still learning the character. HoloEN has gone viral thanks to Gura and Mori's cringe music, which is a big hit amongst SEA fans. Ame, the main character, becomes Gura's sidekick, which causes Ame to become anxious with Gura and totally screws up the team dynamics.
Outside of the Takamori team and Gurame team is Takogirl, who doesn't communicate much with them, preferring to befriend HoloJP 5. First Among Us collab with JP, Gura gets special treatment, Rookie Crush, which Gura and her fans take badly, even though it was "FUN", Gura will remember this. From then on Gura doesn't collaborate much outside her gen, there is no total ban on this but there are very few precedents. Gura starts to be restricted by the management, her subscribers overshadow the other talents, and they put her on a short leash. Ina's catastrophic collab with Mori results in Ina not doing a 1 on 1 collab with her for a year. Similar situation with Ame later. Kiara returns to her homeland in Europe, and no more Takamori for a long time. Haachama is kicked off from the EN Minecraft server, causing resentment between EN and Jp fans, and decreasing interest for HoloEN in Asia (except for Gura)
HoloEN2 debuts at the end of the viral period, but doesn't hit the market as hard as expected. Kronii's unique voice wasn't enough to build a big fanbase, Mumei seemed one-dimensional, Fauna felt like a Green Ina, Sana's character design was a debuff and VA probably kept complaining about it in the background, and Bae was less chaotic than Sana.
HoloEN1 was pushed into the background to make room for the second generation, but it caused fans to tend to drift away to other companies.
Ina used her contacts to recruit Sana successfully, but Sana's inglorious dismissal got Ina PUNished and she disappeared for months. By the time she returned, her fan base had shrunk significantly.
Ame is willing to work with Tempus and to do so, she attacked her own fan base, many of whom opposed the decision and later left her because of it.
Gura's fanbase was mostly made up of 9-year-olds and pedos from the SEA region who left her instantly when the HoloID Kobo debuted. Probably the management was happy about this because it is easier to work with Indonesians and they can communicate in 3 languages right away.
Mori has almost only a musical career left as if she's not even there anymore.
Kiara's role became insignificant last year, the hard core of KFP keeps her alive.
Only Mumei and Fauna have been able to grow stronger, Mumei's one dimensional character has been augmented with a Gura pseudo-consciousness, and Fauna has taken over some of Ina's fans, and drawn in fans who have a mother fetish. This is my headcanon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000674
fpbp
hang /#/fags

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003167
Come on, IDK if Gura's merch number is or isn't affected, but that other anon said
>Gura still making six figures every merch cycle
Even Bae was getting 6 figures on her merch wave just few months ago; There is no way Gura isn't getting the same if not better (as in, 7-digits level)
HoloEN (or the market as a whole) might be reclining, but it's far far away from dead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006668
NTA my dude. You could just check which are new IPs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001219
Ohnonono don't show this to the graph linking anons! SHUT IT DOWN SISTER! AIEEEEEEEEEEE

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
NijiEN deflection thread.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Don't care, hope western VTubing as a whole fails.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49007640
how long did they have to extend Kronii's merch sales to even sell through one run?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49008459
Gura is willingly killing it, it's only a matter of months. Her graduation will be the nail in the coffin.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49008504
Only like a week and a half, and that was mostly because she wasn't able to really shill her birthday merch with any consistency until after she returned back from Japan.

The shipping being utter ass for the neck pillow and no limited merch probably played a big part in the decision to extend it as well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000837
>Mori has tech problems
>Viewers go to other PoVs without tech problems
>Mori returns
>Viewers go back to watching Mori
Are you retarded?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
They killed their own hype thinking streaming and content creation should stay relatively the same despite being under a major corpo

[Anonymous No.]

..I guess something happened in nijisanji

[Anonymous No.]

>>49009220
Doesn't explain why more people watched the Kiara/Gura collab than full myth collabs. You're just coping.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002178
JP gets games EN doesn’t, Hogwarts Legacy is a prime example of this and the JPs literally went through a “which house are you” arc.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49009220
I feel like a lot of folks associate Mori as being the most flagrant using of the "EN Curse" excuse when it comes to dealing stuff like collabs: most of the collabs I've seen on her channel usually have bad volume control so people are either too soft or their normal speaking voices constantly peak the microphone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002646
JPs can talk about or do things EN would never go lengths to. Either super sex topics that Marine, Haachama, or other JP member content that makes ENs most lewd streams look innocent or cultural topics EN would touch with a 10 foot pole.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49009398
And the homo collabs pretty consistently get 20k, but that had literally nothing to do what with what I was talking about.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49009677
I said this few times here and I will say this again: West is no different from Chinkland with all its political correctness. The fans will eat EN alive if they play Hogwarts Legacy. It will be the Taiwan yab but 100 times worse.

[Anonymous No.]

Homos were a fucking mistake. If they had been like JP Homos and stayed in their lane, perhaps shit wouldn't have gotten this bad. The cope about "COVID is over, nobody is watching" is bullshit because the JP Holos have even higher numbers than they did during lockdown, despite their audience being 10x smaller.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49009167
cope more, other people had merch sell out in 10 minutes while they were on break

[Anonymous No.]

>>49010159
Yeah, because Mori's previous audience only tunes in to homocollabs and clips.
Too bad that doesn't pay her bills.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49010294
proofs?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49010165
And stuff like this is what’s holding EN back. Ya an EN Harry Potter would have caused antis that be a temporary pain, but the gain would have outweighed the initial annoyance. Other vtubers that played and didn’t crumble are doing fine technically. Not to mention the overall political aspect has pretty much fallen off with the game still being a success proving it was a small minority.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006502
she must’ve been taking some big dicks while tweeting these

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
We al know it is mori tempus and the fans and the fan and viewership "culture" they breed

[Anonymous No.]

It's been said a bunch in this thread but it must be said again. We have already hit peak vtubing in the West. The fad is fading.
Normalfags have moved on, nerds have picked their handful of favorites and aren't expanding, and otaku are too caught up in their petty tribalism instead of trying to work together to keep the community and the scene going.

[Anonymous No.]

These are the issues that have led to this decay:
>Constant breaks
Those are the result of mental exhaustion and burnout.
It's up to management to babysit the girls and make sure they are in a good mental state.
Also not having new gens puts a bigger burden on them which contributes to burnout. There are even stories of Gura's experiences with management belittling her and disrespecting her in passive aggressive ways.
>Lack of collabs/special content
This is partially result of their burnout, but it's also simply the result of management not doing its job. On JP management will often organize events and set up special streams and big collabs, on EN those are simply not being produced.
>Lack of promotion
Hololive in Japan gets the advantage of localized Youtube algorithm promoting them, on a global scale HoloEN lacks that benefit, targeted ads have a big impact for vtuber groups and HoloEN is just not doing it.
>Lack of singles/group songs
Besides Kiara and Mori most of them don't produce much, they're not all dedicated musicians but they should still release stuff sometimes, it's up to management to help them produce stuff.
>Lack of interesting collabs
The DND collab was great, but it was a rare thing for the branch because they just don't do much together. Part of this is because their numbers are so low, can't have a good collab of game X if there are only 10 members and the game requires 4 members and 3 are on hiatus and the remaining 7 can't agree on a time or some lack interest in that game.
This would be solved if they had more members.

Additional issues that have contributed to this decay
>Loss of momentum
Hololive JP released new gens at a steady pace, Gen 0, 1, 2, gamers, 3 were all released very fast and they only slowed after 4, once the company was well positioned and they had enough members to get stuff done.
If some of them were on a break it was not a big deal, if they wanted to collab there were always enough members interested. Hololive JP feels like a big group while HoloEN is just less than a dozen individuals.
Even Nijisanji figured this out and released enough members to fill itself up quickly and then stopped and slowed down.
HoloEN was not given a proper treatment, its members are released too slowly.
It has been TWO FUCKING YEARS since we got gen 2. By now we should be anticipating the announcement of Gen 4 any day, instead Gen 3 still seems far away.

>Creative/game limitations
This one's another issue that has plagued HoloEN and caused many members to lose motivation. HoloEN management rejects their ideas, refuses to let them make the content they want and just ruins any creativity in them. Even Ame has sort of given up. Gura made a cool music video and it took a year for management to bother giving her the go to release it.
When it comes to games they take ages to get permissions.
This shit really gets in the way of content creation.

So to sum this all up:

Hololive's management of HoloEN has been atrocious, just insanely bad. They have neglected them, even hurt them.
The sheer lack of a proper schedule releasing new members has also led the branch to stagnate, limited its options, killed its momentum and put a greater burden on the remaining members.
The people who are in charge of HoloEN need to be fired, they are utterly incompetent and have costed the company millions as well as its rightful place in western culture.
HoloEN would be much bigger, much more relevant and hyped up if it had been managed properly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49009458
This was such a piece of bullshit.
Fuck EN management. JP and ID all got to play the stupid wizard game and EN just got told to fuck off because twitter cockroaches wouldn't like it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49006415
That's such a defeatist attitude to have - you miss 100% of the shots you never take. Management hasn't been trying with EN for almost 2 years now basically.

It seems they'd rather fail but feel righteous and smug owning le incel unicorns instead of succeed and give the fans what they want. To try to force the homos on us nonstop is to go "haha YOU don't know what you want, here watch this. don't like it? you're an evil anti now" is a fucking condescending piece of shit attitude to have towards your customers. They did it to themselves.

Imagine if homos didn't exist and we had EN3 and EN4 by now, it actually-could have been that way if the management was intent on keeping the original spark and shape of HoloEN (holoJP but just in English) intact. I don't know if it'd be super-strong but it'd be in better shape than today that's for sure. Even if Sana still left and lots of the existing ENs started phoning it in streaming every 1-2 weeks, if there were new girls to pick up the slack the torch would have been passed on. Instead it's just stuck out there in the countryside somewhere in the hands of someone who doesn't feel like running it anymore.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49010285
I hate to tell you this, but JP gacha games often make far more money than their global counterparts too. Japan just has more money and people than the rest of the world combined, so of course their numbers will go up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49011566
If we had 10 more girls and no homos HoloEN would be a fucking titan in today's Western vtuber landscape, imagine what a fucking contrast it would have been to have a pure cute girl's experience vs nijiEN's tryhard-yet-directionless decay and vshojo crumbling from its own girls' greed and disunity. The severe and deep disillusionment fans had with Kronii/Ame etc would probably literally not have happened at all. The homobeggar vs cgdct schism wouldn't have happened within the fandom (and maybe even the girls).

Homos by themselves didn't kill HoloEN akin to how it's not a wolf's fault it hunts a farmer's livestock, it just wants food and is doing its thing and doesn't comprehend what it's doing to the farmer. However, someone let those wolves into the pasture on purpose and that is who is at fault - EN management.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49012267
not really, people just lost interest in vtubing in the west, 5 more girls wouldn't have changed that for covid tourists

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
They released actual merch people can buy instead of SCs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002252
That's either bullshit, they had previous experience, or they got incredibly lucky, like "Luckier than getting into hololive" levels of luck

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Are you fucking joking? Have you watched HoloEN lately? It's a fucking corpse. Nobody cares anymore. It's too late.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49011217
actually, the homos caused it all

[Anonymous No.]

>>49012267
>someone let those wolves into the pasture
Exactly

[Anonymous No.]

>numbers really think vtuber (weeb dipped streaming) would still be inclining hard without guys and 5 new girls
I really wish you guys would come to reality to know what the normie culture is like in America and Western Europe but alas mentally ill

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003167
>CCV
lol lemao

[Anonymous No.]

>secretly a male seethe thread
way to make it super obvious

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>>Every single talent is disinterested or burnt out
How to tell us this is a Mythfag bandwagoner who got bored and doesn't watch streams anymore without telling us.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49013040
Not that anon but things would have been far better regardless.
Marvel kept the hype going for nearly a decade because they kept putting out content of a consistent quality. Once they stopped trying after Endgame, that's when people stopped watching and they started to decline.
If we had two girls gens instead of two male gens, they would have had a better shot of carrying the 2020 momentum forward instead of letting it nearly die completely last year.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49013208
>gets new concert that sold out in seconds
>corpse

[Anonymous No.]

>>49013897
I don't know anon, why're you still bitching when you could be watching their streams instead of arguing with strangers?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000837
the problem with full myth collabs is, quite frankly, they suck. i don't know what it is, if you put any 2 of the myth members in a stream it is fine, even 3, but more than that and it just doesn't turn out well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49007553
You're analytical skills should be used somehwere productive you damn beautiful autistic bastard. Hope your work allows you to flex that neuroplasticity to it's fullest.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49014354
Mori tends to be awkward and give 0 shits about whatever is going on and yet is also really fucking loud about it, as if she's insecure about implying she actually-cared about preparing for anything.

Ame usually just turns into a wallflower, or if she starts talking gets really reserved and standoffish.

Gura is actually-good in collabs and has been the glue that has patched several together single-handedly, but just is often not fucking there.

Ina is OK actually, neither good nor bad, I'd actually say adequate but seems kind of less friendly/open than she is solo.

Kiara is I'd say usually pretty good in collabs but sometimes kinda tries too hard and it's a bit awkward when there's such a disparity between her and the others (cue people complaining she talks too much - more like the others don't talk enough).

[Anonymous No.]

i agree with the idea that vtubers were a bit of a fad in the west. doesn't mean they're dead or dying, but we (quite obviously) haven't retained that spike in many areas. from now on, in order for western vtubers to grow, they're just going to have to grind their way (and in a more saturated and less novel market). there is nothing weird or concerning here, this is common for any sector of the streaming industry that has a big popular moment. you rarely retain all your growth.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002839
A lot of tournament type streams.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Vtubing wasn't a strong subgenre to be begin with. The fact nothing came around to replace HoloEN in numbers despite the members taking constant breaks proves as much.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49010335
That makes zero sense and sounds like a huge amount of cope.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49007553
IRyS's debut was so mismanaged it doesn't even make it into a schizo's ramblings...

[Anonymous No.]

>>49013510
Homos wouldn't be a problem if management were competent.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49016290
>nothing came around to replace HoloEN in numbers
because people didnt all go watch one other thing, they went to tons of indies and other corpos who are all on the incline

[Anonymous No.]

>>49016377
Vsingers and being mismanaged go hand in hand. Nobody gets help until they join Hololive proper. Azki was planning on graduating initially. Suisei was ghosted for MONTHS by her manager, not weeks, and ended up paying for covers out of her own pocket and securing permissions herself. IRyS has had similar issues. The Vsinger label is cursed, luckily IRyS had the foresight to build her own brand by streaming as much as a normal Holo instead of just waiting for projects from management. You can see Azki inclining now too from streaming.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49013510
Homo problems are the result of management incompetence.
Imagine if we had gotten Gen 3 last year, like we should have.
And this year we got the Homos.
There wouldn't have been such a big issue, such a loss of momentum, such an obvious bias that sacrificed the main group for their shitty experiment.
And imagine the girls were told "don't collab with the homos ok?". We wouldn't have had the ongoing shit show that came of that.
Instead management went full retard. 2 years of no Gen 3, then 2 gens of homos in a row, and shilled homo collabs for 2 months.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49014775
The fact is that EN is not like JP and the reason JP is big in Japan is that they have integrity, unlike EN. They thought that "westernizing" the ENs would make them more popular with the west but the fact is they failed to see that if the west could be impressed by this kind of EN then they would just keep watching random twitch indie thots, all Cover had to do is keep the same integrity as JP for EN too and things would've never turned out like this, they forgot that people were getting into JP before EN even existed and there is a reason.

It's like they took anime and turned it into bootleg cartoons trying to impress a wider audience, only to generate a complete failure.

[Anonymous No.]

Then
>Oh wow EN is great thanks Coco/Haato
later
>Oh so this guy(?) Created IRyS and EN ok...
much later
>FUCK OMEGA TROON FIRE HIM
now
>WHERE'S EN 3 ?????????

You guys literally don't deserve EN 3

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
YoY looks like a crying face hehe

[Anonymous No.]

>>49007553
This analysis is stupid and is just pandering to the /vt/ schizos. You should get a life, stay off /vt/ for a while, and talk to real people.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49021091
EN was "great" because it was new and you could finally understand what the holo said but it was only a temporary delusion and then everyone realized that EN is actually shit, this is why the girls have become lazy and have no care for their fans, not only the homo collabs but they way Ina and Gura treat their fans like a nuisance too, they are the worst idols in hololive.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49018938
>"don't collab with the homos ok?"
Not even HoloJP says this, the girls come to that conclusion on their own (most of them.)

[Anonymous No.]

This is the part where we all shill are small corpos in hopes that someone will start watching

[Anonymous No.]

>>49013595
It's not 2014 anymore gramps. Inceldom and sexlessness is on the rise on America.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49023285
We don't know that for sure.
But different branches clearly need different rules.
Haven't heard of JP girls shitting on their fans either but EN might need rules against it as well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49023201
Telling Schizos to fuck off isn't shitting on your fans also lol if you actually think like this

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002726
You think they won't make investments and secure their futures? They'll be shareholders of the company you'll be working for. They might even have their own businesses.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49023201
There still great and the only people who thought this are the people who got triggered over a EN branch in the first place

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024061
>parasocial bad

[Anonymous No.]

>>49003379
I don't watch Nijisanji. Who are these jap idol ESLs you're talking about?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024353
No Being annoying and possessive is

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024431
>if you get angry when your oshi ghosts you with a shitty excuse to play games with her friends you have no right to complain

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024431
I want to see if she was your gf and she ghosted you for days and weeks what you'd say instead of this discord-tier white knight bull shit.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024591
Nigger if you think of a streamer as your gf then that's a (you) problem

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024686
If you are homosexual that's really a (You) problem, don't go pushing your cock fetish on everyone else just because you happen to find yourself on /vt/ once a year.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024686
JP is thriving and EN is on the verge of collapse.
This is pretty much all you need to know to understand that you're a fag.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024813
Holy projection

[Anonymous No.]

Westerners who are nerds or into nerd shit has such little attention span and actual autism focus than the counterparts in the east. We made 'nerd shit' into something chic because they saw the marketability and now nerd circles are filled with people who only want to bandwagon on whatever the new big thing is.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024945
It's you the one who talks like a cuck.

>she's not your gf lol give her money and suck it up otherwise you are a schizo

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024931
>Anon keeps forgetting about the concert

[Anonymous No.]

>>49024591
>if she was your gf
See this is your problem you guys are literally stuck on this shit you admitted it yourself

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025021
Did I say that you had to give them money?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025050
What about it? it's gonna be the last thing they do as a group for EN because this branch is dying.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49023733
>Haven't heard of JP girls shitting on their fans either
Because you don't understand Japanese

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025110
>you can't have a vtuber as your oshi! you have to be an uninterested casual like me and everybody else should as well because... because

[Anonymous No.]

>>49023733
Jps shit on their fans more than IDs retard

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025192
Can you seriously try and make a legit argument? I you like even love things without being in a romantic relationship, Do you want to fuck your mom and dad? borther? sister? cousin? can't like something without being romantically attached to it

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025192
>you can't have a vtuber as your oshi!
Literally who the fuck are you quoting. You were imagining them as your girlfriend you fucking retard

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025119
Just cause a couple of third worlders make Seethe threads daily doesn't reflect most people opinions on en

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025115
Without the money of the fans hololive or cover wouldn't exist at all. They get to larp as idols because their fans are dedicated enough to open their wallets for them and they are dedicated because they make them live the juvenile feels they never had a chance to live. Idols are big in japan because the depressed wageslaves ojisan love them and they make them feel needed, unlike these EN whores who have no respect and are completely ungrateful to their fans, the fans they were supposed to be motivating to do their best.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025167
>>49025264
yeah sure they do buddy

[Anonymous No.]

The Japanese market is receptive to anime. Tourism boards, restaurant chains, etc. This gives them a near constant marketing to keep their interest and numbers up. There is simply no market in EN to compare. You will never see a Cover+MLB collab, because your typical mouth breathing American doesn't even know what anime is and would probably throw a fit if some cartoon women were given some sort of tie in advertisement and marketing collaboration. EN is relegated to the weebs of the western world alone, whereas JP has the whole of Japan as its oyster.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025385
Looking at this thread it seems like it's the other way around

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025385
And that's why Kiara, while not the most liked personality in EN, manages to get the largest hardcore following and does so well with SC's, gets invited to a lot more cross company collabs, and gets asked to do 'official' Cover stuff much more frequently.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025369
>my definition of oshi is more correct than yours
Thanks for confirming you're homosexual yet again. Oshi is literally the same as "she's my gf but she don't know yet" except it's widely accepted in idol culture because that's what idols are for, to fill the hearts of their fans. Naturally I don't expect western whores and casuals like you to even remotely comprehend certain things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025381
Just because your discord circlejerk laughs at your /vt/ screencaps and give you internet points, it doesn't necessarily mean your opinion is worth shit on this site. Your opinion is probably the least relevant to hololive and /vt/ in general, since you're a casual who doesn't understand that most of the /vt/ culture exists because there's people who need this sort of parasocial relationships.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025667
>who need this sort of parasocial relationships.
So much they would blow their wages on their oshis, I dare to add.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002025
Most of them have skills though? Altare is an amazing FPS player, Hakka can sing metal, Flayon is a voice actor, Axel can speak Japanese well

[Anonymous No.]

>>49026159
Even if they got some talent, it's a fact that hololive started dying when tempus came out. Gura getting uppity with management and refusing to keep basic promises with her fans is a huge blow to all of EN because she's the gateway for the /a/ EOPs to get into vtubers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002029
Black debuff is worse than woman debuff

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025451
This is the right answer. There is simply too much opposition for vtubers to break into mainstream culture with boomers, conservatives, religious types, SJWs, wokes all seething about anime. Japanese don't all watch anime but it's already ingrained to their culture and they won't bitch about degenerates or objectification of women. So even though the Western market is 'bigger' it in fact only caters to like 0.1% that are weebs. With the decline in interest this is probably already smaller than Japan's market

[Anonymous No.]

>>49028056
I could say that the pool of people to grab from is much larger in the western sphere, but it all leads back to this >>49025513. The pool of people who are 'nerdy' and like 'nerdy things' who are fine with anime or whatever are trained to jump from one new product to the next. They fucked up by not releasing EN3 to keep people coming back to look at new shit. It wouldn't change that others would still have their numbers go down, but it would redraw in old fans and keep new blood slowly entering the Hololive sphere. Instead they let it fade from the 'nerdy' zeitgeist.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Kids realized that hearing "thanks X" after donating $100 gets old after a while

[Anonymous No.]

>>49025517
Okay anon, you baited me. Enjoy your (you)

[Anonymous No.]

>>49007102
>saying "I choose to play games with my friends" is an attack against fans
lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002726
Holy cope. These people have secured enough wealth for them and their children to coast for thr rest of their lives.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49028646
If it was just her saying it you'd probably be right, but she got management to put out an offical statement to rile up the beggars.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>mori endless yabs
>gura won't stream
>ina won't stream
>ame called his fans incels
>kiara

[Anonymous No.]

>>49029052
>>kiara
is cute

[Anonymous No.]

>>49001219
behold my line of EN decline

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Gura lazy
Ame lazy
Ina lazy
Mori half-hearted
Kiara Kiara

[Anonymous No.]

I wish to see a day when HoloEN become HoloEnd

[Anonymous No.]

>>49031825
I wish to see a day when jpbronies stop seething about vtubers they don't watch

[Anonymous No.]

>>49031825
YNBJPN

[Anonymous No.]

>>49007553
Did you forget there's no sound on webm?

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>Mori
Doesn't give a fuck, unprofessional.
>Kiara
Kiara
>Gura
Wants to quit but knows she can't
>Amelia
Too lazy
>Ina
Too tired

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Niji deflection thread #45

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000837
She lives rent free in your mind, Jakarta-chama

[Anonymous No.]

>>49032432
Be glad she does. Not a lot of people think about her. Judging by how nobody watches her these days.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49012267
>imagine what a fucking contrast it would have been to have a pure cute girl's experience
I'm sure they would magically stream more.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49011566
>That's such a defeatist attitude to have
No it's just realistic and non-retarded
>To try to force the homos on us nonstop
You don't even watch Hololive dude

[Anonymous No.]

>>49032520
5k or 6k a stream isn't bad

[Anonymous No.]

It's almost amazing how all of Myth causes certain anons to lose there shit on this board

[Anonymous No.]

>>49012267
Remember Eien's Kiki Lockhart rude awakening where she laughed at her biggest paypigs. Gura is doing the same with her swedish boyfriend. Women are TERRIBLE people, Tempus just exposed their true colors.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49012022
That's exploiting Japanese gambling addiction, not something to be proud.

[Anonymous No.]

All these experts that are better than professionals and none of them are making money using their own WhoreEN money.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000681
The tempus problem is that they came at the start oh holoEN’s decline and while they may not have explicitly hurt them, having a new female wave could have helped rejuvenate the community at a pivotal time. Holostars english should have been an extra thing that came 6 or so months after EN3, rather then the main focus for the year

[Anonymous No.]

>>49033245
Wat.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
>supachats
Mori has made probably 5x that off of her music career this year alone (buy my BD guiz! lol)

Gura gives zero shits as she sells body pillow covers and dino plushies by the dozens

Ina has an actual day job. Ame is just happy to have money. Kiara only cares about clout.

but yeah, major failures in a major down year for EN vtubing I know I know

[Anonymous No.]

>>49000539
Kronii sabotaged HoloEN.
Cover will start EN3 auditions when a council reaches 1M subs.
Kronii had the numbers and the model to get 1M subs yet she purposely crippled her growth, she avoided Minecraft, stopped streaming, collabed with Homos, shat on idol culture.
No woman has done more damage to HolEN than her.
Sana normalizing taking 2 months breaks is a honorable mention

[Anonymous No.]

>>49032850
>5K
Check how many viewers she got on her last solo gaming stream.
Hell she couldn't even get 5K on her last minecraft collab. The ID she was collabing with mogged her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49011217
Tempus is gen 3 and gen 4. You people just ruined it by being unicorns, so what should be an 18 person company is split in 2.

[Anonymous No.]

>>49002025
I would argue Tempus has better showmanship compared to council
But the elephant in the room that homobeggars don't understand is that no one wants to watch anime fags in the branch built to pander to unicorns.
And the non-jp fujo market that cover wants is already cornered by kpop and chinese singers.