/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

cant wait for janny to delete this spam thread

>>68499158
This model is sexier than the dragon she had.

>>68499382
Nah it’s a downgrade

>>68499436
no

>>68499770
yes

>>68499436
Blonde is always better.

>>68499158
>Schizophrenia episodes
>Manipulated behavior
>Fire Stirrer

>>68499158
She spent money out of pocket on projects that made money for niji
Niji did not compensate her for making them money
And you don't see the issue?

>>68499261

>>68501480
HOHOHO MERRY CHRISTMAS

>>68499954
Same as Holo next question

>>68499158

>>68499382
Don't get me wrong, there's aspects of this model I quite like. But Selen was absolute peak sex, that model was a massive buff.

>>68502951
Factually wrong
Next faggot

>>68502951
show me the holo who spent 200k in a year.

Now we are homeress...

>>68505640
Watame and kson...
Hell, towa has almost dropped that much on singular Mario kart tournaments which is why okayu helped as partner this year after the animated promos and shit.

Lots of the singer holos that don't write their own music (everyone but Mori)

>>68499158
have sex
with me

>>68506232
And that's just from what I know, if you really think it's hard to Believe go through ksons twitch vods. Shes at least talked about it eigo.

Watame's gotten so bad members repeyask her if she's in the red.

And that's just the ones I follow that talk about it enough I didn't miss it. Polka, fbk, marine, etc are always creating all sorts of weird stream assets and movies and such.

>>68499158
I will be donating $200,000 to her to make up for it, don't worry.

nobody asked her to spend 200k. she could have spent as much or as little as she wanted. she could have spent nothing and just raked in the cash playing video games. she could have commissioned artist x instead of artist y whose fees were higher. this is all her being retarded with her money.

>>68506754
Her being retarded with spending and niji being scumbags for not compensating her can both be true at the same time

>>68499382
It is, but hopefully her replacement model is superior. I never liked the Selen model

>>68506939
if she had spent a million dollars, niji should pay her 500k, just 'cause? there was never any agreement that she'd be compensated.

>>68507176
I just pray to god she keeps the smug expression

>>68502951
Not the same at all. Holo will give each girl a budget for projects only if it goes over budget will the girl have to pay out of pocket. Niji just seem care about making any content at all.

>>68499954
I think people need to realize that most corpos outside of maybe Idol maybe make their VTubers pay out of pocket rumao

>>68507865
Not even phase connect is like that. Mostly just a japanese mentality that doesn't really translate well to north american society. The whole purpose of an agency is to support their talents, and if they have to spend a considerable amount of money on projects that do not belong to them, it undermines the purpose of the agency. Obviously, selen is an exceptional fool to have spent 200 fucking grand, but the fact that the agency did not help her manage her finances is bad by itself. And that's not even discussing the issue of Nijisanji not paying their artists for commissions.
To me it really calls into question the viability of the agency itself. What tangible benefit was Nijisanji actually offering to selen? It appears like they just gave her the bare minimum support whilst collecting her earnings like a parasite. If I was a vtuber, I'd rather be a fucking indie than join Nijisanji. I could sell merch, advertise, and coordinate sponsorships by myself, it's not as hard as you'd think.

>200k
wait WHAT

>>68499954
being part of Nijisanji is the payment

>>68508850
payment in blood

>>68508842
She spent 200k on projects for Nijisanji, received no compensation, and had a net less in income for the year

>>68508922
IF she had 200k to spend in the first place then that means Niji pays very well. 2% rrat btfo.

>>68509109
2% is not a rrat, it was confirmed
And she earned 200k in spite of them, not because of them

>>68499382
Yes, the dragon hand always turned me off very hard. Looked like girl had a condition.

What is "jkterjter"? do you guys think it's a hint to the names of the bullies?

>>68509109
The 2% is just from merch sales

>>68503322
this nigga likes girls with pencilnecks

>>68509162
>>68509365
The only thing supporting the merch rrat is a retard who doesn't even know how to do his taxes and was earning millions through Nijisanji. He probably misundestood it.

>>68507865
>people need to realize that most corpos outside of maybe Idol maybe make their VTubers pay out of pocket
Name 5. Name 5 right now.

>>68506232
>>68506413
Provide a clip then if you know so much.

>pwese pay my rent my loyal simps, I spent 200k in vanity projects and now I'm broke

if your mcjob asked you to cover the cost of next week’s burger shipment, you would laugh in their face and tell them to fuck off. selen was asked to cover the burger shipment and she said “yes boss. let’s import the a5 wagyu patties from japan”

>>68509906
If her attempt was successful sisters would be jealous of that too

>>68509722
>>68505640
Don't know how it might stack up but I know that Kanata confirmed spending 5million yen on a single project years ago, which is converting to 33k USD or 45k CAD today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zREufEpj0zM
I think Kiseki Knot cost millions too if I remember right.

And extra old clip
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BrWt2BptvA

She must be spending an insane amount this year. But of course that's her own direction. Hololive can help with a lot, but there's a lot Holos need to spend their own money on.

>>68509222
The dragon arm was the coolest part

>>68506232
Holos also have a salary and has a much larger share of income in most if not all revenue streams, pretty sure Holo also lends a lot of facilities and manpower for the projects.

imagine paying 200k out your own pocket for 2% kek

>>68499954
Holos spend their own money on their projects too, Towa has mentioned multiple times how expensive running the Mario Kart cup is. Also where did the 200K she spent come from? Was she just well enough off beforehand to drop that or was that Niji income?

>>68508776
>Not even phase connect is like that
>he doesn't know

>>68505640
Suisei never get an actual number, but in the lead up to her second live she talked about dropping a fairly large chunk of the money shad gad earned the year leading up to it on the album + the live itself.

>>68499158
It is the responsibility of Niji management to allocate funds for projects thst the girls engage in. They're supposed to take a cut but in return help market, and organize these personal projects and use them to make the branch succeed as a whole.

If not, why ever consent to your management taking such a large cut?

>>68506413
watame's expenditure that year went into her first solo stage (she was able to do performances of all original songs) which is something she expressly wanted to achieve for herself and hololive obviously supported and signed off on it

Selen's case is worse because all that money is gone and wasted, and it was hq that prevented it from making money and generating value

Being irresponsible and impulsive with money is literally a trait of borderline personality disorder

>>68510670
Where did her 200K she spent on this come from? If that’s her income from being in Niji for two and a half years a quick Google search tells me she was well above the average Canadian income. Her blowing all that is her own fault really.

>>68509606
All EN small corpos for sure. Nijisanji. Even Hololive to an extent. Corporate VTubing is VTubing that is meant to be profited off of, and if you read auditions and guidelines you'll see that the purpose of most corpos are to give the vtubers a platform, advertise (which many fail to even do), and some kind of managerial support. The girls exist to make them money in return. Some don't even financially support their debut assets. I wish people would stop blindly believing that all corpos are good when its VTubing for profit

>>68510973
As we have learned from various niji talent complaints, it is apparent that "selen tatsuki" operates as a licensed contractor under the "niisanjiEN" umbrella, and is responsible for its own business expenses including its employees. You think that the girl makes a lot for a person but actually she makes jack shit as a company.

>>68510918
Makes her hotter. I love a chubby psycho

>>68511073
So the 200K she blew threw was her Niji income? If that’s the case complaining she made no profit out of being in Niji is horseshit, she made money a decent portion of the western world would love to make in such a relatively short time frame, she just spent it all. Not like it matters, she’s going to be on easy street for a bit with white knight sponsorships and shit looking for some good PR. Just hope for her she doesn’t spend it all again.

>>68499261
Nijiggers work on grave night shifts.

>>68510763
I do know. Just watch their streams with sakana. Last time, he was jokingly complaining about how his talents didn't want to go the extra mile and they basically just told him to pay them more for it. They'll fund stuff themselves occasionally but, it's never expected. Whereas Nijisanji and even Hololive expect their talents to use their own funds as a given. This is not the case in any north American agency, where it's all optional.

>>68501480
go back to discord

>>68511072
People just believe the corpo they like is good and the corpo they don’t like is bad. They don’t stop to consider they are all businesses trying to make money, and the ones that don’t shit the bed and die out. Niji aren’t even unique as to having absolute shit show management, they are just the biggest name so they stick out the most.

>>68509606
I mean vshojo, but also the talent also receives all the profit of their own projects and that vshojo only takes a cut of things organized and planned within the company. Niji and Cover report revenue from idol solo concert ticket sales, etc. If they make the idol pay the expenses while also handing them the majority of the revenue while in reality the company is doing absolutely nothing outside of 'we part-own the character lmoa', thats insane.

>>68509722
because I don't remember which ark autism fest I was listening to her talk about spending over 100k on her 2nd anniversary live in
I just remembered really enjoying the stream where she fucked up the mochi while chocosen sat there in shame around new years and just put on a random twitch vod after
bitch has like 1 clipper who logs in twice a year, please understand. It would be an ark or zatsu stream from about 30-40 days ago?

watame would have some production assistance from holo, but I'd still imagine venue+3d and all that shit required her to put out at least 50k; she tries to be vague about it and insist she's still making money and fine when people ask

another one I just remembered is towa dropping several thousands on the mario kart tournament assets and opening animation

THE JAPS KNOW
SHUT IT DOWN

>>68511430
fuck off jap, raptorlen and peppalen are the most fuckable things to come out of nijisanji in years and completely appropriate uses of money
the only thing that looked really expensive that wasn't absurdly great was the doraemon song from the live

>>68511222
There's a few angles here
Yes, Selen should manage her money better, however

Shouldn't management throw the brakes on that before it gets to that point isn't thecmanager's entire job to keep the talent's sucsess sustainable?
Niji makes money off of these, where's the compensation?
Is she spending the money because Niji's handling of transactions is shit and she just got tired of things getting paid late and dealing with the backlash?

>>68510532
I will never experience a dragon hand job or have a dragon hand tease my ass

>>68511793
Imagine her claws raking down your back as you make love on missionary, your chest against her perky tits as you make out. We'll never get that now.

>>68511715
> Shouldn't management throw the brakes on that before it gets to that point isn't thecmanager's entire job to keep the talent's sucsess sustainable?
Definitely, it’s undeniable at this point that EN management is an absolute shit show. The blame for racking up that much of a bill is on both parties I’d say, Selen or her manager should’ve put the breaks on well before getting to that supposed 200K mark.
>Niji makes money off of these, where's the compensation?
This is why I ask where that 200K she spent comes from, if it’s her Niji income that’s the compensation there, and as much as people want to meme about 2% or whatever that is in no way an insignificant amount of money to make in less than three years.
>Is she spending the money because Niji's handling of transactions is shit and she just got tired of things getting paid late and dealing with the backlash?
As has been mentioned in this thread but multiple people already, Niji aren’t the only corpo who require talents to fund their own projects. It sounds to me like she either went in with the impression she wouldn’t be the one paying, which I could understand with how shit the EN management seems to be, or she let her ambitions get out of hand went looking for a bit of help and got left out in the cold. Regardless though like I said she’s going to rake it in while the Doki pity train is still rolling, she just has to not make the same mistake again and she will be fine.

>>68511715
they shouldn't throw on the brakes, but they should help her find better commission deals or people to work with; they can only benefit from it

frankly though, they should be using the money they're getting from these vtubers to do anything... Like holy shit people say holo wins by doing nothing, but they're both taking less from each talent and giving them back way fucking more. And vslutjo and small corpos take WAY less and give back somehow a similar amount. NijiEN just seems like a fucked place to be outside of the fact that you can not heavily re-invest and still make a middle class living as a very basic lame jp perms streamer 10 hours a week (for a few years until that probably dries up)
Pomu wasn't really even a solid 4view yet when she quit her job to play minecraft.

I follow some 2view indies that also spend everything they make on vtubing on assets and commissions and stuff for their streams (we still want you back mavia).
Anyways, they should have figured shit out when they realized their entire talent's ego was based around being that dragon girl and they were about to take that away from her on top of whatever other bullcrap was going on behind the scenes.

In case you didn't know, personal initiative is considered a vice in nijisanji. Should've just coasted by doing the absolute minimum. The EN branch is just a side show, not meant for the main stage.

>>68505640
Marine for her MVs

>>68512202
this but super unironically
apparently...
I wish ike, sonny, krisis, rosemi, and ttt well I guess...

Selen "pay for my rent" Tatsuki

>>68499158
Can you name any of those projects? Besides the one with the recent drama, I can't, and that's not Niji's fault.

>>68506232
>>68510481
>>68510776
>>68512224
There's literally no way anyone in holo has ever spent 200k on anything.

>>68511072
You retarded little fucking mongrel shit. Why are you looking at this as a private individual working for a salary. You have to look at it as a business. A business having 200k to use in a year is not that great. Her spending that money to use in videos, banners, art posted on her channel, overlays shit like that costs money. Sure, she could just use the basics of the basic. But you won't grow in this business unless you reinvest at least a little.
Now you can argue, that she should have been smarter about it or not. But even then 200k is not that much money if you are paying for animations, videos, music, art...

>>68499158
>Anycolor doesn’t pay people after agreeing to do so
>she has to pick up the tab
>clearly this is all her fault

>>68512540
Miko's lawyer fees for the rape allegations

>>68512540
Smol adventures Ame animation episode 1

>>68512615
Kanauru when a chuuba drops a clippable quote

>>68510847
>consent to your management taking such a large cut
>consent
It's not their channel or IP. It's well known they're hired to play a role. If management isn't providing then their reaction should be there is no budget for it, not be a narcissist and think it's their IP and their business.
The smart thing to do is to save the money so they can spend it on their own channel and their own IP when they graduate. There is a limit to how much you can blame niji for their lack of financial common sense. But people won't understand this through the niji hate and give a chuuba confirmed to have sieve hands more money to waste on their inflated ego.

>>68512540
bro, have you seen how many outfits watame commissions?
on top of songs from the most popular anime song producers...
and 2 live concerts now
and the wata rock fes 3d assets
like don't get me wrong they get a lot more corporate assistance, but yes, holos are paying for a lot of crap and they talk about it sometimes even if they'd get in trouble for saying everything
and she's still making money

and towa just talks about it every time she does anything because yab is her default state
and the real most impressive part is all the 3d stuff ame convinces people to do for free

>>68499158
>spent 200k
On fucking what, cocaine?!

>>68512587
They don't for personal projects in the first place, so something is missing in the context. The only artists that are paid by AC themselves are those that are actually employed by the,

>>68512800
artists, animators, etc.
think about how much it would cost to make https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFLvtNEp7eM if you had very little art, animation, etc. skills on your own starting from scratch
then repeat that a bunch

that said, 15-20k is definitely overpaying for how last cup of coffee turned out
especially when you look at the stuff amelia gets discord fans to make

>>68512870
>They don't pay for personal projects
Fix'd

>>68512892
>amelia gets discord fans to make
LA CREATIVIDAD DE HOLOLIVE can somehow MacGyver a tube of toothpaste, a squirt gun, and 3 discord jannies who do it for free and turn out Kino with the budget of a peanut butter sandwich and some pocket change.

Everybody else just throws money at the problem which is why artists are smug and overcharge everything.

>>68507270
That's were you are wrong. There are statements of literally "the company was late on the payments to artists, and the vtuber had to pay the advances herself". And then the company never payed that money to the vtuber. So, yes, sure the vtuber in many cases contracted shit by herself, but in other cases it was going through the company.

>>68512583
You missed my point. I’m saying that people think corpos support individual projects monetarily when most of the time they don’t, they’re really only there to give the vtuber a platform

>>68499158
>Invests 200k in projects.
>Niji pockets the profits.
There, fixed.

>>68512540
>"Give me examples of Holos spending that much."
>Gets what he asked for.
>"Fake, and, even if real, it doesn't count."
Why are sisters like this?

>>68512892
Maybe I am crazy but spending 200k on streams that you are not sure will pay it all back seems like a terrible decision to me.
I didnt even know NijiEN vtubers could afford to spend 200k in a year.

>>68513323
Because you retarded monkeys believed the 2% meme when that only was for merch cuts. Top talents like Selen make enough money to not have to have a side job.

>>68513323
she's very much on the high end of nijiEN to be fair, but just look at mysta who bought a house in indo and phillipines after only being in for almost 2 years
idk, I'd rather it be spent on interesting shit for the stream, but there's definitely a balance that she went way past.
it probably doesn't help that everyone else in NijiEn doesn't spend on anything besides base assets and songs

I would not be surprised if Finana was also broke between crippling gacha addiction and the songs she's been putting out.
The rest of NijiEN is likely comfortably middle class in an easy 10 hour a week "job." besides like Aster who is probably making like 30-50k a year but at least it's not a real job or just a side job.

>>68512583
Sure, there are NA agencies that get tiny profit margins, so the talents may fund their own projects should they so choose, but they never "make" their talents do this. Even the poor agencies tend provide some sort of stipend for getting basic works done. The purpose of an agency is to provide support for their talents, not just to sit around like a lazy cat and leech all day long. Otherwise no one would bother joining an agency if it didn't provide a useful service. The reason why Tsunderia collapsed was partly due to this. The owner thought his position was just to sit around and have talents do all the work for him, which evidently was a poor business model.
Selen's case of spending 200k in a single tax year is probably just an extreme case. I really doubt that even most Nijisanji talents spend anywhere near that much. If vtubers across the board had to spend so much money, that most of them didn't make a single net gain, they would all have quit long ago.

>>68512744
To be fair, women are notoriously bad with money. You cant just expect them to make rational financial decisions. You're incorrectly projecting male logic onto females

>>68513024
Have you considered one or both of these statements may be a lie?

>>68513593
mysta and enna being broke was just a joke guys

>>68513730
mysta was broke...
after he bought 2 houses in 2 countries and thought he could still retire after only working for 2 years in his whole life.

>>68513626
Mysta literally made millions off Niji. His tax record proves it. The house in a turd world shithole he paid for was peanuts in the big picture. People are defending millionaires being whiny about not making EVEN MORE money. Clown world.

>>68512744
NTA, but I think that your way of thinking is a trap. Think about it; if you don't invest into the IP/Business, and the company isn't investing into the IP/Business, then why would you ever get popular/profitable enough to leave and make your own channel/IP? That "narcissism" you're deriding is why Selen was one of the top NijiEN members in the first place; her fans noticed her re-investment into the channel and have become a dedicated fanbase for it, and other professionals took notice of her paying them when her company failed to and are willing to help her out/sponsor her because of it. If she just did the bare minimum like you claim she should've, her fanbase wouldn't be nearly as dedicated, she wouldn't have as many connections, and she'd overall be worse off.

If niji didn‘t pay artists they themselves comissioned in some way surely we‘d have heard about it by now no?

>>68513707
What would compel the artist to lie about this? Just saying it basically guarantees that they will never commission him in the future. Whereas if he really was fucked over the Anycolor, he has reason to tell the truth because he wouldn't want to work for them again anyway .

>>68513832
Makes sense but the reason why it's worth it in the end was because it became a big stink when she left and people first learned about the behind the scene.
I could argue that if not for the drama instead of Selen staying quiet like a lot of corpo Vtubers do , it would have been terrible for her

>>68513779
yeah, but luxiem is a shambling husk of what it once was after the yabs and the turning on schizo-yume-death-threat-spammers, but yes he could have stayed and still likely been making 100-200k a year

>>68513832
The obvious flaw in the argument is that it's paradoxical. He's right that the agency's sole purpose is to make money. But the only way to make more money is to invest in your talents. So if the agency never invests in their talents, the owners/ shareholders will make less money. So, it's in the company's interest to spend money on their talents.
The logic only works when they have a fool like selen who is willing to open her wallet at the drop of a hat, but how many people are willing to spend that kind of money on IP for which they do not own?
Agencies cant force their talents to pay for every single thing. It's not economically viable.

Next time Suisei maxes her credit card pulling gacha she should blame Cover.

>>68513772
>had to continue in Vshojo because he needed more money
you should not be the one defending retarded spending habits

>>68514389
False equivalence you drooling nijinigger

>>68507865
so there's literally zero reason to join a corpo, thanks for admitting it.

>>68513984
I'll definitely admit that all the drama has been helping her a lot, but the people who I've seen graduate and move on as someone else (kson, mikineko, matara kan, kuro, and now doki) generally retain about the same levels of popularity they had before the switch; viewers are entertained by the performer, not just their performance (i.e. the vtuber "brand"). In fact, the more I think about it, the more the idea of seperating the "Art" of the Vtuber Persona from the "Artist" of the actual person behind it feels like folly. For example, When rushia graduated and tried to start again as Nazuna, she quickly dropped to significantly less viewers than before... but that was because her fans had already found and came back to her old account, mikineko. Fans are quick to get attached to the person behind the mask, because that's the person putting the most work into the content those fans like.

>>68499158
Imagine having $200K to spend in a year

>>68499382
It's way cuter, but giant dragon tits were sexier.
She can do more with Doki though.

>>68514558
She put so much of herself and fans in to her work and she got shat on by her company.
She put herself in to the negatives for the company, to defend the company to other creators over payment issues.
Imagine how gut-punching that must have felt to let go of.
They lost a lot by letting this fester and not fixing the issues. And by doing that, they lost a bunch of third party content producers too.
I don't think NijiEN will recover from this. Content wise at least, like they'll probably be fine next week, maybe 2, when everything dies down, unless something else comes out...

>>68514480
Is it if she’s pulling on stream for content?

Lemme see if I get this straight
>Most corpos expect talents to fund their own shit
>Niji takes gross majority of cash and still expects this as well
>Selen actually tried to do the thing everyone seems to agree is expected for her to do
>Nijisanji slams a boot into her cooter and says "no nevermind you didn't do it right" and now she's done the thing she was expected to do and got punished for it
>Gets upset at the waste of money and management
>Gets shadow banned for a month for doing the thing everyone, including the people who punished her, expected her to do
Was Selens only fault spending 200k?

>>68514541
Yes, but using your corporate Vtuber identity to promote your roommate account is not above board. And if it's accepted that the Vtuber's handlers could take their profit without properly financing the operation, then we're gonna see a meta of joining agencies to funnel viewers through backdoors and eventually breakup with them.

There are always outliers who have everything work out in the end. Especially for Hololive talents when the company might as well be Disney when it comes to the Vtubing scene . So prominent that youtube recommend videos to make me learn of their roommate accounts against my will

>>68514558
Yeah, I’m finding it hard to feel sorry for a woman who had $200K to blow throw in twelve months with her primary job being to play video games. The bullying and shit sucks, but no sympathy for her not managing her spending.

>>68515165
You are disgusting

>>68512901
>Personal projects
Except the end product is claimed and sold by the company, so it's not personal at all.

>>68513323
>spending 200k on streams that you are not sure will pay it all back seems like a terrible decision to me
It might be, but it also shows how dedicated to her profession she is. Anyone sane would have quit.

>>68514834
>Was Selens only fault spending 200k?
Not even a fault. Imagine trying to be someone in the vtubing space and not getting new art commissioned for yourself. The only fault I could see is if she did not make it tax deductible as a business expense.

>>68499158
shut the fuck up you stupid fucking faggot shill, you’d be calling it a nothingburger if she spent 1k instead

>>68514834
The choice to spend 200k is all on her and shouldn't have anything to do with niji but I still see people going "wow she spent 200k and made NO PROFIT?" as if any of the expensive MVs for holo or anyone else ever makes profit.
The issue with niji not handling the payments for her is a separate issue.

>have the talent pay for it
>take a cut
All vtubing corpos do this shit for some reason and I don‘t get why people are just now complaining about it

>>68511715
Your missing that the artist leaked that Selen would avoid working with management sometimes just because she knew they wouldn't approve some projects or would be slow

so she knew very well, and did not tell management

>>68513157
>they’re really only there to give the vtuber a platform
That is straight up factually wrong. They are supposed to be there because they have laid the groundwork that allows a corpo tuber to work more efficiently, and resolve issues indies can't. An indie will have a harder time wrestling with youtube for example, an indie can't be expected to have a legal team, an indie can't have a manager (until big enough), and indie can't just contact large companies and create massive projects that include promos, merch, marketing. And indie also can't be expected to have a professional mocap studio with a team that operates it.
The point of joining a corpo is supposed to be that you get access to things you can't as a solo creator, this is also why they can take a cut of your money, because its fine for them to get paid to provide all these services to their talents. The problem comes when they can't provide even the most basic service like a manager getting an inhouse OK to use your own inhouse IP in an inhouse production of your inhouse talent.
Its fine for talents to front some of the money, for some of the projects, but now we are talking about a company that seemingly was expecting the talents to pay for everything, and they just get to cash in on the success of the project while not only refusing to help, but actively hindering the projects (not sending proper NDAs, not forwarding the payments, not getting perms). And while a talent can be expected to pay for these things, it can still be expected to go trough the company books. So if Millie makes a song that cost her 15k, instead of her paying out of pocket, the company pays for expenses, and she just gets 15k substracted from her earnings.

>>68499158
don’t you have a gaza strip to pillage?
Oh…ohhh wait wrong board I was thinking of IDF

>>68515611
He never said that nijinigger

>>68515165
You don’t wanna know how much Marine has dropped on just one MV. When you’re an ambitious artist menhera like Doki it makes perfect sense why she would want to collab and make as much content as possible. Not saying she’s justified with doing that but the fact management did FUCKING NOTHING ALL THIS TIME and they DONT EVEN FINANCIALLY SUPPORT THEM is a fucking joke…man fuck this fucking company i’m drunk. I want Nijisanji bankrupt by the end of this month. Fuck this fucking company. Fuck this fucking company.

>>68515242
I’m not retarded enough to spend 200K and cry about it expecting sympathy though.
>>68515527
Because it was Niji this time and Niji bad >=(

>>68515714

>>68515954
huh

>>68515954
He should delete that

>>68499436
Gay.

>>68515611
People are letting their hatred of NijiEN (which was never popular on this board) blind them to the fact that they got hoodwinked by a lying grifter. Stuff is leaking out slowly (like that artist tweet) to add to the fact that I don't believe a word that Selen says. She is a manipulative grifter.

>>68516355
>like that artist tweet
Which one are you referring to?

>>68516257
Why?

>>68516355
Kys

>>68516402
The post that I quoted. They said that Selen wouldn't seek proper approval for projects but spend the money on them anyway and then cry foul when they weren't approved. She is clearly a menhera not deserving of your sympathy. She is doing a very good job of playing the victim right now though and getting a lot of money from useful idiots.

>>68503322
Selen was the least sexual vtuber design I have ever seen.

>>68516500
>spend the money on them anyway and then cry foul when they weren't approved
Not what happened

>>68515954
Selen worked the marks into a shoot and is going to make bank, just like The Rock cucking Cody Rhodes.

>>68508776
>the fact that the agency did not help her manage her finances is bad by itself.
>they didn't give her permission to do things again and again
>the fact that the agency didn't give her permission to do her projects is bad by itself
Selensisters can you please stick to one of those?

>>68516634
I gotta admit she is very good at working the marks. Even Rushia didn't get this kind of support off of her termination. It's pretty remarkable the shitstorm she generated and she knew exactly what she was doing. Grifter prime. Thankfully drama viewers, virtue signalers, and overall useful idiots don't stick around for too long so her 15 minutes of fame should fade fast, god willing.

>>68499158
>NDF pulling fictitious numbers out of their asses
15k is a modest expense for an MV
Nijisanji are just massive pricks for not paying upfront considering she's already a unicorn for them

>>68511263
>where it's all optional.
What's optional? Starting projects in holo and niji is completely optional. If you don't want to pay then don't do anything.

>>68499436
being down several grades just makes it hotter

>>68516822
Exactly
Hololive pays for that stuff so why doesn‘t kurosanji?

>>68516860
Hololive doesn’t though.

>>68499158
I mean did Niji told her to spend that much on projects? If not, then I don't see how it's their fault.

>>68516500
>believing Niji

>>68516860
It's because they operate like a silicon velley firm that begs money to VCs and cashing in as soon as they have fiduciary duties
Hololive actually acts like a talent agency/record label where they pay money upfront in exchange of copyright

>>68499158
Does she have a license to be this smug?

>>68516793
I respect the "guys! I am not you girlfriend!" GFE. It is clearly aimed at more intelligent audience members so making it work is harder than the blatant in your face GFE.

>>68516937
Yeah she should have just done 0 fucking projects retard
Seriously every other company is happy to fund shit like that

>>68517278
>you can only 0% or 100% nothing in between
She should have made less projects when she just admitted that they didn't bring any profits. Only emotional selen simps can't understand this.

>>68514558
>>68515165
> NEET unable to comprehend doing business
> Corpo bootlicker
stop signaling you're a poorfag and shit your pant the moment you hear a woman spending 200k on her career. Niji owning their talent IP, entitled to pay cut, right to veto projects .Meanwhile they can't do the bare minimum expected which is financing the operation properly. There's no way to spin this dog shit

>>68517428
Vtuber corps give them their models and sometimes if necessary a pc to do their job which is streaming. No company, whether that is cover, anycolor or any of the smaller ones, helps with financing tangentially related stuff like expensive music videos or virtual worlds.

>>68517428
>Poorfag
My guy 200K in two and a half years is more money than most people in the western world will make in a similar time frame. I know you mud hurt dwellers have no concept of monetary value though so it’s not your fault you don’t realise that.

You really can't trust a single thing out of a Chinese person's mouth

>>68517653
I mean she’s not wrong.

>>68517653
Based

>>68517653
So typical 4channer, secretly “based”?

>>68517031
That's not GFE you stupid unicorn, that's called sympathy.

>has $200k to spend
>claims bankruptcy over $15k she wasn’t getting back anytime soon
Holy mother of embellishments

>>68518010
That’s called emotional blackmail that makes GFE pale in comparison.
>verification not required

>>68518143
>if all you have is a hammer etc etc
Man, having unicorn mind must be so relaxing. All thing can be clearly defined as GFE and not GFE, and even the non GFE stuff is really GFE.
Truly galaxy brain.

>>68515492
Holowhores regularly drop boku bucks on personal projects and you never hear them bitching about profit loss, probably cause they don't have a shit suck company that actively fucks them over whenever they try to earn money. Imagine that. It was 200k over the course of a year, and she made zero profit, so despite all the supas, merch, collaborative events, and projects, she couldn't even break even with self investments that she was expected to take. How much is a reasonable amount to invest in yourself over the course of a year? I wanna hear everyone's opinion because 200k seems fine

>>68518073
That’s the genius of it, anon. Now she’ll get the 15K and so much more back on the pity gravy train.

>>68518330
>200k seems fine
>A year
In what world?

>>68518330
>Zero profit
Where did the 200K come from?

>>68499158
how can she waste so much money like that

>>68518010
I am talking about her haha gaming dragon tomboy persona. Where she isn't doing rushia shit like ASMR and all that other stuff. She is pretending she isn't GFE and is above that but of course she wants people to be parasocial and sent her money because they develop feelings for her.

It was only 200k Canadian

>>68518370
In the world of SEA where they can’t comprehend the value of money, so they just pretend they can to try and fit in.

>>68518293
Tell me then, is her surge of popularity in any way related to entertainment? Or is it pity and virtue signaling which she’ll profit from? Grow some eyes and some balls you blind infant.

>>68518429
>she wants people to be parasocial
No shit sherlock, else she wouldn't choose streamer as her profession.
But clearly defining boundaries is what separate GFE and non GFE because you can't really control how your viewers think

>>68518330
>probably cause they don't have a shit suck company that actively fucks them over whenever they try to earn money
They're not trying to earn money when they spend shitloads of money on music videos and other shit. There's literally no way to make profit from spending on a music video targeting a niche audience.

>>68518393
From superchats, merch sales, voice pack sales etc.

>>68518370
In the entertainment industry? Are you retarded? How much money do you think Selen generates a year alone for her company?

>>68518542
Ok, so she made enough money from Niji to be able to blow 200K in a single year. So her having 0 profit from her time in Niji is entirely her own fault.

>>68518558
Anon, even for top of the top streamers 200k A YEAR is still a ridiculous amount.

>>68518521
Promotional, getting your music licensed, marines music makes it to the radio, she gets royalties from every station that plays her music, so make a good music video to to attract people to listen and then boom it gets popular and more stations want it in their list. Duh. Dumb nigger.
And that's just radio there's also digital sales, music videos attract listeners which widens your profit margins.

>>68518515
>But clearly defining boundaries is what separate GFE and non GFE because you can't really control how your viewers think
Anon plz.... This is plausible deniability tier. If there were no lonely men to exploit vtubing would be dead. It will always be exploitation of lonely faggots regardless if you pretend you aren't GFE or go full GFE. If anything unabashed GFE is at least transparent and honest dishonesty.

>>68518609
That's not the point retard-chama, business should be beneficial to all parties involved yet in her case only kurosanji benefits from her hard work and projects.

>>68518558
Her loss is negligible so not a lot.

>>68518638
?

>>68518708
It was beneficial to the tune of earning her 200K, it’s not their fault she blew it all on optional spending.

>>68518708
>do projects that don't bring you enough money in
>management steps in to stop you
>continue to do projects that don't bring you enough money in and complain about management
Selenfags you are so fucking deluded that you don't see the problem here. It is painful.

>>68517567
>>68518370
>>68518484
Peak loser energy to get stunlocked on 200k. It doesn't matter if it's 2k, 20k, 200k or 2 mil when the underlying problem is the same. You mf would lick Riku's taint for 20 bucks

>>68518701
You're talking as if vtubing and streaming are two, vastly different thing.
Sometime people just want to be entertained, yaknow?

>>68518788
Why are you so obsessed with Riku’s asshole?

>>68518649
Now where's the logic in Selen spending similar amounts of money when she isn't Marine and never will be? She spent 200k on shit that was never going to be profitable.

>>68510670
Yeah i swear ive heard somewhere anything a holo funds they get a majority of the revenu for it

>>68518719
earning 200k a year and spending 200k a year are not the same, retardo-kun.

>>68518788
It does matter though, she’s basically complaining about earning comfortably above the average income in her country but being stupid enough to blow it all in a year.

>>68518785
>management steps in to stop you
roru
rumao even

>>68518785
>Management steps in to stop you
>By that I mean they wait till you've already blown all your money, disassemble your project so you can't make any more and then vacation your ass so you can't make money even doing your normal job
Cool so just fuck Selen all around right im sure that's good for the long run

>>68499158
How did Selen manage to look more smug before Niji?

>>68518826
Maybe It was just goodwill for the fans? Not everything needs to make money, but the fact that it couldn't make anything back because of nijinigger meddling and also amounted to nothing is the problem.

>>68518992
All blondies chuubas look smug, it's in their gene.

>>68518925
According to this >>68515954 she failed to actually tell them about the projects in advance so that‘s on her

imagine having $200k and wasting it on commissions lmao. These finance noobs are pissing me off

>>68519021
>Maybe It was just goodwill for the fans? Not everything needs to make money
If it was just about goodwill for the fans, why even talk about her not making profit from spending that 200k?
Also, Marine's songs are exactly the same.

>>68518515
The difference between one and the other is that non-GFE keeps the simps blue-balled and GFE gives them explicit masturbation fodder. They both willingly fleece simps, the former is just disgusted in her fans.

>>68499436
on the neck size

>>68519078
Anon, your reading comprehension reps...
What that fag saying is that NijiEN livers prefer to work things out themselves without constant need of waiting for management input because its' slow.
They're not saying the livers started a project without geting management approval first.

>>68519078
1 I don't know who this literally fucking who is,
2 they said they left niji at the start of 2023 which is before Selen even started getting in trouble as stated by Nijisanjis official statement
3, they outright say in the FIRST sentence that they don't know anything about this specific situation, it's only hearsay of experiences they may or may not have had with Selen. That you're treating it like gospel only let's me know how much of a midwit shit stirring nijinigger you are.

>>68518800
That’s what video games and movies are for. Streamers you watch for the parasocial aspect.

>>68519196
>Don’t consult management
>Oh my god management didn’t stop me spending 200K!
なるほど

>>68518829
no youtube cut
no cover cut

>>68519166
Yeah I don't watch chuubas to jack off unless it's asmr , I just want to be entertained.

>>68519235
Sometimes I want background noise while I do things and there are only so much yt essays

>>68519258
>Be fine with investing 200k on yourself
>At least you'll make something back and the fans will appreciate it
>Management suddenly comes in and kicks your feet out from under you making the whole ordeal worthless
Nice bootlicking there anon, don't forget heel now.

Koreans would have drawn the in-betweens for that MV for a fraction of the cost

>>68499158
she spend 200k on project just to cock-blocked by nijisanji, literally throwing money on air

>>68519258
>Her mistake was expecting snakes in management to uphold the bargain
She's clearly dumb, I agree with you, but please stop bootlicking Tazumi's taint for a second won't you

>>68499158
>had $200K to spend in a year and still not homeless
>I'm so poor please pity me

>>68518890
Vtubing is not the only profession with high salaries but is highly competitive with a low chance of succeeding, high upfront investment or limited shelf-life. Singer, actors or doctor, programmer have some or all of those qualities. And it's common sense that you're probably a shit org if you pull the same shit in those field.

>>68519766
>Had to open etsy preorder because she had no money for hospital stuff
She might not be in danger of being homeless but she's clearly not that far off.

>>68517543
Holo give bugets for their talents projects and help them with sponsors and marketing
Agencies are expect to support the talents and ivest in the IPs beyond giving a model and a PC

>>68519909
>t. amouranth viewer

>>68519258
anon even niggersanji admits Selen consulted them and they ignored her or told her no

>>68520112
Who?

>>68518759
>"optional spending"
>the same projects that let her earn 200K
So do nijiniggers live someplace where they're not allowed to make money or are they literally incapable of money management?

>>68520157
>No don’t do the project
>Does the project anyway
>OH MY GOD I SPENT ALL MY MONEY
Oh yeah, that’s much better.

And don't even mention how much of that sum she could write off from her taxes.
You people are fucking retarded.

>>68518393
Do you even know what profit is ?

>>68520248
>So do nijiniggers live someplace where they're not allowed to make money
Well she made 200K so clearly it’s not this, which only leaves
>are they literally incapable of money management?

>>68512540
The problem isn't spending 200k
The problem is spending 200k and getting nothing back for it.
Even Pekora just throwing money at the gacha machine of FGO earned her a profit I assume.
Nijisanji is just evil

>>68520327
Yes, she profited 200K off merch sales and whatever else, and then spent it all like a retard.

>>68520379
SHE INVESTED 200K IN PROJECTS YOU FUCK
AND SHE WOULD GET A TIDY PROFIT TOO IF MANAGEMENT WEREN'T SUCH A SNAKE

Why are NDF like this

>>68520379
>>68520336

That's not profit you retard. Profit is what you have left over after business expenses.

>duhhhhhh just don't do anything

then she wouldn't have made 200K in the first place.

this is why everyone thinks you're brown, you have to spend money to make money and most companies would budget projects with the talents if they weren't vantablack abusive.

>>68499158
why is she so smug?!? i didnt not feel i have the need to sub when she was purple but now i cant stop myself from clicking it

>>68499261
Did you still get paid after all of this NDF?

>>68520447
they're brown and have a very poor concept of money that doesn't involve telecom scams and begging on the street corner, which are the only jobs they are capable of holding.

>>68520267
anon you said earlier she didn't consult management, niggersanji outright says they did, so is niggersanji lying about itself?

>>68520434
NOT ALL INVESTMENT GENERATE PROFIT YOU FUCKTARD

>>68515954
>an indian became lead staff
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>68520615
NDF-chama, the only reason it didn't turn profit was because niji stonewalled her.
Take the MV for example, had it not privated it's reasonable to assume she would at least break even instead of eating the 15k loss

>>68512540
It was several projecta combined retard-sama

>>68512540
>There's literally no way anyone in holo has ever spent 200k on anything.

Bae spent 1 million yen on just Mindcraft. Tho it wasn't her own money, it was given to her by Holo to spend on any project she wants.

>>68520958
>A million yen
Wowee a whole 7k burgerdollars!

>>68520371
Didn't she say she broke even? That means she still made 200k last year. Use your head anon.

>>68519184
I like long sexy necks.

>>68518719
I don't know how much you've put Selen on a pedestal but she is a top female of Nijisanji's EN branch, not Pokimane. She is nowhere close to a top streamer.

>>68522353
Doesn't mayter you economic illiterate, if she had zero profit she mada zero dollars in the period and it's not the same as breaking even

>>68518708
>business should be beneficial to all parties involved
Meaning she shouldn't have blown 200k. I don't know how much the kurokara forgot to pay but I do know they clearly forgot to stop her after she blew a hundred thousand dollars in six months.

>>68520506
NDF doesn't know that Niji will keep delaying their payments like they did to Selen

>>68522620
She didn't blowed money you retard, she invested in her product and was backstabed by Niji's management

>>68522617
I don't give a shit how much she profited in the end if she still raked in 200k from streaming.

>>68499158
You dumbasses know that was a meme right? It's a joke some anon made about their gatcha addiction.

>>68522765
>she invested in her product
It is not investment when you are a retard and get no return on what you invest. Her projects can mostly bring her recognition and potential new customers. You can't run a company where 90% of your budget is marketing. Do a few projects to saturate the need for marketing and don't do more cause you are just blowing money away. Jesus you faggots are so fucking dumb it hurts.

>>68520715
The video getting privated was her own fault. By her own admission they told her to wait for them to check everything on their end before she uploaded it, then she threw a tantrum and uploaded it anyway. If you want to see how an adult handles that situation look at Bae. Hololive management made her push back the release of her Mind Craft cover because they wanted to get things sorted out for it, and that was after she had spent a long time hyping it up for that day. Did she ignore them and just put the video up? No, she openly expressed some disappointment, explained to her fans what happened, then ended up getting the video out. It was later than she wanted but it turned out to be a big success for her. There's no reason Selen couldn't have done the same.

>>68523339
>a 2 year long project
>multiple requests to management to check the finished MV
Blame the management retard, their slow, ETL-ass is at fault here

>Nijisanji confirmed Selen did consult them
>NDF: no she didn't
You subhuman just invent new narrative and lie in every thread in hope it will stick huh ?

>>68523339
Mindcraft was a full-branch project where every member recorded vocals, Cover also gave her $6k to produce the MV and supported and walked her through the whole process of making it. And it only took a few months to make.

How is getting the silent treatment for months only to pull the rug on her at the last minute remotely the same?

>>68509222
>Doesn't want dragon hand to choke you
Why are you gay?

>>68499158
>>68523143
>invest into building brand
>kurokara wastes a bunch of your money
>make 4900% return on $200k anyway
>kurokara takes 98%
>$0 personal profit

>>68499382
I like her smug mouth, need correction in vtai.

I respect Selen for giving everything she had to try to keep her career afloat but holy shit I'd stop after going red for 10k

>>68524882
Literally her fault kek
Do you buy high and sell low too wagie?

>>68506939
You clearly have no idea how money works. If you spend a considerable amount of money buying me something that I never wanted or asked for, I'm not obligated to pay you that money back. I don't owe you shit.

>>68506232
Mori still pays for personal songs. She doesn't pay for the specific songs made by and curated by the japanese music company

>>68515615
But then...how would they keep Niji going if they gave money to their talent? Those baseball yakuza aren't cheap my friend. Riku needs his baseball sticker album to be filled with every bubblegum baseball card. DO YOU EVEN KNOW HOW EXPENSIVE THE OHTANI CARD IS?

>>68513698
If men are so good with money how come you don't got any?

>>68526936
She actually talked them into letting her use her own money for that now

>>68527576
That woman is a trainwreck when it comes to chilling out. Jesus Christ she will cause a giant yab one day due to being sleep deprived

While I'm sure both Niji and Holo don't pay for everything, and livers do regularly end up spending a lot out of pocket, the difference between the two companies is I don't see any artists complaining they didn't receive expected payment from Holo forcing the talents to turn around and pay for it themselves.

And I CERTAINLY don't see Holo trying to claim a talent didn't pay artists, when it was they who were not paying artists... But par for the course, every specific complaint in that termination notice turned out to be a lie.

>>68520371
>The problem is spending 200k and getting nothing back for it.
That's her own fault. Even if we assume that she is under an agreement with the corpo to pay them a license fee to make content for the character she's employed to play, it's her business decision. As an indie or other content creator it isn't much different either. Some guy spent a lot of money to make a video of his self-insert getting chased. Probably didn't make any money from that either. In the end she is also completely at fault for the lack of profit. The only difference is that now that she is an indie she can't blame an agency for it.

>>68510670
the kyoani of vtubing???
blue dorito man, i kneel

>>68522353
She said she made no profits. That means she spent 200k and could've gotten from 1$ to 199999$ and that's still being in the red, albeit by hair thin margin, if she made exactly 200k then she broke even, if she made over 200001$ then she's on profit.

>>68527711
Mori is funding an expensive animated video out of pocket and is glad she has full control over it. The difference is more like they're partners and she is using their IP for her video. They probably have to share profits, but she is paying the costs because she wants to produce the video. If she didn't she would have to wait for them to come up with a plan and if they're involved with some of the costs they have full control over it. This is a very fair arrangement but the difference is that Mori expects to make money from the video, even if some of that is going back to Cover.
Vanity projects are never a good idea under any circumstances.

>>68499382
It's the smug face it just fits so well

Theoretically if Niji is not paying third parties for services rendered their liabilities will be underreported on their balance sheet which constitutes financial fraud.
This is assuming the third parties themselves are able to organize a suit and litigate in Japan which I assume Niji is betting they can't.
Still it's lying to their investors and an organized effort could liquidate the entire company.

>>68499158
>I spent 200k on vanity projects
>None of it was successful because I have no real talent
Can't help that.

>>68499158
You'd think after the first 100,000 dollars she'd stop and go 'hm, this is a lot. Better stop.' but then she sinks another 100,000.

>>68528128
Assuming that assumed assumptions based on assumptions are true. Niji already lost a lawsuit in Japan, it's not friendly territory like some make out. Lawyers can also fax or use this new invention called the internet to partner with a Japanese firm. It's not so complicated. If it's true then do it or "show mercy" i.e., it's not true and there is no case.