/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

>expecting the Western hemisphere of the planet to understand the Eastern hemisphere of the world we live in
That's your first mistake.

>>49456719
Because they have lives outside vtubing, unless, they make vtubing or streaming their life since their early teens.

>>49456719
western hates parasocial pandering

>>49456719
DO U RLY?

They do. You just don't know who they are because they don't have the noombers you crave.

>>49456719
I don't know op, why don't you watch streams?

parasocial fuck

>using screenshots from a clipfag
You need to actually be able to speak the language if you're going to pretend to be Japanese.

>>49456819
nah man they love it to make money
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPGN6DfIaNc&ab_channel=hololiveEnglish

>>49456864
I do watch streams but clips are a convenient way to make bait OP images like these for EOPs to sperg at and distract from their failing branch
> inb4 1%
nijisanji can die for all I care, I don't watch any of them

>>49456839
>and usually end up fucking up and revealing they have a bf, posted nudes or fucked a random fan, cause they're too retarded to keep up the opsec without management to keep them in check
Sadly its not that simple, 2view /here/chuuba anon. They're still arguably better than most large corpo ENs, but for some reason kayfabe and opsec are something ENchuubas have a hard time keeping up for the long run.
t. 2view enjoyer

Pekora is a fucking scammer.

>>49456960
It's funny imagining you as some obese dipshit ending your sentences with dayo. Enough with the act, cringetard.

>>49456719
What fact?
Western audiences are just want exciting drama. Streamers are giving what majority audiences want.

>>49456719
She's the Queen of Hololive and her shy/introvert personality, genuine love for video games & to stay indoors makes her not only relatable but truly
understanding of her audience.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9s_Bucn6yIA

>>49456992
This never forget your Cold Chicken peko

>>49456819
No they love getting parasocial benefits but hate the responsibility of fostering an audience that is parasocial.

come home ENbros...

>>49456719
>Why does no one in the western VTubing industry understand nor acknowledge this simple fact?
If you think western chuubas have a hard time understanding this, never look at some of the big fleshtubers on twitch because they'll blow your fucking mind with the narcissism

>>49457528
is there really that much of a cultural difference? I'm sure there are honest and wholesome streamers in the EN side of streaming as well right?

>>49457140
DYRBI?

>>49457612
Those don't make it big since the Twitch audience wants someone relatable aka just as vain as them.

>>49457624
after almost 3 years of watching her - yes

>>49457612
maybe if you look past all the drama whores, gambling addicts, scammers, sex pests, e-whores, only fan whores, hot tub streamers, porn starts turned twitch streamers, and commies. yeah probably

The anons here who fall for bleeding heart lines like these are the most gullible suckers on this site.
>I-I know they're just saying it as part of their job. It's the kayfabe.
That makes you a self-aware sucker. Then again I guess we're all suckers for dropping money on streamers in the first place.

>>49457612
There are bunch of chill wholesome fleshtuber streamers on Twitch, best example is probably Cohh. Most just don't get into drama and barely get new viewers so hard to know if you didn't know them already.

>>49457958
Source: The society I reside in is in a horrible state and so I assume it must be the same in the rest of the world

PARASOCIAL FUCKS is the general norm here sorry japggots

>>49458028
Projecting much? When did I even make a passing remark about society? I just don't take every word these bitches say as the gospel truth just because they use kawaii avatars.

>>49456987
kayfabe? opsec?
anon posted Pekora, who doesn't just pretend to not have a boyfriend, she chooses to not have one
He's asking why western vtubers can't do that

>>49456719
Western women are vile creatures

>>49456719
superchat = love

>>49456839
then recommend some smart guy

>>49458099
You don't see your clouded judgement. It's sad really.

>>49458211
western women can't live without a man in their life, which is doubly ironic considering they're pushing all the "strong independent women" messaging in the west, along with trying to push out the actual independent women without men out of vtubing
Americans don't even know what they themselves want, they're an absolute mess of a culture.

>>49457319
The only take worth reading here.

>>49458099
but i like living in my anime fantasy delusion

>>49458427
Honestly the only people who benefit from it are the men at the top. They turned women into free use onaholes who defend them from the majority of other men. Sometimes it backfires sure but it's mostly for the smart ones aka the quiet ones

>>49458211
Yeah but that's asking for far too much, especially from attractive women who are into male hobbies. Especially women who grew up in a culture that entourages them to fuck around to express their freedom and independence
I'm sure most non-schizo anons would be contempt with them just not fucking up their opsec/kayfabe, which already seems to be a tall order for ENchuubas

>>49458609
>contempt
did you mean *content?

>>49456719
Lol this parasocial fucker. No wonder you don't have a significant partner; you want girls who won't be able to function without you. Pathetic imp.

>>49458099
A horse can see and laugh at other horses' blinders but it will always be blind to its own.

>>49458739
> you want girls who won't be able to function without you
I want independent female content creators who don't need a man's help from behind to succeed sister.

>>49457319
yep

>>49458211
>anon posted Pekora, who doesn't just pretend to not have a boyfriend, she chooses to not have one
Holy fuck how can you delusional fucks be so fucking stupid? Do you honestly really believe this shit?

>>49457999
> twitch incentivizes drama if you want to grow your fanbase
no wonder the entire site is a fucking cesspool

>>49458363
>I feel so loved by you guys! You guys are all my friends!
>It just so happens that our entire friendship consists of you giving me money!

>>49457716
it's like trying to dumpster dive for edible food, no respectable person will even consider doing it

>>49458851
what are you gonna do sis? seethe about it?

The Japanese society is a sad state of affairs that I can only hope Pekora is just selling this fantasy and she actually has someone out there that cares for her like family instead of just anonymous people on the internet. Western holos seem to have greater disdain of fans who get too attached to them and think they are their girlfriend or a wife and when they do any gfe like streams they clearly state it's fanservice and will return to the usual program in the next stream

Smells like estrogen in here

>>49457612
Every single huge western streamer thinks he's gods gift to earth
It's not even a vtuber thing. They truely believe the fans are not the reason why they are where they are

>>49458877
i give my friends my lunch money all the time.....wait...

Ahh...pekora, you don't have anyone except me? I love you so much I matter so much to you...

Really how the Ken-sama's that claim to watch JP stay on this board instead of posting on 5ch or even /jp/

>>49458823
/thread

>>49457319
fuck you being correct itt

>>49457612
there are and I can count them all on one hand

>>49456992
hi pekoschizo

>>49457319
/thread

>fake whore - >:(
>fake whore japan - :O

>>49458964
Woah...Pekora depends on her fans (actually just me) that much? I'm so special, I better send her another supa because she really needs me so much.

>>49456719
i think if you stopped trying to suck on corpo or big number vtuber tits in hopes they'll wet your dick, and instead tried to give smaller indies a chance, you'd see that many of them do understand and follow this

>itt 2view ENwhores seething that their asses will never ever get a sliver of success that pekora has, because they are incapable of playing nice with their audience
no one will watch you, no matter how much you cry about it /here/

>>49459756
Give me your best example

>>49458823
Just pretending very Corp isn't run by men from behind the streamers

>>49459897
I don't think she's going to link herself here

>>49456719
Japs are cynical, they too, hate that kind of pathetic manchild audience.

>>49456719
She baited your sympathy and you fell for it, now you and some other cucks will rip your wallets out for her.

>>49459756
>>49456987
I gave dozens of 2view ENchuubas a try and other then a select few, they simply couldn't keep it up for very long
Also, since you're clearly a disgruntled 2view yourself, let me give you a word of advice, crying about corpos /here/ or on twitter will instantly label you as seething loser who couldn't make it and is lashing out at the world for it. Doesn't matter whether you think you're right or wrong, its simply not a good first impression

>>49460057
so true, sis!

>>49460284

>>49460284
Funnily enough I haven't spent a single dime on Pekora yet, even though I watch her a lot
I did buy Mio's hoodie though

>>49456719
>JP good EN bad
Retard. JP also has whores like Matsuri and Laplus also Suisei which is literally the Mori of JP

>>49458823
Kweh. 100% successful chuubas has someone behind them to support. It's business where you need to be part of the team to survive and constantly make a content. Live in society, yah?

>>49458609
>entourages
*encourages
>contempt
*content
Spellcheck your shit faggot

>>49459341
non-japanese whores are just bad at faking

>>49460536
>gives 3 examples in JP vs multiple examples in EN
Okay.

>>49459756
>and instead tried to give smaller indies a chance
... Why should I? I get all I want and more from watching HoloJP

>>49456719
If anyone ever asks why is Pekora so popular and not someone like finana, fauna or elira for instance show them this clip https://youtu.be/vfWOCGvYzlA
This is exactly why.

>>49458924
Fans are consequence of decentish content no?
There is no crowds of abstract fans that wanders on internet waves whith the big brand new characters on their shoulders aiming to find free podium to raise them on?

>>49460810
all of this is just the softcore version of a thot writing your name on a board while showing off her t&a with less effort put in on the streamer's part
I like vtubers but all the fake "I wuv you guys" shit is just as cringe from them as it is from any other streamer

if you want that for real, you have to find the right autistic male streamers

>>49460825
Just like how your based JP example is just Pekora

>>49456719
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NLw-SDzfXM

>>49461795
She was in the right tho

>>49457612
Yes, there are wholesome big streamers in EN like Jerma but that's like 1 out of 10 big streamers and the drama-streamers are still twice more popular

>>49463366
Is it Twitch's design that causes dramatubers to bubble up in popularity or do EN audiences just prefer drama over wholesomeness?

>>49457140
t. gachi who bought the hype

>>49463414
EN audience is constantly chasing after "the shiny thing" and drama is the easiest way to stand out. Coupled with the fact that these drama streamers gangs up together in groups to suck and protect each other, the culture just continuously tends to incline in favor of drama. It's kinda like how Vshojo made the EN vtuber meta become female streamers doing coomerbait and how Shotou made male vtuber been seem as faggy

>>49463671
>gachi

UH AH THANK YOU SIR

>>49461795
She tried to warn us.

>>49459341
this

>>49458028
Ah yes, what a horrible state our society is in, unlike those other pure and wholesome societies where a bunch of eternally isolated men have a fantasy relationship with someone cosplaying as an anime little girl

Fauna needs to give Pekora "The Talk" about not lying to your fanbase. They are NOT your friends and you need to tell them to fuck off when they act friendly to you.

>>49463671
ガチ!?

>>49461211
men don't feel love for other men retard, that'd be gay and gays are subhuman

Is "parasocial" new buzzword for antis?

>>49460573
learn English first before you give retarded takes in English

50% of Tuba fans have brain damage.

>she iz muh fren

What?

>>49457319
It's the whole western mentality, wanting the pro but not wanting the con. And that is why lefty westerners are doomed.

Pekora you parasocial FUCK

>>49456719
Women in the west have an inflated sense of self importance and have been told their whole lives that it's morally desirable to bite the hand that feeds them

>>49464129
t. Fauna
Fuck you green whore, Pekora is my friend

>>49456719
Twitch culture

>>49464006
>new

>>49458851
Stop deflecting about the E, cuckling.

>>49463671
so true sister

>>49458851
watch streams, do jp reps, find out for yourself
> basically improve yourself

>>49458851
You do know that no one gives a fuck about what you've just said, right?

>>49460284
Stop projecting. Get outta here and buy your wife's boyfriend a PS5.

>>49464916
>Get blown out
>N-No one care about what you said
>replying back

>>49464328
Pekora is not your friend. To be a friend you have to at least know the other person. Pekora doesn't know who you are. She has never heard your voice and never will. No amount of delusions will change this.
Pekora is an entertainer. Enjoy her for what she is.

>>49466029
cope sapling

>>49457034
Notice how he never responded afterwards? You hit the mark anon.

>>49466029
friend is a subjective term, but in the most general sense, its as simple as somebody you are friendly to. if you were to randomly bump into pekora, if you don't seem like you are going to be incredibly inappropriate (tall order i know), if you mention you watch her streams, shes likely to be more friendly than less. if somebody's behavior to you is more friendly than a stranger, what wold you call it?

>>49456719
I think VTubers should be as close to honest as they are able to. If you don't want kiss the feet of random super chat number 10385 then don't. If you're a parasocial nutcase to your audience like they are to you so be it.

>>49467244
>if you mention you watch her streams, shes likely to be more friendly
I can't believe some of you people actually believe this.

>>49456719
I like how the only responds to this post is “you are just parasocial” Nazuna it’s no real outer agreement, not realize creators need their fans more then the fans need them, as the fans are the ones with the money.

>>49456719
Fauna begs to differ
Kronii begs to differ
Ame begs to differ

>>49467244
Uh, you sure we're watching the same person bud?

>>49468629
>vtubers that get paid by a corporation which gets the money from fan donations.
The money has to come from somewhere after all.

>>49456719
3rd and 4th wave feminism rotted their egos

>>49456864
>post screenshot from stream
>it's just a picture of pekora with no context
are you retarded?

>>49468727
Fans, not friends.

>>49468914
Cope sapcuck

>>49464006
It was weird for a while. No one cared about that shit when it was western fleshtubers and streamers doing it, but as soon as JP vtubers began gaining popularity that word suddenly plopped up everywhere in connection to it and it was all bad and also 'member how problematic the asian idol culture is (that has nothing to do with vtubers)!? Most ironic thing is, that western ethots absolutely want and did that even worse, what they actually took issue with is that the JP variant of this "parasocial relationship" was also about giving back to the fans (even if it is just being more friendly and saying nice things) and not just a one-way street to reap all the benefits, while they get to be the trashiest people in existence when they feel like it, so they saw it as threat to the garbage tier streamer culture they build.

>>49456719
Funny how the only counter argument to this is “you are just parasocial” when entertainers and creators in general need fans more then the fans need them.

ewww, ick, we CANNOT be friends
IM HERE TO ENTERTAIN YOU AND THATS IT

>>49470466
this cope could work if anyone in the EN sphere was actually entertaining

>>49464006
Pretty much. It's been around for about a decade but no one noticed because people were shitting on simps and Onlyfans. It hit mainstream with Ludwig's video and other Twitch streamers both male and female started dunking on parasocials for content and claiming they're just "entertainers"

>>49456719
I know a few that are like this, I do understand your point if youre only talking about 5viewer ENs though

>>49456719
JARVIS INSTALL THE JAPANESE LANGUAGE IN MY BRAIN.

>>49456719
HOLY PARASOCIAL RELATIONSHIP, BATMAN

>>49470466
Yes, that is the relation ship between every streamer and their viewers.

>>49456822
>>49468629
>Fa*na
Ugh

>pretend to watch /jp/
>post clipnigger shit
At least back in hlgg vs hlg days the skepticism was warranted. But holoen is the prob the most yab free generation in all of hololive, or at least 2nd.

>>49456719
Time to drop the EN come to JP
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52ychNwwJ7Y

>>49464768
lol the sister poster still hanging around huh

>>49457449
BASED.

>>49472017
only when the streamer is actually entertaining to watch

>>49472034
No stream= no yab, fucking tard.

>>49456719
The west is all about dunking on men who enjoy niche hobbies while ALSO trying to infiltrate said hobby and find ways to profit from them while subverting the hobby. There are clearly streamers who foster a healthy mutualistic relationship with their chat, not only during streams but creating communities where everyone can get together, talk and do things like community watchalongs or make birthday cards showing their appreciation towards the streamer, but we both know people who scream PARASOCIAL FUCKS will never acknowledge this.

>>49456774
The extreme individualism of the West is a relatively recent development. Pre-60's West would be horrified at the current state of affairs, they would think we're a bunch of narcissistic cunts.

Shut the fuck up. You're like the idiot who thinks online friends are not friends because you don't hang out together IRL.

Because westerners prefer reality of delusion. She’s lying, she has family and friends.

>>49474029
Online friends know who you are individually. A streamer reads your name when you give them money. You are not friends with any of them, you are a viewer.

>>49474243
>Online friends know who you are individually.
Only if you met up with them in real life.

>>49474276
I have online friends who I've met IRL. I have online friends who I've never met IRL but they know my name and I know theirs.
"Friends" on discord servers where all you know about them is their username are not your friends, much like streamers.

>>49474243
>Online friends know who you are individually
No they don't. They don't know where you live or your real name. You share interests and play games together.

>>49473783
women find this really really hard
especially western women after all the indoctrination

>>49472145
you showed him sis

Why did conversation shift from "I don't want to hear Fauna say she's not my friend" to "Fauna is literally my friend"

>>49474367
> yeh fr fr online ppl cant be friends, the mailman tho hes a real nigga

>>49474772
In case you haven't noticed, you're sharing a board with delusional idiots who actually think streamers are their friends.

>>49468629
The funniest part about these dumb bitches is that they would never exist if it wasn't for the likes of Pekora.
It baffles me that they don't see the irony of it all.

>>49476170
Almost as bad as sharing the board with people who pretend to know what they're talking about and have only watched Vtubers for the duration of HoloEN's existence or less.

>>49476170
why the fuck is it always so black and white? there's nuance to this shit.
because i parasocially like a streamer and don't want to hear them say 'you are not my friend' doesn't mean i believe on a rational level that we have a personal one-on-one relationship, nor do i want that.

Literally nothing wrong with being parasocial with a vtuber, and also nothing wrong with expect any of them to return that feeling.

>>49456719
Because the Vtubing industry has gotten too big and is filled with people who don't respect its roots. Our Pax Romana has long passed, and the fanbase is now split between two doctrines; the Unicorns who believe in traditional vtuber culture and the SJWs who believe vtubers should be just like Twitch streamers. The only way it can be saved is a crusade that unites both against the Chinese menace.

>>49477254
You have a calm and rational opinion on this topic?
L + cringe + touch grass + ratio + rip bozo + you're british + PARASOCIAL FUCKS + insert zoomer lingo nonsense here

>>49463366
I'd say there are quite a few big/large enough en streamers that treat their viewers nicely

>>49464006
parasocial has been going around at least since 2020, if not before outside of the vtuber fandom. the west is all about the m e t a, (pseudo-)intellectualizing, subversion etc. we can't simply appreciate things anymore for what they are.
combine that with the preachy "uuuumm this is actually problematic you shouldn't do that" tumblr/twittard attitude, you get perpetually flaw-finding faggots using big speech to tell others how to enjoy things

>>49456719
Anon.... there were threads when pippa was talking about it
>>49456864

>>49480193
what did Pippa say?

>>49456719
>Why does no one in the western VTubing industry understand nor acknowledge this simple fact?

>>49457449
Holy based. You should add the "you guys have friends of the opposite sex right?" snd getting cucked by connor lmao

In the west the streamer thinks the audience exists because of them, rather than the other way around.

>>49482751
How could we have been so blind

>>49464736
it still baffles me how dedicated the sappling jannie is
banning someone for saying a single letter will never not be funny
even the deadbeat jannie is respectable compared to this retard

>>49460536
>Suisei which is literally the Mori of JP
rent free

>>49456819
Seethe more homobeggar, you twittertroons & r*ddit faggots have no loyalty or purchasing power. That’s why everything you support is a failure.

>>49473326
If you're getting parasocial with people you don't even find entertaining you have no standards.

>>49477254
>because i parasocially like a streamer and don't want to hear them say 'you are not my friend' doesn't mean i believe on a rational level that we have a personal one-on-one relationship, nor do i want that
The problem is that if you already understand that a streamer isn't your friend, it shouldn't bother you when they clarify that for the schizos in their audience. That is, by definition, irrational.

>>49486681
I got my message deleted for literally just calling a sapling a cuck, without any external mention to any other thing. At that point I lost all hope for the jannies on this board

>>49456719
Cold chikin...

I've seen this attitude from plenty of EN and western vtubers.
I don't know if EN speaking SEA hired by american corpos can be called "western" tho.
But just on Phase Connect alone plenty of members have said similar shit.

>>49458823
Funny how Hololive EN is full of content creators who already had sizable success before coming to Hololive, as in they had to prove that they could make it without Hololive's help.
Not that Hololive JP are talentless by any means, but iirc several of the early members' first success came with Hololive.

>>49456719
weser hate men

>>49457319
bretty much this
sometimes i wonder if they're numb to receiving positive reinforcement from hundreds of thousands of people

>>49456719

>>49456719
Because the west has no standards and will continue sticking around no matter what they do.

Say what you want about the Japanese, but if you piss them off they will drop you like a hot potato.

It's not western vtubers' fault, its the fact they're being enabled and even being encouraged to be shitty people.

>>49464006
Not really, its used by streamers who are threatened by anime girls cutting into their profits. Fans being close (sometimes romantic feelings) to an entertainer is at least old as early rock musicians and bands.

>>49464006
The only new thing around here is you

>>49496587
True, western fans have this mindset that they owe the content creators their full adoration and criticism is hate and bad and walking away from a creator is some sort of pathetic bitch move.
You're expected to just stay by their side and convince yourself you have no issues with anything they do.
And it works, most people go along with it. It's like the monkeys and the stair experiment, vtuber fans will tear each other apart if anyone stops supporting a vtuber.

>>49482751

She fucked a dude during the Pizza stream and is a con-whore but /vt/ would have you believe she's the gold example when it's just spray paint

>>49501424
Nobody is perfect, but at least she cares about her image and position.

>>49501663

I've seen better cope with leftists and liberals but sure, some people love drinking piss too I guess

>>49457612
they exist, but they are the kind that dont point that out.

how much mental fortitude do you need to have to handle parasocialism since it happens to both sides? streamers cant live without their viewers, a lot of viewers will crumple without their streamer. imagine having to handle that responsibility for both sake's years on end.

>>49456719
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eFbSqRFgSE

A friend is able to accept both the good and bad of another. No one is perfect.
To get mad at them for being honest is not really looking for a friend.

>>49456774
Fpbp

>>49501424

>>49513590
Your just Janny baiting now but watch the stream, I'll even give you the time stamp

headphones on

1:00:44

>>49514978
Just stop
This rrat will never catch on

>>49514978
>doxschizo
>horribly ESL
>probably sweating their brown ass off too as they post this
every time

>>49457612
Not any big ones

>>49456719
uhhhhhh parasocials bad
the wigger said so she knows best right?

Western women are told from birth that GIRL POWER GIRL BOSS CENTURY OF GIRLS GIRLS RULE BOYS DROOL etc. while men are told to be simps, Japanese women are told "you are literally not shit, if you can't work and can't find a husband you are fucking worthless, never forget that" and the men are also told to be wageslaves.

People severely don't understand how constant conditioning for something will make people internalize that thing. This was deliberately done to 'increase female participation' but the end result is women crying about 'being done with men' and 'society doesn't value women over 25' and retarded shit like that, because after college men usually stop putting up with western women.

This filters over to the vtuber world. Japanese women like migo worked a SHIT job before. She is extremely grateful to be liked for being a girl with a weird voice and not having to do that shit job anymore. Amelia is a fucking goblin loser who got propelled into fame by a singularity, something literally that was not any of her doing but because Miko and the other JPs had made hololive 'a thing' and covid pushed them all uphill. Amelia and the holoen girls response, generally, was instead 'society is finally recognizing me for the greatness I am, now if only these LOSERS would piss off'. It's just a different mentality here, they feel not grateful for being financially secure being an instant e-celeb on someone else's efforts, but that this was what they were always owed based on the "you are the bestest" propaganda they were brainwashed with since they were small children, and the fat they were not great successes before this vindicates them that they were always great and it was a glitch in the system (or maybe 'patriarchy') that was keeping them down.

They don't have the ability to be grateful or introspect. They are literally beneath cats and dogs, who are infinitely grateful to owners who give them free food (the best thing in the world) and understand instinctively the generousness at hand.

>>49457319
Based.
>can get money
>BUT
>this would have negative consequences
>"what if I got the money and ignored the consequences"

>>49456719
they are out there but you could probably count them on 1 hand

>>49487707
People like Amouranth and other twitch thots exist anon.
Hana Macchia was unironically right about the EN VTubing side.

>>49501394
And then these same people go around and call Japan as "collectivist" while saying they themselves are individualists kek.
The sheer delusion of western internet users is something to behold.

>>49516730
if they hired cashiers from walmart for holoEN they probably would've done a better job overall. Hiring a twitch streamer and expecting her to change and start behaving like a JP member will never work.

>>49516730
HOLY BASED

>>49456719
>WAH WAH WAH MUH CGDCT
kys

>>49458588
>>>49458427
>the only people who benefit from it are the men at the top.
Precisely.

>Pekora OP
>Pekora schizo out of the woodworks
>suddenly Suisei anti posting
I think the people who hate Pekora hate Suisei too.

>>49456719
too hard

>>49519337
Pekochizo is a 53piss in case you hadn't noticed yet.
Type Spectrum90 or BlannisArt in warosu/Alice

>>49517089
The tweet keeps aging better day by day.
Half the shit EN has said, they would never get away with as a fleshtuber. (Well, back in my day they wouldn't. Not sure about today)
Imagine if Ina said what she said as herself and not with an anime avatar?

I think Kiara is the only EN who's exhibited this specific behavior in EN

>>49516438
Are you talking about Mori?
When did she say that?

>>49488553
jannies just ban you if you offend them, I got banned for calling someone a retard once

>>49486681
That's me, they only warned me for that. They have been pretty tame lately honestly, when they used to camp /#/ you could get a three day ban for merely trying to criticize the green whore.

>>49486681
Every time I just post about the fact Fauna has a boyfriend named Eddie I just reset my router pre-emptively and am back shitposting within 30 seconds. Jannies are cucks and always will be.

>>49516730
2% nijinigger

>>49522825
He's completely right, don't deflect Nijicuck

>>49522825
He didn't even mention Fauna and you're still talking about the 2% thing.
Speaks volumes.

>>49487541
we get to watch live failures right now in holo EN
and their soon to be total failures

>>49521960
Isn't there also a sapling janny shitposter ?

>>49458877
Pekora is not a normal woman, she perceives her audience as more than free money

>>49494478
good, why did they join hololive then?

>>49524289
easy money

>>49519337
Pretty sure the guy hating Peko, Miko and Suisei are the same person.

>>49457319
Based take. This is why (serious) idol agencies are so important to the industry. You can't expect every online entertainer to be some Jack of all Trades philosopher-entrepreneur, they need guidance, moderation & supportive staff. And perhaps even culling at times.

>>49516730
Hololive was not their first job, they worked shit jobs before joining. Later HoloJPs also got instant success from the brand name.
It was not Miko's doing either, it was a stroke of luck and the Youtube algorithm favoring them, which domino'd into all Holos getting more viewers. It's ironic that you've fallen into the same trap of attributing success entirely to ability in a post where you're trying to decry that.
You've missed the mark completely. The whole problem is that hard work does not lead to success and the girls who recognize that become unmotivated, although they are wrong in the sense that hard work is necessary to maintain success. Blame rests with Cover for not keeping minimal streaming requirements and booting out anyone who can't keep up.

>>49457140
Yeah, someone like Kiara or Bae always talk about their friends and they tell when you they got on trips with them even. Never really seen anything like that from Peko, just constant streams. Her last "yab" was her mother showing up on stream.

>>49457319
>the west likes having the rewards without doing the work
>it doesn't help the fact that there will be some who support this behaviour and they can just ignore the rest
it's time to get a new oshi bros

>>49520715
t. schizosagi

>>49526537
>The whole problem is that hard work does not lead to success and the girls who recognize that become unmotivated,
That's sadly true, so much of a vtuber's success can be attributed to the fact that they debuted during the peak of the pandemic and just so happened to be favored by the whims of the youtube algorithm. Even the early Holo girls that were flopping hard before the pandemic ended up later getting a larger boost that nobody debuting now and in the future will ever get.

>>49516730
I think there's also a cultural difference in play.
Eastern cultures have a lot of importance given to "gratitude" for things, like filial piety, giving thanks after even getting the smallest amount of help, thanking people servicing you, thanking people just doing their job.
It might start to feel mundane, but that shit helps a lot to make you feel that you're part of this greater whole, rather than just some superstar held back by whatever boogeyman you thought of that day.
Westerners don't seem to have that mindset of thankfulness, hell even the day they made for it (thanksgiving) has now been fraught with controversy over some historical shit their ancestors supposedly did.
Most of them just can't say a simple "thanks" for anything in their lives, which explains why they treat the fans the way that they do.

Reminder
https://youtu.be/h_6J9InVLPU

>>49529654
>Trying to compare Pekora from AliExpress to the actual Pekora
Kys

>>49528086
Holo should go back to hiring 2views that don't know how to stream (Korone, Subaru etc.) and just have genuine passion for the hobby.
EN Subaru would be an ultra hit...

>>49528086
>The whole problem is that hard work does not lead to success and the girls who recognize that become unmotivated
That isn't true. Hard work does lead to success but it doesn't necessarily lead to the greatest success. In fact, minor success actually motivates people to keep working hard because they know they could easily fail if they start slacking off. The real problem is when a chuuba succeeds so much that she feels like she can just sit back and coast on the momentum. That's what truly kills motivation.

>>49456774
true, ill never understand mudhutters

>>49529654
buy an ad

>>49529654
>Pipkin Pippa ta—
Discarded opinion.

>>49529654
> listening to walmart Pekora

>>49522825
I was talking about amelia not fauna.

>>49526537
>covid pushed them all uphill
You kneejerked to defend your westoid and ignored the post.
>you missed the mark
No.
>does not lead to success
They are already successful which is why they are ungrateful, for most of the past 3 years they were just given money to exist and never had to do anything for it.

>>49526537
>The whole problem is that hard work does not lead to success and the girls who recognize that become unmotivated
The motivation should be to not be an ungrateful leech to your fans and your coworkers, because what for example nazigumi does is exactly that. They let the other holos overwork themselves to death, which allows hololive to stay relevant so they can later ask Cover for a juicy shill stream or having high selling merch because of the brand their coworkers are keeping alive.
Holos are a team where they are allowed to slack of indefinitely yet only like 4 members do that. The company is being run like a charity and it's amazing such environment where most are women doesn't implode.

>>49534691
>for most of the past 3 years they were just given money to exist and never had to do anything for it.
They really are no different from E-girls if you think about it
It's just the same thing with extra steps at this point. It's the same case with some in JP though. (pic unrel)

>>49473841
Vietnam, Iraq, etc are the reason the US is like this. The world police idea taking hold was one of the worst things that ever happened to this country and the retards who brewed it up back then are the reason any sort of patriotic spirit is dead now after it resulted in so much crushing failure. The 30s-60s generations were a bunch of retards whos opinions shouldn't even be considered as equal to anyone today

>>49524289
They want to be idols.

>>49531039
that's Mori
knew shit all about streaming but became one of the more regular streamers, buckbroken into liking cute girls, passionate for boomer games, does the second-third most idol reps in the entire branch and despite all of that she's still pretty normie-adjacent, constantly memed on and a ton of people hate her voice/way of speaking

>>49463959

>>49463959
This but unironically.

>>49514978
Is this really all you got? "Streamer left for 2 minutes to cut a pizza", and your instant thought is that she is fucking a noiseless dude on stream.

>>49456719
In the West, men deserve to be ripped from their fantasy escapism and be miserable 24/7

>>49517089
Do you honestly believe that people who watch them aren't being entertained? They just have no standards.

>>49535451
Wannabe idols?

>>49516730
>>49528975
Indeed, not only this but about the “thanksgiving” thing, if someone needs to dedicate an extensive amount of time and energy to say they are something
>oh guys I’m so thankful/humble/a happy family member
It’s likely a sign they aren’t as they say, in an eastern country that promotes hard work/being a good/ high value person extensively, it doesn’t have to be said, like an unspoken yet highly important and common rule, and doing the opposite (the exception, not the rule) is often frowned upon for doing as such, unlike in (modern) western countries where they keep on again and again have to keep on reminding people
>Hey! Don’t get too attached to that idol/seemingly happy/successful person! They may not be all as they are seem so just be happy and unresentful!!
>Don’t forget how women are always oppressed, but really really cool, no matter what I do, unlike men (yucky! Bad!)
>….unless they conform… that’s a High Value Man right there! He’ll get on his knees and beg you to girlboss for him!!
>Don’t listen to that silly outdated traditional values or human nature or any of that hilariously wrong nonsense that only bigoted Karen conservatives say!!
>This thing of modern men conforming and submitting is really REALLY taboo!! And weird and fighting the patriarchy, in a good way!!
>would YOU fault our sacred cows for shitting on your carpet and eating your/her young? What a BIGOT?!?!
>Don’t listen to anyone telling you to be better! They may speak kindly but they won’t be kind to you! Tell me anything you want to know!
>I’m here for you….
>Always here for you….
>Unlike them…..
Meanwhile in japland it’s all sunshine and rainbows, it’s all uber based tradgirls flooding the street wanting bwc and all virgins with no issues or worker nets nor whores, and if you deny this, your an anti based twitter fagoo who still trusts in false idols and such
>submit to the bugs or be swarmed by the devil known as humanity, for thou shall not obey the false ones, the ones not approved by us, if your knees aren’t touching the ground and your tongue isn’t speaking gospel, then it may as well be cut from your mouth and mind, if you aren’t willing to give yourself, your family, your life and “loves” to us, then you may as well be cursed from the beginning….

>>49536868
I'm sorry, I didn't read the EN part. In EN they just wanted the money, except for Kiara, who was already trying to be an idol before even joining Hololive.

>>49457319
This, western women are incredibly entitled

>>49457612
Western culture and especially twitch culture copy pastes a lot of awful values and tropes onto female creators.
>wholesome vtuber who makes her chat feel validated?
2view purgatory.
>literal eslut that openly talks about cuckolding her fanbase, ridicules her fans and constantly creating annoying drama on twitter
4view indie darling

The sad part is that a lot of the wholesome 2views get convinced that they have to emulate these other girls, so they all end up talking the same, making the same content until you can't even recognize who they were

>>49457449
That would require people on this board to actually learn a skill, which is impossible.

>>49457449
HoloJP will never be topped because of this
>>49539220
You don't need to speak nihongo for a lot of these girls, if you superchat nene she will literally go out of her way to respond to you in english and thank you

>>49539220
>projecting

>>49539220
skill issue

>>49482699
Basically what op pic said, that without her chat, she nothing she's nothing and would rather ad hero than suddenly drop back to where she was when she started

>>49539220
If people bitch about western women being lazy degenerate slut whores and then don't learn Japanese then they deserve to be relegated to vtubers like Kronii and Gura.

>>49477768
You have to realize 40 threads over the last week wouldnt have been made if this board believed your statement. Acting like petulant children is much better content.

>>49535913
>a ton of people hate her voice/way of speaking
Only thing that filters me from mori, ive heard that accent too much, and almost always from just garbage people

>>49524412
exactly, only to leech and bring nothing good

>>49463959
it isn't a fantasy if it's codependency
anyway, eternally isolated young men are the building blocks of modern society
at least japan doesn't have school shootings, they actually acknowledge and pander to a massive and inherently unstable demographic

>>49456719
Because this board does not discuss the good non holo EN chuuba outside generals, which you as a retarded Holobrony has no idea they even exist but you must bait.

>>49544014
> good
> non-holo
> EN chuuba
yeah sure, and I'm the king of ingerland

>>49456719
Except love = money

>>49520715
pretty sure he's falseflagging as a 35p

The west finding out about vtubers was a mistake.

>>49549784
He's been in Miko's chats for years and lives in the Miko thread on this board.

>>49551032
oh wow, a genuine schizo then...

>>49457449
>troon, soijak frogposting on /vt/
fuck off tourist faggots

>>49457449
absolutely based

>>49547272
Charles-kun, what are you doing here

>>49457449
Based

>>49516730
I also believe that popular media also have part of this. Disney, for years always telling young girls "You're special, the world revolve around you and you're a princess"
So they grow up feeling like they're the princess and they deserve everything: The castle, the perfect man and also money.
This will led to two different results:
>The girl grow up and reality hit her in the face. Now she's part of the wage slave and she's not special anymore. She either accepting it or she gonna lash out and became a bitter grown up.
or
>She grew up rich, or hitting it big and score big money so she keeps the same attitude from when she still a kid or teenager. Thinking she's a princess and deserve all the adoration and princessy treatment.

Disney helped create a lot of awful individuals.

>>49456864
She is dead, bro, you have to let her go.

So that's why a lot of girls who don't grow up with Disney tend to have more realistic look in life and mature much better.
I'm not saying that my observation is absolute, there's always exception in both cases.

>>49553080
The bonus third option are the ones who still obsess over disney to the extreme degree and still collect everything disney related and still hold onto the dream
Gibara...

>>49553381
I'm actually fine with people collecting Disney merch. It's the same as people who collect merch from specific IP.
What I consider unbearable are annoying adults who incorporate Disney into their personality like a bloody cult. These people believe Disney can't do no wrong and I remember they like to harass the live Disney performers.

>>49543698
They have street stabbers tho
https://theconversation.com/despite-japans-low-crime-rates-its-seen-a-number-of-mass-stabbings-in-the-past-decade-117910

>>49529654
I don't listen to grifters

>>49529654
I just love that people got butthurt over Pippa's opinion lol

>>49555662
yes she's so based speaking about being a virgin with those pl videos of her and her boyfriend, or how she parrots 4chin like a good grifter to get attention :D, that or supporting pieces of shit like depressed nousagi.

>>49456719
Becausd of feminism
As simple as that

>>49456719
Because if you cross that line they will start putting boundaries this is for the fans sake as well as their own. Your oshi wants to be close to you but not too close, they want to be like friends interacting with you but you're not technically friends. If you go too far you will be face with reality so stay as a fan not something delusional

>>49456719
Is the difference between EN and JP really that much with regards to the pandering?

>>49537534
>the only defense for western ungratefulness is to seethe that the japanese are the true whores
Every time.

>>49563182
Nihongo anon here. Yes, it is. JP and EN are like comparing cricket with skydiving.
And it’s not only the pandering, EN is an extensive downgrade of everything JP has plus a mix of the bad things that actually pushed people into watching vtubers.
JP girls make you feel part of something and after a while you realize it’s not a joke or irony, they truly mean it. They feel deeply grateful toward their fans and they use their those feelings to motivate themselves and try to make you happy.

>>49503835
Every streamer has parasocial fans. Celebrities, music artists, athletes etc all have them. AFAIK most haven't had mental breakdowns because they have some obsessive fans or constantly talking about it because they see one weird comment in a sea of thousands. This is really just a western woman(vtuber) issue.

>>49456719
spicy

>>49456719
Why is she still an introvert? With that amount of money she can easily change herself to be more sociable.

>>49473841
>The extreme individualism of the West is a relatively recent development.

The east and west have always been individualists.

West spends centuries fighting world wars between rome south and rome north while east spends centuries fighting against mongolia east and mongolia west

>>49456719
watch more vtubers

>>49456774
Pretty much every western vtuber I watch says words to this effect when they hit a major milestone.

>>49576429
Such as?

>>49564201
cute ATM

>>49579910
If you're an ATM in JP then you're an even bigger ATM in EN because they get money for literally just existing. (with an exception of Ayame)

>>49456719
western women are brainwashed whores

>>49580208
an ATM is an ATM no matter where it's from

>>49456719

>>49579910
>>49580298

>>49456819
Consider the following:
Finana