/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

>>36964328
not taking your meds generally, normal people just move on to a different streamer or leave the fandom

>>36964328
Cocky behavior. Both literally and figuretively.

Test

>>36964328
Disappointment.

>>36964373
fpbp

the winning move is to watch people you like, and don't watch the people you don't like

>>36964328
Disrespect

>>36964328
egotism and lack of self awareness leading to a sense of entitlement towards someone who does not even know you

>>36964328
Severe and/or multiple mental illnesses

>>36964683
Which is a good policy, until the streamer you hate is in a gen with girls you like and they cross collab, bringing her fucking cringe shit into their content. I'm just glad Myth has dropped the "we're friends, promise!!"

I don't hate Mori. If you like her, fine. I just want to forget she even exists.

>>36964328
Streamer turns on fans

>>36964869
okay so don't watch the streams with Mori in it, you don't have to watch every stream with your oshi, it's an entirely self inflicted wound

>>36964869
Just don't watch the collab then?

>>36964953
>>36964999
>you don't have to watch every stream with your oshi

Do you idiots even know what oshi means?

>>36965041
yeah and I don't streams that I know I'm not going to like even if my oshi's in it

>>36964953
>>36964999
I have stopped. If she toned it down even a little, I would stomach it, but she doesn't. She can't ever make it easy.

Severe brain damage and autism

>>36964328
Mori has consistently done things that warrant hatred for her. Anyone who supports her has a whale fetish and is actively anti-idol because they lead disgusting and disorderly lives. That's all there is to it.

>>36964373
>normal people

>>36964328
Love? I mean, not sure why people try to overcomplicate things when there's way too many examples everywhere about love going haywire.

>>36964953
That’s one of the reasons I don’t watch HoloEN anymore. Given that OP used Mori in his pic, of course people will mention her specifically. She actually has a lot more people who dislike her than most of the other people who get used as bait. I get the feeling you think that everybody who says bad things about her, even relatively understated things like “I find her annoying and I don’t really want to think about her anymore” are also the antis who spam shit about her? No, lots of us are just quietly annoyed and we sometimes talk about that when it’s brought up.
No, I’m nta

>>36965511
dude I don't mind Mori I just don't watch streams that I know I won't enjoy, it's not a very deep consideration

>>36965275
The whole point is that having love for a stranger you’ve never met irl and only know through their content online is wrong. To some extent morally, but mostly wrong as in incorrect and stupid. And a one-way ticket to falling for the sunk cost fallacy.
Is avoiding parasocial feelings possible? No, not entirely. But it’s possible to be self-aware of it, so that when life inevitably slaps you in the face with a reminder that she’s a stranger, you can pick yourself back up and move on instead of wasting even *more* time becoming an anti.

Remember that time when she blew up and said "if you don't like my Adam Sandler jokes get out of my chat" but people could still hear her talking from ina's/irys' streams...

>>36965604
Fair enough, mea culpa. Ironic that I was trying to make a point about not overextrapolating from a random anon’s comment, only to do the same myself.
That’s just the internet, I guess but especially /vt/

Unmedicated Schizophrenia and a diet of dumpster food

>>36965637
That's the ideal, indeed. But people do develop love for the strangest things, this is not limited to a person behind an avatar only.

So, even this distorted form of love will tend to fall in the same kind of issues as normal love.

If "normal" people in love with an actual physical person can't seem to control themselves and end up falling into a vengenful crusade at some point due to x or y reason, 'weird' people doing the same with their distorted form of love isn't unlikely.

>>36964869
That's why I try to do, but it's gotten hard since I like Tempus and she really wants to be a Tempus member.

>>36964328
Typically being shat on when they did nothing to warrant it. That's why you see Kronii and Ame getting more antis because of their behavior, and why good streamers handle scolding their chat much more carefully than the shit ones.

Impossible to say because nobody knows what exactly causes someone to become an anti, to the point where this person lives rent free in your head forever and you do nothing but hate watch them, hang around in their split to hate post among other things.
I get not liking someone, I dont get the level that schizos take their hatred here, like somehow they think pushing endlessly against someone will cause some change.

>>36964328
They start out by having an extremely unrealistic idealized view of a chuuba.
Then reality sets in and the chuuba is not as great as the schizo thought. The schizos sees this as a massive betrayal. The schizo throws a fit that lasts between 6 months and 10 years.

>>36964328
when their oshi changes, broken promises, etc.

>>36964328
Betrayal

Convincing yourself that everything is okay when it isn't, for too long. Then something happens and you snap, and it all falls apart. Rather than accepting the mistake, it's easier to hate someone else.

>>36964373
normal people dont watch streams. watching streams is already a parasocial behaviour.

>>36967828
ask any long haul trucker or office worker if they listen to podcasts while they work

>>36967828
I don't see that as correct, but a 'normal' person certainly doesn't member, SC or buy merch. You get the content with or without doing it, so why would you? And there's no issue with skipping member streams since you'll do it with normal streams anyway. The market wouldn't be sustainable if every viewer was a normal person.

>>36964328
Define "anti?" Is it someone actively trying to harass, dox, and run someone off, or is it someone giving criticism and no longer being a fan?
Cause, you know, OP's pic's particular fanbase simply can't figure out the difference.

>>36964328
The same thing that draws then in. Affection

Whether or not I can think of a good antipost that will stir the pot and give me a lot of yous

>>36964373
Fpbp

>>36967779
this is honestly what turned me into one, after a few months of letting my anger get to me I finally learned to accept my mistakes. don't think I could ever be seen the same way by my oshi and her friends, but oh well, it is what it is

>>36968671

>>36964328
Disdain. Vtubing is special because the girls are gracious for having their viewers, like how an idol thanks her fans for coming to her lives. It's an unspoken agreement between the two where the fans go above and beyond in return, giving their time, their talents, their wallets and energy in return for honest gratitude.
Girl who spit in the faces of their fans and expect the world without giving a bit in return deserve their antis.

>>36968071
I'm not a podcast listener, but when people talk about podcasts it's usually because they find what the people on them are saying interesting. There's some overlap, but people watch vtubers for the chuuba rather than the content they create.

>>36964328
Damn that's hot

>>36964328
A lot of things can do it. I think only passionate fans can become Antis, since people who go from liking someone to moving on can't be considered anti's. For example that Gabriel guy has become a kronii anti. He's still very passionate but not in a positive way.

Betrayal.
Nothing create an anti more than being scorned, used, discarded, played with.

>>36969701
>For example that Gabriel guy has become a kronii anti. He's still very passionate but not in a positive way.
Can you post exactly what that entails?

>>36970016
he's an obsessed schizo

>>36964328
Failure to think introspectively.

>>36967828
Watching tv also consider parasocial, people who kill themselves because they cant go to pandora planet in avatar also consider parasocial.

>>36964328
Being told to improve yourself if you don't like her content

>>36964373
If you asking on vt, mostly they not normal, and usually they rather hate watch her to find anything they can post later in catalog.

>>36964328
maybe its not the v tuber, maybe its the fan, maybe they dont have good methods to switch their brains off and do somthingelse when met with certain situations, maybe not used to it yet. Maybe younger fans below 22. ( 21 and below is emotional baby, regardless of what they say, this has been consistent in my life).

>>36971982
>maybe
lol

>>36966432
Even shitting on individual chatters is fine if its half-joking. But banning people willy-nilly, or being contemptuous of chat as a whole? Yeah that shit is numbers poison

>>36969701
i dont have the full story, but that guy went too far. He sort of said your doing male collab too much, even tho you said you would not do it too much. He cant dictate what she does, and im sure she was going hard to spite people who were against it.( he was relatively polite about it, so I was hoping he would move on, but alas, seems like he is an anti now) He should have switched, theres others to watch, instead of trying to do the impossible and get fried emotionally over what could have been walked around/ avoided. I dont know what else he did, I dont want to read about those stuff. It didnt look good from the little I saw.

>>36969701
>>36972383
People who feel "betrayed" are most likely to become antis. It happens when their expectations don't match with reality even though all their efforts so far were motivated by passion. In real life too, people who feel betrayed try to do extreme things instead of doing something else.

>>36971982
Maybe it is the vtuber. Sometimes. Maybe.

>>36966565
hate watch? no, anti arent really in streams are they? they just bash from clips or rumors. Maybe they stay in stream a little, if they just turned anti, but they leave right? y are you wasting time watching a chuuba you dont like, theres literally too many good chuuba to watch right now and impossible to support all the ones you find interesting. Just go to one of those.

>>36969701
There's also the orc-schizo and kanekolumi-anti type. Jealous, seething women

>>36968295
>but a 'normal' person certainly doesn't member, SC or buy merch.
"normal people don't support content creators they like" is the weirdest fucking take considering... history of human race
writing, art and music of all kind always grew on the back on people who just randomly supported shit they liked, and most of that were normal fucking people

>>36972383
>that guy went too far
>He sort of said your doing male collab too much, even tho you said you would not do it too much
So he pointed out that she'd contradicted herself? How is that going too far?

>>36972728
Eh, he's half right. Normal people join memberships and maybe buy merch. Normal people do not akasupa

>>36965711
thats why i hate collabs that involves her, good entertainer does not repeat their jokes nonstop
thankfully these days she almost never appears in holoJP and ID collabs so i can pretend she doesn't exist

>>36969701
Gabe is a seanigger from /pol/ who likes attention, Kronies just gave him the most of it because of the way their incestuous general works with all the namefagging. He craves attention from the Kronies more than Kronii, Kronies were the only ones retarded enough to give him the spotlight. He was in other girl's fandoms before too.

>>36972745
because trying to strictly hold people to what they said when it was a flaky sorta-kinda thing is retarded
big part of the shitstorm around Kronii that just had her say fuck it and collab with Tempus whenever was when she said "she doesn't Tweet all that much" and her "fans" took it as "she won't tweet at them ever"
so when she tweeted at the stupid underpants post, they lost their minds, because it was such a "massive contradiction and breach of trust"

>>36972876
No, if you watch what she said on the unarchived members stream before she left on break and then her comments and actions directly afterwards, it's a pretty big fuck you. People claim about her commenting on the boxer tweet is what set it off but really it was her promising something in an intimate setting like a member stream and then coming back and telling everyone to fuck off complete with the official Hololive staff disclaimer.

>>36972792
patrons of arts is also a thing that existed across history and in modern times there's a lot more people with disposable income

>>36966432
The way you scold chat isn't *inherently* a marker of whether you're a good streamer or not. But it sure is highly correlated. I say it's because a good streamer understands their audience and is more likely to empathize with them. Which doesn't mean they're unwilling to excuse their chat or that they won't tardwrangle their chat, it just means they know how to do it effectively.
On the other hand, someone who just had a gigantic fanbase fall into their lap and has no real idea what those people are like at all are more likely to not relate to their behavior and say something stupid. I know Connor gets hate here, but he really went out on a limb by discussing a potential issue with HoloEN when it wasn't totally apparent yet. The man was prescient about this kind of shit being a possibility

>>36964328
I wouldn't describe myself as an anti exactly, but what turned me against mori was her long and consistent pattern of lying to people and not giving a shit about others who she claims are friends. The bnb fiasco was the last straw.
I won't go out of my way to anti her though, I just want her to fuck off to do what she really wants and let hololive begin healing.

>>36972978
she told everyone to fuck off after her trying to talk things out and reach sort of a compromise still didn't sate the dramawhores
so she just started doing whatever and for the most part appears much happier for it

>>36973049
She talked things out, reached a compromise that everyone liked, and then promptly threw that compromise into the trash and said we're done discussing this. No explanation, nothing.

>>36972728
There are shades of gray to this. I'm convinced that a lot of the "normal" people you're referring to are less normal than you think and didn't have the means to let their abnormality fully show. They were probably still more normal than the kinds of schizos we're talking about, but that's because the internet enables that sort of thing and provides more sources of dopamine to encourage schizo behavior.

>>36973101
>reached a compromise that everyone liked
apparently not since when she was acting according to the compromise she actually stated (not the one that was made up in the split), people lost their shit

>>36973101
Which is her right. But it was also so stupid. Morally speaking, she did nothing wrong because she doesn't owe anything to a bunch of strangers. Practically speaking, shit like that *reminds* her fans that they're actually strangers. You really don't want to remind them of that if you can avoid it.
The side of me with a conscience knows she's menhera and probably didn't fully realize the implications of what she was doing. The rational side of me can't stop thinking about how someone like Fauna wouldn't have handled it that poorly.

>>36973031
>gigantic fanbase fall into their lap and has no real idea what those people are like at all
I always saw this as a big issue when HoloEN came out.
For JP, Hololive is treated like a union with a lot of shared audience and similar culture. However, for EN the audience is infinitely more diverse with a lot of cultures in the same place. There was no way for HoloEN to act like a union when the audience is not even similar to each other or the streamer. Of course, I don't know about the situation in Twitch, but this is my observation for Youtube.
Inevitably, there will be problems between chat and streamer because of this.

>>36972606
I know that anon but theres people that dont do that, theyll hate watch someone just so they can be there whenever they fuck or say something stupid first.

>>36973424
She spent the past year confiding and talking to her members and telling them they weren't strangers.

>>36972991
To be fair back then it was often as big a political move as anything else. What we do with Vtubers is more like dropping some change in a street performers case just with more pleasant people

>>36973424
I still wonder what actually made her change her mind.
We might never truly know.
She was clearly aware that it would cost her fans, cost her their trust, make them suffer and have negative consequences on her numbers and income.
Her initial choice made a lot of sense, it seemed like it was the result of actually giving it a lot of thought and reaching an understanding with her audience.
And then she just suddenly changes her mind and has the hololive english account make a big deal out of it.
Why?
Did she want to be part of the male collabs that badly? Was it some sort of menhera mood swing? Did someone else talk her into it?

>>36964373
fpbp

>>36974194
I know the board likes to blame the pink wigger for everything but Mori unironically went to visit Kronii IRL immediately following so that makes me think they get along pretty well.
>She was clearly aware that it would cost her fans, cost her their trust, make them suffer and have negative consequences on her numbers and income.
Was she though? Was she really? She asked a bunch of people watching a gook pretend to be an anime girl if they had female friends. The same people who paid money to watch her play indie games badly, sing badly, and buy dakimakuras and oppai mousepads of her.

>>36964328
I learned that she has some polish in her. That's enough to anti her.

>>36974374
Well she knew many of her fans were against it that's why she originally said she wouldn't be doing them.
So the moment she changed her mind she must have known that it would cause their fans to trust her less in the future and hurt them, and it should be pretty obvious that it would lead to less support from them.

>>36972978
I love it how you people claim she told everyone to fuck off when she said no such thing. She said what she was going to do from there on out. There was no fuck off, but idiots sure seem to have this habit of saying she said shit she didn't actually say.

>>36973101
As someone who didn't actually want male collabs, that compromise actually sucked since we would not have gotten her POV. I sure as hell was not happy with it.

>>36964328
Mental illness
>>36964373
Is right

>>36974551
Sure, anon. Sure.

>>36974551
Anon. that's fuck off.

>>36974677
If you have the statement where she told us to fuck off I am sure you can easily prove me wrong. You won't though, because you don't.

>>36974194
My rrat is that it, like most problems that happen with fandoms, arose from misunderstandings and miscommunications. This kind of thing also happens in real life social interaction, but the difference there is that if there's two people who had a misunderstanding, they can often work it out by talking it over.
In this case, it's a group of people and a streamer, neither of whom actually know each other. The chat's message is muddled, and the streamer's interpretation is inaccurate. The loud ones get their message through clearly (don't collab with males reeeeeee), and it's repulsive to most normal people's sensibilities. The REAL message (you don't stream that much and I don't like male collabs, so skipping streams would really suck) is much harder to get through, at least in part because some unicorns say this sort of thing to hide the fact they're unicorns and make the people who actually have this opinion look bad.
So Kronii starts getting bitter towards these fans, misinterpreting what many of them are really thinking, and thinks that anyone who doesn't like male collabs must be a unicorn, no in-between. And thus, this shitshow happens.
The fact that Kronii's menhera probably doesn't help. Someone like Fauna or Gura or Pippa is fairly good at making a connection with their audience without being too personal about it, Kronii isn't. As soon as she collabed with the males, the fact that she was much closer to them then she ever was to chat became really obvious. That's my non-unicorn interpretation as to why it especially irked so many of her viewers.
People who become vtubers are often menhera in some way. I think some of those menhera people find a way to get better through vtubing and some people's menhera just gets enabled by it, and Kronii's is the latter.

>>36973827
I actually think she wasn't lying. She just didn't realize the extent to which her chat *was* strangers. There are so many cognitive biases that we've evolved with as humans that there's a reason the Oracles of Delphi had "Know thyself" as a motto--it's because by default, people don't know themselves.
Another point to my theory that this was a confluence of a bunch of problems that mashed together to turn into a giant shitshow.

>>36964328
/vt/

>>36964328
Shitting on the fanbase
Not listening to the fanbase
Providing no other options

Low testosterone levels

>>36973442
That makes a lot of sense. HoloEN did have a unifying factor when Myth debuted--it was that they were the only EN vtubers. Obviously, they *weren't*, actually, but before them, it was all 2view indies, and that felt cringe. These were "real" vtubers by dint of having a JP corpo backing them up. It gave them legitimacy.
I have a theory that if Kiara or Gura had been the ones to go on Trash Taste instead of Mori that they could have broken down the walled garden. NijiEN has done a little better at maintaining unity, but the entire agency (including in Japan) is based around catering to normies, so doing that wouldn't work.
Ironically, I think being so early and keeping up the walled garden for so long is what screwed them over for so long. Interacting outside the corpo (with collab partners who aren't polarizing and not spamming them nonstop) might have reinforced the brand. Oh, and everyone actually doing their reps and not collabing less and less with JP.
I realize this is a wall of text, but I really do think it was a bunch of little things that helped them become complacent.

>>36967828
Because you should totally worship sportsball teams and HBOmax tv stars instead; that’s what normal people do instead of something sick and twisted like a cute girl/guy anime avatar on Twitch or YouTube.

>>36975714
I wish the walled garden was still up. When I watch Hololive I only want to watch Hololive, I don't want other corpos or indies or internet personalities involved.
And I don't want to see the Hololive members with others either.
We had it so good before.

>>36975918
I'm pretty lukewarm about the thought too, but I think a lot of this is because they don't stream that much, and there's not that many girls to watch (in that they're different enough from each other that a Fauna fan isn't just going to switch to Kiara, or a Gura fan to Bae).
I can imagine an alternate universe where making the wall lower (as in, doing collabs outside the corpo, but not too many of them) would have created more connections, more pressure within the company to debut gens faster, more streams to watch and girls to choose from, and less of an issue if Mori decided to invite Ironmouse onto Chad Cast for whatever ungodly reason.
We're all thinking about these things from the perspective of the current stagnant branch that doesn't have much of a clear direction. With a bit more flexibility and a bit more freedom to do different things (keyword: A BIT) these might not have been such big problems.

https://i.4cdn.org/wsg/1668210389566820.webm

This.

>>36964328
autism, you should never have strong feelings towards people.

>>36974744
Anon is so dense light bends around him.

>>36976710
That's not enough you also need to post the tweets by the hololive english manager account.
By the way that account blocked me after I told replied that male female interactions are not traditionally what Hololive has ever been about and Nijisanji already exists for the demographic that wants it.
The whole saga was done politely but with a very much fuck you attitude.

>>36976710
inb4
>"But she never explicitly tells anyone to fuck off"

>>36972383
>He cant dictate what she does
Why not? Good vtubers listen to their audience. You're utterly delusional if you think that most chuubas don't have a behind the scene discord group telling them what to do. Most of the girls who come into these scene have already been "groomed."

>>36976644
>Do not have a preference in your entertainment, just consoom streamer and get excited for next corpo stream

>>36976980
>politely

>>36964328
Why Mori Calliope is the worst hololive member

>talks about alcohol nonstop to the point where it's one of the only things she sounds genuinely interested in
>applied to hololive as a joke, knowing nothing about vtubers or streaming and only because her friend Milkyqueen was applying too and showed her it, taking her spot in the process
https://youtu.be/tIU0xG-lXkQ?t=2397
>used to heavily bait for superchats in her early days, interrupting collabs to thank red scs "BIG UPS AKASUPA"
>says hololive only takes up 5% of her actual time
https://youtu.be/lBkuqt-xigY
>continuously trying to change hololive by attempting collabs with and mentioning anime youtubers and random men
>always late to collabs and never sets up properly
>according to kiara has overslept multiple collabs, causing them to be cancelled or rescheduled
>barely talked during 2 hour clubhouse 51 collab with Kiara, to the point where Kiara had to use the weather deck to get her to talk at all
>made nothing but grunts and 1-3 word replies during shadowverse collab with kiara
>straight up said "no" when kiara asked if she had seen her new MV
https://youtu.be/nvZcIGnCSrs?t=12222
>lied to kiaras face about loving her king cover (which was a rickroll joke) saying she "listened to it all the time"
https://streamable.com/t2985s
>didn't properly setup for lethal league with ina, played and talked with fans while ina sat and watched
>acted like a bitch once the punishments game for puyo puyo tetris came up, refused to do any of them
>spoils outfits on twitter for first smol collab, does nothing for the jeopardy rounds and slams her keyboard for it
>blabs about alcohol before even introducing herself during a collab with Reine, an Indonesian who isn't allowed to drink
https://youtu.be/VX1hxP-Tmiw?t=342
https://youtu.be/VX1hxP-Tmiw?t=394
>possibly corrupting irys as she mentioned they've met a few times to drink tea
>makes myth wait almost half an hour in the ender dragon fight collab because she got lost looking for wood because she didn't prepare, then makes them lose diamond armor because she jumped into the void in the end
https://youtu.be/BwL9-tqLF3I?t=4641
>didn't call in for Ame's first birthday, called in at the very last minute for her second birthday sounding drunk with a shitty rap
https://youtu.be/tMwKQniur0k
>constantly talks to her collab partners like they're mentally challenged children
>simps over Rikka on and off stream nonstop, they collab on Super Bunny Man and Mori can barely hold a convo in Japanese, forcing Rikka to use his terrible English
>completely ruins highly anticipated first EN meme review with Coco by being nothing but her "dorky rapper" character instead of making any good conversation or jokes, to the point where Coco asks "are you okay? you're acting like a crackhead" and "is she always like this?" to 75k viewers
https://youtu.be/YTTnA4MQkg0?t=2435
https://youtu.be/YTTnA4MQkg0?t=1121
>woke gura up early on a day she planned to stream, wastes everyones time because she only then learned the game they were gonna play is local only, makes them switch to ANOTHER local only game, didn't install the final proper game between the time elapsed switching previous games, then makes sleepy Gura wait another half hour only for their gameplay to be fucked by seconds long delay, then finally settling on Phasmophobia, disables comments afterwards
https://youtu.be/sbo8zS8otzQ
>caused 6 month anniversary Don't Starve myth collab to be delayed by 30 mins
https://twitter.com/ninomaeinanis/status/1370508896150818817
>fell asleep on stream during very first myth Minecraft collab
https://youtu.be/NS3_sNTwIRw?t=10427
>told Gura during a collab that someone said her "booty stank" while working at a restaurant
https://youtu.be/WhM27pQZ_2E

>>36977983
yeah, I'm thinking based

>>36964328
The Trash Taste drama gets its own section, as it is the longest running problem with Mori and the sole reason this post exists

>Mori collabs with Trash Taste
https://youtu.be/tIU0xG-lXkQ (We Met a REAL Virtual YouTuber (ft. Mori Calliope) | Trash Taste #23) [126:25]
https://youtu.be/h5QspNrKphM (The Vtuber Rap God Returns (ft. Mori Calliope) | Trash Taste #74) [136:01]
>guy from TT, Connor, says on Ironmouse's stream that people in hololive are popular not because of their talent but because of the brand
https://files.catbox.moe/91mnvk.MP4
>time passes, Mori mentions TT a significant amount the last few months
>a longtime member in Moris member stream says she shouldn't associate with them
https://files.catbox.moe/lfcm82.png
>Mori insults her members and lies that Connor personally apologised to every holoEN member
https://files.catbox.moe/75cb93.mp4
>"we speak to each other quite a bit, um, as friends", laughing nervously after
>someone asks Kiara about this, Kiara says she isn't in contact with anyone from Trash Taste
https://streamable.com/5a8uq2 (mori lies) [0:35]
>Mori then donates 50 subs to Connor on her new Twitch account
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ce-cR-f8TlM (Calli Surprised Connor When She Gifted Him 50 Subs) [0:36]
>someone superchats "condom money for Connor"
https://www.hololyzer.net/youtube/archive/superchat/iJvbxzGh_a4.html
>Mori announces that she won't read superchats anymore without management reading them first
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxTissHo0AM (Calli won't be Reading These Superchats Anymore 【Mori Calliope / HololiveEN】) [1:44]
>keeps talking about the drama on stream
>Mori announces that she will be streaming on twitch semi-regularly from now on
>deadbeats in her comment section are upset about all of this
>everyone moves on
>days later she suddenly replies to and compliments a 6 day old Twitter post from a dedicated anti account of an MSpaint edit of her getting fucked by Connor, while her fans watch crying, insinuating her fans are cucks
https://web.archive.org/web/20220123054143/https://twitter.com/moricalliope/status/1485121754624593924
>Redditors notice this and post it to the hololive subreddit
>she replies to the reddit thread "can I PLEASE just have some fun. Please."
https://www.reddit.com/r/Hololive/comments/sam9io/uhh_calli/htukq15/
https://files.catbox.moe/lxuexz.png
>she gets downvoted and they shame her for her actions
>someone asks why she did it, she admits she's drunk
https://files.catbox.moe/z2z0mm.jpeg
>deletes everything, apologises on twitter, announces break but then says she's high on lean on her corporate, public twitter account, and then tries to damage control by saying she didn't know what it meant
https://web.archive.org/web/20220124193835/https://twitter.com/moricalliope/status/1485136066008944640
>later, begins collabing with holo members again but it's painfully clear she isn't interested and is faking her enthusiasm, the entire terraria stream is an example
https://youtu.be/8ZiNmfUCEt4 (【TERRARIA】Adventuring With My Friends in a New World?!) [167:29]
>goes out of her way to put "with my FRIENDS" on her Terraria collab, and again "ft FRIENDS" in the title of Surgeon Simulator collab, when she's never done so
https://files.catbox.moe/minblk.jpeg
https://files.catbox.moe/u1ufzu.jpeg
>still won't stop mentioning TT
https://youtu.be/Zm_Q5yLdgas (Did Calli just Reference Trash Taste in her Podcast?) [0:37]

In conclusion, Calliope Mori is a terrible influence on hololive and should graduate immediately. She has proven time and time again that she does not care about her position as a vtuber.

>>36977971
I mean, they're not telling you to fuck off. They're just saying they don't care what you have to say and will do their own thing anyway.

>>36964328
https://streamable.com/zx0e7k

>>36976980
>done politely
twist it a little bit more

>>36978233
Thus removing the one thing hololive had over other streamers.
The unspoken conceit at work was 'they don't have to listen to you, but they do anyway.' Then it's reciprocated. Fans don't have to make fan art, but they do anyway. They don't have to buy merch or member, but they do anyway. As long as none of it was tested, everything puttered on fine.
Once you drop that everything goes back to being transactional, and with the permission issues, lack of gaming skill, lack of stream hours, they come out very lacking in value.

>>36978233
>they're not telling no to fuck off.
>They're just saying they don't care what you have to say and will do their own thing anyway.

.

>>36978651
Indeed, actions have consequences.

>>36976980
Omegatroon thinks he is a vtuber, and larps as Rimuru Tempiss, hence the name.
https://streamable.com/lpvbje

>>36978055
Based. Thanks for the summary. Some of those instances are explainable/forgivable but she is a crash course in how to NOT handle online drama. Additionally collabing with non-holos is a big nono. You're in fucking Hololive. At least somewhat act like it.

>>36964328
Connor

>>36979083
>uWu, maybe I’m a girl tee hee

>>36979083
>the moment nobody asked for.
Omegatroon rises from a puddle of Tempiss

>>36979086
>Additionally collabing with non-holos is a big nono.
Over the last few weeks, I’ve become increasingly convinced that this is only the case because it was Mori who did it first (in EN). Expanding outside the corpo is good. The problem is that most of the ones who want to do that have bad reasons (mostly, Mori trying to dissociate herself from the anime avatar that is the sole reason for her success). I think anons literally do not understand that it is ok for Kiara to collab outside the corpo but not Mori, because it’s a well-known fact that Kiara cares about being an idol and about Hololive, while that’s far from certain for Mori (to put it lightly).

>>36976980
I feel for you, anon. The issue is that plenty of schizos and unicorns say this kind of shit to hide the fact that they’re anathema to polite society (like, legitimately, the only reason normalfags don’t want unicorns to kill themselves is that they think unicorns can be saved—ie stop becoming unicorns), so many people legitimately think anons like you with the balls to say this in public are secretly unicorns trying to shit things up.

>>36979802
I feel sorry for you seeing you try so hard to bait with unicorn this and unicorn that but getting 0 replies. Everyone knows you don't know what you're talking about and won't bother engaging with you.

>>36979083
wasted design on a troon.. ffs, also how do you think teammates are doing after knowing that?

>>36979846
You seriously think the idea that people here larp as somewhat respectable people in public in order to shit it up elsewhere and not break containment is that weird? Did we forget about Gabe, the kronie schizo who basically larped as a voice of reason before showing his true colors a few weeks later?

>>36980029
So in my case never a Ame fan, i would sometimes see streams but i don't like male vtubers or their collabs so i dropped her and that's it, how is it wrong to abandon content i don't like anymore?, i don't harass them i simply ignore and blacklist.

What the fuck?

>>36980110
I believe you. In a roundabout way (too roundabout, perhaps), I was trying to say normalfags have a distorted view of unicorns because of the ones who are schizo and make everyone look bad. As someone who isn’t a unicorn but basically doesn’t trust most western vtubers to do male collabs without spamming them incessantly, we both deal with the same issue of “I’ve got to keep my mouth shut or else they’re gonna think I’m a schizo.”
I usually make sure to use “schizo” most of the time when I’m on /here/, that was a slip-up.

>>36980281
i tend to follow small vtubers because i love to interact with them, it's cute when a slightly flirty message gets a like <3,.

>>36980382
Small vtubers are the best, specially the ones that are autistic enough to keep lists of viewers and actually remember you.

>>36980469
also their fans seem to be very welcoming i don't see almost anyone condemning those interactions, from time to time twitter normies get the spooked when they notice them but meh who cares.

>>36964373
fippy bippy

so why does twitter keeps pushing with male vtuber recommendations even when i discouraged them like 100 times already?

>>36980976
You know why.

>>36980976
you follow furries.

>>36980993
no clue desu... maybe i'm retarded, maybe i need to tweet that i don't like them 100 times for the algorithm to learn it?

>>36980469
any good recommendations?

>>36981078
Nope, the only non human thing i follow is a Mecha/robot artist, that's it.

>>36981085
They'll push what they want you to see and don't care what you actually want to see.

>>36981088
Just open the catalog and check all the small corpo threads. Or the indies threads.
The appeal of small vtubers is being able to find one that really clicks with you, there's a ton of them so you have many options.

>>36981147
i already blacklisted like every famous niji, holo and other male hashtag, even their different kind of hashtags (yaoishit), but still it seems it's not enough

>>36964328
From love to have there's only one step. It works the same way as irl. Disappointment and betrayal.

>>36981263
to hate*

>>36981263
So did one Chuuba made you feel that in your case?

>>36977543
>listen to your audience is the only way to be good in entertainment
Big misconception and retard take. The good entertainers understand their appeal and capitalize on it or shift with finesse into something they want to do more. You can "ignore" your audience and still keep them if you're not stupid.

>>36964328
Delusions, just read the thread

>>36981483
Not yet. I'm struggling with the rrats in my head. Since I can't know for sure if those are true, this struggle depresses me and takes away from the fun of watching her streams. But if my suspicions turn out to be true, I will be extremely disappointed in her because I trusted her. Even so, I won't want to hurt her, but I will want to try to save other anons from the delusions I've fallen into.

Anti-fan is a newspeak term and irrelevant in any intellectual conversation.
You eaither like someone, or you don't, but that has no bearing on what it is your're saying being true or not.
Mori is not a good hololive member. She was once accepted for her flaws, because she admitted to not being wholly sincere in the beginning, And said she'd try to incorporate into the culture...but has since performed, and performed actions, that draw doubt on not being in tune with the corporate culture in which she operates.
I'm not obligated to forgive her, just like anyone, and I just watch any other holo ober her. Its not hard.

>>36964328
Lies

>>36964373
Honestly, yeah.
There is zero (0) reason to dox, harrass, or seethe over an online entertainer. Not because of any issue with doxxing and harrassing, but just because you're better than that, king.
You have better ways to use your time. These hoes will always be trifling, but we got better shit to do than cry over a bitch who doesn't even know you.

>>36981564
>The good entertainers understand their appeal and capitalize on it or shift with finesse into something they want to do more
What you're talking about either happens slowly (the girl who grew up listening to Taylor Swift sing country now twerk to her singing about taking bad boy dick) or doesn't happen at all, they find new audiences instead. Sometimes that audience is bigger, others successful artists crash and burn doing what they love. Compare John Lennon with George and that Indian shit.

And on that note, this is using examples of people with actual talents, not girls who play video games and pretend to be your girlfriend for a living. They are much more dependent on the goodwill of their audience because they rarely have the talent to stand on their own two feet.

>>36964373
Maybe, but I think it does them a favor to throw a tantrum before you go, so they don't end up blaming the wrong thing for their dropping viewership.

>>36983840
>They will take me seriously if I act like a child.
I don't think that strategy will be successful.

>>36983875
That's their loss. In their position, it's better to see viewers' strong feelings.

>>36964328
Unironically self loathing from actually believing the chuuba gave a shit about you as a person or even a fan when in reality she'd prefer it if you just threw money at her without comment or wanting any attention.

>>36981964
Who is your oshi anon?

>>36964328
The line between love and hatred is a lot thinner than most people think.

>>36978055
>guy from TT, Connor, says on Ironmouse's stream that people in hololive are popular not because of their talent but because of the brand
The irony is that this is 99% of the reason why TT is so vehemently hated here above any other third party creators, and the statement was completely right. New holo debuts get automatic hundreds of thousands of subs without even streaming and would otherwise be nobodies.

>>36984515
there are lots of true statements that don't have to be said out loud.
when you do, you're not a beacon of knowledge spreading truth for the betterment of mankind, you're just being an asshole

>>36984515
>Mario games are popular not because they're good but because of the brand
this is how retarded you and Connor sound

>>36978301
...is this guy legitimately retarded? People wouldn't be fans of Tom Cruise going into a discussion on scientology in the middle of top gun either

>>36964328
being concerned that even If I were to move on to another oshi, the quality and health of the fandom is at stake, the bubble, about to bust.
gatekeeping in the form of slander or harrasment is a valid move to keep the fanbase clean

>>36984700
>Mario games are popular not because they're good but because of the brand
yes?
low effort cash grab that stopped being innovative in the 90s, but nintendo fanboys will praise it nonetheless, sounds familiar?

>>36985003
sounds like you have a problem anon, get some help.

>>36985106
>ad hominem
how predictable

>>36984700
You're gonna use Mario, the game that has been a zero effort money generator for decades? The franchise that has been milked harder than call of fucking duty? That Mario?

>>36985154
>>36985183
Then make me a Mario game. Go ahead, I'll wait.

>>36985154
Is that what you tell your therapist? If so that's really funny

>>36984515
The problem with what he said was when and how he said it, the dude has negative charisma but a big mouth.

>>36985245
It was an incomplete truth. He disregarded the efforts many holos put in to make the brand successful.

>>36983732
I guess but if
>listening to your audience for growth
is the standard then anon has pretty low standards on what a vtuber or maybe even streamers can achieve as entertainers.

In Mori's case it's usually people who were not fans to begin with being upset that others like her. Or those seeing what's posted here and deciding to join in. Then a few actual old fans who think she's changed (I don't see it and her stubbornness and unchanging repeated mistakes seem like a more justified reason to be annoyed with her)
Even with the dumb things she has done, no harm came to anyone. Despite what rrats some like to push.
Hating Mori/Deadbeats is a meme. Treat it like one and don't take it seriously.

>>36985404
He didn't really? if you follow the conversation he used an example ironmouse can relate to which is vtubers and he could have said niji but didn't since hololive was the "vtuber company" at the time. Rude wording but not disregarding. He's still a retard though.

>>36972745
he went beyond that, he kept hitting the topic, trying to pressure her with multiple messages. I saw like 4 tweets in a post here, theres prob more. If all he did was bring it up once in the commments, then thats all good. But it wasnt so, and apparently, according to some anon he went anti

>>36964328
betrayal

>>36974551
Anon, that's exactly what fuck off means...

>>36987534
but anon if she doesn't put the letters 'f', 'u', 'c', 'k', 'o', 'f', and 'f' together exactly in that order, she isn't technically saying "fuck off"

>>36964328
Seeing your oshi go from someone with dreams and aspirations who worked hard into a lazy whore who sees fans as walking ATMs and has open contempt against anyone who question her behavior.

This board.

>>36987697
Lol
Lmao

>>36987534
With these discussions you have to remember that it's only a minority who was freaking out over the male collabs. You can decide to view any decision that goes against your interest as a "fuck off" if you want, but she was reasonable with how she said it.
>After much consideration, I decided that I will be collaborating with whomever I want. We’re all here to have fun and to make new friends. Thank you for your understanding
When you read that statement, remember that you want her to not collab or interact with her friends

>>36988496
>minority
this again?

Retardation

>>36977983
old copypasta and not even finished better luck next time

>>36988667
Is it wrong? It's disingenuous to say she went against her fans when most of them were unbothered by her actions

>>36988496
>>36988733
A lot of people freaked out. But only a minority did or said anything about it. There is a lot of social pressure to not sound like a schizo, keep in mind.

>>36988733
>them
Who exactly are you referring to?

>>36988872
>A lot of people freaked out. But only a minority did or said anything about it.
You have absolutely no proof then, not even anecdotal, because by your own statement the majority of people who were freaked out never did or said anything, so how can you claim to know all those people freaked out?

>>36988923
Kronii watchers or members

>>36983840
>it does them a favor
this is what schizos actually believe, and this is why they need to take their meds.

>>36988925
never did or said anything
>in public
Have you talked to people? They're not excited about it, but they don't want to cause problems.

>>36989005
What he's trying to defend is immature destructive feedback as if it was mature constructive feedback. Feedback IS valuable to entertainers, absolutely, but that doesn't excuse acting like a spoiled child and throwing a tantrum.

>>36989074
Yeah nah. Those long winded schizo ramblings of a hundred failings are always dishonest and wrong. Just replace it with
>I dislike you because a male existed
and it's exactly the same feedback.

>>36988950
>greynames
They don't matter. Mostly NPC.
>members
1 month member. Only joined to own the incel.

>>36989292
There's also the off attitude of "I'm doing you a FAVOR, you owe me for this" that permeates their approach, instead of just approaching it as feedback which is a completely normal and expected part of the relationship. I know "entitled" is a buzzword and video game journalists have pretty much destroyed it forever, but it really does apply here. God forbid anyone here ever get an IRL girlfriend and treat their IRL relationship this way too. You gotta communicate, and communication is one of those things that's normal and every day, it's not a favor or an exemplary event.

You're watching western women pretending to be anime girls. What the fuck did you expect?

>>36978301
Connor literally went from making fun of vtubers to leeching off Mouse. The dude is a certifiable retard. And with Mori, dude I have no idea how any deadbeats stuck around

>>36964328
As a former fan turned anti it was mostly caused by falling in love with an idealized version of the chuuba and having a hard time accepting that she can't and doesn't want to live up to it.

>>36964373
>My old oshi disappointed me
>Shitposted about her for a bit then moved on to another vtuber
>Nowadays barely watch vtubers or visit here

Damn I must be the king of the normalfags

The voices

>>36964869
>That Elden Ring stream with IRyS, Mori, and Ina
>Mori sees a negative comment about her stupid fucking Shrek jokes
>"IF YOU DON'T WANT TO HEAR THEM DON'T WATCH"
>A random tako in Ina's chat tells Mori he can't mute her on Ina's stream
Wish I had the screenshot

>>36964328
>mori
I actually was rooting for her until the jumpking stream. Bae and irys's anime zatsudan was so good, but mori couldn't keep up and had to act like a bully. I know it was her stream, but that was the most alive and sincere the audience ever saw bae and irys. I would have forgiven her, but then she had to keep inserting herself with the chad cast shit. She literally killed their growth to pretend to be tt. jesus christ.

>>36988496
>friends
Co workers who she's known for a total of what, a month? It'd be different if people were attacking her based on who her roommate socialises with off stream, but it is reasonable to complain if her stream content is heading in a new direction that you don't like.

>>36991252
Anon, I’m the same. I started just visiting this place out of habit until I started seeing catalog shitposts about Phase Connect. I got so annoyed by the shitslinging, but also curious enough by the fact that people were either saying good things or completely shitting on them, that I checked them out after no one would spoonfeed me with some evidence about the negative things.
Phase Connect unironically kept me into vtubers. Their motto about widening the rabbit hole is more than just a lewd joke.

>>36995477
>hat I checked them out after no one would spoonfeed me with some evidence about the negative things.

Every time:
>posts unsubstantiated claim about vtuber
>offers no evidence and says "do your reps" when asked
>leaves

>>36964373
this. people have to learn to let go and move on. there's a lot of new hobbies people could be taking up instead of obsessing over women online.

which in itself is pretty goddamn pathetic even if it was't about vtubers

>>36994571
The first JK stream with only Mori and IRyS had a great discussion I don't see why you think Mori held back the anime discussion unless you're some BaeRyS schizo

>>36995760
>people have to learn to let go and move on
What kind of gay ass shit is this?
You can't get rid of something that thrives in chaos.

Retards saying that it's normal to just stop watching and move on has obviously never actually paid attention to what happens when a movie franchise, tv show, sports team, or video game series shifts from what the original fans want. Normal fags will absolutely throw a shit fit but for some reason since it's on a bigger scale it's not considered a tantrum

>>36964328
I wouldn't call myself an anti because that's cringe, but I got tired of Mori's shit, and her rm is just embarrassing.

>>36997509
Maybe the difference is between a consumer product vs. a human being

>>36997761
Musicians, authors, and directors are all human beings? Even normie streamers receive pushback if they try to change their content

>>36998067
You’re not wrong. It’s just that for this kind of shit the schizos who hate women are really loud and visible. The human brain has a habit of only working with what it sees. At the moment, “criticizing a female online content creator” is associated with being a schizo or god forbid, an INCEL. If you don’t know the scene and all you see of the controversy is a bunch of schizos ranting about women, of course it’s easy to think that that’s what all complaints about content are like.

>>36964328
Not became an anti but just left the membership, and it was because she cheated on game and spamming valo

so from her regular stream watcher into a mere her clip watcher

>>36964328
Publicly announcing you have a boyfriend and making it a point to ridicule the fans that loved you.

>>36964328
Schizophrenia

>>36964373
FPBP. Not even going to read the rest of the thread.

>>36985584
What is this cope?

I won't become an anti but I'll 100% stop watching them unless they unfortunately do a group collab with people I like.
-Disrespects their audience. I hate it when they feel like they can attack their audience and expect zero clap back for it
-Doesn't put in the effort to meet the audience halfway. If you want a good audience and expect them to put in effort, you have to do the same. That means sometimes playing something you only feel neutral on but still do your best to make it fun
-Being fake. If you join an idol company but hate idol culture and figure you only have to do it for a bit before unveiling your actually shitty personality, fuck off. Go join all the other companies out there instead. Join a company that aligns with your personality and culture rather than trying to get a number boost.
-Lying. Just like in real life, no one likes fucking lairs

>>36994163
Based takodachi

Drinking your own piss. All antis do it.

>>36964328
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eWf-VQ_dN8

>>36964328
I wasn't a big fan of Mori and I'm not big anti now. I used to watch some of her streams, like TTRPG. I didn't care about her TT collabs, but ever since she started pushing Tempus she became an evil actor within the context of Hololive.

>>36979083
Kuso, there goes my hopes for a holo slime, thank you very much troon

>>36984234
She's one of holoJP. That's all I'm gonna say.

>>36980976
>twitter
>the site that didn't had a hololive trend for some shady reason

>>37003640
Kronii and Mori did all of these which is why I hate them.

>>37009053
How recent are the rrats? I'm assuming very recent?
If it's who I think it is, I wouldn't put too much faith in those rrats being true, but I'm still guessing that we're thinking of the same vtuber

>>36964328
Perceived betrayal

>>36976710
>"We're all here to have fun and make new friends."
Sounds like she is including all of us in this statement. Again, where is the "fuck off?" Are you dare trying to suggest that you know the intentions of my oshi better than I do? With your logic, I should be offended by this tweet because I was one of the people on team no male collabs.

>>37010647
>I should be offended by this tweet because I was one of the people on team no male collabs.
Not even that guy, but if you opposed male collabs, why would you watch a vtuber who does them?
One of the reasons why I know my oshi loves her fans is that she knows how much male collabs would hurt us, and chooses to not do them and declines tournament invites to keep away from men

>>36965091
Almost a day later but
>oshi
>not enduring a shit person for her
bruh

>>37010647

lol >>36987697

>>37011227
Because ultimately I am a diehard. You underestimate the Kronii cult of personality.

>>37011927
So what you are saying is I should just disregard what she actually said and instead listen to your narrative based off of how you feel about it? Facts don't care about your feelings.

>>36964328
probably the same thing that makes everyone get unnecessarily angry over stupid shit, entitlement and perceived betrayals/slights

>>37012381
Is that not a natural reaction to betrayal though?

>>37012519
it's not real betrayal, it's just some smuck streaming to other smucks that's it

>>37012599
But you said it yourself, it's perceived as betrayal, so isn't that a natural reaction to betrayal?

lack of practice, lack of commitment, broken promises
basically I was getting tired of nyaru never practicing her dancing/singing then release that shitty cover with that bad mix
seriously what the fuck was that mix on youtube

>>37012269
>You underestimate the Kronii cult of personality.
I suppose I do. Personally speaking, the idea of my own oshi streaming with a guy or laughing at this jokes would be too painful to imagine.

>>37013364
It was explained beautifully in another thread.
>you being the dipshit in the corner watching a bunch of girls and guys flirt with each other
Why would anybody enjoy that? That's not entertaining, it's demoralizing.

>>36964328
In normal fag view, antis are just betrayed fanatics whom once were instigated to act in certain way. Those bitter ones go against their old kin because none likes being used.
By the way, the instigator is the vtuber, the woman behind the avatar, that conveniently none tends to point in these topics. Before fighting between you, at least give a second thought on whom you should point your fingers, or what should be rectified. For once, stop acting like drones.

>>37013486
NTA but Kronii already made it clear that she doesn't see coworkers that way. If only some people listened...

>>37013486
Just think of it as watching some kind of theater, movie or series. You don't have to imagine a loser and then self insert ya doofus

>>36964328
Not an anti, I just lost interest when she only replied to Akasupas and sang the same stuff everyone sang.

I was hoping she would sing something other than anime ops, and I dearly wanted to hear a Hologirl sing Barbie Girl, or Madonna songs, or something spicey like Resurrection by Erection for laughs. She was just my first HoloEN girl. When she did sing something interesting, like when they finally got permissions for english songs I watched, but I still ain't hearin' Barbie Girl, and so I'm just watching and having fun with other streamers.

>>36964328
As somebody who used to watch Mori religiously and now does not, a complete absence of gratitude and an unwillingness to work her personal failings was what drove me away.
Still not an anti though, fuck those guys.

>>37013626
It's a bit disingenous to compare watching a streamer to other forms of media because there is constant feedback between you and the streamer. In a sense, you have a relationship between each other
>series
If a CGDCT series suddenly added a bunch of young men into the cast, a lot of people would get upset and drop the series.

>>36964328
Unironically, an unhealthy unwillingness to just let go. When a fan becomes unsatisfied with what or who they were a fan of, wants to see a change but never really sees it(or sometimes it goes down a worse route), that frustration of having no real power over the matter becomes constant and will forever be attributed to the person/thing. So now all you get from once being a fan is pretty much just negativity. If it gets to a certain point, you just start lashing out and now you're an anti. Simply fucking off when you're no longer having fun just saves you the hassle and headache. Too bad that's too much to expect from some

>>36964328
See Ame

>>37013919
>It's a bit disingenous to compare watching a streamer to other forms of media because there is constant feedback between you and the streamer
>Let me compare streams to CGDCT
This is why I hardly entertain CGDCTfags

>>37014469
That person brought up the "just consider streams in the same way you'd consider a series, so I picked a style of anime series"
I'm not even a CGDCTfag though, my oshi is literally in a romantic relationship with her chat and calls her streams "dates", so it would be retarded to try to bring another man along on your date.

>>37013719
She's sung some Madonna. And some more with her irl Mother.

>>37014370
>Simply fucking off when you're no longer having fun just saves you the hassle and headache
Exactly what I did, but even half a year later I still feel like I went through a bad breakup and just want her back. Not so much headache as heartache.
Never go Full Gosling bros.

>>37010312
No, those rrats are relatively old. The newest ones are from the first half of 2021.

>>37014686

Nice, I'll probably even check them out, if I feel the interest bubble up.

>>37015429
Ok, it's not who I was thinking of.
I'm just a bit curious though: if you've known about them for over a year and a half, why are you having a crisis of faith about your oshi now? Have you been thinking about them for that long?
As someone who has an oshi with a lot of rrats around her, I think it's important to be willing to put your trust in them over what random people on the internet say. But I just can't give a more specific response since I have no idea who you're even referencing and I don't really want you to say if you're holding back their name for a good reason

Zeta saying she won't be my wife and calling me disgusting. I HATE HER!

>>37015920
I missed the latest rrats then as I was on my break from /here/ during that time and picked up on them recently; did some archive reps and accidentally found even more of older ones. I really want to trust her, so I try my best, but because I still continue to be realistic about how the world works, I have a shitload of these narratives going on in my head now.

>>37014544
What I meant by that was to just treat streamers as nothing more than another form of entertainment. I wasn't looking for specific (and also flawed) comparisons/examples. Vtubers are NOT an anime like CGDCTfags insist they are; they are streamers with anime avatars. Anime/manga is highly scripted and edited, streams are all pretty much off the cuff, a spur of the moment thing, with real people usually reacting in real time. With vtubers in particular, there's an implied suspension of disbelief in order to join in on the fun. There's a point where the vtuber will just drop the character/lore anyway, unless it's convenient for a joke, and we're just watching their regular personality. We're way past talking about knowing how to separate fiction from reality. Also, if your oshi is "literally" in a relationship with her chat, which must be dozens if not hundreds of other dudes, she's a whore. And that would make you...?

>>37017906
Her favorite![\spoiler] Obviously

>>37017628
Well, the only advice I can really give is to try to get in touch with some other people in the community and talk to them about it.
Back in February, the Fandead made a poal to chat to each other and that definitely helped a lot of them get through those tough times. So doing something similar could help you talk to people who know the full story and who actually have an interest in talking about the rrats seriously.

>>37017906
If the entertainment becomes bad, you drop it. You don't force yourself to continue consuming it
And I don't really expect any deeper thought processes from someone who could actually write that last part and not realise how retarded they are.

Coco. I never was a fan of her, but I like her. But them she decided to graduate. Thats still fair, she was always a free spirit and shad to deal with hololive management. But then as an Indie and then vshojo... She literally quit so she can sell soft porn to teen on twitch. Im not an anti but I no longer like her.
Rushia. She always manipulated her entire audience, exploiting lonely people, often with mental disorders. She is money hungry and a plain bad person. And then she decided that the best thing to do when she got backlashed for all of this is to pretend she kills herself, try to shift blame on her coworker and then violate her contract.

>>37018212
I don't make the rules m8

>>36964328
rejecting your own content after doing it for months

>>37020686
You couldn't be a more obvious tribalfaggot if you tried.
>try to shift blame on her coworker
Literally didn't happen

>>37020869
Watch as they recoil

>>37013719
>Haachama isn't allowed to do EN karaoke anymore
Crime against humanity

>>37020916
>make up shit
>get called out
>act like the people calling you out are unreasonable

>>37021008
Nerve status: struck.

>>37010647
No one fucking cares about you or how you feel. Kronii's intentions are clear. Keep twisting it however you like.

>>36964328
well if your oshi give more attention to the antis, why be a fan

Unsubbed and stop watching her.

>>36964328
Thinking your streamer of choice likes what they do, likes their fans, etc, then you find out the opposite is true. Like if you say hello to someone at work and think you're on good terms, then find out they're talking shit about you for no reason.

>>37018107
It just so happens that many of my oshi's fans /here/ aren't very interested in such conversations and see any attempt to start a discussion as a means of stirring up "drama", which I somewhat understand, given that for some real shitposter and dramafag it's easy to cut in and mess everything up.
Well, fandead have a very specific oshi and relationship with her that openly involves being gachikoi and talking about RM. But in the case of my oshi, many of her fans don't want to go any further than viewing her solely as an "entertainer" and reject any conversation beyond that. That's why I'm even a little jealous of fandead on this particular issue.
So I guess I'll just continue my struggle until I reach some kind of peace in my mind. I'm not going to just give up on her unless my suspicions are confirmed and revealed, which I hope will not happen.

>>36964328
Sunk cost fallacy.

>>37028069
What's the cost?

>>36964328
Having nowhere else to go to

>>36964328
I'm her fan when she's working hard and grateful of my support. I'm not her fan if she no longer need me.

>>36967828
Retard.

>>36964373
fpbp
Schizo in shambles.

>>36964328
Disrespects their audience. Shitting on your chat as if you were doing them a favor is not banter.

>>36964373
>normal people
tasty bait

>>36964328
anger