/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

>>346297
>Does the debut make or break the chuuba?
No, plenty of chuubas have godawful debuts and get good later on.
>How necessary is a debut?
Not at all, but they're fun.
>What makes a good or bad debut?
The most important part is actually starting in the first place, debut or no.

>How necessary is a debut?
What kinda question is this? The first stream is the debut. If you didn't have it yet then you're not active at all.

Anyway Korone is proof that you can recover from a bad debut.

I'm going to assume the 2nd question is about if the formal debut format is necessary, I don't think so. I think it's an artifact from old school idol culture. They're usually pretty boring and there's a lot of focus on raw chat interaction for someone who's probably already feeling uncomfortable trying to balance playing a character and acting natural. Might be a better idea to just get into a game like they did with Korone and let the personality come out that way.

I can't say they're make or break but they're of course important to establish an initial audience. You can always recover.

They can also be great for a laugh if they're cringy enough.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWnOK_n-nAA

>>346997
This is true, debut self reaction streams are hilarious and missing out on that a year on is a shame

>>346683
>How necessary is a debut?
>What kinda question is this?

Some Vtubers opt to not have a debut at all and just start off streaming casually. I asked this to gauge how necessary people find debuts to be, especially with the increasing amount of Entubers claiming they are a 'toxic' concept and should be done away with.

>>347289
>introducing yourself is toxic
?????

>>347432
From what I've seen the argument seems to be that they put unnecessary pressure on TBAs and have their root in JP idol culture which is inherently toxic.

Debuts only make sense if you are backed by an established company or group that already managed to build a large audience.

>>346297
>Does the debut make or break the chuuba?
Yeah, man. Nobody talks about Korone, Ame, Miko or Pekora at all after their shit debuts.

>>347289
>especially with the increasing amount of Entubers claiming they are a 'toxic' concept and should be done away with
wut

>>347524
/thread

korone had the worst debut in the history of hololive and still managed to become the first holo to reach 1mil subs, debuts don't matter

>>347511
>vtubing has roots in JP idolshit
>Introducing yourself is a normal thing people do to new audiences as it helps establish your content
>"debuts are toxic due idol culture"
I hope every TBAvtuber hops on another trend before they ruin vtubing as a whole.

>>346683
No, debut is a specific type of introduction. A lot of vtubers simply start streaming or posting videos without a proper debut, some post videos first and then do a debut.

Korone's debut was not even in the top half of worst Hololive debuts, it's just that her current character is a radical departure from the original concept.

>>347511
who gives a shit about TBAs lmao

>>348106
Introducing yourself is literally a basic human interaction. A debut doesn't even need to be a hyped up hour long event, it could literally be 5 minutes of saying "sup, you guys like this shit I like too by chance? cool, let's play gaem" boom, move on. I honestly don't understand this mentality.

If debuting is putting "unnecessary pressure" on them it's because they're so boring that wouldn't even know what to talk about in that time.

>>346297
yes and no depends on if you have a company to carry your ass until you can recover from a bad debut

>>348488
No, the debut is specifically the hyped up event, not a simple introduction, don't be stupid.

>>348316
Korone's debut was Technical Issues: The Stream, she was also a nervous wreck and awkward af through most of it until Okayu showed up, but yeah it wasn't even that bad and nkw it's looked upon earnestly and as a sign of her growth

>>348601
Well, they are the retards who only follow by imitation and try to do big debuts because Hololive does them

>>347557
>Miko
>Ame
Who?

>>347289
I think it would be nice if vtubers had a non-stream introductory video, that people can check out quickly to see what they're all about.

For current hololive, its probably unecessary since their debuts are already where most people are gonna get their first impressions.
But for small streamers, assuming they're eventually gonna get traction, are probably gonna get most of their viewers long after their debut.

>>348771
>feel pressured to copy big company to get big
>instead of just doing something different because you pressured, accuse someone of being immoral
nuke everything

2020:
>I'm still haven't debuted because I'm building up presence for a big hololive-style debut extravaganza stream with tens thousands of viewers
2021:
>akshually, I don't want a big debut after all because they have their roots in toxic idol culture
Fucking vtweeters, lmao

>>348887
>I think it would be nice if vtubers had a non-stream introductory video

This actually used to be the common route, I remember years back a Vtuber debut was called an introduction video that usually clocked in about 5-6 minutes. Now that Vtuber basically means "anime streamer" it's always a debut stream instead. Hell, feels like most of them are on twitch now anyways, so a intro video isn't exactly viable there.

>>348771
That's literally why they're trying to move away from debuts, you fucking retard.

>>349176
If they just want not to debut that's fine, it's taking the extra step and going "debuts are bad actually" that's stupid

>>349176
Maybe if vtweeters didn't kept using the "wanting the perfect debut" excuse for not debuting for months only to do a 180 and now claim that debuts are now toxic people wouldn't be calling them retards

>have unrealistic expectations for your debut based on a company that has been on the game for 3 years and has an established viewer base of hundreds of thousands
>get 10 viewers on your debut stream, 5 of which them are other vtweeters you've been discussing politics for the past month because it turns out that twitter followers and reddit upvotes don't necessarily translate into subscibers
>2 weeks later no one is watching you because it turns out no amount of pre-debut hype can make up for lack of talent as an entertainer
>"actually, big debuts are bad because they are part of toxicnidol culture"
This is why ENvtubing will always be a shitshow

>>350366
We need more vtuber agencies. Not so we can straight up import holo idolshit or nijisanji, but to just reduce the twitter whiner dominance in certain areas and raise the bar a little

a great one can make you, as it did for ollie, but a bad one can't break you. it may just slow you down a bit. and a debut that's as good as ollie's was can set the bar way the fuck too high for the followups

>>346297
In the context of corporate vtubers they’re important for early growth. Bad / technical problems in your debut will set you back but can be pushed through.

For vtweeters, with or without a debut no ones going to watch them. Their opinion is irrelevant and should be ignored until they move onto the next trend.

>>350662
A bad one can stunt your potential growth though
Continuing your ID gen 2 example, Reine is as quality of streamer as Ollie is but she completely fucked up her debut by mentioning how she wanted to mostly speak indonesian
Even though she's mostly backpedaled from that statement it's stunted her channel's growth because everyone's first impressive of her was basically "Oh, she's gonna speaking mostly indonesian? guess I won't be watching her then"

>debuts arent that important
>meanwhile Artemis antis never shut up about her debut

>>350530
i think that we just need to wait a little bit, maybe a year or two.
these trend hopping "TBA/predebut vtweeters" are going to move on eventually when the next big thing happens

>>346297
I'm just here for Nobuhime lewd videos. Sauce?

>>351720
If Reine debuted before Anya she'd be doing as well as Ollie. Her debut was even better than Ollie's but Anya's trashfire of a debut really cucked her.

>>346297
Planning a debut, OP?

>>355543
https://streamable.com/8blawk

Debuting makes sense when you're a corporate Chuuba.

It gives you the chance to separate yourself from the others in your group and also allows you to sell yourself to already established fans.

It wouldnt make sense if you're an indie imo. No one is going to watch your debut stream, unless you managed to hype people up like Artemis did, and judging at how he quickly dropped the ball on his debut stream no less, people have wisened up to that.

>>346297
Yeah, I think so. That said perseverance is what truly cements you in the end. Having a rough start can make you give up. Having a good start can make it easier.

>>351830
Antis never shut up about her debut because they've been never watched anything else after, and for good reason.

Artemis was one big clickbait, and everyone fell for it.

Never again.

>>352078
AHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
No
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA
It's like you don't know them at all

>>346297
For an indie the debut should be just a simple and quick presentation, and that's all, leave the huge debut to the big names

>>348082
>the worst debut in the history of hololive
Defective...
Dagger...

>>346297
Look what they have done.
Nobuhime is the definitive proof that HL is shit. Nobuhime was so fucking good, and now we only have a bland clown...

>>357110
Blame the retards at upd8. HL just picked up the pieces.

>>346297
That's like asking 'How much does the Wedding Day matter to a lasting marriage?'

>>355543
https://youtu.be/HxnXKGNMrWU
https://youtu.be/u1RcAhDvb0Q
https://youtu.be/DTdtXnlVJmI
>>355670
more

>>346297
>Korone and Ame

>>357430
I've heard talk of some bj fanbox stuff.
Please.

>>346297
>Does the debut make or break the chuuba? How necessary is a debut?
Kind of. You're going to say your interests, plans, likes/dislikes and etc on your debut so, if your viewers do not like what they see they might not come again for your next stream.
>What makes a good or bad debut?
As long as you achieve the minimum goal (mentioned above), it should be ok. But, you can go the extra mile by thinking of creative ways to debut.

She was much happier as Nobu and will never forgive herself for not making it and "selling out" to corporate vtubing. Alone at night she dreams of getting an email from youtube saying it was all a mistake and her channel is back and she can go back, pretend nothing happened and collab with ne(po)labo without the clown makeup.

>>358297
>She was much happier as Nobu

>>355543
>hj2
Where's 1

>>351830
I just watched 5 sends and nope'd out when I heard his voice. So much for the hype.

>>358297
>"selling out" to corporate vtubing.
Because she was totally an indie amirite?

>>357589
Idk about that but I have this.
https://files.catbox.moe/ooelki.webm

If you're an indie chuuba, there's literally no point to doing a debut, since there'd be nobody to direct traffic to you. If you're part of an agency, the debut is necessary to establish your character as part of the fold. It'd be pretty fucking weird if somebody just started streaming under the hololive banner out of nowhere, and people would be less inclined to just randomly watch them without any context. People are more inclined to watch debuts of characters in agencies they follow, which makes it easier to establish them.
For example, Aqua is one of the most subscribed people in hololive, but I've never bothered to watch a second of her content, since I have absolutely no context as to what she's like, and my time is already being spent on other chuubas. Meanwhile, Reine is the second least subscribed, and I watch her content frequently, because her character stuck out to me in her debut. I had time to watch an hour long introduction for Reine, which established enough interest in her to make room in my vtuber watching habits for her, but I didn't have enough interest to dig through already pre-established content to find a good starting point for Aqua.

>>358658
https://streamable.com/o1rgv8

>>359479
>ancient cursed knowledge

>>358297
>Much happier as Nobuhime
>Literally retires in tears because management treated her that badly

>>357430
Nobuhime was my favorite vtuber design. She is the only vtuber I ever considered buying the fanbox for. Now she's gone and my balls look like clown noses.

>>359719
I've found the moment that breaks or makes the debut is when the character speaks for the first time, and what they do within the first 5 minutes of the actual stream. Usually it ends up being them saying something like "Hey!! It's so nice to meet you guys! Oh, Pekorasdivacup21, thank you for the 5 dollars! I'm gonna faint you guys, this is too much!!" and I never watch the vtuber again. I guess in hololive and bigger vtuber's case it's different because I'm usually bound to see more of them later from clippers that will reignite interest, but indies are dead to me the moment their hyped up debuts are.

>>346297
if you care about numbers as a content creator you already lost the game

>>347289
>especially with the increasing amount of Entubers claiming they are a 'toxic' concept and should be done away with.
Who the fuck is saying this?
The Vshojo girls even did re-debut streams despite streaming before with the same characters.

>>364566
Indie entubers, not Vshojo. Primarily TBAs but I've seen a couple established indie ENs tout this as well. Usually when you hear a ridiculous stance in regards to vtubers it's coming from that crowd.

>>363740
Is her fanbox still accessible or did they clear that out when she graduated?

>>364736
Wasn't able to get into it myself, I think it's closed. I'm not sure if those who were already paying for it still have access or not, but I'm inclined to say no given there are not really any archives of her fanbox content

>>364897
That's what I was thinking as well. Such a shame if they really did scrub her fanbox clean.

>>347511
These are the shitheads Mori had to take to the woodshed in her song. Useless fucks that sit around all day on twitter trying to make up rules for everyone when they don't even stream.

>>347289
>>347511

That's just vtweeters trying to justify their cowardice.

Debuts aren't important but having a video you can hang in your channel homepage to give visitors an idea of your content is objectively a good idea.

>>348082
>still managed to become the first holo to reach 1mil subs,
keep telling yourself that weeaboofaggot LOL

Debuts are extremely important and it's fucking stupid how much of this thread thinks otherwise. Western or Japanese, corporate or indie, a debut is a massive opportunity for new vtubers to try to appeal to people. Tons of viewers will show up just for a debut that wouldn't check out different vtubers normally and the success of a debut is almost always represented in viewership for months. People who recover quickly from a bad debut or grow after no debut are almost always boosted by some viral happening, the vast majority of vtubers who grow healthily do it after a strong start.

Just follow the route that Nina Saotome took (check out /wvt/ for more great western chuubas).
>Starts streaming and socials work at the same time
>Builds viewbase for about 1 month.
>Once confident that this whole gig can work out, schedule a debut. fix problems with hardware before the key moment.
>Nail the debut to an audience of around 70 people.
>Network and spend time improving own skills to improve the stream.
>Build your character, community and stream forward while mixing unique events with giving back to the actual VTuber community and the viewers.

In that spirit I agree with: >>367110

MAKE CONTENT

>>367110
It's like saying, the same way you're not Led Zepplin just because critics trashed your album, you're not going to be Korone just because your debut was a disaster.

>>367110
>Tons of viewers will show up just for a debut
Fucking bullshit. This is some fantasyland holofag narrative shit. Unless you do something like >>372629 said, where you have at least some amount of obvious experience, there's no way in hell some random indie stream on twitch or youtube is gonna have anyone 'attend' a debut. And if you're saying "well uh yeah duh doesn't mean you can't have the 'debut' as an archive", the reality of it is that "debut" and "intro video/channel preview" serve much the same purpose, especially for WVTs. Arguably moreso than a slideshow. And the best way to make such a compilation is to have archival footage to clip together.

>>373025
>holofag narrative
Don't blame us, blame the retards who think they need to have a grand debut like Artemis.

>>372629
>MAKE CONTENT
It doesnt matter if its shitposts like so
https://www.youtube.com/c/FutakuchiManaCh/videos

>>367110
How will people know to check into your debut when you're an absolute zero?

Unless you mean be a Twitter/Reddit grifter and post "HEY GUYS I'M DEBUTING, COME WATCH ME" then sure, but I'd still argue that's unnecessary because NO ONE IS GOING TO WATCH YOU IN THE FIRST PLACE.

An Introduction video, I can understand, but debuting implies that you dedicate one whole stream (that you don't even know if people would watch) to show off your character.

>>375147
This. A debut is mainly necessary if you want to showcase a CHARACTER. If you're jusst going to stream with an avatar, a short introduction video is all that's necessary unless you want a grand debut for those sweet validation points.

>>357110
Upd8 broke her and Aloe’s graduation only made things worse. She’s hanging in there give her time, member her to see her best content.

>>346297
I have never watched a debut

>>377235
Based

>>364897
odanobuhime.fanbox.cc/
The fanbox and posts are still there but you can't become member. Prolly only original members can see the posts.

>>378758
Greedy dogs, keeping her all to themselves

>>377235
I watched about 5 minutes of gura's debut but started to feel anxiety on her behalf and had to shut it off

>>375727
so what kind of content? wholesome, lewd, chatting?

>>378955
Her members ASMR is spectacular. It's a mixture of traditional ASMR stuff (whispering, binaural mic) chatting (a lot more intimate and personal than her public stuff) and a lot of explicitly romantic content like ear nibbling, kisses and confessions of love.

She also does chatting/video diary stuff as members content, the occasional cute wallpaper using her model and sweet messages to her members like this one. (translated by a commenter)

>>379230
I love her so much. And yeah, she has the best members content.

>>379230
that's it im joining membership next time she goes live.

>>379462
You won't regret it. Her Christmas ASMR is my personal favorite so far.

>>378874
I wish someone ripped it and uploaded it to nyaa or something

>>347511
I'm still 100% convinced that this entire trend of TBA western vtubers on twitter is just people that want to have an anime profile picture on their social media but are retarded enough to be dissuaded by the memes about anime pfp's being some mess of buzzwords so they go through this whole song and dance they have absolutely zero intention to actually follow through with just so they can have a loophole that only makes sense in their retarded head.

>>379573
Christmas and the most recent one are both very good.

>>346297
not remotely essential but they have their place in the vtuber meta because you can make an event of it. Some people skipped doing formal debuts initially but decided to do one later as a introduction. Some never do it.

There's also no need to strictly follow some kind of debut template, if you want to make a 12 hours endurance stream your debut there's nothing stopping you. I know at least one who did, being creative might set you apart from the crowd.

Basically do whatever the fuck you want for vtubing but put some thought into what you want from it.

>>374741
Content is content my dude . If people get with your shitposts then you will succeed in the long run

>>351830
clickbaiting tranny fucking hyped his shit for months on acting like a big leech
would have been mostly excuseable if he didnt admit to putting zero effort into his debut stream despite it being up for months and people hanging out in the prechat for it
then saying they really dont know anything about vtubeing and hate videogames makeing them prettymuch a fucking shit heel

>>346297
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXrFrkIlE-0
/thread

>>346297
>Does it make or break a tuber
Not really. You can have the biggest and most successful debut and still crash and burn in a few months if you're really terrible at chuubing and vice versa.
>is it necessary
Maybe for chuubas under big labels like Holo or 2434. For smaller ones, they aren't worth the time unless they have connections with other established chuubas and even then they could easily just do a random collab and maybe achieve the same effect.

>>381360
And your still seething. Just cope and move on.