/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.9954860]

So did they pretty much run out of ideas? This blue nigga is the most useless character from any final fantasy

[Anonymous No.9954865]

Isn't it heavily implying he is from the monster realm?

[Anonymous No.9954890]

>>9954860
He’s not even the most useless character in his own game, that’s easily Cyan. Umaro rapes the second hardest dungeon in the game (Cultists’ Tower), Cyan just sits there for an hour per turn before doing anything useful. Setzer sucks too if you don’t use glitches to rig his slots.

[Anonymous No.9954920]

>>9954890
>He’s not even the most useless character in his own game, that’s easily Cyan
I disagree. He is indeed one of the worst characters, but he can still do a hell of a lot more than Umaro. Give him either a Tempest or a Scimitar plus an Offering (or if you wanna go balls to the wall, dual Tempests), and he can do quite a bit of damage on enemies without relying on his slow-ass Swordtechs, not to mention he can still cast Magic, use Espers and benefit from Esper boosts. Meanwhile, Umaro's only real potential use is in the Cultists' Tower.
>Setzer sucks too if you don’t use glitches to rig his slots
Nope. He's not the greatest character, but he hardly sucks. Fixed Dice + Offering can wreck shit, and he has access to some good gear, including the Force Armor. Since the Fixed Dice doesn't use the Vigor stat, you can build him up as a decent backup mage, too.

[Anonymous No.9955018]

He was just a fun easter egg character to find and goof around with. You were never meant to use him seriously other than after you've beaten the game and are just messing around.

[Anonymous No.9955025]

>>9954890
wtf were they thinking with cyan? his swordtechs are ass anyway, but sitting there waiting for them to charge is so fucking retarded
>>9955018
pretty much this

[Anonymous No.9955080]

There are a couple characters that essentially come 'complete' so you can more easily get through Phoenix Cave + Kefka's Tower. Umaro is one of them. But he's also good at Cultist's Tower and a few Colliseum battles. He also has the ability to wield the Snow Muffler which has the highest defense stat in the game.

Cyan also wants to run a team of berserkers + Celes/Gogo for Runic so your teammates can attack whilst he charges his sword tech. Umaro, Gau, Mog, Gogo can all go berserk for the entire battle so ATB isn't fully wasted whilst Cyan charges. Dragoons (Mog/Edgar) can be decent with Cyan too.

[Anonymous No.9955091]

>>9955025
His Quadra Slice is actually really fucking good, way better than Bum Rush potentially. Unfortunately, it takes forfuckingever to charge.

[Anonymous No.9955101]

>>9955091
>His Quadra Slice is actually really fucking good
You're wrong.

[Anonymous No.9955147]

>Cyan bad
Just play in wait

[Anonymous No.9955154]

These debates are pointless because the game is so open ended and easy that it doesn't really matter. Use who you like, you'll do fine.

[Anonymous No.9955156]

>>9955101
>four consecutive hits that ignore defense
>not good
Let's compare it to Bum Rush. Given no Vigor boosts for Cyan or Magic boosts for Sabin, assuming they're hitting a single enemy, at level 40 they end up about equal in damage, if not slightly in favor of Quadra Slice. At this same level with max Vigor and a Hero Ring/Atlas Armlet, however, Quadra Slice is straight-up superior. By this point Bum Rush will cap at 9999, while Quadra Slice can deal over 13,000 damage, and it only gets better and better from there. So yes, it is a damn good attack, or it would be if it wasn't for the retarded charge time.

[Anonymous No.9955167]

>>9955156
chill out spaz. no one wants to charge cyan's retarded moves

[Anonymous No.9955178]

>>9955167
Yes, I've said as much twice already. All I'm saying is the attack itself is great.

[Anonymous No.9955302]

>>9954890
Genji Glove, Offering, Dual Tempest, 128 Magic Power Cyan is top Tier

[Anonymous No.9955597]

>>9955025
Cyan is fucked because of coding errors and stuff that was cut.

[Anonymous No.9955635]

>>9955597
such as?

[Anonymous No.9955703]

Cyan is like Frog. Spreadsheet calculator no pussy getting nerds hate them, while real bros consider them to be the best characters in their game.

[Anonymous No.9955727]

I remember him literally saving my ass from a boss after all my party was killed. Fuck thig game for forcing you to level up 3 entire parties of 12 for Kefka castle

[Anonymous No.9955936]

I'm writing a dooujin where he cucks Locke and fucks celes

[Anonymous No.9955961]

>>9955703
I think I like him because he's the closest thing to a character from FF4 being carried over. He fits the aesthetic of FF4 very well.

[Anonymous No.9956059]

>>9955727
Game is so easy that you can probably divide up your main four characters into the three teams and still steam roll, so long as everyone is properly equipped. The worst part about the whole three teams thing is sharing the equipment you have among all three is clunky as hell, so you either give your best stuff to some and outfit the rest with mediocre crap, or spend time equipping and unequipping shit every time you switch parties.

[Anonymous No.9956076]

>fun random non-required extra character

S o u l. There's nothing better than getting a bonus character to join you. I drove myself crazy as a small child playing Ultima 3 spamming the JOIN text command on every NPC I found, hoping it would work (it didn't). It wasn't till Ultima IV that you actually got NPC party members to join you, but as a tyke I always hoped it would work retroactively.

Hang all zoomers.

[Anonymous No.9956341]

>>9954860
I liked him with a gauntlet in my last randomizer run, double his power, I think everyone has a least useful character, for me It's Celes, what's the point of runic in that game, useless except for the tunnel armor, they are better way to counter magic attack

[Anonymous No.9956348]

Interesting party member, no other character in franchise functioned like him.

[Anonymous No.9956380]

>>9956341
It's necessary in low level runs. Makes her useful in Kefka's tower/phoenix cave for weaker teams since she can spam runic to carry a team of shitters through their section. Also you can use Gau to feed MP to Celes in low level runs via Runic. Which can allow you to spam the more powerful spells when you need to.

[Anonymous No.9957261]

Step aside

[Anonymous No.9957272]

>>9957261
The worst part about Amarant is the fact that he got a complete (if short and uneventful) character arc and Freya didn't.

[Anonymous No.9957274]

>>9957261
Square has a habit of making badass looking characters suck

[Anonymous No.9957378]

>>9956341
Celes is like the second best character in the game, though, just behind Terra because of Morph. She has the best equipment draw in the game and can easily get a maxed MBlock stat, so she can do crazy shit like avoid almost all attacks, nullify most of the elemental attacks she can't avoid, and still hit hard with X-magic.

[Anonymous No.9957394]

>>9957378
Also, and let's not forget this, Celes is beautiful and I love her and want to have a family with her.

[Anonymous No.9957408]

>>9957261
This guys design is a readability nightmare. Even his in game icon is unclear, I thought his chinbeard was like a beak, looked like a fucking rooster back on the old CRT.

[Anonymous No.9958136]

>>9957408
The one that confused me back then was Freya. I couldn't quite tell what was up with her face, both in her portrait as well as her CG render.

[Anonymous No.9958197]

>>9957394
more of a Terra man myself. especially when she morphs. she reminds me of an 80's aerobics instructor with the big hair

[Anonymous No.9958283]

>>9958197
you'd forget all about such things if you ever found out what was underneath the robes

[Anonymous No.9958327]

>>9954860
Umaro best boy. No bully allowed

[Anonymous No.9958332]

>>9957261
>>9957408
>This guys design is a readability nightmare.
dude is just lowpolycarrottop.jpeg

[Anonymous No.9958338]

Get gold Hairpin or save Mog?
Final Fantasy T-Edition.
I don't have gotta-catch-em-all autism, and probably won't even save Shadow. Am I not getting Umaro too if Mog falls?

[Anonymous No.9958341]

>>9958338
>T-Edition

[Anonymous No.9958351]

>>9954890
I disagree. You don't need Umaro for the Fanatic's Tower - just need Siren for White Dragon and Life 3 for Magimaster. Umaro is basically worse Cyan. You know when you first meet Cyan, that bit where he's fighting the soldiers but you don't control him? So he either uses a normal attack or Dispatch? That's Umaro - Cyan but nerfed.
And Setzer is shit until you get two pieces of equipment - Fixed Dice and Offering. Now he's doing around 20-30k damage per turn, no mana needed, and he doesn't need strength or magic so you can just use Bahamut to pump his strength up. And you don't have to use glitches or tricks or anything - just equip the weapon and relic on him and attack.

[Anonymous No.9958354]

>>9955703
Yeah, he is like Frog. A frumpy knight who talks with a stupid accent that nobody else on earth uses, and is supposed to be powerful but is actually shit. At least Frog has the Heal spell, a.k.a. the only reason to ever use him.

[Anonymous No.9958362]

>>9957408
I agree. He's the worst designed character in a FF game up to that point. Everything else in the game is too notch, and he's complete shit.

[Anonymous No.9958365]

>>9956059
I don't swap items around, but people are still equipped fine. Let me break it down:

Terra
Enhancer
Aegis Shield
Mystery Veil
Minerva
Gem Box
Earrings

Locke
Valiant Knife
Thunder Shield
Red Cap
Force Armor
Atlas Armlet (Muscle Belt once you get it)
Black Belt

Edgar
Pearl Lance
Thunder Shield
Circlet
Genji Armor
Dragoon Boots
Dragon Horn

Sabin
Tiger Fangs
Thunder Shield
Genji Helm
Red Jacket
Earrings
Earrings

Shadow
Thief Knife
Thunder Shield
Genji Helm
Genji Armor
Hero Ring
Back Guard

Celes
Enhancer
Aegis Shield
Mystery Veil
Minerva
Earrings
Earrings

Gau
Nothing
Genji Shield
Circlet
Snow Muffler
Hero Ring
Black Belt

Setzer
Fixed Dice
Thunder Shield
Genji Helm
Force Armor
Offering
Black Belt

Mog
Pearl Lance
Genji Shield
Circlet
Snow Muffler
Dragoon Boots
Dragon Horn

Strago
Magus Rod
Thunder Shield
Circlet
Behemoth Suit
Earrings
Earrings

Relm
Magus Rod
Thunder Shield
Cat Hood
Behemoth Suit
Earrings
Earrings

Gogo
Magus Rod
Thunder Shield
Red Cap
Tao Robe
Earrings
Earrings

[Anonymous No.9958367]

>>9957274
God, they really did do him dirty.

[Anonymous No.9958657]

>>9958365
Not too bad, I suppose. I personally would change Terra and Celes's equips around to max out MBlock, but this works well, too.

[Anonymous No.9959103]

>>9957408
>>9958136
Yeah, to me Freya was always the worst as far as design readability. Amarant was pretty bad too. I don't know why it happened, considering the rest of the characters' design varies from good to great, and are all very readable.

[Anonymous No.9959792]

>>9958351
two tempests on cyan with offering outdamages fixed dice against multiple enemies

[Anonymous No.9959797]

He’s great for the colloseum

[Anonymous No.9959806]

>>9958338
getting all rages/lores, thats autism. getting all characters just means youre not retarded

[Anonymous No.9959860]

>>9954860
Stop being a min-maxing retard and just play the game for fun

[Anonymous No.9959861]

>>9958338
You will save Shadow on T-Edition whether you intend to or not

[Anonymous No.9959928]

>>9959792
Yeah, against all enemies, maybe. But he's slow, and you have to Genji Glove him so he can't use a shield. Setzer can have his shield, do it from the back row, his speed is way better, he's better against single targets (i.e. most bosses) and you can pump up his health with Bahamut for levels since you don't have to care about his strength or magic.
I mean, if you wanna use Cyan, go for it. But he's not for me.

[Anonymous No.9959946]

>>9959928
Speed doesn't really matter all that much in FFVI. Not that it doesn't help to have more, but you can usually throw on some RunningShoes or Marvel Shoes and that's usually enough to speed a character up. Would've been nice if boosting Cyan's speed also boosted his Swordtech charge time, though.

As for Setzer, I'd rather boost his Magic so he can act as a good backup mage in a pinch.

[Anonymous No.9960007]

>>9959806
The lores aren't that bad. It's only 21 lores to gather since you start with 3 of them. Real issue is just his join time is shit in both worlds. Gau has around 250 total rages to learn.

[Anonymous No.9960013]

>>9959806
The only lore I ever bother with is Grand Train. But yeah, like >>9960007 says, Strago isn't a bad character, but you barely get any time with him.

[Anonymous No.9960052]

>>9954860
thats not Gau

[Anonymous No.9960057]

>>9960052
Someone's never tried his Wind God setup.

[Anonymous No.9960103]

>>9960057
Or the Nightshade Rage. Completely defangs most bosses.

[Anonymous No.9960112]

>>9954860
He’s a secret / bonus character, nobody is making you use him. Plus he picks up your own guys and chucks them at the enemy, that’s pretty funny.

[Anonymous No.9960115]

>>9958338
Who needs Gold Hairpin
Tell me the last time you ran out of MP in a fight

[Anonymous No.9960117]

>>9958283
>like
man.woman, or should we ask?

[Anonymous No.9960129]

>>9960007
>250 rages
Stray Cat, Nightshade, and a handful of others only bc they’re cool (ex. Io for Flare Star)

[Anonymous No.9960140]

>>9960129
Yeah, this. I get Stray Cat, Rodox, and Marshall in WoB, then Nightshade in WoR. That's it.

[Anonymous No.9960159]

This might just be the most broken setup in the game, at least in the original SNES version. Combined with a Gem Box, Terra can actually solo the whole final battle by herself even at lower levels.

[Anonymous No.9960180]

>>9960159
Setzer/fixed dice/offering is fucking based

[Anonymous No.9960181]

>>9960180
Fun fact: Fixed Dice does not ignore Morph's multiplier, so if you give it to Terra with the Merit Award, she can do twice as much damage as Setzer at the same level.

[Anonymous No.9960185]

>>9960129
>>9960140
Which was the rage that did the Earth element attack that also hit your party members? I remember abusing that with gaia gear and thinking I was a cunning little kid

[Anonymous No.9960197]

>>9960185
Think it was ChickenLip. Quake is indeed pretty strong in the WoB, so good on you for figuring it out.

[Anonymous No.9960217]

>>9960140
I used Chimera the most until I got Ninja

[Anonymous No.9960225]

>>9960159
gem box feels like it slows you down to the point where you arent getting any advantage from it.

[Anonymous No.9960239]

>>9959928
shield? why bother. everyone who uses weapons gets a genji glove. everyone except mog and edward since theyre dragoons.

[Anonymous No.9960240]

>>9960225
You mean, from having to use Osmose to get your MP back? That's certainly a factor - one person with the Gem Box isn't as good as two people - but I don't think it negates the benefit.

[Anonymous No.9960262]

>>9960225
I disagree. While it does slow down your casting, it's still really powerful, especially if you combine it with Quick. You can cast four spells, then get all your MP back with Osmose on the last cast.

[Anonymous No.9960506]

>>9956059

I just turn those characters into Imp dragoons. Just farm some imp gear and dragoon horn and boots and your worst characters are now useful.

[Anonymous No.9960793]

>>9960185
you can also just cast float
another great WoB rage is Aspik, you encounter them in the serpent trench and it uses Giga Volt which is inbetween Bolt 2 and Bolt 3 in strength

[Anonymous No.9960832]

>>9958338
kys, qol hack zoomer

[Anonymous No.9960956]

>>9960197
>>9960185

It was, in fact, ChickenLip. Cut my life into pieces the very first time I used it not knowing.

[Anonymous No.9960959]

>>9960239
Top-tier shields increase your Magic Block, which in the unpatched original is also your Evasion.

[Anonymous No.9961434]

He's just a fun little bonus and its not like the game is difficult anyway.

[Anonymous No.9961461]

>>9955302
>Genji Glove
>Offering

Pic-related makes far better use of those.

[Anonymous No.9961509]

>>9961461
Pic related is a fag and I throw him in the meat grinder every chance I get.

[Anonymous No.9962007]

>>9961461
You mean pic related right?

Locke is the best later on provided you just focus on raising his hp via espers. Then you can wield offering + genji glove and both Atma Weapon + Valiant Knife. So he is pretty much always inflicting massive damage regardless of his current hp. Give him a green beret too from WoB. This has the benefit of being much quicker than slowly raising strength.

[Anonymous No.9962229]

>>9962007
IMO due to the way its damage growth algorithm works, the Atma Weapon isn't really worth using until you reach around level 45 or so, and even then IIRC it doesn't even exceed the Valiant Knife's base attack damage until like level 52.
>Green Beret
You want the Red Cap, actually, as that gives a bigger HP boost.

[Anonymous No.9962238]

>>9955302
I always do Genji Glove + Offering with Edgar

Atma Weapon + Ragnarok, and his tools are great even late game.

[Anonymous No.9962254]

>>9954860
You use him in the magic tower and Coliseum. If you actually level him he hits like a fucking truck. I found him more useful than Cyan who's techs sucks.

[Anonymous No.9962436]

>>9958338
Google charm is worth saving Mog alone. The fact he has the highest defences in the game and literally only takes one damage from physical attacks with the Snowmuffller equipped endgame is icing on the cake. Mog is a beast.

[Anonymous No.9962443]

>>9960013
Step Mine is OP.

[Anonymous No.9962449]

>>9960103
Stray Cat is the only rage you need. He becomes God with it.

[Anonymous No.9962471]

>>9962436
Moogle Charm. Fucking auto correct.

[Anonymous No.9962514]

>>9962436
He takes zero if you put him in the back row, which you should.

[Anonymous No.9962516]

>>9955703
>Cyan is like Frog
AKA useless

[Anonymous No.9962536]

>>9954860
>blue
He is very purple.

[Anonymous No.9964203]

>>9962238
>Ragnarok
Illumina is straight-up better, though.

[Anonymous No.9964207]

>>9954860
>This blue nigga is the most useless character from any final fantasy
What about Dagger? For a huge chunk of the game she can't use her summons, for another chunk she's mute and fails to act, and she is utterly outclassed by Eiko in terms of healing powers and buffing.

By the time she gets her shit together, Steiner is burying enemies in 4-digit damage without breaking a sweat in a game where 65535 is the enemy HP limit.

[Anonymous No.9964218]

>>9958136
Her hair hidden behind her eye and snout really don't do it any favors.

[Anonymous No.9965151]

>>9964207
Dagger's only edge over Eiko is damage, and that's if you can be bothered to power up bahamut since eiko casting holy/madeen will outperform with just holy element boosting items in a playthrough where you don't grind much.
I think the main thing that irritated me about that game is summons were a main part of the plot, and you get two summoners, yet the summons are largely underwhelming and inferior to your other party members.

[Anonymous No.9965168]

>>9964203
that's actually what i meant, been a while

[Anonymous No.9965196]

>>9965151
I think one thing that hurts them is the fact that max damage is easily reached with other, less expensive and less time-consuming attacks from characters with more overall utility. At least Eiko doubles as a very competent White Mage who even gets dualcast when in Trance. IMO the game could've used some multi-hit or damage limit-breaking attacks, which is where Dagger's summons could've shined. As it stands, the only ones who can attack more than once are Vivi and Eiko in trance, and Vivi falls off quite a bit in the late game.

[Anonymous No.9965413]

>>9955703
This anon gets it. You picked my favorite character from both games. lol

They may not be the best fighters in their games, but their stories and music are the best in both.

[Anonymous No.9965469]

>>9965151
>>9964207
I pretty much always use Dagger even though I know others are better. She's been with you most of the game and even when she is at her worst I still can't help but field her. Eiko comes in too late for me to care that much despite being frankly superior.

[Anonymous No.9965513]

Are you fuckers out of your MINDS.
If you don't know how to utilize Umaro you just aren't paying attention.

Also
>>9955147
It doesn't work that way.

[Anonymous No.9966403]

>>9955703
I never knew people had a problem with Frog.

[Anonymous No.9966440]

>>9966403
It's a combination of people becoming hyper aware of his Ye Olde Englishe accent being a meme localization change by Woolsey and the game being so figured out (due to its age and popularity) that people realized he's one of the worst characters in the late game, despite the game being so easy it literally doesn't matter.

[Anonymous No.9966823]

>>9965469
It certainly helps that she's the hero's love interest.

[Anonymous No.9967218]

>>9955703
Frog's double and triple techs are the best though. Frog/Chrono/Ayla or Frog/Chrono/Robo stomp as teams.

[Anonymous No.9967251]

>>9962514
Yes. Back row with X-Jump is usually my go too with him. Either that or a support caster. I also like to pair him up with Gau, Gogo, and Umaro for the fully automatic team because fuck why not. I like to mix it up, the game is fucking easy

[Anonymous No.9967267]

>>9967218
>Frog/Chrono/Ayla or Frog/Chrono/Robo stomp as teams
Because Robo and Ayla are OP.
Chrono/Ayla/Robo is the best party, period.
>but muh double and triple techs
Chrono/Ayla/Robo party is just as adept at doing damage with more efficient single techs.

[Anonymous No.9967408]

>>9961461
his damage is halved when using offering, unlike setzer or cyan w/ tempests

>>9962238
thats silly. he should use pearl lance, dragon boots, and dragon horn, like mog. way more damage and hes safe from death spelos while hes in the air

[Anonymous No.9967413]

>>9967408
Use Atma Weapon and that other thing. 9999 × 8 damage every time.

[Anonymous No.9967418]

>>9967413
>Use Atma Weapon and that other thing. 9999 × 8 damage every time.
At level 99, with max or near max Vigor, at full HP, in the front row.

[Anonymous No.9967421]

>>9967267
I just level up everyone equally, get all the Techs, and mix it up whenever I get bored. Frog is rad, and the game is too easy to worry about having to min/max. Playing the same jacked up team all game is boring.

[Anonymous No.9967423]

>>9967418
Yeah? And?

[Anonymous No.9967461]

>People splitting hairs over a game where most characters can 1-turn kill the most powerful enemy in the game

[Anonymous No.9967478]

>>9967423
Just letting others know what you failed to disclose. At actual sane levels you might actually reach without tons of pointless grinding, the setup will do maybe a third of that at most, which is still good damage, but it leaves Locke quite vulnerable without much in the way of defenses, what with having to be in the front row and lacking a shield. Probably doesn't matter too much by level 50 or so, since you're likely to have a decent bit of HP by then (especially with the Red Cap equipped), but still, I think I'd rather just have him equip just the Valiant Knife, Offering and a Hero Ring and still hit for good damage with much better defenses.

[Anonymous No.9967483]

>>9967461
You are contributing extremely basic NPC level posting. You can do better than that.

[Anonymous No.9967513]

>>9967478
I mean if you wanted to beat the game at low level just stack Ultima on everyone and Gembox if you have it. Or Merton and Fire Heal armour. The game is too easy unless you try to make it difficult for yourself. I thought the point of the discussion is that we were trying to take it to a logical extreme. Getting all your guys to high levels is easy and doesn't take THAT long with the right tricks. I find Locke hits the damage cap quite a few levels before 99.

[Anonymous No.9967545]

>>9967513
Hell, you don't even need Ultima or Merton. I beat my last playthrough with everyone at levels hovering around 20 without getting those spells (I did get Quick on a couple of characters, though). At that level, Sabin's Bum Rush still does like 7000+ damage, Terra and Celes are all but invincible thanks to max MBlock setups, and Wind God Gau just rapes everything. Kefka didn't stand a fucking chance.

[Anonymous No.9967650]

>>9967545
Sabine absolutely stomps at low levels. You basically wanna use him all through the world of balance. Same with Gau, to think how many playthroughs I did before i bothered trying to unlock his full potential. Rushing Strago's Grand Train is also super fucking strong early.

[Anonymous No.9967653]

>>9967650
Fucking new phone I gotta teach fuckin autocorrect the fuckin FF6 characters names again.

[Anonymous No.9967929]

>>9967423
at lvl 99 two tempest cyan is going to do 9999 x 8 to every enemy on the screen

[Anonymous No.9967935]

>>9967545
I am too lazy to use sabine. and I always forget to take my thumb completely off the dpad before pressing face buttons and wind up fucking his input up because it is programmed like shit and not like how a fighting game handles input at all. cant process two inputs at once at all. in fact I think hes staying in the boat with umaro and gogo when I hit kefkas tower tonight

[Anonymous No.9967954]

>>9967935
I usually leave Sabin and Cyan on the boat cause Gogo's utility and Umaro's raw strength are too good to pass up.

[Anonymous No.9968392]

>>9967935
In that case, take Mog instead. He's an absolute tank. Give him the Dragoon relics, the Pearl Lance, the Snow Muffler, the Red Cap, and if you REALLY want to make him close to unkillable, the Paladin Shield. Motherfucker will NEVER die.

[Anonymous No.9970157]

Umaro is the most fun I've had in an rpg