/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.9531372]

If they hadn't made Ecco the Dolphin so hard out of fear of kids renting it, beating it, and returning it in a day, would it have been more fondly remembered?

[Anonymous No.9531384]

It would have a slighty bigger cult following like the other dead sega franchises.

[Anonymous No.9531387]

>>9531372
It'd probably be more forgotten. There's that Ecco Jr and I think that's much easier and no one talks about that.

[Anonymous No.9531397]

I'll be honest with you

looking at that cover is like looking at a horror movie poster

[Anonymous No.9531398]

>>9531387
mostly because its just focused on local waters and kinda bland zones, no atlantis, time travel, polar ice, prehistoric, alien stuff, etc

[Anonymous No.9531407]

...Ecco is fondly remembered though? even DOTF which had a pretty small player base. idk what more you could do because the meme is real, most ppl just don't want to play swimming games no matter how good they are.

[Anonymous No.9531417]

>>9531398
Yeah I haven't touched it in the longest time so I barely remembered it.

[Anonymous No.9531421]

>>9531407
People keep bitching about its difficulty saying it ruins the whole experience

[Anonymous No.9531432]

>>9531397
Ecco is one of the most Lovecraftian horror games

[Anonymous No.9531434]

>>9531421
who's people? certainly not anyone on here, and the reason anyone comes here is because a lot of the gaming opinions outside of here are stupid and sometimes the opinions found here are not stupid. stop reading what people think about retro games on reddit.

[Anonymous No.9531435]

>>9531421
People bitch about every swimming level they can think of. If Ecco wasn't too hard it'd be too easy, or too "languid" or whatever. You've seen it before

[Anonymous No.9531440]

Literally made on ketamine.

[Anonymous No.9531443]

>>9531440
Not true
The dev spoke against that
Ecco wasn't even influenced by that American experiment led by a drugged up scientist to teach dolphins English to prepare for alien contact leading to one dolphin developing sexual relations with a researcher and killing himself after being separated
Ecco wasn't named after the acronym ECCO, he was named after the word Echo rewritten as Ecco because said dev was Italian

[Anonymous No.9532265]

>>9531443
There was a clothing brand called Ecco that actually used the stylized logo from DOTF, pretty sure Sega forced them to rebrand since I haven't seen their stuff in the last few years.

[Anonymous No.9532279]

>>9531372
>if x wasn’t a bad game would it be good game??

[Anonymous No.9532283]

>>9532279
please engage more honestly with the material you encounter

[Anonymous No.9532286]

>>9531372
Ecco the Dolphin is one of my favorite Sega CD titles. Excellent music, great atmosphere, great controls.

Ecco is a masterpiece. Nobody ever rented it at my local place. Older kids and the people working there constantly recommended it at my store, eh.

We get it.

[Anonymous No.9532623]

>>9531372
The first 2 games and the one on dreamcast are usually in the top 10 games on their systems. I can just imagine how bad they would ruin it if they tried to make a remake or a new game in the series. I imagine ecco would look like he was made of rubber and would use excessive and unnecessary raytracing to make everything shiny, it would end up looking realistic but dull and grey instead of bright and colourful.

[Anonymous No.9532662]

Let's make the game worse so people will buy it instead if rent it. Did it ever work.

[Anonymous No.9532670]

>>9531372
Ecco is great just the way it is. I don't care how it's remembered, I care that it's a great game.

>>9531421
Let them complain. It's no problem of mine.

[Anonymous No.9532680]

>>9531434
people on /vr/ rightfully call out the pointlessly relentless enemy spawning system and the last level being badly designed trial and error.

[Anonymous No.9532683]

>>9531372
>>9531421
Ah yes, "they" and "people". Those fools inside my head that encourage me to invent rebuttals to criticisms nobody is actually making.

[Anonymous No.9532689]

>>9531372
yes. no one ever really complains about resident evil being hard outside of the tank control inhibited, it's taken as a given that the difficulty present enhances the experience, makes it tense. If ecco had been properly balanced people would view the desperate race for oxygen and fending off pre historic crabs in a similar way instead of it being demoralizing.

[Anonymous No.9532806]

>>9532680
The last level is a very lame end to a great game because it's just a memorization test.

The respawning enemies are only a problem for people who don't understand the game. One of the first quests in the game gives you the ability to permakill enemies.

Outside of The Machine I consider Ecco almost a perfect game. But part of that is the understanding that a truly great game will never appeal to everyone.

[Anonymous No.9532823]

>>9532806
People obviously did love it back then, my genesis emulator on my og xbox is an Ecco themed emu that constantly loops one of the themes and it is absolutely amazing. I started the rom a couple of times but without knowing anything I gave up pretty quick. I had no idea it was so complex I thought it was just going to be Mario under water. I feel like I need a manual and a legit emu or the actual cart to play it because the emu, while amazing is unstable.

[Anonymous No.9532839]

>>9532286
was the final level on SCD version nerfed? Cause that level is fucked

[Anonymous No.9532841]

>>9531372
It’s widely beloved though?

[Anonymous No.9532843]

>>9532680
>pointlessly relentless enemy spawning system
Just suck them into your forehead brah

[Anonymous No.9532869]

>>9532823
There are several good ports. My personal favorite way to play is the M2 3D one on the 3ds. They did a phenomenal job and even fish in a given school are at different depths. I have played it emulated many times though with no issue.

I do recommend a guide if you feel stuck, there are two quests near the beginning where you rescue lost dolphins and those give you very useful abilities for the rest of the game.

Finally though, if you find yourself very stuck or the game is too hard, or you just want to play it more casually, all versions including the GBA port have the debug code which is quite robust.

You can yourself invulnerable if you want, level select or teleport to any area of the current zone. Almost more fun though is you can change the music tempo which given Ecco's incredible soundtrack makes for some really cool variations you can do.

[Anonymous No.9532972]

>>9532869
Hey thanks for the info, I’ll definitely check out your suggestions! The game always had a mystique and I always heard good things but the last time I tried was probably 2012 maybe for 5 seconds and actually tried tried in 2002 when my box got modded because of the emulator.

[Anonymous No.9533064]

>>9532972
Good luck with it, I'm glad to help! It's one of my favorite games of all time, but I understand well why it's always been a little niche. My suggestion if you try again is just take it slow for a while and learn how the game flows. The second level has an octopus that is there to help teach you. You'll feel low on air and like you should be rushing, but the octopus will slap you back of you do. In Ecco, rushing is what usually kills you. Your air is always depleting and you will think you're going to drown if you don't, but success relies on keeping calm under pressure and being accurate. Many people say it's crazy hard, but really outside of the Asterite fight and the Vortex queen at the end, it's really not that difficult ot just takes a kind of mentality that most games don't require as much.

[Anonymous No.9533082]

>>9533064
also one opinion that might help a new player convince themself to push forward. i think the game gets way better after you beat the level with that octopus in your image. that level was really hard, but the rest of the game (besides for final level) is solid. save state the final level, if you want to still like the game

[Anonymous No.9533097]

>>9533082
The octopus level is overall very easy outside of that one teaching bit. The two truly hard parts in my opinion are the asterite partly because you have to figure out for yourself how to beat it and the vortex queen because almost anything she hits you with is a OHKO which sends you back to the beginning of The Machine which is the only boring and stupid level in the game. It seems super hard at first, but once you memorize where to go so you don't get crushed it's really just a dull time sink. Shame because it's the one true true shit part of an otherwise great game.

[Anonymous No.9533120]

>>9533097
vortex queen is hard but would be fun hard if it saved at the boss fight instead of making me do the whole level before it.
i got lucky with the asterite

[Anonymous No.9533123]

>cute dolphin game
>completely rapes anyone who bought it
kinda based actually

[Anonymous No.9533213]

Dolphins rape, Octo's slap fish out of spite..

[Anonymous No.9533753]

>>9533064
>>9533082
I’ll keep that in mind for sure

[Anonymous No.9533867]

>>9533120
I agree, it's a more fun fight than the Asterite actually but The Machine sucks so much it makes it a chore. Asterite actually lead to one of my most eerie gaming moments back in the day. I was totally stuck on him and had started trying to find a code to a later level after noticing there were certain letter patterns thar repeated. I got all sorts of working codes, but none to a level after the Asterite. At the same time my brother was in his room next to mine blaring Pink Floyd at high volume. So out of frustration both from not getting a working code and the noise I mashed NNNNNNNN which happens to bring you to the last level.

At literally the exact moment the screen turned black and pic related came up, Rodgers Waters sings "welcome my son, welcome to the machine" and then I'm in a spaceship and killed by Geiger aliens.

[Anonymous No.9533903]

>>9532839
it had a checkpoint so yea. In fact all the levels had checkpoints, and a couple of tweaks to bullshit enemy ai and new levels

its a much better version of the game

[Anonymous No.9534126]

>>9533903
It's s shame because I like the sega cd version in a bunch of ways, but the music just doesn't fit nearly as well. It's a bit funny no one has made a mod that puts the extra levels into the original game.

[Anonymous No.9535241]

>>9533753
Bumping out of curiosity if you've made it any further. The thread got me playing again too >>9534452

[Anonymous No.9535247]

>>9531421
Too much friction, no doubt.

[Anonymous No.9535250]

>>9532806
>cya shitlords

[Anonymous No.9535254]

>>9531372
Thank god memory cards killed the anti renters trend devs were doing for 4th gen

[Anonymous No.9535270]

>>9535254
Lol Disney games w insane difficulty. Who was this for??

[Anonymous No.9535272]

>>9532839
Whats the difference?

[Anonymous No.9535281]

>>9535270
Not just disney but some devs were making games that were un beatable so kids would buy instead of rent and find out later they were just broken

[Anonymous No.9535375]

>>9535281
Me and a buddy managed to make it decently far since we would swap the controller after every like 2 deaths. It was Lion King tho so they could've put it as a text game and id have played it on the Genesis... I remember it being hard as balls but still fun. Need to try it again, after I try Ecco.

[Anonymous No.9535413]

>>9535250
Don't blame me for you not knowing you can permanently kill enemies.

[Anonymous No.9535508]

>>9531372
Because dolphins are kinda “gay” compared to the bad ass action characters that Sega had in the 90s. In actuality the game is not gay, and is pretty damn fun. But look at in the scope of a kid from the 90s. This game boxart would look like something your sister should be playing. If I told my dad to buy me this game at Circuit City he would have probably handed me a copy of Joe Montana Football instead

[Anonymous No.9535619]

>>9535508
I actually saw it from a totally different perspective, to me it was like "hmmmm never seen this kinda stuff before.."
lets not forget that most of the "sister games" back then were just Barbie crap. back then a Dolphin on the cover did not automatically give people the feeling of it being a kids game, hell the Genesis was even marketed as a console for dudebros way before the xbox360 coined that phrase.
back then most of us just didn't even feel like we could be subjected to kids games on the Genesis, Snes for sure cuz Nintendo. but Genesis just felt differently.
you saw Toejam & Earl and you didn't think "oh kiddy alien game" no you thought "wow, thats a whacky bro experience!"

Even now when I go through my rom collection and find stuff like Richard Scarry's Busytown it feels.. off somehow. as in "this shouldn't be on the Genesis"
That's just how it was marketed, even Lion King and Aladdin didn't feel like they were for kids, they were for all ages.

[Anonymous No.9535718]

I've only ever played the GameGear version of the game. How different is it compared to the Mega Drive one, aside from graphics?

The Lion King game was very different on GameGear, that much I remember

[Anonymous No.9535754]

You really have to play this game a lot to get into the gameplay groove I think. It's one of those games you must play for years to actually appreciate. I didn't think the fast swimming was very fitting with the awful puzzle block puzzle shit and enemy ambushes in corridors this game puts you through. I enjoyed the sections you have to jump and swim fast (even those infamous jumps in the library), but that's not even like 10% of the game. As soon as the game makes you push that seashell into stones in the beginning caves I knew I wasn't gonna enjoy this game. It's like threading a needle but with a jackhammer. And of course the game culminates in a horrid autoscroller full of ambushes. I beat the Machine legit twice, and the worst thing is, after you beat it, the transition to the vortex queen is very disorienting, looks like a glitch and sends you flying towards one of those alien dudes.... which can kill you in one hit before you even realize what the fuck happened. That has to be intentional.

Game shoulda have more open sections and shit, not be full of tight underwater corridors being precariously chased by non-animated crab pngs. Sounds great, looks amazing, just thinking about playing it again is giving me agitta. I was playing the M2 port and I think I gave up entirely on beating it legit during the prehistory stages, started doing savestates. Some of those are just so long and tricky and awful. Game's just not fun most of the time, I am glad I took the time to play it and know what it is but I just never want to see that fucking Asterite fight ever again lmao.

[Anonymous No.9535770]

>>9535754
That's why the octopus is there in the second level, although you can go fast, really the game is much more about being slow and careful. But I fully understand people not digging it. For me I'm happy it is the way it is and not more like a dolphin themed Sonic or something. If you never tried it but are curious, the sequel is more action heavy , but it's fundamentallyrics a similar game.

[Anonymous No.9535783]

>>9531372
Would the game be more fondly remembered if it wasn't so kick you in the teeth hard? Yes, that's how fond memories work. I'll say, Sega screwed up making it so tough, from a marketing and brand position. It doesn't at all have the vibe of a nintendohard style game. It's a damn dolphin with stars on it. The game has some engrossing atmosphere though and with a slight tweak to difficulty Ecco could have been as a iconic as metroid.

[Anonymous No.9535820]

>>9535770
>although you can go fast, really the game is much more about being slow and careful
Yeah but it is sort of a painful balancing act with the air meter and all the cheap enemies and dead ends, I didn't find it very fun, and like it was at odds with your control, I don't know. It's not something like Space Harrier or Streets of Rage that you can play and even if it kicks your ass, still have fun with the pacing. Then again the difficulty is part the mystique of the game and you're right in being happy with how it is, it can just be a thing I don't appreciate playing, even if I did like the settings and music and everything else a lot. That's why I do wanna give the sequel a try, I saw a bit of footage of it and I liked what I saw. Even if I don't want to play the original ever again I am very glad I put some time into it and I respect it.

[Anonymous No.9536224]

>>9533064
>Get a message saying swim past 8 legs slowly
>Get slapped by octopus

>zoomers, this game is graping meeee

[Anonymous No.9536263]

>>9535413
I don't accept your handwave, the mechanic you're referring too was tedious and unreliable, again why have enemy spawns so spasmatic that you can't go a pixel backwards without the screen blowing up in fish jpgs? ninja gaiden at least has very tight controls.

[Anonymous No.9536286]

>>9531372
I liked the idea of the difficulty, making drowning panic inducing, making crabs and other weird vertebrates threatning, but then the reality of constantly restarting levels because several chunky sprite slammed into me from offscreen set in and I just couldn't really enjoy it. I got to the last level and went to youtube.

[Anonymous No.9536610]

>>9533903
Did it? I played the Sega CD version and don't remember checkpoints at all in Welcome yo the machine.
>>9534126
Filtered, Spencer Nilsen-sama's OST is the best

[Anonymous No.9536739]

>>9533867
Awesome story

[Anonymous No.9536893]

>>9536610
>Filtered, Spencer Nilsen-sama's OST is the best
We wont miss you, the Nilsen music is good but completely misses the point of the game.

[Anonymous No.9537720]

>>9535820
>It's not something like Space Harrier or Streets of Rage that you can play and even if it kicks your ass, still have fun with the pacing

See I guess I just don't see it that way. While I love Space Harrier to a huge degree, I also like Ecco. They are very different, but I don't see that as a bad thing. I hate this comparison being thrown around, but in many ways Ecco is like Demon's Souls was compared to other contemporary games.

From an objective standpoint there are many harder retro games, Ninja Gaiden, Castlevania 3, Super Ghouls n Ghosts, Battletoads, 1ccing Gradius etc (all of which get regular threads here by people declaring that the difficulty is overstated) are all much harder than anything Ecco throws at you, even the last levels. Most games, especially platformers have similar enough controls that you tangentially get good at others while playing it. With Ecco, nothing else plays like it so you're also learning a whole new control scheme.

However, all those games have a similar flow which is much more action focused. Ecco is all about being careful, scoping out the environment with your sonar and clearing an area of enemies so when you have to rush through you can. It's very different from many other console games of the era, but I don't see that as a bad thing.

>>9536263
It's really not a handwave, it's how the game is designed. You can call it tedious, but it was never meant to be a bing bing wahoo rush to the finish type game. Unreliable just makes no sense, if you want to permakill an enemy, you can. It's about making the decision you want to.

Again as I always say in these threads, since first playing Ecco has always been in my top selection of games and I almost always have a playthrough on the go somewhere. Along with that love is the understanding it doesn't appeal to everyone, but I don't see that as a bad thing. Games should appeal to many different people.

[Anonymous No.9537805]

>>9536893
Nonsense, Nilsen-sama's OST was specifically written with the underwater documentary style of Ecco, approved by Ed.
I like the chiptune soundtrack but Nilsen-sama just elevated everything.

[Anonymous No.9537834]

>>9535619
This was more my perspective. I read about it in an issue of Games magazine (almost impossible to Google now apparently) and thought it sounded cool. I had a friend with a Genesis and we rented it one weekend. He didn't care for it, but I was hooked. That Christmas I asked for a Genesis and Ecco. I got them along with the pack in Sonic 1 and The Humans. Ecco was an instant favorite and Humans is still one of my favorite games on the system, but to this day I don't think I've even played half way through Sonic. Diff'rent strokes yo.

[Anonymous No.9537859]

>>9536893
I agree with this. Nilsen's music sounds good, but it's very generic 90's newage fare. It's exactly what you would expect from a documentary about dolphins. But Ecco the Dolphin is far from a new agey documentary, it's the crazy tale of a super powered time traveling dolphin who fights Geiger aliens to save the world and eventually create insects. The Genesis soundtrack is so much more unique and surreal that it fits the game far better. They even give you the option to alter the tempo to make things weirder.

Tubes of Medusa is one of the truly great video game level themes of all time
https://youtu.be/Kk72RMv9d0s

[Anonymous No.9537989]

>>9531372
Can you make a new thread without the loaded question?

[Anonymous No.9537993]

>>9531372
Why do zoomers cry about the same five games?

[Anonymous No.9537996]

>infinite lives
>hard

[Anonymous No.9538581]

>>9532265
IIRC didn't the creator got back the rights to Ecco like what the guy behind Toejam & Earl did?

[Anonymous No.9538756]

>>9537993
They've never actually played any, but heard Youtubers say those five games were hard/bad.

[Anonymous No.9538762]

>>9531372
ecco is not hard, idk why people say that

[Anonymous No.9538765]

>>9538756
this

[Anonymous No.9538802]

>>9537720
>are all much harder than anything Ecco throws at you, even the last levels
I disagree with this one, ecco's last level is only made somewhat manageable by unlimited continues, it's harder than castlevania 3 and would be harder than ninja gaiden without the kick back to 6-1.

[Anonymous No.9538809]

>>9531372
Sega CD had the better version, I still listen to the Genesis' and CD's soundtracks to this day

[Anonymous No.9538819]

>>9533064
It took decades for a contender to be this good at being a Noob™ filter

[Anonymous No.9538928]

>>9538756
>>9537993
What are the five?

[Anonymous No.9539912]

>>9538802
I don't know how you can possibly say that. The last level is stupid in that it's an auto stroller, but other than remembering where to go it's really not that hard, you barely even get attacked and have super sonar by that point anyway. It's not even in the same ballpark of difficulty as Ninja Gaiden.

[Anonymous No.9539984]

Did the sequel correct any of these problems. Never played it.

[Anonymous No.9540560]

>>9539984
The sequel is a little more action focused than the first, but other than that they're pretty similar design wise. It's up to you if that's good or not.

[Anonymous No.9542182]

>>9537859
The Viper Fox remix of this is fucking great. Can't find it on the Youtube to share, but it's a banger if you can find it.

[Anonymous No.9543187]

>>9542182
Damn I used to have a cool remix of it on an old hard drive that got nuked, I wonder if it was the same one. Shame it's not on youtube.

[Anonymous No.9544010]

>>9532680
>muh bad game design

[Anonymous No.9544025]

>>9538928
In order of ass blast:
Castlevania 2 - how was i supposed to know
Zelda 2 - muh short sword
Zelda - how was i supposed to know
Ecco - this thread
Mario 3 - why can't i save my game

[Anonymous No.9544042]

>>9544025
Zelda 2 isn't even close to being one of the hardest/most unfair games of its era. What is this list anon? Do you play games?

[Anonymous No.9544043]

>>9531372
I was fuckin terrible at this game and tides of time as a kid but it still made a huge impression on me. Gameplay is kinda shit despite ecco being fun to control, the part that makes it interesting is the creepy setting. Combining the actual mystery and horror of the deep with the fantasy and alien stuff is awesome, and the creepy synth soundtrack wraps the whole thing in a nice little bow.

[Anonymous No.9544053]

>>9544025
I’m 34 and don’t defend CV2’s bullshit

[Anonymous No.9544140]

>>9544042
Since you are illiterate, I'll help you. This is the list of games zoomers complain about, not the list of games I complain about.

[Anonymous No.9544143]

>>9544053
I'm 43 and I will defend it. The clues are there.

[Anonymous No.9544162]

tbqh Ecco always looked like an Amiga game to me, and I mean that as an insult

[Anonymous No.9544179]

Ok
Guys
Listen
Hey guys
I have an idea
Guys

...

What if SEGA games like Sonic and Ecco but like 50% more zoomed out? Ehh? How much better would that have been? Then you can see what's coming with all that blast processing S P E E D.

[Anonymous No.9544342]

>>9531372
He was sort of like SoA's mascot. I remember them putting him alongside Sonic in a lot of advertisements. Sadly a lot of Genesis IP's didn't make it to the Saturn, but at least he got another game on Dreamcast. I think it shows that SEGA (or at least SoA) still saw value in the series.

[Anonymous No.9544437]

>>9531372
Is there a way to beat it with Game Genie?

[Anonymous No.9544458]

>>9544025
Metroid is up there too.

[Anonymous No.9544839]

>>9544025
>>9544053
49 here and how ironic it is I happen to have Ecco and CV2 beside each other on my 3ds. I love both games, have since the first time I played them. Castlevania is a great game, but Simon's Quest was an amazing adventure. I did get stuck but asked around at school and learned about kneeling with the crystal which was where I was stuck.

It was obtuse, but compared to my other playing obsession, plsying Rogue which was just just a random game on a floppy so I didn't even have a manual it was fairly straightforward.

[Anonymous No.9545105]

>>9544342
A dolphin is a solid mascot and had a lot of property potential. The game just wasn't a huge hit. It's so so cerebral and genre bending. The fact Ecco got sequels and jr is telling though. Ecco could have been up there with Link and Star Fox for Sega, but Sega didn't know what they were doing there.

[Anonymous No.9545269]

>>9544437
There are built in codes for infinite health and air and stuff. I forget the input but you have to pause when ecco’s facing the screen

[Anonymous No.9545872]

>>9545269
It's just one code, it opens the debug menu here >>9532869 When Ecco is facing you, pause the game. Then press Right, B, C, B, C, Down, C, and Up.

It let's you teleport anywhere and play with the music tempo too. Very cool.

[Anonymous No.9545920]

>>9544839
Castlevania 2 was one of the first games I bought myself as a kid and I loved it. Seems like people who grew up with it enjoyed it more. Maybe people today just expect to fly through it and don't feel like putting the time in. Makes me wonder why they bother playing it if they aren't enjoying it. Maybe they just want to check it off a list as some sort of half assed accomplishment.

[Anonymous No.9545941]

>>9545920
I played it as a 6yo kid and really disliked it for shallow reasons (no castle early on)
Played it later as an adult and disliked it for better reasons (weak level design compared to its predecessor, dumb trial and error gameplay like invisible pits, guide-damn-it moments, weaker boss fights and enemy encounters)

I generally try not to be a negative nancy but I really think CV2 was a mistake. What is it that you like about it?

[Anonymous No.9546296]

>>9545941
>9544839 here, I was around 14 when it came out and I think it just hit at a really good time. It was obtuse, bit I liked games like that. It helped that others at school were playing it so we'd talk about stuff at lunch which is how I learned how to use the red crystal. I can see how it would be more frustrating without that , but many games were similar back then.

What I really liked was it was a platform game, but in a huge open world complete with day night cycle where I could just explore and figure out what to do. To me that's one of my favorite things in games and why I also love Ecco so much. The areas weren't as challenging or interesting in terms of platforming, it's true but I still think it's pretty fun and a fine trade off for the other aspects.

Really it's the precursor to what SotN would be which is another game I love but there I wish it had taken a few more notes from SQ and been at least somewhat more of a challenge.

[Anonymous No.9546824]

>>9545941
I didn't like it because I compared it to Faxanadu at the time, which was a better game in the same genre.

[Anonymous No.9547667]

>>9546824
Faxanadu is also awesome but I like the setting of Simon's Quest more.

[Anonymous No.9547886]

>>9546296
>Maybe people today just expect to fly through it and don't feel like putting the time in
nah people can just recognize bad design that requires mindless bruteforcing and spam.

[Anonymous No.9547903]

>>9547886
I'm fine with people thinking that. Plenty think the same of Ecco, different strokes. Most people who try original Rogue these days find it completely impenetrable too.

[Anonymous No.9547906]

>>9547903
>different strokes
no castlevania 2 is badly designed.

[Anonymous No.9547938]

>>9547906
That's nice. It's still a game I thoroughly enjoyed as a teen and now enjoy revisiting now and then. What kids these days think of it doesn't really matter to me.

[Anonymous No.9547940]

>>9531432
>Lovecraftian
No it wasn’t

[Anonymous No.9548090]

>>9547940
Post your well-read copy of Mountains of Madness

[Anonymous No.9548191]

>>9548090
Not him, but what do you think Ecco and Mountains of Madness have in common in any way? One is about ancient eldritch monsters that built a civilization in Antarctica. The other is about ripoff Geiger aliens who periodically visit earth to use it as a smorgasbord and then get thwarted by a dolphin with super powers.

Maybe that the vortex eventually being defeated in the distant past and their remnants evolving into crustaceans and insects?

[Anonymous No.9548513]

>>9545941
I love adventure and discovering secrets and unique treasure. Also at the time there weren't a whole lot of action adventure games. I just think people don't actually take the time to explore and want to draw the conclusion that it sucks. It's not any more obtuse than many other nes games, but it has a reputation. When you compare it to games like Hydlide that gives you hardly any hints to find the jewels and fairies, cv2 feels like a very polished game. Not that I consider Hydlide is bad. There is some fun to be had in that game too.

[Anonymous No.9548518]

>>9547886
>mindless bruteforcing and spam
Completely wrong. They should recognize their own impatience and poor perception.

[Anonymous No.9548525]

>>9547906
It's not. Bad design has become a meme just like everyone screaming glitch when they get stuck for more than a moment. Your inability to provide any examples is proof of this.

[Anonymous No.9548560]

>>9531372
It has been fondly remembered already.

[Anonymous No.9549349]

>>9538819
It's pretty funny, the board that calls Super Ghouls n Ghosts easy, Battletoads meme difficulty and you can't even think of yourself as being a gamer if you haven't 1cc'd every Gradius gets completely filtered by a game about a dolphin.

[Anonymous No.9550083]

>>9531372
Probably, me and some others got filtered by the first level alone lmao

[Anonymous No.9550529]

>>9550083
Hey guys what's going on? Sure is nice down here.

[Anonymous No.9550548]

>>9550529

[Anonymous No.9550656]

>>9531372
I think what it suffers from is that the difficulty curve is too deep. If they had just a couple more levels that were relatively easy to beat at the start, it would probably be a lot more popular

[Anonymous No.9550667]

>>9550548

[Anonymous No.9550687]

>>9550667
YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT!

[Anonymous No.9550856]

>>9550656
Undercaves is really not that hard. The one "hard" bit is a very intentional learning point to teach the player not to rush blindly and get themselves killed. The next couple levels are also pretty easy if you don't bother to rescue the dolphins.

[Anonymous No.9551973]

>>9550548
Octopods are the best.

[Anonymous No.9552054]

>>9550856
>SWIM SLOWLY PAST EIGHT ARMS
“WTF does this mean why does this squid keep killing me”

[Anonymous No.9552080]

>>9552054
>“why does this squid keep killing me”
Out of spite

[Anonymous No.9552847]

Ecco is such a beautiful game and I’m sad that it is unmatched.
Also RIP Ecco, fuck Sega for not allowing the developer to pick it up again and finish the trilogy.

[Chud Anon No.9552871]

>>9531397
>>9531432
ITS A SWIMMING MAMMAL IM FREAKING OUT MAN

[Anonymous No.9553003]

>>9552847
The two Genesis games wrap up that story well. Defender of the Future is also cool but separate.

[Anonymous No.9553428]

Based hungarian ludo. Yeah it's still not as polished as japanese games but better than anglojank

[Anonymous No.9553795]

>>9552847
>>9553003
Eh, I'm sure he could have made a nice 2D Ecco on the Saturn. with some neat FMV clips and CD audio.
lost opportunity.

[Anonymous No.9553845]

>>9553795
Honestly as much as I adore Ecco, I feel those two games are enough. A third 2d one would probably have to get more gimmicky to not just feel like more levels and the story is wrapped up so well. If I had any wish it would be that he either did a completely different game or a sequel to Kolibri.

[Anonymous No.9554173]

>>9531397
It's by Boris Vallejo.
I prefer Frazzetta, but Boris is still pretty great.

[Anonymous No.9554532]

>>9553845
>I feel those two games are enough.
Would you support a new game, a remake, for a modern audience?
Zoomers have never heard of it.

[Anonymous No.9555163]

>>9553845
>the story is wrapped up so wel
Did you… not finish 2?

[Anonymous No.9556231]

>>9554532
I don't really see a need for a remake, the gameis great as is and available in several collections, one of them being the masterful 3D port by M2. It's already a beautiful and wonderful game. My only sad point is Tides of Time is much more forgotten and has fewer ports. But anyone now who plays a version of the first game and loves it can find a way to play Tides without too much trouble.

I don't think you could reboot the game in this era and have it he the same kind of game. Players now would expect a lot more bells and whistles, Ecco would need branching skill trees, grind xp off jellyfish and items to collect and the like. All that would change what the game is which would be a huge disappointment. One of the very things that makes Ecco so great is how unique it is in many ways and presents a very different kind of game and challenge.

>>9555163
Ohh yes, which is why I say that. I think it wraps up beautifully. Ecco finally defeats the vortex for good, forcing them to co-evolve with life on earth, both giving us insects and making it kinda cool that all those damn crabs you've been killing the whole time.

Then having done his work saving the world, in true hero fashion goes on his way. To me, if someone is looking for that third Ecco game, we got it with Defender of the Future. Ecco disappears into the time steam and then re-emerges in literally a different dimension for a whole new adventure.

[Anonymous No.9557392]

>>9554173
Certain sprites, especially in the paleolithic levels were taken directly from Zdenek Burian too.

[Anonymous No.9557892]

>>9557392
Wasn't it programmed by hungarians?
Burian was unknown in the us, I guess his V4 neighbors knew of him.

[Anonymous No.9558823]

>>9557892
I knew of him because I had a couple of his dinosaur books as a kid, but he's certainly not nearly as well known over here.

[Anonymous No.9560417]

How bad is this version?

[Anonymous No.9560428]

Isn't there a PC remake of the game? Does anyone have it? It was called Ecco Fixed and Enhanced.

>>9560417
It has some good music tracks, Treasure Caves being a good standout.

[Anonymous No.9560852]

>>9560417
Its pretty much made for all the anons in these threads who cry about the first level of Ecco 1 being too difficult for them.

[Anonymous No.9560893]

>>9557892
His books were everywhere in Hungary during the early nineties.

[Anonymous No.9561797]

>>9531372
>>9531397

I think it was supposed cash-in on the Free Willy hype just like all those prehistoric/caveman vs. dino games were a cash in on Jurassic Park.

[Anonymous No.9562792]

>>9561797
Free Willy came out a year after Ecco though, and Sega was never smart enough to lurk around Hollywood and see what MIGHT have been a popular movie in a year or so.

[Anonymous No.9562801]

What exactly is the big fucking problem with this game that makes people complain about it or say it's scary?

[Anonymous No.9562826]

>>9562801
Earlier posts mentions it.
>Complains
It's hard. First few levels are pretty rough cause you're learning, one level in particular didnt have enough air pockets which makes it tedious to even explore. the final level is maximum mega bullshit, but most people complaining about this game didnt make it that far
>Scary
Kids be kids. the weirdest things scare them. The eel in SM64 scares me. I dont think Ecco is scary, but it's the open ocean with interesting music

[Anonymous No.9562949]

>>9547940
Zoomers use "Lovecraftian" as a catch-all term for any kind of horror that isn't Dracula and Frankenstein in a spooky mansion with spider webs

[Anonymous No.9562956]

>>9544179
The zoomed in perspective is what gives these games their sense of speed. The levels are designed in such a distinct manner that your muscle memory will automatically react to obstacles after just a single playthrough.

[Anonymous No.9562964]

As a kid I just booted it up every day to fuck around and hang out with the dolphin bros in the intro stage

[Anonymous No.9562969]

>Welcome to the Machine
I have never beaten this game because of that fucking level. Holy shit. Name a single more sadistic level in any game.
At least the music is good, and that part of the story is so kino that it makes up for the level itself being shit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ils-NolTIAg