[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/vr/ - Retro Games


View post   

File: 121 KB, 460x640, Phantasy_Star_II_Box_Art.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9526658 No.9526658 [Reply] [Original]

no one reads long posts but bear with me
>want to play picrelated
>read it's hard
>we can do it
>someone suggests improvement patches
>decide I don't want 2x/3x/4x EXP and gold
>start playing
>literally zero in-game info on items / stats / techniques
>we can do it
>DL manuals and maps
>go out to grind
>painfully little experience and gold
>weapons and armor cost a fortune
>we can do it
>grind enough money
>guide suggests "buy daggers instead of guns, trust me"
>wat
>daggers give +8 attack, guns give +17
>fuck it, get guns
>deal weirdly little damage
>equip daggers instead, they deal way more
>wtf
>zero explanation in the guide or manual
>finally find some old explanation on one forum
>"guns' attack stat is a plain lie and doesn't mean anything"
>"due to a bug, all swords' attack is actually half of what it states"
>"Strength, Mental, and Luck stats have no effect in the game whatsoever."
>ok then
>go to first dungeon
>it's a fucking labyrinth
>10x harder than any starting dungeon in any RPG I've played
I won't get filtered, r-right?

>> No.9526684

Why, Mr. Anderson?
Why, why, why?
Why do you do it?
Why do you persist?

>> No.9526691

>>9526684
I read a walkthrough of the game in a Genesis guides & cheats book 20 years ago, always wanted to play it for the looks / music and the setting
Honestly it feels pretty good, just hard and rough around edges

>> No.9526692

>>9526658
this game just sucks

>> No.9526697

>>9526691
Alright, I did this for:
-Dragon Quest [NES/FC]
-Record of Lodoss War [SNES]
You can also get some endless labyrinth in the Shin Megami Tenseis.

>> No.9526753

Stop forcing yourself and go play 4. Unless you are really enjoying it, then do whatever the fuck you want, you're a grown man.

>> No.9526780

>>9526658
Just use the hintbook that came with the game.

>> No.9526792

>>9526780
Thanks. I read that it came with maps, but I didn't know about the hintbook. I'll try to go without it though

>> No.9526828

>>9526780
now that I think of it, I can't decide. is it "fair" to use it for dungeon maps? did the devs intend for you to use it? or are you supposed to find the routes on your own?

>> No.9526871

>>9526658
Benefits with guns is not the strength itself, but that it mostly ignores defense, so for the larger shot weapons, it can consistently put out 50+ damage on any enemy with Rudo late game. The attack stat with it does mean something, it's just that all the different types of weapons have weirdly different damage formulas, so if you aren't using a guide you basically have to experiment with them a bit.
>>9526828
There was a seperate japanese guide available for purchase, so I imagine they expected some people would have needed it at least. I wouldn't be too hesistant on using guides if you're finding dungeons painful to traverse, especially now since it really only gets more complex from the starting dungeon. The dungeons are definitely possible to get through without one, you'll just need to record your routes on pen and paper.

>> No.9526886

>>9526871
yeah, I read about the guns. so it makes sense that in late game everyone has high defense, therefore guns will be useful since they bypass it. but in the early game, it seems the opposite is true. someone claimed guns deal fixed damage that just fluctuates +/-7%. so Sonic Gun does 6-7 dmg, always. I got exactly that.
>The dungeons are definitely possible to get through without one, you'll just need to record your routes on pen and paper.
…and if i don't?

>> No.9526898

>>9526658
You're going to love the dams and the Nei dungeons. I love this game because you have to really prepare for some of the labyrinths. Really nice music, aesthetics and story as well.

>> No.9526903
File: 360 KB, 747x420, PS4.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9526903

>>9526658
4 is amazing but you have to go through so much bullshit just to understand some references and context that it almost seems not worth it. If you really want a great phantasy star game just play 4. Only play 2 if you really want to understand that extra bit of trivia. Also before you say it, no, Phantasy Star 3 has practically nothing to do with the series and if you are struggling with 2 then don't even bother with 1.

>> No.9526915

>>9526658
You already got filtered when you decided to look up a guide, something you didn't even bother mentioning in that novel of a post.

>> No.9527074

>>9526915
There's virtually zero handholding in the game, and with all the expensive equipment to buy and no hints on it, I wanted at least some basic explanations to get going.

>> No.9527083

>>9527074
That's a lot of words just to say "I got filtered"

>> No.9527086

>>9527074
>There's virtually zero handholding in the game, and
...so in other words, you got filtered.

>> No.9527091

>>9526886
>…and if i don't?
Just gonna take longer to get through them. I have beaten some through just keeping mental notes like using chests as landmarks but there are certain ones that would've taken me forever if I didn't record them on paper myself.

>> No.9527136

An overenthusiastic employee made a bunch of ridiculously difficult mazes for the game. They used them in the game just because they didn't want to hurt his feelings. Recognizing that the mazes are, in fact, ridiculous, they included a full guide with the game.
You can go through and draw maps of all the dungeons. This is how I like to do it. It's a kind of challenge that doesn't exist in RPGs anymore. For patient people, it's fun.
Or you can skip all that trouble and use the maps that were included with the game. It's still fun, although there is a bit of grinding. I kind of like the grinding.

>> No.9527182

>>9526886
If you've not played older actual dungeon crawl games, I would recommend trying to draw your own maps. It adds a significant flavor and investment that is very satisfying.

>> No.9527204

>>9527182
I've been doing this somewhat regularly for about a decade now. I had a few attempts at a single "game notes" book, but that has never materialized. One had loads of notes in it, but I left that with a previous relationship. One of my fondest memories was making maps of the crazy MOTHER / EarthBound Zero factories. The music in these games really burns into your brain permanently, and shapes how you feel. It is super cool to go back and reference old notes, though, on repeated playthroughs. The first time took forever, but this time it's your own previous hard work which allows you to coast more easily through.

>> No.9527241

>>9527074
There are some hints on equipment in game, particularly whether or not a character can equip it as the shopkeeper comments if the equipment cannot be used by the character you're buying it for. The manual also does explain and give lots of hints towards how most things work in the game, biggest exception being how the attack stats actually work. It even tells you that you could find items that allow you to cast techniques, which is very helpful to know for end game.

>> No.9527334
File: 51 KB, 1459x808, 10533.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9527334

>>9527204
>One of my fondest memories was making maps of the crazy MOTHER / EarthBound Zero factories.
that factory feels as big as half of the overworld

>> No.9527382

>>9526903
I found 1 easier to get into than 2. Like them both though.

>> No.9527689

>>9526828
Some retard who literally got hired like a week earlier designed the dungeons and didn't have the slightest clue about good dungeon design. By the time someone with common sense realized they were hot garbage it was too late to start over and redesign them from scratch. So don't worry about it. Just use the maps and get through them.

>> No.9527968

>>9526658
You can do it!

>> No.9527972

Well you know what I think? I think Tetsuya Nomura played Phantasy Star IV and based Tifa Lockhart's design off the NPC that gives you quests at the hunters guild.

Checkmate atheists.

>> No.9527989

>>9527972
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M65Osd-TASc

>> No.9528180

>>9526915
Dude I bought the game on opening and it CAME with a huge 200 page hintbook. You're SUPPOSED to refer to a guide for some explanations.

>> No.9529090 [SPOILER] 
File: 659 KB, 3102x3588, ikuto.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9529090

>>9526828
>did the devs intend for you to use it?
No, it was a crutch included by the American publisher. Getting lost and figuring your way out is what RPGs are all about, in games like this having a premade map really turns it into a dull numbers game. I say fall back on maps as a last resort, when you just can't take anymore.

There is one dungeon in this game where I wussed out and used a map, I'm just not a bad enough dude for this one. Trigger alert, this dungeon is traumatising.

>> No.9529101
File: 37 KB, 450x676, sakaguchi.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9529101

>>9527972
And I'm pretty sure Seth in PS4 is just Sakaguchi with a headband.

>> No.9529126
File: 39 KB, 640x448, 4Phantasy Star IV - PurgatoryMode (v1_000.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9529126

>>9529101
holy shit

I love PS. Its my favorite RPG series ever. PS2 is too fucking much. The mazes are convoluted garbage. The battle system is slow as shit. I enjoyed 1,4, and even the steaming shitpile known as 3. I tried 2 recently and It was not worth the time. Thats with speed/exp patches. The ideas and story are lovely. The game itself is for masochists. I've always stated that PS3 was in dire need of a remake to fix everything. But it might in fact be 2 thats in need of an overhaul. Everyone keeps saying "play 4". Just do that.

>> No.9529140

>>9528180
200? I found one online and it has around 112 pages. still very long though.
but then again, Earthbound also came with a huge guide, and it's a pretty easy game. I can definitely see why they decided to include one in PSII, it's clear that the game would be incredibly hard for someone who's never played RPGs.

>> No.9529150
File: 40 KB, 460x661, aYYg3Ax_460s.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9529150

>>9527972
most likely just Jennifer Connelly
>>9529101
Sakaguchi himself looks like mid 80s Japanese dad

>> No.9529213

>>9526658
Anyone that recommends PS1, 2, or 3 are straight up lying to you on purpose. Those are legit some of the worst JRPGs ever made. Just pure garbage. Don't waste your time OP. I'm trying to help you.

PS4 is good though. You can play that one if you'd like.

>> No.9529269

>>9529213
>Those are legit some of the worst JRPGs ever made.
what's your reasoning? I like RPGs that aren't easy. I like mazes and I like grinding.
I like the game a lot so far, I just fear that later dungeons would be too much to take.

>> No.9529274

>>9529269
They're unfinished and no thought was put into the design and the user interface sucks and makes no sense. The least intuitive trilogy of games ever made. Each one actually gets worse than the last.

>> No.9529286

>>9529274
>They're unfinished
in what sense? it's long as hell
>no thought was put into the design
design of what? I like the battle system overall, having so many chars to choose from is nice
>the user interface sucks and makes no sense.
ok, I partially agree here. but on the other hand, there are great parts like not having to enter your commands every time.

>> No.9529312

>>9528180
>>9529140
Both these games included guides with the American release because they knew Americans were so retarded they wouldn't be able to handle the game.
You weren't actually supposed to use them, they just knew you were so dumb you had to cheat.

>> No.9529361
File: 19 KB, 298x286, ps2_ikuto.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9529361

>>9529090
>There is one dungeon in this game where I wussed out and used a map, I'm just not a bad enough dude for this one. Trigger alert, this dungeon is traumatising.

>> No.9529362

>>9529312
Video games were still largely seen as something "for kids" in the West in 1990. Go ahead and tell me you'd beat this game with no hint books if you were 8yo.
>inb4 "I beat Wizardry IV when I was 5 just git gud"

>> No.9529381
File: 38 KB, 370x370, Nice progress you've made there, it'll be a shame if something happened to it.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9529381

The gun damage formula working the way it does owes a lot to the first Phantasy Star, which also had guns that did set damage and ignored enemy defense. They also struck whole groups instead of just single targets, so guns were useful to whittle down the 6+ enemy mobs you'd get at random. PS3 and PS4 largely did away with that and just treated them as regular weapons.

>>9527689
>Some retard who literally got hired like a week earlier designed the dungeons
It's true, all of it. Some of them were so bad that when it came time to remake the game (Generation:2) some of the dungeons were overhauled to make more sense.

>> No.9529428

>>9529381
Fuck that blaster. It was unreasonably hard for only two characters to down and coming in packs of twos to delete your party.

>> No.9529680

I don't know nothing about the games, I just saw a retrospective about ilthrm, but all this problems are also found in the retranslation/improvement hack and the ps2 collection?

>> No.9529724

>>9529381
Just met these purple guys. Wtf do I even do vs them?

>> No.9530108

How can anyone hate PS1? PS1 is great
2 and 3 have issues though

>> No.9530434
File: 50 KB, 524x479, 20221116_133031.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9530434

>>9526658

>> No.9531252

>>9530108
Heh, been actually playing PS1 since Wednesday, grinding levels and money all the time. Weirdly satisfying.
I bought PS2 used for my Mega Drive twenty years ago, but it came without the hintbook and I had no idea what I was doing. I tried to draw a map of the first dungeon, but failed horribly.
I liked Nei, though.

>> No.9532063
File: 2 KB, 256x224, Nei's_Adventure_Title.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9532063

Just learned about the PSII text adventure games. Anyone played those?

>> No.9533576

>>9526658
I beat this game, the end dungeon is pretty hard. I just used savestates so I didn't waste a lot of time backtracking. Maps are a must have for this, and I don't remember much beyond the dungeons and their constant use of falling down holes in the floor. Don't even remember the story. The dungeons actually feel like SMT2 dungeons when i think about it.

>> No.9533587

>>9526828
Who cares what devs intend? They could intend to bust your balls for all you know.

>> No.9533594

>>9529150
Tifa's hairstyle is far more jappy. Tifa also originally wore white and red.

>> No.9533931

My memories of phantasy Star for the SMS are

Jrpgs suck except phantasy Star

>> No.9533973

I only played the first one, are the sequels good ?

>> No.9534134

>>9526828
they wanted you to map them out but considering how it's not first person and you have weird half-tile movement, it's nearly impossible.

>> No.9534164
File: 7 KB, 320x224, img-18.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9534164

>>9529724
Run. Especially if you're up against two or three.

They're but another symptom of this game's harried development, they really shouldn't be appearing as early as they do. The game's balancing needed more fine-tuning.

>> No.9534172
File: 1 KB, 256x224, rolf-title.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9534172

>>9532063
Played the first, Eusis' Adventure. Not a fan of the random element to battles based on die throws. Got to the end but came away unsatisfied, kinda wish the storylines presented could be played in the traditional PSII way, adapted like some kind of sidequest. Generation:2 would have been the perfect time to do just that and give the party members some actual backstory, and they completely ignored them.

>> No.9534239

i was the same, the PS2 remakes were more tard-friendly so I suggest playing through those if the original's are a bit obtuse

>> No.9534264

>>9533973
Nope. 2 and 3 are abysmal. Only PS worth playing is 4.

>> No.9534289
File: 11 KB, 320x224, 925screenshot1.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9534289

>playing the original release instead of taking the rom image, applying one of several game patches that addresses the many weak points of the original and enjoying a slightly enhanced experience

enjoy your bugs

>> No.9534316

>>9529312
Japanese people literally got easier versions of every major game retard

>> No.9534327

>>9526753
*groin man

>> No.9534737

>>9534289
I'm literally playing that exact hack (PSII improvement). I just didn't add the 2x experience / meseta option.

>> No.9534894

>>9533973
2 and 4 are fantastic.

>> No.9535101

>>9534289
Just finished PS1 and will now proceed to PS2. Is the original really so buggy? Will play on an emulator.

>> No.9535251

PS2 is my favourite game of all time but you have to enjoy grinding to enjoy it. I fucking love grinding a JRPG party, and I love the difficulty curve of PS2. You are kept perpetually poor, forcing you to work hard to upgrade your party. The ability to configure your party membership throughout the game creates emergent gameplay, like patrolling a small area of the map with a party of 2 to fast level specific party members with specific powers. The difficulty curve makes the minimal story elements all the more satisfying when they're delivered. And the music, aesthetics and atmosphere are just perfect. Its telling that when Sega rebooted Phantasy Star for the Dreamcast, it was the look and feel of PS2 that they sought to translate into 3d

>> No.9535262

>>9535101
No, it isn't buggy at all. It's very polished, very polished indeed. An excellent game to play on your phone.

>> No.9535321
File: 67 KB, 744x479, 1671610792934149.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9535321

>>9535101
Not sure about bugs, I'm OP and I'm playing the improvement patch. It fixes most of the retarded stuff, like super slow walk speed, screen flashing red several times on every hit, game text being all caps, and so on. The game's script is also updated, some items are renamed to be more consistent with the later games. The game mechanics are all preserved intact, there are just light overhauls to tech learning order here and there, as well as removal of the most obviously useless weapons/items. I guess it's the best option if you want the most vanilla version of the game without the bugs / text errors / irritating stuff. there's an option to turn on double exp / meseta if you want, you'll need to apply a separate patch that comes in the archive.
My only gripe with the patch is that the walk speed is a tiny bit fast for towns, doing precise movement may be a bit hard, but it's way worth saved time.

>> No.9535364
File: 283 KB, 722x1498, PSII tech chart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9535364

>>9535251
I'm around Piata right now, I wonder if Hugh will ever get useful though? I've looked at his tech, only Vol / Savol seem useful. Rest like paralyze / confuse / etc. sounds underpowered.
Still thinking if I should continue with Amy at this point, I guess she's well roundded for now

>> No.9535595

>>9526658
>it's a fucking labyrinth
Yeah, they are. The way I understand it, you are supposed to beat them in several tries: go in, explore, teleport away, heal, go back.
Or use the guide. The mazes are not that complicated though, except for >>9529090
A couple of gameplay hints:
Grinding become easier halfway through the game when you get a set of armor in the second dam that casts Gra with no TP charge.
Robots and magical enemies tend to resist melee damage. Guns and techs ignore resistance.
All guides tell that Kain's techs work on robots and Hugh's techs work on biomonsters. What they don't tell you is that they both work on magical enemies in the later dungeons.

>> No.9535664

>>9535262
People play games like this on their phones?

>>9535321
Ah, okay, I see. Thanks for replying. I'll might give the original a try, see how it works.

>> No.9536730

>>9535664
I'm playing it on my phone via Retroarch. RPGs and strategies are perfect for this, even the clunky onscreen joypad works well. Can always save/load and fast forward stuff. PSII also allows most fights to go basically on auto combat, all you have to do is select "auto" and not press any buttons afterwards.
Since it's Retroarch, you can also have some nice additions like filters / shaders (CRT Royale / Blargg / etc), high quality Genesis sound chip emulation, etc.

>> No.9536887

>>9526658
never got into it. After Phantasy Star 1 with the 3d dungeons which I could memorize, these top down labyrinths were painfully slow and awful. PS4 is alright though.

>> No.9536912

>>9536887
improvement patch makes the walk speed faster, could also apply 2x exp/meseta. but if you hate 2d then ok

>> No.9536972

>>9526658
>phantasy star 2
Nice. I remember playing it on Sega Smash Pack cd many years ago. I emulated and finished it last year, or was it the year before? I also finished Phantady Star 1 before it. I didn't use any mods to fix 1 but I did use maps, so it was slow going mostly. For 2 I also used maps, and used a mod that fixes the party members so all of them are usable and not just Rudo Amy Anna like the game itself insists you do. So naturally I used Hugh Shir and Kain all the way through the game instead. Shir best girl, and I will die on this hill.
>decide I don't want 2x/3x/4x EXP and gold
I didn't have that either
>literally zero in-game info on items / stats / techniques
I hated that too. You eventually learn it based on skill names, but some skills straight up do nothing or are basically useless without any fixes
>DL manuals and maps
I don't blame you for doing so, seeing the absolute state of lategame dungeons
>painfully little experience and gold
Some enemies give more than others, and I learned that very quickly
>"buy daggers instead of guns, trust me"
You absolutely need guns on Rudo. For Rolf the guide I used said use a gun until you get an actual good sword melee for him. For the other party members it varies
>"guns' attack stat is a plain lie and doesn't mean anything"
>"due to a bug, all swords' attack is actually half of what it states"
No way. I wonder if the fix mod I had fixed it too. It must have, because I didn't notice any stupid shit like that. Rolf with a sword fucked enemies up hard nonstop
>"Strength, Mental, and Luck stats have no effect in the game whatsoever
What the hell?
>it's a fucking labyrinth
>10x harder than any starting dungeon in any RPG I've played
All the damn dungeons in Phantasy Star 2 are huge labyrinths that look the same.

>> No.9536980

>>9536972
Found irt, this is the one I used
https://www.romhacking.net/hacks/925/

>> No.9536990
File: 1.07 MB, 1280x592, b-team.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9536990

>>9535101
>Is the original really so buggy?
here's a small sample:
- dialogue text bugs (some lines are accidentally omitted or attributed to the wrong character)
- Laconian Dagger, a weapon bought/found late game, having an attack stat of 4 instead of 40
- Hugh is unable to cast Gires outside of battle
- missing sounds during spellcasting for certain techniques
- contrary to what >>9535364 's tech list states, Shinb was meant to allow a guaranteed escape from battle with biomonsters when cast, but the tech was broken and never worked
- If you choose to DEFEND in battle and then on the next turn use an item or cast a tech, the DEFEND status is maintained, only choosing ATTACK will cause it to drop
- missing animation frames from some enemies in battle


>>9535364
>I wonder if Hugh will ever get useful though?
Sadly, he becomes dead weight once the cybernetic enemies infest Motavia later. And if you're not using one of the enhancement patches that gives him a little more late-game utility, than he won't be much help on Dezolis either.

>> No.9536994 [DELETED] 

>>9536972
>You absolutely need guns on Rudo.
>No way. I wonder if the fix mod I had fixed it too. It must have, because I didn't notice any stupid shit like that. Rolf with a sword fucked enemies up hard nonstop
maybe it did fix the guns. because the maths is really simple, in the vanilla game the guns simply do worse dmg early in the game. they deal low amounts of fixed damage, see picrel. that said, I'm at the part of the game right now when they're starting to make sense (as they bypass high defense).
as for swords, will have to test this. right now swords look about same on paper as knives, so I either deal 50 dmg with laser sword or 2x 28 dmg with laser knives. I have yet to test it though (because the equipment is so goddamn expensive).

>> No.9536997
File: 40 KB, 326x456, Screen Shot 2023-01-02 at 09.34.16.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9536997

>>9536972
>You absolutely need guns on Rudo.
>No way. I wonder if the fix mod I had fixed it too. It must have, because I didn't notice any stupid shit like that. Rolf with a sword fucked enemies up hard nonstop
maybe it did fix the guns. because the maths is really simple, in the vanilla game the guns simply do worse dmg early in the game. they deal low amounts of fixed damage, see picrel. that said, I'm at the part of the game right now when they're starting to make sense (as they bypass high defense).
as for swords, will have to test this. right now swords look about same on paper as knives, so I either deal 50 dmg with laser sword or 2x28 dmg with laser knives. I have yet to test it though (because the equipment is so goddamn expensive).

>> No.9537008

>>9536980
that's the one I'm playing. so far guns have been consistently worse than knives for Rudo, but I now got access to Vulcan, so this might change. Also, I gave Amy 2 Acid Shots, her attack is low but now she does fixed 19-20 dmg with guns which is nice.
that said, I just got Shir and she can steal Fire Staves, so I guess they'll be useless again now.

>> No.9537013

>>9529381
Fuck these cloud niggers

>> No.9537027

>>9536990
>that pic
Its the anti-bio and anti-tech bros and double knife best girl that steals me the Moon Dew and Star Mist

>> No.9537035

>>9536997
>they're starting to make sense (as they bypass high defense)
Damn big rocket roboniggers that take single digit from a fucking Rolf sword hit. Use guns and Kain and GIFOI, don't forget the attack items for free spells

>> No.9537038

>>9536990
>Sadly, he becomes dead weight once the cybernetic enemies infest Motavia later. And if you're not using one of the enhancement patches that gives him a little more late-game utility, than he won't be much help on Dezolis either.
pretty sad, really. those "15-20 dmg to single biomonster / all biomonsters" techniques look pretty lame when there are many ways you can cast Gra or Zan / Gizan for same effect (that also work on everyone, not just biomonsters).
even Vol doesn't sound exactly great, I'm reading it has 60% hit rate, and getting rid of 1 biomonster doesn't sound hard anyway (unless there's some boss? even then, would it even get affected by instakills?). killing all of them with SaVol is better, but he'd need to be lvl 24 which is too late.

>> No.9537039

>>9537038
Vol helps to farm the dragons in the Dezoris dungeons. I remember doing that on my own improvement mod run

>> No.9537042

>>9537035
Yeah, that's what I was talking about. I haven't yet made it to robots though, so guns feel like shit so far. I'm still dealing 15-30 dmg with every knife attack, even Vulkan that is super expensive will give me 16x3 dmg.

>> No.9537049

>>9537039
Oh ok. Thanks for the tip. I havent yet made it to that stage, I just read someone say that robots are the hardest part of the mid-late game. And the guide I use sometimes says "biomonsters are easy to kill anyway", but the guy who wrote it sounds a bit biased.
can you kill the dragons with just NaFoi / NaThu & guns though?

>> No.9537665

>>9536980
Hmm... I started PS2 yesterday, first vanilla, then I installed a patch to remove the annoying red flicker. Now, after reading >>9536990 (thanks, anon), I probably start fresh with your patch.

>> No.9537841

I actually own an original cart, but I guess it would be foolish to actually play it over a patched ROM

>> No.9537964

I really loved the sega ages port of the first phantasy star on the switch. I wish there were versions like this for the other ones. I'm an old school gamer but not having a map for the dungeons fill out as I explore makes me filtered before even trying the game.

>> No.9539386
File: 1.04 MB, 2048x1536, smsdemake_sample.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9539386

>>9537964
pls look forward to the Master System demake, coming sometime in 2027 maybe

>> No.9539445

>>9539386
could be nice if it had FP dungeons

>> No.9539491

>>9529213
PS 1 and 2 are the best rpgs for their time
ps3 is decent for a 1990 game and looks better than early snes rpgs

>> No.9539613

Should I play PS3 after PS2? I'm reading all that stuff about it being the black sheep of the series and that it's a very flawed game and all. But I also read that PS4 references it.

>> No.9539646
File: 20 KB, 640x800, sms_ps2_0010_171.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9539646

>>9539386
Looked exciting at first, but that style is exact same as modern indie "pixel art". Too much contrast, too shiny and too much shading, emphasizing 3D look way too much, every single detail is embossed. Everything looks like it's made of candy, Kain's back looks like he does steroids.
Just look at the originals. They deliberately have very "flat" shading. That's because most if not all of anime uses this, and most of Japanese art in general. It's obvious that PS2 is closest to anime in terms of style.
When you see those 3D looking sprites, it's always telling that they were made by some clueless guy on Deviantart.

>> No.9539715
File: 4 KB, 168x279, kensai.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9539715

>>9539613
I used to think so too, even after playing through it once getting all four endings by abusing the save system. The battle system needed work (put all points into healing, none of the other techniques matter because melee combat too strunk), the localization drops massive amounts of story detail that was in the Japanese version, monster design and animations leave a lot to be desired after the phenomenal work in the last two games, and a lot of the towns and dungeons feel very copy-and-paste. Why is there a sunny, grass-filled village in the middle of a terminally snowy dome?

Basically, the game feels very unfinished and lacking polish. That being said, the music is on par with some catchy tunes (not many though) and the Generations system gives the game a little bit of added replay value even if by the red generation everything basically wraps up in the exact same way despite the 2nd generation going to great lengths to pit you on either side of the Orakian-Layan war depending on your choice of bride at the end of the 1st.

There's actually a fun little jrpg to have here if you can get passed some of its quirks. It's a lot more forgiving and less-grindy than PS2, at least.

>> No.9539718

>>9539715
>red generation
*3rd generation, sorry

>> No.9539736
File: 127 KB, 256x192, you are now hearing Dungeon 1 in your head.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9539736

>>9539445
that it would

>> No.9539954

>>9539715
I see, thanks. Still on the fence about it though. It has a retranslation, have you tried it? Do I lose much if I just skip to PS4?

>> No.9539960
File: 372 KB, 3092x1992, uzo.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9539960

finally beat this part. they didn't lie about it, I'd never beat it if i didn't map it out myself. nearly got served my shit by it
JUST LOOK AT IT

>> No.9540020

>>9539646
I think they look better.

>> No.9540061
File: 160 KB, 509x664, B163IeMCIAAdmk9.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9540061

>>9540020
To each his own. These aren't the worst, but at best these "improvements" look different, too modern and clashing with the old style. Reminds me of Mother 25th anniversary edition—sure, they made everything more detailed and all, but it ruined the overall style and it doesn't look authentic anymore. I prefer authentic experience and preserving artistic direction to everything else, someone else may not.

>> No.9540346

>>9539386
I hope I live long enough to this...

>> No.9540350
File: 56 KB, 860x2145, DDSMTII_SHINJUKU.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9540350

>>9526828
I make my own maps in excel for dungeons. start using overworld maps in RPGs when/if exploration starts to get overwhelming

>> No.9540353

>>9536990
>- If you choose to DEFEND in battle and then on the next turn use an item or cast a tech, the DEFEND status is maintained, only choosing ATTACK will cause it to drop

Why isn't this a feature in any RPG? Sounds like it would make the Defend command actually useful in many games

>> No.9540473

>>9539736
>filename
Son of a bitch. You got me

>> No.9540818
File: 6 KB, 525x366, Screenshot from 2020-02-08 19-05-32c.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9540818

>>9539960
>fuck not another one

>> No.9540885

>>9539613
I believe you should play all Phantasy Star games before IV just due to its references to the previous three games. Phantasy Star III is the equivalent of eating cardboard. It's functional enough to get to the end and it isn't frustrating, but there isn't much to really grab you as a player.

>> No.9541154

>>9530108
PS1 is literally the best possible combination between simplified Dragon Quest and western CRPGs of the time. It's one of my favorite games ever made.

I just wish 2 had the first person dungeons and less ugly overworld sprites

>> No.9541163

>>9535595
>Yeah, they are. The way I understand it, you are supposed to beat them in several tries: go in, explore, teleport away, heal, go back.

This is how it should be, going back to the roots of the original dungeon crawlers which inspired the JRPG genre... I hate that modern day "dungeons" are just setpieces. I miss the feeling of "this is a dangerous, labyrinthine space I have to bring the right items for and might have to come back to on another attempt.

>> No.9542034
File: 580 KB, 728x1000, wojak agony crying painting.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9542034

>>9540818
I take that back though, Climatrol somehow managed to be 2x as bad and objectively THE biggest bullshit I've seen in an RPG and nothing comes even close.
I needed a small sheet of paper for the tree island, I needed 4 of them for Climatrol to write down where every teleport leads. I also filled every unoccupied item slot with dimates. The fact that you ALSO kinda want to save TP for last is ridiculous though. You can't really cheese it either, starting it over takes very long and at that point you're likely on your best equipment you can buy and no amount of cash is gonna give you anything better.
It was mentally exhausting. I felt really, really relieved that the dams after that were almost babby tier dungeons (by PS2 standards)
Alive… but at what cost

>> No.9542647

>>9542034
Yeah you gotta save up TP to burst down the boss. Spam those attack items. Remember to get Shir to steal those Star Mist and Moon Dew for Dezoris. If you beat the dams already, how did you handle the robots?

>> No.9542701

>>9526903
1 is easier than 2. More fun too.

>> No.9543107

>>9542647
I'm on the last dam. It's like climatrol all over again, you start with 5 different ways to go and all of them have forks. I'm gonna map it and hopefully beat it tomorrow. It's hard, but those dams had some great items for reward, such as Storm Gear / Crescent Gear / Snow Crown. Though half of them were Anna/Shir items, I just went with Rolf / Rudo / Amy / Kain.
That said, it's still exhausting, mainly because Rolf barely does damage, and Rudo's guns are good but not huge damage either. Kain's / Rolf's techs are great, Nagaj and Nafoi do huge damage, except both cost a lot of TP. I also feel like Deban helps a ton, but Amy's damage is abysmall, maybe I was wrong to think Fire Staves would make her good (they can cast Gifoi in a patched version, but it's still not much). I'm thinking of just giving her 2 Acid Shots or maybe even 2 shields, i don't know really. I tried double shields on Kain, but I lost extra gun damage (he can equip Vulcan in the patch) and didn't really get much. He's still too weak to put in the front, in the back he doesn't get targeted much for 2 shields to make difference.
As for Crystal armor (or whatever it's called), casting Gra isn't much help when there's just 2-3 enemies.

>> No.9543283

>>9543107
Actually I'm a retard, I just realized I don't have to equip Storm Gear on Kain and I can use it with any character. Same with Snow Crown. Guess it'll be easier now
Pretty weird mechanic though, slightly broken too

>> No.9544475
File: 209 KB, 1600x1067, phantasy_star_2_custom_dolls__complete_cast__by_cimmerianwillow_dc569ay-fullview.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9544475

Amy should absolutely be casting magic via items instead of relying on physical attacks, give her two shields to keep her from losing HP too fast as she's the only character with a huge TP pool who can cast the stronger SAR techs for fast party healing.

Storm Gear is interesting: it casts Gizan but unlike a normal Gizan it targets all enemies on screen instead of just a group (bug?). Should have someone in your party using this on the regular at this point.

Basically anyone who can't deal good damage with their melee weapon should be using one of the magic-casting items instead. You'll eventually find 4 pieces of equipment that can cast Gires, everybody in your active party should have one in their inventory for free healing.

>> No.9544482
File: 14 KB, 336x704, phantasy_star_ii_remake_mockup_by_bg87_d6xxm3k.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9544482

>>9539646
I thought this mock-up looked more aesthetically pleasing, looks like something that could have come out on GBA

>> No.9544486
File: 2 KB, 192x62, ps2_party (2x flip).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9544486

>>9544482
though I'd miss the lanky overworld sprites

>> No.9544495

>>9544482
Neat, but yeah, as you said, this looks very much like other GBA games, not really like PS. The style is just different, though it looks OK. the battle sprites of the party look especially good though, I feel like that's what a true "remake" of the game would look like if it was made by Sega (though it clashes with the overworld sprites). the last shot is weird though, Nei has a jaw and neck of a football player

>> No.9544504

>>9544486
I kinda dislike that Kain/Hugh and Amy/Shir are palette swaps. They had only 8 characters, could as well make 2 new sprite sets. Could be cartridge size, but hard to say.

>> No.9544518

>>9541154
I really liked the balance between fantasy and sci fi elements in PS1 too. It felt like something that would fit in right alongside the Barsoom series and other old pulpy stories like that. The other games get a little too high tech and lose some of that charm.

>> No.9545775

>>9543283
>>9542647
So after I realized I can give Crescent Gear / Aegis / Truth Sleeves to anyone, the difficulty went down from nightmare to relatively easy. Frankly, those items are a bit broken, healing for free during battle is too good. I just wish the battle UI was less obtuse, switching from healing to attacking is annoying.

>> No.9546082

>>9534172
generation 2 did add content from the text adventures. there's an entire new sidequest involving shelley from eusis' adventure and if you do the secret to save nei there's a new late game sidequest for nei to get the animal claw involving the white cat and the silver bullet from nei's adventure.

>> No.9546124
File: 54 KB, 765x579, hueysadventure.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9546124

why is he so bad

>> No.9546128

>>9543107
I remember back on my own run I had Hugh run dual shields and spam Fire Staff or Vol/Savol on Dezoris

>> No.9546143

>>9546124
>uses Savol on Dezoris in the improvement mod
>deletes a dragon, several flying swords, two mystery niggas, and a rabbit from the face of the planet

>> No.9547283

>>9546128
>>9546143
I guess I'll level up Hugh when I get there. At first I thought getting to lvl 15/24 would take forever, but when I took lvl 1 Kain to grind he almost immediately got to lvl 12.
Savol also has 70% hit rate, so not like some meme technique that works less than half of the time. Hugh's other techs are pretty shitty, but these 2 easily could be strongest ones in the game.
>deletes a dragon, several flying swords, two mystery niggas, and a rabbit from the face of the planet
wait, does it affect all monsters or only a group?

>> No.9547395
File: 764 KB, 852x680, PS3 foreshadow in PSG2.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
9547395

>>9546082
Interesting. That and the added backstory that leads into PSIII has me wanting to try playing through the game again, but... that battle system. It's such a pain in the ass.

>>9546124
>why is he so bad
his name is Huey. How could he not be?

>>9547283
>wait, does it affect all monsters or only a group?
PSII has a hard limit of only having two types of monsters on screen at any given time. And depending on how much screen real estate they take up, you can have up to 3 of each.

So without even looking up a tech guide, the answer to your question is: it's only a group, because there's no way that anon encountered all those monsters at once.