/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.9450015]

the best JRPG on gameboy and the level curve contributes to that

[Anonymous No.9450056]

>His JRPG doesn't allow him to field his entire party at once

Damn OP, you even trying?

[Anonymous No.9450353]

The pacing of this game is all off, by the time you get to the elite 4 your Pokemon are still fairly low level which is unsatisfying, which then leaves you then with nothing to do but grind for a while to beat Red. It's all very anti-climactic.

[Anonymous No.9450398]

>>9450015
the best JRPG on gameboy and the level curve contributes to that

[Anonymous No.9450521]

I played both P1 & P2 on release. I remember being very hyped for 2 and its several improvements (sex, day and night, smartphone) felt like I was actually playing a follow up of pokemon.

However, in retrospective, pokemon 2 was actually inferior to 1 for several reasons:
- First of all, the world itself (Johto) is worse than Kanto. I think that traversing the map in a circle fashion was much better than the shape they came up with for 2.
- Team rocket seamed to have minor role in the game, yet it was an important actor in 1. If I recall correctly, in two they are almost disbanded, they barely have any presence. Half of pokemon 1 however was to fight them.
- As time went on I realized that "quality of life" additions removed the sense of danger and peril from the game by detracting the player from actual fighting into other minor diversions. More pokeballs, machines, and side content that, in time, helped the game become more people with the kawai crowd than the original kids who wanted to go on adventures and explore the world.
- It was a second part, it did good at providing more of what I loved without being an exact clone. But it was just a continuation of what I did in 1, you can just revive the experience a second time. For those like me who were maybe 10 at the time, everybody was playing pokemon then, and you could make new friends just by discussing rumors and theories. I think that, at the time 2 came in, I was just too mature for the game or not as naive.

[Anonymous No.9450540]

>>9450056
>Giant Lobster shaped battleship
What is this, Darius??

[Anonymous No.9450570]

>>9450015
No, gen 1 mogs 2, the rocket storyline is some shitty sloppy seconds redo that goes absolutely nowhere, the Mew/Mewtwo mythos that defined a lot of the themes of the pokemon universe is completely absent and the focus starts shifting towards deity-like pokemon.

This isn't even mentioning the abysmal new roster of pokemon that are often erroneously assumed to be gen 1 leftovers but turns out they aren't at all, the art director has even admitted how they focused more on simple designs to facilitate the production of merch and animation of the tv show. Speaking of the anime, "Red" having an unevolved Pikachu as his ace completely takes me out of it.

[Anonymous No.9450575]

Gen 1 and 2 Pokemon were kino.

[Anonymous No.9450613]

>>9450353
If you need to grind against red you are a massive idiot.

[Anonymous No.9450731]

Johtrannies at it again, neither /vr/ or /vp/ like you

[Anonymous No.9450796]

>>9450613
His Pokemon are all above level 70, you beat the elite 4 with Pokemon at level 50 or some shit

[Anonymous No.9450816]

>>9450570
>the Mew/Mewtwo mythos that defined a lot of the themes of the pokemon universe is completely absent and the focus starts shifting towards deity-like pokemon.
this comment of yours rubs me the wrong way because it flies in the face of what gen 2 actually presents. either you don't understand or you're disregarding it.

if you were around when gen 1 was fresh everyone always wondered about stuff like could you get behind Bill's house, could you sail over in the S.S. Anne water and use strength on the truck.

however in gen 2 you're actually given the ruins of alph, and when you you tune in the radio in over there you hear spooky sounds. and when you root around and solve puzzles you find there's 26 mysterious pokemon there to catch.

and in the middle of the game you get turned on to the 3 legendaries and you get to either see suicune around (crystal) or you can just go and find all three of them in a wild encounter (if you fail the first time they appear in your map from then on)

[Anonymous No.9450857]

>>9450816
By mew/mewtwo mythos I'm not talking about the bullshit rumors, just the storyline suggested in the game that really rides home the themes of that universe.

>B-b-but gen 2 is about tradition!
That doesn't change how it infinitely less cool and poorly handled

The fact that you're trying to pass off getting to the ancient japanese ruins and turns out these mystical glyph pokemon are letters of the fucking English/Latin alphabet with an eye as a good thing is beyond cringe.

[Anonymous No.9450865]

>muh gen 2 is bad because level curve
>*rom hack fixes the level curve*
>it's still easy as shit because it's pokemon
gen 2 haters are a meme

[Anonymous No.9450867]

>>9450857
the diary entries don't pertain to the theme of the universe, just the theme of cloning mew and breeding a more powerful pokemon.
the theme of the first gen was technology overtaking nature. everywhere you go you find the natural parts of the world being shrunk as metropolitan structures grow. making the first games came from Satoshi Tajiri wanting to talk about preservation of the natural world.

[Anonymous No.9450887]

>>9450867
*Facepalm*

How do you not get that discovering a pokemon in the jungle and twisting it's offspring to become a superweapon and things go wrong directly relates to the idea of abusing science and technology to exploit the natural world with nefarious consequences?

[Anonymous No.9451067]

>>9450887
>>>/vp/

[Anonymous No.9451107]

>>9451067
You must be new, /vp/ despises anything gen 1

[Anonymous No.9451163]

>>9451107
This. /vp/ has threads in which zoomers are shitting all over Gen 1 as we speak.

[Anonymous No.9451170]

>>9450865
Pokemon fans will complain about the games being easy but then get mad that gold and silver actually has some challenge and forces you to to think outside of using super effective attacking move over and over.

[Anonymous No.9451193]

>>9450865
It really does just come down to younger fans of the series being upset that they missed out on Pokemania. They grew up thinking Diamond and Pearl or Black and White or whatever were flawless masterpieces, and then got upset when they went online and learned about what a big deal Pokemon used to be. Then they go back and try to play Gen 1 and 2 to see what all the fuss was about, and get frustrated by the lack of hand-holding that the later gens introduced, and get filtered by the 8-bit graphics.

[Anonymous No.9451197]

>>9451170
>>9450865
>>9451193
Whitney's Miltank is such an iconic battle

[Anonymous No.9451208]

>>9450015
I'm gonna consider your post refering to Gen II in general. My Gen II game was Crystal, I consider that to be the best

[Anonymous No.9451221]

>>9451208
you should. because i prefer Silver and i posted Gold

[Anonymous No.9451228]

>>9451221
Totally agreed, then

[Anonymous No.9451230]

>>9451163
>>9451193
/vp/ is a forsaken board that effectively reflects the state of the main games.
Sometimes I still lurk in there but it is mostly coomers threads, or doomposting by the old guard.
The franchise is headed in a direction similar to sonic, the fanbase is costantly fighting itself because everyone wants something different from the games.
Sinnoh is bad because I get lost in it, Unova is bad because it is so linear.
Johto bad because muh level curve, new games bad because leveling is a joke now.

It can only go worse.
It really needed to stop at gen II.

[Anonymous No.9451235]

>>9451230
>It really needed to stop at gen I
*

[Anonymous No.9451238]

>>9451230
I'd say FireRed and LeafGreen were worth it, though. In many ways, I think these two games are the definitive Pokemon experience at least in some ways. Even though I love Gen I and II, everytime I play FR and LG, I can't help but think that these two games are what the developers really wanted to do in the beginning, and they finally made it after years of trial and error and having the appropriate hardware

[Anonymous No.9451241]

>>9451235
why was there never a gen 0, a prequel, that'd be cool. medieval aesthetic and pokemon battles.

[Anonymous No.9451245]

>>9451238
FR/LG would be improved if they uncensored the dialogue, removed abilities and natures, and brought back the original TMs.

[Anonymous No.9451246]

>>9451238
if you go as far as FR and LG then why bother stopping there. HGSS are better than those. BW2 is better. ORAS is better.

[Anonymous No.9451248]

>>9450056
based lufiaposter

[Anonymous No.9451262]

>>9451230
They needed to not focus any aspect on smartphone freemium shit.

[Anonymous No.9451284]

>>9451238
>>9451246
That is what I was talking about.
Even the modern games like oras have a few good things going for them.
I loved that radar thing, the post game islands, the secret bases returning, watching finally hoehn sea at the sunset.
But we all know very well that oras fucked up a lot of things like difficulty and post game.

[Anonymous No.9451293]

>>9451238
Please die, FRLG are a disgrace to gen 1 and if you can't see it you're a moron

[Anonymous No.9451297]

>>9451293
boomer cope

[Anonymous No.9451313]

It's about 1/3 of a game that FFLII is.

[Anonymous No.9451329]

>>9451297
Just as originally intended, this is what they've always imagined :^)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdJQopRuH1E
https://youtu.be/SE4sz2lnTpU?t=9

[Anonymous No.9451330]

>>9451241
If you take away the technological aspect of digitising monster in balls and kids messing around filling in checkbooks, you just have animal violence

[Anonymous No.9451362]

>>9451284
>like difficulty
they give you an opt-in easy mode early on. it's entirely up to the player whether they want to use their latios or latias.
the pokeradar + the exp share allows you to use a ton of varied teams whenever you feel like it.
>and post game
pokemon is meant to be a multiplayer battle game, fuck battle frontier. i am sick of hearing about it. the stuff that was added was way better than a bunch of bland singleplayer shit.

[Anonymous No.9451385]

>>9451329
FR/LG were composed by the same guy, so yeah. It's the music he always imagined, with more instruments to work with.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpas1mDvKCY

[Anonymous No.9451434]

>>9451385
I'm sure you believe this is how George Lucas originally envisioned this scene and it's therefore better

https://youtu.be/PiDRgDmXGi4

[Anonymous No.9451450]

>>9451434
Kek, what a fucking retarded comparison. George Lucas had people working with him originally reining in his creative decisions who were no longer there to stop him when he made these edits. The FR/LG soundtrack was composed by the same exact guy with the same amount of creative control he had originally.

[Anonymous No.9451462]

Why did it feel to me that despite having more Pokemon, there was somehow less useful Pokemon?

Also something that really bugged me about G2 was hiding evolution stones behind side quests

[Anonymous No.9451469]

>>9451462
>Why did it feel to me that despite having more Pokemon, there was somehow less useful Pokemon?
Because the Johtodex is comprised primarily of shitmons, many of which were cut from the first game because they thought the designs weren't good enough.

[Anonymous No.9451474]

>>9451238
>Takes everything good about gens 2/3 up untill that point an throws it out the window
>No day/night, not even a fucking clock like rse
>Literal 1-1 recreation of kanto
>Gen 1 mons don't function as intended using gen 3 battle mechanics, ie abilities that offer zero advantage and movepools that are just as bad gen 1 debut
>No breeding for main game, some egg moves would be appreciated given the "muh 150 ONLY FOR RHE WHOLE GAME"
>Berries? Yes. Planting them? No fuck you go forage like a pilgrim
>Absolute retard levels of trade restrictions, literally stuck with the party you make untill you beat the entirely everything
>This one's personal but fuck leaf Green for getting slowbro and starmie, variety for psychic helps when your best alternative is hypno for a solo playthrough
>Also found out the hard way if you start the post game sevi islands sequence after the first e4 run, you can't go back mid-islands to grind
>Subsequently afterwards e4 gets revised mons/levels which would be nice had the team your still stuck with are even more desperately underleveled than before
I could care less about "muh brobat keeps trying to evolve" but it'd be nice if I could throw a couple mons of colo or rse to break up the monotony during the main playthrough

[Chud Anon No.9451476]

>>9450731
>caring what /vp/edos think

Go back.

[Anonymous No.9451484]

>>9451476
t. got humiliated and ran off the board by Unovachads, uses /vr/ as his safe space

[Anonymous No.9451490]

Eh played gen 2 more than any other as a kid, the level scaling sucked. I remember fighting red with most of my mons like level 65ish cause there were no decent grinding locations. And if you wanted to run anything that you couldn't find in johto (houndoom, tyranitar, probably a few others) you're stuck grinding forever on the same elite 4 fights.

I was super hyped to go back to Kanto tho, that was a really cool idea, it's just a shame that half the Kanto gym leaders are jobbers with lower level teams than in r\b\y. Would have preferred If they scaled those fights up and added a post Kanto elite 4.

[Anonymous No.9451519]

>>9451462
idk why you feel like that? my impression is great right from the start. i like the sentrets paired with the pidgies, sure beats the ratatas from the original

[Anonymous No.9451524]

>>9451469
>many of which were cut from the first game because they thought the designs weren't good enough.
Stop spewing this bullshit. There's always a retard like you parroting this shit every single thread. That's not true

[Anonymous No.9451530]

>>9451524
It's /vp/ tourists, they're the ones who came up with the meme. It's a board full of zoomers who seethe about the gameboy games every single fucking day and make up bullshit.

[Anonymous No.9451689]

>>9450796
Yes, if you need a team of 70 level pokemon you are an idiot. You literally can just set up on Pikachu and sweat.

[Anonymous No.9451690]

>>9451689
*sweap

[Anonymous No.9451697]

>>9451689
This. The Red fight is piss easy, he's a jobber. The Cynthia battle from D/P/Pt mogs the fuck out of him.

[Anonymous No.9451719]

>>9451241
That's literally Legends Arceus

[Anonymous No.9451720]

>>9451719
>not based on Kanto
It's shit.

[Anonymous No.9451750]

>>9451462
Early to mid game had abysmal pokemon choices and you can't fucking get houndour until post game, like wtf it's a new badass pokemon that you can't even use, crystal lacks ampharos and octillery iirc, there's like 5 fire types and 2 of them are legendaries, while another one is a pre-evolution of a gen 1 mon. There's even less electric types. You can sweep every gym because they are all under leveled, starting with the fist gym which has a level 9 Pidgeotto as it's ace (what the actual fuck we're they thinking) post game is a gimped gen 1 (while neat, they could have used that space for better pokemon or the orange islands). Ho oh actually sucks, celebi can get raped by mew/Mewtwo. Hoothoot is flying hypno with a worse move pool, the pre-evolutions are cute AF, but ultimately useless and take up space for desperately needed better pokemon. Missingno, like other anon said are ass blasted by being the English alphabet from ancient Japan (come on man wtf) Entei/Raikou/suicune are the only really great things in the main storyline of the game. The real meat of gen 2 is breeding for shines and ivs(was it still dvs in gen2 can't remember), pokerus is cool, day night cycle was cool, berries and apricorns we're a nice addition. In retrospect gen 2 was not that great in terms of Pokemon, but aesthetics and added mechanics hold it together. Gen 2 animations are top tier comfy and soul.

[Anonymous No.9451759]

>>9451484
>Unovachad
More like unovagina because the only pussy youll ever see was when you were born.

[Anonymous No.9451760]

>>9451720
It's the best pokemon video game. I don't give a fuck if it's not Kanto, I actually get to sneak up and throw pokeballs metal gear solid style. There's no better pokemon experience.

[Anonymous No.9451776]

>>9451759
You never really got (You)s the multiple times you tried this one back in /vp/ so here's a pity (You).

[Anonymous No.9451791]

>>9451776
I appreciate it anon, I don't plan on going back to /vp/ anytime soon. So, you coming here to show fealty to gen 1 is very kind of you. A true unovachad acting so charitable and nice, truly fitting of the name.... Not. Go stick a wobuffet up your worn out unovagina, bitch

[Anonymous No.9451812]

>>9451791
>I appreciate it anon, I don't plan on going back to /vp/ anytime soon.
kek, I wouldn't either if I were you.

[Anonymous No.9451829]

>>9450015
No, Gen 2 is objectively the worst gen. It introduced some great new mechanics but the games themselves were dog shit.

[Anonymous No.9451843]

>>9451208
iirc though, isn't Crystal's selection of Pokemon jank?

[Anonymous No.9451850]

>>9451689
Who said anything about a team of level 70s? But you need at least two Pokemon in the 60s I'd say, which is not really going to happen playing organically.

[Anonymous No.9451853]

>>9451843
No, the complete opposite. It brings a number of johto pokemon that used to be tied to the postgame to the earlygame and has some kino ideas like zubat also being found outside of caves at night.

[Anonymous No.9451857]

gen won and gen poo

[Anonymous No.9451874]

>>9451474
To add to all that, prior to beating the e4
>no dark types so Psychic still OP even with Dark moves and Ghost being fixed
>only Steel option is Magnemite line

[Anonymous No.9451876]

>>9451857
fucking tragic selection

>b-but they are not meant to be a standalone roster just an addition to the rest!
>b-but there's nothing wrong with single stage mons!
all would be forgiven if the designs were actually good, alas they suck(for the most part) so there's no excuse

[Anonymous No.9451878]

>>9451857
Gen 1: Absolute kino, a true passion project with heart and soul poured into it
Gen 2: Lazy cash-in, Nintendo wanted more Pokemon games because the first ones sold well
There's the difference, and why Gen 1 is much more soulful than Gen 2.

[Anonymous No.9451881]

>>9451857
>"I see. Most Pokemon in Gold & Silver were of the cute variety, but this time…”
>Sugimori: “Indeed, there were a lot of kiddy designs, and some fans were starting to say Pokemon had become too babyish, so one theme for Ruby & Sapphire was returning to the coolness of monsters.
>“In your previous interview at the time of Gold & Silver (February 2000 issue), you said when you were designing Pokemon, you had to consider merchandising, and that created some constraints.”
>Sugimori: “Rather than constraints, I’d say we were careful about a lot of things. Like we’d say ‘if we don’t make a Pokemon this way, they’ll be difficult to animate in the TV show.’ We didn’t really think about those kinds of things this time, which might be bad for the anime staff and independent artists.”

>inb4 but muh tyranitar is complex!

[Anonymous No.9451884]

>>9451857
>>9451876
>>9451881
Go back to /vp/

[Anonymous No.9451886]

>>9451884
>go back to a board that hates Gen 1
No. /vr/ is our home.

[Anonymous No.9451895]

>>9451884
cope and seethe genpooer

[Anonymous No.9451958]

>>9451362
Insane cope, you are defending a legendary mega as an unavoidable gift and the removal of features.
Please go back to slurp their latest game.

[Anonymous No.9452019]

>>9450056
what game is this?

[Anonymous No.9452024]

>>9451690
sweep*

[Anonymous No.9452026]

>>9452019
Lufia: The Legend Returns on the GBC. Solid JRPG.

[Anonymous No.9452028]

>>9451524
don't know what that anon was smoking but the designs were cut from Gen 1 due to hardware limitations and crunch. It was a miracle Iwata and the team even made it possible to include another 100 in the follow up games, let alone fit two entire regions in what.. an 8mb cart?
Games that should have never been and yet were, and Crystal will forever be king

[Anonymous No.9452030]

>>9452026
Hell yeah brother
added another one to the list to look out for

[Anonymous No.9452034]

>>9451958
One good thing about the gift latias/latios is it saves you having to chase the stupid thing all over the region. Although giving it and its Mega stone right before the 6th gym is definitely pandering to kids and mega casuals.

[Anonymous No.9452076]

>>9452028
>two entire regions
A significantly downsized Kanto with all of the interesting buildings and dungeons removed is not an entire region.

[Anonymous No.9452084]

>>9450865
What rom hack fixes the level curve?

[Anonymous No.9452092]

>>9452076
did you forget the part where I said this was it fit on an 8mb cart or should I mention the file size was nearly 25% of that?

[Anonymous No.9452093]

>>9452092
>backpedaling
You said two entire regions, that's not even close to true.

[Anonymous No.9452095]

>>9452028
>due to hardware limitations and crunch
The latter, absolutely, but not the former. Both Gen I and Gen II have 256 Pokemon programmed within them. In Gen I, with only 151 actual Pokemon, the other 105 are the MissingNos, which do have some data - and there's more than enough space for the rest to be added. In Gen II, only four of these slots are dummies (251 + egg = 252). And of course, the new mons from Gen II were not cut Gen I designs - the cut Gen I mons were by and large not reintroduced (excepting Komala, which was not part of GSC but SMUSUM).
>It was a miracle Iwata and the team even made it possible to include another 100 in the follow up games, let alone fit two entire regions
Iwata's primary contributions were not memory optimization but making the game be able to decompress its files at a decent speed. His changes to their algorithms actually cost them space, though of course that's just the trade-off you have to make and not a mark against him.

[Anonymous No.9452216]

>>9452028
Everytime I read this shit I lose braincells. It's about time this meme dies.
Gen 1 had 190 pokemon, we know of all the 40 pokemon that were cut from, none made it to the final version of gen 2. Moreover we have access to several beta versions of gold and silver that show how they were actively heavily redesigning pokemon all the way through development. Now add to this Sugimori interviews which are the cherry on top.

Tyranitar can be argued to be an heavy redesign of the cut gen 1 pokemon Gyaoon but that's about it. Stop spewing false information like it's fact

>"I see. Most Pokemon in Gold & Silver were of the cute variety, but this time…”
>Sugimori: “Indeed, there were a lot of kiddy designs, and some fans were starting to say Pokemon had become too babyish, so one theme for Ruby & Sapphire was returning to the coolness of monsters.
>“In your previous interview at the time of Gold & Silver (February 2000 issue), you said when you were designing Pokemon, you had to consider merchandising, and that created some constraints.”
>Sugimori: “Rather than constraints, I’d say we were careful about a lot of things. Like we’d say ‘if we don’t make a Pokemon this way, they’ll be difficult to animate in the TV show.’ We didn’t really think about those kinds of things this time, which might be bad for the anime staff and independent artists.”

[Anonymous No.9452274]

>>9450353
>pokemon 2nd gen
>grind
kek

[Anonymous No.9452286]

>>9451895
>gen 2 is bad because it has a smaller version of kanto
You do know that's the entire map of gen1 vs less than half the map of gen 2?

[Anonymous No.9452310]

>>9452286
They really should have just used the extra space that was freed up to make Johto better. It could have had its own Safari Zone, some larger routes, another town or two with some actually-interesting plot stuff, a cool dungeon. The Johto we ended up getting just has a reputation in the fanbase as West Kanto because it's so bland.

[Anonymous No.9452320]

>>9451895
Gen 1 postgame: Unknown dungeon, Mewtwo.
Gen 2 postgame: Kanto region & gyms, Mt. Silver, Red, Lugia/Ho-Oh.
Here's a fair comparison.

[Anonymous No.9452332]

>10 years old, in the car at night, about to enter the kanto power plant in pokemon silver
>ready myself for a big grindfest
>...it's actually cozy wozy and super comf
>the nice scientists give me ZAP CANNON, WOAH AN ELECTRIC MOVE BETTER THAN THUNDER!!!
>i have no thunder types... oh wait togetic can learn it! finally he has a good move!
>the animation looks so cool
>i am happy :)

>20 years later
>retards fight over which game is better online for eternity like a down syndrome valhalla

[Anonymous No.9452341]

>>9450816
And then they failed magnificently with Celebi by making it a transferrable event only that ended up being in Japan only

[Anonymous No.9452350]

>>9451230
>It really needed to stop at gen II.
I was pissed at the GBA ones for not being able to transfer my hard work. I skipped it
Then came the DS ones and I WTF'd at it not being 3D. This massive franchise got out-ambition by Square with DQ Monsters, that sold infinitely less
Then the 3DS, pathetic
And then the new gens, which just looks like they're working with an unchanged 3DS engine and still working on 3DS scale. The games are as easy as ever, same story as ever, the overall story sucks, dialogue sucks, the game is still stuck in stiff GB like animations, the game throws everything at you and is easy as shit, it feels like it's ashamed to be a JRPG, once the game is done there's nothing to do, etc, etc, etc
I'm so fucking frustrated that the whole series is this fucking pathetic and people just keeps buying it. It's a terrible JRPG. The two first gens, supplemented by the Stadium games were truly where it's at. It's never been the same since

[Anonymous No.9452353]

>>9452332
more cute memories
>get to the first town after new bark
>see a pond with some headbutt trees north-east of the pokemon center, think the map will loop around at some point
>it doesn't
>talk to kids at school about said area
>"yeah i have a gameshark and i got over there and there are aipoms in the trees and totodiles in the water"
>woah that's cool, i'm gonna start again with chikorita so i can catch totodile at some point
>never do, meganium becomes best bro anyway

>listen to the lottery channel on the pokeradio every day in anticipation
>number never gets called

>mom buys me a snorlax plushie with my money
>haha the snorlax doll is big :)
>imagine snuggling on it

>friend tells me if you catch a hypno and get it to level 50 it learns super hypnosis, which makes it so you can catch any mon easily
>stupid hypno never learned it

>want steelix cos he big
>try to convince everyone at school to trade with me
>friend trades scyther for my onix, wtf is a scizor!?
>tempted to keep it but trade it back so i don't get bashed up, steelix looks cool anyway
>steelix is shit, why do his attacks not do much damage?

>bug catching contest
>spend hours looking for pink butterfree
>never find it, think i'm extremely unlucky

>surfing, spam kill everything i see
>wait was that seaking a different colour?

[Anonymous No.9452386]

>>9450015
I just played crystal and the level curve is legit shit, right off the bat the levels of trainers and wild pokemon are so fucking low and increase at a glacial pace. Then there is the big excuse of the path branching from ecruteak, where you spend many hours massacring level 20 jobbers. After that it gets better, right? Well, no. The levels still grow at a pathetic rate. The pokemon selection is, as we know, shit. There are no good TMs. The TMs of RBY are often memed as "so shit! so weird!" but the ones in GSC are just useless and you won't get anything interesting until kanto or so. You don't casually get Psychic for free relatively early, you can't scam Rock Slide and Ice Beam off a little girl. No fun allowed.

Kanto is super shit. It's sad. It's like a dying mall, visited late in the evening when everything is closing down. You can feel the desperation. It's not enough that every point of interest is closed down, the routes are butchered too as is the music variety. It takes like 6 hours to do everything of interest in Kanto, like swatting down the jobber trainers and the jobber gym leaders who have completely given up on increasing their levels. You beat these level 40 losers, Blue is like 50, then Red is suddenly like 75. Very "fun", even if the sudden level inflation is likely there to compensate for the lack of DVs and stat exp on enemies ( i might be wrong). Still, they're all brainless single battles so you can just cheese any boss with the brainless "unga bunga me switch to counter, then spam X items and sweep" '''strategy'''.

The worst thing is that it feels defanged. The stupid bugs and glitches in RB are fixed but that's what gave it soul. Badge boosts were bugged, many moves were bugged, cinnabar surfing was there. Odd mechanics like crit rate. But they were soulful. GSC feels modern, but without the really interesting later additions like abilities and better battle formats, so it just feels like a 'no fun allowed' version of RB.

[Anonymous No.9452390]

>>9452386
Also, the phone is annoying. It's not fun at all to have the game interrupted by inane NPC gibbering or to look up guides online to help decide which dumbshit NPC's number you should keep, since space is limited and some of them give rare items you need like a water stone. Inventory space juggling feels worse than in RB even though things like TMs don't take space in the main pocket anymore - because you have trash like apricorns and "+1% damage to this type" hold items gobbling up space. Berries too, with inconsistent names like 'PRZCUREBERRY' and 'MINTBERRY'. The HMs piss me off too, fuck off whoever thought it was fine to add 2 more water HMs when they're both worse than Surf.

[Anonymous No.9452405]

>>9452386
>The worst thing is that it feels defanged. The stupid bugs and glitches in RB are fixed but that's what gave it soul. Badge boosts were bugged, many moves were bugged, cinnabar surfing was there. Odd mechanics like crit rate. But they were soulful.
Seemed fairly convincing up until this part. Do better next time.

[Anonymous No.9452621]

>>9451843
Everyone cries "no ampharos" but having phanpy and teddiursa prior to the first gym amongst other revised encounters more than make up for it. Thunderpunch typholosion /ice punch feraligatr makes ampharos irrelevant anyways

[Anonymous No.9452646]

>>9452286
you're looking at quantity over quality, the criticism isn't that it's small, it's that it's extremely gimped to the point you're dictating the lore of the world purely out of logistical development reasons: "oops the safari zone closed down", "oops the volcano conveniently erupted and destroyed the town" "oops all the graves of the pokemon tower were moved inside a little house and you're not allowed to go up the new radio tower"... it's blatantly contrived and just overall low quality content.

>>9452320
postgame is a meme, the games are enough of a time sink, no need to keep up after the story ran its course and the pacing loses all its steam, at that point it's just meaningless skinner boxes

[Anonymous No.9452673]

>>9451238
>I'd say FireRed and LeafGreen were worth it, though
i dont know how anyone thinks this ever, the music is completely terrible. i can't get over that

[Anonymous No.9452707]

>>9452673
I take a lot of issue with the graphics too. They took the entire region and filled it up with trees without taking into account the nuances of each location. Every fucking city and route is encircled by a forest when the whole point is that it's urban region and the loss of the natural world was a big theme in the original game. Hell, even in Viridian Forest one major sprite originally used there throughout was of a cut down tree stump, in the remakes they said fuck it and made the place as lush as it could be.

[Anonymous No.9452712]

>>9451719
It's not medieval, it's set in a meiji restoration analogue, that's why you have a western style building in the middle of jubilife. And game is set around sinnoh while it was barely populated.

Pokemon Conquest is medieval, but it's actual medieval Japan with real historical figures alongside pokemon...it's probably not meant to be in the same continuity

[Anonymous No.9452720]

>>9452707
>the loss of the natural world was a big theme in the original game
you've been smoking weed while playing

[Anonymous No.9452792]

>>9452720
Or maybe you weren't paying attention

[Anonymous No.9452804]

My g2 squad. Growlithe wasn't even high enough to evolve yet.

[Anonymous No.9452805]

>>9452707
They now have to make the aesthetic match the anime where countless filler episodes have Ash's gang getting lost in lush forests and having adventures.

[Anonymous No.9452849]

>>9451193
Zoomers just hate gen 2 because some e celeb told them it was bad. They have never actually played the games

[Anonymous No.9452856]

>>9452849
I thought I didn't like it because completing the dex requires a strategy guide, because the pokedex ingame is useless and you can't even see many of the new pokemon used ingame to check anyways. Thanks for clearing it up.

[Anonymous No.9452863]

>>9452804
So, no friends or using an emulator?

[Anonymous No.9452917]

>>9452646
>postgame is a meme, the games are enough of a time sink, no need to keep up after the story ran its course and the pacing loses all its steam, at that point it's just meaningless skinner boxes
THANK YOU

[Anonymous No.9452960]

>>9451958
>removal of features
they didn't remove 'SHITTY THING YOU LIKE'
they added other stuff and not 'SHITTY THING YOU LIKE'

[Anonymous No.9452980]

>>9450540

Lufia: The Legend Returns

[Anonymous No.9453023]

>>9451812
>""""Realistic"""" = good
Must be hard looking in the mirror if that's the case, you goofy looking troon

[Anonymous No.9453052]

>>9452804
>Growlithe wasn't even high enough to evolve yet.
Fire Stone bro...?

[Anonymous No.9453093]

>>9453052
Growlithe learns flamethrower at level 50

[Anonymous No.9453116]

I tried Pokémon back when it first came out and got so bored with how easy it was. I have just never seen the appeal of such simple RPGs.

[Anonymous No.9453126]

>>9453116
The selling point is the creatures themselves you don't get to pick from 150 cool characters full of charisma in other rpgs

[Anonymous No.9453143]

the battery for saving goes fast. had to replace mine recently

[Anonymous No.9453186]

>>9453143
How many times did you need to replace it (assuming you've owned yours for 20 years)?
I lost my Gen 1 and 2 games in a fire back in 2005 and never bothered replacing them or play any of the gen 3+ games.

[Anonymous No.9453363]

>>9453186
Maybe 15 years or so? you can buy saved battery replaced games off eBay but they do tend to command a premium due to the work involved

[Anonymous No.9453364]

>>9452310
No extra space was ever freed up.

[Anonymous No.9453390]

Johto kinda rhymes with scrotum

[Anonymous No.9453391]

>>9452621
Do people really care about ampharos? Back during pokemania the only ones who would even use mareep were girls, and everyone thought ampharos looked too dumb to want to use.

[Anonymous No.9453394]

>>9453391
I though ampharos was cool as fuck and I'm definitely male (male)

[Anonymous No.9453407]

>>9453394
Then you weren’t around for pokemania. Ampharos is a daft-looking thing that evolves from a girly sheep.

[Anonymous No.9453489]

>>9451812
I really really like Gen 5

[Anonymous No.9453491]

>>9453407
You sound insufferable

[Anonymous No.9453498]

It's new for me people hate Gen 2

[Anonymous No.9453505]

>>9453489
Gen 5 is pure kino.

[Anonymous No.9453512]

>>9453498
what's new is everyone seemingly hating gen2 due to the level curve. but with it, it's the only pokemon game that demands you apply strategy to deal with opponent's higher levels

[Anonymous No.9453519]

>>9453491
The world still had firm gender roles back then, it's not like today. No young lad wanted to use a girly pokemon unless they were a poof, simple as.

[Anonymous No.9453525]

>>9453498
>>9453512
The average pokemon fan posting on 4chan right now grew up with Gen 4 or 5. Gen 2 looks quaint at best by comparison, and missing a lot of quality of life improvements that they're used to. Maybe when you were a kid, you looked at old Atari games and thought they were fossils. That's how they view the games Gen X and Millennials played as children.

[Anonymous No.9453528]

>>9453407
I'm probably old enough to be your dad son

[Anonymous No.9453532]

>>9453525
that seems a bit too much of a stretch. it's more like someone who grew up with xbox and gamecube looking back at NES and Genesis and thinking it looks bad.

[Anonymous No.9453536]

>>9453525
Not them but I was too young to realize how old the Atari 2600 was when my dad got it in '93.
It didn't last very long. We ended up with an N64 as its replacement.

[Anonymous No.9453838]

>>9453528
Okay boomer

[Anonymous No.9453843]

>>9453519
t. got his ass handed to him by the kid that mained jigglypuff in melee
It's okay, anon, we won't talk about your bitter tears.

[Anonymous No.9453870]

>>9453525
I was born in '89 and experienced the cusp of retro gaming to modern gaming pretty much spanning the SNES/Genesis - PS2/Xbox as a "youth", so I admittedly just have a better and more well adjusted insight when it comes to gaming specifically than people born later, but regardless of that advantage...I knew something wasn't better specifically just because it was newer. When I saw Star Wars Episode 1 in theaters I knew it was crap and missing something despite having modern effects and flashier action.

[Anonymous No.9453891]

>>9453843
I wasn't friends with homosexuals, so I wouldn't have even been in a position to have that experience. Sorry mate.

[Anonymous No.9453905]

>>9452960
>Still trying to defend oras, the first games that directly insulted the players
Yes, yes I want my shitty thing, and this way of doing things is exactly what I was talking about.
No one can agree anymore on what is a good pokemon game.
Apologists like you will gladly eat any shit gf forces down your throat, and that is the only way to be a modern pokemon """fan""".

[Anonymous No.9453921]

>>9453905
if you feel insulted, then you deserve it. fuck battle frontier and anyone who misses that shit.
i will take a much more pleasant game to replay instead (ORAS) thank you very much.

[Anonymous No.9454023]

>>9453838
yes

[Anonymous No.9454025]

>>9453519
I see cute baby lamb poke I pet. Simple as. Electric type too? Holy SHIT
Any questions?

[Anonymous No.9454047]

>>9454025
yaaas smash that toxic masculinity

[Anonymous No.9454091]

that other anon was right, you do sound insufferable

[Anonymous No.9454148]

>>9454091
shut up homo

[Anonymous No.9454156]

>>9454091
Liking cutesey animal creatures that Gamefreak designed for girls does in fact make you a fag. I don't care that Jews have convinced you otherwise by subverting gender roles and expectations.

[Anonymous No.9454427]

>>9450521
This is a really retarded list of complaints to be quite frank with you.

[Anonymous No.9454432]

>>9454156
Projecting and pathetic, go say that to a woman and see the look of confused disgust on her face, loser.

[Anonymous No.9454474]

>>9453891
Whatever cope keeps you sleeping at night

[Anonymous No.9454681]

>>9453921
Why are you even here faggot?
I hope you are baiting because preferring oras to emerald should be considered a crime.
Go back to your annual shovelware, retrogaming clearly is not for you.

[Anonymous No.9454875]

>>9452341
There were tons of Celebi events throughout gen 2, just like with Mew in gen 1. For some reason newfags have this absurd idea that Celebi was never given out anywhere until Crystal's online event for the GS Ball, but it was given out multiple times before Crystal was even announced.

[Anonymous No.9454891]

>>9454875
There were a total of 5 Celebi events during gen 2.
>Nintendo Spaceworld 2000 (August 2000)
>Raffle contests in the 9 age-specific Shogakukan magazines (Kindergartener, Preschooler, First Grader, Second Grader, etc) (October 2000)
>World Hobby Fair Winter 2001 (January 2001)
>online distribution of the GS Ball in Crystal (April and May 2001)
>rerun of the GS Ball event in Crystal (August 2001)

It was about as available as Mew was. Gen 3 is when they started making mythical Pokemon actual events rather than "this secret Pokemon you can't catch in the game".

[Anonymous No.9454901]

>>9454875
>>9454891
Yeah, "tons", and of course, none even remotely close to you
https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/List_of_PCNY_event_Pok%C3%A9mon_distributions_(Generation_II)
Also IIRC, the actual event was never distributed in the west, and even if they did, you probably couldn't attend
They should have made it a freaking button code or complicated sequence that releases later

[Anonymous No.9454907]

>>9454901
The game was not made with the west in mind. It's not Game Freak's fault Nintendo of America didn't work with a big children's magazine distributor to run contests where the winners got to send in their carts and get them back with a Mew/Celebi on them.

[Anonymous No.9454995]

>>9454875

it was all in fucking america or japan. how is a fucking 8 year old going to fly around the world just to get a celebi? fucking die

[Anonymous No.9455038]

>>9452804
>My g2 squad
>only 2 g2 Pokemon
lol

[Anonymous No.9455078]

>>9451238
FR/LG are trash purely because they introduced EVs. EVs are cancer. DVs were a much better system and encouraged actually raising your Pokémon. EVs are a "Gotcha! Your best friend is permanently shit cause you didn't know that by grinding those Sandshrew, you increased his Attack stat when he has shit attack and shittier attack moves and there's no way to undo it! Fuck you!"

[Anonymous No.9455098]

>>9451385
>>9451450
Not him, but that other anon is 100% right. The original games, probably due to the hardware limitations, have a much more impactful sound and melody that stands out more. The newer ones sound incredibly messy, like there's a lot more unneeded instrumentation there that just gets in the way of the actual sound that its trying to produce. I think the George Lucas comparison is actually really apt.

[Anonymous No.9455196]

>>9455078
>and there's no way to undo it
There is, though. Starting with Emerald (which you can trade back and forth with FRLG with) the games have had items that reduce EVs, letting you get rid of bad ones and grind up good ones to replace them.

[Anonymous No.9455197]

>>9454995
>>9454907

[Anonymous No.9455206]

>>9451750
You could just legit level that complaint at all of the Pokémon games to be quite honest with you. Gen 1 is only difficult in the slightest is you pick Charmander, and 90% of what you find up until Safari zone are Geodudes, Zubats, and Pidgey. Gen 3 have literally 2 trainers in the entire game that have grass typing that you actually have to face. Gen 4, you cannot find a single fire type other than the fire starter and Ponyta until the post end-game Gen 5 is shit and their faults are extremely obvious. Gen 6 would have been a return to form if they had just increased the level on trainer's Pokémon and reduced the XP you got. Gen 7 was bleh. And Gen 8 is like Gen 6 but worse.

Generically saying shit like "oh you get bad choices for your monsters" on just one gen is being purposefully retarded.

[Anonymous No.9455285]

>>9451876
>>b-but they are not meant to be a standalone roster just an addition to the rest!
>>b-but there's nothing wrong with single stage mons!
Calling out your own fatal flaws in advance doesn't make them less fatally flawed. They are still meant to be an addition to the rest, and there is nothing wrong with single stage mons. Cope.

[Anonymous No.9455343]

>>9452332
>>9452353
I don't know why, but I have this memory of me at like, 9-10 years old. We had just gone to wal mart and picked up Pokémon Gold for me. It was very dark outside, and we were in the drive through for McDonalds. I was in the back of the family van on my GBC, using the little tiny light extension thing to see. I remember being amazed at the new music, how good the coloring was compared to Yellow/my Super GameBoy, and thinking about how cool my Chikorita was going to look on Pokémon Stadium 2 whenever it would come out.

There's really nothing interesting about that moment, but somehow when I was a child, I knew I was going to remember that moment forever. It's the moment I think of when I think about comfy feelings that I'll never be able to recreate no matter how hard I try.

[Anonymous No.9455385]

>>9455285
I literally responded in advance because I anticipated those retarded arguments. Qwilfish & friends are still be terrrible even if you put them in a fully fledged roster

[Anonymous No.9455398]

>>9455385
>I literally responded in advance because I anticipated those retarded arguments.
You anticipated them because you realized they were the greatest flaws of your argument, and then tried to poison the well by addressing them first, like a child calling out playground rules. Like I said, calling them out in advance does not nullify them, and you did an excellent job of highlighting why your opinions are worthless and invalid.

[Anonymous No.9455427]

>>9455398
Yes you sure told me, Delibird is most definitely a great addition to the franchise, who doesn't want a bird shitmon stylized like Santa Claws as a pokemon

It doesn't matter if they are meant to be additions, it doesn't matter that they are single stage pokemon because at the end of the day bad designs are bad designs

[Anonymous No.9455479]

>>9455427
Jynx completely invalidates whatever shit you're talking about Delibird, and you're still incorrect. Continue to be worthless.

[Anonymous No.9455526]

>>9455479
>This thing bad which means moving forward you have permission to do more bad things
Lmao keep seething. The fact of the matter is that the art director as referred to the gen 2 designs as mostly cute and babyish and admitted they were thinking of making it easy for the show animators and merch producers when creating them . The fact of the matter is that most are extremely forgettable. The fact of the matter is that they will NEVER be considered part of the originals so stop trying to lump them together. Even the excuse that they are gen 1 leftovers has long been disproved. COPE

I dare anyone else in the thread, not (you) because you're gonna cheat anyway, to do this challenge to really put into perspective how unmemorable they truly are
https://www.sporcle.com/games/g/pokemongen2

[Anonymous No.9455582]

>>9451850
No you don't

[Anonymous No.9455613]

>>9455526
>The fact of the matter is that the art director as referred to the gen 2 designs as mostly cute and babyish and admitted they were thinking of making it easy for the show animators and merch producers when creating them
Correct. This does not dictate whether or not the designs were bad though. Fact.
>The fact of the matter is that most are extremely forgettable
Incorrect.
>The fact of the matter is that they will NEVER be considered part of the originals so stop trying to lump them together.
>Even the excuse that they are gen 1 leftovers has long been disproved.
This was never in contention in this discussion. Only that they were meant as an addition to the additional Pokémon that already existed, not as a replacement. Anything else you're trying to derive out of your pitiful headcanon is pure copium on your part.

Gen 2's designs were great and additive. There is literally nothing wrong about stand-alone monsters. These are irrefutable facts. Please kill yourself immediately for having worthless opinions and shitting up the internet with them.

[Anonymous No.9455656]

>>9455206
>Gen 1 is only difficult in the slightest is you pick Charmander, and 90% of what you find up until Safari zone are Geodudes, Zubats, and Pidgey.
That's funny, cause I'm playing POKEMON BLUE VERSION right now and I already picked up a Pikachu, Nidoran, and Spearow all before the first gym leader

[Anonymous No.9455676]

>>9455656
>Spearow
Surprised you also didn't take the other low hanging fruit of Weedle and Caterpie. Maybe even a Metapod or Rattata to boot?

[Anonymous No.9455687]

>>9455479
Jynx was actually one of the most relevant mons with a killer signature move when she was introduced. Delibird is a gimmick shitmon with a shit gimmick signature move. Literally exists to be a meme.

[Anonymous No.9455703]

>>9455687
>one of the most relevant mons with a killer signature move when she was introduced.
lolwut? That bitch was trash and shows up in PU lists all over.

[Anonymous No.9455706]

>>9455703
Not in RBY where she exclusively had the best non-Spore sleep move.

[Anonymous No.9455707]

>>9455656
>blue
>not kaizo blue

[Anonymous No.9455708]

>>9455706
Literally just looked up a tier list for RBY/Gen 1, and she shows up in PU, dumbass.

[Anonymous No.9455714]

>>9455708
No you didn't.
https://www.smogon.com/dex/rb/pokemon/jynx/
>OU

[Anonymous No.9455730]

>>9455714
Try something more recent:
https://tiermaker.com/categories/pokemon/pokemon-tiers-credit-smogon-532716
Jynx is shit and always has been shit.

[Anonymous No.9455735]

>>9455730
>Uber
>Charizard
I'm going to stop responding to you now.

[Anonymous No.9455737]

>>9455735
>Can't graciously admit defeat.
Okay. Bye.

[Anonymous No.9455795]

>>9455730
Bruh this list has Squirtle and Mewtwo in the same tier - a tier which, despite Mewtwo's overwhelming superiority over virtually every Pokemon, is not Uber. It's clearly a popularity contest, not a reflection of actual battle usage.

[Anonymous No.9455829]

>>9455582
Yeah you do. Pikachu is, at minimum, 2HKOing pretty much anything you send out.

[Anonymous No.9455909]

>>9455829
>send out ground type

[Anonymous No.9455938]

>>9455909
>Surf, thanks for the free kills bro

[Anonymous No.9455965]

>>9455938
>he actually beat all of Stadium, transferred a Yellow version Pikachu to it, then transferred that same Pikachu to GS
Kill yourself.

[Anonymous No.9455971]

>>9455938
Red's Pikachu doesn't know Surf.

[Anonymous No.9456105]

>>9455965
It's worth it for the surfing sprite

[Anonymous No.9456138]

>>9451689
You're full of shit

[Anonymous No.9456142]

>>9456138
Pikachu is actually the easiest mon to set up on because ground types wall it entirely. Just don't tell the retard above because his entire world might implode.

[Anonymous No.9456442]

>>9455965
this is where we are now. the whole EXPERIENCE of gen 2 is unpalatable to gamers, somehow

[Anonymous No.9456448]

>>9456142
Doesn't the Trainer AI switch Pokemon if it is completely unable to damage you? Pikachu at least has a Normal-type attack, I assume.

[Anonymous No.9456450]

>>9456142
You can't kill Pokemon 20 levels higher than you, type advantages be damned

[Anonymous No.9456461]

>>9456448
No.
>>9456450
You are braindead.

[Anonymous No.9456576]

You know, there is no harm admitting you never played nor understood gen I&II.
You would definitely seem less retarded.

[Anonymous No.9456704]

>>9456105
Yeah it is, still seems like a slept on secret.

The mimic ditto for breeding, or the 1 in 128 ditto you can catch in the shiny family outside of Goldenrod lets you easily breed a shiny Pikachu to send back to RBY and beat Stadium with to teach it surf. Sprite also appears blue for the gal in Crystal.

[Anonymous No.9457054]

>>9455938
This is his Pikachu's moveset you disingenuous fuckass, doesnt even have light ball

If you really wanted to absolutely fuck Red at nearly ANY level you could easily set up on this thing with a Rhydon and spam x speed and attacks on it and OHKO his whole team without even having to use any potions, i bet you could literally do it with a wild Rhydon freshly caught in Victory Road in Crystal assuming you gave it EQ and Rock Slide

[Anonymous No.9457106]

>>9457054
Oh I didn’t read the thread. I typed that just to feel smart.
Worked too : D

[Anonymous No.9457125]

>>9457106
You feel smart after that? Id feel retarded in your position.

[Anonymous No.9457150]

>>9455730
Bait or actually retarded

[Anonymous No.9457190]

>>9457054
>dude you can kill a team of level 70 pokemon including water and grass types with a level 30 rhydon
You're full of shit

[Anonymous No.9457196]

>>9457125
I'm sure considering what you've posted so far, you'd feel retarded in any position if you had a thing called self-awareness.

[Anonymous No.9458101]

>>9451812
Poliwrath still looks like a cool cartoon monster regardless of the "realism", Seismitoad looks like it has an STD...nobody would want one on their team. That's the problem with many modern Pokemon designs, they're just not wantable.

[Anonymous No.9458117]

>>9457054
If it's that easy, why don't speedrunners do it? They go in with level 60s AND need setup

[Anonymous No.9458478]

>>9450865
Idk brother Set Mode still makes difficulty hacks decently interesting. Shift turns even the hardest hacks into trivial experiences.

[Anonymous No.9458521]

>>9451490
Gen 2 is the only game designed as a direct follow-up. It's kind of interesting but retroactively the game's choices seem confusing. They wanted to gate new Pokemon as something to show off to friends. Tyranitar in particular was supposed to be this ultra rare super monster you used to dunk on your pals. GameFreak wouldn't even do something as retardedly frustrating as the Safari Zone these days. No point in a Pokemon being that rare or hard to catch when breeding mechanics exist alongside online functionality.

Red was also supposed to be the game's super boss, so I don't think they wanted players to be at his level. However that means that there's no good means of grinding up higher to fight your friends. All just a result of Pokemon not really being as refined of a brand at the time, and the games just wanting to be a monster collectathon where you fight your friends a couple of times and call it a day.

[Anonymous No.9458560]

>>9455656
>>9455676
>>9455206
The anon currently playing the game is correct. What exactly is this perception of Gen 1's catchable crop being poorly implemented? Before Safari Zone, you have access to Nidoking, Fearow, Dugtrio, Hypno, Primeape, Raichu, Victreebel, Clefable, Persian, and motherfucking Dodrio. All very easy to get a lot of mileage out of. Other Pokemon that are useable but demand some babying are Gyarados, Sandslash, Kadabra, Haunter, Arcanine, Nintetails, Poliwrath, Machoke, and Graveler. All this on top of the Eevee evolutions, Snorlax, Lapras, Mr. Mime, and Jynx. You can even run off and get Hitmonlee. All before Safari Zone. Raticate is also extremely underrated for the early to mid game. The notable shitmons are Pidgeot, Parasect, Arbok, and Wigglytuff.

Gen 1's lineup of useable Pokemon is both quite strong and decently balanced so as to not heavily favor a certain group for more optimal play. At least not before you really break things down. That's not even something later generations can boast. Anybody barely thinking about their team comp at all will immediately recognize that the desert Pokemon in Gen 5 completely eclipse what you can catch before and after that area in terms of ease of use.

[Anonymous No.9458569]

>>9451812
If you have to use "and" three times when describing a Pokemon then it's probably not as a simplistic as you're making it out to be. What a poor attempt at trying to own the original image. You don't even include starters or early game mons (the most visible designs) because you know you'd have no ground to stand on.

[Anonymous No.9458619]

>>9458560
>Before Safari Zone, you have access to Nidoking, Fearow, Dugtrio, Hypno, Primeape, Raichu, Victreebel, Clefable, Persian, and motherfucking Dodrio. All very easy to get a lot of mileage out of.
"Have access to" is not quite the same as "having good spread." Yeah, you CAN get a Drowzee, and he's not THAT far out of the way. Just go down a path, cut, then go into the grass for about 10 minutes. The problem is that you still have to do that when you're probably already loaded on the Pokémon from multiple areas of the main route, which are indeed Zubats, Geodudes, Weedles, Spearows, Pidgeys, Bug Types, and if you're lucky, you caught a Diglet and a Meowth/Growlith. Maybe a Gyarados if you took the Magikarp they dumped on you. The perception still comes from that simple fact that this is 90% of what they throw at you, and some of the mons you mentioned above like Pikachu and Clefairy have really rare appearance rates in their chosen areas.

Is this way better than some of the later gens? Oh absolutely. Gen 4 literally having NO fire Pokémon whatsoever until post-elite 4 is unforgivable. Is Gen 1 THAT great? No. You're making it sound like the game serves up all these different types to you on a platter, when the reality is that you probably aren't even going to know they're there without going out of your way for them or using a strategy guide.

[Anonymous No.9458817]

>>9458560
I remember using Raticate on my first team. Super Fang and Hyper Fang are both really good moves for general single player purposes.

[Anonymous No.9458838]

>>9458117
Because speedrunners basically solo the game with Raikou who is already past level 60 by the time they beat E4

[Anonymous No.9459007]

>>9455343
I don't have any (fond) memories of getting the game, like yours. I think I've gotten Silver for either my 11th birthday or the following Christmas. I only know I ompleted the story and had Mewtwo in my roster. The game, among some other favorite Game Boy games, got destroyed in a fire, in 2005.

[Anonymous No.9459404]

>>9458569
Uoooooohhh I'm cherrrrrrryyyyy pickiiiiiiiiiiiing!!!!!

[Anonymous No.9459979]

>>9459404
How's it cherrypicking to analyze the most common and visible mons? Especially the starters, who're meant to represent the entire generation.

[Anonymous No.9460193]

>>9451874
To add to this
>still no good bug moves for all the Kanto insects
Why even bother hiding cool bugs in the safari if they’re gonna be useless!?

[Anonymous No.9460201]

>>9459979
Imo you need to analyze more than just 20 pokemon to make this conclusion. I agree with their conclusion and was thinking about this the other day. New pokemon maybe like 10 to 20 percent of pokemon designs are really good, prior to gen 4 it was more like half of them are great. These conclusions lead to the conclusion that all nu pokemon designs are shit which is not true

[Anonymous No.9460204]

>>9460201
Just realized in that post I said conclusion like 6 times baka

[Anonymous No.9460227]

>>9460204
Good that the wordfilter caught you. Pokemon fans are so retarded.

[Anonymous No.9460263]

>>9460201
That's fair but on the other hand, I don't think anyone really believes that literally every single nu-gen design is bad, that's just 4chan hyperbole. People are talking about overall trends. When talking about a game with so many monsters you have to use a small diverse sample because no one is gonna read a series of images reviewing every single mon

[Anonymous No.9460281]

>>9460263
That all being said I'd be impressed if you could come up with 15 Gen 9 mons that look realistic or as detailed as Volcarona. Seems like they're going for more flat, simplified cartoony designs because they're easier to model

[Anonymous No.9460960]

Should I replace Quick Attack on Pikachu with Swift?

Pikachu knows Thunderbolt, Thunderwave, Quick Attack, and Mega Punch.

[Anonymous No.9460978]

>>9460960
They're both not-overly-powerful utility moves. Quick Attack has 40 power and always goes first, which you can use to fuck over faster opponents, while Swift has 60 power and always hits the opponent no matter what. Neither should be your primary attack move.

Swift is probably more useful in single player desu.

[Anonymous No.9460981]

>>9460960
They're both not-overly-powerful utility moves. Quick Attack has 40 power and always goes first, which you can use to fuck over faster opponents, while Swift has 60 power and always hits the opponent no matter what, which you can use to fuck over opponents with accuracy debuffs/evade buffs. In gen 1 it would also hit opponents that used Fly or Dig. Neither should be your primary attack move.

Swift is probably more useful in single player desu.

[Anonymous No.9460983]

>>9450056
I tried getting into this game right after Lufia 2 but I couldn't get into it at all. It felt like a step down.

[Anonymous No.9461059]

>>9458619
So you’re saying go exploring in the exploring game!?

[Anonymous No.9461434]

>>9451230
Then you bring all that here and shit up vr. Go take back your 3rd world containment board instead. You pokefags are all cancer, but Yellow was the best version of the best gen so at least you're cancer with taste

[Anonymous No.9461581]

>>9461434
Well thanks I guess.
You are right anyway, this series is cancerous, but I don't feel sorry to bring this discussion to /vr/, even for just this time.
Pokefags need to be exposed and humiliated for being almost all pathetic apologists.

[Anonymous No.9461714]

>>9461059
Pokémon is a generic Monster JRPG, and I would describe 0 of them as "exploration" games. Similar to how I don't call Mario a romance game because hes' trying to save a princess.

[Anonymous No.9461716]

>>9460960
Also seconding the other anon. Quick Attack for competitive PvP, Swift for PVE or for your shitty ass friend with no honor.

[Anonymous No.9461717]

Pokemon silver pretty much taught me how to read.
>Mommy what the word does leer mean?

[Anonymous No.9461743]

>>9461714
Hunting for Pokemon is still part of the fun. Some Pokemon are more rare than others, it's done on purpose. Of course, it's still piss easy since these are games for kids...but if you can't be assed to spend a little extra time looking for a Pikachu amongst the Weedles and Caterpies you don't deserve a Pikachu

As a kid, you didn't play these games speedrunning, you took your time and explored every new environment if you were smart, trying to uncover what new Pokemon might be lurking, you checked out different paths to see if there would be new ones or not, etc, that was part of the fun.

[Chud Anon No.9461770]

>>9451484
>>9451776
I never went to /vp/ faggot, I remember it was literally made as a containment board to keep you “people” off of /v/.

You are literally a containment board for pedos and furries and kanto/johto chads mog you.

[Anonymous No.9462042]

>>9461717
I bet she leered at you

[Anonymous No.9462342]

>>9461770
Johto is nu-pokemon shit, it's when they made pokemon all round and cutesy-looking and gave legendaries magic powers, it's soulless and nothing like Gen 1

[Anonymous No.9462486]

>>9461770
/vp/ was made because /v/ was 50% Pokemon threads at the time, not because of some "everyone that likes this thing need to be contained" sentiment. There's never been any rule against posting about Pokemon outside /vp/ the way there has for ponies outside /mlp/.

[Anonymous No.9463293]

>>9462486
it's ironic because the pokemon fanbase is way more unbearable and toxic

[Anonymous No.9463342]

>>9451462
Crystal unironically really improved the phone system compared to Gold and Silver, and making more evolution stones available is one aspect of that.

[Anonymous No.9463363]

>>9452095
Gen 1 actually had 190 Pokemon programmed, meaning there were only 39 Missingnos.

[Anonymous No.9463763]

>>9461743
>.but if you can't be assed to spend a little extra time looking for a Pikachu amongst the Weedles and Caterpies you don't deserve a Pikachu
While this might work for things like Drowzee which are common finds off the beaten path, that doesn't work for a lot of the better, more rare ones like Pikachu that are in common areas with an insanely low rate. You're not going to know about those unless
1. You encounter it, want it, and check the Pokédex for its habitat.
2. Get a good roll for it, then hunt the area.
3. Read the guide.

>As a kid, you didn't play these games speedrunning
Exactly. You played them casually and didn't know to beeline for specific areas and hunt in the grass for specific mons. You just went.

Either way, still not exploration.

[Anonymous No.9463772]

>>9463763
>You're not going to know about those unless
>1. You encounter it, want it, and check the Pokédex for its habitat.

If you don't check the fucking Pokedex to see where you can catch the Pokemon you don't have, you obviously don't care about having them in the first place.
Pikachu was a shitty example too considering the third gym leader has one, and he's located right next to the shortcut back to the spot where you can catch Pikachu.

[Anonymous No.9463783]

>>9463772
>If you don't check the fucking Pokedex to see where you can catch the Pokemon you don't have
No, it means I don't have autism. I've never once checked the Pokédex for Electrobuzz because I simply didn't want nor cared about one. Drawing anything out of this is unironic autism since you're failing to understand the normie perspective of "I'm not going to needlessly stop my game to catch something just because I haven't caught it before."

[Anonymous No.9463891]

>>9450056
>THIS is what I would call frue destruction!

[Anonymous No.9464272]

>>9463783
ok zoomer

[Anonymous No.9464540]

>>9458521
>Gen 2 is the only game designed as a direct follow-up.
I see you forgot about Black 2 and White 2. An easy mistake. At the time of B2W2, no brains journalists were calling them the first direct follow-up and ignoring GSC.

[Anonymous No.9464724]

For a thread about a kids' game with a positive OP tone it sure has attracted some salty manchildren.

[Anonymous No.9464815]

>>9464724
sounds like the average pokemon discussion to me, why do you think this stea masset flip sells millions?, fanbase are rabid fanatical manchildren after all

[Anonymous No.9466684]

>>9463763
>like Pikachu that are in common areas with an insanely low rate. You're not going to know about those unless
>1. You encounter it, want it, and check the Pokédex for its habitat.
>2. Get a good roll for it, then hunt the area.
>3. Read the guide.
Yeah sorry I don't see the problem here, you're just bitching because some Pokemon are more rare than other ones. Pokemon is already a baby game and you can't even handle that.

[Anonymous No.9466752]

>>9466684
No, the complaint is "The spread actually isn't that good." If you're going to join a conversation, you should actually read it so we don't have to baby you with points we're already discussing.

[Anonymous No.9466762]

>>9466752
>the spread isn't that good because i never took the time to find out which pokemon live where in the game and missed out on the rare ones
It's a personal problem, I had no problem getting Pikachu or any rare Pokemon as a child

[Anonymous No.9466770]

>>9466762
Probably cause you read a strategy guide, got a good roll and confused this for good gameplay on your part, or you encountered Lt. Surge/a trainer with one, looked at your Pokédex for habitat, then grinded.

Thanks for bringing us back to the beginning of the conversation like a total scrub.

[Anonymous No.9466774]

>>9466770
If you didn't spend time in each new area looking for new Pokemon while training your current ones, you weren't playing the game right. Your whole argument, to be honest, reeks of someone who didn't actually play the game as a kid but as an adult speeding through it

[Anonymous No.9466804]

>>9466774
>you weren't playing the game right.
True Scotsman fallacy.

[Anonymous No.9469105]

>>9464724
lol

[Anonymous No.9470948]

>>9451462
try shin megami tensei 4 if you want a truly unbound national dex

[Anonymous No.9471392]

>>9466770
>or you encountered Lt. Surge/a trainer with one, looked at your Pokédex for habitat, then grinded

The game instructs you to do this throug the rival and can't be missed, most Pokemon can be encountered in trainer battles (dratini, fossils and legendary the only missing), you get the shortcut to return to Viridian forest after LT. Surge.
How much spoonfeed do you need?

[Anonymous No.9471820]

>>9450015
>level curve
what level curve?

>>9450521
I think 2 gives a different sense of adventure. 1 feels more mysterious by 2 is more immersive due to the night, the ruins area and the route its on in particular I remember returning to several times and loving. However I do think it makes Kanto feel small, and the Johto layout is not as fun. However the battle with Red on Mt Silver is one of the best moments in gaming IMHO and I think overall Silver/Gold are better than Red/Blue.

[Anonymous No.9472147]

>>9470948
huh

[Anonymous No.9472204]

>>9471392
>The game instructs you to do this throug the rival and can't be missed
The key part you're missing here is the desire. It's not a question of finding the function in the PokéDex. That was never in question and you're arguing in bad faith if you thought it was. The question was urge or desire. You have to see a Pokémon that's new, then decide you want it bad enough that you're going to check its habitat, THEN go grind for it. Which is often times very out of the way (inb4 >hurrdurr muh shortcuts on this Pikachu and none of the other mons that invalidate my arguments!). And like I said in an above post, only extreme autism would encourage someone to play in this way which is highly inefficient and time consuming. The average player who is about middle-to-no interest on the mon isn't going to go to that extra effort, making it out of the way.

The entire argument is that the anon above that started this was making heavy implications that your spread for Kanto was INSANELY diverse, implying you had a lot of commonly encountered monsters that were of a wide variety. Which is only true under the circumstances above.

[Anonymous No.9472236]

>>9472204
This is extremely retarded argument. Part of the entire purpose of Pokemon is hunting and catching Pokemon, the tagline is "gotta catch em all".

If you didn't want to play a monster hunting game, you are an idiot to play Pokemon.

[Anonymous No.9472345]

>>9472236
>the tagline is "gotta catch em all".
Which was dropped in later years as more and more Pokemon made it harder to achieve, and then GameFreak just stopped making it possible altogether.

[Anonymous No.9472379]

>>9472236
>This is extremely retarded argument.
No, it's just one lacking in autism. The most efficient way to catch them all is to complete the game first, catching what happens to show up to your door while you're journeying, and then going back to catch the riff raff. Even the Pikachu example we're talking about, it's actually better for you to wait until the electric power plant where Pikachu is a common appearance instead of a rare one, and at a higher level to boot. On top of that, you can even save a Thunderstone and just catch a Raichu as your rare instead. Your method of "grind my adventure to a halt to go catch a Pokémon I just saw" is, as stated, autistic.

[Anonymous No.9472401]

>>9472379
>i played pokemon as an adult trying to speedrun it
Pokemon is for kids, kids didn't play the games the way you're describing, fuck off zoomer

[Anonymous No.9472417]

>>9472401
>It's speedrunning if you play it efficiently!
lol
lmao
>Kids aren't lazy!
Most kids don't even make it TO Viridian forest, let alone have actual autism. I should know. I was the kid that all the other ones would go to for help on their own games, helping them walk through the beginning parts of the game, or getting through Mt. Moon.

You my friend, are very in denial about being on the spectrum.

[Anonymous No.9472426]

>i played pokemon as an adult trying to speedrun it
Pokemon is for kids, kids didn't play the games the way you're describing, fuck off.

Spending five minutes in Viridian Forest for a Pikachu doesn't grind anything to a halt, you're an ADHD retard who is playing the games wrong. You actually sound like you DO have autism which is the ironic thing here, you can't even understand the concept of a baby game.

And by the way, your method doesn't fucking matter. If you catch a Pikachu in the Power Plant, it's probably going to be at least a few levels underleveled compared to your team, so you'd have to spend time grinding to catch it up regardless, as opposed to just already having a powerful Raichu by that point in the game because you spent like five minutes looking for one, er, "grinding your game to a hault", to find one at the beginning

[Anonymous No.9472431]

>>9472379
>i played pokemon as an adult trying to speedrun it
Pokemon is for kids, kids didn't play the games the way you're describing, fuck off.

Spending five minutes in Viridian Forest for a Pikachu doesn't grind anything to a halt, you're an ADHD retard who is playing the games wrong. You actually sound like you DO have autism which is the ironic thing here, you can't even understand the concept of a baby game.

And by the way, your method doesn't fucking matter. If you catch a Pikachu in the Power Plant, it's probably going to be at least a few levels underleveled compared to your team, so you'd have to spend time grinding to catch it up regardless, as opposed to just already having a powerful Raichu by that point in the game because you spent like five minutes looking for one, er, "grinding your game to a hault", to find one at the beginning

>>9472417
>Most kids don't even make it TO Viridian forest, let alone have actual autism
This argument is absolutely retarded and you're either retarded or just trolling at this point.

[Anonymous No.9472438]

>>9472379
You argue that looking up Pokemon in the Pokedex,
And then flying to that location to try and catch them is complex,
But let me tell you, you are wrong on every level,
For every child has experienced this, and it's a fundamental.

The thrill of the hunt, the excitement of the catch,
Is what makes Pokemon so appealing, there's no need to attach,
Any other meaning or purpose, it's pure and simple fun,
And to argue otherwise, makes you look like a dunce.

So listen up, and take my advice,
Embrace the joy of catching Pokemon, and roll the dice,
For you will never be wrong, or stupid forever,
When you play the game with a childlike wonder and endeavor.

[Anonymous No.9472491]

>>9472431
>Spending five minutes in Viridian Forest for a Pikachu doesn't grind anything to a halt
You are only required to be in Viridian Forest once for the entire game. Even with ">muh shortcut" you're around the outer perimeter, barricaded by a bush that requires cut (hope you brought your HM slave) to get back to it, and you're not even there for a necessary item. If you are IN the forest, and you already KNOW Pikachu is there? Sure, I can give you that. Otherwise, it's still literally out of your way and not useful.

>If you catch a Pikachu in the Power Plant, it's probably going to be at least a few levels underleveled compared to your team, so you'd have to spend time grinding to catch it up regardless
? It would still be more efficient to have the higher level Pikachu to begin with.
>as opposed to just already having a powerful Raichu by that point in the game because you spent like five minutes looking for one
???? You would only spend the 5 minutes in the forest the first time if you ALREADY knew it was there.

Are you a strategy guide user, autism anon?

>This argument is absolutely retarded and you're either retarded or just trolling at this point.
No I just actually interacted with my peers back in 3rd grade when the game came out, continued to interact with my peers as I continued through life, and I didn't ride the short bus to school as you so clearly did. Shrug.

>>9472438
This is actually cringe, lol. Anyways, no, it's not "complex", it's just not worth most peoples efforts or on their radar. They didn't have a "fundamental" experience of grinding their game to a halt to go out of their way to catch anything that they just simply were not in love with when they saw it.

[Anonymous No.9472496]

>>9472491
Poems are not cringe, that's plain to see
They're works of art, as valid as can be
To say otherwise, is just not right
For poetry has been around since the dawn of time

It's a way to express emotions and thoughts
To capture a moment, to record what's been wrought
In words and meter, in rhyme and verse
Poetry has a power that's hard to disperse

So don't be quick to dismiss it as cringe
For poetry has a beauty and grace that's sublime
It's a form of art that's worth exploring
So give it a chance, and keep an open mind.

[Anonymous No.9472504]

>>9472496
No, it's still cringe. We're discussing ideas. We don't need any aestheticism, and it's not increasing our ability to understand each other; to hear and be heard. It's, at best, you trying to show off, and at worse, you intentionally trying to obfuscate or lengthen what you're actually saying.

[Anonymous No.9472515]

>>9472504
I speak as clearly as I can
It's not to show off, but to take a stand
To communicate my thoughts and ideas
In a way that's true to who I am

I know that some may find my words
A little strange, or even absurd
But that's okay, for I am me
And this is how I choose to be

So don't dismiss me, or try to change
My way of speaking, it's not in vain
For I am simply expressing myself
In the best way that I know how

And as for your ideas, they may be grand
But they're not important, in this world so vast
So don't expect recognition, or even a glance
For your ideas are not worth the chance.

[Anonymous No.9472525]

>>9472515
I mean you're clearly just going to keep doing this no matter what and it's not really bothering me. I'm just letting you know that it's just cringe. Keep doing you.

[Anonymous No.9472589]

>>9472491
>If you are IN the forest, and you already KNOW Pikachu is there? Sure, I can give you that. Otherwise, it's still literally out of your way and not useful.
If you are IN Viridian Forest, which you will be, there is a high chance you'll be training one of your freshly caught bird Pokemon against the bug Pokemon to raise it's level. In doing so, for maybe five minutes, you will encounter a Pikachu.

That's just one scenario about how the game was meant to be played, regardless, I've already made my point. Part of what you're SUPPOSED TO DO in Pokemon is tread every new area to seek out new Pokemon. That is, if you're interested in catching new Pokemon, which is a key game mechanic, dare I say, THE MAIN game mechanic, this isn't some RPG where characters join your party, you create your own party, and HUNTING FOR POKEMON is how you do this, some Pokemon are more rare than others because that's part of what makes it a hunt, and it is still MINIMALLY challenging, like I said, it would tak like five minutes to encounter a "super rare" Pikachu

>>9472496
Based poem

[Anonymous No.9472604]

>>9472515
Nice.

>>9472525
A man who can't appreciate art is the cringe one. I don't even know what you guys are arguing about but the guy reciting poetry is the one putting in a high amount of effort, unlike you.

[Anonymous No.9472616]

>>9472491
>If you are IN the forest, and you already KNOW Pikachu is there? Sure, I can give you that. Otherwise, it's still literally out of your way and not useful.
If you are IN Viridian Forest, which you will be, there is a high chance you'll be training one of your freshly caught bird Pokemon against the bug Pokemon to raise it's level. In doing so, for maybe five minutes, you will encounter a Pikachu.

That's just one scenario about how the game was meant to be played, regardless, I've already made my point. Part of what you're SUPPOSED TO DO in Pokemon is tread every new area to seek out new Pokemon. That is, if you're interested in catching new Pokemon, which is a key game mechanic, dare I say, THE MAIN game mechanic, this isn't some RPG where characters join your party, you create your own party, and HUNTING FOR POKEMON is how you do this, some Pokemon are more rare than others because that's part of what makes it a hunt, and it is still MINIMALLY challenging, like I said, it would tak like five minutes to encounter a "super rare" Pikachu

>>9472496
Based poem

[Anonymous No.9472619]

>>9472491
>If you are IN the forest, and you already KNOW Pikachu is there? Sure, I can give you that. Otherwise, it's still literally out of your way and not useful.
If you are IN Viridian Forest, which you will be, there is a high chance you'll be training one of your freshly caught bird Pokemon against the bug Pokemon to raise it's level. In doing so, for maybe five minutes, you will encounter a Pikachu.

That's just one scenario about how the game was meant to be played, regardless, I've already made my point. Part of what you're SUPPOSED TO DO in Pokemon is tread every new area to seek out new Pokemon. That is, if you're interested in catching new Pokemon, which is a key game mechanic, dare I say, THE MAIN game mechanic, this isn't some RPG where characters join your party, you create your own party, and HUNTING FOR POKEMON is how you do this, some Pokemon are more rare than others because that's part of what makes it a hunt, and it is still MINIMALLY challenging, like I said, it would tak like five minutes to encounter a "super rare" Pikachu

>>9472438
Based poem

[Anonymous No.9472627]

>>9472616
Eh, I once spent an hour in Viridian Forest during a replay hunting for Pikachu to add to my team. Wasn't even fighting the other mons, literally escape and run around again until the next encounter. Don't underestimate the ability of RNG to fuck people over. That said, it's a pretty minimal deal if you're not getting fucked, especially with the over-inflated complaints about the shortcut and Cut (the shortcut back to the Forest is adjacent to the town where you *get* Cut, so the odds of having it in your team when you go there to get Flash are super high - especially since you encountered so many cut trees in the western part of the map blocking access to cool places). You're generally correct that part of the Pokemon experience is grinding for new mons and XP, and Brock is a gym leader where this is basically guaranteed to happen because of the level disparity between his gym and everything beforehand. A new player will incorrectly assume that they need to put in a lot of effort to overcome his gym even though it's one of the weakest boss fights in the whole series.

[Anonymous No.9472691]

>>9472604
>he guy reciting poetry is the one putting in a high amount of effort, unlike you.
Putting a high amount of effort into making trash still results in trash.

>>9472619
>If you are IN Viridian Forest, which you will be, there is a high chance you'll be training one of your freshly caught bird Pokemon against the bug Pokemon to raise it's level.
lolwut. This is a really pathetic stretch to try and make this argument feasible.

1. Your flying types before Pewter City Gym are Pidgey & Spearow. Pidgey only knows Gust, which is a NORMAL type move, not a Flying type. It would not have type advantage from any of its attacks until level 28. Except UH OH! Pidgey evolves at level 18. And even at that that point in the game, you haven't run into the NPC that hints about learning better moves faster unevolved. There's literally no reason for a non-expert to stop evolution, much less so with children and first time players. So in actuality, Pidgeotto isn't going to learn Wing Attack until level 31.

Spearow learns...Peck! But Spearow itself is a 10% catch rate as well, in a side area of the game you are not likely to spend a lot of time in. Which means you are not very likely to have encountered or caught him.

2. Why the fuck would you train on level 3-5 Caterpie and Weedle to begin with? Especially when Weedles use poison sting, and the other battles are against Metapod and Kakunas which are worthless catches and prolong your training sessions a shit ton with harden?

3. Even if you had multiple flying types that wanted to specifically train for a rock type gym coming up, and wanted to do this...the patch of grass outside Pewter HAS bug types in it anyways!

TL;DR there is NO REASON for "a freshly caught bird Pokémon" to be training in there in specific as opposed to the other patches of grass closer to the Pewter City Pokémon Center. You overextended yourself here.

>Part of what you're SUPPOSED TO D
Stopped reading here. It's just another True Scotsman fallacy.

[Anonymous No.9472710]

>>9472691
>Spearow learns...Peck! But Spearow itself is a 10% catch rate as well, in a side area of the game you are not likely to spend a lot of time in. Which means you are not very likely to have encountered or caught him.
This is the dumbest shit ever. Spearow has been my gen 1 flying type since I was a kid, since the very first time I played the game and I went to that area. That area is also where you'll find Nidoran, a popular Pokemon to many. I always start my game by getting Spearow and Nidoran.

Your whole argument is that "nobody spends time looking for Pokemon", and I'm telling you you're wrong, because that's the point of the game.

If you're not checking every path in a Pokemon game you're doing it wrong, scotsman my ass.

[Anonymous No.9472716]

>>9472627
>especially with the over-inflated complaints about the shortcut and Cut
The other anon here, it's not even like I'm making complaints, as in "oh this is bullshit nobody just gave me a Pikachu," I'm just highlighting mental and actual road barriers to the Pokémon that another anon was suggesting made such a magnificent spread to gen 1, that might prevent someone from weighing their cost-benefit analysis of a situation in their favor. Every little thing in the way of that adds up to them saying "nah" in the end. Unless they have an impetus, like they just really love the design of the monster they just saw.

>Forest is adjacent to the town where you *get* Cut, so the odds of having it in your team when you go there to get Flash are super high
All the above being said, I don't actually think this is the clear-cut case you make of it. From when I watch playthroughs or skim other people talking about it, most people tend to do Diglett's Cave first, before S.S. Anne and Lt. Surge. Once they're done with that, they tend to have little interest in going back into Diglett's cave cause it's long, encounter-filled, and they typically recognize that the trees just lead back to Viridian Forest. So you're right in that its the town where they get Cut, but the order of operations is more important here.

They MAY wind up doing it in reverse, saving Diglett's cave for last and being able to potentially catch the "missed" Pikachu. This, of course, is underlined by the idea that they had enough interest in knowing where Pikachu spawns to begin with to bother flipping to that entry in the Dex, and then remembering the spot, and then deciding "eh, while I'm here." Not impossible, but still rare enough to make the initial point.

[Anonymous No.9472730]

>>9472710
>Spearow has been my gen 1 flying type since I was a kid, since the very first time I played the game and I went to that area.
Then you either looked it up in a strategy guide (congrats on being a shit-eating child) or you got lucky and misattributed this to skill. Cause like I said, there's no reason for you to intentionally sit there and grind out encounters unless you know something is there or you have autism.

>hat area is also where you'll find Nidoran, a popular Pokemon to many. I always start my game by getting Spearow and Nidoran.
Congratulations. You've played the game before.

>Your whole argument is that "nobody spends time looking for Pokemon",
My whole argument is that "90% of the typical encounters most players will face up to Safari zone are going to be typical duds, like Zubat, Geodude, Rattata, and Pidgey." This is literally a tangent of a side discussion that is missing the main point (We haven't even gotten into the crux meat of this argument by talking about how all of the rare Pokémon offered up as a suggestion to the spread are rare, therefore even when you do decide to bother grinding for them, you still encounter 90% Zubat, Geodude, Rattata, and Pidgey anyways, which is why normies have massive amounts of normie jokes about running into "yet another Zubat"), but also a tangent that is massively failing in its retardation (You suggesting that because you remember where you encountered a Nidoran after looking it up, your future playthroughs counter the idea that it's still 90% of the dudmons).

It's frankly like I'm playing in a shooting gallery with a sniper rifle, and you're still sitting around playing with nerf darts. You're not even in the real discussion yet. The only anon who got close to it so far was this guy: >>9472627

[Anonymous No.9472775]

>>9472730
>or you got lucky and misattributed this to skill.
Pokemon is not really a skill based game, but being "good" at it does mean seeking out new Pokemon.
>there's no reason for you to intentionally sit there and grind out encounters unless you know something is there or you have autism.
There is a reason, that reason is to find new Pokemon. Very early on, in fact in the area we're discussing, the game teaches you that different areas yield different results in terms of Pokemon, this instills in you the idea that you should actively look around in different areas. If you ever saw an open path or an unexplored patch of grass in a Pokemon game and you didn't go in it, you're an idiot.

As for some Pokemon being more rare than others, that's how the game is. I learned this quickly as a child, so anybody else could have and should have as well. I spent time searching for new Pokemon only to find the same old ones, but I also found rare Pokemon and was rewarded for it, as the game intended. If you were too impatient to search for new and rare Pokemon, tough shit. Other kids knew how to play the game more than you did.

You're also just clearly an impatient baby, because you already complained about the fact that it's too hard to use the Pokedex to hunt for Pokemon after seeing them from trainers, you're just an ADHD tard.

[Anonymous No.9472947]

>>9472691
>Pidgey only knows Gust, which is a NORMAL type move, not a Flying type.
In Gen I it *was* a flying-type move. They changed it so that people who picked Chikorita wouldn't be completely and utterly gang-raped by bird Pokemon on their way to the bird-type gym, then never changed it back.

[Anonymous No.9473403]

>>9472775
>but being "good" at it does mean seeking out new Pokemon.
As I said, misattributed your luck as skill. Thanks for confirming.

>There is a reason, that reason is to find new Pokemon.
I think you may be misunderstanding what I'm saying here. I've never stated, nor intended, that someone would NOT go through the grass a few times in the area, especially if its on their main path forward. I actually don't know how you got that idea.

The discussion is about the spread of Pokémon obtained and the rare Pokémon included in the spread. Which you just admitted here:
>I spent time searching for new Pokemon only to find the same old ones,
Which means you just acknowledged everything I stated here: >>9472730
And are a retard.

>You're also just clearly an impatient baby,
Hilarious since you didn't read my last post and just posted your same arguments that have been picked apart over and over again, as well as ignoring >>9472716
>I'm just highlighting mental and actual road barriers to the Pokémon that another anon was suggesting made such a magnificent spread to gen 1, that might prevent someone from weighing their cost-benefit analysis of a situation in their favor.

>>9472947
https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Gust_(move)
I'm very curious about you as a person, anon. Do you genuinely think that we couldn't just google it or boot up a rom or the original cart before you told a lie? If you were being legit and just misremembered, why didn't you google or boot up a rom before posting?

Also, holy shit, I never knew that gust could hit during Fly/Bounce. What the hell?

[Anonymous No.9473425]

>>9472438
>>9472496
>>9472515
Reddit moment.

[Anonymous No.9474078]

>>9473403
>Also, holy shit, I never knew that gust could hit during Fly/Bounce. What the hell?
kek, just saw this in my latest Gold playthrough. Imagine programming this interaction so maybe one mid level bird trainer in the entire game possibly hits you in the mirror match with you using Fly. Great use of dev time.

[Anonymous No.9474101]

>>9473403
>>I'm just highlighting mental and actual road barriers to the Pokémon that another anon was suggesting made such a magnificent spread to gen 1, that might prevent someone from weighing their cost-benefit analysis of a situation in their favor.

Ok, and this is still just autistic nitpicking. The fact that some Pokemon are found off the main path or are more rare to encounter isn't bad game design, because the purpose of the game is to seek out new types of Pokemon, not be handed them willy nilly.

You can make the argument but "yeah but see, Pikachu is less common than Zubat" all day but it means absolutely nothing. Pikachu is still in the game and anyone with a brain and a minimal amount of patience could get one if they wanted it.

[Anonymous No.9474137]

>>9474101
I don't know how people complain about 'muh gentoo mons being too rare' when the face of the franchise was a 5% encounter rate to begin with.

[Anonymous No.9474149]

>>9474137
Pikachu wasn't the face of the franchise until the anime decided to make him the star.

[Anonymous No.9474157]

>>9474149
The anime existed before the games were even localized.

[Anonymous No.9474180]

>>9474157
Yes, and...? That doesn't change the fact that "the face of the franchise" is a 5% encounter rate shitmon the game never treats as anything special because it wasn't the face of the franchise until after the game was made.

[Anonymous No.9474189]

>>9474149
Eh, the only other two contenders were Poliwhirl and Clefairy, the latter also being a rare, single location monster and the former requiring you to be at least halfway through the game to get.

[Anonymous No.9474204]

>>9474180
Yes, and the western retards who played GSC after RBY complain about rare monsters while the western face of the series is a 5% encounter.

[Anonymous No.9474213]

If I emulate S/G on my pc will it actually keep track of the time? I just want to play this game and have the clock actually work. I miss night time gen 2.

[Anonymous No.9474216]

>>9474213
Yes.

[Anonymous No.9474224]

>>9452646
>at that point it's just meaningless skinner boxes
bro, all of life is

[Anonymous No.9474226]

>>9452646
Kanto is actually just an elaborate excuse to grind you for Red. And even then you won't be the same level as Red.

[Anonymous No.9474465]

>>9474101
>The fact that some Pokemon are found off the main path or are more rare to encounter isn't bad game design
Never said it was. I just merely stated that generically claiming "This gen has a bad spread!" could be levelled at all gens. I even had a post above that some gens handled it better than other gens, such as it actually being physically impossible to get a fire type pre-Elite 4. But I pointed out that gen 1's spread is also kind of shit cause 90% of what you run into are generic duds like Zubat, Geodude, Pidgey, and Rattata. Some genwunner above got butthurt about that and pointed out you could also catch a Spearow or something, and here we are.

[Anonymous No.9474475]

>>9474189
Nah. Nidoking was very prominent in very early marketing, for instance.

[Anonymous No.9476437]

>>9474213
It will. I know years ago you had to change a setting on VBA but nowadays I would imagine it's configured immediately.

[Anonymous No.9478067]

>>9474189
Poliwhirl is an idiot

[Anonymous No.9478084]

>>9456704
Holy shit can you give me a walkthrough on how to do this?? This sounds really cool!

[Anonymous No.9479165]

I always felt like Gen 1 was a more cohesive smooth experience than Gen 2

[Anonymous No.9480882]

>>9472730
>Then you either looked it up in a strategy guide (congrats on being a shit-eating child)
You have this hang-up about people using strategy guides even though most RPGs from back then had stuff that was extremely difficult to find without using them. It was either use a guide or spend hours exploring and dicking around, just how game design worked back then.
Not to mention, it's 2022, no one's playing these games blind anymore. If you want a diverse team in Gen 1 you can get it without too much effort, which is more than you can say for some other gens, most infamously 4 as you pointed out.

[Anonymous No.9480896]

>>9463783
>>9463772
>>9463763
>>9466684
>>9466770
>>9466774
seems like you oomer dipshits forgot that the instruction manual pikachu iviridian fforest

[Anonymous No.9481649]

>>9480882
>You have this hang-up about people using strategy guides even though most RPGs from back then had stuff that was extremely difficult to find without using them.
I was actually just thinking about this, but Pokemon like a lot of JRPGs is a game you can easily be fucked in without prior knowledge

And I'm not even talking about where to find Pokemon or how to get through dungeons, I mean mainly because the game doesn't tell you anything about moves and TMs....as a kid playing blind, you basically just had to have blind faith in whichever moves you chose and hope it worked out, I remember replacing old moves being really anxiety inducing. And then there's the fact that you also tend to think as a kid that you need to evolve Pokemon/let them evolve as soon as you can, missing a lot of moves that actually make them good in the process

[Anonymous No.9482918]

>>9450521
>More pokeballs, machines, and side content that, in time, helped the game become more people with the kawai crowd than the original kids who wanted to go on adventures
I think anime is cancer, but this is the gayest take i've ever seen. Idk how you could posted that without the realization and deep shame of how much of a boomer you are.

[Anonymous No.9483012]

>>9481649
The difference is that Pokemon is so stupidly easy you can never fuck yourself over THAT hard.

[Anonymous No.9483032]

>>9450731
rent free

[Anonymous No.9483038]

hoenn mogs, mega zoomies cant into a few water routes.

[Anonymous No.9483063]

>>9482918
I was 10 at the time, and now I’m 30. I dont need to realize that Pokémon’s target audience has changed for worse.

[Anonymous No.9483242]

>>9450015
Whoops! I posted the wrong version, sorry!

[Anonymous No.9483459]

I've been replaying it and the game really punishes you for trying to use a balanced team.
There's just not enough enemy trainers to keep a team of five sufficiently levelled to face gyms
There's basically no reason not to just stomp everything with your starter

[Anonymous No.9483462]

>>9480882
>If I call it a hang-up, that excuses me!
No, it's just you being shit at a game. If there is a part of the game that is truly and objectively unsolvable or unobtainable without an external source to the game telling you about it directly, then it's shit game design. Simple as.
>Not to mention, it's 2022, no one's playing these games blind anymore.
I agree, there has been a significant casulization of video gamers and video games in the modern era, which is why retro games are superior. For example: >>9481649
>I mean mainly because the game doesn't tell you anything about moves and TMs....as a kid playing blind, you basically just had to have blind faith in whichever moves you chose and hope it worked out
This 4 year-old anon never thought of just saving, using the TM, and reloading after finding out what the move does. Instead, he resorts to using a strategy guide! If this isn't shit-eating casualization of my hobby, then I don't know what is.

[Anonymous No.9483884]

>>9483242
What is supposedly better about Crystal

[Anonymous No.9483926]

>>9483462
>This 4 year-old anon never thought of just saving, using the TM, and reloading after finding out what the move does. Instead, he resorts to using a strategy guide!
Were you the anon going on about how no one wants to spend time searching through the grass to find Pokemon? If so then this is a strange suggestion coming from you. The same people who don't wanna bother looking for mons aren't gonna bother testing out moves, either.

[Anonymous No.9483947]

people complain about the leveling curve but the EV system basically means your pokemon will always be stronger than the enemies even if they have a huge level advantage

[Anonymous No.9484030]

Don't know what this thread is about but I want you all to know i'm playing pokemon blue for the first time in about 10 years and I'm having a surprising amount of fun.

[Anonymous No.9484057]

>>9450015
The worse thing jd thr lack of stones. You are forced to find a lot of pokemkn that can't evolve to third form because it requires stone. And you find a fuckton of them before you ever reach your fifth stone. There are hardly a diverse types of pokemons and they are mostly useless because you cannot evolve those fuckers. I hated that, holy shit.

[Anonymous No.9484604]

>>9483926
>Were you the anon going on about how no one wants to spend time searching through the grass to find Pokemon?
I don't believe either anon in any conversation suggested this. Where are you pulling this out from?
>The same people who don't wanna bother looking for mons aren't gonna bother testing out moves, either.
This is lazy generalization though. The cost-benefit of finding out what the move does is far quicker and better in the benefit side of the scale than the cost side of the scale. You've somehow associated the strawman argument you put up forth from above with "ANY amount of effort = nobody does it!" It's about cost-benefit analysis.

>>9484030
Pokémon is just a timeless classic.

[Anonymous No.9484612]

>>9484057
It's supposed to further incentivize trading. You can buy stones in the gen 1 games, and you can trade Pokemon back and forth between gen 1 and 2.

[Anonymous No.9484632]

Does any other game attract so much autistic nitpicking?

[Anonymous No.9484653]

>>9484632
/tg/ games in general. If you've never played, some versions of D&D are very math and character-build heavy, so you can get insanely autistic about that. What makes it worse is that a required player for table-top in general is the Dungeon/Game Master, who is set as a position of authority, but also as a narrator of the fiction. That means that the math nerds above have to argue their characters against an imaginary personality, or in a white-room theory craft, and the debate gets more intense about that. Top that off with even the most mundane, abstract things being argued by the DM themselves despite it being very nuanced and subjective, and you've a recipe for disaster. The worst argument I've ever gotten in on /v/ lasted maybe 20 or so posts of genuine debate, then just devolved into like 5+ posts of namecalling before it ended. I've posted what I thought were genuinely benign pedestrian observations on /tg/ that easily boil into 100+ replies, sometimes going over into new threads.

Pokemon debates are easily a close second though, and it's shockingly a good 66% rate of misinformation combined with everyone sorting themselves into tribes based on generation gaps. There's a lot of hate between Gen 2 and Gen 5 in particular.

[Anonymous No.9484820]

>>9484030
I played through Blue again this past summer after not having played it in probably fifteen years at least. It still holds up great.

I always tell people, you gotta play it on actual hardware with Pokemon Stadium if possible. Stadium basically completes the first two gens. The amount of content it brings is massive for the era and even later entries like Colosseum and Battle Revolution don't even compare to the sheer amount of different things you can do. Plus the Doduo/Dodrio Tower makes things a lot less "grindy" if you're trying to find a certain Pokemon or whatever, and being able to manage all of your Pokemon and items in the lab really is a game changer.

I think the Stadium games, or at least Stadium 1 specifically, were released in that perfect time during the heart of "Pokemania." You could slap your own physical cartridge with your own Pokemon that you caught and battled with, and you could finally see them fully realized in full color and 3D on the big screen. I think every kid wondered at the time just how much cooler Pokemon would get. Unfortunately a lot of us are pretty disappointed in the direction of the series.

[Anonymous No.9484973]

>>9455038
Welcome to the Johto games.

[Anonymous No.9485090]

>>9484820
I also replayed through Yellow earlier this year and I was disappointed about the lack in variety for enemy trainers in the mid-game
>rocket Game corner is full of poison types
>Celadon gym is also heavy with poison types
>channelers in pokemon tower all have the same one pokemon (poison type)
>face team rocket again, an abundance of poison types
>down the cycling road, bikers all have poison types
>reach Fuchsia city, gym is exclusively poison types

[Anonymous No.9485117]

>>9485090
The bikers have more variety than just poison and Fuchsia City's regular gym trainers have only a couple Arboks as far as poison goes; the rest of them are packing Drowzee/Hypno, a Kadabra, and a Sandslash. It's still not a lot of variety but it's better than you make it sound.

[Anonymous No.9485159]

>>9485090
I'm speaking on behalf of Red/Blue so if Yellow changed this I'm an ass, but at that point in the game though and on/around those routes and cities there are also a lot of fishermen with water types, rockers with electric types, cueballs with fighting types, bird keepers with bird types

[Anonymous No.9485265]

>>9450816
The unown were interesting, but the pursuit of catching them all is a dead end. It's only a reward if you have a gameboy printer. It's like the god damn christmas story decoder message being an ad for ovaltine. That's literally what it ends up being, a "congrats, now buy a gameboy printer". Effort for a non-reward.

The beasts roaming around the world and randomly encountering them was a really neat mechanic.

Team Rocket is an after thought in gen 2. The overworld of gen 2 suffered too much to properly pace out team rocket. Gen 1 is struchtured in a dungeon > boss > dungeon > boss, ect. Like Viridian forest, then brock, then mt moon, then misty, ss anne, lt.surge and so on. Gen 2 is not paced in this way. So it doesn't leave opportunity for team rocket to be at half of these events. So much of gen 2 is just too small.

[Anonymous No.9485428]

>>9484604
>I don't believe either anon in any conversation suggested this. Where are you pulling this out from?
lol you're not fooling anyone dude
>The cost-benefit of finding out what the move does is far quicker and better in the benefit side of the scale than the cost side of the scale.
For just one TM? Sure. But there's 50 of them and the majority of them in Gen 1 are trash. If you can imagine that no one will bother searching for Pikachu, then it's just as easy to imagine someone just relying on their starter's level up movepool after it turns out the first 5 TMs they find are duds. There's a reason why memes like this exist.

[Anonymous No.9486249]

>>9485428
>lol you're not fooling anyone dude
Then I am absolutely sure you'd have no problem quoting the post and the exact line then to prove this isn't a strawman pulled out of your ass, right?

>For just one TM? Sure. But there's 50 of them and the majority of them in Gen 1 are trash
Problem with this is most NPCs tell you what exactly the move does when you pick it up from them. For all others, the process is:
1. Save (Which is something you want to do anyways and often)
2. Boot up TM, which then tells you what the actual move is?
3. Still don't know? Put it on your guy that can learn it.
4. Try move and/or read text.
Don't like it? Reload. It's actually really simple, right there, and requires minimal effort for the benefit of answering a question. At worst, you don't have any Pokémon that can learn the move. In that case, you can just put it back in the PC the next time you hit a PokéCenter until you learn more about it as you naturally play the game.


>If you can imagine that no one will bother searching for Pikachu
You're still hung up on the exact same issue I've stated: You've failed cost-benefit analysis and have assumed ANY amount of effort = no one will do that, which was never stated by anyone other than your strawman. My actual argument is that nobody is going to have these Pokémon in their spread UNLESS they've taken enough interest in its design upon site that they will go track them down of their own accord, in which case the cost-benefit has, for them, outweighed the cost of the effort.

Try to keep up, dear.

[Anonymous No.9486827]

>>9484973
Oh nohto, it's johto

[Anonymous No.9486996]

>>9486249
>Problem with this is most NPCs tell you what exactly the move does when you pick it up from them.
Only a tiny amount of TMs are given to you by NPCs, most are just found in the world or bought from stores.
>You've failed cost-benefit analysis and have assumed ANY amount of effort = no one will do that
The problem with judging things solely off cost-benefit is that this game is most easily beaten with your overleveled starter, so any discussion of TMs or other mons is entirely irrelevant. That's why I find this strange cope about just "just save and reload to find out bro" so funny, I've never heard of anyone doing that and just sounds like you've made up a guy to rationalize your hatred of guides, even though the whole idea of Pokemon is that other people help you get the monsters you want. This ain't Wizardry.

[Anonymous No.9487031]

People in this thread seem pretty well versed on the subject, so could I get some recommendations on series or one-off jrpgs to play to really get into the genre. I realized the other day that it’s the only type of retro game I really haven’t played a lot of.

[Anonymous No.9487102]

>>9486996
>Only a tiny amount of TMs are given to you by NPCs, most are just found in the world or bought from stores.
Good thing I explained the rest then.

>The problem with judging things solely off cost-benefit is that this game is most easily beaten with your overleveled starter
That's not really a problem and it doesn't have anything to do with the discussion.
>so any discussion of TMs or other mons is entirely irrelevant.
This conclusion to that statement is entirely false to boot. Even talking about the kids who did do the "only used my starter" thing, why WOULDN'T those kids want to boot up a TM to see if their starter could use it? That doesn't make any sense, considering it's a 3 second thing to find out.

>That's why I find this strange cope about just "just save and reload to find out bro" so funny, I've never heard of anyone doing that
>save scum
>"strange cope"
>"never heard of anyone doing that"
lolwut? Are you 12 years-old and have never seen a retro game console in-person or something? It was an insanely common playground tactic to shut off your gameboy 2 seconds into saving to cause glitches, and that's some ADVANCED save shenanigans. You're sitting here trying to tell me that you've never heard or thought of reloading a save? Okay buddy, good luck convincing anyone of that argument.

>even though the whole idea of Pokemon is that other people help you get the monsters you want. This ain't Wizardry.
I don't get this line. It seems like you're implying that shit-eating strategy guides should be okay because of playground talk (a very stark false equivalency), but then you contradict this by saying it's "Not Wizardry" despite that being a game that very much benefits from playground talk. Which is it?

Also, I noticed yo bitch ass didn't quote that post you mentioned from earlier, so let me remind you that you still need to do that. Just in case you conveniently forgotten.

>>9487031
Dragon Quest 1-3.

[Anonymous No.9487152]

>>9487102
>That's not really a problem and it doesn't have anything to do with the discussion.
The most efficient way of playing the game has nothing to do with a discussion over cost-benefit analysis? lol
>Even talking about the kids who did do the "only used my starter" thing, why WOULDN'T those kids want to boot up a TM to see if their starter could use it? That doesn't make any sense, considering it's a 3 second thing to find out.
It's more than a few seconds to figure out what the move does, not to mention most TMs are worthless for the starters anyway. If the first couple of TMs turn out to be garbage and they're going through the game just fine then it's likely that someone wouldn't bother.
>It was an insanely common playground tactic to shut off your gameboy 2 seconds into saving to cause glitches, and that's some ADVANCED save shenanigans. You're sitting here trying to tell me that you've never heard or thought of reloading a save? Okay buddy, good luck convincing anyone of that argument.
Abusing the save system to pull off glitches like duping or the Mew Glitch? Yep, I've sure heard of that. To figure out how TMs work? Nope.
>It seems like you're implying that shit-eating strategy guides should be okay because of playground talk (a very stark false equivalency)
I like how you word this, "should be okay", like we're discussing a potential crime
Anyway, I didn't say "playground talk", I used the words I did for a reason. Pokemon is a relaxed adventure, where other people can help you out. It had a PvP scene within the first couple years, something only possible with guide usage and collectivized knowledge.
>Also, I noticed yo bitch ass didn't quote that post you mentioned from earlier, so let me remind you that you still need to do that. Just in case you conveniently forgotten.
You'll have to search through this thread and find it yourself. I'd apologize, but you seem to like finding things on your own :3

[Anonymous No.9487190]

>>9487152
>The most efficient way of playing the game has nothing to do with a discussion over cost-benefit analysis?
Correct. We're discussing cost-benefit analysis of specific actions.

>It's more than a few seconds to figure out what the move does
Irrelevant and splitting hairs.

>To figure out how TMs work? Nope.
Then that sounds like a skill issue on your half. Don't know what else to tell you other than this is a hard enough push that I can ignore this with safe knowledge that not a single person will believe you, including yourself.

>"should be okay", like we're discussing a potential crime
Yes.

>something only possible with guide usage
Incorrect and for shit-eaters.

>You'll have to search through this thread and find it yourself.
I accept your concession. Never bring up your strawman again around here.