/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.9375808]

>Revenge is motivation enough, at least it's honest. HATE ME, but do it honestly.
Why does he even care about that?

[Anonymous No.9375813]

He didn't want Raziel being a cuck for Moebius.

[Anonymous No.9375859]

Kain is 5D chessing Raziel again, making him realize he is just a puppet

[Anonymous No.9375904]

>>9375808
The Soul Reaver games suck compared to Blood Omen. Blood Omen was such a beautiful dark atmospheric game, and all of it was thrown away in favour of some clunky cartoon game.

[Anonymous No.9375906]

>>9375904
You got filtered.

[Anonymous No.9375937]

>>9375904
was it the block puzzles?

[Anonymous No.9375949]

>>9375808
I don't even know the context because I only played the original Blood Omen and Soul Reaver, but I think its a good line.

Since everyone feels like they play a real role in political and cultural events due to social media now, everyone who participates in these things has turned into Machivellian of sorts, dressing up their hatred for other groups in flowery ideological and moral language. As Kain says, the hatred itself is fine and natural but the elaborate smoke and mirrors used to justify it is fake and gay.

[Anonymous No.9375952]

>>9375937
I have no idea what that is. I looked at the design of Kain and the protagonist, and immediately dropped it.

[Anonymous No.9375956]

>>9375904
Did you even play the same game

[Anonymous No.9375958]

>>9375952
Gotta hand it to you, I've never heard that particular take before. Did you feel the same way about Ocarina of Time compared to Link to the Past?

[Anonymous No.9375990]

>>9375956
I didn't play Soul Reaver except for the first hour of clunky mess. I looked up gameplay and images of it and saw that it didn't have anything that I liked about Blood Omen, except for the voice acting.
>The great gameplay with metroidvania world, traps and vast amount of spells and overpowered progression?
Gone in favour of a repetitive press square to hit "combat".
>The amazing dark atmosphere?
Gone in favour of drab grey uninspired world.
>Cool dark fantasy enemies with gory deaths, pale vampire protagonist?
Gone in favour of ugly exaggerated cartoon characters. Literally compare op pic to Blood Omen's Kain.

>>9375958
No.

[Anonymous No.9376095]

>>9375952
Kain LITERALLY evolved into a elder vampire lile Vorador. Did you even play BO1?

[Anonymous No.9376156]

>>9376095
And Vorador's design is the one thing that looked completely out of place in Blood Omen.

[Anonymous No.9376165]

>>9376156
because he was only old as fuck vampire at the time.

[Anonymous No.9376178]

>>9376156
Do you love talking out of your ass?

[Anonymous No.9376179]

>>9376165
And Kain was the only young vampire. What's your point?

[Anonymous No.9376181]

>>9376178
The concept art versions look much better.

[Anonymous No.9376183]

>>9376181
Could say the same about many games from the time, who cares.

[Anonymous No.9376185]

>>9376183
I care and this is different because concept art Vorador fits in the game, but ingame one looks like something out of 90s children's CG cartoon.

[Anonymous No.9376196]

>>9375990
It's still an exploration focused game. Combat in blood omen is also pretty crap.

[Anonymous No.9376204]

>>9376185
Take it up with the CG team because I really have no issue with how they tried to replicate the design.

[Anonymous No.9376219]

>>9376178
>V-Vorador sama!... I kneel...
KWAB

[Anonymous No.9376234]

>>9375949
It works best with the full line
>Let's drop the moral posturing shall we? We both know there is no altruism in this pursuit, your reckless indignation brought you here; I counted on it! There's no shame in it Raziel, revenge is motivation enough; at least it's honest. Hate me, but do it honestly.

[Anonymous No.9376257]

>>9375808
>Why does he even care about that?
Because he is evil. Legacy of Kain is pure gnosticism

[Anonymous No.9376274]

>>9375990
Blood Omen's artstyle was far more cartoonish than Soul Reaver. Look at the 3D model of Kain in the cutscenes.

[Anonymous No.9376386]

>>9376257
>>9375808
It's because there's nothing Kain hates more than liars and deceivers. He prefers honesty even with malice.

[Anonymous No.9376446]

>>9376185
90s CG kid's shows looked cool as hell

[Anonymous No.9376464]

>>9376219
>KWAB
The man you just called a bitch was made a wraith by Mortanius. He allowed some members of the Circle to be killed. He could've fucking walked. All he had to do was say Moebius' name, but he didn't. He kept his fucking mouth shut, and did his fucking time, and he did it like a man. He did 500 years for Nosgoth.
So, Anon...you're telling me this very good guardian of ours, who did 500 years for the pillars, who in 500 years never made a compromise, no matter what. You're telling me that now that this man has to fight Vorador, and is making good on his commitment to us, he's just gonna decide OUTTA THE FUCKING BLUE to kneel? Why don't you tell me what you really think?

[Anonymous No.9376517]

>>9376219
Vorador beating Malek is my biggest gripe with BO1. In game Vorador uses the same spells Kain has and not a single one of them can damage Malek. If he was killed by Kain wielding the Soul Reaver. I would accept it due to it devouring his soul on contact. But not Vorador who was killed by a small group of vampire hunters like a total bitch.

[Anonymous No.9376526]

>>9376464
I think he didn't properly do his duty to his fellow guardians

[Anonymous No.9376757]

>>9376526
what was his end game? and why is he alive in soul reaver 2? i honestly have no idea what's going on after blood omen

[Anonymous No.9376807]

>>9376757
Originally young Kain kills Moebius in Blood Omen and the Elder God revives him so he can keep working as his servant
However in Defiance the timeline is changed and old Kain kills him as soon as he revives, then Raziel consumes his soul to put him back into the wheel of life

[Anonymous No.9378152]

>>9376757
>what was his end game?
Not allowing for Kain to stagnate the flow of souls so the Elder God has enough snacks. Also his side goal was to cause as much conflict as possible. At the end he believed the pillars would be finally free from vampires and humans would rule them completely. Moebious was raised by vampires since childhood and for some reason despised them along with Mortarion.

[Anonymous No.9378156]

>>9378152
>Mortarion
lol Mortanius

[Anonymous No.9378206]

>>9376517
>has and not a single one of them can damage Malek.
Because when you fight Malek it's basically just his spirit, not the man.

[Anonymous No.9378208]

>>9376757
>and why is he alive in soul reaver 2?
He tells you himself, Kain will kill him about 30 years from where they are at that point in time, which he does during the events of BO1.

[Anonymous No.9378242]

>>9376757
>>9376807
both of you got it wrong, Moebius was killed in the orginal timeline that lead up to Soul Reaver, at the end of Soul Reaver Kain and Raziel go some time back into the past before the events of Blood Omen happen. Soul Reaver 2 and Defiance play in an alternate timeline by creating paradoxes, time traveling and trying to rewrite known outcomes to one that Kain wants

[Anonymous No.9378249]

>>9375808
why does he look like jeepers creepers in the later games?

[Anonymous No.9378254]

>>9378249
Vampires age like shit apparently

[Anonymous No.9378283]

>>9378249
>>9378254
how can i become a vampire bros?
>inb4 become a jew and suck goyblood to become immortal

[Anonymous No.9378407]

>>9378283
well you either find one so he can bite you or you let a necromancer make you into one after you get murdered so you can become his pawn

[Anonymous No.9378417]

>>9378249
It's due to him being a "artificial" vampire like all the ones created through the dark ceremonies instead of being a member of the winged race. They all get real ugly over time.

[Anonymous No.9378421]

>>9378242
It's quite frankly amazing that they don't fuck it up, but that's because they work paradoxes into being part of the plot.

[Anonymous No.9378516]

>>9378421
Probably since Kain very likely has tried lots of stuff,
>Eternity is relentless, Raziel. When I first stole into this chamber centuries ago, I did not fathom the true power of knowledge. To know the future, Raziel. To see its paths and streams tracing out into the infinite. As a man, I could never have contained such forbidden truths.

[Anonymous No.9378564]

>>9378421
who murdered Ariel and why? haven't played past Soul reaver 2

[Anonymous No.9378575]

Amazing the people in this thread who have played these games and paid no attention to the story.

[Anonymous No.9379303]

anyone has the pic of Raziel with a nintendo 65?

[Anonymous No.9379456]

>>9379303

[Anonymous No.9380302]

>>9379456
Kek, at first glance Kain does look like a petty bitch

[Anonymous No.9380327]

>>9379303
That dialogue is not Kain'd enough.
>If your body is stricken with indomitable sickness, such malignant forces are likewise too great a burden for your soul

[Anonymous No.9380391]

>>9380327
I would like to speak with such a rich vocabulary in my everyday life, that's one of my aspirations

[Anonymous No.9380482]

>>9378564
>who murdered Ariel
Mortanius possessed by Hash'ak'gik (the general of the Hylden)

[Anonymous No.9380486]

>>9380302
Kain did initially what he did out of petty jealousy, it just coincidentally turned out to be the thing that ended up saving Nosgoth.

[Anonymous No.9380497]

>games have a rule that you can't actually change the future without creating a paradox because the timestream is too resilient to be moved by little changes
>Raziel, by virture of the fact that his soul exists simultaneously inside and outside of his body, is a living paradox and thus any action he takes will permenantly alter history, is the one person whose fate isn't predetermined
>this only makes him the greatest slave of all as his fate-altering powers means everyone else in the setting manipulates him for their own gain
You couldn't write shit this poetic today.

[Anonymous No.9380672]

what was his goddamn problem?

[Anonymous No.9380694]

>>9380482
It's "the Unspoken".

[Anonymous No.9380763]

>>9376757
Because Raziel traveled back in time to a point before Moebius' death, just around the time Kain was born and the pillars became corrupted. Did you even play the game?

[Anonymous No.9380801]

>>9380763
>Did you even play the game?
no

[Anonymous No.9380915]

If Kain knows how to travel in time and how to manipulate paradoxes to change the course of history, why can't he get two instances of Soul Reaver with Raziel's soul in them and strike one with the other like when he fought William? I know time in LoK is strictly deterministic but does it prevent the characters from acting out of logic? Is Kain that much of a brainlet?

[Anonymous No.9380934]

>>9380915
Because they never got to do that in another game.

[Anonymous No.9381495]

>>9380694
The Hylden Lord has many names

[Anonymous No.9381503]

>>9380915
Well for one, I'm not 100% sure that Kain ever figured out that Raziel's Soul is the Reaver itself before Raziel killed himself at the end of Defiance. He knew Raziel was the key, but I don't think he knew why. He just knows that Raziel's spectral Reaver is special.

Also by the time he would've started figuring that out at the end of SR2, Raziel slipped into the pseudo-coma and spent centuries in the spectral realm so by the time the two met again, it was a Kain at an earlier point in history.

[Anonymous No.9381504]

>>9381495
Wasn't the Hylden in 1996.

[Anonymous No.9381509]

>>9381504
Because the original BO1 was written by a different person than Amy Hennig. Regardless nothing in BO1 contradicts the stuff that came later, she put a lot of work in making sure the canon was always internally consistent even if it's convoluted as all fuck. So yes you can say that the thing that possessed Mortanius being Hylden Lord is a retcon, but it's a retcon that doesn't change or contradict anything about BO1 because we learn jack shit about the Hylden in BO1 aside from a wierd cult of them existing who go by the Hylden's other name of Hash'ak'gik.

[Anonymous No.9381520]

>>9381509
>Regardless nothing in BO1 contradicts the stuff that came later
Nta but ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh it kinda does. If Defiance was never written you'd be right but in Defiance they decided that the thing the Avernus cult worships is giant monster Turel. Now Turel gets possessed by several Hylden himself but by all accounts The Unspoken became the Hylden Race in general and Hash'ak'gik became at least in the eyes of the Avernus mortals, their name for Turel.

[Anonymous No.9382105]

how would the 2nd game (and franchise) be if Silicon knights didn't lose the rights?

[Anonymous No.9382140]

Find a flaw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNWSDvDqm9g

[Anonymous No.9382406]

>>9382105
Do you mean the originally intended "Kain 2"? Because Shifter was a separate IP before becoming Soul Reaver.

[Anonymous No.9382679]

>>9382406
>Do you mean the originally intended "Kain 2"?
yes, i'm curious about the direction SK would have taken the franchise after blood omen

[Anonymous No.9383617]

Soul Reaver's original intended ending > anything that came afterwards

[Anonymous No.9383694]

>>9383617
Seconded.

[Anonymous No.9383706]

>>9383617
>>9383694
explain

[Anonymous No.9383753]

>>9376446
Yeah, that aesthetic is part of why I enjoy Legacy of Kain

[Anonymous No.9383878]

>>9382679
>>9382406
yes i am did someone ever got any info?

[Anonymous No.9383897]

>>9383706
God, you're in for a long one.

[Anonymous No.9383906]

>>9383878
There's not much other than some copyright info and writing on paper, nothing progressed beyond that during talks for "Kain 2".

[Anonymous No.9384208]

>>9383617
>>9383694
Maybe but at the same time I'm glad we got what we did. SR2 is by far the worst one gameplay-wise but I live the story we got out of it with some of the most conversations in the series
>Apparently so, but suppose you throw a coin enough times... suppose one day, it lands on its edge.

>You must understand, our presence here doesn't alter history. You and i meet here because we are compelled to, we have always met here. History is irredeemable. Drop a stone into a rushing river, the current simply courses around it and flows on as if the obstruction were never there. You and I are pebbles, Raziel, and have even less hope of disrupting the time-stream. The continum of history is simply too strong, too resilient.

>And I realized I could never escape my terrible destiny, I had merely postponed it. History abhors a paradox.

and of course my absolute favorite exchange from all of LoK
>You're a righteous fiend, aren't you?
>Apparently I am...

[Anonymous No.9384227]

>>9384208
>I live the story
love the story, I meant

[Anonymous No.9384824]

>>9384208
>that pic
kinda crazy that raziel kills himself and then his bros again

[Anonymous No.9385313]

>>9376446
>>9383753
Children.

[Anonymous No.9385380]

>>9380915
>Is Kain that much of a brainlet?
wasnt it a plot point in SR2 that whenever they alter history they also get their memories altered accordingly. trying to fix the timeline through trial and error is a pretty based retard thing to do.

[Anonymous No.9385389]

>>9384208
I like to view SR2 as a Disc 2 that locks you in once you reach it, albeit one on a totally different system with entirely new graphics. Typically I can look past linear games that end clearly, but the thing that becomes hard to overlook in SR2 is how the predecessor features an open world with secrets that become open to you as you gain new abilities, and that is gone entirely. Parts of it are on rails almost, particularly the end "Boss Rush" where Raziel cannot take any damage at all.

[Anonymous No.9385401]

>>9385389
I want to add too that I am aware there are checkpoints should you ever lose all your health in the spectral realm, but the combat is so low stakes you'd basically have to get really unlucky against a demon enemy.

[COPIUM SNEEDMAN No.9385640]

>>9383897
Explain

[Anonymous No.9385642]

Funny coincidence that this thread is up as I just finished playing the series like a week ago. It's a great series, some of the games are better than others but none of them are bad games. Most shared great writing, atmosphere and overall design. I thought the plot was convoluted but never the less very interesting and original. The LoK games are made with a lot of care and passion and I hope to see more games like this in the future.

My rating of the games from best to least good:
1. Blood Omen: Legacy of Kain
2. Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver
3. Blood Omen 2. Legacy of kain
4. Legacy of Kain: Defiance
5. Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver 2

[Anonymous No.9385658]

>>9385640
https://www.thelostworlds.net/SR1/index.html

[Anonymous No.9385801]

>>9385389
as i understood they had to cut all the fun stuff, thanks eidos glad you went down

[Anonymous No.9385927]

>>9385380
>wasnt it a plot point in SR2 that whenever they alter history they also get their memories altered accordingly.
Yes. It's why he suddenly realized they fell for the Hylden's trap as soon as it happened.

[Anonymous No.9385938]

>>9385389
>particularly the end "Boss Rush" where Raziel cannot take any damage at all.
That should bother me, everything about it screams something where it should. But it's so tied to the narrative that it simply didn't. The real problem is that since combat is so janky, even while completely invincible it still feels tedious.
But from a writing standpoint I love it. There isn't a single LoK game that I dislike in terms of its writing, even Blood Omen 2 has a lot of neat moments.

[Anonymous No.9386087]

who was in the wrong?

[Anonymous No.9386115]

>>9386087
Of course Kain because at the time it was an act of petty jealousy but in the end his actions benefited all of Nosgoth. I don't think he knew the scope of his actions at the time, only until he struck Raziel with the Reaver.

[Anonymous No.9386282]

>>9386115
To think Kain did a homer, that's wild

[Anonymous No.9386620]

>>9385642
I could see putting BO2 above SR2, but above Defiance?

I love the series and Kain is absolutely my favorite video game character. It's kind of interesting how the Blood Omen games are pretty self contained. BO2 also has the benefit of being a good pick up and play, so it's probably the most accessible of the games.

SR1 is a more interesting game. Putting in the code to unlock all of Raziel's ability opens the game up from the beginning, making it neat to just explore all the corners of the game.

If they make a new LoK game, they really need to make like 70% of the game not related to the plot. That was part of what made SR1 and BO1 interesting. Even BO2 despite being a straight linear game, it's like the entire game is that unrelated side stuff happening to Kain.

SR2 had the most interesting story but the game was a drag. Defiance got a good balance of game and story, it just sucked that it was part 3 of the story (and all the retreading of the vampire citadel).

[Anonymous No.9387085]

why did all of Kain's ''sons'' become horrible deformed demons?

[Anonymous No.9387271]

>>9375952
>>9375990
Doesn't Kain look the way he does in Soul Reaver specifically because he's a human-turned-vampire rather than a true vampire?

[Anonymous No.9387291]

>>9387271
The real question is why Raziel grew wings and (in wraith form) turned blue like the "true" vampires?

[Anonymous No.9387302]

>>9387291
Wasn't he created/born a vampire, rather than turned into a vampire?

[Anonymous No.9387305]

>>9387302
Unless I'm forgetting something he was always a human Sarafan like the rest of his brothers.

[Anonymous No.9387314]

>>9387305
Oh yeah he was, then Kain brought him back. Some weird shit happend to Kain after Vorador's death.

[Anonymous No.9387556]

>dooms Nosgoth by refusing to sacrifice himself
>becomes emperor and builts his throne right on his own pillar
what an asshole

[Anonymous No.9387595]

>>9386115
I'm not actually 100% sure Kain understood why the Reaver shattered against Raziel.

[Anonymous No.9387603]

>>9386620
>It's kind of interesting how the Blood Omen games are pretty self contained.
For 1 yes but like half of BO2's plot makes no sense if you didn't beat SR2.

[Anonymous No.9387616]

>>9387085
Corruption of the pillars. After the opening of Soul Reaver he time traveled to Nosgoth's future. He did not actually wait a thousand years, so he looks the same as his mostly humanoid children. And because Raziel purified his soul at the end of Defiance, it is safe to say he will not mutate further. Not to mention Kain wasn't created like other vampires, Mortanius took Janos Audron's heart and shoved it in Kain's corpse.

[Anonymous No.9387619]

>>9387556
It turns out the sacrifice would've been a Hylden trap anyway

[Anonymous No.9388178]

>>9386620
I really wanted to like Defiance but there were two things which really bogged it down for me: The camera system and the whole fetch-different-reavers thing. I'm a sucker for fixed camera angles but they're easy to mess up. The camera angles in Defiance often felt annoying, especially in confined spaces where they constantly turn around. It also felt very awkward to move the camera around. The whole gimmick of going into warp gates to fetch different reavers felt tedious. I felt like I wasn't advancing the plot, it just felt like filler to make the game longer. I also don't see the need for Raziel to have like 8 different variations of the Soul Reaver. If it hadn't been for these two things I'd have rated it above Blood Omen 2.
Still, Defiance had the series hallmarks. Great writing, story and atmosphere. I think Defiance has the best version of Raziel's spirit realm. All the different sounds like crying and distorted speech echoing around really made it feel like a nightmare. The level design was great, I especially liked Vorador's Mansion. The storyline of Kain and Raziel working together centuries apart to defy their fates was epic and really cool. Combat was simple but fun. A lot of neat little tricks, like using telekinesis to throw enemies into flames and they'd actually run around on fire and ignite other enemies they'd run into. Also throwing them off ledges and hearing their screams echo as they fall. It was also fun to combat the big statue enemies, especially once I realized they could fall victim to friendly fire.
Another thing I really liked was the faithfulness to the series. Like using the spirit ream sound effect from Soul Reaver 1 in the intro logos and playing Ozar Midrashim during Raziel's boss fights. Overall Defiance is a very well-made game that was drawn out a bit too much.

[Anonymous No.9388187]

>>9388178
And I know Blood Omen 2 gets a bad rep but I find it criminally underrated. Yes, it's more action-oriented than the other games but that doesn't make it a bad game. If you approach it as an unrelated spin-off it's very enjoyable. It's sort of like Legacy of Kain's Silent Hill 4.
I think Blood Omen 2 is one of the few games which really lets you play as the "bad guy". Fucking shit up as Kain was fantastic. The combat was simple but I felt the different weapons and abilities helped keep it entertaining. Weapons having different execution moves was really cool. One thing I really liked was how you could use the jump ability to lock on to enemies from a far. It's also great how malicious Kain is, like you can grab enemies by the throat and kick them while they're down. Kain even laughs sometimes when you do it. The blood drinking animation is the best in the series and it was really cool that the game focuses the camera angle on you during it. Also the fact that drinking blood makes Kain stronger actually encourages the player to kill humans for their blood. The game literally encourages you to murder innocents lol.
I really liked the design of Blood Omen 2. It's like gothic fantasy on steroids. Kain's costumes were great and I just really loved the overall design of Kain. How he moves, how he stands in combat with claws out, how he glides through the air like an evil phantom. The level design was spot on as well, going from from middle-ages slums to canyons to alien fortresses. Using Kain's different abilities to traverse the environment was fun and the levels all had great atmosphere.
My only gripe with the game was an abundance of cutscenes, some of them very long. While I really enjoyed the game the cutscenes did not age well and felt very clunky to watch. Also it has the worst writing out of the LoK games but let's be honest, you're not playing BO2 for the writing.

[Anonymous No.9388204]

>>9388178
The game is so frequently buggy that every time it cut to the warp gate transition I thought the game had crashed because it would hang on these sequences with no audio.

[Anonymous No.9388221]

>>9388204
I experienced the silent warp gate animation too. I thought it was a bug but I looked up a playthrough on Youtube and it was the same there. There was also this one cutscene that begins with a mass of bats flying through a valley and they eventually merge into Kain, that cutscene was completely silent as well. I also thought that was a bug but apparently not! I'm not sure if both those things were intended.

[Anonymous No.9388227]

>>9387595
I don't think he knew why either but I'm sure that he knew it was significant.

[Anonymous No.9388273]

>>9388221
There were a couple of instances where the game would incorrectly load Raziel into Kain's areas and vice versa. If Kain was loaded into the spectral realm you couldn't progress. Even the hidden cartoon Kain and Raziel were buggy and had no animations for opening doors.

[Anonymous No.9388282]

>>9388187
BO2 isn't inherently bad but it feels so lacklustre and cheap. If you want a laugh, activate the Soul Reaver cheat to witness it clip through Kain's shoulder for the remainder of the game once you clear the industrial quarter. This is also how I learned the lore system is pointless, because the game automatically catches you up should you not drink enough blood by the time you get to the next level, so unless you want to gain more HP during the level you're on there's really no need to activate lore crates or drink blood past healing damage.

[Anonymous No.9388295]

>>9388273
I never experienced that bug. Sounds like a fucking ballbreaker lol.
>hidden cartoon Kain and Raziel
Wait, what?

[Anonymous No.9388296]

>>9388282
I never knew the game automatically did that. I always drank all the blood/opened all the crates I could find so I never experienced it.

[Anonymous No.9388305]

>>9388295
There's a cheat to turn Raziel and Kain into cartoon versions of themselves and it's fun for the most part, but tons of animations are seemingly missing.

>>9388296
Same, I checked it with a dry run after first encountering it and it happened without the Soul Reaver mode being activated. Little disappointing.

[Anonymous No.9388337]

>>9388305
Yeah, it is disappointing. It always sucks when developers dumb down a game.

[Anonymous No.9388403]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wejWbyGnNsg&ab_channel=Grewky

[Anonymous No.9388421]

>>9388403
>turel grown into a massive bat monster in the pit
>also went insane in the process
>revered as a god by the humans
>actually a puppet for the hylden
>Would I remain if I could GET OUT?

The writing in these fucking games is amazing. Seriously one of the best in vidya history.

[Anonymous No.9388457]

Is there a good YouTube video that summarises LoK's story? I played Blood Omen but I found the sequel ass.

[Anonymous No.9388479]

>>9388457
Yeah I recommend fucking off, that's a good one.

[Anonymous No.9388492]

>>9388457
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KLzHqTiaOU&list=PLzYNNF-AUcPxDvD4Z18KsvDscYWdWuJjA&ab_channel=StrictlyFantasy

I don't think there is any one video but this guy's character study videos on different LoK characters offers some good insight into the series. Play the games before watching.

[Anonymous No.9388918]

>there will never be another game series as well written as LoK ever again

[Anonymous No.9388937]

Just killed Malchiah. How many more times will I be loudly thinking
>WHAT DO I DO
>WHERE DO I GO
before the end of the game? Some shit in this game is really not designed to be obvious.

[Anonymous No.9389263]

>>9388937
Welcome to old video games

[Anonymous No.9389385]

>>9388937
Listen. To. The. Dialogue. In. The. Cutscenes. That. You. Can't. Skip.

[Anonymous No.9389703]

>>9388937
Soul Reaver 1 is the definition of a normie filter lol.
It filtered me too but I did finish it.

[Anonymous No.9389779]

>>9388187
Is it true drinking blood doesn't actually count for the level up mechanic?

[Anonymous No.9389827]

>>9375808
Are there decent PC ports of these games? At least Blood Omen and Soul Reaver?

Soul Reaver is fine on ps1 but Blood Omen's shitty menu load times make me not want to play the original again if a better optimized version exists

[Anonymous No.9390267]

>>9388403
what a great scene

[Anonymous No.9390435]

>>9388937
The general idea for progression is
>oh, I have a new ability now. Let me think, was there somewhere else earlier that I could get past if I do what the boss was able to do?

[Anonymous No.9390446]

>>9389827
I hear they're mostly decent.

>>9388421
>>9388918
It depends on what you're looking for. Not retro but Amy Hennig also wrote the first 3 Uncharted games and while that's a very different genre (Indiana Jones-style adventuring and treasure-hunting), her dialog writing that she's known for is still clearly there.

[Anonymous No.9390450]

>>9389827
The gog version of BO1 almost completely eliminated load times.

[Anonymous No.9391003]

>>9389827
Blood Omen GOG with Wrace's Patch is the best version.
For Soul Reaver, Flycast HD for best graphics. Redream for best performance. PC with Wrace's patch if you want subtitles.

[Anonymous No.9391030]

>>9375808
because its written by an english lit major who should have been serving coffee instead of writing for games

[Anonymous No.9391041]

>>9391030
Sorry it happened to you and not her.

[Anonymous No.9391121]

>>9388918
>there will never be another game series as well written as *Blood Omen ever again

[Anonymous No.9391124]

>>9375808
He's the good guy

[Anonymous No.9391178]

>>9391121
There were was though, Soul Reaver.

[Anonymous No.9391179]

>>9391178
>t. Low iq nigger.

[Anonymous No.9391183]

>>9391179
Le cope, le seethe et le dilate.

[Anonymous No.9391185]

>>9391183
Funny use of the Spanish meme. I admit defeat.

[Anonymous No.9391202]

>>9387556
>sacrifice himself
>doom Nosgoth to repeated cycle of corruption
>accomplish nothing and die in vain
OH NO

[Anonymous No.9391204]

>>9375956
Blood Omen is better

[Anonymous No.9391207]

>>9376178
>>9376181
moar

[Anonymous No.9391212]

>>9391207

>>9391204
Not enough. Blood Omen is the ONLY good game.

[Anonymous No.9391214]

>>9391207
>>9391212

[Anonymous No.9391216]

>>9391207
>>9391214

[Anonymous No.9391217]

>>9391204
i love how Kain describes every single thing in your inventory, i coul listen him talking for hours

[Anonymous No.9391219]

>>9391207
>>9391216

[Anonymous No.9391221]

>>9391207
>>9391219

[Anonymous No.9391224]

>>9391207
>>9391221

>>9391217
Yes.

[Anonymous No.9391225]

>>9391207
>>9391224

[Anonymous No.9391289]

>>9391207
Imagine being this new to the series.

[Anonymous No.9391294]

>>9391212
It's better than Zelda that's for sure.

[Anonymous No.9391575]

fuck me time to replay Blood Omen
here, listen to this before i get back
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kDzqScUs-E

[Anonymous No.9391578]

>>9391212
>>9391214
>>9391216
>>9391219
>>9391221
>>9391224
>>9391225
astonishingly based, thank you breh

[Anonymous No.9391638]

The Heart of Darkness.

[Anonymous No.9391670]

Alas poor Nubraptor, I knew him well
...well not really

[Anonymous No.9391674]

VERY WELL OLD FOOL
IF IT IS DEATH YOU SEEK
*I* WILL NOT DENY YOU

[Anonymous No.9391681]

>>9391638
THE HEART OF DARKNESS

[Anonymous No.9391736]

>>9391638
>>9391681
"Reputed to have been ripped from the chest of the greatest vampire to have ever existed, Janos Audron, the Heart of Darkness restores vampiric unlife. Life is precious, Janos discovered – as it was torn throbbing and bleeding from his own body."

[Anonymous No.9391748]

>Implode
>Of all the methods I employ, this is perhaps the cruelest, causing my victim's body to shrink on itself, crushing bones and rupturing organs 'til the pressure inside bursts the sac of fleshy skin, spraying its contents for all to see.

[Anonymous No.9391778]

I seek only a kyoah

[Anonymous No.9391781]

>>9391736
>Reputed to have been ripped from the chest of the greatest vampire to have ever existed
How many fucking hearts does this dude have?

[Anonymous No.9391815]

>>9391781
He IS the "greatest vampire", so his heart presumably grows back, which immediately gets ripped out again.

[Anonymous No.9391870]

>that moment near the end of Defiance where Raziel says Vae Victis when he rips out Kain's heart
It's the little touches

[Anonymous No.9391875]

>>9391670
how come that old coot was banging Ariel? how did he do it bros?

[Anonymous No.9391889]

>>9391875
Nupraptor has mind control powers.

[Anonymous No.9391894]

>>9391875
He raptured her for some nuptial action

[Anonymous No.9392114]

>>9378249
>>9378254
>>9378417

Besides being a vampire created through Mortanius' necromancy instead of sired from the original vampires, Kain was still corrupted from the madness of the Circle at that point. He'd remain that way all the way up to the end, when Raziel purifies him.

I wish they'd take up the series again, but two things make me dread it:
-too much woke offal in the game industry, it would RUIN LoK
-Simon Templeman isn't going to be around forever, and it wouldn't be the same without him.

...For that matter, where is our Elric of Melnibone game/animated series? Templeman was born to be Elric's voice actor!

[Anonymous No.9392139]

>>9391778
There is no cure for death.

[Anonymous No.9392146]

>>9391875
He was pretty funny

[Anonymous No.9392161]

>>9392114
one last game to finish the story, for it to be like shenmue 3 but done right

[Anonymous No.9392184]

>>9392114
>Simon Templeman isn't going to be around forever, and it wouldn't be the same without him.
And Tony Jay is dead. And I'm pretty sure Michael Bell is retired.

[Anonymous No.9392341]

>>9392184
>And I'm pretty sure Michael Bell is retired.
he said in an interview that he's too old for voicing Raziel, but that he ''could voice his uncle or something like that'' lol

[Anonymous No.9392343]

>>9392341
He's too old for much of anything. Hell he was old back in '87 when he played the administrator in Encounter at Farpoint, the very first episode of TNG.

[Anonymous No.9392730]

>>9391781
Amy Hennig actually said that those are attempted copies of the true heart.

[Anonymous No.9392743]

>>9392114
>>9392341
>most of the voice actors are dead/retired
>LoK: Dead Sun had terrible writing
>woke pseudo-political bullshit could very likely ruin a sequel
>defiance ends on an unresolved note

It hurts.

[Anonymous No.9393097]

>>9391778
the corruption of the pillars ran a train on my boy Kain, he even lost his fingers

[Anonymous No.9393239]

>>9392743
>LoK: Dead Sun had terrible writing
Thankfully it died before the world had to be exposed to it beyond a short teaser.

[Anonymous No.9393454]

>>9392730
>Amy Hennig
Nothing to do with Blood Omen. Fuck off.

[Anonymous No.9394432]

>>9393454
Nta but I have never understood why Crystal Dynamics is put on such a pedestal over the rest of the series. Gameplay-wise yeah it's good but it's mostly a gothic zelda. But narratively? It's mostly the same kind of stuff we got later, it's not like there's some gulf in quality between the two or that it's even a radically different kind of storytelling. It's not like massive retcons happened or they just ignored parts of BO1's story, if anything they painstakingly went to the effort to all make it fit into one cohesive narrative.

[Anonymous No.9394452]

>>9394432
>I have never understood why Crystal Dynamics is put on such a pedestal over the rest of the series.
did you mean blood omen/Silicon knights?

[Anonymous No.9394467]

>>9394432
>Crystal Dynamics
Blood Omen was not made by Crystal Dynamic. It's literally the only one that's not.
>put on such a pedestal over the rest of the series
Blood Omen is the one which is least talked about.
>but it's mostly a gothic zelda
That sounds amazing.
>narratively? It's mostly the same kind of stuff we got later
No. And even if that is true, that's not a good thing. And Blood Omen has much more going for it than plot. The atmosphere is unmatched.

[Anonymous No.9394507]

>>9388178
normally I like fixed cameras but in Defiance they killed my favourite thing about the previous games - exploration. I remember playing the opening and being disappointed that I couldn't take a good look around the place or get any closer to the murals and statues.

[Anonymous No.9394806]

>>9394452
>>9394467
Right my bad I meant Silicon Knights. I keep forgetting that Crystal Dynamics was the Soul Reaver people because I always just called them Eidos.

[Anonymous No.9394815]

>>9394467
>And even if that is true, that's not a good thing.
Yes it is because the narrative fucking carries this series, even at its best the gameplay was just serviceable.
>The atmosphere is unmatched.
I'm going to be completely honest, the value of atmosphere is lost on me in videogames. The idea of how a world "feels" in a game just goes over my head and it just seems like a vague way of people saying "i like how the visuals match the music" a lot of the time. To me it's just a fancier, more grounded version of SOUL.
But then I'm autistic so I simply don't see artistic merit in things, I'm very literal-minded.

[Anonymous No.9394818]

>>9394467
>Blood Omen is the one which is least talked about.
No that's BO2 by far.

[Anonymous No.9395359]

>>9394432
>It's not like massive retcons happened or they just ignored parts of BO1's story
Hash'ak'gik was supposed to be a demon whose cult is specialized in possession, explaining how he had taken over Mortanious' body. And Nupraptor didn't cause the rest of the circle to go mad because "they're symbiotically bound", he did it out of spite.

[Anonymous No.9395517]

>>9395359
>Hash'ak'gik was supposed to be a demon whose cult is specialized in possession
The cult is so vaguely defined in BO1 that I don't even know if that one counts as a retcon. Though technically that description DOES fit the Hylden to a T. The real retcon is that Hash'ak'gik is actually Turel, possessed by the Hylden.
>And Nupraptor didn't cause the rest of the circle to go mad because "they're symbiotically bound", he did it out of spite.
I'm pretty sure that was never retconned, he still deliberately turned his mentalist powers against the circle out of anguish for losing his waifu.

If anything is a retcon it's that the "Good Ending" was a Hylden trap.

[Anonymous No.9395814]

>>9394815
If plot is the only thing redeemable about the game, then it is a movie game. But that's no surprise, after all Amy is the one behind all those shitty Sony movie games. I don't understand how anyone can sit through the repetitive gameplay of Soul Reavers just to watch some ugly cutscenes which supposedly tell a good story. I'd rather just read the plot on wiki and save me time.

[Anonymous No.9396081]

>>9395359
Where does it say that Nupraptor did it out of spite?

[Anonymous No.9396114]

>>9380672
Vampires were denying him his nuggies. Can't devour shit if souls inhabit immortal bodies.

[Anonymous No.9396216]

>>9396114
It was the Hylden who made their bodies immortal, though.

[Anonymous No.9396786]

>>9395517
>I'm pretty sure that was never retconned, he still deliberately turned his mentalist powers against the circle out of anguish for losing his waifu.
SR2 says it was because the guardians are symbiotically bound.

>>9396081
>[BO1] Ariel to Kain: "The Nine of the Protectors of Hope were sworn to use their powers to preserve our world. Now these pillars have been corrupted by a traitor.
My murder at the hands of this beast drove my love Nupraptor mad. Now he spreads misery and pain among the Circle, crumbling the very foundation of Nosgoth."
[BO1] Kain: "Nupraptor, with his blind act of vengeance threatened to destroy all of Nosgoth.
Each Circle member was bonded to the Pillar he served. The Pillars reflected the mental state of their servants, and as the minds of the Circle degenerated and descended further into dementia, the Pillars crumbled.
To restore them, each member of the Circle had to die, and the artifact that served as their link to the Pillar had to be returned.
Only when all the Pillars were restored, did Ariel claim my curse would end. And so my hunt for Nupraptor began."

[Anonymous No.9396796]

>>9396786
Oh and this:
http://www.dark-chronicle.co.uk/resources/bo1_faq/faqchars.htm
>A magician of phenomenal mental and psychic ability, Nupraptor is hypersensitive to peoples' emotions and thoughts. This constant exposure has made him extremely unstable - prone to rash action and sometimes unpredictable and illogical decision making. He is a passionate man, however, and very loyal to those who are special to him. And so it was with Ariel, the original Balance wizard. When Nupraptor discovers that Mortanius, under the malevolent control of the Dark Entity, Hash'ak'gik, has murdered Ariel, he goes over the edge. He vows vengeance upon Mortanius and the fates that have caused this event, and turns his powerful magic to bear on the other members of the Circle of Nine. All across Nosgoth, the minds of the sensitive and intellectual are blasted by relentless waves of hatred. There is no stopping the assault. When the enchantment ends, the entire Circle is quite insane, some raving like madmen, others maliciously in control of their actions... And now, Nosgoth is at their mercy.

[Anonymous No.9397053]

>>9395814
Because it's a silly story carried by really good voice acting.

[Anonymous No.9397079]

>>9395814
>If plot is the only thing redeemable about the game
Well good thing it's not then. The LoK series has good writing, voice acting, visual aesthetics, music (if anything I think the series' music is understated in how good it is), even the gameplay I would say was only outright bad in SR2. I wouldn't want them to just be movies because I don't think they would work as just movies. BO1 and SR1 are both effectively metroidvanias and that gameplay format is directly tied to the story itself.

[Anonymous No.9397429]

>>9395814
>Amy is the one behind all those shitty Sony movie games.
Calling Uncharted "movie games" is quite frankly, an insult to movies. With Indiana Jones every scene is meticulously made and acted. There's a nice mix of practical effects and competent acting. Now Uncharted is just some boatride for 20 minutes while you have to listen to some boring dialogue. That's not a movie.

[Anonymous No.9398696]

>>9397079
>I think the series' music is understated in how good it is
Fucking preach. The first time I heard this track in Blood Omen I got chills down my spine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cc1ajxywgkk&ab_channel=IsaacMoring

[Anonymous No.9398704]

>>9394815
>the narrative fucking carries this series, even at its best the gameplay was just serviceable.
This.

[Anonymous No.9398963]

>>9398696
Kain's Mausoleum hits really hard with subwoofers.

[Anonymous No.9399757]

for me it's SR1's overworld design. learning to swim, exploring the depths, finding the optional fire reaver shrine, and then emerging out of that pool near the start of the game was a great setpiece. the hack and slash combat kind of sucks but I like nailing vampires with spears, and I like that you have to obey vampire lore to actually kill them. it's not like you have to do much hacking and slashing anyway once you've got the insta-kill reaver 1/4th into the game. I also like all the puzzles that aren't block puzzles, although that arguably only leaves 20% of them. the shifter stuff is cool, changing the architecture and the way weight and water behaves.
basically I think it's solid enough, it's just the endless block puzzles and KRRM HRRM SKSHHH SKSHHH that lets it down.

[Anonymous No.9399768]

>>9399757
Thought this was Ralph Wiggum at first.

[Anonymous No.9399801]

>>9399757
The melee range is way too low. The dash attack is the most reliable way to hit enemies. This game should've been remade without the lock puzzles and more combat abilities.

[Anonymous No.9399915]

>>9376274
you cant possibly claim that its "far more cartoonish" when the graphics leave so much more to the imagination, and whats actually on the screen tilts the imagination into far darker territory than what soul reaver puts on screen

the color palette, the weather, the literal darkness, the way it presents its world with nonstop grimdark brutality and horror etc etc. It only looks mildly comical in the cutscenes which I always just thought/ treated as early FMV relics which were never going to look "serious" or good if they planned on using them

[Anonymous No.9399932]

>Protagonist is literally missing his lower jaw and intestines
>Enemies are introduced in cutscenes where they're shown goring the fuck out of humans
>The methods to kill them are just as brutal
>Raziel's brothers look like Zdzisław Beksiński paintings by the time he fights them
>So many people are dead by the time Raziel wakes up that he rarely comes upon another soul in each area of the overworld
>"Cartoony"

[Anonymous No.9400038]

>>9399757
do you have more raziel spiderman edits? i like those

[Anonymous No.9400130]

>>9375808
Because Kain was a real nigga.

[Anonymous No.9400139]

>>9383617
It does have a certain elegant finality to it.

[Anonymous No.9400157]

>>9400139
okay that's pretty funny

[Anonymous No.9400292]

>>9398696
Every game was filled wih bangers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0j_B00LXrE

[Anonymous No.9400327]

>>9400038

[Anonymous No.9401072]

>>9399757
I liked how much effort they put into making the block puzzles varied. Like you've got block puzzles where they have a hole in the middle and you gotta divert water through the holes. Block puzzles where you gotta line up an image. Block puzzles where you gotta stacks blocks upon blocks. SR1 has block puzzles for days!

[Anonymous No.9401087]

>>9401072
I honestly like the block puzzles, but if it had the same quality puzzles that SR2 would later have, it would have really improved the game. I think the cut areas would have really added some variety, because Raziel would then have to guess where he would need to shift planes, as the portals would be gone. He would have also needed to lower and raise water levels beneath the human city to find the vampire priestess, and use the possession ability to manipulate other vampires into accomplishing tasks. I liked how, in the alpha build, the spirit forge and glyph altar would be activated by possessing a vampire and sacrificing it in the temple.

[Anonymous No.9401139]

>>9401087
That's pretty cool in the alpha build. In my opinion what the game really needs is a world map.

[Anonymous No.9401476]

[Anonymous No.9401504]

Please post moar Kain and Raziel edits.

[Anonymous No.9401525]

>oh god, did I leave the paradox on?

[Anonymous No.9401527]

>oh right, the automatic abhoring system

[Anonymous No.9401528]

[Anonymous No.9401532]

>>9401528
Why can't I hold all these soul reavers?

[Anonymous No.9401534]

[Anonymous No.9401536]

[Anonymous No.9401538]

[Anonymous No.9401543]

extras

[Anonymous No.9401548]

[Anonymous No.9401551]

[Anonymous No.9401559]

>>9401551
>>9401538
Kane and his wife are cute! CUTE!!!

[Anonymous No.9401580]

>>9401534
I fucking lol'd.

[Anonymous No.9401589]

Would it have been so hard to put names for each location on gates? I'd rather walk around.

[Anonymous No.9401615]

>>9401589
I think if they had included the world map as planned then it wouldn't have been as big of an issue.

[Anonymous No.9401635]

>>9401589
Destroys the immersion otherwise.

[Anonymous No.9401679]

>>9401635
As opposed to the button prompts that show up whenever you learn a new ability?

[Anonymous No.9401768]

>>9400292
>>9398696
I like how SR1 feels very dread and depressing and SR2 sounds very mystic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLA3fYV6494
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bPxkggJlj0

[Anonymous No.9401773]

>>9401072
>>9401087
>>9399757
I'm kinda neutral on it, to me it simply said "well we made Tomb Raider and people liked that, and that had block puzzles so SR should have them too"

[Anonymous No.9402074]

>>9400327
>>9401476
>>9401525
>>9401527
>>9401476
>>9401534
>>9401528
>>9401538
>>9401536
>>9401543
>>9401548
>>9401551
love 'em

[Anonymous No.9402219]

I demand this Legacy of Kain thread amasses enough posts to hit the bump limit.

[Anonymous No.9402886]

>>9402219
okay

[Anonymous No.9402913]

>>9401534
magnificent

[Anonymous No.9402936]

God I fucking love good dynamic music in games, and Soul Reaver has some of the best.
https://youtu.be/9fOuwfGjehA
https://youtu.be/v83o0AYMLfM
https://youtu.be/1QOkoIl5MRs
https://youtu.be/60lThnhaWQE
https://youtu.be/HfXk_ANGBOo
https://youtu.be/rTN9_u4qNiI
The suite for the necropolis even got reused for Defiance.
https://youtu.be/Y6YjSRA3Ky4
https://youtu.be/ShpNtgVtaJU

[Anonymous No.9403052]

>>9375937
I hated those fucking spider boys the first time I played that game.

[Anonymous No.9403492]

>>9403052
You only encounter them in Zephon's level so they're not that bad.

[Anonymous No.9403496]

>>9403492
It's cool you seemingly would have fought them again but once you returned to the Silenced Cathedral and started removing the webbing blocking the pipes.

[Anonymous No.9403527]

>>9398696
On the Road to Vengeance is probably my second favorite theme in the series, but #1 for me has to be the remix of Sarafan Stronghold from the opening of Defiance.
It's more subtle and brooding than the SR2 track, perfect for being holed up in a snowy fortress, plotting world domination. :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJCl7qovfKY

[Anonymous No.9403531]

>>9403527
I remember that track from Defiance. Brings back comfy memories.

[Anonymous No.9403753]

>>9403527
It really is the best track to open the game with.

[Anonymous No.9403846]

>>9402936
I knew I recognized that track in Defiance.
I never knew Soul Reaver had dynamic music but I hear it now when you link all the different versions of the track. The Necropolis is such a good level, great atmosphere.

[Anonymous No.9403880]

>>9403846
SR2 has like 4 tracks for every area depending on it being peaceful, enemies being nearby, you fighting enemies, and being in the spectral realm

[Anonymous No.9403887]

>>9403880
The spectral realm audio was so quiet it basically had no music for me.

[Anonymous No.9403902]

>>9403887
The spectral realm doesn't really have music, it's more like ambience.

[Anonymous No.9403913]

>>9403902
Well it had music in the first game.

[Anonymous No.9404468]

I'm quite frankly stunned at the leap in visual quality between SR1 and 2 considering it was only a year between releases. SR2 was practically a launch title for the PS2 and yet it has better facial animations in cutscenes than some late-era PS2 games.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1JjBFfBk8I

[Anonymous No.9404618]

>>9404468
It still has very impressive facial animations, moreso than later games on the PS3 and 360. It probably helps the character faces are very stylised, but I remember being very impressed at how expressive Moebius is.

[Anonymous No.9404653]

>>9404618
>It probably helps the character faces are very stylised
Kinda? I think they were actually trying to go for realistic at the time with characters like Moebius, it's just that you can't really do much with Kain or Raziel in terms of realism.

[Anonymous No.9404907]

>>9404468
The later Legacy of Kain games have some fantastic cutscenes excluding Blood Omen 2. The cutscene linked earlier in the thread where Raziel meets Turel is fucking awesome. So well done.

[Anonymous No.9404928]

>>9404907
It didn't happen but I like how originally he and Dumah were the least deformed lieutenants and were bipedal giants.

[Anonymous No.9405163]

It was then, and not a moment before, that the waves of anon's past flooded his mind. Fragments of memory coalesced to uncover the dark truth bound to Soul Reaver's cliffhanger ending - he had beaten the game before, yet he lost all record of this feat to the wheel of Moebius.
His mind reeling from the swift extinguishing effect of this anti-climatic ending, anon inquires the Council of the Shitpostelim on the qualities of Soul Reaver 2, and if its gameplay is worth more than a cursory glance.

[Anonymous No.9405398]

>>9375990
lmao Blood Omen literally couldn't have been more cartoony than it already is. The music just does a damn good job of hiding it.

[Anonymous No.9405831]

I'll always be thankful to these games for giving me one of my favorite words: malefactor. I know it's just the opposite of a benefactor but it's not a word people use.

[Anonymous No.9406223]

>>9404928
His design looks vaguely similar to his appearance in Defiance.

[Anonymous No.9406593]

Soul Reaver is the definition of a hidden gem. I used to think this game was the black sheep of the LoK family but the amount of content this game hides under the hood is astounding. The game world is surprisingly complex. There's a hidden respect system with the human enemies, if you don't kill any humans they never turn hostile to you and instead revere you. There's also an entire human fortress level hidden away that the game never tells you about. Not to mention the magic system which is more or less hidden. There's a great game here but you'll only experience it if you seek it out, something I wish more games had the balls to do. Cause Soul Reaver is a really ballsy game. I have to give the developers credit for doing something completely different from Blood Omen instead of staying safe and rehashing the same formula.
Soul Reaver has hands down the best writing and voice acting in the series. The intro cinematic still gives me goosebumps and Ozar Midrashim is the best piece of music to come out of LoK. Raziel is a great and unique character and his paradoxical nature makes him interesting.
The level design is great. The ruined world of Nosgoth is harrowing to traverse through. It's a completely fucked world where both sides, vampire and human, have lost. The spectral realm was a creative way to utilize the environment.
The one thing the game really lacks is a map or some way to guide the player through the game world. It's huge and involves a lot of backtracking. I remember the narrator telling me to "go north" and I'm just like "derp" cause I have no idea which direction that is in the game.

[Anonymous No.9406616]

>>9406593
I agree with your post but it's arguably the most popular game in the series. It's not "hidden" at all.

[Anonymous No.9406645]

>>9406223
Eh, "vaguely" is the keyword because it's basically an entirely new design in Defiance. The two details that were retained were the mandibles and the white eyes.

[Anonymous No.9406648]

>>9406616
I thought SR got a bad rep? It's very cryptic and I imagine a lot of people would miss most of the content.

[Anonymous No.9406672]

>>9401551
>in the SR ending as it was originally planned Ariel cries in agony when Kain's soul is absorbed into the blade, because now she'll have to spend eternity together with the criature she hates the most for forcing her to exist as a wraith, haunting the pillars for thousands of years.

>Kain laughs

[Anonymous No.9406683]

>>9406672
lel>>9401538

[Anonymous No.9406708]

The best thing about Defiance is that it's a remake of Blood Omen 1 with Raziel in the place of Kain. But he chooses integrity and accepts the sacrifice.

[Anonymous No.9406806]

>>9406648
It's not fucking cryptic lol

Literally pay fucking attention to the cutscenes.

[Anonymous No.9406846]

For years it always confused me that if we saw Vorador kill all but 3 of the Circle, why does Kain have to go around killing them in Blood Omen? Only recently did I realize that Kain was going around killing the new Circle brought in to replace the guys Vorador killed.

[Anonymous No.9406849]

>they planned to bring back all of Kain's BO1 spells in the game after Defiance but they never got to make it
Goddamnit

[Anonymous No.9407063]

>>9406708
How many times does it need to be said? The game was rigged, the humans are not able to sustain the pillars, only the vampires can.

[Anonymous No.9407452]

>>9407063
It was rigged so hard that even the edge of the coin was accounted for in the rigging

[Anonymous No.9407463]

>>9385640
Here:
https://files.catbox.moe/kweesq.ogg

[Anonymous No.9407785]

>>9406849
Truly a tragedy.

[Anonymous No.9408865]

>>9379456
lmao

[Anonymous No.9408941]

>>9383617
>raziel kills kain
>plays the massive pipe organ to wipe out all vampires
Wouldn't this just have been the end of the LoK series?

[Anonymous No.9408949]

>>9375952
Matthewmatosis dedicated like seven minutes of one his videos to explaining why the protag design is so incredible

[Anonymous No.9408964]

>>9408941
Yeah and it honestly would have been better off for it. It's easily missed but a big theme in Blood Omen and Soul Reaver is the theme of free will. Ignoring the wider meta narrative of the later games, at the end of Blood Omen, the player gets to make the choice about whether Kain lives or dies, which is Kain's only real choice given he leapt at the chance of revenge without considering the wider implications. In Soul Reaver, Raziel does everything the Elder God tells him to, right up to this original intended conclusion of wiping out all of the vampires and remaining a servant forever. It's with that ending, that any other version of Soul Reaver 2 may have tried to give Raziel a totally different conclusion by having him travel back in time.

[Anonymous No.9408968]

>>9408949
W h o

[Anonymous No.9408971]

>>9408968
I know it can be tough, personally when I don't know someone I try using Google, that usually helps

[Anonymous No.9408972]

>>9408971
Yeah I don't watch JewTube

[Anonymous No.9408974]

>>9408972
I wasn't putting a gun to your head and forcing you to respond to my post but ok

[Anonymous No.9409019]

>>9408949
I literally couldn't care less.

[Anonymous No.9409384]

I wish there was some way to mod out all of the PLEASE, HELP ME KIND SIR

[Anonymous No.9409387]

>>9409384
UUUUUUGGGHHH

[Anonymous No.9409390]

>>9409384
VAE VICTIS!

[Anonymous No.9409405]

>>9409390
No keep that one in for the reason listed here >>9391870

[Anonymous No.9409448]

>>9409384
It's called a mute button.

[Anonymous No.9409665]

>>9409448
but i want to hear everything else

[Anonymous No.9409868]

>>9409384
I liked how characters and objects in Blood Omen 1 often had just one sound effect that they used over and over again. It was cheesy but in a good way.

[Anonymous No.9410606]

>>9408941
I thought it was like ringing a bell or something.

[Anonymous No.9410636]

Replaying SR2 and I forgot how many times Raziel uses the word "aroused" to describe something being awake and active.

[Anonymous No.9410669]

One thing I've never understood was the Nemesis. Or rather, why Moebius set up events so that the Nemesis would be erased from existence and William the Just would be martyred in order to start the vampire crusade. Considering that it was Moebius's influence that turned William into the bloodthirsty tyrant whose army murderraped their way through Nosgoth, couldn't he have just used that to wipe out the vampires?

[Anonymous No.9410703]

>>9410669
Moebius doesn't actually want Nosgoth to turn into a paradise for servants of Khorne, it's just that William the Just is too soft to genocide the vampires so he needs this timeline altering to make it happen.

[Anonymous No.9410898]

>>9380497
We live in it right now. In class society, the workers are numerous and powerful enough to change society into a new state of motion. The old and rotting, but still powerful, ruling class of today have not been able to qualitatively change the entire society at that high level. Inherently, they move as one class interest and are set in contradiction to the workers
But within that class, the rulers are set against one another. Pretty typical through human history so far. But since the working class has no use for exploiting others, only they have the consciousness to change reality through disciplined, organized action (no one wants to organize with their exploiters). Today's rulers know the workers are the real movers of the world and attempt to manipulate them in the same way as Raziel.
Like Raziel, workers are a living contradiction: they must work which builds man's spirit but they are alienated from the product of their labor through the relations to production. This alienation results in *having* spirit but it being disconnected from the working man. Here, "spirit" is in the materialist Hegelian sense—what is built by social relations through labor.
Did the creators of this series read Hegel or Marx? It seems like they understand dialectical materialism.

[Anonymous No.9410992]

>>9410898
holy cringe

[Anonymous No.9411052]

>>9380486
If you played the game you’d know that’s not why he did that

[Anonymous No.9411065]

>>9409384
There is.

https://www.nexusmods.com/bloodomenlegacyofkain/mods/5

[Anonymous No.9411239]

>>9411065
This is such wimp shit.

[Anonymous No.9411389]

>Please, help me kind sir!
>Kain kills him and laughs
It was awesome every time.

[Anonymous No.9411391]

Explain to me this please, I think I've missed something
>How the SOUL Reaver has Raziel's soul inside it in the original timeline before Kain goes back to kill the Nemesis. Kain wasn't surviving that war, the Time Streaming device saved his ass. If Azimuth didn't have that lying around he would've died in the Battle of the Last stand or after that when the Nemesis commited to fully making Nosgoth his bitch.
>How is the Soul Reaver breaking when Kain strikes Raziel in the Sanctuary of the Clans a paradox as Raziel says at the end of SR2? Kain says they always meet on William's chapel, if the outcome is always the same then how is that a paradox? If the blade didn't break there would be no soul in it since Raziel couldn't have been eaten at the end of SR2

[Anonymous No.9411414]

>>9411391
Be aware of one thing: all of the more convoluted time travel, Raziel being in the Reaver, was never a thing until SR2 and Defiance.

[Anonymous No.9411436]

>>9411391
All the time travel shit is so convoluted. It's very hard to follow. Plus a lot of shit was meant to be revealed in later games and we all know how that went. :(

[Anonymous No.9411535]

I found an oldie.

[Anonymous No.9411664]

>>9411535
>grotesque race
>gets banished by a noble race for causing shit in their land
>so butthurt by this, they curse the noble race with degeneracy and sterility to make them slowly go extinct
>behind the scenes scheming throughout centuries
>everyone's scared to name them
What did Amy Hennig meme by this?

[Anonymous No.9411683]

>>9411664
There are some similarities to a certain long-nosed folk.

[Anonymous No.9411686]

>>9411664
>>9411683
jesus christ, hennig

[Anonymous No.9411925]

>>9411535
looks like that laney broad or whatever was her name

[Anonymous No.9412183]

>>9411391
Raziel in SR2 went back in time to before Kain ever first picked up the blade (in fact it was like an hour or so before Kain was born) and was the one who repaired it by accidentally infusing his own soul with it, which means when Kain got the sword in BO1 it already had Raziel's soul in it because that seems to persist regardless of timeline once it's been infused at that point in time in at least 1 timeline. As far as we know the reaver didn't have Raziel's soul in it when William wielded it, but the one Kain wielded did because his reaver was from the future.
>How is the Soul Reaver breaking when Kain strikes Raziel in the Sanctuary of the Clans a paradox as Raziel says at the end of SR2?
Because the Reaver in that instant trying to devour itself which is paradoxical. The paradox isn't them meeting, it was the reaver attempting to devour its own soul.

[Anonymous No.9412190]

>>9411391
>if the outcome is always the same
It's not, Raziel was supposed to strike down Kain there but he managed to resist fate enough to avoid it which is why the timeline shifted to accomodate the change.

[Anonymous No.9412206]

Also, if I'm being completely honest I'm not 100% sure that Kain killing William the Just actually required having 2 Reavers there since that is such a monumental event that the timeline can't help but shift from such a change, but Moebius probably did it just to ensure that a paradox would happen and the timestream couldn't wiggle its way around it.

[Anonymous No.9412239]

>>9412183
>was the one who repaired it by accidentally infusing his own soul with it, which means when Kain got the sword in BO1 it already had Raziel's soul in it because that seems to persist regardless of timeline once it's been infused at that point in time in at least 1 timeline
>Because the Reaver in that instant trying to devour itself which is paradoxical. The paradox isn't them meeting, it was the reaver attempting to devour its own soul.
It still doesn't make sense tho, if Raziel's soul enters the Reaver pre Blood Omen era(SR2), then it attempting to eat Raziel at the Sanctuary can't be a paradox as it's never supposed eat Raziel in the first place. It must always break(SR1 era) so Raziel can be on the chapel (SR2 Pre Blood Omen era) to always repair it.
At point I'm just gonna assume I'm too retarded to understand it and move on.
>>9412190
I meant the outcome is always the same at the Sanctuary.
>>9412206
I don't know on this either. To begin with, it's not even stated how Moebius achieved this. They say history is fatalistic, is Moebius compelled to always give William and Kain access to a Reaver?

[Anonymous No.9412242]

>>9411239
It's just a mod, you'll be ok. It can't hurt you.

[Anonymous No.9412260]

>>9412239
>They say history is fatalistic, is Moebius compelled to always give William and Kain access to a Reaver?
Yes, this was all part of the Elder God's plan to wipe out the vampires.
>It still doesn't make sense tho, if Raziel's soul enters the Reaver pre Blood Omen era(SR2), then it attempting to eat Raziel at the Sanctuary can't be a paradox as it's never supposed eat Raziel in the first place.
What happens at the very end of SR2 isn't his soul trying to consume itself, it was his soul trying to leave his body behind and fully merge with the Reaver like it's supposed to and like it does at the end of Defiance. That's the edge of the coin Kain was waiting for, the exact moment where the soul is still in transfer to the Reaver and thus when Kain separates them prematurely, Raziel has been turned into a living paradox by having his soul simultaneously exist both in his body and in the Reaver, turning Raziel and the Reaver into paradox machines that can alter fate at will.

[Anonymous No.9412267]

>>9412260
Oh also, that turned out to be a bad thing because that specific paradox broke the seal that was keeping the Hylden out of their world. Which is why at the end of Defiance, Raziel realizes that the only thing that can defeat the Hylden, banish the Elder God, and ultimately save Nosgoth is a purified Kain wielding the true Reaver that has his entire soul within it, which is why he chooses to use his free will to sacrifice himself.

[Anonymous No.9412269]

>>9412242
Neither can audio.

[Anonymous No.9412285]

>>9412260
>What happens at the very end of SR2 isn't his soul trying to consume itself, it was his soul trying to leave his body behind and fully merge with the Reaver like it's supposed to and like it does at the end of Defiance
I should've specified sorry, I mean that the Reaver should always break at the Sanctuary of the Clans so it can be repaired by Raziel at William's chapel. I understand what happens at the end of SR2.

[Anonymous No.9412290]

>>9412285
The shattered reaver you find in the start of SR2 was William's reaver that shattered against Kain's reaver, probably because Kain's had Raziel's soul in it and William's didn't so it was just a normal (albeit cool-looking) magic sword.
The one that shattered in SR1 presumably was lost and forgetten forever since that's in the ruined future they never went back to.

[Anonymous No.9412314]

>>9411052
A big point of the series is Kain not accounting for the unintended consequences of his actions.

[Anonymous No.9412343]

>>9412269
Idk, I've played this game several times already, I'm just the messenger.

[Anonymous No.9412654]

>>9412260
>>9412290
I love how fucking intricate the storyline is in Legacy of Kain. It's so well crafted. Will we ever see a video game series this well written again?

[Anonymous No.9412980]

>>9378421
The didn't fall into the time travel meme because they set ground rules for time travel, treating it as if it were a sentient entity that will yeet your ass out of existence if you keep fucking with it.

[Anonymous No.9413001]

>>9388187
Can't unsee.

[Anonymous No.9413091]

>>9412654
Probably not if we're being completely honest.

>>9412980
It's basically just "fate" with more words thrown in.

[Anonymous No.9413097]

I like how Defiance is basically Raziel going through the events of Blood Omen from a different perspective.

[Anonymous No.9413134]

>>9413001
that edit must be done

[Anonymous No.9413156]

One sort of fanfic idea I've had since, I dunno, end of SR2. We see, from Raziel's point of view, Kain breaking the Reaver on Raziel in SR1, which leads to the time streaming device encounter, SR2, and Defiance.

However, what if the order is different from Kain's point? The coda of the last game, Kain's final action, is to set SR1 in motion. The final boss is Kain fighting Raziel for Raziel's first time, ending with Kain breaking the Reaver, freeing his loyal servant to go on to his destiny.