/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.9171929]

Can we agree that Dolphin is the best Emulator?

[Anonymous No.9171971]

>>9171929
No.

[Anonymous No.9171989]

There are literally perfect emulators around, and Dolphin has never been perfect, so no. It's been impressive and pretty good at least.

[Anonymous No.9171997]

Pcsx2 and duckstation are runner up

Ppsspp has been the best emu for years

[Anonymous No.9172019]

>>9171989
>perfect emulators
impossible, literally an oxymoron

[Anonymous No.9172021]

what makes an emulator the best? asking for a friend

[Anonymous No.9172026]

>>9172019
Creating a cycle-accurate NES emulator is piss easy, and bsnes is cycle-accurate. Hell, there's an NES emulator that accurate down to the transistor level.

[Anonymous No.9172028]

>>9171929
>Wonky workaround for 4 player GBA-controller games which took years to be implemented because the developers are retards stuck on their own beliefs
>Awful Nunchuck calibration
>Inexistent shaders unless piggybacking on garbage frontends like Retroarch
>Input delay outta the ass
It emulates the games alright but goddamn the devs are fucking autists when they don't like something

[Anonymous No.9172046]

>>9171929
I'm afraid that accolade belongs to Retroarch bro

[Anonymous No.9172048]

>>9172046
>Frontend
>Emulator
Lmao

[Anonymous No.9172061]

>>9172021
jewtubers opinions

[Anonymous No.9172068]

why does dolphin still have shit options for emulating wii motes, why is it so hard to just let me use the mouse as a pointer and a controller as the nunchuck

[Anonymous No.9172071]

>>9172021
Accuracy followed (at great distance) by bonus features

[Anonymous No.9172117]

>>9172028
>Input delay outta the ass
weird, dolphin is one of the only emulators i've tried that has no noticeable input delay, up there with mednafen

[Anonymous No.9172138]

yes- so much so that for third party titles I had on PS2 as a kid I now play gamecube copies of because Dolphin is so god damned good.

[Anonymous No.9172145]

>>9172021
plays the most games I like on potato hardware at full speed (or better) with resolution scaling
>>9171997
pcsx2 is maybe the worst of the "popular" emulators. PPSSPP is God tier as well.

[Anonymous No.9172180]

>stutter from shaders even if you have the latest fixes
nah

[Anonymous No.9172196]

>>9171929
Best 6th and 7th gen emulator maybe. If you class an overclocked GameCube with a waggle controller as 7th gen that is.

[Anonymous No.9172201]

>>9172026
Don't post anything like this. You're gonna make coomlectors cry

[Anonymous No.9172206]

>>9171929
That's not NESticle, fool!

[Anonymous No.9172207]

>>9171989
Is there actually a 100% perfect emulator? 4th gen and prior emulators are pretty close but I still see people jerk off about Nestopia being way more accurate than FCE Ultra even though I can't personally see a difference.

[Anonymous No.9172213]

>>9171997
pcsx2 is infamously bad what are you on about? Its impressive that a console as convoluted as the PS2 is emulated that well at all but its still way behind compared to Dolphin. Some games still have tons of stutter without speedhacks, I just tried playing Persona 3 FES on it recently and it was awful.

[Anonymous No.9172218]

Dolphin still has a lot of problems despite nintendo using it

[Anonymous No.9172227]

>>9172213
PCSX2's hardware renderer has dogshit compatibility with most games, but software rendering has never really had any issues with whatever I've thrown at it. All hard-to-emulate graphical effects are present with software emulation. You also get the benefit of deinterlacing for some titles, so there's an advantage to using PCSX2 over real hardware even if you're not upscaling. If you're getting stutters then that just sounds like an end-user problem.

>Its impressive that a console as convoluted as the PS2 is emulated that well at all but its still way behind compared to Dolphin.
People always say this but Dolphin is extremely overrated. At the end of day, both Dolphin and PCSX2 use roundabout hacks to emulate games that aren't particularly clean solutions to complex problems. GameCube just has a relatively tiny library compared to all of the shovelware that the PS2 has, so compatibility statistics between both emulators will always be skewed.

[Anonymous No.9172229]

>>9172227
I would hardly call it that, despite the huge library the PS2 had few shovelware

[Anonymous No.9172241]

>>9172227
>GameCube just has a relatively tiny library compared to all of the shovelware that the PS2 has, so compatibility statistics between both emulators will always be skewed.

Not really a fair point as emulators focus on the games people actually want to go back and play. Compatibility on pcsx2 has felt borderline random to me. Some obscure shit nobody played like King's Field IV will run perfectly and then Silent Hill 2 runs like dogshit

[Anonymous No.9172242]

>>9172026
yeah but that one runs in minutes per frame, still impressive tho

[Anonymous No.9172249]

>>9172241
I don't think I've had any issues with SH2, and that was years ago back when the emulator was much worse. I don't want to pull a "werks on my machine ;)" but there's a difference between games being demanding to emulate and straight up emulation issues like missing/broken graphical effects. From what I've glanced at from the wiki, only the FMV issue seems to be a massive accuracy oversight, but I'm not sure if it's an old report from before the 1.7.xxxx nightly builds.

[Anonymous No.9172251]

>>9172249
Forgot pic related
https://wiki.pcsx2.net/Silent_Hill_2

[Anonymous No.9172262]

>>9172028
>inexistent
you can't even spell right

[Anonymous No.9172609]

>>9171929
Not retro

[Anonymous No.9172678]

>>9171929
Ok but why do I want to play Nintendo?

I really dont care enough to play Nintendo

[Anonymous No.9172690]

Wii/GC is one of those consoles which is so cheap and so easy to pirate on real hardware that emulation just doesn't have much appeal to me.

[Anonymous No.9172920]

>>9171929
it's pretty bad, but emulation in 6th gen is pretty wonky anyway so I guess it's alright relatively speaking
compared to emulators for much simpler consoles (up to 4th gen) it's shit but there's no point in making such comparison. you can only compare emulators for the same console and dolphin is pretty much the only functional GC emulator

[Anonymous No.9172929]

Incoming soul

[Anonymous No.9173002]

>>9171929
Duckstation and ppsspp = black magic.

[Anonymous No.9173314]

>>9172026
cool, still an emulator and thus not "perfect" tho

[Anonymous No.9173318]

>>9172920
Which games have played badly on Dolphin?

[Anonymous No.9173375]

>>9172207
not a single emulator is perfect in any possible way. It's one of the most stupid things anyone can say. What you can have is a high library compatibility and minor issues, but perfect is just not possible (even if it was, you'll not have the hardware to run it in real time in your lifetime)

[Anonymous No.9173379]

>>9172046
retroarch isn't an emulator

[Anonymous No.9173392]

>>9172213
FES ran great when I played. wdym

[Anonymous No.9173393]

>>9171929
Sadly, it's a bad project and most people didn't noticed soon enough to prevent the same fate for PCSX2. Dolphin has a ton of per game hacks that are auto-enabled (so users will never know the game isn't running properly, sometimes even features are disabled to make it run at all), and now stenzek gave PCSX2 the "Dolphin way of dealing with issues", so a lot of users will parrot that the project has less hacks, while the truth is that they're still there but auto-enabled when you load a specific game.

[Anonymous No.9173396]

>>9173375
Yeah, I wouldn't go as far as to say any emulator is perfect, but a few are so close to it that if there are issues they are so imperceptible you may as well say they're not really there.

[Anonymous No.9173403]

>>9173396
With that I can agree, people can say the emulator is a nice experience, but accuracy (specially for those being praised in this thread) is garbage.

[Anonymous No.9173409]

Unix philosophy is best, a program should serve a single purpose and do it well.
That being said, gb/gbc/gba are close enough.

[Anonymous No.9173423]

>>9173409
GBA emulation is a lot buggier than people think, having poked around with mGBA a bit.

[Anonymous No.9173450]

>>9173409
They can't even fix the scrolling screen stuttering issue that many users reported over the years. Even abandoned emulators from 8 years ago didn't had this issue

[Anonymous No.9173553]

After using ares for the past 3 months, I can see why users are migrating from other stuff to it. Unless your hardware is old, for the systems that are "complete" this is as good as it gets if you want to play your games until the very end with no fear of shit crashing randomly

[Anonymous No.9173689]

[Anonymous No.9173732]

>>9173393
The Dolphin devs are aware and acknowledge these concessions in their dev blogs.
Some of the hacks are due to how accurately emulating certain behaviours would be too computationally expensive on a per-game basis, or tweaking one thing may break compatibility for many other games.

It's a science, and you keep working towards a better understanding of the system until you eventually have the full picture.
But again, there are challenges in getting certain PPC CPU and GPU instructions working on X64 or ARM systems, API layers and that sort of thing.

[Anonymous No.9173762]

>>9173732
>The Dolphin devs are aware and acknowledge these concessions in their dev blogs.
99% of them are never mentioned, you can wonder why
>tweaking one thing may break compatibility for many other games
This is how you know you're doing a terrible job, as the correct behavior wouldn't break either game
>It's a science, and you keep working towards a better understanding of the system until you eventually have the full picture
The thing is, the way things are done (and you can blame this on stenzek and similar devs), even new developers will have a hard time knowing what's wrong due to how many issues aren't documented and are just buried under the hacks. I'm all for a good experience when we're talking about just playing the games, but saying Dolphin is a good emulator or accurate is a joke

[Anonymous No.9173791]

>>9171929
Emulators discussion? Nice
I have just recently found interest in the PC engine/Turbografix library and
what the fuck should I use to run PCe-CD games?
So fare I'm using Ootake, but I've heard BizHawk is nice too, especially considering I wanna try the other non-nintendo 16 bit systems too, I do play casually however.

[Anonymous No.9173807]

>>9171929
Best is subjective, but I will agree Dolphin is great and is a highly mature product that other emulators should strive to imitate.

[Anonymous No.9173809]

>>9173393
That's why you read the documentation for the game you plan on playing and decide for yourself which options to choose.

[Anonymous No.9173812]

Mame is the best you all fuckin noobs
Mednafen is the runner up you all fuckin noobs

[Anonymous No.9173816]

>>9173809
You're joking, but even the PCSX2 documentation of the issues for each game at their wiki is an even worse joke

[Anonymous No.9173843]

>>9173409
>Can't play Ham-Ham Heartbreak
mGBA is nice, but its still got issues that VBA from a decade ago doesn't.

[Anonymous No.9174387]

>>9171997
About Mednafen? It emulates SS quite well.

[Anonymous No.9174514]

>>9171997
>duckstation
Beetle PSX is better

[Anonymous No.9174582]

>>9173812
This poster is a dickless fucking turd lmao

[Anonymous No.9175285]

>>9172021
Works on hardware I own and plays games I like without messing up the audio/video to an irritating degree, has support for savestates, and, in the case of emulators for 3d-capable systems, allows upscaling the internal resolution. Also important that it doesn't require significant tinkering with various settings to get it to work properly (especially on a per-game basis).

[Anonymous No.9175647]

>>9172021
#1 Having reasonable system requirements
#2 Being able to play games by any means (accuracy niggers wait your turn)
#3 Basic functionality such as a navigable UI and essential configuration options
#4 Hardware accuracy (now it's your turn)
#5 additional features like online emulators or netplay

[Anonymous No.9175651]

There was a tranny programmer on Dolphin that set himself on fire.

[Anonymous No.9175662]

>>9175651
Is he ok?

[Anonymous No.9175864]

>>9171997
>Pcsx2
Are you braindead?

>>9174514
Beetle wasn't dropped.

[Anonymous No.9175880]

>>9172929
Used it for a very long time before been forced to use retroarch for other systems and it became the easiest way to play multiple systems. True soul indeed.

[Anonymous No.9175884]

>>9172929
That UI was probably the ugliest piece of shit UI I've ever used. God, I hated it in the early 2000s and even thinking about it makes me angry.

[Anonymous No.9175896]

>>9175662
"She" died.

[Anonymous No.9177032]

>>9171929
>(laughs in Rouge Squadron)
>(laughs in Pikmin 2 Wii)
>(laughs in F-Zero GX)

[Anonymous No.9177043]

>>9177032
What's up with F-Zero GX on Dolphin?

[Anonymous No.9177496]

so I was recommended to switch from Higan to snes9x a while ago, and while I like it, there's one major bug / flaw that's bothering me. whenever the controller comes loose or is temporarily disconnected, snes9x will *not* detect it again, forcing me to exit out entirely and reopen. even though there appears to be an option for that very thing. however, when I click it, it doesn't stay checked off or otherwise do anything. if this is a bug, is there any way to fix it?

[Anonymous No.9177497]

>>9175864
>Beetle wasn't dropped
And neither was Duckstation

[Anonymous No.9177509]

>>9177043
Works fine on standalone Dolphin but is completely fucked on retroarch

[Anonymous No.9178364]

>>9173393
Its probably not physically possible to construct a PS2 emulator that runs at a playable speed without hacks.

[Anonymous No.9178404]

>>9177509
I just ran a few laps and I'm not sure what the problem is. Works fine on my end. Try resetting your settings, updating the core and using Vulkan. It's version 645cd0d which I'm guessing is just the newest beta.

[Anonymous No.9179081]

the perfect emulator is bsnes, always has been and always will be, the product of intense autism and pure love for the system.

[Anonymous No.9179103]

>All these niggers praising ppsspp
Shit has the worst input lag of any emulator I've ever tried, even the devs admit that the emulator has a minimum of like 4-6 frames of input lag

[Anonymous No.9179105]

>>9179081
zsnes not only beat it by seven years, it also has the virtue of actually being playable.

[Anonymous No.9179113]

>>9175651
No way.

[Anonymous No.9179189]

>>9173812

Mame is the most accurate emulator, it's been actively developped for so many years, it's hands down the best.

For mednafen psx is obviously good, pc engine too, but the rest is kinda hit or miss.

[Anonymous No.9179194]

>>9179103
yeah PPSSPP is fucking bad, there's not even option for integer scale, wtf.
devs said it's not needed...

[Anonymous No.9179235]

>>9178364
It's possible to have a very accurate PS2 emulator that run in real time with avg hardware (avg == mostly mid tier 6th intel corei generation needed, even for edge cases), but developers sometimes are the most stupid smart people when it comes to the implementation to some solutions (there's a lot of instruction paths that you'll never need to touch while still being able to run better with 95% of the CPUs on the market). Rendering wise, most developers are 100% clueless outside of the basic stuff like creating a context for whatever API they're using + some fast code path they copy pasted from some older project. There's so much performance you can gain from some very, VERY small changes with no downsides, which makes me think that most developers only publish their source codes because they can't do better and need someone else to push the project for them

[Anonymous No.9179238]

>>9179194
I mean, it's open source and the part of the code where you can add an integer scaling is right there, you don't even to know how to code to do it, monkey-see-monkey-do baby

[Anonymous No.9179248]

>>9179081
It's not perfect, even the damn test results and some game specific code added to it will tell you otherwise
>>9179105
Now you're just being dumb, zsnes has terrible sound in most games, sprites being cut in a ton of others, save corruption can and will happen in a number of known games, not every game is playable. The only thing I can give about it is the damn snow animation because nostalgia (and even that you can implement in some minutes in any other project)

[Anonymous No.9179249]

>>9179238
Yeah, sure i'll learn to code to add a fucking option to a shitty emulator, males fuicking sense.

You sounds like my daughter who told me i can't criticize ariane grande, because i suck at singing...

But yeah, i'm the baby.

[Anonymous No.9179252]

>>9175651
let's be honest: when you start making your own emulator, you're already soaking yourself in gasoline

[Anonymous No.9179256]

>>9179249
you couldn't even read what I've said above, so now I'm sure you can't code lol
tldr: I've said you don't need to know how to code, it's just a matter of changing some already existing values at some already existing options (and strings so they make sense when you look at the damn UI). Also, comparing singing to copy pasting... you're a baby

[Anonymous No.9179272]

>>9179103
Use dx11, all the other backends are multithreaded and have a ton of input lag as a result.

[Anonymous No.9179291]

>>9179272
>all the other backends are multithreaded and have a ton of input lag as a result
that's not the reason, dumb user

[Anonymous No.9179559]

>>9179235
What about the non standard floating point math? The only way to accurately emulate it is full software emulation, which no cpu in existence is powerful enough to do.

[Anonymous No.9179647]

>>9172218
>Dolphin still has a lot of problems despite nintendo using it
Do they?

[Anonymous No.9179780]

fw still cant emulate Rogue Squadron 2 and 3 properly

[Anonymous No.9179789]

>>9171929
Dolphincucks are annoying

[Anonymous No.9179802]

>>9179789
DOSBox is extremely flawed and has superior forks.

[Anonymous No.9179849]

>>9179802
considering the wide range of pc hardware that ran dos back in the 80s and 90s, dosbox is impressive.

[Anonymous No.9180421]

>>9179559
bull-fucking-shit, you can cover all the non standard cases with not a lot of overhead, what would actually make shit go slower could be some of the EE caching stuff, and even in this case there's a lot of easy solutions. Honestly, open source is a damn joke

[Anonymous No.9180440]

>>9171929
PPSSPP is also pretty good. RPCS3 is the most technically impressive of them all.

[Anonymous No.9180447]

>>9179647
No.

[Anonymous No.9180452]

>>9172929
Even back then I upgraded to SNES9X, faglord, that piece of shit was always broken.

[Anonymous No.9180458]

>>9173375
Once you reach cycle-accuracy, what's the difference? You're technically "perfect". But then, most people don't want perfect. They want high resolutions, garbage filters, runahead, savestates, widescreen hacks and all the bells and whistles.

[Anonymous No.9180460]

>>9173689
Did they finish the sourceport?

[Anonymous No.9180462]

>>9173762
You're just dismissing everything posted while providing no insight whatsoever. Why these retards keep entertaining you is anyone's guess.

[Anonymous No.9180464]

>>9173791
Mednafen.

[Anonymous No.9180467]

>>9180458
Not even that. They just want it to play the popular games everyone's already played to death without obvious, glaring issues, and as long as it's as easy as "load ROM, maybe drop in a BIOS, play", that's enough for people to fellate you.

[Anonymous No.9180469]

>>9177509
The gamecube core in retroarch is pretty much abandoned and grossly out of date. They don't bother maintaining it at al.

[Anonymous No.9180471]

>>9179189
>Mame is the most accurate emulator
You're basing this on exactly nothing.

[Anonymous No.9180474]

>>9179235
>It's possible to have a very accurate PS2 emulator that run in real time with avg hardware
You really need to stop sharing your little outbursts of stupidity.

[Anonymous No.9180476]

>>9180458
Most emulators are not anywhere close to cycle accurate. cycle accuracy requires advancing each component of the system clock cycle by clock cycle. Modern cpus are really bad at running this type of code, it completly blows out the l1 cache and branch prediction making the code crawl.

[Anonymous No.9180491]

>>9180476
And they're not cycle-accurate because it's a waste of resources, when running software at acceptable speeds with a high level of "accuracy" can be achieved in other ways. But there are a few, mostly for NES and older systems.

[Anonymous No.9180496]

>>9180469
It makes sense. It's one of the most complex cores, and since it's a fork and absolutely no one in the Dolphin team has any interest whatsoever in merging it into upstream or helping it along in any way, it falls upon others to try. Apparently there was one guy who was really active with it, but he got tired of the lead RetroArch dude's shit (tends to happen, the guy is a massive sperg), and just up and left one day, and it's sat pretty much abandoned since.

[Anonymous No.9180518]

>>9180496
Sure it does, but the other guy was complaining about the Dolphin core as if it were up to par with the standalone emulator, which isn't even remotely the case.

[Anonymous No.9180527]

>>9180518
Hell, the Vulkan renderer is straight-up broken on both Intel and AMD from the look of things. It works on my laptop with a shitty Quadro from 2013, but crashes on my desktop with both its Intel graphics and a newer AMD GPU.

[Anonymous No.9180741]

>>9179780
I want nothing more than to play those games flawlessly, having played the original RS as a kid.

[Anonymous No.9181052]

>>9180474
>You really need to stop sharing your little outbursts of stupidity.
Feel free to share your solution for accurate floats in realtime
PROTIP: copypasting Accurate xfloat off of RPCS3 isn't gonna cut it

[Anonymous No.9181074]

>>9179780
They fixed those years ago.

[Anonymous No.9181076]

>>9181052
>Feel free to share your solution for accurate floats in realtime
That has fuckall to do with what you said before. If you have something to share, do it without provocation, this isn't your therapy session.
What we do have are only two attempts at emulating that architecture with insane amounts of overhead, rather low accuracy and barely acceptable performance.

[Anonymous No.9181090]

>>9179235
Accurate emulation on low end hardware is impossible, but if you do one of those reverse-engineered projects it might be possible. it's impressive to see mario 64 at 60 fps on a dos machine

[Anonymous No.9181121]

>>9181076
Sorry I need to stop shitposting right after i wake up, somehow thought you were >>9179235
But yeah to clarify if you're gonna go and post >>9179235 without knowing that the main reason why anything remotely accurate PS2 emulation wise isn't gonna happen as long as someone doesn't find a way to deal with the floating point issue in realtime is idiotic, literally every other issue is currently fixable provided someone takes the time to do it
Every alternative to full software float has been tried, so right now the only way you're getting those accurate floats is brute forcing it, meaning you'll have to wait until either CPUs can bruteforce it in real time though considering that's low single digit on current top end hardware you're gonna be waiting a while or somehow they add some instruction set or function that makes it fast enough which likely isn't happening.

[Anonymous No.9181403]

>>9174514
I'm currently using Duckstation to play tear ring saga.
What am I missing out on without Beetle?

[Anonymous No.9181412]

>>9181403
Just keep both around. Unfortunately neither one has 100% compatibility, so if one game doesn't work in one, it might work in the other. But yeah, if there's no perceptible problems, just stick with what you're using. No sense in switching things around and potentially opening yourself up to issues.

[Anonymous No.9181421]

>>9181412
Noted, thank you
I wasn't looking forward to switching things around so that's a relief.

[Anonymous No.9182026]

>>9179291
>that's not the reason, dumb user
Yes it is.
“To get the graphics multithreading as effective as it is, we buffer up whole frames. Up to 3 frames can be in flight at once and it's a little too easy right now for the CPU to run too far ahead of the GPU even when it's really not needed. I plan to reduce the max to 2 and make it a lot smarter, and possibly even split frames into pieces when the CPU load is small and the buffering not worth it. But believe me, especially on weak multicore Android devices, the buffering is crucial to get the speed we need.”

[Anonymous No.9182052]

>>9179235
Most emulators are done by like one or two autistic guys who learned how to code through the internet
Expecting them to be industry grade is stupid

[Anonymous No.9182094]

>>9182052
If they are such amateurs, why did capcom use mame in their emulator?

[Anonymous No.9182107]

>>9180471
Just look at the changelogs, it all explained there

[Anonymous No.9182431]

>>9180458
Maybe if you're not a moron you can understand that you NEED a damn accurate emulator to use as a reference so you can later implement things with performance in mind (instead of the documentation and readability needed to be sure you understand how the hardware actually works with not a lot of guessing)
>>9180462
Maybe because I'm right?
>>9182094
Because it's very cheap and the license allows the commercial usage. You would need to be very stupid to pay someone to develop a project if you can instead just grab something for free and hide it under a cute UI made in 2 hours + roms
>>9182052
This is why I've said that no one worth their salt is going to open source their code

[Anonymous No.9182434]

>>9182107
Changelogs are very generic and don't go into details about most of the changes. But lucky you, the codebase from MAME is an example of readability done right

[Anonymous No.9182437]

>>9172026
>Creating a cycle-accurate NES emulator is piss easy
why'd it take like 30 years then

[Anonymous No.9182445]

>>9182437
Emulating the NES is the easy part. Emulating all the kooky shit which can appear in a cartridge not so much.

[Anonymous No.9182483]

>>9177496
That's just the way some emulators work. Citra used to be like this too, but they fixed it somehow.

[Anonymous No.9182609]

>>9182434
the latest changelog is 70000 characters, it's bigger than some nes games, what is generic about it? do you even try to verify things before talking turds bigger than your mouth?

[Anonymous No.9184375]

When will Xemu get on the same level?