/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.8974350]

Ocarina was better, this had less dungeons and more bullshit

[Anonymous No.8974364]

>>8974350
I dunno if Ocarina was better but I must admit a lot of the side quests are way more annoying than I remembered. The beaver race drags on far too long and the goron race is fucking aids

[Anonymous No.8974391]

>>8974350
I don't like 3d zelda dungeons. They're always gimmicky and kinda shit. Occasionally one will nail the atmosphere like the Forest Temple but other than that they're all kinda terrible.

[Anonymous No.8974443]

>>8974391
The main problem with 3D dungeons is that if you started with 2D Zelda everything feels so damn slow. In 2D entries you are constantly doing something, whereas in the 3D ones you are either running or fucking CLIMBING, god. When I'm solving the 3D dungeons and enter some new area/floor I always think to myself
>Shit, there's more? It will never end, will it?

[Anonymous No.8974469]

>>8974443
>pic
>Shit, there's more? It will never end, will it?
thought that so many times in that temple. Great Bay was even worse. snowhead and the swamp one weren't that bad but they felt like a chore.

[Anonymous No.8974470]

>>8974350
Your opinion's correct but "less" is for continuous amounts. Use "fewer" for discrete quantities.

[Anonymous No.8974480]

>>8974470
Based and Grammar pilled

[Anonymous No.8974490]

i enjoyed the bullshit of Majora's Mask, it usually feels warranted beyond the
-play the song to save
-lose your items each time

it somehow doesn't feel shorter than OoT imho, due to the nature of how involved the events are to open up the four dungeons. the design of MM also lends itself toward a randomizer moreso than OoT as well, so if you're big into the game like me it virtually never gets old.

[Anonymous No.8974503]

>>8974470
Not him and I'm ESL but I've heard native speakers use less with words like coins, pieces, etc. Aren't they basically interchangeable nowadays? Who gives a shit anyway, it's 2022

[Anonymous No.8974507]

>>8974503
yeah, i am an english speaker and they're used interchangeably, most of the time grammar autists on 4chan are just proving they're fucking idiots

[Anonymous No.8974568]

>>8974350
i mean last time i played i did use a guide for the collectables admittedly but the dungeons weren't too confusing
only time i got stuck for a bit was when i needed to go back to the beginning of great bay temple to reverse the flow of the water
>>8974364
tbdesu i thought those were some of the easier minigames
the real shit ones were the shooting galleries, especially swamp's

[Anonymous No.8974581]

>>8974350
I liked Ocarina's pacing more, it felt like you were progressing along with the world, somewhat.
Majora's was okay in this aspect it just always bummed me out going back to the first day and see it all back to what it was

[Anonymous No.8974596]

>>8974503
Similar to how split infinitives are considered bad form in English, the fewer / less distinction exists in English because that's how it worked in Latin.
Few comes old Germanic pao, which itself traces back to pau- as in the Latin word pauciores.
Less in its original Germanic use, was the comparative form for little, and in Latin you had minus as less to use for continuous amounts vs. pauciores for discrete amounts.
The distinction makes sense. There's a difference between having a reduction in the number of things you're talking about vs. a smaller size with no quantity change.

[Anonymous No.8974736]

>>8974596
blah blah blah
it's however not important to distinctively use either or when talking about fewer/less/smaller suchness

[Anonymous No.8974787]

OoT is more fun to replay.

[Anonymous No.8975008]

>>8974350
Ocarina = Blue Album
Majora = Pinkerton

[Anonymous No.8975396]

There's really no need to like one and dislike the other.
OOT is classic, but MM is cult.
Yeah it has only 4 dungeons but all 4 are pretty big and challenging, the game expects the player to come fresh from OOT, so no need for introductory dungeons like Inside Deku Tree.
That, coupled with other locations that are like mini-dungeons (skulltulas houses, ikana castle, deku palace, etc) make MM brim with content, it's just not as clearly structured like OOT, MM is more abstract.

[Anonymous No.8975468]

>>8974443
I got this feeling in Twilight constantly

>>8974469
I walked into Snowhead. Took one look at the massive pillar in the middle and just took a break for a day because I thought it would be a never ending slog. It wasn't as bad as it looked but it still was kinda tedious constantly messing with the pillar height.

[Anonymous No.8975476]

>>8975396
>OOT is classic, but MM is cult.
MM was just as popular as OOT in it's day. It's just retroactively after the fact Nintendo plastered OOT everywhere while Majora got mentioned less so, so it became slightly obscure. If Nintendo wasn't constantly keeping OOTs name alive it'd probably end up like other /vr/ games where no one who grew up with them would remember it.

[Anonymous No.8975513]

>>8974391
>>8974443
Forest Temple and Water Temple both nailed it, imo. Good and interesting use of 3d space.

[Anonymous No.8975719]

>>8974350
Clock Town is pure kino and still to this day one of the best main hubs in any video game
https://youtu.be/QEV1YKYTp3I

[Anonymous No.8975742]

>>8975719
I agree with you there anon. Very pleasing hub design. It feels very natural.

[Anonymous No.8976013]

>>8974350
>Ocarina was better
No shit.
You had to have the expansion "pak" back in the day to play this. Most people didn't have it because it was largely a waste of money. You couldn't even borrow it because Nintendo said taking it out of a console once it had been put in would ruin it.
So, the ones that did have it were invested in hyping up their games that most others hadn't played. Majora's Mask was babby's first contrarianism.

[Anonymous No.8976017]

>>8974350
majoras mask was somehow even sadder than OoT

so many fucked up stories woven together

[Anonymous No.8976019]

>>8975468
>walk into Great Bay Temple
>see water (nuff said honestly), tubes, water wheels and all that other shit

[Anonymous No.8976021]

>>8974581
you learned impermance
but did you come to terms with it? and your own mortality?

[Anonymous No.8976026]

>>8975476
>MM was just as popular as OOT in it's day.
You're a fucking idiot and you were probably born in like 2006. Almost no one played this shit in the N64 days because no one had the stupid pak you needed.

[Anonymous No.8976051]

>>8976026
it should have came with it
but many of my peers had it thinking their games were "better now"

[Anonymous No.8976067]

>>8976051
I'm sure "many" people did have it but no where near the majority of the install base, and the sales numbers of OoT and MM reflect that it was no where near as popular as OoT. It never was and never will be.
Convincing your parents to buy you that piece of shit pak was a hard sell. It was like "We already bought you the console and like 15 games, now you need a "pak" to play more games? Go outside."

[Anonymous No.8976069]

ITT old boomers with rotten brains and no attention span

[Anonymous No.8976071]

>>8976051
Didn't have a Wii back in the days but as far as I remember even Skyward Sword came packed with WiiMote+

[Anonymous No.8977787]

>>8975008
Ocarina = Star Wars
Majora's = Empire Strikes Back

Majora is great but only built on the foundation of Ocarina. Majora is standing on the shoulders of a giant (no pun intended), so it naturally comes out a little "taller". That's the best way I've ever heard anyone put it.

[Anonymous No.8977797]

>>8976019
Better design than OoT Water Temple

[Anonymous No.8977803]

>>8976051
Many games actually were "better now". Ex. Star Wars Pod Racer runs without Expansion Pak, but if you put one in you get better resolution and FPS

[Anonymous No.8977806]

>>8977803
However, Space Station Silicon Valley crashes randomly if an Expansion Pak is in. Probably some sanity check or anti piracy measure where they reference memory that shouldn't exist (I.e. before expansion pak existed) and if it works (since it shouldnt), it crashes the game. Earthbound on SNES did something similar.

[Anonymous No.8977812]

>>8977787
Majora's Mask = Holiday Special
Twilight Princess is the real Empire Strikes Back

[Anonymous No.8977818]

>>8977812
Also A Link to the Past is The Hidden Fortress I guess lol

[Anonymous No.8977846]

>>8977812
Kek

[Anonymous No.8977858]

all the prerelease material shared in old magazines led me astray of what MM would end up being, it feels like a weird experimental surreal Dreamcast game, not an N64 zeldurman'emup

[Anonymous No.8977913]

>>8976019
I kinda figured out early on you just have to visit the rooms in order and breezed through it. I think Nintendo did it in another game.

[Anonymous No.8977920]

>>8976026
Everyone I grew up with who played OOT also played MM. I never met anyone who played OOT and not MM unless it was someone who played it years after the fact.

[Anonymous No.8978042]

>>8977812
I dont remember empire having a two hour intro.

[Anonymous No.8978075]

>>8978042
I don't remember people not giving a fuck about it when it came out just to start praising it years later either

[Anonymous No.8978173]

>>8974350
>Ocarina was better
Nah, Majora's is at least its own game. Ocarina is a shameless ALTTP remake it gets no points from me. I honestly don't understand how people give it such a pass.

[Anonymous No.8978232]

>>8978042
This has always been my biggest problem with Majora’s Mask. Forcing you to play as a deku scrub for the opening hours of the game was a huge mistake imo. The first dungeon is completely uninteresting to me.

[Anonymous No.8978239]

>>8978075
I never noticed this but now that you mention it.... I do remember there was so much hype leading up to it then when it came out everyone forgot about it within a few weeks.

[Anonymous No.8978349]

has science gone too far?
https://youtu.be/sOClp6WbO4M?t=1063

[Anonymous No.8978357]

>>8974490
>the design of MM also lends itself toward a randomizer
What do the randomizers randomize? Does it mess with the dungeon layouts or is it just an item shuffle?

[Anonymous No.8978362]

>>8978349
How long until the DMCA comes?

[Anonymous No.8978369]

>>8978173
Ocarina of Time has a lot of parallels with A Link to the Past but it definitely isn't anything close to a remake of it.
And that aside ALttP doesn't have the cinematic experience OoT does. That was the foundation for its popularity. When it was released the way you experienced that three dimensional world from the beginning with the 1st person camera of Navi's flight through the Kokiri Forest and into Link's treehouse had the magic of a Christmas morning. It wasn't the same as a fun 2D game of finding items and fighting enemies. You got much more of a real feeling world with scenes of the sages, the royal family and Ganondorf's impending treachery, the different races like the Gorons and the Zora, etc.
And dungeons like the Forest Temple or Shadow Temple were more distinctive / memorable compared to ALttP where the dungeons all mostly stick to generic tilesets and aren't very thematic e.g. Dark Palace is situated in a lightly monkey themed architecture and its boss is a masked fire dinosaur such that the name, structure, and boss don't really connect, vs. the Shadow Temple which is an undead torture-murder dungeon of invisible traps where the boss is a decapitated demon with severed hands.
And the music too is much higher quality and memorable, with each section's music adding a great portion to the overall atmosphere.

[Anonymous No.8978386]

>>8978357
if you change what items you get then you end up with different dungeon orders, you need deku mask for swamp, you need arrows for mountain, you need epona for beach, you need ice arrows for desert

[Anonymous No.8980020]

>>8977858
Thats why its good anon

[Anonymous No.8980030]

Anyone know the most reliable way to get a ocarina of time or majoras mask cart in good condition? The last n64 game I bought seemed like they replaced all the screws for some reason, and I don’t think it was even in the original cartridge shell.

[Anonymous No.8980052]

Both games are overrated but ocarina of shit has a more annoying fanbase

[Anonymous No.8980067]

>>8980052
*stands up* what the FUCK did you say BRO?

[Anonymous No.8980129]

>>8980052
OoT's "fanbase" is basically just every person alive who was between the ages of 8 and 18 in the year 1998.

[Anonymous No.8980136]

>>8980052
Not even close. Majora’s Mask to this day has a terrible, tumblr style fanbase that goes on and on about how “dark” it is and how it’s the “Twin Peaks of Zelda”.

[Anonymous No.8980140]

>>8980136
THOSE types are probably the ones fuckinf with the screws in the cartridges because it’s mainly something speedeunners do

[Anonymous No.8980328]

>>8974364
you don't have to do the goron race.

[Anonymous No.8980712]

OoT is better simply because it doesn't have the dumb time cycle bullshit which literally only exists to pad out the game due to the short dev cycle

[Anonymous No.8981821]

>>8980712
>he doesn't know he can slow down time

[Anonymous No.8982051]

>>8975476
> MM was just as popular as OOT in its day.

I love MM but this is simply not true my dawg.

[Anonymous No.8982838]

>>8980140
>fucking with the screws in the cartridges
wait what? context?

[Anonymous No.8983230]

>>8974350
I don't like timeloop games where the timer is constantly in your face. It's too stressful.
Legitimately the game would have been better if there was no counter and the only indication you got was in-world changes.
Maybe it would have been more tedious for sidequests but I think it would have been better as an experience.
Though I think the deeper issue is that the time loop concept only works for short loops. Groundhog Day was a single day, shouldn't go any longer than that. Three days is too much. When it gets too long the game is forced to add a more structured schedule which just makes things more tedious and stressful. The sense of organic exploration and wonder is lost and it starts to feel like a job.
Of course, the reason that MM's loop is still long is that it's still a Zelda game. It didn't fully commit to being a timeloop game from the ground up, but put it on top of the typical Zelda structure (but with less content than you'd get from a quintessential Zelda game like LttP or OoT).

[Anonymous No.8983328]

If you slow down time and begin dungeons right at the start of the first day you have more than enough time to finish the dungeons

[Anonymous No.8983589]

>>8983328
It's annoying to even have to consider time regardless of how many tricks there are to get you a large enough amount of it.

[Anonymous No.8984217]

>>8974503
>It's [Current Year]

At least try to not think like a stupid person.

[Anonymous No.8984479]

>>8974443
Only Link's Awakening and later 2D Zeldas had great dungeons. It's not like LTTP and LOZ are bad (far from it), but Zelda hadn't fully become a "puzzle-solving game" yet.

[Anonymous No.8984521]

>>8974350
I only remember how much of a pain in the ass to get all the masks. There was one you could only get by doing a sidequest that took up to very last minute of the Final Day. Can't remember the name, as I haven't played Majora's Mask since it came out.

[Anonymous No.8984567]

>>8984521
>There was one you could only get by doing a sidequest that took up to very last minute of the Final Day.
Why are you complaining? That's the kind of shit that makes MM a masterclass kino.

[Anonymous No.8984590]

>>8975396
>OOT is classic, but MM is cult.

>BRO YOU GOTTA FUCKIN' BELEIVE ME! NOBODY PLAY THE SEQUEL TO ONE OF THE MOST ACCLAIMED GAMES OF THE FIFTH GEN BACK IN THE DAY. NOBODY EVEN HEARD OF IT UNTIL A DECADE LATER

[Anonymous No.8984594]

>>8984567
For you, maybe.

[Anonymous No.8984595]

>>8984521
>There was one you could only get by doing a sidequest that took up to very last minute of the Final Day.

Was this a problem?

[Anonymous No.8984597]

>>8974350
I could never play this as a child because the 3 day timer stressed me out so bad. Literally ruined the game for me. Thinking about playing it even now gives me anxiety.

[Anonymous No.8984923]

>>8984590
It's not about knowing it exists, MM is a more cult game in the sense it would be best enjoyed by fans of the series (and of course people who already played oot) and people who enjoy avant-garde angles at video game design. A lot of people were (and still are) filtered by MM's time limit (aka they never had the patience to get to the reverse song of time learning) or the increased difficulty from the get go, compared to OOT.

[Anonymous No.8985068]

>>8984594
For me. And that means for everyone.

[Anonymous No.8985412]

>>8984590
Sales numbers exist you know. Go back to /v/ with your shitposting.

[Anonymous No.8985869]

>>8978357
randomizers are just item shuffles most of the time; Super Metroid randomizer is the same way

[Anonymous No.8985901]

>>8985412
3 million sales does not a obscure game make

[Anonymous No.8985912]

>>8974596
nobody cares

[Anonymous No.8985913]

I wouldn't call MM "cult" but there were a lot of obstacles that made it less of a phenomenon than OOT. I think the major one is just that 2000 was really late for an N64 game, a lot of kids would've just lost interest by then.

[Anonymous No.8985935]

>>8975476
I get shitting on Ocarina is the cool, hip thing to do nowadays, but don't LARP and try to downplay how popular OoT was (and still is).

[Anonymous No.8985943]

>>8975476
>MM was just as popular as OOT in it's day.
It sold less than half of what OOT did.