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/vr/ - Retro Games

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File: 473 KB, 2006x768, ditheronoff.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
8929583 No.8929583 [Reply] [Original]

Do you like PS1 dithering?

>> No.8929596

>>8929583
No, that's why I try to use composite as much as possible with the PS1

>> No.8929604

>>8929583
It's a lot less noticeable on shadow mask tubes with moderate TVL counts. That's one of the reasons I prefer shadow mask over aperture grill for early 3D. It's a lot more forgiving.

Composite hides it pretty well too of course, but it fucks up the colors too much.

>> No.8929619

>>8929583
yes, but probably mostly for the nostalgia

>> No.8929634

>>8929583
N64 didn't have this problem

>> No.8929648

>>8929634
Maybe not but it had plenty of other problems. Only a handful of worthy games for one

>> No.8929659

>>8929583
Not really. I set internal res to 2x and dithering to game res in beetle psx. I get why the dithering was a thing, but you wouldn't even think about it on a CRT.

>> No.8929674

>>8929634
N64 sucked and has no games besides plumber boy and gay elf in green tunic

>> No.8929676

>>8929634
>>8929648
>>8929674
Are you guys in the 90s? This thread wasn't made for console wars.

>> No.8929682

>>8929634
It's only a problem for some people. Conversely, the N64's approach is only a "solution" and not an entirely different problem for some as well.
On a visual level, the N64 did have objectively superior features on several accounts, but ironically the PS1's visual artifacts (wobbling and snapping, unfiltered textures and probably the dithering as well) are now considered an "aesthetic", while the N64's simply represents a very crude early form of the "proper" graphics architecture the industry would build from.

>> No.8929685

>>8929674
>greasy italian bear-mode plumber
>feminine elf in green dress and tights
It had something for everyone.

>> No.8929693

>>8929583
It isn't noticeable on a CRT and on emulators it can removed entirely.

>> No.8929694

>>8929583
I upscale, then downscale, then use a CRT filter.

>> No.8929875
File: 1.37 MB, 2239x1440, SH.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
8929875

>>8929583
Yes but I wish duckstation had better dither scaling.
If you scale to resolution the pattern breaks and becomes super small. Something like half native monitor res would be neat.

>> No.8929950

>>8929583
Nope.

It's only acceptable in games like Silent Hill because the color banding would be too noticeable otherwise.

>> No.8930079

>>8929634
>calling sovl a problem

>> No.8930090

I dont care, i don’t even know what dithering is.

>> No.8930095
File: 884 KB, 800x1200, King chad.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
8930095

>>8930090
Based.

>> No.8930856
File: 122 KB, 1280x960, nu0-190812-182950.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
8930856

>>8929634
N64 acthuially has 3 dithering options (bayer, magic, noise), theyre just way more subtle than playstation and devs could swap them to fit their game better or just turn it off completely.

>> No.8930865

>>8929634
>N64 didn't have this problem
No, on the N64 you had every texture looking like shit smeared across the screen because the system had this awful bilinear filtering and could only produce textures half the size of a C64 sprite.

>> No.8930869

>>8930090
This guy FUCKS

>> No.8930912

>>8929583
I remember long ago getting component cables for my PS2, and I decided to try playing a PS1 game just to see how it would look, so I went with FFIX. I loaded up some old abandoned save file in Disc 1, which happened to start me in the overworld, and what struck me was there were dots all over the screen, which I did not remember ever seeing before, as I had only ever played it either with RF or composite back when I first got it, or through emulators like ePSXe which rendered it in hi-res. My first kneejerk thought was there was something wrong with the cable, so I switched back to composite to test, and the dots were gone. I then remembered dithering was a thing, and composite signals often blended it together, and it all clicked. Threw me for a loop, it did.

>> No.8930914

>>8929583
nah
I just slap a shader on it and call it a day

>> No.8930936
File: 3.94 MB, 3840x2160, Final Fantasy VIII (USA) (Disc 2)-220521-163723.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
8930936

>>8930914
This.

>> No.8930942

>>8929634
The dithering was the only good-looking visual artifact the PS1 had.

>> No.8930947

>>8929583
i can barely make out what's supposed to be different
besides the coloring being darker

>> No.8930968

>>8930947
zoom in a bit

>> No.8931357

>>8929583
I can't even see the difference

>> No.8931601

I don't know what dithering is. I just play games.

>> No.8931660

>>8929583
Yep

>> No.8931675

I like dithering, and I like chunky pixels with sharp edges.
>B-BUT THAT'S NOT HOW IT LOOKED ON A CATHODE RAY TUBE
I don't care :^)

>> No.8931770

>>8930090
The only correct answer

>> No.8932185

>>8931675
>t.zoomer

>> No.8932208

>>8931601
this guy gets it

>> No.8932220

>>8931675
based

>> No.8932261

>>8929583
Omg I love this game so much

>> No.8932272

>>8931675
Actually, by the end of the Playstation's life cycle, a lot of CRTs were big and clear enough to show the dithering.

>> No.8932495

>>8932272
Whether you see the dithering or not has more to do with the signal quality than the CRT. I had a 27" Sony WEGA, and dithering only became apparent if I used S-video or component cables.

>> No.8932532
File: 347 KB, 1920x1440, Legend of Zelda, The - Ocarina of Time (USA).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
8932532

>>8929634
N64 does have dithering. It was just mostly blurred by the excessively aggressive AA that makes N64 games look so blurry. You can see it in some parts of this image

>> No.8932536

>>8929875
you can do that, don't use scale to window, instead choose 2x or 3x and tick scaled dithering on enhancements

>> No.8932554

>>8929634
>there's no problem if you can't see it! - Nintendo

>> No.8932563

>>8929583
dithering and warping, yes.

>> No.8932569
File: 873 KB, 1280x960, N64 VI filters.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
8932569

>>8932532
With renderers like Angrylion or ParaLLEl-RDP, you can blend the dithering without the AA or blurring if you wish for a sharper picture.

>> No.8932570

>>8932569
Sure, if you upscale then downscale. My point was just that real N64 hardware uses dithering.

>> No.8932573

>>8932570
No, downsampling is not necessary (though it helps immensely), you just disable the AA and bilinear VI filters. But yes, on real hardware, it is there. As usual, composite cables also worked to hide it.

>> No.8932578

>>8932573
True, but downscaling might be the better option since it eliminates color banding. Hell, even modern games have color banding issues that can only be eliminated with noise/grain, which is basically just a modern form of dithering.

>> No.8932673

>>8929583
Yes. Sometimes what it did was make surfaces seem 'grittier' than the developer even intended because dithering pattern can appear rough, and in many games that was actually kinda cool about them. Silent Hill undithered is a mistake, for instance.

The extra downside apart from the completely obvious was that PSX dither would desaturate an image slightly, which you wouldn't think would be an effect of that.

>> No.8933187

>>8932532
Even modern games like elden ring have dithering on PC (you can see it the best at the foggy lake). PS1s dithering is just very intense compared to basically every other console in existence.

>> No.8933219

>>8929583
I turn it off in my emulator

>> No.8933308

>>8933187
>elden ring have dithering
Then why is there still banding?

>> No.8934012

>>8933308
small japanese company, prease understand

>> No.8934129

>>8929583
It's how the games were meant to so I got no issues with it.