"MiSTer is the more accurate retro gaming experience"

[Anonymous No.7984859]

So many games doesn't work right HAHAHA

[Anonymous No.7984865]

>>7984859
How can mister sisters recover from this?

[Anonymous No.7985235]

>>7984859
Hmm should I use emulators which cost nothing and all the games have been tested, or buy this "more accurate" thing that's filled with glitches
>oOOps please be patient while we update the core!!

[Anonymous No.7985297]

>>7984859
Mister is not more accurate for all consoles YET, but it is actually physically possible for Mister to be accurate. Modern cpus are completely incapable of accurate emulation for many consoles, software emulators have a 20+ year head start on FPGA, but those inaccuracies are being whittled away.

[Anonymous No.7985310]

>>7985297
Get the fuck out of here with all this nuance. I just want to revive my childhood and turn this into a console war. X86 or get the ever loving fuck out of here I can't believe you would have an interest in some other hobbyist shit when you could just emulate on Windows. You're just trying to shill me a development board REEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!! STOP THE MISTER PROJECT NOW EMULATE EMULATE EMULATE

[Anonymous No.7985454]

>>7985310
Blame the guy who started the my_coomlection.jpg meme. Mister is a project in development to replicate the physical hardware. But right now
- it's janky for playing games
- it costs money
If you're aware of the facts, posting the Mister in coomlector threads actually makes the hardwarefags look smart.

[Anonymous No.7985487]

>develop Silicon Graphics MIPS emulator for Mister
>install IRIX
>install version of Alias PowerAnimator from 20 years ago
>can now do proper NURBS modeling
>Blender still can't do NURBS even after the exact same amount of time it's been around

[Anonymous No.7985514]

>FPGA is inherently more accurate than software emulation (© Analogue Inc.)
>MiSTer is about game preservation
These two memes did a lot of damage to MiSTer's audience. Instead of seeing it as yet another emulation project with flaws and constant tweaks they treat it as a universal solution to all gaming problems.

[Anonymous No.7985529]

>>7985514
It would be great if we could kick all the dumbasses out of this hobby/community. When things like this come along it's exciting because my interests in retro games/hobbyist computing intersect. You see people doing cool things just because they can. Then retarded monkeys like OP come around and fling shit everywhere. A less mature project existing isn't going to make all the traditional emulators suddenly disappear. Anybody who actually wants to buy this shit and play with it should have did proper research about it first.

[Anonymous No.7985540]

>>7984859
FPGAys have the potential to be more accurate, but software emulators have millions of coders ironing out the bugs for many years.

[Anonymous No.7985574]

>>7985529
The idea that FPGAs are some magic "perfect copy" box thing has always been the sales pitch for MiSTer et al. If most core authors admitted "actually I just went and copied how the emulator you already used works lol" it wouldn't sell half as many devices.

[Anonymous No.7985578]

>>7985574
It's a DE-10 Nano board. The only people making a "sales pitch" for it are YouTubers and the people offering accessories for it. You're more disingenuous than they are.

[Anonymous No.7985583]

>>7985578
Don't pretend there aren't people here making that sell. Not every misterfag is as honest as you are.

[Anonymous No.7985586]

>>7985583
It's just a commodity board like any other. Like a Raspberry Pi. I know you know that. You think you're really clever trying to pretend it's some grand conspiracy to lie to everyone. I don't believe you're that dumb though.

[Anonymous No.7985590]

>>7985586
Disingenuous heeb, there doesn't need to be a conspiracy of people intentionally lying, all they have to do is buy into the same youtube videos you just mentioned. I only called you honest not with the implication that they are lying but that you obviously have background with hobby computing so you know what the real state of the affair is, unlike people who would just go along with it because of rumors that it is simply the best emulation box around.

[Anonymous No.7985597]

>>7985590
If they all make YouTube videos without any kind of kickbacks from the Taiwanese company making the board and I buy one to use this free and open source project but never buy accessories from any of these people... Well then what? How is it any different than buying a Raspberry Pi and installing some emulators on it? You have an agenda and I'm not buying it now you're raging calling me a heeb. Stay mad faggot. Maybe if you sharpen up your lying skills enough you can get hired as a CNN anchor.

[Anonymous No.7985605]

>>7985597
>How is it any different than buying a Raspberry Pi and installing some emulators on it?
It isn't. I usually tell people to just do that.

>You have an agenda and I'm not buying it now you're raging calling me a heeb.
Just telling you that mister people aren't always bright, some are just falling for hype, don't know what the agenda is, you even agreed with this point in your original post. You threw the insults first btw.

[Anonymous No.7985646]

>>7985297
>i cant stop coping YET

[Anonymous No.7986023]

>>7985297
>Modern cpus are completely incapable of accurate emulation for many consoles
Which consoles? For most 4th-gen consoles and below, cycle-accurate emulation is possible on commodity hardware, with no known software incompatibility. So where are the (complete and fully compatible) FPGA emulators for 5th gen consoles?

[Anonymous No.7986092]

>>7986023
Multi-cpu systems are a serious problem for software emulation. Accurate emulation requires each component to be stepped cycle by cycle. To do this requires one to cycle around all the emulated components millions of times per second. This constant switching between different components completely negates the performance of a modern CPU, it kills the code cache and branch prediction.

[Anonymous No.7986134]

>>7986092
You didn't answer the question.

[Anonymous No.7986145]

>>7984859
>many games doesn't work right HAHAHA
>>7984865
>How can mister sisters recover from this?

Imagine being a retarded streamer that don't set the SuperChip option for SuperChip games like Jr. Pacman.

There is nothing to recover from if nothing is broken, ill guess the brainlet filter works just fine.

[Anonymous No.7986282]

>>7986134
The sega genesis is one example of a dual cpu system. And if you include its add-ons, then things get even worse. For the full 32x cd system, you have 5 cpus all running at the same time as well as all the other components of the system.

[Anonymous No.7986340]

>>7984859
Most who buy it know just enough to be wrong, so they believe mister cores program the actual chips and not reverse engineered approximations of their functionality.

[Anonymous No.7986353]

>>7984859
I'm not playing random pre third gen consoles or home computers on it so I don care. Stuff like nintendo, sega, and neogeo run perfectly so I'm pleased.

[Anonymous No.7986429]

>>7986145
Huh, I never actually knew that the Atari also did expansion chip stuff. They should probably have some way of either detecting SuperChip usage or making that option more obvious, but atm most MiSTer cores aren't designed to be retard proof yet

[Anonymous No.7986454]

>>7986429
SuperChip (128b RAM). 's' can be added to extension to automatically enable SuperChip (i.e. my_game.00s).

[Anonymous No.7986614]

>>7986145
What is the point of this then?

[Anonymous No.7986618]

>>7986145
...and here another 2 not in that Superchip list, mario flickers and the other doesn't even boot

[Anonymous No.7986630]

>>7986614
Idk what this is and what build that dude use, but the readme makes it clear.
RTFM -> https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Atari2600_MiSTer/blob/master/README.md

Supported mappers:
Auto detected: F8, FA, F6, F4, 32
Manual set through file extension(ex: my_game.E0) : E0, FE, 3F, P2, CV, UA, E7, F0
SuperChip (128b RAM). 's' can be added to extension to automatically enable SuperChip (i.e. my_game.00s).
Any supported mapper can be forced through file extension.

>>7986429
>... but atm most MiSTer cores aren't designed to be retard proof yet

This.
People these days except to be spoonfed on every topic.

[Anonymous No.7986639]

why is this fag playing 2600 games? that whole romset is cheaper on actual cartridges than his mister set up anyway. like, who would buy a mister just to play atari games?

[Anonymous No.7986649]

>>7986618
Yeah, I guess the HDMI capture card that he uses is totally happy with that fucked up signal from the Atari 2600 where the game dev needs to manage the timing of the electron beam which is "totally in the specs" modern HDMI devices. ;)

Here is a tip for your bald man child streamer. If he uses the HDMI output on systems that don't comply to the spec's of modern TV's/displays (like many games from the Atari 2600) he needs to use the analog video out or enable the frame buffer for video stabilization.

[Anonymous No.7986653]

>>7986639
>that whole romset is cheaper on actual cartridges than his mister set up anyway. like, who would buy a mister just to play atari games?
Congratulations, you win the price for today's funniest comment

[Anonymous No.7986719]

>>7986618
>>7986649

Btw instead of investing all his time searching gif's for his stream, he could invest 2 min searching why the Atari 2600 don't work so well on modern displays and how to fix that (like enabling the frame buffer even if it breaks "muh accuracy")

[Anonymous No.7986756]

>>7986649
>systems that don't comply to the spec's of modern TV's/displays (like many games from the Atari 2600)
Atari VCS in particular is a motherfucker for getting stable video signal out of it. Nothing is defined in hardware, programmers have total control over vblank and can subtly change the frame line count on the fly. Many capture devices can just give up on it.
Then you have this kusoge from Sega which displays its title screen in 65hz.

[Anonymous No.7986831]

I even found the stream...

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1100007750

>>7984859
>So many games doesn't work right HAHAHA
>Dude pushes some buttons ... game don't start. Loads the next ROM.
>Yeah must be broken

OP you reminds me of those videos where kids can't figure out how a Walkman works.

[Anonymous No.7986957]

>>7986831
You could just ask for the link.
I'm not defending him, just saying that this expensive box is not the best experience like everyone here say

[Anonymous No.7986998]

>>7986282
Yet mister Genesis and Sega CD implementation have more emulation bugs than accurate software emulators....

[Anonymous No.7987019]

>>7986957
The only thing that I can agree on is the mapper "problem". But ill guess it's not ideal to add a header to a tiny ROM that is already tiny as fuck.

To be honest, in most cases' people expect things to work without reading the manual and most manufacturers try to make their products "idiot-proof"

After setting up everything correctly it's just a "great experience" if someone gets filtered just because he or she is too lazy to read, I don't relay care. But most people just use the SNES/Genesis core and call it a day, and on those cores you can't fuck up to hard.

I don't want to know how many people would fail if the "update_all" script wouldn't exist that sets up nearly all arcade cores for the people.

TL;DR if you get filtered by the setting up a core, you deserve it. It's not harder than setting up a Pi.

>>7986998
Source?
>Just trust me bro

[Anonymous No.7987024]

>>7986957
The only thing that I can agree on is the mapper "problem". But ill guess it's not ideal to add a header to a tiny ROM that is already tiny as fuck.
To be honest, in most cases' people expect things to work without reading the manual and most manufacturers try to make their products "idiot-proof"
After setting up everything correctly it's just a "great experience" if someone gets filtered just because he or she is too lazy to read, I don't relay care. But most people just use the SNES/Genesis core and call it a day, and on those cores you can't fuck up to hard.
I don't want to know how many people would fail if the "update_all" script wouldn't exist that sets up nearly all arcade cores for the people.

TL;DR if you get filtered by setting up a core, you deserve it. It's not harder than setting up a Pi.

>>7986998
Source?
>Just trust me bro

[Anonymous No.7987175]

>>7985514
This is 100% accurate and it’s wild that they still get angry that you call it emulation

[Anonymous No.7987512]

>>7986998
I never said the cores were perfect yet, I just said that perfection is at least physically attainable. No amount of work will ever allow the software emulators to be accurate because the cpu just can't do it, whilst the fpga emulators improve quickly.

[Anonymous No.7987529]

>>7987512
>No amount of work will ever allow the software emulators to be accurate because the cpu just can't do it
there are literally multiple perfect software emulators though, both have their pros and cons but don't just lie to save face

[Anonymous No.7987728]

>>7985514
I just think FPGAs in general are cool, I enjoyed working with them in college, and like that they're getting cheap enough for fun consumer applications like this. And yet it all goes to shit, so fast.

[Anonymous No.7988084]

>>7987529
But there's a shortage of autists willing to dedicate their lives to coding them. Hint hint.

[Anonymous No.7988089]

>>7988084
irrelevant
there is no shortage of autists at any time and creating for a niche product which obviously has hard limitations

[Anonymous No.7988090]

>>7988089
which obviously has hard limitations is a bad idea
especially when more and more people want enhancements if they so choose

[Anonymous No.7988098]

>>7988089
I didn't say there was a shortage of autists. I said there's a shortage of autists willing to dedicate their lives to making complicated cycle accurate emulators to run on PCs. Also much like aging white women there's THE WALL. This is where the goalposts get moved. The newer the generation of console the more raw fucking power you're going to need to accurately emulate it with a home computer. /emugen/ types don't care because their purpose for getting into emulation of later generations of consoles is muh graphics look I'm running it at a higher resolution. No fucks given about accuracy at all. So once you talk about emulating those kinds of things it's muh superior graphics. Anyway I am just glad there are more options, more people trying to solve this problem in new ways, and I think you're a tourist /vg/ faggot and should drink bleach.

[Anonymous No.7988102]

>just use an emulator bro
>look I'm playing the new zelda remake at 1440p!

[Anonymous No.7988304]

>>7987024
>source?

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/MegaCD_MiSTer/issues
https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Genesis_MiSTer/issues

I don't have these issues in the software emulators I use

[Anonymous No.7988337]

>>7985235
>But it's input lag free, the same way you can get for free with emulators and run-ahead!

[Anonymous No.7989173]

>>7984859
b-b-but they said it wasn't emulation!

[Anonymous No.7989371]

Reminder: Chad doesn't emulate.

[Anonymous No.7989375]

>>7989371
guess that emulator box gathers dust then

[Anonymous No.7989389]

>>7985487
Will software emulation not do it properly?

[Anonymous No.7989481]

>>7988337
X86 fags forced to choose accuracy or no input lag. It's no secret that run-ahead is an accuracy destroying hack. Devs openly admit it. If you want cycle accuracy it's a no go.

[Anonymous No.7989821]

>>7984859
>it's totally not just an emulator flashed into a shitty programmable processor at all
Such horse shit.

[Anonymous No.7989830]

>>7989481
More accurate than FPGA, and just about every goddamn thing is just fine with a single frame and you know it. Even without it, no vsync/gsync on a modern low latency display is close enough. Cope hardware fag.

[Anonymous No.7989847]

>>7989481
> run-ahead is an accuracy destroying hack
Maybe, it would highly depend on the game though, many would be absolutely fine. The most likely issue that would occur would be with raster effects, as they render concurrently with the execution of the game engine so if those effects are not double buffered then input from the next frame could possibly contaminate the previous frame.

[Anonymous No.7989857]

>>7989830
If you are playing on a sample and hold display then lag would be the least of your concern. I have no idea how anyone can stand the eye bleeding motion blur. For 3d games is livable, but for 2d games its unbearable.

[Anonymous No.7989868]

>>7989857
>no blur on CRT meme
What is phosphor decay? This is the most overstated meme of a display artifact I've ever heard. On OLED I see no blur even without meme frame insertion.

[Anonymous No.7989916]

>>7989481
Could you elaborate, please? I'm using run-ahead for months now, and still haven't see an issue compared to when I didn't use it. The dev you're mentioned specified any game in which that happens?

So far, no problems encountered with NES, Master System, Super Nintendo, Mega Drive and Neo Geo.

[Anonymous No.7989925]

>>7989868
Sample and hold blur is several orders of magnitude worse than phosphor decay. They are not even remotely comparable. Phosphor decay will sometimes leave trails if you have a dark background. But for most scenes they are not visible at all, on the other hand, sample and hold blur is visible any time anything moves.
> On OLED I see no blur
Well lucky you for not being able to see it, one you can see, you can never un-see it.

[Anonymous No.7989930]

>>7989916
https://www.libretro.com/index.php/retroarch-1-7-2%E2%80%8A-%E2%80%8Aachieving-better-latency-than-original-hardware-through-new-runahead-method/
>Accurate? No way. Fascinating? You betcha. Mere “same latency as real hardware” is SO last month…
From the initial announcement of this feature.

[Anonymous No.7990010]

>>7989925
I can see it on LED, especially older/lower end models pretty easily. Just not so much on my OLED. Not enough to be put off.

[Anonymous No.7990070]

>>7989916
it's cope. it's inaccurate in that it uses savestates and thus isn't truly authentic, but your average person will never notice any hiccups assuming that runahead is set to something reasonable

[Anonymous No.7990132]

Been going through this thread since whenever this shit comes up I like to read up on it as much as possible. Not just to argue with people on here who have an almost religious devotion to trying to convince other people what they should use. I do it because I am autistic enough to actually care about these things and find them interesting.
https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=65425&sid=7d67d487ee23bf5988ff5f857cec6f0e&start=60
The points donluca is making stuck out the most to me besides the retards on both sides doing the same kind of shit flinging we did in this thread
>run ahead is a bad attempt at copying GroovyMAME's frame_delay which is now evolving into frame slicing and other, better ways to kill that last frame of lag due to vsync.
>Retroarch should have never existed, IMHO, it has done an ungodly amount of damage to the quality of the emus themselves for the sake of convenience, but i'll keep that rant for another day/thread.
>Again, and for the last time: the only thing FPGAs have on their own side is convenience since they can achieve lagless input/output without the user actually doing anything, while on PCs there's quite a steep learning curve to learn how to configure OS and emu properly.

Now even though I like researching these things and the kinds of claims being made I personally like emulating on shit hardware and don't care about accuracy most of the time. I'm too cheap to pay for FPGA shit with rare exceptions like when I bought a Chinese made SD2SNES. I enjoy laughing at the people that get personally offended when the topic is even brought up and start preaching the gospel of traditional emulation. They make lots of accusations when they are just as guilty of making claims that don't hold up.

[Anonymous No.7990159]

>>7990132
Why would you link someone else's opinion? That thread says nothing of substance or shows any relevant tests.

[Anonymous No.7990172]

>>7990159
It's more relevant and interesting than whatever you have to say lmao. The whole point is cutting through marketing speak and getting to the truth isn't it? I'm in here shitposting about how you x86 fags won't get accurate emulation without input lag while asking myself is that really true? Going down this path tells me perhaps not but the devs of the software you're using don't care to implement it and it will take a bit of effort on your part to actually make it work on your end. That's 1000x more interesting and relevant than shilling one thing over the other console war faggotry.

[Anonymous No.7990202]

>>7990172
That thread is just some rando blowing smoke. There's no tests or concrete examples given, just "groovymame good retroarch bad". It's basically the same as this thread but forced to be more polite because people aren't anonymous.

[Anonymous No.7990209]

>>7990202
You could google something like groovymame CRT tests if you really cared that much. I don't think you do though. That's what makes this so funny to me. Rather than concede that the emulators you use sacrifice accuracy for speed but it's good enough for you and you don't care, the same exact thing I would tell you, you want to take it this far.

[Anonymous No.7990240]

Mame lmao.

[Anonymous No.7990306]

>>7989930
I think it's an interpretation problem. The text means "innacurate" as "the original hardware doesn't have input lag this low", not that problems will arise. Until now, I've still to find a game having issues because of run-ahead.

[Anonymous No.7990318]

>>7990306
Nobody who's seriously into emulation is going to mistake discussion of accuracy as talking about games having issues running. The games I want to play work without issues on the old ass version of snes9x I run on my Vita. I'd never mistake that for an accurate emulator though.

[Anonymous No.7990330]

>>7990318
Then, there's no problem if everything works just fine. We can't be stuck on what-if scenarios when there's no difference between original hardware and emulation, even if the latter isn't cycle accurate.

[Anonymous No.7990339]

>>7990330
If you want an authentic experience, which you should*, there is a problem. The asterisk is to note that you should want the best the hardware you want to play it on and are willing to spend your money on is able to deliver. If I was crying that my Vita with it's underpowered CPU isn't accurate enough and requires hacky emulators designed for ancient PCs that weren't up to modern standards I'd sound like a complete idiot. Much like I would if I complained about the progress being made with FPGAs and told people to just use something else.

[Anonymous No.7990387]

>>7990339
I'd unironically like to know why someone *should* seek the "authentic" experience, if there's no perceivable difference. Anything other than original hardware isn't authentic anymore, so there is no set path. Go with whatever you want. For the consoles I emulate, I can say the video/audio/gameplay experience is very satisfactory, though I'm pretty sure the code behind the scenes must have its idiosyncrasies. Well, I'm no machine, so I don't care about the code, if the result is the same. I enjoy having this freedom.

[Anonymous No.7990406]

>>7990387
I can definitely perceive the shittiness of a bad emulator. It's just off. It's especially noticeable if you have experience playing on real hardware. One of my closest friends is a graphics fag and he's interested in running games at higher resolutions and shit like that. I'm a purist and want to leave things like they are unless there's a really good reason like slowdowns etc not to. When I share my opinions with him he rages about them. Unless a game runs like shit on it I will always recommend real hardware over anything else. Beyond that I recommend the best most accurate emulation possible, even down to what's most convenient for you to use personally. I wouldn't tell you to upgrade if you were happy playing snes9x on a netbook.

[Anonymous No.7990410]

>>7990240
Show a clip of a game running faster on software emulation, otherwise GTFO

[Anonymous No.7990513]

the thing is, if you're white, you're going to want a mister. I'm white, and I have 4 (one per system, when you mix and match sometimes you have to deal with core retention from gate burn, no thanks). the other day I was passing by an indian couple on the street and I flashed my mister at them. needless to say, rajdeep was assblasted when amarpreet immediately came with me and gave me sloppy toppy in my backseat. she said he plays roms on a raspberry pi and it was a huge turnoff. to be honest, I can't blame her!

[Anonymous No.7990523]

>>7990513
kek raspberry pi, what's he trying to do with that, lose on robot wars?

[Anonymous No.7990525]

>>7990513
Only a beta soidrinker would buy a mister. See OPs webm

[Anonymous No.7990659]

>>7990525
spoken like someone who is too poor to buy (at least) 4 misters. it's ok Raj, since you're a zoomer nobody expects you to have that much money yet but please, it's not a good look to be coping this hard

[Anonymous No.7990906]

>>7990209
>I’ve made up my own mind with 0 proof of my point
I mean the only thing that’s laughable here is you mate

[Anonymous No.7990908]

>>7990906
I'd fun post a bit more but the janny's feelings are getting hurt. It's time to lay off this dead horse.

[Anonymous No.7991031]

>>7989371
Based

[Anonymous No.7991065]

>>7989868
confirmed too young to have ever played on a crt

[Anonymous No.7991164]

>run ahead is a bad attempt at copying GroovyMAME's frame_delay

Not at all, they are completely different things, something that is clearly and correctly outlined in that shmups thread in response to Donluca’s lack of knowledge on the subject.