/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.783029]

This game truly marks the beginning of the Final Fantasy series's decline into mediocrity. It might even mark the eventual decline of all JRPGs in the way that it negatively influenced the genre and led to such forgettable rehashes. The way it was marketed was profitable for Square and Sony, but ultimately it did more harm that good for this industry.

PS: If this was your first Final Fantasy then take off your nostalgia goggles please.

[Anonymous No.783042]

>but ultimately it did more harm that good for this industry.

Yeah, it made people think jRPG's were good. It took years to de-program people. Thankfully, nobody gives a fuck about jRPG's anymore.

[Anonymous No.783048]

>implying FFX was not an awesome game
nigga what?

[Zangief !!YG0uo46UrxQ No.783049]

>>783029

No need to start a fight about it buddy, I didn't like it either, but throwing a fit about it a decade and one half later isn't gonna change anything

[Anonymous No.783050]

>>783029
>PS: If this was your first Final Fantasy then take off your nostalgia goggles please.

I like IX or Tactics more. Have since I played them. Doesn't mean VII wasn't my first. Not everyone thinks this game is the best. Even if it was their first introduction to the series as a whole.

>>783042
Incorrect. You're not everybody, so stop acting like you speak for them.

[Anonymous No.783053]

>>783050
>Incorrect. You're not everybody, so stop acting like you speak for them.

What I said was a fact. It's not for you to cry like a baby about. Get over it.

[Anonymous No.783057]

>>783053
>Thankfully, nobody gives a fuck about jRPG's anymore.

That's not a fact, since people still make and buy them.

You can't make up facts and then cry about people going "that doesn't sound quite right".

[Anonymous No.783058]

>>783029
FF3 - 7 are the best Fina fancies
That and some classic Dragon Quest games are all I need to fill my quench for classic traditional JRPGs

[Anonymous No.783062]

>>783057

Please, people still make text adventure games too. That doesn't mean they're popular or sell well. Games like Ni No Kuni and Xenoblade didn't even sell well in Japan.

[Anonymous No.783069]

>>783048
>implying it was

[Anonymous No.783067]

>>783062
>Nobody gives a shit about them anymore.
>People bought them.

No. They might be falling out of the limelight, but that doesn't mean the entire genre is now dismissed by everyone, as you so boldly claimed.

By the way? Pokémon, by logic, is a jRPG. That sells just fine.

[Anonymous No.783078]

>>783062
http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/the-myth-of-jrpg-decline.225095/

[Anonymous No.783084]

I really enjoyed 7 and after a recent playthrough it still blew me away. Prior to 7 I played all of the other US releases (1, 4 and 6)

[Anonymous No.783108]

>>783069
how would it not have been? Music was awesome, battles were great, Auron was a fucking badass and the battle system was awesome. i honestly have no idea why people shit on turn-based battle systems.

[Anonymous No.783123]

>>783108
Music was good, battle system was good, Auron was cool, but that's all I'll grant. The battle system itself quickly devolved into the simplest color-coded game of rock paper scissors I've ever seen. By the third or fourth area, I was ALREADY sick of running into the same recolored enemies over and over. There was no strategy to it, it was just "if it's flying, use Wakka, etc." Wasted a really good turn-based system.

But my real problem with the game comes from the bizarre and mismatched art direction, the near-universally grating characters (save Auron and Jecht), and the HORRENDOUS story.

[Anonymous No.783132]

>>783123
I hate FFX. Im sure the music and everything is good, but i didnt get very far. There arent many games I give up on but the pacing was awful. it was flashy and exciting but fuck let me do something.
>talk to person
>cutscene where Im taken to a new area/world/what ever
>repeat

how am I supposed to play a game that doesnt let me do anything. I havent played a FF since X it was so bad. At least in older games I can walk to the next area myself even in the beginning

[Anonymous No.783146]

>>783132
Yeah i agree with this.
I just started playing blitzball and had more fun with that than the rest of the story and never actually finished it for ages. And when i did it was just a token final boss fight that was absolutely no challenge. Took bloody ages to get to it as well. So many cut scenes.

[Anonymous No.783162]

Sorry OP but 9 is a great FF so you are objectively wrong.

[Anonymous No.783230]

>>783029
>It might even mark the eventual decline of all JRPGs
>implying that JRPGs don't stay afloat at the very least because of Fatlus

[Anonymous No.783313]

Hi. OP here.

>>783132
Yeah FFX is terrible. Everything about it pissed me off and it was the last straw actually. Not going to play another FF ever again.

>>783042
JRPGs are still kicking and aren't going anywhere. The FF7 casual market doesn't exactly exist though. That group of course will move on to the next popularized game that has been marketed toward them with over the top graphics and other cliches.

>>783162
I understand that FFIX was a belated apology to fans that were offended and disgusted by the broken mechanics of FFVIII and the Hollywood sellout ff a game that VII. But you can't go back to the good old days by slapping on the same costume, putting on a bunch of pretty graphics, and turning into a midget. Albeit the game was a significant improvement and I did finish it, it wasn't up to par with the many previous entries I enjoyed... And what followed with X needs no further explanation.

[Anonymous No.783317]

But OP, the pinnacle of the series isn't even out yet.

[Anonymous No.783323]

B-but OP, this was the first FF game that us Europeans actually got. It was a great game, and made it possible for the previous games to eventually be released.

[Anonymous No.783357]

>>783108
let's be honest. the pace of FFX is an absolute fucking joke. cutscenes trigger EVERY three steps in some areas when they want to shoehorn some story section. it pisses me the fuck off to no end.

same question as for most modern games: what do you want? a game or a fucking movie? I sure as fuck want the former and no movie simulator where only play a game for the sole reason of unlocking cutscene content and not much inbetween.

other than that there is the weird ass art direction already mentioned

[Anonymous No.783364]

>>783323
>implying you wouldn't just be able download the other games for an emulator either way

[Anonymous No.783383]

I don't think a single game is to blame for JRPGs' downfall. The time changed. People simply prefer shooters and action-adventure games now. It's not even S-E's fault. Well, it is their fault for not realizing that the classic JRPG formula doesn't work. They really should make shooters or action-adventure games or JRPGs with a combat system of a shooter game or like a real time beat 'em up style combat. Granted, they can't really do shooters but they have great artists and all those subsidiaries. So simply let someone else do the programming and game design and you do the art, the models, the cutscenes, the story, etc.

[Anonymous No.783424]

>>783029

My first final fantasy was Final Fantasy III on the SNES and I still like FFVII man.

There is nothing inherently "wrong" with FFVII in the sense that it caused any sort of "decline" of all JRPGs. I mean, how did it cause what you claim it caused? Because it became a household name and popular as fuck? Because it spawned spin-offs and a movie?

I mean, at that point, you're just saying that because it was successful, the entire genre is currently in decline.

Do you realize how retarded you sound? You just hate that it made FFVII even more popular than it already was, and FFIII was a very very popular game.

[Anonymous No.783434]

It's been so long since I've last played FFVII that I actually forgot majority of the plot and it's devices.

It'd be like playing it for the first time again..

[Anonymous No.783445]

>>783424
I think that what he's implying isn't that it killed off the genre by giving it an example to follow, but that the example it gave was inherently more flawed that what was present in the (sub)genre before it. Not that I agree with him, the only thing that the FF series killed off was FF itself. And maybe Xenogears.

[Anonymous No.783447]

>>783029
>This game truly marks the beginning of the Final Fantasy series's decline into mediocrity
No, Chrono Trigger does. It was the game that killed JRPGs by providing a truly great story, art and music and "fun", but easy and simplistic gameplay.

Everyone since has been emulating it and failing miserably, because the formula was bad from the get-go. Unless you manage to create something truly amazing even without the gameplay, Chrono Trigger-type game barely works at all.

[Anonymous No.783452]

>>783146
>blitzball
>fun

pick one

[Anonymous No.783460]

>>783445

I think xenogears killed itself

I mean, lets be honest with ourselves, as much as I love the game, you can't deny how weird it is to explain the universe almost exclusively outside of the game the way Xenogears did.

It was just too ambitious.

[Anonymous No.783462]

>>783447
>No, Chrono Trigger does. It was the game that killed JRPGs by providing a truly great story, art and music and "fun", but easy and simplistic gameplay.
Uh, you do realize that you've just described Dragon Quest. Which CT largely drew from.

[Anonymous No.783463]

>>783447

>Implying Simple is bad

Not everything has to be complex

[Anonymous No.783465]

>>783447
>Chrono Trigger
>Truly great story

[Anonymous No.783468]

>>783460
I didn't mean Xenogears as a game on its own as I actually liked CD2 more than CD1, I rather meant as a potential franchise. Xenosaga 1-3 were sort-of successors but let's be honest here that they were quite different in their feel and direction at the same time, they almost felt haphazardly tacked onto the story.

[Anonymous No.783475]

>>783465
It's not like most JRPGs (and hell, even WRPGs) have a better story than CT. Although for me it's just a testament of how far we are from seeing videogames accepted as a serious narrative medium.

[Anonymous No.783478]

>>783468

Xenosaga Ep.1 tripped me the fuck out man

The sequels just didn't click with me, so I can agree

[Anonymous No.783482]

I personally enjoy all the final fantasy games, although I think nine is my favorite.

[Anonymous No.783514]

>implying it isn't the second best FF game.

Stop being so tryhard and hating what's popular.

Even FF9, 13 and 13-2 were good games.

[Anonymous No.783519]

>>783029
For me, personally, it's after FF7 when Square (and JRPG's in general) start to become hit-or-miss with their games and I'd rather point the finger at FF8. There's only two things wrong with FF7; the highly vocal, retarded section of its fanbase, and the shitty sequels/prequels that never should have been made.

[Anonymous No.783530]

>>783029
I played through VII for the first time last year and I can promptly say you're full of shit. It is at least as good as VI.

[Anonymous No.783531]

>>783519
>There's only two things wrong with FF7; the highly vocal, retarded section of its fanbase, and the shitty sequels/prequels that never should have been made.
And the plothole swiss cheese. And the 2 minute animations for attacks.

[Anonymous No.783538]

>>783531
It has no more plot holes than any other Final Fantasy game.

[Anonymous No.783539]

>>783538
Hence FF stories always sucked

[Anonymous No.783540]

>>783514
>13 and 13-2 were good games
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=47YPs-qwNQU#t=24s

[Anonymous No.783541]

>>783539
Pretty much, we are in agreement

[Anonymous No.783546]

>>783541
In that case, FF4 is the start of the decline, because it prompted increasing the focus on the story in future installments (except FF5 to an extent).

[Anonymous No.783549]

>>783465
It's one of the best of any video game. If you think it's bad, you must think 99% of video game stories are shit.

[Anonymous No.783551]

>>783546
Although to be honest, if it werent for the hilarious stories, there would be no reason to play the games at all. As games, they're tedios, repetitive and unrewarding.

[Anonymous No.783556]

>>783551
Which stories did you find hillarious? I think they're awkward at best.
>As games, they're tedios, repetitive and unrewarding.
Hence FF series as a whole is pretty damn bad.

[Anonymous No.783561]

>>783556
VIII in particular was so bad it could have been a comedy. And yeah, FF is awful. As is he whole JRPG genre to be honest

[Anonymous No.783563]

>>783546

They aren't perfect, but i like the stories

[Anonymous No.783568]

>>783561
SMT and SaGa are pretty fine...

[Anonymous No.783571]

>>783029
>This game truly marks the beginning of the Final Fantasy series's decline into mediocrity.

I'd argue that FF8 was moreso that


>ultimately it did more harm that good for this industry.

Wrong. FF7 is the reason why that whole gen was ruled by JRPGs

>>783042

Because the current environment of short expensive FPS's with DLC everything is so much better than paying $50 or less for a 40 hours (or longer) game that was 100% complete and well done.

[Anonymous No.783591]

>>783462
>Uh, you do realize that you've just described Dragon Quest. Which CT largely drew from.
CT deviated from DQ as far as could possibly be. Gameplay wise, DQ and CT are the opposites.

And DQ doesn't survive on story. It actually has great adventure gameplay. Battles are numerous, but irrelevant. It's all about solving field puzzles.

Unlike post-CT type of JRPG, i.e. FFVII+ etc.

[Anonymous No.783592]

>>783463
I did not say "simple". I said "simplistic".

C- for reading comprehension.

[Anonymous No.783594]

>>783591
>CT deviated from DQ as far as could possibly be. Gameplay wise, DQ and CT are the opposites.
How? It did away with random encounters, the story did get somewhat nonlinear at some point, but those two aspects hardly make it the "opposite".

[Anonymous No.783601]

>>783594
It's still a JRPG, but it's the story-focused JRPG that triest to never kill the player and barely has any field puzzles.

DQ, on the other hand, always had minimal story, high challenge level compared to CT and such, and had field puzzles as it's major gameplay focus.

They are opposites.

[Anonymous No.783603]

>>783594
Trigger has pretty much the exact same ATB system as FF6 has with dual/triple techs added in. Dragon Quest has the old turn based combat which FF hasn't used since FF3 on the NES. That's extremely different.

[Anonymous No.783610]

>>783603
Battles are much less important in DQ than in Final Fantasy.

Take away the battles, and DQ turns into an adventure game. Do the same to any FF, and it turns out to dust.

[Anonymous No.783617]

>>783601
>It's still a JRPG, but it's the story-focused JRPG that triest to never kill the player
That's a difficulty issue, and that has more to do with games becoming more accessible and demanded by the general public than CT's direct influence.
>minimal story
Not really, it never had a thoroughly defined protag like some other JRPGs, but neither did CT and starting with DQ4, story was becoming more and more of a focus.
>had field puzzles as it's major gameplay focus.
What field puzzles do you have in mind?
>>783603
Not quite as different as you'd think. Both are variants of a turnbased model. ATB is basically a way of giving a "time limit" to your turns, although it does more than just that, but I don't feel like going into details here.
>>783610
There's hardly more of an "adventure game" in DQ than in FF3 for example.

[Anonymous No.783624]

>>783617
>and that has more to do with games becoming more accessible and demanded by the general public than CT's direct influence
Chicken and egg.

The point is, CT was the beginning of the end, not FFVII.

[Anonymous No.783631]

If FF7 had sold like shit and was obscure as fuck you wouldn't hear anything but high praise for the game.

[Anonymous No.783636]

>>783617
>There's hardly more of an "adventure game" in DQ than in FF3 for example.
Truth be told, I haven't played 2, 3 and 5, so I can't speak for those. Maybe they were aping DQ better than 1 and 4.

[Anonymous No.783645]

>>783636
Even then, the "adventure gameplay" in DQ is severely gimped, if it's present at all. The "field puzzles" in DQ were hardly puzzles (if you're thinking about the same thing as I do), they were more like quests when somebody tells you that you have to use item X on spot Y to progress. I'd hardly call that a puzzle really.

[Anonymous No.783656]

>>783571
I agree with this man.

But it's only fair that FF7 catches more shit because it was a lot more popular. And we all know popular things are garbage (unless made by Nintendo).

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.783672]

I thought 9, 10, 11, and 12 were all much better so I disagree that it hurt the Final Fantasy series, but there's no reason to get all upset about one game.

[Anonymous No.783692]

IT wad my first Final Fantasy and I still can't get into it the rest of the series. I even tried fucking Mystic Quest. I never tried 7 again because I'm, afraid I'll hate it and I have some really good memories of playing it with my mom right after her and my dad got divorced. So no, I'm leaving the nostalgia goggles on.

[Anonymous No.783693]

>>783692

I accidentally the whole thing.

[Anonymous No.783701]

>>783692
As long as you don't go around IGN or Gamefaqs and spout it's the greatest work of art by man, then everybody's okay with that.

[Anonymous No.783709]

Final Fantasy II/IV will always be my favorite game. Everything about it is still amazing to me. Although, and sorry about this op, I did really enjoy VIII. VII was shit though, it just got lots of acclaim because it was in 3D.

[Anonymous No.783717]

>>783672
>11
huh

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.783724]

>>783717
Played it for 6 years, it was fantastic.

Not an appropriate convo for /vr/ though.

[Anonymous No.783729]

>>783029
>rehash

You dumb fuckers have used this word so much that now you just sling it at anything you don't like. It's meaningless now. It's just another stupid, /v/-tier buzzword.

[Anonymous No.783865]

>>783029

Why would you say that without listing reasons as to why it's so terrible?

[Anonymous No.783869]

>>783053

Well it didn't take long for this board to start becoming /v/.

[Anonymous No.783878]

>>783132

Oh you think FF X was bad? You should give XIII a try, X will seem like a fairly good game after that one.

[Anonymous No.783879]

>>783317

I've tried to get into that game twice. It seems that I don't like the style of game, I just can't get into it. Shame, I actually liked the story from what I played.

[Anonymous No.783897]

>>783132

yeah, play through more of the game. That opinion is awful.

[Anonymous No.783920]

>>783897

It's pretty spot on, actually. It was a linear cutscene fest, even more-so than previous games in the series (though it wasn't as bad as XIII).

[Anonymous No.783995]

FF7 haters are mostly faggots since most of them liked the game, seeing as it's a good game and all, and then backpedaled once fanboys found their secret club.

As for a decline I don't think there was one. There's been ups and downs, but the series didn't slowly lose steam. It crashed suddenly. People did not like 13, but SE won't move past it.

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784003]

>>783995
Didn't play it til a few years ago and still didn't like it.

Not to mention not everyone feels the same way playing a game today than when they first played it. There's a fine line between nostalgia and delusion.

So many things from the "date", the snowboarding, the generic characters, the hot tub scene, etc, all point to the fact that it was clearly made for younger people, so it's not really that farfetched that a site made up of adults don't like it.

[Anonymous No.784008]

>>784003

>Whorehouse
>Crossdressing
>Teenage suicide
>Globalization
>Terrorism (before it was cool)
>Made for younger people

[Anonymous No.784010]

I started out with the first Final Fantasy
Best. Game. Ever

[Anonymous No.784013]

>>784003

And I first played it three years ago when I was 27 and I loved it (though I like VI more). Just because you don't like it doesn't mean that all adults share your views. Not everyone who does, likes it for nostalgia.

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784017]

>>784008
>Whorehouse
Only interesting to those just hitting puberty.
>Crossdressing
Only funny to those just hitting puberty.
>Teenage suicide
Easily overlooked.
>Globalization
Easily overlooked.
>Terrorism (before it was cool)
For edgy kids just hitting puberty.
>Made for younger people
Yup.

>>784013
>Just because you don't like it doesn't mean that all adults share your views
...No shit?

[Anonymous No.784028]

>>784017

>Crossdressing
>Only funny to those just hitting puberty.

Depends on how it's used. It's been used in comedy forever, for all sorts of audiences.

>Easily overlooked

I liked this board better in it's first week, before it was another /v/.

>For edgy kids just hitting puberty.

That's how it's used now. In FF VII it was a plot point, AVALANCE resorted to terrorism because that's what they thought they had to do, but later Barret admitted that he was wrong.

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784035]

>>784028
If people disagree with you, this board is "another /v/"?

I just don't like FF7. Stop getting your panties in a bunch about it.

[Anonymous No.784041]

Hi, OP here

>>783447
To be honest, I strongly agree with you the more I think about it. Chrono Trigger represents the first JRPG to reach above and beyond to hold serious cinematic qualities. I suppose some might argue that such gems as Dragon Quest 5 and Final Fantasy 6 possessed similar qualities, the technology and/or the passion wasn't there until the Dream Team took over. Chrono Trigger provides the player with a plethora of "cutscenes", and the idea of virtual consequences and an almost D&D sense of supposed morality (within the first few hours of gameplay) via the concept of time travel and item placement. Chrono Trigger also provides the player with a plethora of cinematic feedback in hopes of influencing the player to post modernly change the "reality" of the game. This can be seen in the numerous endings of the game, Frog's flashbacks of life with Cyrus, the ambiguity of what happens to Schala, and more.

This is what makes Chronk Trigger a fantastic game and also unfortunately makes it a negative influence upon games that would follow.

>>783462
This isn't what the poster was referring to. I am a huge fan of Dragon Quest and there is a significant reason why it has stood the test of time, not completely lost its audience, and not completely imploded upon itself from a story point of view. DQ is not Chrono Trigger. I know that the spikey hair protagonist of DQ6 resembles Chrono a little bit, but our similarities end there. DQ games are not story-driven, and are far from cinematic, flashback/cutscene filled messes of voice actors stumbling through lines. DQ is a game that is about its own gameplay and, most importantly, about the ad adventure of traveling itself. You won't find over the top character driven narratives in any DQ game.

These leads me to the initial conclusion: FF7 blows

[Anonymous No.784039]

I have to agree. This is when they started with story-lines that were better suited for soap operas. Heavy focus on love and romance and feelings over any real plot killed the series.

[Anonymous No.784047]

>>784035

He's right though, your arguments are very flawed and your line of reasoning like "edgy = bad" is very in line with /v/ thought patterns. Also you are a tripfag. I don't know what you're thinking but you won't find acceptance on /vr/ for both of those reasons

[Anonymous No.784048]

>>784035

People can disagree with me all they like, it's just that saying "Easily overlooked" is just a throw away comment used when you don't actually have a good argument. It's a technique that runs rampant on /v/.

[Anonymous No.784056]

>>784039

Love was a big focus on IV as well. One of the most used themes in the game was even called "Theme of Love".

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784057]

>>784047
My only real "argument" was against his implication that everyone who hates FF7 is just pretending to seem cool.
>Also you are a tripfag.
So

[Anonymous No.784063]

>>784057

>his implication that everyone who hates FF7 is just pretending to seem cool.

I never even said that, that was someone else entirely.

[Anonymous No.784068]

>>784056
I felt like it was handled much better there though. Like character relationships didn't push the plot into the background the same way they did in FF 7+

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784073]

>>784063
>that was someone else entirely
Don't jump into a conversation that you're not a part of then if you're not willing to read that conversation first?

Or just get a tripcode if you care about your identity so much.

[Anonymous No.784074]

>>784057

So you will be subject to ridicule no matter what you post because you make yourself out to be a target. Tripfags are unwelcome on /vr/ just like on most boards. The only thing /vr/ hates more than a tripfag is a reseller, so I guess you got that going for you

[Anonymous No.784075]

>>784068

True enough, though I don't think love got in the way of the plot too much in VII. Yeah it was there, and focused on more than in IV, but there was still a lot of focus on Sephiroth being a bastard. I will agree that it did really get in the way of VIII-X.

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784078]

>>784074
Stop shitposting, take this meta shit to >>>/q/

[sage No.784083]

>>784073
whatthefuckamireading

[Anonymous No.784085]

>>784073

This is a public image board, everyone jumps into conversations, that's kind of the point. I did read the conversation, which is why I responded. You got pissed because you're an attention whore who must always be right.

[sage No.784089]

>>784078

I liked it better when you posted loli. Now you're just annoying.

[Anonymous No.784090]

>>784089

>Posting sage in the wrong field

What the fuck is wrong with me.

[Anonymous No.784094]

>>784073
>>784078

You don't understand that not everyone on 4chan is the same person. You are a lot newer than I thought. Lurk the fuck more.

[Anonymous No.784093]

>>784041
>DQ games are not story-driven
What the hell

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784095]

>>784085
>everyone jumps into conversations
Of course. I didn't say "Don't ever jump into any conversations ever". Please read the full sentences before responding to them.
>I did read the conversation, which is why I responded
Clearly you didn't because you seemed to have forgotten the original thing I argued against in the first place.

I'll stop feeding into you, however, because this thread doesn't need anymore derailing. Talk about FF7 or don't.

[sage No.784098]

>>784094
>>Lurk the fuck more

do this peeweed. and please do it on another board.

[Anonymous No.784103]

FFVII threads should be removed immediately. They're a cesspool for infighting and shitposting.

[Anonymous No.784109]

>>784103

That's kinda funny, I've been in some damn good FF VII threads on /v/.

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784116]

>>784041
>DQ is a game that is about its own gameplay and, most importantly, about the ad adventure of traveling itself. You won't find over the top character driven narratives in any DQ game.
I honestly felt that way about Chrono Trigger. Didn't care for the story or characters, but did just enjoy playing the game.

Doesn't take too much to impress me in an RPG's gameplay, though. Even Dragon Quest doesn't let you do the "Press X til the end of the game" shit which is exactly what FF7 lets you do.

[Anonymous No.784117]

>>784095
I think sephiroth could kick your ass.

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784126]

>>784117
>I think sephiroth could kick your ass.
I should hope so. Despite his edginess, he's still an ex-military serial killer. If he couldn't beat up a measly gamer, there's little hope for him.

[Anonymous No.784130]

>you will never be a golden chocobo

[Anonymous No.784638]

FF7 was great. 6 and 8 were unbearably shitty. 10 was good unless you suffer from social autism/being 12 year old. 11+ is total Gackt-shit.

[Anonymous No.784670]

>>784638

>6
>Shitty
>10
>good

[Anonymous No.784706]

>>784670
At least X had a plot. 6 was nothing but sidequests five hours into the game

[Anonymous No.784717]

>>784706

Well FF VI was made back when JRPGs still split focus between gameplay and story so yeah, it does have actual gameplay. I guess I can see why you hate it if all you care about are pretty cutscenes.

[Anonymous No.784723]

>>784706

>6 was nothing but sidequests five hours into the game

What? I don't care if you like VI or not but what are you talking about?

[Anonymous No.784730]

>>784717

>FFX doesn't have gameplay
>Just because I don't like it, it's not gameplay

X *is* better than 6 (a lot), and second to FF5.

[Anonymous No.784740]

>>784730

Well more gameplay than FF XIII, anyway. Still, it was the FF XIII prototype, linear and cutscenes fucking everywhere. Any semblence of player choice was gone when X came around.

[Anonymous No.784759]

>>784740

Why do people make a big deal about player choice in JRPGs when most of the titles are linear as all-get-out anyway?

[Anonymous No.784769]

>>784759

Because some player input is a nice thing. It doesn't have to be a WRPG, but still, some is nice. Deciding on whether or not Shadow lives or dies, forming your own team, settling the score with Magus or not. It just brings a little extra something, it lets you know that you're still playing a game.

[Anonymous No.784772]

>>784740
>player choice

>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>NO
>DO U WANT TO JOIN THE REBELS
>YES
>OK TIME TO ADVANCE THE PLOT

[Anonymous No.784771]

>>784759
Because you spend more time watching a game than, well, playing it. When one wants to play a game, he doesn't want to watch a movie. And then play for 5 minutes. And then watch another movie.

[Anonymous No.784775]

>>784769

But you do get player input in FFX. Sphere grid, party combinations, etc. The game isn't as braindead as you people like to make it out.

[Anonymous No.784776]

>>784769

To add to this; That's the great thing about games. They can allow you some control over the story. Either a little or a lot. That's something that only video games can do (unless you count Chose Your Own Adventure books). Unfortunately, that isn't used as much as it should be. Now you play games until the next cutscene, you can't affect the story at all, or pick up secret characters anymore. Obviously I'm generalizing, that stuff still exists in some games, but it's becoming rarer and rarer.

[Anonymous No.784780]

>>784771

No, you're making a false dichotomy here. Either the game is "open" or it has too many cutscenes and no gameplay? No, that's not right at all. Especially not about FFX.

[Anonymous No.784791]

>>784776

Yes you are generalizing, and being silly at that, especially considering we're talking about JRPGs here, the genre famous for "But thou must"

Nevermind a TON of the games we used to play didn't give you a whole lot of choice in the matter.

[Anonymous No.784796]

[Anonymous No.784797]

>>784776

I'm with you there. I wish more games did it something like Blood Omen. It keeps things succinct, gives you a good amount of information in a minute what other games require 15 minute cutscenes to convey. Also, you still get to actually play (unless you press a menu button, that could have been done better) while the dialogue is going on.

[Anonymous No.784807]

I just want to go back to 1990. I could amuse people with stories about how I was from the future, an era in which people care more about story and flashy cutscenes than actual gameplay.

[Anonymous No.784883]

>None gives a shit about IX

What is wrong with you guys.

[Anonymous No.784934]

>>783029
>FFVII
>Dragonball-Z-esque emo dyed-spiky-haired boy cliche
>Berserk-esque big sword cliche
>Harem cliche
>semi-evil, tragic villain cliche
>tacked-on, irrelevant characters (Cait Sith, Yuffie, etc.)
>doomsday cliche
>evil organization cliche
>etc etc etc

[Anonymous No.784940]

>>784934
>What is a trope

[Seaweed !!lq+3fff+/ev No.784948]

>>784638
>11+ is total Gackt-shit.
What was wrong with 11?

Did you play through CoP?

[Anonymous No.784950]

>>784934

>Emo

Come on, Cloud wasn't emo in FF VII, he was emo in everything after FF VII.

[Anonymous No.784992]

FF8 is what destroyed the JRPG genre, not FF7. FF7 was a huge investment of resources and represented the peak of effort placed into a single JRPG by the industry.

FF8 was a lazy attempt to catapult another moneymaker off the backs of the successes of FF4, 6, Tactics, and 7. A lot of people came late to the party after only hearing good things about 7, seeing that 8 was out, and thinking that a FF sequel must be like a megaman sequel, in that if you just get the latest one it'll basically be what you're looking for.

FF8 taught the industry that you didn't actually have to put any effort into anything other than graphics to make a profitable JRPG.

FF7 was a GOOD game. The genre went downhill AFTER it was released. Are we going to blame a good thing for the crappy copies that came after it?

[Anonymous No.784998]

>>784934
>Cloud made it a cliche to begin with, also he wasn't emo in that game
>What harem?
>durr hurr i want my villains 1D
>what are secret characters
>implying evil businessmen were a cliche for video games made in the 90s

[Anonymous No.785001]

>>784992
>FF8 is what destroyed the JRPG genre

The JRPG genre was never destroyed and if it ever did die (it didn't), FF8 had nothing to do with it.

[Anonymous No.785003]

>>784883

IX was just Square feeling guilty about ruining the franchise with VIII but not knowing what exactly to do about it, thus tripping over their own feet and landing directly on their dick.

[Anonymous No.785009]

>>784998

Let it alone, he's just one of those people who hate FF VII because it's popular, not one of the (apparently rare) people who hate it because they've actually played it and it wasn't their style.

[Anonymous No.785018]

>>785003

Fun Fact: FF IX was originally Final Fantasy Gaiden. It was only sometime after development began that they decided to make it a main title, which is why the story changes into the melodramatic bullshit that it does later on in the game. That's also why it was generally a good game, it wasn't meant to be a main entry, it was just a throwback for old fans.

[Anonymous No.785036]

>>785018

The whole idea of the throwback, which was VERY heavily advertised at the time and is still used to apologize for its mediocrity-at-best, has always been an obvious code for "oh shit, FF8 was really shitty and our fanbase is divided over it, I wonder what we did wrong - no wait, I don't wonder, they probably just wanted old fantasy, so we'll do that to make it up to them."

There was just no thought put into why FF8 split the fanbase as hard as it did, and Square never really recovered or figured out what they did wrong. They clearly didn't learn from FF13, either. The money will run out before they learn the lesson.

[Anonymous No.785043]

FF7 did bring about a lot of negative influences for the JRPG genre but I don't think it's fair to call it a bad game because of that. The true fault lies behind the developers that misunderstand what made the game good and just tried cheap attempts at copying it.

I don't think it's the best thing the JRPG genre has to offer, hell not even close, but I don't think it's a bad game. Materia system is pretty fun to mess around with (you really have to use GameFAQS or something to know how to break it), story tried to be more unique by making the conflict less black and white, dungeon crawling was fun, a lot of fun minigames and sidequests, and you had some amount of control over your player character when it comes to relationships and how he acted towards others. The interactivity is no where near the level of a WRPG but it's those neat little things that make you feel like you're more involved in the game. That is what made the game fun to me, not the flashy animations, bishonen-inspired character designs, the FMVs, or the character drama (Which wasn't really bad in the game).

[Anonymous No.785049]

>>785036

>The money will run out before they learn the lesson.

I'll be somewhat surprised if they make it to 2016, especially if FF XIV bombs again.

[Anonymous No.785052]

>>785001

It looks pretty dead to me. What is there to speak of? A tiny cult of SMT games, the flagship series of the most infamous JRPG developer reduced to hallways populated by Meg Ryan clones that nobody even tries to seriously critique anymore? The occasional Fatlus title that nobody knows about?

Where are the JRPG hits to be found? If "dead" is too exaggerated for you, how about "in sharp decline since '97"? Outside the golden age, things have been damned near silent outside the occasional spasm for JRPGs on the whole.

[Anonymous No.785054]

>>785043

>The true fault lies behind the developers that misunderstand what made the game good and just tried cheap attempts at copying it.

This. It's similar to how the entire comics industry missed what made Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns good, and just started making grimdark titles.

[Anonymous No.785058]

>playing any Final Fantasy after 6

I'm not saying six was perfect, there was a lot of superficiality in its development, but FF7 took that style-over-substance bullshit too far and honestly if you consider FF7 a classic you should probably just kill yourself, thanx

[Anonymous No.785068]

>>785058

What if I consider VI AND VII classics?

[Anonymous No.785071]

>>785052
Pokemon is still popular.

[Anonymous No.785075]

>>785071

And I don't even know why, Nintendo has mashed B every time the series has tried to evolve.

[Anonymous No.785076]

>>785068
You got one wrong, bub

[Anonymous No.785082]

>>785054
>This. It's similar to how the entire comics industry missed what made Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns good, and just started making grimdark titles.

Except Watchmen and DKR were actually great and FF7 is mediocre.

[Anonymous No.785079]

>>785058

FF7 marked the twilight of the golden age of JRPGs. I wouldn't exclude it from that age on account of it being involved in the console jump and move to 3D.

[Anonymous No.785081]

>>785052

You don't actually play JRPGs do you? Just because FF has gone to shit doesn't mean the entire genre has.

[Anonymous No.785084]

>>785058

>Style over substance

In VII? Yeah it certainly tried to be stylish but I thought it had a decent amount of substance to it. Not as much as V or VI, but it wasn't bereft of it.

[Anonymous No.785087]

>>785082

I'd call VII good, but not great, myself. But yeah, basically you got it, but that wasn't the point.

[Anonymous No.785095]

Who else just drops the FF from the 7 since they can't stand the rest of the FF fanbase after years of them all collectively shit posting about how their game is better than 7 even though the majority of them have never actually played it?

Heck I don't even like to think of 7 as a JRPG anymore since every JRPG fan also defines his love of one game by how much he hates 7 even though he likely never played it,

[Anonymous No.785093]

So guys, how much longer until VII is old enough that it becomes okay to like it again?

[Anonymous No.785094]

>>785081

I'm stuck in the land of Carpe Fulgur for now. The rest of the JRPG landscape is looking pretty barren to me.

[Anonymous No.785097]

>>785009
I've played the whole damn game from start to finish, bro, including beating the damn weapons.

[Anonymous No.785101]

>>785093
The retrodrones will never accept FF7 as a true Final Fantasy. They're far too edgy and hardcore for that.

[Anonymous No.785102]

>>785094

Try Tales, Destiny: Director's Cut especially if you can read Nihongo or don't mind translation guides. Xenoblade is fun too if you don't do the sidequests.

[Anonymous No.785104]

>>785093
It already is. Go to /v/, the FF7 fanbase has a larger presence there I believe.

[Anonymous No.785106]

>>785102

>Tales, Destiny: Director's Cut

What the fuck did my fingers do? I meant Tales of Destiny: Director's Cut.

[Anonymous No.785109]

>>785058
>playing any Final Fantasy, period
They've been style-over-substance since the very beginning. Possibly the only good idea to come from the series were jobs, and even they were only half-realized.

[Anonymous No.785110]

>>785095
Yeah, I don't think FF7 is a JRPG either, nor a game. It's just a story, fag

[Anonymous No.785113]

>>785104

Depends on the day.

[Anonymous No.785116]

>>785109
>They've been style-over-substance since the very beginning.

Play FF1, FF3, FF5 and then get back to me

[Anonymous No.785118]

>>785093
Honestly /v/ had some of the best FF7 threads. Otherwise the FF7 LP thread by Elentor on Something Awful is a great place to post about the game. I also like the lifestream.net but just like /v/ and SA you still have to put up with other jrpg fans coming about how they prefer game x over FF7 because of reasons.

[Anonymous No.785119]

>>785109

>They've been style-over-substance since the
very beginning.

Wat. Back then JRPGs were "Kill the Dragon, save the Princess." FF I had a hell of a lot more to it than that. The job system was pretty cool for a console RPG at the time and the game was pure exploration.

[Anonymous No.785120]

I think the popularity of the JRPG genre has declined but I think that's because the whole thing has kind of run it's course. FF7 made JRPGs way, way, way more popular and that popularity wasn't going to hold forever. As a retro-relevant comparison, consider platformers. Mario made them incredibly popular, and they flooded the market in the 80s and 90s, but they started to lose their popularity once RPGs got popular. Sure, we still have popular stuff like Mario and Sonic, but they don't flood the market like RPGs used to. And yet, we still have a decent variety of platformers today, and in the future, we'll still have a decent selection of JRPGs.

[Anonymous No.785126]

>>785118

I've never understood what people like about X. Yeah I played it when it came out but even then I wasn't thrilled with it. I'm guessing most of the people who fawn over it played it before any other FF.

[Anonymous No.785123]

>>785058
This. Too many ppl are treating FF7 as if it's the Holy Grail of jrpgs.

[Anonymous No.785128]

>>785102

I liked Tales of Phantasia back when you had party members who tried to whore themselves off to buy passage on a ship. I remember more recent entries in the series as being vomit-inducing and involving coffee that may or may not be hot.

[Anonymous No.785135]

>>785128

Phantasia was great. I like recent entries too, though.

[Anonymous No.785138]

I don't like this game so i can't understand why someone can like this game: the daily thread

[Anonymous No.785140]

Dragon Quest killed JRPGs.

[Anonymous No.785149]

>>785126
>I've never understood what people like about X. Yeah I played it when it came out but even then I wasn't thrilled with it. I'm guessing most of the people who fawn over it played it before any other FF.

Projecting, much?

[Anonymous No.785150]

>>785128
Tales of Phantasia was a good game, but then they ruined it at the end with a Sephiroth-esque protagonist.

>dhaos-kun: hurr i just want to save my people
>mana tree sama: lol, you've sinned, but i'm going to give you some mana now to save your people.

[Anonymous No.785156]

>>785109
>the only good idea to come from the series were jobs

>implying they didn't just steal that idea from DQ3 just to make it more shallow and less customizable

[Anonymous No.785159]

>>785149

Yes, I am projecting my thoughts onto an image board, wondering if some old fans can tell me what it is about FF X that makes people love it so much.

[Anonymous No.785163]

>>785138

I'll never get tired of reading people shit on games they hate, but only in detail. It's hard to enjoy someone just saying "meh it's just mediocre" as opposed to a full-on Spoony retrospective.

I'm perfectly happy to hear that you hate something I love, but not if you're going to be vague about it - there's no way I could understand hating something and not being able to go into excruciating detail to explain exactly why. It makes me suspicious that one is just being a hipster hating on something due to its popularity. We're talking about hate here. Hate is not the sort of thing that just waves a dismissive hand in the general direction of its object.

[Anonymous No.785169]

>>785156

>Stole it from DQ3
>DQ3 came out a year after FF I

[Anonymous No.785175]

>>785116
FF1's main virtue over games from its era were the charming graphics. The actual gameplay is trash. Imbalanced, bugs, combat is primitive and devolves into turn 1-2 victory/losses. Mage ambushes were also cheap instant deaths.
FF3 was a little bit better, but it was still too random with the encounters, especially in the later areas. Unless you get lucky you get assraped, and no amount of grind or "skill" will alleviate that.
FF5 was the best realized one but even then, the jobs had little influence on each other besides carrying over a single skill, only exception being the freelancer class.

>>785119
Back then, JRPGs were Dragon Quest. But westerners already had Ultima 4.
>FF1
>exploration
Did the game even have any side dungeons besides the Bahamut one?

>>785156
>implying that DQ3 didn't steal it from Wizardry

>>785169
>FF1
>jobs
Full retard

[Anonymous No.785180]

>>785163

>there's no way I could understand hating something and not being able to go into excruciating detail to explain exactly why.

I'm the same way. I wasn't annoyed at a friend because he hated Deus Ex, I was annoyed because he couldn't give me a single reason as to why it was bad (later on he told me that it offered too much freedom and he hated that augmentations weren't passive).

[Anonymous No.785182]

>>785169
FF1 stole it from Wizardry and they admit it.

[Anonymous No.785185]

>>785175

>Back then, JRPGs were Dragon Quest. But westerners already had Ultima 4.

Yes, but Ultima 4 was a PC game, which is why I specified that FF I was pretty cool for a Console RPG at the time.

>Did the game even have any side dungeons besides the Bahamut one?

The Castle of Ordeals? No. However, that doesn't detract from the game being about exploring dungeons.

[Anonymous No.785189]

>>785175

So are you telling me that Fighter, Thief, Black Belt, White Mage, Black Mage, Red Mage, and their upgrades aren't jobs?

[Anonymous No.785190]

>>785185
>FF I was pretty cool for a Console RPG at the time.
>for a Console RPG
I know this probably wasn't your intention, but can we leave that shit on /v/? You know what I mean

[Anonymous No.785194]

>>785159
Someone whose favorite FFs are I, X, VIII and Tactics here.
Soundtrack and locations are 10/10 tier, i truly loved the story, and every single main character was colorful and had a fully fleshed-out backstory and personality, which is more than you can say about... like 95% of JRPGs. Battles were fun as hell too, and surprisingly deep for what was basically a rock-paper-scissors affair. Feel free to disagree, those are just opinions.

[Anonymous No.785197]

>>785182
Source?

[Anonymous No.785198]

>>785185
Ultima 4 came out on many platforms, NES included...
>However, that doesn't detract from the game being about exploring dungeons.
But just about the only thing you explore in the game are side paths in dungeons which contain chests... which is basically like in every RPG ever I guess.

>>785189
Those are RPG classes, not "jobs". The "job system" was that free interchangeable shit that they used in FF3 and 5.

[Anonymous No.785201]

>>785190

No, actually, I have no idea what you mean. I wasn't trying to be "PC Master Race" if that's what you thought.

[Anonymous No.785204]

>>785197
Not him and I don't have source, but it's a no-brainer. Wizardry was super popular among Japs back then and they even took the faux-Vancian magic system in FF1 from it.

[Anonymous No.785206]

>>785194

I did enjoy the battle system, it and the Sphere Grid. The only character I really liked through was Auron. I'm not sure what it was about the world that I didn't like, but I wasn't fond of it either. Still, it certainly looked good.

[Anonymous No.785212]

>>785198

When it comes to FF, jobs and classes are two terms for the same thing. It may not have been called the job system back then but it is now, since it's a basic version of it.

[Anonymous No.785217]

>>785206
I can kind of understand. Tidus was pretty whiny for the first half, Wakka had a silly accent and Lulu was mostly forgettable.
I liked how 'natural' the world was, though. Save for Luca and Bevelle, the world was one big, untamed, hostile, magical place, and i loved it. Same reason i loved the ambience of Gran Pulse too.

[Anonymous No.785219]

>>785212
>It may not have been called the job system back then but it is now, since it's a basic version of it.
How? It doesn't function like FF3/5 at all. Do you call any RPG's system where you can pick your own characters the "job system"?

[Anonymous No.785227]

>>785219

>Do you call any RPG's system where you can pick your own characters the "job system"?

If that's what they're called, yeah. I wasn't the one who named the system in FF I "job system" that's what Square and/or the fanbase came up with, take it up with them if it gets your panties so knotted up.

[Anonymous No.785228]

>>785219

You are barking very hard up this tree of not calling the FF1 job classes what they are just because you can't switch them in-game, and it's not going to work out for you. A primitive system without all the features it would have in later iterations isn't disqualified on account of its early status and lack of your favorite particular features.

[Anonymous No.785231]

>>785217

I actually ended up rather liking Wakka due to a a decent kind of character growth. It's too bad most can't get passed the accent and B-B-BUT HE'S RELIGIOUS!

Lulu, eh I remember her mainly cause she was kinda like a goth chick, which I don't recall a lot of in FF. Other than that though, yeah she was kind of the bland big-tittied fanservice girl like Tifa, though she did nothing to annoy me.

[Anonymous No.785232]

I was hoping /vr/ would be more like /v/ in regards to FF7. Instead we just get the same shit posting faggots that permeate the rest of the internet. Fantastic.

[Anonymous No.785236]

>>785219

>Do you call the Model-T a car even though it lacks an air conditioner, radio, and GPS?

[Anonymous No.785240]

>>785231
I like Wakka, to be honest. I don't mind his accent, and he's pretty... i dunno, spirited.

[Anonymous No.785242]

>>785232

/vr/ seemed to be mostly cool with it in the week or two after its creation, but then it got invaded by elitists.

[Anonymous No.785243]

>>785227
I've never heard of Square referring to FF1's shit as "job system" ever. What the fans think is irrelevant, it's not like 90% of them even know what Wizardry is or how classes and class changes in D&D work.
>>785228
But the free switch ability is what defines the system you numbnuts. It's like class changing except it's rather flexible and there's no penalty for it (except for requiring some "capacity" points in FF3 which were easy to get)
>>785236
I certainly hope you can explain how you came up with this analogy to me.

[Anonymous No.785246]

>>785232
You mean like how much of /v/ now fawns over 7 and how it's pretty much the best (especially compared to that OH SO AWFUL FF6) in just about way?

[Anonymous No.785250]

>>785243

The Model-T is barely related to modern cars. It was basically the prototype, lacking many features. The job system in FF I lacked features of the later job system, it was a prototype.

[Anonymous No.785253]

>>785243

A job system where you can't switch jobs on the fly is still a job system, just not the kind you happen to like the most.

It's not like FF1 is hard to criticize without this point. You don't have to live and die with it in your clutches.

[Anonymous No.785259]

>nostalgia goggles
>FF7
>somehow doesn't apply to FF6

[Anonymous No.785258]

>>785243

I'm not sure if Square has ever called the system in FF I "job system", but they did call the system in FF XII: International Zodiac Job System... Job system, and it's pretty much exactly the same as the system in FF I. You pick a job, you're stuck with it.

[Anonymous No.785262]

>>785243

>I've never heard of Square referring to FF1's shit as "job system" ever.

[Anonymous No.785264]

>>785259

Are you kidding? I see people shout "Nostalgia goggles!" all the time in regards to FF VI.

[Anonymous No.785267]

>>785259
>somehow doesn't apply to FF5
>somehow doesn't apply to FF4
>somehow doesn't apply to FF1
>somehow doesn't apply to any RPG that came out before FF7

[Anonymous No.785269]

>>785242
The worst thing is that I recognize every single argument made by these elitists from years back. I knew one FF6 fan who literally made it his fucking life mission to just bad mouth FF7 any chance he could whilst pandering to whatever crowd happened to be listening to him. I knew him across multiple fucking websites where he pulled this shit. I wouldn't be surprised if he was shit posting even today.

[Anonymous No.785270]

>>785003
They should do that more often

[Anonymous No.785273]

>>783364
>emulators capable of playing FFVII in 1997
>good job brain, you really got them thinking now

[Anonymous No.785274]

>>785269

Yeah I don't know why people can't just chill out. I hate FF II and XIII, but I don't attempt to proselytize over them.

[Anonymous No.785275]

>>785259
>>nostalgia goggles
>>FF7
>>somehow doesn't apply to FF6

i ve done a lot of thinking and FF6 is a legitimately great game

[Anonymous No.785276]

>>785250
And the class system in Wizardry 1 (predating FF1 by six years) had the same options as FF1 and also allowed for class changing. Does it also have "retroactively" a job system? Does Icewind Dale have a job system? Does Ultima 4 have a job system?

>>785253
I'm not doing this because of FF1 hate, I'm doing this because you keep pushing your dumb implication without even realizing what it encompasses.

>>785262
Does it refer to FF1?
Also
>japan exclusive
You do realize that their CRPG terminology is completely screwed there.

[Anonymous No.785280]

>>785264
Yeah but FF7 is the game that gets almost daily threads calling it nothing but nostalgia. Even though FF6 is even older. People like the OP say the series declined with FF7 but doesn't realize that its pretty hypocritical to pull the nostalgia card.

[Anonymous No.785281]

>>785246
I never see anyone call 6 shit in regards to 7. Why does it have to be one way or the other with you guys?

[Anonymous No.785283]

>>785276

>Does it refer to FF1?

Nope but the system is literally exactly the same. You are presented with some jobs, you pick one for a character, and you can never ever change it. The ONLY difference is that you choose jobs after getting the characters instead of right after you press "New Game".

>It doesn't count because the Japanese don't know how to talk.

Right, we're done here.

[Anonymous No.785289]

I'm playing FFVII right now. What's wrong with it?

[Anonymous No.785290]

>>785283
So Square is allowed to rewrite the entire CRPG historical terminology now with a japan exclusive title?

[Anonymous No.785285]

>>785232
>you guys disagree with me, therefore you're shitposting faggots

That's hilarious, man.

[Anonymous No.785286]

>>785276

>You do realize that their CRPG terminology is completely screwed there.

>Presented with proof that Square-Enix refers to that particular system as job system

>That doesn't count, guys.

[Anonymous No.785294]

>>785289
Find it yourself. You're already playing it, what other people have to say is meaningless in this situation.

[Anonymous No.785296]

>>785281
Then you haven't been around much this year. There was one point (don't know if it's still going on, I mostly stick to /vr/ now) where /v/ would have constant FF7 threads praising it, to a point that a thread about any other FF save 13 hate threads.

The 6 thing comes from the fact that there is just a strong rivalry between the two. It makes sense as one came out after the other and they have quite a few notable similarities.

[Anonymous No.785297]

>>785286
If Infinity Ward refers to the new CoD as a realtime strategy game (because you have to, like, think up a strategy in real time, dude), does it make it or any other CoD that plays like it realtime strategy games? No. Videogame terms do have a certain historical connotation that's already set in stone.

[Anonymous No.785302]

>>785290

They're allowed to call the system used in their game whatever the hell they want.

[Anonymous No.785306]

>>785294

But I've been playing for 12 hours now and I haven't noticed anything wrong. I'm just wondering if there's something I'm not seeing.

[Anonymous No.785305]

7 was great for it's time. It does have some glaring flaws, particularly with the way it told it's story, but having revisited it a few years ago I'm still willing to stand by it. And it's not 7's fault that each game afterwards became increasingly linear. I won't claim 8 was all that great, but really the slide didn't begin until FFX.

[Anonymous No.785312]

>>785302
Then allow me to get back to the original point that was, DQ3 and FF1 both took their, ahem, "job system" from Wizardry and in FF1 it was pretty dumb and they only did something interesting with it in FF3 and 5, as I was referring to in this post >>785109
Fucking autist.

[Anonymous No.785314]

>>785289

Characters are only as customizable as their materia loadouts. Limit breaks are the biggest differences they have from each other. Speaking of limit breaks, just by a bunch of Hypers as soon as the first item shop offers them to you, and keep your party in a perpetual state of Fury for limit break spam.

There's tons of materia but the only ones that really matter are restorative ones and the enemy skill materia with its fullscreen damage spells (chiefly matra magic, beta, aqualung, and trine) and big barrier. Everything else is kind of wasteful and pointless.

The really awesome materia and equipment - the only ones that are interesting - come right up at the end of the game where you get to use them the least.

Raising and racing chocobos is a huge pain in the ass without a guide, and any decent guide will just tell you the in-game cheat for having infinite stamina so none of the shit you do with your birds really matters anyway.

If you want to romance fictional women, your time would be better spent on a Visual Novel. Your waifu dies in this game no matter what you do anyway.

[Anonymous No.785315]

>>785296
What's the problem with that? A good few years back it was IX. Chill out. Shhh.

Nobody cares.

[Anonymous No.785316]

>>785306
It's not so much what's wrong with it as it is what's not the best about it usually. That's where most of the FF7 hate came from. Years of hate has caused something of a 180 though, which has made something of a turning cycle.

[Anonymous No.785321]

>>785315
Well by that logic, what's the problem with FF7 being mostly hated?

A game being hailed as the worst and hailed as the best are two parallels that bring similar outcries.

[Anonymous No.785323]

I thought I was in /v/ until I went to /vr/ and saw this thread again.

[Anonymous No.785329]

>>785323
Then how about you don't go into a thread about what's generally regarded as one of the most undeservedly overrated games ever created.

[Anonymous No.785330]

>>785329
3/10 b8 m8

[Anonymous No.785335]

>>785321
>you aren't allowed to like what I hate

[Anonymous No.785331]

>>785312

>Autist

If anything, you should call me fastidious. Using buzzwords that don't mean what you think they mean just makes you look retarded.

[Anonymous No.785332]

>>785296
>Then you haven't been around much this year. There was one point (don't know if it's still going on, I mostly stick to /vr/ now) where /v/ would have constant FF7 threads praising it, to a point that a thread about any other FF save 13 hate threads.
Oh I loved that period. Finally I could have a proper FF7 discussion without the rest of the FF and JRPG fandom bogging it down with their bullshit.

You know we actually talked about the disc 2 spoiler and what it meant in regards to Sephiroth and Jenova? I've never had a discussion about that part of the game prior to that period simply cause most FF7 fans don't remember FF7 for shit or were too young to understand any of what was going on. I had to wait 16 fucking years just to talk about how awesome Cloud was for throwing Sephiroth into that pit. I eagerly anticipated the FF7 thread on SA reaching that point just so I could sperg about how much I loved the way the main theme kicked in right as Cloud took off his Shinra Helmet. The devs had a fantastic understanding of animation and sound when they made the game and it really shows in that part of the game.

[Anonymous No.785340]

>>785314

>Everything else is kind of wasteful and pointless.

All Materia is great for making money.

[Anonymous No.785338]

>>785314

I must be the only person who never spams Limit breaks in FF VII or VIII.

[Anonymous No.785341]

>>785335
>you must love the game I love above all others

[Anonymous No.785345]

>>785331
Nice avoiding the point brah.
Also read >>785297, which also refers to IZJS

[Anonymous No.785349]

>>785332
That sequence was the high point of the game. The whole back story (the real version) was redone for the anime short Final Fantasy 7 Last Order, the only thing worthwhile to come out of the FF7 spinoff craze.

[Anonymous No.785358]

>>785341
Good thing I don't play favorites to show off to my gaming friends.

[Anonymous No.785362]

>>785332
I'm going to search the SA archives for that LP so I can find your dorky gushing on that scene.

[Anonymous No.785371]

>>785332
yeah the music was great for that scene. also when Sephiroth was thrown over the side the music turned all dramatic at just the right time

[Anonymous No.785375]

>>785349
I hated that scene simply because of the shit with Cloud's eyes glowing and Sephiroth killing himself because of that.

It really showed just how little they understood of why Cloud was awesome. Finding out he was just another stormtrooper who somehow took down the strongest super soldier in the world was a fantastic backstory. The fact that they felt the need to imply that Cloud was abnormal really pisses me off. I could count Last Order as the worst part of the FF7 spinoff craze just because it attempted to mess with the best scene in all FF7 - if the rest of the spinoffs weren't even worse.

[Anonymous No.785378]

>>785358
Too bad your are either missing or ignoring the point that the answer isn't to flood the board with love threads and outcast any other game from being discussed.

[Anonymous No.785401]

>>783029
>nostalgia goggles
>the only excuse they come up with
top lel
>More trolling by OP
Delete this thread and try again with less trolling please.

[Anonymous No.785404]

>>785375
I was under the assumption that Cloud flunked out of the SOLDIER program because he received a mako infusion and couldn't handle it, which would explain his glowing eyes (and why he was able to flip Sephiroth in the first place).

[Anonymous No.785408]

>That feel when I can't create a "Which do you prefer, FF VI or FF VII?" thread without it turning into a shitflinging fest.

Man, I just want to have a civil discussion, I'm not asking "Which one is objectively better".

[Anonymous No.785409]

>>785404
He didn't recieve mako infusions until after Sephiroth burnt down Nibelheim when he was getting injected with Jenova cells for the reunion project.

[Anonymous No.785417]

People forget that 7 was the first time where Square was free from Nintendo's heavy-handed censorship at the time. For all the shit it gets, it was the first time Square had full creative freedom, and it shows just about everywhere in the game from the whole Midgar setting to the dialogue.

[Anonymous No.785438]

>>785409
Yep, which pretty much formed the basis for the events of FF7, I get that. It's not really explained if he got close enough to the SOLDIER program to receive the infusions (as all SOLDIERs members did definitively receive such infusions) prior to the experiments, so that's admittedly speculation on my part.

The scene's awesome regardless.

[Anonymous No.785467]

>>785438
That could be possible. It really isn't explained. And later Cloud does have that reaction to the lifestream which could point to that being a definite possibility.

It wouldn't be that farfetched either what with some of the other subtle hints the whole Nibelheim scene dulls out. Are you familiar with the whole theory about Sephiroth being an insomniac or that the reason Cloud was late to the meeting prior to going up the mountain was because he was sleeping in his own home (instead of the inn) which explains when the conversation with Cloud and his mother took place?

[Anonymous No.785485]

>>785467
Nope, not familiar with those. There are enough fuzzy plot points that I'm not surprised by all the theories though.

[Anonymous No.785528]

>>785262

while square's call may be the official call, if it's a class you pick and class changes are heavily restricted, it's just a class system.

it's the ease of flipping between jobs which defines the job system we're familiar with from ff3, ff5, ffT, tactics ogre, etc. when square called a class system a job system, they were just wrong.

[Anonymous No.785593]

>>785485
>was having dinner
Sephiroth basically tells Cloud that he shouldn't worry about him when he brings up the matter of there not being enough beds and he reminds the troops to go to bed early whilst he himself says he will be staying up late. Later on we get the whole library scene where the light never goes out and he reads lab report for a whole week. From his tone it actually sounds like Sephiroth forgot that normal people don't sleep when he reminds them all to go to bed early. This is further reinforced by the whole deal at the town entrance where he asks Cloud what it is like being back to his town after a long while. It feels very forced on his part and generally he just seems completely inhuman and cold throughout. Sephiroth talks to Cloud like he isn't a member of SOLDIER that he has known for a while but some random grunt who he would rather not even know. This is all kind of easy to explain in other ways but it is fun to think about.

The whole deal with Cloud and his mom during the flashback is from Cloud editing the conversation to remove any reference to the fact that he might not have been in SOLDIER. If you pay attention to the dialogue it sounds like his mom is trying to tell him to stay away from Tifa and that its ok that he failed to make it into SOLDIER and that she will always love him regardless. This explains why Cloud was late to the meeting with Tifa's father and Sephiroth in the morning in that rather than staying at the inn instead he stayed overnight at his mom's house. This one I think of as pretty much canon.

[Anonymous No.785654]

Can we make this thread a "retarded Shinra executives thread"? Those are the best.


>Sir, the building holding up the city is nearly finished
>Great, now add a built-in time bomb. And make sure you can't disarm it.
>Wh..why sir?
>Just a safety precaution for terrorists.
>I don't understand sir.
>I don't pay you to understand I pay you to fucking put bombs in buildings

[Anonymous No.785736]

>>785438
>>785467
There's a big explanation over at GameFaqs about it. I believe Cloud was injected with mako by Hojo when he was being experimented on.

[Anonymous No.788254]

This thread are gay.

[Anonymous No.788270]

>>788254
Arith is a slut anyway might as well breed her with a dog

[Anonymous No.788392]

The only thing I dislike about this game is Sephiroth. I don't get why he wants to become a God, what he'll do after it, why he sticks so much with Jenova, etc.

[Anonymous No.788459]

>>788392
Have you replayed the game since becoming an adult? Serious question. Take a look at some of the story FAQs.

Long story short, Jenova was an alien parasite that crashed into the planet centuries ago and was defeated by a magic-using civilization known as the Centra (the "Ancients"), who later died out as regular humans usurped them. Shinra scientists later discover the creature and, getting the legends mixed up, thinking its a Centra. The scientist Hojo injects the creature's cells into his own son's fetus as part of a twisted experiment.

Sephiroth eventually discovers some of the details of his birth, jumps to a lot of mistaken conclusions, and goes crazy, winds up in the lifestream and floats to Jenova's crash site (northern crater), during which time Jenova's consciousness fuses with/dominates his own, since Jenova is basically able to dominate creatures by infecting them with her cells, and the scientists did that for her. Being a malleable blob of cells, she can also change her own form or even just parts of it, which Sephiroth/Jenova uses to great effect.

Understanding this rather poorly explained series of plot points is essential to understanding the rest of the game.

[Anonymous No.788490]

>>788459
Jenova has no will of her own. She was brain dead the entire game. Sephiroth is just using her body to get things done.

[Anonymous No.788506]

>>788490
None of the information I can find suggests that.

[Anonymous No.788520]

Game was good.
9 was better.

/opinions

[Anonymous No.788623]

>jRPGs will never be about cute girls ever again

Feels bad

[Anonymous No.788628]

>>788506
What sources are you looking at? This is the actual truth regardless of how hard Jenova's eye ball tits get you.

[Anonymous No.788665]

>>788628
Sephiroth's Final Fantasy wiki article. The term "remains" does get thrown around a lot.

If Jenova is in fact dead, then it's cells would be functionless by definition. Unless you're defining "dead" some other way.

[Anonymous No.788674]

I havn't read the thread, but we all agreed that OP is a big faggot rite?

So

How bout that FF4, man, I love the game 5ever

[Anonymous No.789016]

>>788674
OP is just trolling like every other ff7 thread ever made. Nothing new at all. Ignore him.

[Anonymous No.789049]

**** First of all, I'm spanish, my English is a bit rusty, I beg your pardon ****

FF I
Meh game, but it was pretty cool at the time.

FF II
Cool, yeah.

FF III
I didn't play it, and I know I should as I love the job system.

FF IV
Meh.

FF V
The job system is lovable, and the OST was bloody amazing, but characters had such a "yeah, I don't care about nothing, I will just join the party and start beating asses" feeling. I mean, really, they seem like children looking for adventures to me.

FF VI
Piece of art.

FF VII
FF VII is a rushed game, and it has obvious flaws. The Materia system was cool, though is was really imbalanced. All the sidequests and secrets made this game really cool, but it is unfinished, and that's a shame because I think it could have been the shit. The OST is great btw.
It's a cool game, but... yeah... it could have been really better.

FF VIII
I hated the "draw" mechanic, and I hated all the combat system because of that. Squall is just idiot. Beside of those two things, the game is great.

FF IX
Pretty cool.

FF X
Pretty cool, yeah.

The rest of the "main" saga
All of them suck

Tactics saga
Pretty cool.

[Anonymous No.789086]

>>789049
There's no point in listing all the games like this if you don't have anything interesting to say about them.

[Anonymous No.789567]

as a kid i played with my friend FFVIII without any knowledge about english and at that time it was great (we were stuck just before exam where you fight with demon). Later on when i managed to find old discs and brush off the dust, I made my way to the 3rd disc and stopped, becouse game was so fucking dumb (dumb zell and emo squall). Later on tried FFVII, it had flaws and some stupid things (like dressing as a woman) but it was fun, even after so many years. After a year or something played FFX, oh brother. Most fucked up story i ever saw. Yea fighting was fun and everything but if squall is emo-gay, then tidus is fucking over 9000 in gay-o-bitch-meter. This story makes no sense, I make better stories when I'm shiting and I am not even trying.

Okay I am calm now.

[Zangief !!YG0uo46UrxQ No.789575]

>>789086

There's no point in replying to his post if you don't have anything interesting to say about it

[Anonymous No.789579]

FF9 was the best game in the series and that came out years after FF7, so I don't know what you're talking about with this supposed "decline".

[Anonymous No.789601]

Every other day, every other damn day, we get: "FFVII IS SOOO OVERRATED U DAMN DIRTY PLEBS TAKE OFF DA NOSTALGIA GOGGLES MUH FFVI MAUH FFVI!!" I'm tired of this crap. If Final Fantasy VII has the most rabid fanbase, then I guess it also has the most butthurt detractors. Can't we just skedaddle and move on? Do we have to have a thread about it every other fucking day? Do you know how annoying you people are?

[Anonymous No.789626]

>>789575
There's no point in replying to his post if you have nothing interesting to say either.

...oh sh! Yeah... I got nothing interesting to say. (._.)

[Anonymous No.789839]

>>788665
The definition of "dead" in most modern countries essentially is "has a dead brain". No matter whether the rest of the body is functional or not.

[Anonymous No.789860]

>>789601
It's sad that even on a board normally as chill as /vr/, 3/4 of all Final Fantasy threads are dedicated to trashing one of the games the OP dislikes, instead of people talking about the ones they do like. I mean seriously, guys, anyone that cares enough about retro vidya has already heard every single argument pro- and con- any given game in the main series. Do you really think threads like this are going to change peoples' minds? Same for Chrono Trigger and Earthbound, for that matter.

[Anonymous No.789960]

This is one of Final Fantasy I've never finished to this day. I ALWAYS ALWAYS get to the crater and quit. I have it downloaded to emulate and it's even worse: I lose interest after getting out of Midgar, or after Juno.

I don't see as it as the begin of Square's medicority as I thought FF8 was fun despite the horribly easy to abuse junction system, and FF9 is my all time favorite FF. FF7 may of started a trend, but it was because 7 was the game that blew Square up, made them tons of money, and let's not even talk about the merger with Enix. After the PSX era, we got FFX, FFX-2, and FF12 for the PS2.... FFX is basically a movie with random battles inbetween, FFX-2 is silly but fun, and while I enjoyed FF12's story to an extent, absolutely hated the battle/gambit system.

We won't talk of the monstrosity of them trying to get into the online market. Essentially FF7 gave Square a product idea that "worked" and they rolled with it. The need to innovate and be creative was no longer necessary, and although they returned to their roots with FF9, that game was released after PS2 was already out. I know a lot of people like it here on /vr/, but general opinion of FF9 seems "meh" at best, if they even remember it, while they do remember 7 and 8.

[Anonymous No.789981]

>>789839
No, that's a "vegetative state" not "dead" no modern country on Earth would call something with a pulse and respiration dead.

[Anonymous No.790017]

>>783029
>FF7
>This game truly marks the beginning of the Final Fantasy series's decline into mediocrity
>it might even mark the eventual decline of all JRPGs

Go back to 5 years ago when Square was spewing out that "Compilation of FFVII" campaign by releasing Advent Children and Dirge of Cerberus.

Because that's also when people might've held your unique, edgy, contrarian opinion in some regard.

[Anonymous No.790084]

>>789860
>>790017
So it's not ok to provide constructive criticism of the most popular Final Fantasy game on an anonymous message board on the Internet? No, it's the place to do it. Many other posted insightful arguments or compliance. You are the ones that are needlessly complaining.

[Anonymous No.790118]

>>790084
>So it's not ok to provide constructive criticism

There is no constructive criticism in the OP, shitpickle. All the OP says is "This game sucked and it badly influenced things". That doesn't say anything about the game itself. OP is posting some obvious bait, and you come in and try to hide it behind "constructive criticism" when you know damn well there's not a single sentence in the OP that constructively criticizes anything. This is low tier trolling. 0/10, I am not impressed.

[Anonymous No.790136]

>>789960

>I lose interest after getting out of Midgar, or after Juno.

I know how you feel. I love FF VII, it's one of my favorite. I always get so excited when I start the game again, I have hours of fun. Then I leave Midgar and there goes a lot of my excitement. Midgar is just so damn well done,

[Anonymous No.790145]

>>789960

>The need to innovate and be creative was no longer necessary,

Come on now, even if FF went downhill after VII, it still changed things up. VII was huge, they could have just made FF VII forever after that but they didn't, they took a risk and got rid of the Materia system, they got rid of rows and MP, they got rid of a lot of mainstays in FF VIII and put new things in. Junctioning, Magic being treated like items, etc. Even after they it's reception they continued to try new things in every game afterward. Sure I think Final Fantasy has been shit since FF X, but I at least respect the fact that they try to do something different in every game.

[Anonymous No.790156]

>>789960
Your experience isn't unique, and it explains the real reason why FF7 became popular back then when it was first released: novelty. The game was the first 3D RPG on PSX and also the first FF game on PSX. That's it. Nothing else. The story wasn't special. It just borrowed elements from Homeric/Shakespearean tragedies, Gaia theory, and western sci-fi, then clobbered them together into a half-assed story. The battle system wasn't special: summoning system was generic and boring, offensive magic was mostly useless, the materia was only good for stat boosts, and the limit breaks were basically the same for everyone except for the animations.

There really wasn't anything special about the game. It's not deep. It's not graphically impressive. The characters are as flat and as bland as cardboard. The people who like it are those who haven't experienced anything better (i.e., kids). That's why FF games are best enjoyed by younger people.

[Anonymous No.790159]

>>790156
But what was better that was available? Other than Chrono Trigger, at that point FF5 still hadn't come to America.

[Anonymous No.790160]

>>790156

>The story wasn't special.

You seem to forget that a lot of people played FF VII as kids or teenagers. The story of FF VII is fantastic when you're 13.

[Anonymous No.790161]

>>790159

On the PSX? I'm not sure if anything was. In general? FF VI.

[Anonymous No.790164]

>>783549

You're joking, right? Almost zero fleshing out of characters aside from Magus and Frog. CT is just as bland as FF7 was after Midgar.

Your game is a 5/10 at best.

[Anonymous No.790167]

>>790160
So are eating boogers and watching Spongebob

[Anonymous No.790171]

>>790167

Stop it with the strawman argument. You gave your views on why FF VII sucks, I gave my views on why it was thought to be great by the people who played it in 1997. Nothing more need be said.

[Anonymous No.790172]

>>790161
Nah. FF6's battle system was worse than 7's.

>all dat glitching
>Evade is useless
>Why ever use attack command when everyone gets a defense ignoring skill from the start
>dat party homogeneity when magic is learnable
>special skills like dance and blue magic are useless

[Anonymous No.790173]

>>790167
Hey, fuck you.

I still eat my boogers sometimes.

[Anonymous No.790174]

>>783146
That Jecht theme, though, right?

[Anonymous No.790179]

>>790174
The thing that sounded like a dog chewing on a microphone? I think it may just hold a record for worst final battle theme of all time.

[Anonymous No.790180]

>>790172

>Evade is useless

Magic block was useless in VII. You're right about the glitches though.

>dat party homogeneity when magic is learnable

Come now, it's the same with VII, even more so with the Materia system. The only things that really differentiate them at all are their Limit Breaks.

>Dance and Blue Magic are useless

Did you not rape everything with El Nino?

[Anonymous No.790182]

>>790171
That was actually my first post in this thread, I'm not the dude you're arguing with

[Anonymous No.790184]

>>790180

Note: Let's not turn this into an argument, I'm not trying to prove that one is better than the other.

[Anonymous No.790885]

>>788623
is that fucking dark souls in your jRPG list

[Anonymous No.792383]

>>783317
>Tactics Ogre For Dummies
>pinnacle of anything

[Anonymous No.792402]

>>790172
>dat party homogeneity
I like the combat in FF7, but that was it's one big flaw. All the characters are the same thing. >>790180 mentioned limit breaks, but most of those are similar to each other as well.

[Anonymous No.792397]

>>792383
My thoughts exactly.
Tactics Ogre > Final Faggotry Tactics

[Anonymous No.792404]

>>790885
Not that guy, but it is, and it IS a jrpg. Even if it seems to be kinda western inspired.
Its also not retro.