/hbg/ Homebrew / Romhack General

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/hbg/ Homebrew / Romhack General 11 Fri Apr 23 00:50:44 2021 No.7679650 [Reply] [Original]

Gameplay and development discussion:
What homebrew / hacks are you playing /vr/ ?

Are you working on anything? Would you like to learn? Projects and questions welcome.

Communities:
romhacking.net
smwcentral.net
metroidconstruction.com
sonichacking.org
pouet.net

IPS Patcher:
romhacking.net/utilities/240

Archives:
archive.org/details/rom-hack-patch-archive
mediafire.com/folder/50m95vbbuyf25/vr's_ROM_>Hack_Recommendations
mega.nz/folder/jpMxlQyZ#oCwbRyPFaMcZl3gOF5mvSg
mega.nz/folder/TBgnhIxS#aKF0Cv0DA9kYI_qUI_gXvg

NESdev:
wiki.nesdev.com
forums.nesdev.com

SNESdev:
wiki.superfamicom.org
github.com/alekmaul/pvsneslib

N64dev:
n64dev.org

SMS Dev:
smspower.org

Genesis Dev:
gendev.spritesmind.net/page-doc.html
github.com/Stephane-D/SGDK

Saturn Dev:
antime.kapsi.fi/sega/docs.html
segaxtreme.net
www.jo-engine.org

GB Dev:
gbdev.gg8.se/wiki

GBA Dev:
forum.gbadev.org
github.com/pret

DS Dev:
ndshb.com
forums.serenesforest.net/index.php?/topic/26913-nintenlords-hacking-utilities

Previous: @ warosu.org/vr/ (but it's been down lately...)
>>7631727
>>7597758
>>7544203
>>7485931
>>7433626
>>7373559
>>7311797
>>7262583
>>7205614
>>7155960

Want something here? Post it for the next thread.

>>	0B Fri Apr 23 00:52:15 2021 No.7679658 File: 554 KB, 792x524, deus_ex_64.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] what's your dream homebrew, /vr/? >>7631732

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 01:01:29 2021 No.7679678

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch3GsWBSTKI

I'd mentioned about an NES port of Gateway to Apshai? Well fuck, I just realized it's got H and V scrolling and that falls into the earlier comment about how you can't do that unless MMC3 is used. I guess you could just make like LOZ and block scroll vertically.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 02:51:18 2021 No.7679872
File: 680 KB, 853x480, seachase_21_4_23.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7676058
initial mission splash screen with playfield vertical scroll-in code frame is built. good ideas. still a little screen jank to work out but it's just about there

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 02:54:07 2021 No.7679880

>>7679678
Zelda was originally an FDS game so it should have been possible to do 4-way scrolling as the FDS provided an IRQ timer. Anon said the code was a mess? Probably because in the process of converting it to an MMC1 cartridge game they had to rewrite much of the scroll routines.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 03:10:23 2021 No.7679910

>>7679880
you could code the game as an FDS title. i've never heard of modern homebrew FDS games but it's certainly possible and Everdrives include FDS support so the game can be tested on a real NES. however it would probably be a good idea to not use the FDS's sound chip because you couldn't very easily test it on real hardware (the Everdrive's emulation is inaccurate and you can't get the sound on a US model NES anyway).

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 03:14:09 2021 No.7679914 >>7679910 That's interesting but I still think it'd just make more sense to make a normal cartridge game and use block scrolling for the vertical scroll.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 07:00:21 2021 No.7680396

>>7679678
You could also educate yourself and then do it without an MMC3. I mean, not (You) you, but someone capable of that as opposed to chasing the can't do scrolling dragon.

>>7679910
>i've never heard of modern homebrew FDS games
Your zoom is showing. There's tons of FDS home brew. It was a fucking homebrew dream. It's practically the original NES "flash cart".
>you couldn't very easily test it on real hardware
(You) couldn't. It's trivial for a grownup.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 10:59:27 2021 No.7681023 >>7680396 >There's tons of FDS home brew. sauce?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 12:29:47 2021 No.7681325 >>7681023 Reality?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 12:45:07 2021 No.7681373 >>7681325 i mean links to FDS homebrew games

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 14:20:45 2021 No.7681636 I need the latest and hottest homebrew on NES what do you recommend?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 14:31:09 2021 No.7681663 File: 17 KB, 420x350, nesdev.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7681636 2020 NESdev contest entries: https://neshomebrew.ca/files/2020/

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 14:47:45 2021 No.7681703 Ignore the schizo assembly language LARPer

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 14:50:31 2021 No.7681708 >>7681703 I think I'll just ignore you instead.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 14:54:07 2021 No.7681720

For anyone who's new to this particular piece of /vr/ bullshit, this schizo is autistic asshat known locally as the "assembly language larper" in order to put out some bait that's meant to look like a zoomer kid foolishly asking how to make a video game. There is no correct response to him. No matter how you respond to the bait, you're going to get met with snide, condescending remarks calling you a zoomer and a larper who doesn't know anything. This is meant to suck you in to a shitposting session. This particular autist has been doing this for years now, and shows no signs of letting up.

Your only real advantage here (other than just not engaging) is the fact that he isn't actually a programmer himself, as evidenced by the very first thread he appeared in.
https://desuarchive.org/vr/thread/4458748/
He still hasn't bothered to learn anything in the years that followed, so if you do actually know what you're talking about he'll usually back off when he realizes it. If you're as full of shit as he is, though, you're going to be at it for hours. We're all going to laugh at you both. Just saying.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 14:57:09 2021 No.7681729
File: 157 KB, 1024x651, do_not_feed_the_trolls.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7681703
he was a C larper last thread too... this mother fucker couldn't even compile stdio.h
if your response contains the word "trivial" or "zoomie" don't even bother responding.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 14:59:09 2021 No.7681735 >>7681729 Anyone using the word "schizo" isn't worth listening to either.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:11:05 2021 No.7681761 >>7681735 agree, learned that in /vt/

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:39:19 2021 No.7681843 File: 52 KB, 668x740, f74rw5678.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Crossfire, another game I looked at but damn me if I can figure out what anything does or what's code and what's data.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:41:27 2021 No.7681848 >>7681843 these are obviously code, the CAs I think are RET instructions

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:41:49 2021 No.7681849 File: 105 KB, 1496x896, altirra_debug.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7681843 Try the Altirra debugger. Press F8 to activate and F11 to step through each line of code.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:44:03 2021 No.7681856 >>7681848 > the CAs I think are RET instructions no, well, not 6502 anyway. RTI and RTS are $40 and $60 respectively. https://www.masswerk.at/6502/6502_instruction_set.html

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:46:39 2021 No.7681864 >>7681849 it's C64 game, not Atari

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:48:41 2021 No.7681868 >>7681864 Oh, well in that case, i don't know what tools the community uses, but, i'm sure a decent emulator with a step through debugger exists. Same advice.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 15:51:58 2021 No.7681878

>Usenet many years ago
>I posted a remark on comp.sys.cbm saying I thought crack screens on games were chintzy and I didn't like them
>some guy who I would assume used to be involved in the crack/piracy scene acts extremely offended and goes i bet you also complain about your free antivirus software having ads in
>I said "Say you what? I don't use free antivirus shit."
>"Oh well you missed my point anyway forget it."
>and goes on to say something like how crack screens were important part of the C64 scene back in the day
Seriously, he was that offended that someone criticized his precious demo/crack scene.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 16:04:47 2021 No.7681908 Almost finished Chrono Trigger on DS and was wondering if I should play Chrono Cross on Vita or PS3? How’s playing non-handheld games on a handheld?

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 17:16:53 2021 No.7682138

>>7681849
the controls on the Atari as I understand it were:

>Select--choose difficulty
>Start--start game
>joystick to move and shoot

on the NES this easily translates to the equivalent controller buttons

>Select--choose difficulty
>Start--start game, pause in-game (dunno if the original has a pause feature, a lot of computer games at the time didn't)
>dpad to move
>A to shoot

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 17:30:59 2021 No.7682194 File: 106 KB, 1456x979, seachase_controller_map.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7682138 yep. mapped them that way.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 17:36:53 2021 No.7682215 >>7682138 Part of Nintendo's Q/C checklist for NES games included the requirement that games have a title screen and a pause feature.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 17:44:25 2021 No.7682241

https://desuarchive.org/vr/thread/7631727/#7676057

when porting game from C64 or whatever you never know. sometimes you may overrun the CHR table and end up needing to use banking. NES games were typically designed to be very conservative with tile use and frequently recycling assets because you had limited ROM space, while computer games didn't have that limitation. even with MMC1/3 the max supported CHR ROM was 128k, or 32 CHR tables.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 17:55:16 2021 No.7682261

>>7682241
MMC3 can support 512KB. You can switch in 1 or 2 KB chunks, it depends what configuration you're in as to whether each chunk is 1/2 KB. Kirby had 256KB, some J game had 512KB.
If the game really had some dynamic funky graphics going on, CHR RAM is an option, but you won't be able to write to it nearly as much as the C64 could. You can only write to it in vBlank on the NES, where as the C64 can write to it at anytime. That could be problematic.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 17:57:03 2021 No.7682267 >>7682261 no i'm thinking of MMC5.... 256KB was max for MMC3.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 17:59:06 2021 No.7682271 >>7682261 The PRG ROM is 512k, CHR ROM is limited to 128k.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 18:00:40 2021 No.7682273 File: 5 KB, 256x224, kirbys_adv_nightmare.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7682271 256. Kirby has that. It can be referenced in 1KB chunks.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 18:04:50 2021 No.7682286 the one unfortunate thing about MMC3 is it removed the option to set single screen mirroring that MMC1 had

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:27:47 2021 No.7682498 Do you guys know how much is the space gain from using run length encoding for 2 bit images? Also how the hell did the megadrive encode its images? A ton of good looking megadrive games are always like less than 1mb.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:30:11 2021 No.7682505 >>7682498 the Mega Drive uses packed pixels which are more space-efficient than the SNES's bit planes. this is why on average Mega Drive games can get away with smaller ROMs. there are some 128k Mega Drive games while the smallest SNES game is 256k.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:30:35 2021 No.7682506 >>7681373 http://www.google.com/

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:32:02 2021 No.7682512 >>7682506 i was hoping for some recommendations. what are your favorites?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:33:49 2021 No.7682517 >>7682512 http://www.google.com/

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:35:14 2021 No.7682519 >>7682517 thanks!

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:40:33 2021 No.7682529 >>7682519 Anytime, bb

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 19:49:07 2021 No.7682543 >>7682286 MMC1 really kind of sucks. Banking is very slow and it doesn't add an IRQ counter or anything else to help make coding a game easier. The only thing it has over MMC3 is as you said the ability to disable the second tile map.

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 21:20:09 2021 No.7682768
File: 1.01 MB, 582x972, 00-2021-04-23_20.04.05.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7682505
>packed pixels
I've been using that technique, but I can only get to around 8K(6K if I do only 256x192) from 32K per image.
So I was thinking maybe it was better to use some sort of compression.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 21:37:34 2021 No.7682804 File: 99 KB, 1200x857, basic-programming-atari-2600.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7682768 >deadbabe

Anonymous Fri Apr 23 21:46:31 2021 No.7682835

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMfKRhLnLy0

Here's a fun obscurity, Sirius's Buzzard Bait which was only on the Apple II and PC. It didn't get on other systems likely because they didn't have the sprite capabilities to handle it. The A8's sprites are too limited and C64 would need a multiplexer which nobody knew how to do yet in 1983. Even on the NES you'd have a hard time doing this game without massive flicker/sprite dropout. Having just a dumb frame buffer without the limitations of custom graphics chips does offer certain freedoms.

The Apple II is also surprisingly fast for 1.2Mhz since the video circuit doesn't steal CPU cycles unlike on the A8 and C64 where you lose up to 20% of them.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 21:52:38 2021 No.7682850 File: 150 KB, 800x800, terry.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7682835 that is damn impressive for an apple ][ holy shit i'd imagine that code is dead locked into all kinds of hardware tricks... and it ain't leaving

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 21:54:47 2021 No.7682858 >>7682850 there's no l33t hax0r hardware tricks to speak of on an Apple II. there's just a bitmap frame buffer and a 1-bit speaker for sound. there's not even any interrupts.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 22:04:27 2021 No.7682884 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7J7FhbxeoI this also gets up to a pretty impressive framerate

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 22:15:53 2021 No.7682920 >>7682804 cafebabe is 2mainstream

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 22:16:42 2021 No.7682924 emulator videos never do Apple II games justice, they're always more sluggish than the real thing and the graphics look "off."

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 23 22:25:33 2021 No.7682943 >>7682835 This game is very much like Moonbugs on the PC which was a clone of an arcade game (can't remember which one though)

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 00:06:57 2021 No.7683143 Why haven't you started a disassembly of your favorite game, anon?

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 00:54:24 2021 No.7683243 if only someone could do a decent C64 Galaxian instead of the sad piece of crap we got

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 00:56:18 2021 No.7683248 >>7681908 Playing handheld is almost always better can you still get cross on the vita though?

Anonymous Sat Apr 24 01:37:31 2021 No.7683334

>>7679872
more structure and code cleaning today. nothing exciting. sorry...
it's one thing to kludge in a few lines of code to make something "work". it's another thing entirely to have a structure that does it. if you don't pay very close attention to structure, assembly language can quickly spiral into an unmaintainable mess, even more so than other languages.
i'm happy with the structure now. more fun stuff tomorrow...

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 02:54:34 2021 No.7683475 >>7682512 I'm afraid you'll need to find someone with much lower standards than me if you want recommendations. They're all shit. Even stuff that would, in theory, be useful like copiers is shit. I only know/care about them because I collect them.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 03:13:12 2021 No.7683536 Sup assembly language LARPer

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 06:30:44 2021 No.7683858 >>7683536 >O B S E S S E D

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 13:16:26 2021 No.7684734 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9pcA2AkZnM

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 20:50:27 2021 No.7685990 >>7683536 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsvSZamCCBM

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 20:57:41 2021 No.7686008 >>7684734 I cannot stand that obnoxious youtuber. The way he says "V six times" is retarded. And who runs up to a pit of spikes and automatically assumes you have to jump into them?

Anonymous Sat Apr 24 21:02:24 2021 No.7686021
File: 102 KB, 228x271, goldeneye_face.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7686008
hes not the greatest but the game looks really cool. there was one where he showed all of the "Please Insert Controller N64 Screens" and it was riddled with spelling errors. cool idea but oof

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 21:02:38 2021 No.7686023 so I should finish learning C and an assembler?

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 21:06:38 2021 No.7686040 File: 339 KB, 527x484, chuck.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7686023 > finish learning C and an assembler you never finish. always room to improve. starting would be a good step though

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 22:18:40 2021 No.7686228 >>7686040 True, thank you. I mean I want to write some retro-like game that is really small. Like good enough to be played on raspberry pies and the like. I realized I hated my major and I'm switching to computer systems engineering :') feels good

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 22:22:37 2021 No.7686234 >>7686040 >retro-like game Try Godot or Unity honestly. Targeting actual retro hardware is 10x harder but so worth it

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 24 22:27:42 2021 No.7686239 >>7686234 >Godot Nigger Lives DON'T Matter >Unity >

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 02:59:58 2021 No.7686695 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJnz6dEWwIw

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 03:44:47 2021 No.7686758 >>7686239 >Godot >Nigger Lives DON'T Matter what >>7686234 Just use Gamemaker 8.0 or studio

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 05:39:51 2021 No.7686971 Is there any way to edit DSi ware games? I have both .nds and .cia files. I just want to do some light modding, mostly editing textures.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 06:04:43 2021 No.7687006 >>7686239 Go back to pol you fucking weirdo

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 11:55:43 2021 No.7687667 >>7686971 try this https://gbatemp.net/threads/the-ultimate-nintendo-ds-rom-hacking-guide.291274/

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 16:48:22 2021 No.7688425 >>7686040 >starting would be a good step though based and keked

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 17:03:04 2021 No.7688497 >>7679650 >Previous: @ warosu.org/vr/ (but it's been down lately...) uh, use desu?

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 17:33:22 2021 No.7688618 >>7688497 i've never heard of t b h archive

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 17:42:00 2021 No.7688643 >>7688294 How port this to NES? It'd be a pretty big one. You'd need 256k ROM, MMC1, and battery save. Also redoing the controls to work with the dpad instead of the keyboard.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 18:09:21 2021 No.7688728 >>7688643 Looks like someone started disassembling / documenting the C64 version: It's in Basic. heh. i'd start there: https://www.melon64.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5578

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 18:14:48 2021 No.7688745 i wonder if the Apple II version was also BASIC. the 16-bit versions prolly used some early shitty C compiler. maybe even compiled BASIC.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 21:55:59 2021 No.7689294 >>7688643 MMC3 would be better so you could scroll the screen around in 4 directions easily. Back in the day an MMC3+256k ROM+battery save cartridge would have been really expensive but we don't have to worry about that in 2021 now, do we? (^:

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 22:07:22 2021 No.7689329 >>7689294 >but we don't have to worry about that in 2021 now, do we? it depends if you want to release a physical game or not honestly. if you're just screwing around then go nuts.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 22:16:05 2021 No.7689352 >>7689329 who cares? you just put the ROM on Steam and it can be loaded on a Flash cart if you want to play it on a real console.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 22:32:09 2021 No.7689392 >>7689352 Right. It depends on your goals. Doing a physical release with a battery backed MMC3 with an extra ram chip could be problematic.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 22:41:08 2021 No.7689409 >>7689392 Think he's saying physical release people are autistic (which, really, it is)

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 23:03:14 2021 No.7689451 >>7688497 also archived.moe

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 25 23:04:38 2021 No.7689457 >>7689409 i'm not disagreeing lol. you don't have to worry about configurations in 2021 IF you aren't planning a physical release. if you are, then it's a whole different ball game.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 01:31:40 2021 No.7689810

the problem is homebrew NES games like Nebs n Debs where it's so obvious they wanted to make a 256k MMC3 game but couldn't be bothered or wanted to do a physical cartridge release so instead they shoehorn it into NROM and you end up with a painfully shitty, compromised game. they should be realistic about what you can accomplish with 40k of ROM and accept that that's going to be single screen black background 1984 Ice Climber tier shit.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 04:18:00 2021 No.7690132

>>7688643
Maybe learn to write hello world for the system before you start imagining what kind of cart you'd use for a game your fantasizing about porting

>>7689392
It's would only be problematic for someone playing fantasy cart design league on the internet. For a hobbyist with a few days practice laying out out PCBs it would be trivial.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 10:07:10 2021 No.7690758

>>7690132
> For a hobbyist with a few days practice laying out out PCBs it would be trivial.
True. That's not the problem.
The problem is you can't find most of these mapper chips. The other problem is it would end up costing you more money to make the cart than you could sell it for.
Anyone not going the NROM route ends up with an oversized UNROM with 512k PRG and a CHR RAM chip. You can get clone MMC3s, from what i hear, but if you choose any other configuration or mapper you physically cannot find those chips in 2021. That is the problem. unless you get into cart harvesting territory which is disgusting

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 12:17:05 2021 No.7691047

>>7690758
>The problem is you can't find most of these mapper chips
That's one reason MMC3 is the no brainer option. Does a lot and is cheap and easy to find.
>it would end up costing you more money to make the cart than you could sell it for.
And yet people make and sell carts all the time. Do they loose money on every one but make it up on volume?
>if you choose any other configuration or mapper you physically cannot find those chips in 2021
If only there were cheap alternatives to the custom chips used for those mappers that were programmable even while out farming in your field in 2021.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 12:25:07 2021 No.7691059

>>7691047
> And yet people make and sell carts all the time
Most are NROM or UNROM 512: as i said
https://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/UNROM_512
I've heard you can find clone MMC3s, but, they are mostly found in chinese repro carts. i don't know of any homebrew games that use them?
Flashcarts implement FPGA solutions, which to my knowledge, i don't think you could crank out in volume for less than 100 bucks and make any sort of profit, not even considering boxes or manuals.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 12:28:48 2021 No.7691065 If I wanted to use the N163 audio chip in an NES homebrew, would I be locked into only using a specific mapper?

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 12:33:14 2021 No.7691081

>>7691065
A physical release would be all but impossible. You can't find those, or even VRC6's. Not to mention an unmodified american NES, or even a european one, can't play the sound from it.
But yeah, if you want to make something with one of those chips, you could release it digitally and bake it in with an emulator and release it on steam or something to that effect.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 12:39:07 2021 No.7691094 >>7691081 Oh, I already knew a physical release was impossible, but that doesn't answer my question as to whether or not I would be constrained to working with a specific mapper or not.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 12:50:32 2021 No.7691142 >>7690758 >seriously replying to the schizo assembly language LARPer

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 12:57:04 2021 No.7691163 >>7690758 >Anyone not going the NROM route ends up with an oversized UNROM with 512k PRG and a CHR RAM chip CNROM, AxROM, etc are also just discreet mapper and not custom ASIC. Wonder why you don't see those used?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 13:00:45 2021 No.7691176 >>7691094 Oh, sorry: Yes. It's a fairly nice mapper though. http://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/INES_Mapper_019 >>7691142 I should fuckin know better >>7691163 Hmm so like, you could just throw in a TTL chip or something? I don't know?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 13:02:23 2021 No.7691182 >>7690132 >Maybe learn to write hello world for the system before you >boot up Family BASIC in FCEUX >type 10 PRINT "HELLO WORLD" >type RUN (^:

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 13:06:09 2021 No.7691191

>>7691176
>Hmm so like, you could just throw in a TTL chip or something? I don't know?
http://bootgod.dyndns.org:7777/profile.php?id=362

They're just a TTL used to switch the ROM banks. No custom silicon required. In fact that's what UNROM-512 is except an expanded version that supports 512k ROM while UNROM carts back in the day were usually always 128k (rarely 256k).

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 13:08:56 2021 No.7691202 >>7691191 ahhh i see. i suppose the "mapper" designation is more for emulators to know how to handle the ROM.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 13:16:07 2021 No.7691228

>>7691202
basically you had either discreet logic mappers or custom ASICs the latter of which didn't appear until 1987. the latter add all the cool stuff like battery save support, IRQ timers, software switching of the mirroring direction, etc. discreet mappers are cheap and really fast (only 2 instructions needed to bank the ROM) but add no additional hardware capabilities to the NES other than the ability to switch ROM banks, so it's basically NROM but you can have bigger games.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 13:19:21 2021 No.7691238 Amazon's Running Diet was MMC3 and they didn't do any physical cartridges, they just put the ROM up online as a freebie.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 14:19:40 2021 No.7691465 since this thread was ruined anyway by the assembly language LARPer we should just make a new one.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 14:20:54 2021 No.7691472 >>7691465 it sucks that he's breathing but it's not necessary. whatever thread you make will be polluted with "trivial" and "zoomie"

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 14:24:44 2021 No.7691486 what's with that one dude who kept ranting how he hates Micro Mages because the sprites would be blurry on an old 80s TV?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 14:42:22 2021 No.7691559 >>7691465 >assembly language LARPer Who?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 14:43:27 2021 No.7691561 >>7691559 >>7690132 This schizo.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:02:28 2021 No.7691614 >>7679658 Corpse Party 64

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:04:03 2021 No.7691618 >>7679658 Darkstalkers: The Night Warrior / Vampire 1 port for SNES/SFC

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:16:08 2021 No.7691640 yeah if you make NROM shit stick to making Door-Door, guys

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:24:50 2021 No.7691668 >>7691640 the fuck is door door?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:30:06 2021 No.7691681 >>7691668 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrN0_iGy2DA One of Enix's first Famicom releases and I think it was a port of a JPC game.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:34:55 2021 No.7691698 File: 42 KB, 771x717, kirbys_adv_7-3.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7691681 it's pretty amazing that that's the kind of 1983 shit the Senpai/NES was built to do considering the things that it ended up doing.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:42:17 2021 No.7691717

>>7691698
Of course. But the thing is, homebrew guys imagine that people think all NES games are supposed to look like Kirby. Fine, nothing wrong with that. But then they proceed to try and make an NROM game with Kirby-tier graphics and gameplay and of course it doesn't work because you can't do that in 40k of ROM.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:45:46 2021 No.7691734 >>7691717 i guess i see your point in that trying to cram an ambitious game into an NROM leads to too many sacrifices, but, i do like seeing the technical challenge of it solved in creative ways. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWQ0591PAxM

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:51:19 2021 No.7691758 >>7691734 >i guess i see your point in that trying to cram an ambitious game into an NROM leads to too many sacrifices Also none of them are as good as the SMB programmers. That was really insane what they managed to do with that game.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:54:20 2021 No.7691765 >Last thread Med? How autismo fail?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:54:53 2021 No.7691768 Two things the SMB team didn't do was try and have overstuffed, overdesigned graphics (well I mean they couldn't with 1985 tools anyway, but...) or making a Famitracker tune that ate half the ROM.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 15:58:54 2021 No.7691783 A lot of these guys including the Micro Mages dude are Euro demosceners and we can all agree that Euros should be banned from ever making vidya. They cannot do it, it's just not in them.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 16:09:43 2021 No.7691819 >>7691734 I wish I could like that game. The characters are way too small for me, sadly.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 16:10:44 2021 No.7691823 >>7679658 >dream homebrew Magical Quest 4: Mickey and Goofy for snes. Man, I'll make that game one day, even if I spend my whole life on it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 16:15:12 2021 No.7691839 >>7691819 No duh, we've discussed that many times before. The programmer admitted he did it that way deliberately because he was a lazy fuck who couldn't be bothered to deal with the scanline limit.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 16:15:57 2021 No.7691845
File: 70 KB, 1238x930, smb_music_format.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7691768
> Famitracker tune that ate half the ROM
oh god my sides. the SMB music storage/compression format is insane. the entire OST, SFX, and frequency lookup table is less than 2KB.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 16:25:19 2021 No.7691875 >>7691845 the best NES coders (I'm talking like Nintendo and Konami guys) were madmen. it's nuts what they were able to accomplish in such a tiny amount of space.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 16:45:33 2021 No.7691948 >>7691819 if they did 16x16 sprites, black backgrounds, and simplistic 1984-85 graphics (say it looked like Chack'N'Pop) then I might like it.

Anonymous Mon Apr 26 19:39:10 2021 No.7692489

>>7682498
The better graphics compressions used in NES and SNES games simply used string copying of bytes, but they often rearranged the bytes so that each color plane was side-by-side to allow longer runs of repetitive data.
Bytes were compressible because each would be a 1 bit of a row of 8 pixels, which could repeat in columns but also sometimes not need the other color planes.
Also data copying can be used to recreate RLE strings, just simply start copying how many bytes of a pattern you want to create behind the output position, it then repeats the pattern as it overflows into the new data.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 23:10:31 2021 No.7693026 Has anyone here tried NESmaker? Would you recommend it for making an RPG or would it be better to start from scratch?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 26 23:21:11 2021 No.7693043 >>7693026 do you have any game making experience? i would start with something much more simple first of all. do nerdy nights: https://taywee.github.io/NerdyNights/

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 00:01:45 2021 No.7693108 >>7691618 >>7679658 This but with darkstalkers 3 for the 3DS/DS

Anonymous Tue Apr 27 00:44:39 2021 No.7693210

>>7691059
>Most are NROM or UNROM 512: as i said
Ackchyually most aren't and aren't even for the NES. Lads who can into electronics make massively more complex carts that sell for hundreds and sell like hot cakes.
>I've heard you can find clone MMC3s
You can. Cheap and easy to find, as I said.
>to my knowledge
Well there's yer problem. For you FPGAs are expensive magic black boxes. For an electronics hobbyist they're just another interesting line of toys, many of which are very cheap <$2. For a professional they're just tools to be used like a bitch. You wouldn't even need an FPGA for something like MMC3. A small CPLD would do.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 00:50:41 2021 No.7693220 >>7693210 do you ever quit spewing complete bullshit?

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 00:51:49 2021 No.7693223 >>7692489 Thats more or less what I meant by run length. I was thinking say have 1 byte have a max of 128 pixels in a horizontal line with the sign bit being the color since I want to do a black&white game.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 00:58:42 2021 No.7693243 >>7693043 Thanks, I’ll check it out.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 01:28:57 2021 No.7693315 >>7691948 Damn, that would be amazing.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 08:55:15 2021 No.7694056 >>7679658 Castle of Illusion or Lucky Dime Caper for NES would be cool. Kinda surprised if the chinese haven't done it yet.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:17:41 2021 No.7695334 https://github.com/Roninkoi/CRENDER how long would it take a non-programmer to learn enough C to make a game with this code?

Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:29:32 2021 No.7695370

>>7695334
oh boy. tough to say. first of all, you're looking at a graphics demo with a few API functions to draw shapes. this is not a video game engine. it would be up to you to implement logic, text, and possibly hitboxes to make something resembling a game.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:30:20 2021 No.7695373 >>7695370 I just want to make a flat shaded first person melee game, why is this so much to ask for?

Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:34:52 2021 No.7695382

>>7695373
ok. the first step i would take is figure out how the demo is drawing shapes. see if you can draw your own shapes. next, try to get a key to draw a shape, and another one to undraw that shape. after that, it's just a process of implementing more logic to draw more shapes under different circumstances. i wish you well

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:41:46 2021 No.7695396 >>7695373 ok, before any of that though, you're going to have to get the code to compile. it says it's ANSI C compliant, so that's good news. try this: http://mixsoftware.com/product/powerc.htm

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:43:55 2021 No.7695404 >>7695396 But this will only run in DOS, right? would Tiny C Compiler work?

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:46:28 2021 No.7695414 >>7695404 oh no this compiler you sent is for DOS, let's try this out

Anonymous Tue Apr 27 16:47:03 2021 No.7695416

>>7695404
I would try to build it in DOSbox or a VM. In theory any ANSI-C compatible compiler would work, but, you won't really know until you can build it successfully. Pure ANSI-C can accept some gnarly inputs that modern GCC would not, so, either contact the author for his setup or keep trying compilers. gl

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 17:23:31 2021 No.7695524 Do you guys know of any good spriting tutorial that takes into account actual hardware limitations and its not just "le retro art XD"?

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 17:28:12 2021 No.7695532 >>7695524 I found a decent one at http://www.google.com/

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 17:34:40 2021 No.7695548 >>7695532 if you weren't such an insufferable asshole and actually searched for spiriting tutorials before, most do not take into account the actual palette and palette-space limitations of old consoles. i'd be interested in one as well.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 17:37:50 2021 No.7695560 >>7695548 Sounds like you already know what you're doing, so why are you asking here for one?

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 17:40:44 2021 No.7695578 File: 120 KB, 801x605, seachase_sprites.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7695560 i'm not the person who asked? and just because i have some idea of what i'm doing doesn't mean i can't learn a few good tricks from someone else.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 17:47:18 2021 No.7695595 >>7695560 Because am a programmer, I know jackshit about making good looking sprites within constraints. Shit is popular as fuck, thats why am asking since there are tons and tons of useless stuff around.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 22:08:32 2021 No.7696370 >>7693220 Your ignorance doesn't make facts bullshit. It just makes you look retarded.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 22:13:30 2021 No.7696376 >>7696370 FPGA's under 2 bucks lol ok. I must be on the wrong fuckin digikey. The problem with the NES is you need both chips with a ton of address lines to handle bankswitching properly and that can safely run at 5 volts. Those ain't cheap nigga.

Anonymous Tue Apr 27 22:16:48 2021 No.7696386

>>7696376
>The problem with the NES is you need both chips with a ton of address lines to handle bankswitching properly and that can safely run at 5 volts. Those ain't cheap nigga.
well no not really you just use a step-down to drop the voltage to 3.3V. of course that's an extra component you have to pay for.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 27 22:25:27 2021 No.7696418 >>7696386 but you also have to step it back up to feed it back to the console? and that's for each address line?

Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:00:07 2021 No.7696774
File: 104 KB, 365x876, lol.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7696376
>I must be on the wrong fuckin digikey
Nah. You're just retarded. Pic related.
>a ton of address lines to handle bankswitching properly
MMC3 is a 44pn QFP, 37 of those are I/O. You need 37 I/O pins, just like the original part.
>safely run at 5 volts
The voltage the part runs at is irrelevant. You either need 5V tolerant I/O or level shifters.

>>7696418
Nope. That's not how the MMC3 works.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:19:08 2021 No.7696813 >>7696418 No. The cartridge slot supplies 5V to the cartridge PCB which has a step-down to reduce the voltage to 3.3V.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:21:53 2021 No.7696815 >>7696774 oh neat i just have to order a minimum 5000 to get those prices... fuckin neato So if i found a 5v QFP 44 pin chip how would i get it to behave like an MMC3?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:29:21 2021 No.7696832 after this Sea Chase project is done someone will have to put it on an Everdrive and try it out with a real NES to make sure it does what we think it does because with emulators you never know

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:40:18 2021 No.7696854 File: 869 KB, 1492x2128, seac_20210428_013433.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7696832

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:44:35 2021 No.7696863 >>7696854 As is usually the case it looks far better on a real machine with a CRT. the border has a nice braided effect that's absent on emulation.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:45:37 2021 No.7696867 >>7696863 ill set up my stupid Hauppauge tomorrow and get some real footage

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:47:13 2021 No.7696869 >>7696854 >Gyromite cartridge what

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:48:57 2021 No.7696875 >>7696869 that's a late 2013 famicom everdrive N8, before the american one was even released, with a real gyromite converter.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:54:22 2021 No.7696890 >>7696875 bleh. old Everdrive revisions like that are ok enough for just playing basic bitch UNROM or MMC1 games but that was before support for a lot of the more exotic Famicom mappers was added.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 01:58:13 2021 No.7696898 >>7696890 i have the latest firmware idiot

Anonymous Wed Apr 28 02:03:26 2021 No.7696903

>>7696863
dunno how the Atari original looks on a real machine. it's probably a little smoother because the NTSC burst on the A8 stays constant from line to line while ithe NES flips it 52 degrees every line, which is why its graphics have a "netting" effect to them. on the Atari it should be more like faint vertical bars.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 02:07:10 2021 No.7696910 >>7696898 Neat, you can play LaGrange Point and have it sound like ass because half the sound is missing on a toaster NES.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 02:07:22 2021 No.7696912 >>7696903 it honestly just looks like scrolling (R)'s. shitty phone camera sucks. i'll get console capture tomorrow. the original was using some stretched double size text mode but that isn't a realistic option here.

Anonymous Wed Apr 28 02:10:40 2021 No.7696925

>>7696912
>the original was using some stretched double size text mode but that isn't a realistic option here.
yeah the A8 has a couple of useless double size text modes for memory saving reasons because it was designed in the late 70s when memory was expensive and they anticipated selling machines with only 4-8k of RAM. since RAM prices quickly dropped after their launch, those video modes became pointless.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 02:11:20 2021 No.7696928 >>7696910 it's possible to mod but i haven't done it. gimmick would be fun

Anonymous Wed Apr 28 04:00:29 2021 No.7697149

>>7696815
>oh neat i just have to order a minimum 5000 to get those prices
Nah. You just need to not be retarded and pick a part with a lower moq, or discover that there's more than one place that sells components.
>>7696815
>how would i get it to behave like an MMC3?
You wouldn't. For a myriad of reasons, ranging from you being incapable of even understanding that's not what you should be looking for to the ridiculousness of the wildly fanciful notion that you'd be able to program such a part.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 10:15:58 2021 No.7697801 >>7695334 I've got an even better idea, are there any open source wireframe games?

Anonymous Wed Apr 28 10:37:11 2021 No.7697838

>>7697149
> that's not what you should be looking for
didn't you just say it was?
> wildly fanciful notion that you'd be able to program such a part.
that's the one thing i probably could do. fuck me if i could wire it to a breadboard or whatever i'd have to do to flash the ROM though.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 13:01:34 2021 No.7698290 >>7696910 that game isn't even that good. basically an absurdly expensive tech demo that retailed for something like 100 USD (I don't know what that would be in yen).

Anonymous Wed Apr 28 15:21:21 2021 No.7698728

>>7697838
>didn't you just say it was?
I didn't. You may recognize the words I used because they're English but you have no idea what they mean in this context. You'll need a basic understanding of the subject to understand what I said.
>that's the one thing i probably could do. fuck me if i could wire it to a breadboard or whatever i'd have to do to flash the ROM though.
I'm not even sure where to start here. There is no ROM. There's a configuration that needs to be loaded into device. This configuration needs to be programmed in a language that can be complied into a bitstream the part understands. You either must learn one of those languages or use a tool that helps you translate equations/schematics/whatever (all of which you must first learn to create) into one of those languages. I could go on but since I lost you at "There is no ROM" there's not much point.
tl;dr: No and no

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 15:49:14 2021 No.7698842 >>7698728 >There is no ROM. ok >There's a configuration that needs to be loaded into device. hmmm.... > I could go on go on....

Anonymous Wed Apr 28 22:34:26 2021 No.7700108
File: 2.74 MB, 853x480, seachase_21_4_28.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7679872
transition screens are done with smooth playfield scroll in.
it was difficult to get a perfect moving sprite 0 hit for the vertically scrolling background color change but you can accomplish difficult things when you put your mind to it.
>>7696832
video captured from real console

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 22:51:42 2021 No.7700152 >>7700108 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fLAjL1JhQo it'd be a hell of a lot easier to just scroll the title screen like the early Namco titles and not scroll the playfield

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 28 22:56:18 2021 No.7700162 >>7700152 you are absolutely right. i don't do things because they are easy. anyway, i like the instant title screen load. every screen is instantly skippable too.

Anonymous Thu Apr 29 01:20:02 2021 No.7700459

>>7698842
It's great you're interested but this really is OT at this point. You should check out an electronics hobby site like sparkfun. You'll find all the basics you need to know covered in detail with explanations and pictures done much better than I could ever do here.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 09:29:50 2021 No.7701321 is there any reason why mesen/nestopia/bnes are showing varying colors for the same thing?

Anonymous Thu Apr 29 11:04:16 2021 No.7701545
File: 55 KB, 730x611, palette_nes.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7701321
Yes. The real NES generates color in a non-standard way. It takes the NTSC colorburst and throws voltages at it, somewhat haphazardly. No CRT will ever agree on what "color" it is trying to display, hence why "the sky is purple" and each emulator can't agree on colors either. Most emulators allow you to load a palette file.
https://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/NTSC_video
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorburst

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 13:57:15 2021 No.7702069 >>7701545 different PPU revisions also have slightly differing color palettes

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 15:18:52 2021 No.7702345 >>7701545 i see, thanks used mesen for a quick recording beforehand and it shows a blue sky so i guess that's good enough

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 15:33:26 2021 No.7702383 >>7691163 >>7691059 the answer is because you can buy cheap NROM or UNROM 512 chink PCBs on Aliexpress.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 15:52:46 2021 No.7702431 >>7679658 Shantae for TG-16 and possibly PC-98.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 15:54:52 2021 No.7702436 >>7691561 >issues Take your med.

Anonymous Thu Apr 29 16:08:54 2021 No.7702480

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd7NO-bAUmY

International Karate would be a fun NES port project with a few caveats.

>the NES can't do the big C64 sprites, you would have to make something more like the MSX version
>it could not be done in NROM, a mapper is required but since the game really doesn't do much other than change around the backgrounds, CNROM should do the trick

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 16:13:51 2021 No.7702493 >>7691618 >already knew SFA Vol.2 port was crap Gigabased

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 16:18:43 2021 No.7702515 >>7702431 what about porting a good game?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 16:28:05 2021 No.7702548 >>7702480 >the NES can't do the big C64 sprites true, but it looks like 8x16 mode could handle those

Anonymous Thu Apr 29 16:41:19 2021 No.7702593
File: 139 KB, 594x448, merio.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

had a look at merio out of boredom
top is a crop of a png from nintendo jp which showed the "widescreen game and watch" 35th anniv
scaled the bottom two to match, they're mesen default and rgb arcade

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 16:53:34 2021 No.7702626 >>7702593 the worst was Wii VC that looked dark as hell

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 16:55:44 2021 No.7702634 File: 1.57 MB, 2916x2236, trin_20210331_185524.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7702593 top looks most like my CRT does anyway

Anonymous Thu Apr 29 17:38:47 2021 No.7702763

>>7702593
the TVs I've tried my NES on always had a powder blue sky and rust or deep orange bricks, this included three different CRTs and one flat screen and I never got colors like >>7702634. the TV is only one factor, it's also the particular PPU revision you have.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 19:53:56 2021 No.7703146 >>7702480 Does this do disk multiload? Because that can be a real PITA to unravel.

Anonymous Thu Apr 29 19:59:21 2021 No.7703157

>>7702480
According to Gamebase64, IK is 399 blocks which equals 102,144 bytes but it's also padded out with crack game bullshit like a loading screen and docs. Subtracting that and it's probably about 90k or so in which case perhaps you'd need MMC1 since the size limit for CNROM is 64k.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 21:47:40 2021 No.7703431 >>7703157 The game has 8 different cities/levels and CNROM allows 8 different CHR tables. I think that should be fine.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 23:23:21 2021 No.7703692 as i said, instead of playing cartridge PCB designer for the fantasy port of a game that exists in your head, try and write a Hello World program first, kiddo

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 29 23:39:20 2021 No.7703738 >>7703692 > Hello World https://taywee.github.io/NerdyNights/

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 02:57:02 2021 No.7704210 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSvsjvake_0

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 04:13:58 2021 No.7704364 File: 52 KB, 320x371, 15919661.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7703692

Anonymous Fri Apr 30 09:57:08 2021 No.7704925

>>7701545
That's a popular misconception, the NES used a fairly correct hue range.
Granted the luma wasn't as correct, was square waves and only used 2/3 of the dot crawl rotation (caused jagged color collisions) plus was about 10% brighter than normal, but that mostly screws with digital decoders that expected the final strict NTSC standard.

The problem was most CRT televsions did not comply with the NTSC color decoding standard.
NTSC used a skewed hue gamut, more range was devoted to orange and cyan.
But many televisions used a cheaper more linear color decoder, this is why fixing skin tones would mess up the sky color & vice versa.
So the sky in SMB1 was indeed blue (though a light pure blue is a shade of Blue-lavender ($FF8080) , which appears slightly violet, but is not purple)
Also, these "accurate" palettes don't take into account most people had their TVs adjusted to strengthen colors such as red, yellow & sky blue.
Later consoles shifted the colors more in-between the standard and non-standard hues to look more consistant, but those still had issues that modern digital decoders dont like.

So the proper NES hues are: azure, blue, violet, purple, cool red, orange-red, orange, golden yellow, lime, green, aqua, cyan.
The cyan can throw people off, it's Mega Mans lighter color that people assume is supposed to be purely light blue, nope, it's that mana/neon cyan.
Well, the "reds" too, games had to choose between the cool or warm red. The yellows only looked right if used next to darker colors.

So, in other words, there is no "perfect" NES palette because each developer had their own tint-shift they preferred.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 16:50:59 2021 No.7706123 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWmtBEvgI-4

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 16:59:44 2021 No.7706162 >>>/v/553832661 Look's like /v/'s revving up to make another Super Mario World hack

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 17:04:06 2021 No.7706175 >>7706162 i love the soundtracks to those https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Wg3iuAaJ2Y

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 17:29:41 2021 No.7706269 >>7693108 >3DS Kinda wish Starforce 4 and Darkstalkers 4 happens.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 17:30:44 2021 No.7706272 >>7702515 Ummm any title?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 18:32:29 2021 No.7706483 >>7679658 Alice for N64, GameCube and possibly Dreamcast.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 30 19:42:34 2021 No.7706719 >>7703692 Oh right

Anonymous Sat May 1 00:09:10 2021 No.7707508

Are there any demos that show off really fast wire rendering? preferably on 8-bit consoles? Something that could possibly be implemented in a homebrew game

Where do I even ask about this stuff? It's one thing to look into making a homebrew but when you get into 3D there's a massive dearth of info, there has to be a forum somewhere that people are good with early 3d development

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 00:22:39 2021 No.7707548 File: 32 KB, 1024x978, elite_nes.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7707508 There was Elite for PAL NES? that was a thing

Anonymous Sat May 1 00:25:01 2021 No.7707558

>>7707548
I know about Elite, that's one of the only examples, along with Mercenary, but what I'm interested in is stuff like this

https://youtu.be/kEoSXKgPcqU
https://youtu.be/bdiAKjPpA-E
https://youtu.be/r_GHKfQnILc

That last one especially, how does this magic work? Is it possible that you could get a 30 fps wireframe game working on 8-bit PCs with a similar technique? I assumed this was something precalculated or some video trickery but after seeing comments from the creators, all of this stuff is real 3D, without extra chips, we can make high framerate 3D for these consoles, what I want to know is how, I'm going to have to email these developers

Anonymous Sat May 1 00:33:36 2021 No.7707585

>>7707558
There are some raycasting demos on the NES like this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcOneF-dLfc
There's an anon around here somewhere making a 3d engine for the genesis, but he hasn't been around for a minute
https://desuarchive.org/vr/thread/7433626/#q7437496

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 04:15:53 2021 No.7708061 >>7695334 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qS9XhNwZHe4

Anonymous Sat May 1 10:45:57 2021 No.7708817

>>7707585
I remember him, I wanted to ask about his engine but I never got to properly

Raycasting is way different from what I'm looking to do though, let's see if I can hunt these demoscene guys down and send them an email, everything I learn about 3D rendering can get posted here

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 13:44:11 2021 No.7709309 >>7679650 What's good to play these days, my negros? Friend and I typically play romhacks when we hang out. Looking for more that are Mario Mystery Meat and Puresabe Mega Man hack tier. Any suggestions?

Anonymous Sat May 1 16:41:04 2021 No.7709884
File: 1.26 MB, 1233x1069, peachs_adventure_green_hill2.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7709309
Check the thread copypasta for archives of prepatched roms, my favorites are:
SMB3mix
Peach's Adventure (SMW)
Super Mario Bros DX (SMB1)
Sonic Megamix
Rockman 4 burst chaser x air sliding
Super Metroid Vitality

Anonymous Sat May 1 17:30:56 2021 No.7710019

>>7708817
https://docs.google.com/document/d/17pX_PS5uXSWoaS71JurC-DSKIV8ZAzlaP4o1jXbJ9CA/edit#heading=h.ynqebtitvi0b

Here's a writeup on the Red Eyes demo, there's a lot of info about the 3D in here, some of its cheated but most of it is real, but I can't make sense of any of it really, if that Genesis 3Ddev were here I'm sure he could explain it

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 17:51:31 2021 No.7710108 File: 22 KB, 570x428, pokemon cock.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I'm playing Pokemon Cock. The dialogues are mostly about sex which is funny but pokemons mostly land in the box bugged. Still playable though.

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 17:58:16 2021 No.7710137 What's the easier simpler, more straightforward processor, the 6502 or Z80? the 6502 right?

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 18:00:05 2021 No.7710145 >>7710137 The Z80 is generally easier to use and requires less jumping through hoops especially for block copying or 16-bit arithmetic.

Anonymous Sat May 1 18:05:07 2021 No.7710175

>>7710145
But how often is that stuff used? That's sort of like saying Python is easier to use than C, that doesn't necessarily mean I want to learn Python, but what processor is simpler overall, like as an instruction set, which is more minimal, not what's easier to use

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 19:39:37 2021 No.7710460 >>7706123 Super underrated

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 19:40:40 2021 No.7710464 >>7710460 the hack, not that faggot snooplax lmao

Anonymous Sat May 1 22:01:39 2021 No.7710950

>>7710137
once you learn one processor / assembler's language and syntax, others become readable and usable to some degree. it's a similar situation with higher level OOP languages like C#, Lua, Python, Javascript, what have you. the differences are more akin to having a british accent then speaking french.
i'd start with one you are most interested in, getting over the initial hump learning the first one is the toughest struggle.

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 23:09:38 2021 No.7711148 >>7709214 I always wanted this for the C64

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 23:11:27 2021 No.7711151 >>7679658 Some RPGs for the Dreamcast. Seriously, why hasn't anyone done anything yet?

Anonymous Sat May 1 23:29:26 2021 No.7711185

>>7711151
>Seriously, why hasn't anyone done anything yet?
Probably the amount of work that goes into a commercial quality 5th/6th gen console game has something to do with it. Probably the archaic tools to build one compared to a modern tools like Unity. Probably the expectation that they wouldn't make a return on their investment after years of work. Anything rivaling commercial quality beyond 16bit isn't realistic for one person or a small team unfortunately.

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 23:32:38 2021 No.7711195 >>7711185 Yeah I understand, but even something small like 16bit would be nice.

>>	Anonymous Sat May 1 23:37:43 2021 No.7711206 >>7711195 With 16-bit consoles the programming isn't so big a deal, it's the graphics since you need a professional artist to make something that looks like a commercial SNES game.

Anonymous Sat May 1 23:59:43 2021 No.7711262
File: 422 KB, 648x497, alishas_adv.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7711206
i think 8 bit art is a much better and more realistic target.
that said, there are sites like opengameart.org that you can use for assets and convert. i'd still consider 16bit pixel art much less of a workload and a much more learnable skill than 3d modeling and texturing. it's difficult and time consuming but not impossible.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 06:36:42 2021 No.7712082 I'd be willing to pay someone to mod in the fixed camera of the Japanese version of blue stinger to the american version

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 12:39:55 2021 No.7712779 Where can I find the version of Puresabe's Kirby's Adventure hack that features Quick Man's stage?

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 12:58:10 2021 No.7712817 File: 40 KB, 479x720, tips fedora.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7711262 >pontificating about shit you can't even comprehend

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 13:04:19 2021 No.7712828 >>7712817 speak for yourself https://github.com/Kannagi/SNESConvert

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 13:12:07 2021 No.7712852 File: 65 KB, 763x719, kirbys_adv_puresabe2.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7712779 hmm, i guess it is hard to find now. i have a copy. here. https://nesblast.com/stuff/Kirby'sAdventureHack(Puresabe).nes

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 13:39:12 2021 No.7712889 >>7712852 based, thank you. i was looking for it a while ago but couldn't find it anywhere

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 13:39:56 2021 No.7712891 >>7711262 there's a reason why a lot of modern indie games go for 3D with 2D sprites as models these days, or just isometric

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 15:23:32 2021 No.7713138 >>7710019 so I found out how I want to do this What's an early console/computer with a really strong CPU and monochrome display or even text-mode display? I'm trying to what I'm going to develop for

Anonymous Sun May 2 16:05:54 2021 No.7713215
File: 93 KB, 824x768, gk.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7713138
> What's an early console/computer with a really strong CPU
Talking pre-1990? Intel x86's were way stronger than their contemporaries, which is why they blew every other chip out of the market. Plus there is a ton of knowledge and tools for them.
Consoles didn't have "strong" CPU's, they each made up for it with the way they were architected to spit out graphics and sound quickly.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 16:21:26 2021 No.7713247 >>7713215 I meant pre-1980 but yeah, then it would be the Z80 right?

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 16:25:37 2021 No.7713261 >>7713247 Tough to say pre-1980, but, whatever machine you decide to target, you should learn about how it renders graphics and form a plan around that. It's way more important than CPU power.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 16:29:01 2021 No.7713269 >>7713215 This is you>>7712817

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 16:31:02 2021 No.7713271 >>7713269 how am i wrong?

Anonymous Sun May 2 16:45:08 2021 No.7713325

>>7713261
I want to make a wireframe immersive sim, so I'll give some examples

https://youtu.be/c4GNNpfGeKY
https://youtu.be/PSzcoG7k2FI
https://youtu.be/t_xVR1LFVmQ
https://youtu.be/TznJFneHEKk

Something like Ultima Underworld but wireframe, I'm trying to figure out which of the early consoles is best for wireframe graphics, I'm thinking an 8-bit console with a coprocessor chip, a simple one just for trigonometry would be period correct, maybe a MSX so I can take advantage of the keyboard

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 18:25:10 2021 No.7713614 >>7713325 Looks like someone annotated the source code for Elite for BBC Micro, might be a good place to start https://github.com/markmoxon/elite-beebasm

Anonymous Sun May 2 18:38:49 2021 No.7713651

>>7679678
lyl no actually LOZ just switches the mirroring direction on the fly. And you most certainly can do 4 way scrolling without an ASIC mapper, in fact a status bar makes it easier to hide artifacts. You have to understand that the reason the bare NES hardware uses either fixed H or V mirroring is because they didn't really consider the idea of 4 way scrolling when the console was designed, they were just assuming a game would scroll in one direction only.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 18:45:07 2021 No.7713669 >>7711262 Nice

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 18:56:32 2021 No.7713697 >>7713512 NES port of Minesweeper. That'd be fun.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 19:08:17 2021 No.7713735 >>7713697 Very doable. You'd be limited to 3 colors and a background color for 8x8 squares as you can only set the color space for 16x16 regions, but, that's not such a big deal.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 19:40:55 2021 No.7713841 >>7713669 Playing aria alter (hack of aria of sorrow) and it's surprisingly great. Also grabbed pokemon ultra violet and liquid crystal

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 19:47:43 2021 No.7713867 >>7713735 even more fun would be a large screen like that which you could do as 4x4 and implement with 4 screen mirroring

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 19:51:15 2021 No.7713879 >>7713867 Don't you need a mapper for 4 screen mirroring?

Anonymous Sun May 2 19:58:48 2021 No.7713901

>>7713879
No actually you don't, you just need an extra cartridge RAM chip to supply the memory needed for the extra nametables. Sometimes this was a 2k chip like Gauntlet used, which combines with the 2k onboard RAM to give you 4k total, but most games with extra RAM just used an 8k chip which actually replaces the onboard 2k in the NES completely; if you're playing, say, LOZ, the cartridge RAM is used for everything and it doesn't use the onboard RAM at all. Most games didn't need 8k RAM and often only used a small amount of the chip, but I guess 8k SRAM chips were cheaper and more readily available than 2k ones.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:01:22 2021 No.7713906 >>7713879 Yes, also 2KB of RAM. Each nametable needs 1KB are there is only 2KB of RAM in the console.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:03:44 2021 No.7713917 >>7713906 >>7713901 So yes or no?

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:04:26 2021 No.7713919 >>7713901 > No actually you don't Right, it depends if hooking up address lines constitutes as a "mapper", but, an emulator would still need to know how to handle it.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:06:21 2021 No.7713926 >>7713917 Theoretically no, but in practice you'd probably want to assign a mapper so an emulator could handle it.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:06:59 2021 No.7713929 >>7713906 As I said, this is solved by putting RAM in the cartridge to supply the extra nametable space. cf. Gauntlet http://bootgod.dyndns.org:7777/profile.php?id=473

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:10:45 2021 No.7713937 >>7713841 Oops meant for >>7679650

Anonymous Sun May 2 20:12:07 2021 No.7713945

>>7713926
>>7713919
the iNES format will let you set 4 screen mirroring on any mapper configuration unless it explicitly conflicts with that mapper's setup. i guess you also have to specify the existence of ext. cartridge RAM. so you can even do things like 4-screen NROM that no actually released game used.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:13:11 2021 No.7713956 >>7713929 Right. I don't know of any games that used an "NROM with an extra 2KB chip for 4 nametables" configuration? It should be possible?

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:14:43 2021 No.7713961 >>7713945 Ah i see. You are absolutely right. https://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/INES#Flags_6

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 20:22:06 2021 No.7713996 Normally the nametable is in the 2k of PPU RAM and if you use 4 screen mirroring with an ext. RAM chip, the nametable goes there instead. Or you can add additional PPU RAM and have the extended nametable in the PPU address space, whatever you prefer.

Anonymous Sun May 2 21:31:35 2021 No.7714196
File: 2 KB, 384x272, SquishemC64screenshot.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

So to go back on the earlier comment about Squish 'Em, doing vscroll on the NES with a status bar wouldn't be a serious issue. I do agree it'd be easier to have one status bar instead of two. I mean in theory you could make two of them by switching sprite 0 around but it'd be a PITA.

Anonymous Sun May 2 21:36:16 2021 No.7714215

>>7714196
>I mean in theory you could make two of them by switching sprite 0 around
Nope. You can't update sprites mid frame for broken hardware reasons, and even if you could, the sprite 0 flag only activates once per frame and resets at the end of vBlank before the frame is drawn. Not an option.
There are some crazy theoretical ways to do it but this isn't one of them.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 21:39:52 2021 No.7714229 >>7714215 >>7714196 Maniac Mansion does it but they got away with it because there's hardly anything going on most of the time and the CPU is pretty much idle. For a dynamic game with lots of action, it's not happening.

Anonymous Sun May 2 21:43:55 2021 No.7714246

>>7714229
Right. It's using a majority of CPU screen time to spin around and wait for the bottom menu. If you had code with no branching that always took the same amount of cycles it could be done. There are even ways to synchronize with the DMC channel interrupt which is some galaxy brain stuff.

Anonymous Sun May 2 22:05:27 2021 No.7714337

>>7714246
Yes, you can use the DPCM channel to generate multiple scanline interrupts per frame, one at about every 4 vertical pixels, but this means it can't be used for sampled SFX plus you gotta pick an unnoticeable tone since it will be outputting whatever sample it's positioned at.
And on top of that the DPCM channels state will affect the volume of the triangle channel.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 22:11:46 2021 No.7714359 >>7714337 I dunno if any games use this. If there is I imagine it's like one unlicensed Taiwanese game no normal person has ever heard of.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 22:28:46 2021 No.7714392 >>7714359 I don't think any games did it, but there is a homebrew demo of it in action: https://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?p=65871#p65871

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 23:16:57 2021 No.7714518 >>7713901 i used to think if you had 8k cartridge RAM it would combine with the built in 2k RAM and give you 10k total but turns out that's not the case. the cartridge RAM takes over that address space completely and disables the onboard WRAM.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 23:17:54 2021 No.7714520 >>7712828 >>7713269 >low iq cope

>>	Anonymous Sun May 2 23:44:54 2021 No.7714572 >>7714196 easy for this game. it only scrolls vertically so just set H mirroring and away you go.

Anonymous Sun May 2 23:47:49 2021 No.7714583

>>7714518
Uh, the PPU address space is 16KB.
The CHRROM or VRAM is mapped to the lower 8KB by default, since each 128x128 pixel tile page is 4KB (uses 2).
I'm not sure I remember, but they either only assigned more RAM to the upper space for 4-screen mirroring, or used 16KB RAM to replace the whole space to get VRAM + 4-screen, though a few KB is wasted this way since some or all of the $3000~$3FFF space is rigged to the internal palette.

The NES's onboard 2K can be moved, say reassigned to 1-screen plus 64 VRAM tiles without any CHR ROM or RAM.
But it still seems used whether you use CHR ROM or RAM.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 00:01:06 2021 No.7714603 File: 82 KB, 600x380, smb3 pcb.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7714583 Meaning cartridge RAM like SMB3 uses. This RAM is mapped into the CPU address space from $0-$1FFF and the onboard 2k RAM at $0-$7FF is disabled and not used at all.

Anonymous Mon May 3 00:13:41 2021 No.7714635

>>7714603
> This RAM is mapped into the CPU address space from $0-$1FFF and the onboard 2k RAM at $0-$7FF is disabled and not used at all.
No. That's not how SMB3 or any MMC3 games map CPU RAM, or any game i know of for that matter. The 8k cartridge RAM is mapped to $6000-$7FFF and the game absolutely does use the onboard 2K $0-$7FF range. Zero page, $0-$FF, is especially important for speedy operations and storing pointers.

Anonymous Mon May 3 00:17:45 2021 No.7714647

>>7713929
Gauntlet has 2k RAM that replaces the PPU RAM and contains half the name table and the NES's WRAM has the other half and there's some switching logic to control access to both chips. The licensed version, that is. The black shell unlicensed Gauntlet just uses an 8k RAM chip mapped into the PPU address space to hold the 4 screen name table.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 00:28:05 2021 No.7714664 >>7714647 yeah most of the 8k chip isn't used but i guess it was cheaper than the extra TTL and the 2k RAM which probably cost more due to scale of economics

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 00:34:30 2021 No.7714675 iNES assumes 8k RAM at $6000-$7FFF by default even if it's an NROM game. NES 2.0 however does allow you to set any RAM size or no RAM size.

Anonymous Mon May 3 00:36:40 2021 No.7714679

>>7714603
I meant the 2KB nametable memory can be appended and even used as 64 rewritable tiles even with no CHR at all in the cart.

And I don't think SMB3 changes the lower RAM mapping, it's still the usual mirrored 2K.
But it does map additional RAM to the $6000 address space, used mostly to buffer the stage layouts.

Of course, it would've been possible to do lots of fancy things with memory mapping, like unifying the graphics and CPU memory to allow the CPU to redraw tiles directly, but making such a mapper that can latch and time reads & writes between the two were too complicated to risk spending big development money on, the MMC5 does some of these things but it was too late for most games to make use of it.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 00:38:09 2021 No.7714689 >>7714675 >iNES assumes 8k RAM at $6000-$7FFF It is actually mapped there on most carts right? I'd assume CPU address space has to be emulated accurately otherwise the game would be referencing invalid space?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 00:38:38 2021 No.7714691 >>7714675 >iNES assumes 8k RAM at $6000-$7FFF by default even if it's an NROM game that was ok for emulation but you can't have that on a real NES because some games actually need that space to be empty to avoid bus conflicts.

Anonymous Mon May 3 00:45:20 2021 No.7714710

>>7714689
>It is actually mapped there on most carts right?
Normally yes.

>>7713901
Zelda, in addition to holding save game data, also uses the 8k RAM as temporary work space by copying certain data and code routines there so they can be accessed no matter which ROM bank is switched in.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 01:08:55 2021 No.7714762 >>7714710 > also uses the 8k RAM as temporary work space by copying certain data and code routines there For the record, you can absolutely write self modifying code on the NES >>7675313

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 02:29:57 2021 No.7714915 >>7714647 so it combines CHR ROM and RAM, no?

Anonymous Mon May 3 02:48:38 2021 No.7714948

>>7714915
No. The PPU has a 14-bit address space running from $0-$3FFF. From $0-$7FF is mapped the 2k RAM that contains the tile map and palette data. $800-$1FFF is a 6k hole with nothing normally in it and then $2000-$3FFF holds the 8k CHR ROM (or CHR RAM if applicable). What Gauntlet does is instead include 8k RAM which maps into $0-$1FFF and replaces/disables the onboard PPU RAM and this is used to hold the 4-screen tile map.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 02:54:26 2021 No.7714959 and then of course the gray licensed version of the game has the 2k cartridge RAM and splits the tile map between that and the onboard RAM and uses a TTL to switch between the two.

Anonymous Mon May 3 03:26:52 2021 No.7715041
File: 6 KB, 256x224, NES_Mega_Man.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7713651
Zelda normally only has the currently active screen set up and if you go to another screen, there's a momentary pause as it's setting up the tile map. Mega Man 1 works in a somewhat similiar way, but only when going up or down. Normally the game is scrolling horizontally (it's UNROM so mirroring is hardwired to H and doesn't switch dynamically like Zelda) but if you go up or down a screen, it pauses to load the next screen into the tile map.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 03:32:39 2021 No.7715058 >>7715041 I don't know why they chose to use H mirroring in MM1 since the game is mostly scrolling horizontally, V mirroring would make more sense.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 03:48:24 2021 No.7715086 >>7714196 Maybe you should try learning the fundamentals of coding before you talk about the fantasy port of a game you intend on doing but can't, kiddo.

Anonymous Mon May 3 11:52:34 2021 No.7716117

>>7714915
>>7714948
Are you two doing one of those old-fashioned comedy duos or something?
You get some things right but some things so persistently wrong.

For the others being serious, the NES has two memory maps.

CPU space;
0000-07FF - 2KB RAM, Zero-page(CPU cache), stack and sprite data.
0800-1FFF - (is that same 2K in quadruplicate due to a few unused address pins)
2000-4FFF - System registers, scattered. CPU, PPU & hardware settings & statuses.
5000-5FFF - optional mapper regs or memory. MMC5 shares some memory with the PPU here.
6000-7FFF - SRAM, optional extra 8KB of program memory that can be battery saved, can be paged up to 2MB (but 32KB might've been the most used officially)
8000-FFFF - ROM pages, often swapped out in big chunks. Mappers often place their controls here, occasionally RAM is placed in here too.

PPU space;
0000-0FFF - tile graphics A.
1000-1FFF - tile graphics B.
Each graphics page is 256 8x8 tiles, 4KB each, both A & B are open for ROM or VRAM.
2000-23FF - Nametable page 1.
2400-27FF - NT page 2.
2800-2BFF - NT page 3.
2C00-2FFF - NT page 4
Nametables hold the placement of 32x30 background tiles as 1KB each. NES's other 2KB RAM supplies 2 nametables built-in.
3000-3F00 - wasted space, can partially mirror the nametables.
3F00-3FFF - NES color palettes, as internal memory.

So the NES has 2x 2KB chips built in, one for CPU, other for PPU nametables.

Also have to upload data to the PPU memory space indirectly by using the CPU regs at 2006 & 2007, this is slow, can take a few frames to replace all the graphics, so games usually only update tiny strips of the background at a time.

Anonymous Mon May 3 12:11:45 2021 No.7716161

>>7715058
Maybe laziness or naivety.
That did cause that annoying bane of many NES games - the broken graphics on the right or left side of the screen, which some did avoid with better methods.

I assume they assumed they'd have to do some heavy math to scroll vertically since the nametables are missing a vertical row (like modulo 30).
But seems simply updating one row up or down at a time incrementally never occurred to them.

Anonymous Mon May 3 12:24:41 2021 No.7716193

>>7716117
>Also have to upload data to the PPU memory space indirectly by using the CPU regs at 2006 & 2007, this is slow, can take a few frames to replace all the graphics

SMB2, Zelda II, and Micronics games reload the entire map at once which is why there's always a long pause when switching screens. Not a very efficient way to do it.

Anonymous Mon May 3 12:29:10 2021 No.7716197
File: 28 KB, 512x448, Double_Dragon (Technos) 1988.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Double Dragon also only ever uses H mirroring despite scrolling horizontally most of the time even though it's an MMC1 game and could use dynamic mirroring. In this case understandable since it was made by a really inexperienced team which is why it's so buggy.

Anonymous Mon May 3 12:30:20 2021 No.7716202

>>7716161
Though I should append that MM1 did use the correct mirroring.
They choose vertical because it allows a wider horizon which gets rid of the mangled left/right screen issue, but at the sacrifice of complicating vertical scrolling.
It's often the games that allowed free diagonal scrolling that would get this wrong (like SMB3).

Anonymous Mon May 3 12:37:04 2021 No.7716218

>>7716202
>It's often the games that allowed free diagonal scrolling that would get this wrong (like SMB3)
SMB3 is always just H mirroring even though it's got an ASIC mapper so they didn't have to do it that way, they could have switched directions as need be.

Anonymous Mon May 3 12:45:14 2021 No.7716248
File: 2.72 MB, 853x480, smb2_mapload.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7716193
>SMB2, Zelda II, and Micronics games reload the entire map at once which is why there's always a long pause when switching screens.
No. This is not how SMB2 works. It loads one 16px vertical or horizontal line at a time as you move through it. You couldn't "load an entire map" into VRAM nametable space, there isn't nearly enough room.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 12:47:59 2021 No.7716252 >>7716248 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFPoNZoFBXM I think what he means is the effect at 4:35

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 12:51:05 2021 No.7716264 >>7716252 No. It only loads 2 screens worth of map: That's all it possibly could load anyway.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 12:55:03 2021 No.7716278 >>7716252 i remember seeing a technical explanation for that effect on NESDev but i can't remember what it was.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 14:44:56 2021 No.7716626 the Master System and Gameboy don't have a full 2x2 tile map as the NES does likely because they were designed later and some things were better understood (the NES's setup is fairly wasteful in terms of memory use).

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 14:53:18 2021 No.7716671 >>7713945 >the iNES format will let you set 4 screen mirroring on any mapper configuration unless it explicitly conflicts with that mapper's setup I guess this would include stuff like AxROM as that's explicitly single screen mirroring.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 14:57:42 2021 No.7716686 >>7716671 yes. it should work with NROM, the common discreet mappers, and MMC1/MMC3 which covers about 80% of licensed US NES games

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 14:58:06 2021 No.7716689 >>7716671 AxROM also has PRG bankswitching. it does the entire 32KB.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 16:07:08 2021 No.7716902 Hmm well with Double Dragon it was probably same deal as MM1 where keeping the mirroring horizontal made the vertical scrolling easier. The game also really doesn't use any of the MMC1's capabilities, they only needed it so they could fit a 256k ROM.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 16:19:42 2021 No.7716941 >makes a 50 GB NES game thanks to bank swapping problem officer?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 16:23:08 2021 No.7716954 >>7716626 The Gameboy only has a partially mirrored map where it's like 4 rows of tiles are mirrored.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 16:38:35 2021 No.7717005 File: 3 KB, 256x192, 46022-mouse-trap-colecovision-screenshot-a-game-in-progress.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7714196 Mouse Trap for the Colecovision but converting the Z80 code to 6502 would suck.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 17:40:35 2021 No.7717226 almost at the end

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 17:45:04 2021 No.7717243 >>7716902 technically is 128k PRG and 128k CHR ROM

None !!i/dxk/7TJYA Mon May 3 17:46:49 2021 No.7717250
File: 9 KB, 512x448, 1620045320510.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

I figured this would be the best place, but currently I am running the third Super Mario /v/orld hack on /v/ right now, and I decided to invite people from here to contribute if they want to. The current thread is <a href="//boards.4channel.org/v/thread/554158802#p554158802" class="quotelink">>>>/v/554158802,</a> and they're made daily. I may make a thread here too if people are interested, but I wanted ro get some interest first.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 17:49:13 2021 No.7717258 >>7717243 yeah for some dumb reason they decided to add a bonus arena fighting mode to DD

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 17:51:38 2021 No.7717265 A lot of NES arcade ports weren't direct conversions but reimaginings with added content as the original was typically considered too short for a suitable home system game.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 17:52:40 2021 No.7717270 >>7716902 DD is a buggy mess due to inexperienced programmers. They didn't even include the two player co-op mode because they didn't feel up to attempting it.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 17:53:18 2021 No.7717271 >>7717250 >>7706162

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 17:58:52 2021 No.7717289 I think Renegade was the first NES game Technos released but it's not nearly as much of a hatchet job. Maybe the programming team was a different one.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 18:00:19 2021 No.7717290 i used to have Renegade but my cartridge disappeared to parts unknown

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 18:03:08 2021 No.7717296 >>7717005 I found the arcade game used a 6502. Sweet. That would make it so much easier.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 18:12:31 2021 No.7717326 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIN35Iph6rc this game looks like so much fun and it was only ported to the Colecovision/Atari 2600/Intellivision. that's too bad. it should have been on everything.

>>	None !!i/dxk/7TJYA Mon May 3 18:12:48 2021 No.7717328 >>7717271 Fair enough, though my offer still stands. I haven't used /vr/ since the rules changed, would a thread for this do well here?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 18:22:35 2021 No.7717364 >>7717326 what system you want it ported on?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 18:29:23 2021 No.7717384 >>7717364 Literally any early 80s system could do Mouse Trap but the Apple II would be my least favorite pick. IDK, I just find its aesthetic bland and I can't get behind it.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 18:33:54 2021 No.7717392 >>7717364 Atari 8-bit, VIC-20, C64, 8086 PC, NES, doesn't matter. whatever one is your favorite or you're familiar with programming.

Anonymous Mon May 3 19:12:41 2021 No.7717518

>>7717005
Big problem with this game. See the different colored doors? on the arcade you press one of three buttons to open or close the corresponding doors. while that's not an issue on computer systems which have a keyboard or the Colecovision's keypad...you see the problem with the NES controller.

Anonymous Mon May 3 19:19:21 2021 No.7717546

>>7717518
the best way around that would be to have only two door colors instead of three. that way the A and B buttons can control the doors and Select can be used to activate dog mode. on C64 or other computers you can just use the joystick button to activate dog mode and, say, press 1, 2, and 3 to open and close the doors.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 19:25:13 2021 No.7717578 Where do I find info on SG-1000/Coleco/MSX1 homebrew programming? SMS Power is all about the SMS and that has a much different VDP

Anonymous Mon May 3 19:28:01 2021 No.7717592

>>7717518
NES games would use button combos to allow more options.
Say for that you could hold a "door" button that would highlight them all, then also press a direction to select which one.
It's important to hint or highlight what buttons could possibly do since not everyone will automatically know.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 19:28:51 2021 No.7717601 >>7679658 I'd love to see Stack Attack on the Game Boy or anything else, really. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjh7mMdTulk

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 19:30:49 2021 No.7717608 >>7717578 http://colecoboxart.com/faq/FAQ05.htm That took all of two seconds.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 19:35:47 2021 No.7717620 >>7717592 I really don't like that idea at all. It would be cumbersome and really break up the flow of the game when in the arcade you'd just hit the buttons to open and close the doors instantaneously.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 19:37:01 2021 No.7717627 >>7717608 okay like, I can find some stuff sure but I just wanted to know if there was stuff that was recommended, I'm not a programmer and I can't do much with a bunch of specs

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 19:42:24 2021 No.7717640 >>7717627 Could ask on AtariAge I suppose.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 20:06:45 2021 No.7717702 >>7717326 Exidy were a small arcade outfit that unfortunately struggled to compete with the heavyweights like Atari and Bally-Midway.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 20:58:49 2021 No.7717851 >>7717392 no ZX Spectrum because the Spectrum is gay

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 21:02:02 2021 No.7717859 >>7717851 I mean the Spectrum could certainly handle Mouse Trap but a lot of us don't live in the requisite regions of the world where we have access to a real machine to test it on.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 21:13:25 2021 No.7717885 >>7717578 i want to like the Master System too bad its sound sucks so much and the graphics make everything look like a bad Flash game.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 22:43:53 2021 No.7718150 Some Saturn Homebrew: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLjWkKvpUfs

>>	Anonymous Mon May 3 23:57:55 2021 No.7718345 Mouse Trap was apparently not a major success in the arcades, it was widely dismissed as another Pac-Man clone and Exidy didn't have the name recognition of the big arcade manufacturers.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 00:20:34 2021 No.7718403 File: 11 KB, 704x480, 576587564534.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] someone on AtariAge made this mockup of the game for the A8. i guess you would have to use char mode not bitmap mode as it needs at least 5 colors.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 00:23:36 2021 No.7718410 >>7718403 the one thing I don't like about the A8 is its sprites are always in 160x200 resolution while C64 can do full 320x200 (in hi res mode) so everything looks really blocky.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 00:36:01 2021 No.7718435 >>7718403 the Atari has only 4 player sprites. that looks like it may not be enough. the cats may have to be char sprites.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 00:52:38 2021 No.7718464 >>7717546 >A=open red doors >B=open blue doors >A+B=open yellow doors That was hard.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 00:56:42 2021 No.7718473 File: 4 KB, 256x224, mouse trap.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7717005 stretched to NES resolution. lyl.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 01:06:46 2021 No.7718493 >>7718403 Yeah I noticed. There's at least six cats and then the mouse and the hawk (on those levels) are another sprite. At least something will have to be char sprites.

Anonymous Tue May 4 01:11:52 2021 No.7718505

>>7718403
>Going to the "In" box in the center of the maze teleports the player to one of the four corners of the map (drawn at random).
On the Atari no big deal as the POKEY can be used for random number generation. On the NES you'd just have to make some pseudo-RNG.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 01:28:00 2021 No.7718554 >>7718473 aw man it'd be so cool to have the barking dog sample from the arcade with the NES's PCM channel

Anonymous Tue May 4 01:28:47 2021 No.7718556
File: 104 KB, 1668x962, seachase_random.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7718505
> On the NES you'd just have to make some pseudo-RNG.
Not a big deal. I replaced POKEY's random register with a byte and a subroutine that increments the previous value, adds the controller input byte and the framecount. I run this subroutine before each read.
This is similar to the method Punch-Out uses.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 01:42:50 2021 No.7718601 >>7718505 the white noise channel. as on C64. the NES, Colecovision, etc too bad you can't use their sound chips for that as the registers are write-only.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 03:39:38 2021 No.7718918 >>7718410 Everything happens at 160x200 resolutuon on the Atari 8-bit including scrolling and sprite movement so animation is more coarse than it is on other systems.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 08:10:20 2021 No.7719392 >>7717326 That’s game actually looks fun. Reminds me of lock and chase.

Anonymous Tue May 4 12:40:46 2021 No.7720008 [DELETED]

>>7719392
yes. i vote as soon as this Sea Chase thing is done we start work on a port of it to...IDK, pick something. better to use the arcade ROM as a basis since it's 6502. the Colecovision code wouldn't be really very useful unless you wanted to make a ZX Spectrum port.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 12:47:38 2021 No.7720024 >>7720008 The A8 might be a good start since someone already made mockup graphics which saves some work. Still a C64 port would be great too and a CGA PC port, if there was any modern dev tools for that which there isn't.

Anonymous Tue May 4 12:52:00 2021 No.7720043

The arcade ROM is 48k and the Colecovision was about 12k (16k ROM not all of that space used). I guess a large part of the arcade ROM is the test/diagnostic mode and the sampled speech clips--I know for example Donkey Kong's ROM devotes 25% of its total space to just the sample of Donkey Kong grunting.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 12:53:19 2021 No.7720047 >>7720043 4k of that is the BIOS right?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 12:55:51 2021 No.7720051 >>7720047 The game ROM not of course including the Colecovision's BIOS. That did save you some coding effort and space incidentally as games could call the BIOS for certain functions and not need their own subroutines for it.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 12:59:14 2021 No.7720058 File: 18 KB, 768x720, seachase_21_5_4.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7720008 > as soon as this Sea Chase thing is done i've got other plans after that... happy to help get someone else going on a project

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 14:11:22 2021 No.7720246 I have Atari800Win on my other computer but I understand it's outdated and it can't display the artifact colors in hi res mode.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 14:21:44 2021 No.7720278 File: 126 KB, 1496x896, altirra_debug - Copy.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7720246 Altirra is nice. I haven't run it through the gauntlet or anything but it seems accurate and useful for dev.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 15:59:19 2021 No.7720628 File: 8 KB, 256x224, Ishin_No_Arashi.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Making slow progress on a translation for Ishin No Arashi. There's still much work to do.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 16:00:41 2021 No.7720637 >>7720628 This looks like Romance of the Three Kingdoms, what is it?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 16:20:02 2021 No.7720689 >>7720637 Yes it was made by Koei. An MMC5 game with both CHR ROM and RAM. This is pretty heavy stuff, it's not some rinky-dink CNROM game.

Anonymous Tue May 4 16:23:34 2021 No.7720705
File: 73 KB, 640x480, Seiken_Densetsu_3_en.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7720628
> still much work to do
ain't that always the truth... when translating a game, is it mostly text string and graphics replacement or do you have to rewrite drawing routines as well? a little bit of both?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 16:26:05 2021 No.7720710 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=laNXcsfclVg I'm not precisely sure what this game does that necessitates MMC5.

Anonymous Tue May 4 16:31:06 2021 No.7720724

>>7720637
This game is somewhat more similar to Uncharted Waters than Romance of the Three Kingdoms. It's a Koei game set in Japan during the Bakumatsu period (around 1850 until the Meiji Restoration of 1867). At that time, the country was divided into three political parties. You control a single character and roam freely around the country, debating people or dueling them. Your goal is to unify the country under a single ideology by persuading influential figures (such as the daimyo).

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 16:50:44 2021 No.7720779 https://forum.metroidconstruction.com/index.php/topic,5353.0.html There's a speedrunner holding a competition for Super Metroid hacks and is offering $3,000.

Anonymous Tue May 4 16:57:35 2021 No.7720803

how realistic is it to re-translate a game that's already been fan-translated? most of the hard work has already been done with the string replacements, right, or is there anything more complicated to do? I'm just really not happy with the Dragon Quest VI fantranslation and now that the game's officially localized script has been available for years I'm not sure why nobody has tried to complete the translation (perhaps a compromise can be made with keeping the original names). As it stands though the finished release is only 90% complete so it's been due for a revisiting for a while.

Anonymous Tue May 4 17:08:26 2021 No.7720832

>>7720803
The officially localized script is from DQVI released to DS? If so, that is shit. Modern DQ translation is shit, fuck that stupid idea of putting accent in characters and making it even hard to understand what they are saying. I can't remember which DQ it was, but as soon as I tried that and saw that accent shit, I drop it and decided to learn Japanese. Now I can play the original and understand it easily unlike trying to understand some of those retarded sentences in the localization.

Anonymous Tue May 4 17:14:30 2021 No.7720852

>>7720832
Okay, well I like it a lot and think it adds a lot of charm, sorry it wasn't for you. VI doesn't really have a lot of accents, and I like the characters who do, as they have no personality in the original. I've never found any of the characters illegible, maybe you're not a native English speaker if that's the case. However, the fantranslation is a) not finished, b) mistranslated in key scenes, c) full of grammatical mistakes and typos, d) very awkward to read and very confusing (take the scene where the king wakes up from mudo's body, it's terrible). It hasn't been updated in almost 15 years I don't think. I think a compromise should be made to have the original character names, towns, and spells, but the base of the translation needs to be overhauled and the localization is a good foundation.

Anonymous Tue May 4 17:19:37 2021 No.7720871

>>7720803
It's possible. If it's easy kinda depends on the tooling. I ended up "retranslating" FFV using information from this editor: https://github.com/everything8215/ff6tools

At least in some Square games, the text is just a huge table of strings--usually encoded in something other than ascii, though there are exceptions. The big issue is that there are often command sequences placed into the strings. Things like wait 30 frames or shake the box or whatever.

The other issue is that the game might have requirements on where the text has to be placed, bankwise or offset in bankwise. SMRPG has a complicated allocation scheme which highly depends on what id the string is. Whereas the fan translation of FFV uses full pointers.

Anyway, it's a crapshoot and you might get lucky.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 17:29:18 2021 No.7720907 >>7720852 >think it adds a lot of charm That is the same thinking that gave us Working Designs and whatever is currently badly translating jrpg and have people shitting on it on /v/.

Anonymous Tue May 4 17:31:43 2021 No.7720920

>>7718473
>>7720043
Some of that 12k will be graphics data. NES graphics are stored in the separate CHR ROM not in the main ROM as on the Colecovision. So if 2-3k consists of graphics, figure that's off-loaded to the CHR ROM. However this is more than made up for by the larger size of 6502 code. Thus if the game has 8k of Z80 code, it will probably balloon to 10k.

Anonymous Tue May 4 17:38:09 2021 No.7720954

>>7720907
>>7720832
you're obviously not a native english speaker, it's understandable you didn't get the accents (which are not really accents but basic contractions like "ain't"), I'm sorry for your experience.

>>7720871
Thanks a lot. I'm thinking it's the former example, the strings that were left untranslated actually have their pointer number in the display. The guy didn't finish his translation but he at least left his progress, and I think I can find the rest of the strings by looking up the incomplete pointers. However, it's the strings that might trigger sequences that have me worried.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 17:40:03 2021 No.7720962 >>7720920 The smallest you can declare PRG space in an iNES header is 16KB. If worse comes to worse 32KB of PRG is free with no bankswitching. That's about the least of your worries.

Anonymous Tue May 4 17:46:57 2021 No.7720990

>>7720962
NES 2.0 also has minimum size of 16k because Galaxian was the only game to have a physical ROM smaller than 16k. For the Colecovision it seems 16k was also the minimum ROM size used although not all games used all of the ROM space available, as noted above Mouse Trap was 12k with the remainder of the ROM empty.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 17:51:56 2021 No.7721006 The original Famicom release of Galaga had a 16k ROM but the North American release is 32k, but half unused. I guess by the time that was released 32k ROMs were cheap enough that they could afford to waste half of one.

Anonymous Tue May 4 17:54:28 2021 No.7721015

>>7720990
It looks like they both use $8000-$FFFF for ROM space, so that's convenient. It's nice to not have to shift hard coded stuff around too much.
For Sea Chase, i injected JSR's into places where i needed more code, which was necessary in most cases as opposed to just writing more code or using macros, because the branching instructions can only move -128 or 127 bytes from the program counter, and they were heavily used and pretty tightly packed.
Now, there is a slight performance penalty for using subroutine calls, as opposed to just writing in-ilne, but there is plenty of performance overhead and it wasn't worth rewriting a ton of code.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 17:55:46 2021 No.7721025 Sea Chase was originally an 8k game on the Atari? I believe that's been brought up before?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 17:57:50 2021 No.7721035 >>7720954 >not a native english speaker Yes, I'm not. I'd not try to learn Japanese if I had not already learned a language before. Shit is hard as fuck and unless you are crazy or enjoy it, it's hardly worth the time you spent on it.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 17:58:56 2021 No.7721037 >>7721025 Correct. It was also an EEPROM not a mask ROM as Romox had the gimmick of offering rewritable cartridges from a booth at the store similar to what was done later with the FDS.

Anonymous Tue May 4 18:06:40 2021 No.7721067

>>7721035
Well I really am proud of you for attempting to learn such a hard language, and I don't say that as a joke, but unfortunately a localization is a localization after all, the audience was assumed to be familiar with the kinds of dialogue in the game, where it's quite natural to us, and it makes the foreign-ness of foreign characters more apparent as well, though I can understand why this would be confusing to an outsider who finds even the normal dialogue to be foreign. That said, I would assume the localization is easier for an ESL person to read than going through all of the trouble to learn Japanese. The "just learn Japanese" thing is a meme. I've actually done work before in college with Latin and German translations, so I really am all in favor of people learning foreign languages, but come on, it's quite a task to just ask a random person on the internet who has no background in foreign languages. But, if you enjoy it I'm sure you'll get a big reward out of it when you can play a lot of games like this in their original form, so keep up with it.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 18:09:18 2021 No.7721076 >>7721067 Well, I'm not telling people to learn Japanese, I'm just complaining about modern translations of DQ compared to the old ones.

Anonymous Tue May 4 18:15:15 2021 No.7721096

>>7721025
Cartridges on the Atari 8-bits map into $8000-$BFFF (this game was 8k so it only went to $9FFF). NES carts map at $8000-$FFFF and you have to start from the top of memory and work your way down because the CPU vectors are at $FFFA-$FFFF. So for Sea Chase we will have set the ROM size to 16k (the minimum iNES/NES 2.0 can use) and remap it to $C000-$FFFF.

As for the Colecovision, it's a Z80 machine and the Z80 has its CPU vectors at $0-$6 rather than $FFFA-$FFFF like the 6502 does. The Colecovision's BIOS sits down there and provides the vectors (the SG-1000 has no BIOS and maps its ROM at $0-$7FFF so the game ROM must provide its own vectors).

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 18:26:54 2021 No.7721138 The Colecovision's graphics are much closer to how the NES's graphics work while the A8's are completely alien. On the other hand, completely different CPU.

Anonymous Tue May 4 18:49:17 2021 No.7721256

>>7721096
> So for Sea Chase we will have set the ROM size to 16k (the minimum iNES/NES 2.0 can use) and remap it to $C000-$FFFF.
Uh, way past you dude. I have the game running you know... >>7700108
It was in $A000-$BFFF so i kept it there. I put my own code in $8000-$9FFF. Since it's 16K those positions mirror accordingly to $C000-$FFFF.

Anonymous Tue May 4 19:22:09 2021 No.7721390
File: 1.21 MB, 853x480, seachase_nametable_structure.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7721138
> The Colecovision's graphics are much closer to how the NES's graphics work while the A8's are completely alien.
True. They are completely different in almost every way. I didn't keep any of the A8's graphics routines: Rewrote and redrew everything. That was fun...
The only thing that was helpful was the game logic that activated said graphics, i hijacked some of those routines and threw JSR's in there and wrote my own subroutines, or just used the RAM values that those routines set. Other things are rendered on powerup and stay rendered. The plan worked without any real issues.
The game board is always drawn in the second nametable from startup. I had to stack the title screen and transition screens in the first nametable. The redraws only take 2 frames, so it's all but instantaneous.

Anonymous Tue May 4 19:33:45 2021 No.7721428

>>7721390
the only other machines that work in a similar manner are the Atari 2600 and Amiga as they were designed by the same guys. even if you port it to C64 you couldn't keep any of the graphics code, it would have to be completely discarded.

>>7721256
yeah he was confused there because almost all Atari 8 bit cartridge map in $A000. the Atari 800 uniquely had 2 cartridge slots the second of which maps in $8000.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 19:52:52 2021 No.7721489 >>7721428 > the Atari 800 uniquely had 2 cartridge slots the second of which maps in $8000. Right, i'm not all that familiar with the A8bits, but wasn't a BASIC cartridge kept in the $8000-$9FFF slot most of the time?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 19:56:49 2021 No.7721509 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY3qUqWkCK0 Here's Soccer. This is a very early one from '85 but even this would be too much for the A8 to handle because it just doesn't have enough sprites (C64 can do this fairly easily with a multiplexer).

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 20:00:17 2021 No.7721523 >>7721509 those fast moving clocks always crack me up. the machines were perfectly capable of keeping (mostly) accurate time, i wonder why they did that? Even SMB's clock ticks every 40 frames instead of 60 for some reason.

Anonymous Tue May 4 20:10:29 2021 No.7721543

>>7721489
BASIC goes in $A000-$BFFF since of course it had to also work on the Atari 400 which had only one cartridge slot. There are only 14 cartridges that use the right slot and all of them are utilities not games. The right slot also only supports 8k cartridges mapped in $8000-$9FFF while the left slot supports any combination up to 16k and it can map at either $8000 or $A000.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 20:17:27 2021 No.7721567 >>7721509 You can multiplex A8 sprites horizontally (as you could later on the Amiga) but not vertically.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 20:26:56 2021 No.7721593 >>7721567 > but not vertically mmmmm yeah, but, the "sprite" is 200px tall and takes up every vertical scanline. A better way to think about it is you can have 4 sprites 8px wide per scanline: It's up to you to multiplex that.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 20:29:34 2021 No.7721595 Did all the necessary RE/programming work for a translation, got through about 30% of the text, but now my motivation has completely died. I don’t know how people can stayed focused on a single project for many months.

Anonymous Tue May 4 20:38:08 2021 No.7721617
File: 184 KB, 435x298, goldeneye_face - Copy.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7721595
> I don’t know how people can stayed focused on a single project for many months.
Most don't. That's the real struggle. Once the "fun" part is done of solving technical challenges and realizing your dream is achievable, grinding through the rest of the project, mindless hex slogging, fixing bugs, and polishing the end result is grueling.
Take a week off or two and do something fun. There is no magic: ya just gotta fuckin do it. gl hf

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 21:58:57 2021 No.7721898 >>7721595 >I don’t know how people can stayed focused on a single project for many months my problem is i have so many ideas I can't stay focused on just one, i keep wanting to try something else

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 22:49:34 2021 No.7722008 romhacking.com have you guys seen this yet? simpleflips made a romhack database for every single sm64 hack and is planning on expanding to all games.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 22:57:29 2021 No.7722032 >>7722008 romhacking.net is gonna flip

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 22:58:42 2021 No.7722036 >>7722032 he's apparently owned the domain for years

>>	Anonymous Tue May 4 23:25:27 2021 No.7722141 >>7722008 > romhacking.com that's a hilarious dick move. shoutouts to simpleflips

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 00:56:47 2021 No.7722361 >>7721509 you might try XORed bitmaps like Donkey Kong uses

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 01:21:11 2021 No.7722428 I know the A8 port of Gauntlet is in bitmap mode because the 128 char limit was insufficient for the game, however there is somewhat of a performance penalty in using bitmaps.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 03:00:32 2021 No.7722591 >>7722361 I think it's a fairly even split between char mode and bitmap in A8 games while about 75% of C64 games use multicolor char mode.

Anonymous Wed May 5 05:08:12 2021 No.7722828
File: 2.17 MB, 853x480, seachase_21_5_5.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7700108
Mines now have hitboxes. They are very accurate. Circles are tough too. Through the wonders of mathemagic you can test for one mine and be testing for all mines. That was fun.
The mines also bob up and down subtly in the water, and yes, that does affect the hitbox. Properly.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 15:30:10 2021 No.7724314 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyfleYvj4Ro

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 19:07:16 2021 No.7724976 Anyone got any recs on good gb homebrew? I’m thinking about making one because I assume it’d be easier than most other consoles, and I wanna see what other people are capable of on the system

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 19:11:42 2021 No.7724989 >>7724976 start here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tn1rFUutkdo

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 21:25:26 2021 No.7725372 I wanted to try some Donkey Kong Country romhacks (1, 2 or 3), but couldn't find any in the recommended lists of the first post, so I guess I'll go and try whatever I can find. In the meantime, do any of you have any personal recommendation?

Anonymous Wed May 5 21:34:35 2021 No.7725390
File: 10 KB, 512x448, 5895069078998689.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Cool idea for a NES ROM hack. Expand Lode Runner to include all 150 levels from the original computer game--it had only 50 due to the space limitations of a 16k ROM but if expanded to 32k you could fit many more levels.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 21:36:48 2021 No.7725397 https://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/PPU_registers#Color_Control >grayscale and color tint I only know of two games that use this, Kirby's Adventure does in one level and I think the intermission screens in Double Dragon?

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 21:49:43 2021 No.7725443 >>7720962 >If worse comes to worse 32KB of PRG is free with no bankswitching Then again you still have only one graphics set without banking and that can be filled up fast; SMB relied on some very creative graphics reuse to get away with one set.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 5 23:07:05 2021 No.7725697 >>7725443 Mouse Trap won't even begin to fill the sprite or background tables with the default 8K. That is the least of your worries.

Anonymous Wed May 5 23:12:49 2021 No.7725719
File: 88 KB, 1139x795, kirbys_adv_classic.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7725397
> Kirby's Adventure does in one level
I thought so too, but it actually doesn't. It just uses black and white palettes in normal mode. Kirby is pink.
There is some game that uses it for a lightning effect, but, i forget what it is.

Anonymous Wed May 5 23:43:06 2021 No.7725806
File: 202 KB, 1291x1014, mouse_trap_coleco.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7717005
> Mouse Trap
Since everyone seems to hot on it, i did a bit of digging. There is an emulator called MEKA with some nice debugging tools. The graphics are 1BPP and show up in YY-CHR. I've got my own shit to do, but, if anyone wants to pick this up i'd be happy to walk you through it.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 00:13:29 2021 No.7725875 >>7725806 the issue in this case is more the CPU than the graphics but the arcade game was 6502, that could be used instead.

Anonymous Thu May 6 00:16:44 2021 No.7725880

>>7725806
Given the address range, I'd suppose that code is the Colecovision BIOS not the game. Also as can clearly be seen, Z80 code is much more like x86 code than 6502 code and a lot of the early software for the IBM PC was Z80 ports as this was simple to do (WordStar was apparently ported to the x86 in one all-night coding session).

Anonymous Thu May 6 00:19:39 2021 No.7725891 [DELETED]

>>7725875
> the issue in this case is more the CPU than the graphics
100%. The process would go something like this: Step through the Z80 code, figure out what it does, and label it. Once you've done enough of that, convert the instructions to 6502. If anyone makes it even near that far i can kick in on the NES part.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 00:29:14 2021 No.7725910 >>7725880 The biggest headache, definitely 16-bit arithmetic as trying do do that on a 6502 is not very nice.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 00:36:02 2021 No.7725919 >>7725910 > 16-bit arithmetic as trying do do that on a 6502 is not very nice. It's not so bad. You just use the carry flag.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 00:41:24 2021 No.7725930 >>7725719 I seem to remember Kirby does a trick where PPU rendering is turned off in order to switch in a different graphics set for the status bar.

Anonymous Thu May 6 01:07:33 2021 No.7725972
File: 124 KB, 1826x793, kirbys_adv_status_bar.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7725930
Not quite: It never shuts off the PPU. It times the necessary writes in hBlank: when the screen isn't drawing between scanlines.
At scanline 175, the MMC3 scanline IRQ is triggered, it waits until right before the next hBlank, switches the CHR banks, and then in hBlank repositions the PPU to start drawing the top of the menu.
Switching the graphics bank doesn't require an idle PPU, but repositioning the "camera" does. God coder Iwata don't shut off no PPU =)

Anonymous Thu May 6 01:55:13 2021 No.7726067

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVkIJ95A4uE

Grand Master. Neat ARPG that got little attention since it was so late in the Famicom's lifespan and it was made by a small dev not one of the big names. I am told the final palace had a bug where if you fall into a pit it crashes the game and freezes up. Dunno if anyone's ever patched the ROM to fix this or what exactly causes this bug.

Anonymous Thu May 6 03:53:10 2021 No.7726274 [DELETED]

>>7725875
this would be cake to make a ZX Spectrum port except most of us don't have access to a real machine to test it with (not even sure if the Zniggy guy tested the game on a real Spectrum) same CPU nearly same graphics, the sound is a lot different and you'd have to lose a lot of it since its speaker can't run independent of the CPU.

Anonymous Thu May 6 03:55:44 2021 No.7726280

>>7725806
this would be cake to make a ZX Spectrum port except most of us don't have access to a real machine to test it with (not even sure if the Zniggy guy tested the game on a real Spectrum) same CPU nearly same graphics, the sound is a lot different and you'd have to lose a lot of it since its speaker can't run independent of the CPU.

Anonymous Thu May 6 04:12:27 2021 No.7726306

hell we could do a NES, an Atari 8-bit, a C64, maybe a VIC-20 or ZX Spectrum port. not the Apple II though. that's a machine I just can't get excited over. i don't care if someone wants to do it but i don't feel the world would miss out on anything from not having an Apple II port of the game. besides i don't think there's any modern dev tools for it anyway.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 15:40:11 2021 No.7727783 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZsWqOuJFKI

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 16:04:24 2021 No.7727870 Has anyone tried porting game mechanics from New Super Mario Bros. for SMB 1, 2 or 3? Like wall jump, breaking blocks on drop, enemies dropping coins etc

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 16:09:47 2021 No.7727894 File: 6 KB, 256x224, super_orb_bros.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7727870 Super Orb Bros has done some of that. It's a kaizo hack though.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 16:58:55 2021 No.7728036 >>7727894 >It's a kaizo hack though Aw, that sucks, gonna look it up though.Thanks!

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 17:09:29 2021 No.7728061 >>7728036 From what i remember, you can bounce midair on shells, throw them upward, and it has some other mechanics from later games.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 6 23:35:37 2021 No.7729280 >>7728061 I see, looks like the guy went all out with the hacking

>>	Anonymous Fri May 7 00:55:22 2021 No.7729460 File: 19 KB, 764x720, mario_paper_sai.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] new thread i guess... >>7727686 >>7727686 >>7727686

Anonymous Fri May 7 01:00:37 2021 No.7729475
File: 514 B, 120x124, PissedOffStar.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7729280
he really went all out, the changes feel and play great. i'd love to see a more vanilla hack with those changes. i ain't got time to die a million fuckin times to frame perfect bullshit my speedtranny days are long behind me

>>	Anonymous Fri May 7 08:47:27 2021 No.7730216 >>7729475 Yeah, from your description it did sound like stuff for speedrunners that have the game completely figured out.

>>	Anonymous Thu Aug 26 02:05:56 2021 No.7730216,1 >>7721617 Hence so

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/vr/ - Retro Games