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/vr/ - Retro Games

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749607 No.749607 [Reply] [Original]

Well this game was average.

>> No.749608

You're kidding, right?

>> No.749614

>>749608
Nope.
Predictable story.
Uninteresting characters.
Less than stellar gameplay.

Not sure what's so great about it.

>> No.749618

I thought it just plain sucked.

>> No.749625

>>749618
I agree with this guy

>> No.749627

>>749614
What one JRPG do you consider superior?

>> No.749628

i wish i could post a reaction image but wiiu
anyways opinions

>> No.749630

>>749614
>Predictable story
Yep. Especially that Zeal part.
Seriously? Floating islands with a magically-advanced civilization on it? Totally. Called. It!

>Uninteresting characters
That bugged me too, that "Crono" guy, not talking and shit. Maybe he's the father of the Pokemon protagonist?

>Less than stellar gameplay
I totally understand what you mean by that, what bugged you, what was good and what was bad,...

Seriously-er.

Some people loved the story...
Some people loved the characters...
Some people loved the gameplay...

>> No.749665

>>749627
Chrono Cross
Xeogears
Dark Chronicle
Disgea
FF7
DQ5
Persona 4
Nocturne
Valkerie Profile 1 and 3
Vagrant Story
FF tactics
Tactics Ogre
Radiant Historia
Sakura Wars 1 and 3


Lots of games really

>> No.749673

>>749618
>>749625
I agree with these two troublemakers, but then again I think most traditional turn based jrpgs are sleep inducing garbage.
Seriously, shit's the gaming equivalent of working on an assembly line.

>> No.749675
File: 1.08 MB, 380x248, 1364387162974.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
749675

>this entire thread and every one like it

>> No.749679

>>749675
>>749630
>>749608


>NO OPINIONS
>NO FREETHINKING!

What is this Brave New World?

>> No.749680

>>749665
In this case you're wrong.

Being a JRPG, Chrono Trigger is flawed, and even it's writing is imperfect, but it's easily superior to every game on the list.

Also, Vagrant Story is a dungeon crawler, and FFT and OB are japanese TBS games, as are Sakura Wars and, obviously, Disgaea.

>> No.749684

>>749679
More like people can't into differentiate between personal opinion and anything else.

>> No.749685

>>749679
Nobody says OP shouldn't have an opinion. He's being told that his opinion is a poor one.

He can keep it. He thinks that Xenogears has better gameplay than Chrono Trigger, while Xenogears doesn't even have gameplay for the absolute majority of it's length.

>> No.749687

>>749685
He also doesn't even know what a JRPG is. He thinks Sakura Taisen is one. It's like saying that Sonic The Hedgehog is a racing game.

>> No.749690

>>749685
Let's face it, the battles in Chrono Trigger are the usual, tedious "use fire sword on ice demon" nonsense anyway. Even the combination attacks don't add anything since they take zero effort to execute effectively.

>> No.749692

>>749690
It's all true. Except no JRPG on the >>749665 list is any better.

Compared to games with actual gameplay, Chrono Trigger is inferior, but compared to other JRPGs it's still one of the best.

>> No.749694

>>749685
There's no such thing as a poor opinion, that's part of the problem.
Sitting outside of opinions, CT is an "ok" game. Its gameplay wasn't anything interesting or original, its story was a bit above the curve as far as video games go, sure, but outside of games, it's pretty basic. The characters fit general archtypes, the flow of things is predictable.

Overall, it's slightly above average, and is objectively worse or, in the very least, not that much better than many other RPG's.

>> No.749696

>>749614
To be fair you have to take context into account when making these points. Back then the story would not have been predictable, and you wouldn't have seen these same characters a million times before.

>> No.749702
File: 74 KB, 640x640, sonic-all-stars-racing-transformed-wii-u.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
749702

>>749687

>> No.749703

>>749694
>There's no such thing as a poor opinion, that's part of the problem.

>Sitting outside of opinions, CT is an "ok" game. Its gameplay wasn't anything interesting or original
Ha ha, I just... gentlemen, look at this.

>> No.749705

>>749702
This is not "Sonic The Hedgehog". It's a completely different video game. Are you mentally impaired?

>> No.749707

>>749696
Yeah well I never see you guys make that argument for FF7 or anything else which was made like a year after

>> No.749709

>>749696

One advantage chrono trigger had at the time was that most jrpgs didn't get localized in the west. But we pretending that other rpgs didn't come before and after it that used some of the same tropes and plot points doesn't make the game any better.
It just means there is not much to CT other than nostalgia value.

>> No.749712

>>749705
He looks like a Hedgehog to me you autistic faggot

>> No.749713

>>749712
You actually think you're trolling someone, don't you, junior?

>> No.749716

YEAH WELL CHRONO TRIGGER HAS 24 BILLION ENDINGS!

OH WAIT NO IT DOESN'T IT HAS 2!

>> No.749714

>>749703
As I said, opinions aside. Purely comparing it to other things.

Comparing CT to other RPG's, the gameplay is average.
Comparing CT to other RPG's, the characters are average.
Comparing CT to other RPG's, the story is more interesting, but compared to other mediums, it's not that interesting.
Comparing CT as a whole to other RPG's, it's a bit above the curve, and at that point it comes down to opinion, as it would boil down to personal taste.

It's an alright game, I liked it, and I believe it's a solid entry in a retro line-up.

>> No.749718

>>749713
Listen kid you got caught out and now you're trying to save face cute

>> No.749719

>>749709
>One advantage chrono trigger had at the time was that most jrpgs didn't get localized in the west.
Another was a unique story that combined elements from numerous subgenres, a fine twist on ATB-type menu-based gameplay (you may want to choose to wait for other characters to get ready to perform special attacks), great graphics and an amazing soundtrack.

>> No.749720

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_games_containing_time_travel#Time_travel_as_a_gameplay_element
>The game contains various modes of time travel transport at the player's free will, including portals called "Gates" and, later in gameplay, a flying time machine called the "Epoch".

Had to buy the port for DS, because there are not many games which actually have that kind of freedom concerning time traveling.

>> No.749721

>>749714
All baseless speculation, but thanks for trying.

Also, don't use the apostrophe to pluralize.

>> No.749724

>>749718
Bud daddy you said we won't get caught, ever.

>> No.749725
File: 65 KB, 494x605, 1354138752042.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
749725

>Alright time to play Chrono Trigger after the years of hype this is gonna be good
>5 hours later
>Well this is shit the story is generic tripe and the characters uninteresting plus every battle is heavily scripted not what I was told at all
>Take out put in FF7
>Ah a good game

>> No.749728

>>749720
It wans't original enough for OP, though.

But Xenogears was.

>> No.749731

>>749728
Xeogears is a masterpiece with a fantastic story and characters!

>> No.749734

>>749721
>baseless speculation
Either give up trying to defend the chastity if your cherished gem or learn something or two.
I never called any of it bad, and yet you're recoiling like I'm bashing it as a terrible game, which to re-iterate, I am not.

It's simply not the holy fucking grail of RPG's like you people want to make it out to be.

>> No.749737

>>749607
Chrono Shitter more like

>> No.749740

>>749734
I don't know what you're talking about. Your post is a baseless list, regardless of what I personally think about it.

Instead of the promised opinion-free fact listing, it was 100% opinion.

>> No.749739

>>749719

As I said, at the time that's what made it stand out. With the knowledge we have now, we know it's not that special. Unless you treat it like it exists in some sort of vacuum, apart from other rpgs, it just isn't that great.

>> No.749746

>>749725
It's hilarious. Especially considering that square RPGs are basically the cowadoody of role playing games.

>> No.749748

>>749728
Well, I fap to all games which have the New Game+ feature...

>> No.749753

>>749739
>As I said, at the time that's what made it stand out. With the knowledge we have now, we know it's not that special.

with this logic we could say that any retro game is nothing special.

>> No.749750

>>749740
Nigga, his comparison is way more objective and carries more weight than anything you posted.

>> No.749752

>>749740
No, it was simply contrary to your own opinion.

>> No.749754

>>749739
>As I said, at the time that's what made it stand out
That's copletely irrelevant, though.

>With the knowledge we have now, we know it's not that special.
We know that it is.

>> No.749756

>>749752
You promised that it wouldn't be an opinion at all, though.

>> No.749757

>Chrono Trigger is one of the most overrated games of all time, it is mediocre in every way
>FFVI is a mid tier FF game at best, it's riddled with issues
>Suikoden II is a mediocre entry in a mediocre series
>Xenogears is just plain bad
>Dragon Quest V and VIII are low tier DQ games
It really seems like the only people that agree with my opinions are the people that have actually played more than a handful of JRPGs. It seems the same games keep getting hyped up and shit because people don't want to leave their comfort zone of hyped up games, so they never play the better stuff, but are still quick to praise the only games they bother playing.

>> No.749758

>>749756
Fact can be contrary to opinion.
Seriously, how dense are you?

>> No.749762

>>749757
Wait, you're expecting people to play anything other than the more popular things? They wouldn't be able to fit in that way!

>> No.749760

>>749737
Chrono Tricker that tricks people into thinking this game is good.

>> No.749761

>>749753
Not unless you have a very shallow knowledge of old games. A lot of them are still the benchmark by which modern games are judged. Stuff like Alpha Centauri and Quake are still among the best games of their kind in terms of craftsmanship, if not in terms of presentation.

>> No.749765

>>749758
The facts are contrary to your opinion from that post, yes.

>> No.749769

>>749757
post some god-tier jrpgs then, i never really got into them, both chrono trigger and FFVI and VII were pretty boring to me

>> No.749770

>>749765
You're like trying to talk with a goldfish. Have fun with your holy grail and "oh my god my opinions are the only ones that matter" mentality.
No one else is gonna be involved.

>> No.749772

>>749746

I don't like JRPGs.
I do, however, like Chrono Trigger.
It's more like a JRPG for people who don't generally like JRPGs much.

>> No.749773

So fucking mediocre in nearly every aspect.

Story? HA. The second they shat out the OMG TIME TRAVEL it was obvious that you'd go to LE MIDDLE AGES, LE PREHISTORIC PAST, LE MYSTERIOUS ADVANCED CIVILIZATION PAST and LE FUTURE THAT NEEDS TO BE AVOIDED. Time travel was used in a way that made everything just a fetch quest WITH A RETARDED TWIST.

Characters? Fucking turnip from CC has more character than the whole party combined. Lucca gets lucky because she gets some off-screen development in CC, but that hardly counts.

Gameplay? Oh wow, glorified ATB, color me impressed.

The graphics were okay, albeit a bit too washed out. Didn't like the sprites much. The only music that's somewhat memorable sounds like lifted from SoM.

>> No.749778

>>749772
That would be stuff like Azure Dreams and Fushigi no Dungeon. CT has the same tedious battle system and whimsical fantasy plot as a dozen other games. Nothing about it stands out except for the presentation.

>> No.749781

>>749769
What jrpgs weren't boring to you? Maybe the genre just isn't for you.

>> No.749789

>>749778

It isn't as tedious as most JRPGs.
The ATB system, while somewhat poorly executed, makes the game feel a lot more natural and less like a game of chess.

>> No.749804

>>749789
Most battles were still just about mashing one button to get them over with as fast as possible and it's not like you're ever under pressure anyway since the menus aren't hard to navigate.

>> No.749810

>>749781
i didn't really played many of them, but i liked indie and underground jrpgs, like Laxius Power.

>> No.749813

I guess no one here can express their opinion without acting like whiny, immature faggots. This goes for both sides. Go back to /v/ if you can't and won't grow up.

>> No.749825
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749825

>I- I just came here... t- to tell you that I didn't really like this g- game you like
>confirmed replies

Well done, OP. Good thing you picked something obvious as Chrono Trigger.

>> No.749852
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749852

>all of CT is just a setup for the true Chrono game
>the entitiy doesn't exist
>Lavos made the portals
>Crono and fags have been manipulated to enable the birth of the Dream Devourer by Lavos

>> No.749857

>>749810
What did you like about them?

>> No.749873

>>749804

isn't that like, every JRPG ever

I appreciated the fact they didn't unnecessarily drag out battles.

>> No.749884

>>749679
Don't cry wolf.

First argument was "Dude, some parts are not predictable by a majority of people. If you saw Zeal coming, good job."

Second argument was for fun. A lot of RPGs got "uninteresting characters" and are still good RPGs (ie: Pokemon). But this is still a matter of TASTE. To me, except Crono (who was blank as fuck), they are all developed in their own way.

Third argument was because you don't mean shit. What IS gameplay? Walk in places, fight monsters, overworld and items management. That's standard JRPG stuff here. Plus it's got nice additions: enemies on map, combat is on map, dual/triple techs,... But if you don't say what you didn't like about gameplay, this just feels like random bashing to me.

>> No.749890

>>749679
Though, seeing your list of JRPGs you like, there is one true thing: Chrono Trigger lacks depth when you compare it to Xenogears or FF7.

>> No.749894
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749894

>> No.749892

>>749716
Thirteen or twelve with the DS one.

>> No.749898
File: 617 KB, 1024x1511, schala_wg_comic_commission_pt2_by_theamericandream-d4bqmfz.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
749898

>> No.749902
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749902

>> No.749909

>>749894
>>749898
>>749902

why did someone make this.

>> No.749958

>>749734
But he's right though; all you really said was 'compared to things, it's _____' with no real substance or elaboration on what fits it in these catagories. Then in the story bit you get into an opinion (which is understandable, as storytelling is extremely subjective by nature) as well as your last bit essentially just being the general statement that it is just a subjective thing in the first place; at that point, why are we even trying to claim any sort of objective discussion in the first place?

He was a dumb faggot or one too lazy/privilaged to bother explaining himself, but he was right. That said, I wouldn't mind hearing what you have to say about how average it is compared to other RPGs; in my experience, while it's not something I'd go and pick up again at this moment, it is in some ways different from a lot of RPGs, especially ones out during its time.

>> No.749980

>>749958
To add, for clarity: Just because you make a statement doesn't often make it a factual statement without some context to back it up. I could tell someone 2+2=4, but without a lecture or previously established mutual understanding of mathematics I could just as well be telling them the sky is red, from their perspective.

>> No.749991

I really enjoyed Chrono Trigger for its characters, atmosphere and time travel story.
It's just such a charming game. I love the scenery, the music and the party banter.
This one scene where Lucca goes back to the past and tries to save her mother made me cry. You can really imagine what she felt in this situation.
There's a couple more scenes like this in the game that I found really touching. It's very rare for a game to succeed in connecting to the player on an emotional level.

I understand that people didn't like the gameplay. I personally hate ATB. Either make it real turn-based or real real-time combat, ATB systems just take the worst of the two worlds without adding anything worthwhile. One of the few games that did ATB right is Grandia.
The game is also too easy for the amount of battles it throws at the player. Encounters just get really repetitive.

Charm and soul, those are the redeeming qualities of this game.
This isn't nostalgia speaking by the way, we didn't have the game in Europe. The first time I played it was with 18 years.

>> No.751618

>>749607
Your mom was pretty average in bed last night

>> No.751621

>>751618
#rekt

>> No.751661

>>751618
#shotsfired

>> No.751664

This is like the 5th thread bashing this game just this week. I know it's flawed and overrated, but geez, I thought the playstation FFs were way worse in that sense.

>> No.751668

>>751664
It's just the one guy making the threads.

>> No.751670

>>749852
>the true Chrono game

Yes, Radical Dreamers.

>> No.751681

>>751670

Radical Dreamers was a god-awful VN, it wasn't even a game, let alone a good one.

And it had less to do with CT than Cross.

>> No.751725

>>751664
Chrono Trigger is one of the games /vr/ loves to make hate threads for, alongside Earthbound, Final Fantasy 6 and Final Fantasy 7
We get these threads almost daily and people fall for them every single time.

>> No.751727

>>749607
Well this thread is hidden

>> No.751742

>>749679
>>749685
I think it's more that OP has basically stated the game was average, which in itself is seemingly an attempt at an objective statement, as if opinion has nothing to do with it. Then states why they thing so, only to have someone counter those statements. So it's silly to act as if a counter argument is some kind of attempt at dismissing, or even oppressing, a different opinion rather than just an attempt to get some worthwhile discussion going and to bring up some actual reasons why the poster thinks OP doesn't really have a strong standing in their statements.

Basically, and in short, this is just a shitty troll.

>> No.751757

>>749750
His comparison is literally just a list of conclusions with no observations or evidence to support his supposed argument.

>> No.751786

>>749770
Different person. Can I ask if you're serious? Your attempts to claim the game is average is filled with conclusions with no real attempt to explain why.

>Comparing CT to other RPG's, the gameplay is average.
>Comparing CT to other RPG's, the characters are average.
>Comparing CT to other RPG's, the story is more interesting, but compared to other mediums, it's not that interesting.
>Comparing CT as a whole to other RPG's, it's a bit above the curve, and at that point it comes down to opinion, as it would boil down to personal taste.

There is no evidence provided in any of your posts that even suggests you think any of this is anything, but obvious. However, many people have disagreed with you, and your only solution is to, in the same argument, claim that they are incapable of seeing their opinion as anything, but fact and continuing on to claim that what you state isn't actually opinion, but fact. Which is quite hilarious considering you've provided literally no evidence to uphold your claims.

Is it that your discussion is because your attempts are to troll or because you're actually deluded enough to think that the incredibly little information you provided is even close to acceptable as evidence towards proving your opinion as the supposed fact that you claim it is?

Honestly, your insults to the posts disagreeing with me cause me to lean toward the former as such statements cause me to believe your intent is to stir up negative feelings and upset the poster. Whereas if you were just self absorbed and deluded you would actually make an attempt to provide actual evidence. Unless of course you're also incredibly unintelligent, but I'm not assuming that.

>> No.751793

I'd rather suck a dick than touch that shitty game again

>> No.751801
File: 69 KB, 250x272, 1320790549633.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
751801

>>749665
>Chrono Cross

>> No.751808

>>751801
Aptly chosen image, elementary school kid.

>> No.751820

Cross is objectively better than Trigger.

>> No.751825
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751825

>>751808

>> No.751828
File: 226 KB, 310x327, welcome to it.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
751828

Well, that's just, like, your opinion man.

>> No.751856
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751856

>>751820

Ice cream is objectively better than brownies. GO AHEAD PROVE ME WRONG

>> No.751868

>>751856
Are you trying to prove a point or something? You're both right, CC is the better game and icecream is superior too.

>> No.751886

>>751868

I mainly wanted to use that reaction image.

>Not eating brownie ice cream

>> No.751920

>>751856
I tried to make pot ice cream once, it was awful.

Brownies rule.

>> No.751921
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751921

>>751886
They... they make that?

>> No.751928

>>751921

Mostly in specialist places like Coldstone, but yes.

>> No.752160

>>749746
>square RPGs are basically the cowadoody of role playing games.
How so?

>> No.752278

>>749746
>x are the y of z

Please stop.

>> No.752296

>>752160
>>square RPGs are basically the cowadoody of role playing games.
>How so?
teenagers talking to teenagers

>> No.752329

>>752296
Well that is a silly way to relate it to Call of Duty.

>> No.752409

This also isnt /v/. Take your edge somewhere else.

>> No.752910

>>749958
>>749980
>>751786
To try and clarify; my stance comes from comparing it to other RPG's at the time. SoM, SD3, SoE, all the FF's, BoF, DQ, SO, PHS, Actraiser, and even some early PS1 titles like ATL.

There's really nothing to compare CT favorably to when it comes to comparing individual parts to each of these games. Compared to FF5, SO, and ATL, the characters in CT are not as fleshed out and not as interesting.
You have the mute protag, you have the noble lady character, you have the inventor and something that may as well be her invention, you have the solemn mage dude, you have the stoic knight, and you have the amazoness technically cavewoman, but the characterization is the same. These are all very well-established and common characters, especially in RPG's. There's no breaking ground here.

On the gameplay: All it is is the common JRPG turnbased system, but with the people moving around a bit. Sure, you have the ATB active battle system but that's nothing new. Games did it before CT, and games have done it after. It's better than the standard, sure, but again it's nothing special. Outside of combat, you have a world map, and you have areas, and you have dungeons. Standard RPG fare.

Now, the story, which I shall continue in a second post because it has gone over the character limit.

>> No.752931

>>752910
The story, while original for a JRPG, was far from original in a storytelling sense, and honestly failed to live up to its full potential. With any time traveling anything, there should be major concequences for fucking around in time. CT has very little of this outside of killing the final boss and saving the world. A world which we hardly see so we feel very little impact for saving.
In good storytelling, the narration should connect us to people and places. Make us care for them.

We don't even get to see the era we save. Sure, we see the aftermath, but that's a moot point because it doesn't happen after you kill Lavos. We don't actually experience the "modern" world, which is what Lavos destroys. This is a huge potential chunk of storytelling and gameplay that's completely left out.

Plus, again, there was a lot of things missing to make it a good time traveling story. There was no messing up the timelines, there was very little impact in later periods from what you did. This MAY be able to be attributed to lack of space for the game on the cartridge, but I highly doubt it.

Continued-

>> No.752946

This thread is so /v/ it is painful

>> No.752951
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752951

>>752931
Those are the key components to the game. Gameplay, story, characters. These are the top 3 in most games, but most notably in RPG's. Sure the music is awesome, sure it has a nice aesthetic, but these are far seconds to the major three, and having explored the three what are we left with? Standard gameplay, standard characters, and an original but mediocre story.

To compare to other games, FF does much better on the type of gameplay. Outside of running into things on the map, it simply has more things to do, more depth, and is more fleshed out, whereas CT, the actual components to the gameplay are pretty standard and pretty light in content. To compare to other types of gameplay and this is getting into opinion I think that non-turnbased is better, in the case of SoM, SD3, etc.
The characters are dead average with other RPG's. One problem is that many other RPG's of the time have the same cutouts, the same tropes, and the same general type of characters. But since CT follows suit, that makes it just like them; AKA average.
The story is hard to compare without sounding like pure opinion. But from a huge time travel fan, my honest and well-educated opinion is that it's original for a game, but not well-done.

I feel like I'm going in circles, so I'll stop here. Hopefully, this rant makes sense to people, and they don't just start screaming "OPINIONS OPINIONS"

>> No.752957

I replay CT because the characters don't annoy me, the twists are fun, and I like how it doesn't have random encounters which would be a huge turn off otherwise.

>> No.752962

>>752910
>>752931
>>752951
Also, this all being said, I like the game. I personally think it has its own un-explainable charm to it, and well deserves to be in any list for most notable RPG's, but that doesn't change it from being barely above average. To put a number to it: 6/10

>> No.754154

>>752910
>>752931
>>752951
>>752962
Now THAT is a great opinion I would love to hear more often.

The characters are not fleshed out at all. I said it earlier: they lack DEPTH. Crono is just a blank page, everyone else lives his (back)story,... It's even more visible when you compare it to other great RPGs of the time (though I'm pretty sure I could list some popular "great RPGs" of the era where characters where particularly empty...)

For the story, the consequences for fucking up the timeline are visited in Lucca's mom's quest and in some other parts. And there ARE consequences. Did you get the reptite end? The ending where you kill Lavos out of existence before he removes Reptites from the face of the earth) It's treated in light-hearted tone but it's still a consequence: good job removing the human race from the face of the Earth hero!

Now for not seeing 1999, I appreciate that. I'm always frustrated by big areas being pictured in the game by maps that don't give justice to the size of the town. (Visit it in the Crimson Echoes hack and you'll see how horrible it is).

>> No.754173

>>754154
I don't count endings. And really, there's a lot they did not explore in the incredibly wide range of possibilities in the realm of time travel.
Seeing 1999 I can understand in a certain light, but I think that in this scenario it would make more sense to have had the party go through some small areas before getting to Lavos and fighting him there. To see the impending destruction, and to get hints of civilization at the time before facing Lavos.

But that's a minor thing, really.