/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.6617117]

someone redpill me on these games. Apparently you can kill YVWH?

[Anonymous No.6617125]

The Shin Megami Tensei games are a fast way to learn how not to make friends and lose all your current ones. The fans are all creepy weirdos obsessed with a series of games they often describe as pokemon but serious and about demons and god. The kind of thing the potential school shooter kid gets way too into. Kinda like Madden.

[Anonymous No.6617128]

>>6617117
Grimdark Pokemon that you can kill your friends and all sorts of mythological beings, Abrahamic god included.

[Anonymous No.6617137]

If you've played one you've played 'em all.
Ditch that bullshit and play Maken X on Dreamcast

[Anonymous No.6617361]

>>6617117
1 is busted but interesting. 2 is a really great early gen dungeon crawler with a cool story. Yes, you kill the Jewish god in 2.(not Christian since Jesus is never in these games as a character).

[Anonymous No.6617363]

>>6617125
>>6617137
/vr/ is butthurt about SMT now? Why?

[Anonymous No.6617370]

>>6617125
Ahhh, now THIS is schizo posting.

[Anonymous No.6617479]

>>6617361
>kill the Jewish god in 2.(not Christian
but isn't he the christian god nowadays?

[Anonymous No.6617489]

>>6617479
No, kinda sorta. God in SMT is very much JUST the old testament god and has a lot of Jewish symbolism and lore around him that Christians ditched. He even uses the old jewish name for God instead of just calling himself like God or something.

[Anonymous No.6617639]

>>6617137
Not really true, and Maken X kind of sucks. The controls are a nightmare.
>>6617479
Technically the same; the Christian "Jehova" is a corruption/forced pronunciation of YHVH — the true pronunciation has been lost. Jews use the word "Hashem", which means "The Name". Christians and Jews technically worship the same God, but the God in SMT is very much the Old Testament / Torah God, who behaves quite differently from the one in the New Testament. And as >>6617489 said, lots of Jewish mysticism in SMT; the Tetragrammaton, tree of life, many demons, etc. For whatever reason Jewish mysticism is often depicted as the "exotic magic" in a lot of Japanese media, which is why you'll often see the star-of-david in lots of other Famicom-era games as a sign of magic, etc.

[Anonymous No.6618343]

>>6617125
What the fuck are you talking about?

[Anonymous No.6618672]

>>6617363
I've only seen one autist hate it because it dares let you be meany mean to God and Americans.

[Anonymous No.6618675]

>>6617125
Die.

[Anonymous No.6618693]

>>6617125
>>6618672
>>6617363
>>6617370
>>6618343
>>6618675
None of you got it

[Anonymous No.6618694]

>>6617125
>games they often describe as pokemon but serious
People only describe it that way when talking to new people unfamiliar with the series, because Pokemon has grown to monopolize the concept of catching monsters and making them fight for you.
After that, the connection is forgotten, which sucks because I kinda like it, and there are some things from Pokemon that I'd like to see in SMT, and some things that people and developers who've only played Pokemon could learn from SMT. Even Demikids doesn't really really fill the gap for me.

[Anonymous No.6618698]

>>6617639
>For whatever reason Jewish mysticism is often depicted as the "exotic magic" in a lot of Japanese media
The Key of Solomon and the Lesser Key of Solomon were a prime inspiration for magic circle stuff in media in general. Nips get really into that tree of life stuff too

[Anonymous No.6618707]

>>6617639
>For whatever reason Jewish mysticism is often depicted as the "exotic magic"
I mean pretty much the whole world, including this place, is obsessed with jews

[Anonymous No.6618872]

I'm thinking about getting into this series. I keep reading it's pokemon for adults, is that true? What's the worst game in the series?

[Anonymous No.6618883]

>>6618872
> I keep reading it's pokemon for adults, is that true? What's the worst game in the series?
It's less childish than Pokemon but I wouldn't say it's for adults, it's more like Pokemon is for 8 year olds and Shin Megami Tensei is for 13 year olds. I have fun with both as someone in their 20s though so whatever. Worst mainline game is Shin Megami Tensei NINE for the Xbox. Can't go wrong with any of the others (I, II, if..., III:Nocturne, Strange Journey, IV, IV Apocalypse)

[Anonymous No.6618885]

>>6618872
It predates pokemon by a decade, and demons don't really work the same way.
>What's the worst game in the series?
They aren't retro

[Anonymous No.6618889]

Aren't demons incapable of leveling up and learning new moves in the earlier games?

[Anonymous No.6618892]

>>6618889
It varies from game to game.

[Anonymous No.6618897]

>>6618883
>it's more like Pokemon is for 8 year olds and Shin Megami Tensei is for 13 year olds
so basically it's digimon

[Anonymous No.6618910]

>>6618872
It's got monster recruiting that's more akin to Dragon Quest and the combat and dungeon crawling is like Wizardry. The actual retro games in the series we can discuss are all pretty solid.

[Anonymous No.6618917]

>>6617639
That made me wonder if "The Great Will" mentioned in Nocturne is referring to the New Testament God and that YHVH in II and IV/IV Apocalypse is just a lower god (or Lucifer's equal in a sense) just playing their roles of destroying and recreating the universe (or the Amala network, if we are to include the multiverse).

[Anonymous No.6619134]

>>6618872
Megami Tensei is not only older than Pokemon but shares just as much similarities as it does with any other monster collecting game, which is to say aside from there being tons of monsters, it's really not all that much like Pokemon.

[Anonymous No.6619326]

>>6617361
"I played John Madden Football once and I am now going to go shoot up my school because I think it will help me score more touchdowns"
-No one, ever.

[Anonymous No.6619373]

>>6617125
fpbp, smtrannies on suicide watch

[Anonymous No.6619378]

Yeah, heh...that would never happen...

[Anonymous No.6619387]

>>6617125
t. feminist cuckold

[Anonymous No.6619390]

>>6617125
the only SMT fans i have ever met are trannies or total socially inept freaks man. and not the good socially inept freaks like me. the ones that force their shitty taste in things on everyone else.

[Anonymous No.6619391]

>>6618897
Digimon definitely lifted a lot of ideas from SMT, and Pokemon took some ideas from both. Pokemon and Digimon are both more aimed at kids, with some side stuff aimed more at adolescents. SMT is purely for adolescents.

[Anonymous No.6619631]

>>6618698
>>6618707
Are they really still Jews if they worship Moloch tho

[Anonymous No.6619720]

>>6617125
Thanks for the hot tip anon.

[Anonymous No.6619742]

>>6617117
Play persona 1

[Anonymous No.6620581]

Nocturne remaster on Switch and PS4 confirmed, check it out

[Anonymous No.6620931]

>>6617125
The friend who introduced me to SMT was a South American Catholic, and I myself am a religious Slav and we both play either Neutral or go full Lawfag.
Because guess fucking what? It's a fucking video game. Who cares.

>>6618917
I am pretty sure it's implied that the Great Will is the real God. Plus SMT flirts with Gnosticism a lot, so I think they were trying to give that sort of dynamic for it's mythology. It's a shame that after SMT3 the series took a pretty weird direction imo.

[Anonymous No.6620953]

>>6620581
runs at half the framerate lol

[Anonymous No.6620962]

>>6620581
Hopefully it's success brings a Digital Devil Saga Collection and Raidou 1+2 HD.

[Anonymous No.6621590]

>>6617125
>going this far for bait

Well done filthy gajin~

[Anonymous No.6621637]

>>6617125
ok 90's soccer mom

[Anonymous No.6622949]

>>6617125
>kinda like Madden
wtf what? sports games are for Chads

[Anonymous No.6622952]

>>6617117
I was curious about these games until i saw the trailer for the nocturne remake. the weebtrash character design and voice acting put me off

[Anonymous No.6622983]

>>6617117
If there was any single game series in the world that could be properly be considered "pretentious", it's this.

[Anonymous No.6623041]

>>6622952
Nocturne has no voice acting.

[Anonymous No.6623070]

>>6622983
Shin Megami Tensei can't be pretentious, it's actually good.

[Anonymous No.6623095]

>>6622952
>Kazuma Kaneko art
>weebtrash
what the actual fuck are you talking about

[Anonymous No.6623114]

SMT is actually anti-Jewish and not anti-Christianity

[Anonymous No.6623202]

>>6623095
looks pretty weebshit to me. What's worse, it looks like the annoying emo kid kind, like Death Note. At least that's my impression from the trailer
>>6623041
good to know, looks like the remake does. I'll consider checking out the original one

[Anonymous No.6623206]

>>6623114
it's not anti-anything retard, it's just a video game franchise slightly inspired by abrahamic religions

[Anonymous No.6623630]

>>6623114
wrong and gay, >>6623206 is correct.

[Anonymous No.6623653]

>>6623206
>>6623630
it literally presents Judaism and it's worshipers as the ultimate enemy and aggressors to almost every conflict in the series bar like twice. It also shows their literal god as a petty warmonger who only cares about mindless worship
Sorry, it's 100% true.

[Anonymous No.6623687]

>Jesus is a demon

[Anonymous No.6623716]

>>6620581
you're welcome

[Anonymous No.6623814]

>>6623653
>it literally presents Judaism and it's worshipers as the ultimate enemy and aggressors to almost every conflict in the series bar like twice

lol that is total nonsense / your personal edgy headcanon anon. Pic related, Jews are known for their use of the cross as a symbol of their faith right?

[Anonymous No.6623831]

>>6623814
is that the gba version?
didn't know it was translated

[Anonymous No.6623837]

>>6623831
It was officially translated and released on iOS years ago, and then never updated to 64-bit and delisted. It's basically the GBA version with the music from the PSX version, kind of a weird hybrid. It's actually the only version of SMT I've beaten.

[Anonymous No.6623841]

>>6623814
Why don't you play the fucking game.

[Anonymous No.6623845]

So I guess Kaneko is not coming back, uh?

[Anonymous No.6623854]

>>6623202
This is really one of those cases where you shouldn't judge a book by it's cover, anon.

[Anonymous No.6623865]

>>6617125
the only you got right is the
>fast way to learn how not to make friends and lose all your current ones
part and just that, because everyone pretends to like it, just like yakuza

[Anonymous No.6623868]

>>6623841

[Anonymous No.6623883]

>>6623868
>>6623814
They use crosses but the god in the game is the old testament god and draw WAY more from Jewish lore than christan lore. Jesus also never appears as a character there are multiple messiah figures running around through the various games that are the good guys that actively oppose god.
Trying to claim it's not the jewish god when it very clearly is just makes you look retarded desu

[Anonymous No.6623921]

>>6623883
I literally said YHVH is the Old Testament God here, >>6617639. You're moving the goalposts.
You said:
>it literally presents Judaism and it's worshipers as the ultimate enemy...

All I'm saying is that is totally false. Having lore heavily influenced by Judaism (as well as every other major world religion) and a malevolent OT God doesn't mean "Jews are the enemy" in Megaten. It's as simple as that; God can be the enemy, but the worshippers you speak of are cross-bearing messiah following zealots.

[Anonymous No.6623925]

I tried the first one and by god did I try to make it to any of the interesting shit but it all just put me to sleep. How did this shit get popular?

[Anonymous No.6623931]

>>6623925
Battle mechanics, lore, music, bestiary, art, dungeon design, etc. It's got it all, and it's a "legacy" series like DQ and FF so it's got that going for it too.

[Anonymous No.6623964]

>>6623925
If you're not into Wizardry-style RPGs, early megaten is not for you.

[Anonymous No.6624525]

>>6620953
The image is fucking clean and has no motion blur after-frames you cannot even remove with PCSX2.

[Anonymous No.6624527]

>>6623925
Anon, this is like judging all Dragon Quest games by playing the NES ones.

[Anonymous No.6624795]

>>6623687
Have there ever been Christian saints from Catholicism or Orthodoxy in SMT? They should at add least some, there's nothing that should really stop them.

[Anonymous No.6624821]

>>6618693
What, that you posted the truth but say
"hahaha I was le jokes and irony"?

[Anonymous No.6624925]

>>6622949
reference to >>6619378

[Anonymous No.6625154]

>>6623883
very retarded post. Jewish god is literally the same Yahweh as Christian god according to historians, and to Nips it's all the same shit cause they don't give a fuck about western religions beyond the cool cathedral and demons/angels imagery. Just like the last airbender mixes a bunch of Buddhist religions with Daoism and Shamanism, it's a goofy story for children you mouthbreathing idiot
>It also shows their literal god as a petty warmonger who only cares about mindless worship
sounds the christian God to me. also the Jewish one. and the Islamic one. It's almost as if they're derivative works. To a Jap they're even more indistinguishable

[Anonymous No.6625158]

>>6625154
>Jewish god is literally the same Yahweh as Christian god according to historians
Brainlet

[Anonymous No.6625235]

>>6625154
it's gnostic. YHWH is a fallen demiurge (his final form in SMT IV looks like Yaldabaoth) and the Great Will is the pleroma. Law and Chaos are just two poles of a universe intentionally polarized by YHWH to keep the whole thing running. it's very simple.

[Anonymous No.6625468]

>>6624525
>has no motion blur after-frames
thank god

[Anonymous No.6625709]

>>6623687
Just like in real life

[Anonymous No.6625794]

>>6625235
yeah, Gnostic is correct. So not anti-jewish as that other anon was saying

[Anonymous No.6626258]

>>6623687
Just talk to him lmao

[Anonymous No.6626616]

>>6625235
>it's very simple.
And yet you got it completely wrong.

[Anonymous No.6626630]

>>6624527
Jokes on you that's how I got into Dragon Quest.

[Anonymous No.6626646]

>>6617639
>Technically the same; the Christian "Jehova" is a corruption/forced pronunciation of YHVH

No it's not, and quit blaspheming you retarded little faggot, it is literally the "proper" name of God.

[Anonymous No.6626649]

>>6617639
>Technically the same; the Christian "Jehova" is a corruption/forced pronunciation of YHVH

No it's not you retarded little faggot, it is literally the "proper" name of God.

[Anonymous No.6626651]

>>6623070
>t. doesn't know what pretentious means

[Anonymous No.6626662]

>>6625709
t. Jew

[Anonymous No.6626667]

>>6623687
Thousands of people were crucified, and Jesus was also resurrected after being brought down from the cross, you're objectively wrong, unless the devs are literally retarded and know nothing about

[Anonymous No.6626674]

>>6625154
>>6623883
>>6623814
>>6623653
>arguing about a dumb game for children written by people who have zero understanding or comprehension of the religion they're parodying

Cringe and yikes.

[Anonymous No.6627114]

>>6626649
Sorry bro, I don't know what your pastor told you but that pronunciation was just made up by Christians and is totally false. The true pronunciation is lost. There's nothing "proper" whatsoever about "Jehova", it's just bullshit.

[Anonymous No.6627327]

>>6626674
>your mom gets eating by a demon from inside out
>for children
Only school shooters actually believe this

[Anonymous No.6627598]

PASCAL THE DOG IS HERE

[Anonymous No.6627602]

>>6626662
But I'm not Jesus

[Anonymous No.6627610]

>>6626674
>I don't care about this game so I'm going to make sure no one else does
Yikes and cringe.

[Anonymous No.6627635]

https://twitter.com/gymzatan/status/1285256129774321664?s=19

[Anonymous No.6627682]

>>6627635
That's awesome, hopefully gets finished. I love MT1 but it is fucking brutal.

[Anonymous No.6627763]

>>6626674
>bragging about your superior understanding of a glorified fantasy novel written by cave people

[Anonymous No.6628580]

>>6617125
Your bait works perfectly fine.
>>6617117
Yeah, you can in 2 and Kuuuyaku 2, just have strong demons and full STR stat on MC. Then play Majin Tensei 2 and Last Bible 3.

[Anonymous No.6629138]

>>6623687
that's not Jesus, that's some random cuck being crucified.

[Anonymous No.6629149]

>the most absolulely chill version of The Great Will is in Nocturne

[Anonymous No.6629184]

>>6618917
Almost on the money as SMT IV reveals The Axiom(Great Will) which is pretty much what you describe and creates saviors(the protagonists) to defeat YHVH which is a sort of false avatar

[Anonymous No.6629195]

>>6625235
Man, makes me think about just how many JRPGs use gnostic concepts.

[Anonymous No.6629205]

i thought the great will was just a fancy way of talking about the universe itself

[Anonymous No.6629823]

>>6629205
It's literally the collective unconscious from Persona. Anyone who says that it's YHVH has no idea what they're talking about.

[Anonymous No.6629834]

30 minutes until the stream:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lViDk0_2mUE&feature=youtu.be

Come see how bad/good it'll be.

[Anonymous No.6629852]

>>6623687
The author of the original seemed more direct with Christian references, but the later books are untranslated so I have no idea

[Anonymous No.6629853]

>>6629195
Because gnosticism is cool and makes Christianity look like less of a mess

[Anonymous No.6629857]

>>6629834
Damn, and I was just about to go to bed

[Anonymous No.6629906]

>>6629834
>They're showing Dante
Dammit I wish I knew nip. I thought Dante wasn't going to be in the remake?

[Anonymous No.6629949]

>>6623964
I like the early ones, but dislike Persona and the later ones. Strange Journey was nice. I dunno, I'm not particularly fond of school settings at all and newer SMT shit is loaded with it.

[Anonymous No.6630085]

>>6629834
Samuraaaaaaaai

[Anonymous No.6630110]

>>6630085
Fun stream. Remake looks to just be updated textures and remastered audio which is perfect.

[Anonymous No.6630154]

How come you can't recruit Christ as a demon? What about prominent Christian figures like Gabriel?

[Anonymous No.6630220]

at least you can talk and form alliances with the demons in this game, unlike doom

[Anonymous No.6630227]

>>6630154
Gabby is in SMT and they went for extra blasphemy by making him female in some of the games

[Anonymous No.6630229]

>>6630220
They're assholes, and I want to shoot them.

[Anonymous No.6630248]

>>6630227
>by making him female in some of the games
Retard. Angels don't have gender, it's why the people who bitch about Lucy sometimes showing himself as a female are retards.

[Anonymous No.6630252]

>>6630229
You can do that as well.

[Anonymous No.6630265]

>>6629834
>fucking Master Asia is voicing Matador

[Anonymous No.6630315]

>>6630248
>Lucy
Who? Lucifer? A character created by John Milton in Paradise Lost, which I remember is a male, so it's wrong to show himself as a female if they are using the name "Lucifer".

[Anonymous No.6630501]

>>6630315
>A character created by John Milton in Paradise Lost

[Anonymous No.6630549]

>>6630501
That is what it is, anon. No where in the Holy Bible it says the devil is called Lucifer, not even those badly translated bibles. Yet everything people talks about the character Lucifer, it comes from Paradise Lost.

[Anonymous No.6630582]

>>6630549
So this is autism...

[Anonymous No.6630821]

>>6630549
The name lucifer comes from the Latin word for the morning star, similarly Satan come from the Hebrew word for adversary

[Anonymous No.6630990]

>>6617125
kek, quality post

[Anonymous No.6631017]

>>6617137
>play Maken X on Dreamcast
Agreed
>>6617137
>If you've played one you've played 'em all.
Incorrect

[Anonymous No.6631080]

>>6630821
lucifer in the bible is not capitalized unlike every single other name. It is just a noun there, not a name for something.

[Anonymous No.6631136]

>>6631080
You're actually a brainlet

[Anonymous No.6631163]

>>6631136

"As a result, "Lucifer has become a byword for Satan or the devil in the church and in popular literature",[3] as in Dante Alighieri's Inferno, Joost van den Vondel's Lucifer, and John Milton's Paradise Lost.[53] However, unlike the English word, the Latin word was not used exclusively in this way and was applied to others also, including Jesus: the Latin (Vulgate) text of Revelation 22:16 (where English translations refer to Jesus as "the bright morning star") has stella matutina, not lucifer, but the term lucifer is applied to Jesus in the Easter Exultet and in a hymn by Hilary of Poitiers that contains the phrase: "Tu verus mundi lucifer" (You are the true light bringer of the world).[81]

However, the understanding of the morning star in Isaiah 14:12 as a metaphor referring to a king of Babylon continued also to exist among Christians. Theodoret of Cyrus (c. 393 – c. 457) wrote that Isaiah calls the king "morning star", not as being the star, but as having had the illusion of being it.[89] The same understanding is shown in Christian translations of the passage, which in English generally use "morning star" rather than treating the word as a proper name, "Lucifer". So too in other languages, such as French,[90] German,[91] Portuguese,[92] and Spanish.[93] Even the Vulgate text in Latin is printed with lower-case lucifer (morning star), not upper-case Lucifer (proper name).[5]

John Calvin said: "The exposition of this passage, which some have given, as if it referred to Satan, has arisen from ignorance: for the context plainly shows these statements must be understood in reference to the king of the Babylonians."[94] Martin Luther also considered it a gross error to refer this verse to the devil.[95] "

[Anonymous No.6631173]

>>6631163
Literally in the first line you posted there. He's called Lucifer in the games but he's the fucking devil / the first of the fallen and that SHOULD be obvious to anyone who isn't a retard with massive amounts of autism that make them miss basic facts.

[Anonymous No.6631180]

>>6631173
My point was about the original argument that lucifer being a woman is wrong, since the character, in popular literature, has always been a male.

[Anonymous No.6631185]

>>6631180
No, Lucifer is an angel and they don't have gender therefor what meat suit he decided to wear to trick people into siding with him doesn't fucking matter.
SMT also has one of the archangels with boobs a lot and it doesn't fucking matter.

[Anonymous No.6631197]

>>6631180
>>6631185
Also go reread what was written, dumbass. I never said he was a woman I said he sometimes showed himself as one.

[Anonymous No.6631217]

Lucifer is a hermaphrodite.

[Anonymous No.6631249]

>>6631185
>>6631197
>arguing about fairytales on a chinese basket weaving forum
congrats, you're both retarded

[Anonymous No.6631253]

>>6631249
>Heh, I was just pretending and it never mattered at all!
Lame way to end it.

[Anonymous No.6631483]

>>6623687
well there's god(YHVH)and satan, mary and lucifer, remiel, uriel, michael, gabriel, camael and raphael, cain and abel are in a persona anime,

dominions and principalities are upgraded angels in christian mytholgy aswell

the only one thats not really in is jesus, but p3's upgraded persona is called the messiah, so there's that

[Anonymous No.6633270]

>>6631217
In devilman, which SMT takes big inspiration from

[Anonymous No.6633273]

>>6631483
>but p3's upgraded persona is called the messiah, so there's that
That's more about the concept of messiah than something about Jesus himself

[Anonymous No.6633389]