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/vr/ - Retro Games

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6346323 No.6346323 [Reply] [Original]

Why are there so many doom/duke nukem etc. clones/similar games/inspired by of that era and not many of daggerfall or that typo of rpg?

Is it just a matter of what sold better/popularity? Even "fantasy" games like hexen and witchaven are essentially doom.

Are there really no dos games to compare to daggerfall?

>> No.6346427
File: 17 KB, 640x400, dungeon-master_9.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6346427

All the RPG games of that era were Ultima and Dungeon Master clones, Daggerfall included. Daggerfall and Arena were just one of the more technically impressive ones that was closer to Ultima Underworld.
There are more fantasy RPGs like Daggerfall than there are ones like Doom, theyre just really fucking clunky like Legends of Valour

>> No.6346437
File: 128 KB, 552x377, 17.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6346437

>>6346323
There are tons of first person RPGs, you apparently just have never heard of them.

>> No.6346475

>>6346427
Yeah there are lots of dungeon crawler types but most are not even in real time, they are pictures.

>Legends of Valour

That actually looks really good, I love that style.

>>6346437
I have and Ravenloft games I have, they are not really on par with daggerfall, the graphics you can barely make out at times. Are they not linear too?

>> No.6346494

>>6346323
Because Daggerfall had some nice concepts but never really did too much with it. Almost all of the towns and dungeons have the exact same shit no matter where you go. It's like being dmed by an unimaginative random number generator. It's a shame really, some of the game's ideas, like having different skills for different in-game languages and different speech skills for the commoners and nobility were really cool, and could have should have been replicated by someone.


Maybe that someone is you, op.

>> No.6346502

>>6346475
They are much older games than Daggerfall, designed to run on hardware that would not be able to run Daggerfall at all. And it depends what you mean by linear. You can sure get lost.

Have you played Ultima Underworld?

>> No.6346525

>>6346475
>they are pictures
I dont know what you mean. Even the turn based combat games like Aden Thunderscape are animated and everything outside of combat is in real time.

>> No.6346563

Expensive and difficult to develop compared to other kinds of games. Even well into the 2000s you only see a few games like Morrowind, Gothic and Arx Fatalis and they all have way smaller scope than Daggerfall.

>> No.6346568

>>6346563
Yeah, we had to wait all the way until 2007 for Two Worlds to perfect the formula.

>> No.6346580

>>6346494
Maybe!

>>6346502
Yeah But can't find too many like this.

>>6346525
>Aden Thunderscape

That is yes and that looks good. Games of that style. The vast majority of rpgs are dungeon crawlers with pictures/slides or whatever you call them changing and not actual movement.

>>6346563
Yeah I figured they are much more complex and would take a more powerful pc in general

>> No.6346705

Daggerfall used Bethesda's Xngine, same which was used to power Terminator Future Shock & Skynet. Although not RPGs but shooters, they should give a more open world feeling as the engine allowed for pretty big maps unlike doom/duke

>> No.6346790

>>6346427
>Dungeon Master
That's a funny way to spell Wizardry

>> No.6347142

>>6346790
DM was real time

>> No.6347452

>>6346323
If you gave me a choice between making an FPS game or a first-person RPG with elder scrolls leveling I'd already be designing the guns.

>>6346563
Daggerfall's scope was purely because the entire map was randomly generated. People rag on Skyrim for having much smaller areas, but the polygon count of a single building alone probably dwarfs entire towns in Daggerfall. The biggest problem with large RPG worlds is that a sidequest turns from "Kill the bandit" to "Find the Hide and Seek World Champion".

>> No.6347470

>>6346323
Ultima Underworld series? System Shock (though not fantasy)? Descent to Undermountain? Shadowcaster? There were quite a few.

>> No.6347579

>>6346323
That's a great question OP. Oh wait, this isn't opposite day!

>> No.6349518

>>6346437
Is that Legends of Valour in the picture or something else? Not a keen player on dungeon crawlers or first person RPGs but this artstyle piqued my interest.

>> No.6349556

>>6347470
Note that Ultima Underworld was released before the first Doom game. It was, in fact, an inspiration (motivation?) to Carmack.

>> No.6349605

>>6349556
>an inspiration (motivation?) to Carmack.
>implying an artificial intelligence at the disguise of human can be inspired from something

>> No.6349637
File: 477 KB, 2481x1693, Once Lost Games.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6349637

>>6346494

>> No.6351508

>>6349518
That image is Ravenloft: Stone Prophet

>> No.6351838

>>6347470
>Descent to Undermountain

I love the look of this game! My all time fav look of games. But I always hear bad reviews and it's another game not really finished and pushed out too fast.

That style of game... one that works.. slightly bigger game screen.. perfect.

>> No.6351867

>>6349556
it released before Wolf3D - according to the book "Masters Of Doom" a couple years before UW's release, Carmack saw how the early demo of UW featured fully texture mapped environments, which inspired him to make Catacomb 3D

>> No.6351879

>>6346323
Why are you making so many 1 and done Daggerfall threads?

>> No.6352120

>>6351879
>1 and done Daggerfall threads?

I'm not sure if this is even English and this is my first thread in around 3 months. Thanks.

>> No.6352167
File: 2.54 MB, 390x373, 1585270792164.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6352167

>>6346323
Because DOOM and DOOK are based and Daggerfall is cringe.

>> No.6352178
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6352178

>>6349637
can't fucking wait

>> No.6352329

>>6346323
I think the main reason is CRPG fans were less focused on whether or not it was first person. First Person Dungeon Crawlers were also old-hat and Daggerfall wasn't really THAT much of a leap forward.
Daggerfall came out in 96
Ultima Online came out right after. From there We had Baldur's Gate and so on.
By that point the MMO thing had already gotten bigger with EverQuest and Asheron's Call.


DOOM was a massive shift in action shooter games, but Daggerfall was just another CRPG with even shittier combat than usual

>> No.6352394

>>6349637
>ian phoenix
Whose bright idea was it to hire this dumb clueless e-celeb faggot?

>> No.6352436

>>6347142
Yeah, and years later. He's right, and nobody should underestimate Wizardry's impact, it's kind of insane. Like the entire fucking Japanese home PC market since it was one of the few early translations they got for some reason, had a huge impact, mutated and filtered into Japanese console games, then fed back into Western games years later.
I kinda dislike Wizardry but I'll give it all due credit.

>> No.6352627

The later Might & Magic games were kind of Daggerfall-ish, right?

>> No.6354340

>Aden Thunderscape
>Legends of Valour

what else is as comfy as these?

>> No.6354385

>>6346494
I've never played Daggerfall but what you describe perfectly sums up what playing Skyrim and Morrowind were like to me. Hot fuck did I hate those games.

>> No.6355701

>>6346494
>>6354385
Elder scrolls games aren't about detailed level design, difficult challenge, or emotional stories, they're about conquering the game's world through whatever means. Fans of gothic will never understand what TES fans find to be fun.

>> No.6357303

>>6346705
Yeah those both have a similar feel as daggerfall.