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623113 No.623113 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

sup /vr/,

can we have an in-depth thread about Wizardry - Llylgamyn saga?

a fair few of you guys suggested it and some even started playing after it was suggested in various threads - including me.

a few questions:
so any advice for starters?
translation options?
what does each spell do and are the descriptions only in japanese and nowhere in english?

and most importantly: how can I rest my party? camp option does nothing. inns in Llygamyn are expensive on the long run.

>> No.623129

btw I played up until I had all my self-made party member on level 5. but when I went to the third floor of the maze I got my ass handed to myself. do I really need to grind all that much in the first module?

>> No.623147

I think this game is fairly hard if you're used to older SMT games or the old Final Fantasy stuff (1-3).

always and I mean always have at least 3 Fighters with you.

>> No.623157

>walk into maze
>walk into dark clouds
>keep going
>enter door in the dark
>see man in robes
>turns around
>says "begone, strangers!"
>teleports entire party back to town
>everything went better than expected

>> No.623173

take a fair share of potions against EVERYTHING with you.

I realized that "paralyzed" is a fucking shit status. in most FF games f.e. it only causes party members to lose a turn and do nothing by chance. In fucking Llygamyn they are all absolutely useless. kinda like being petrified.

>> No.623176

>>623113
To find out the spell effects, download a manual for the original Wizardry games. The original and old non-console ports didn't have the descriptions at all and you had to look into the manual either way.

I don't know about the translations for this version, but the SNES one (Story of Llylgamyn) is completely translated, spell descriptions and all, thanks to Aeon Genesis.

To rest your party, the only real option is to sleep in the inn... however, you can do a neat little trick here that'll save you lots of money - spellcasters replenish spellpoints even if sleeping in the stables (for free), so have your cleric sleep there, then exit the town with the party, have cleric cast Dios a couple of times, then repeat.

As for advice for starters, class changing is a really powerful tool in this game, and it's often better to plan out at least one change for most of the characters you'll make. It doesn't hurt to make a bunch of characters at first in mono-classes to just explore the dungeon, but when it comes to actually doing some serious shit, the more inaccessible the class, the better. Lords and Ninjas are indispensable. Also, the game only starts getting REALLY tough past level 4.

>> No.623181

I think the museum parts of enemies and items in this game is so neat and beautiful as well as the whole artwork and the whole canvas stuff in the title screen. a fine game like fine wine.

>> No.623189

>>623173
Potions are fucking expensive though.
>>623176
Another good trick I forgot to mention - grind up a few extra "backup" clerics (or bishops), then take them with you through the dungeon and leave them in spots you'd deem as important landmarks. The clerics can function as "recharge stations" in case your party starts to get really hurt after that point and doesn't seem to be able to make it back home.

>> No.623193

>>623176
gee, thanks for elaborating, man.

one thing though: does class changing kinda make a let's say lvl.4 fighter stop at lvl. 4 and give him the new class at lvl.1?

does the "lord" and "ninja" class happen automatically or are these two the results of multiclassing? like once you reach level 10 or something your fighter becomes a lord/knight?

>> No.623203

>>623189
>grind up a few extra "backup" clerics (or bishops), then take them with you through the dungeon and leave them in spots you'd deem as important landmarks.

holy shit. I didn't even know you can do that. but how to I "place" them around the dungeon hallways?

>> No.623206

>>623176
>To find out the spell effects, download a manual for the original Wizardry games. The original and old non-console ports didn't have the descriptions at all and you had to look into the manual either way.

I thought about doing that. but I wasn't sure if there even is anything. I'll google.

>> No.623209

>>623189
>Potions are fucking expensive though.

yeah, trading post merchant is a damn jew.

>1500 Gold for a short sword +1 lol

at least identifying is cheap but the temples are ridiculous concerning prices.

>> No.623216

what's the silver key for?

is it for that door that none of your party can break down?

>> No.623220

>>623193
>one thing though: does class changing kinda make a let's say lvl.4 fighter stop at lvl. 4 and give him the new class at lvl.1?
Yes, and you keep your current HP and spells/spellpoints, but your stats will be reset to the minimum for your current race (so a dwarf will drop to 10 strength, etc. for all stats) and the character ages a few years (5 I think?). Also, until you reach the current level of your past class, you can only gain 1 HP per level.

Lord and Ninjas are more or less "prestige classes", they have very high stat requirements and it's almost impossible to make one in the character generation process. They otherwise function like every other class does, there's no auto class changing or anything of that sort.

>>623203
Simple, once you have the party at the spot you want them on, use the Quit command. This'll return you back to the town screen with no party, but you can restore an already active party with an option (don't remember what it's called in the PSX version though, just go to Edge of Town -> Restore an "OUT" Party or something like that). Then you get to see alreadty active characters in the dungeon, and you can reassemble your party from as many as you want. The ones you didn't take will remain on the same spot you left them on.

>>623206
I personally use the PDF manual for the Ultimate Wizardry Archives edition.

>>623216
Most likely yes. Not sure where you are at.

>> No.623238

>>623220
>Simple, once you have the party at the spot you want them on, use the Quit command. This'll return you back to the town screen with no party, but you can restore an already active party with an option (don't remember what it's called in the PSX version though, just go to Edge of Town -> Restore an "OUT" Party or something like that). Then you get to see alreadty active characters in the dungeon, and you can reassemble your party from as many as you want. The ones you didn't take will remain on the same spot you left them on.

that sounds a bit complicated for me reading it only in theory but I think I'll manage even if that means having to go through 5 menues everytime. thanks.

>Lord and Ninjas are more or less "prestige classes", they have very high stat requirements and it's almost impossible to make one in the character generation process. They otherwise function like every other class does, there's no auto class changing or anything of that sort.

I see. Should get interesting in the second module.

>I personally use the PDF manual for the Ultimate Wizardry Archives edition.

I'll find that one. there is another one I just looked up but your option seems more reliable right now.

>> No.623241

>>623220
>Most likely yes. Not sure where you are at.

I think it's right on the first floor.
but what the hell are tiny statues for?

>> No.623248

>>623241
What statues? The ones you search for the keys?

>> No.623256

>>623248
like when you walk into a dead end room. a text message appears about a "boar statue" and then one of the characters you have gains it and you can identify it afterwards.

I figured they are just stuff you could sell for a lot of money, kinda like the old stuff you find in Persona 3 or 4. but I really don't know what those are for, you know?

about keys: do I have to use them with ITEMS option in front of doors or do I walk through locked doors automatically?

>> No.623265

>>623256
Use item in front of the door using the select button menu, not the camp menu.

>> No.623271

>>623256
I don't remember being able to get a boar statue, I thought there was just the one you search to find a key (there are two on the first floor IIRC). Truth be told though, I'm more familiar with Wizardry 5 (which plays fundamentally the same) than the early ones.

>about keys: do I have to use them with ITEMS option in front of doors or do I walk through locked doors automatically?
What >>623265 said.

>> No.623273

>>623265
ah. goddamn. I always used the CAMP menu instead. figures. thanks a ton.

>> No.623278

Two best items in the game IMO:
Solemn Talisman: the only object G'bli Gedook sells to you. It's essentially Dumapic for free, which lets you check your map constantly.

Rubber duck: Can't drown when the character holding it swims. Pools are really fun and important in this game but all of the good shit tends to be at the bottom. The deeper you go, the more likely you are to drown. Plus I think the Duck of Sparks needs one from you. You can buy them from the Mad Stomper on floor B, the blue floor.

>> No.623282

>>623273
Yeah it's a pain in the ass that they pull that on you. Think of the B button as shit that affects your characters directly and the select button as things that affect the environment. I think that's why you can cast shit like Desto and Califich from their respective menus.

>> No.623284

>>623271
>I don't remember being able to get a boar statue, I thought there was just the one you search to find a key (there are two on the first floor IIRC). Truth be told though, I'm more familiar with Wizardry 5 (which plays fundamentally the same) than the early ones.

it's fine. don't worry. I'll figure it out myself at some point. it's good to consult somebody who knows about a game directly instead of searching and scrolling through walkthroughs every now and then.

as for Wizardry 5: I tried that one too but dropped it for a while once I saw Llylgamyn Saga for PS1. it was just because of the eye-candy which is a terrible reason to go play a retro game. but I realized they are similar. I want to play Wizardry from the very start though.

>> No.623289

>>623271
I just started up a new game yesterday. I beat it once a long time ago on the SNES sans cheats but I'm playing less honestly this time around since it's on an emulator.

>> No.623291

>>623282
it sure is a bit archaic and binary thinking game design- and controls-wise but I guess that makes it retro.

>> No.623296

>>623220
>Also, until you reach the current level of your past class, you can only gain 1 HP per level.
Oh, scratch this, I'm a dumbass. Concerning HP it's a bit different and very complex, I don't understand it very much myself - each class has an innate "base HP" for each level that if you're over, you only gain 1 HP, or something like that. So you can't use class-changing as an easy way to increase your HP.

>>623284
Wizardry 5 is on the PS1 too though. As is Wizardry 7, but that one's jap only and it's a pretty crap port anyway. Wiz 5 is about as a good start as 1 though, maybe even better since the game is a bit (emphasis on "a bit") more forgiving and linear.

>> No.623297

>>623289
the portals are such a chore sometimes though as well as map limits that make you appear on a different map but like it's still unexplored areas.

I recently discovered that there is indeed a quickmap button. I feel like a total faggot. some days I go I always went through 3 fucking menus like a retard everytime I wanted to look at the dungeonmap.

>> No.623302

>>623291
I'd kill for a modern Wizardry game with hyper-detailed character creation. It should be just as ball-crushingly hard as its predecessors too. Really drive home the pain of losing that character you spent two hours creating to a random lightning bolt because your thief thought the chest was just trapped with a vapor coil.

>> No.623309

>>623302
since Grimrock and Co. were successful and a new Might and Magic game is on the way maybe we might even see a Wizardry reboot with the most classic mechanics.

>> No.623310

>>623297
Quick map? In Wizardry 5? Explain. I've just been going to the camp menu and using the solemn talisman out of my first character's inventory.

>> No.623312
File: 142 KB, 500x764, Wiz 4.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
623312

>Llygamyn saga
Play the DOS versions instead.

>> No.623315

>>623296
>Wizardry 5 is on the PS1 too though. As is Wizardry 7, but that one's jap only and it's a pretty crap port anyway. Wiz 5 is about as a good start as 1 though, maybe even better since the game is a bit (emphasis on "a bit") more forgiving and linear.

that's good to know. I'm such a damn casual when it comes to FP-Dungeon crawlers. I'm glad to have it at least a bit easier. if it's more like a 3rd person DnD cRPG I never have much problems though. but these games are unforgiving.

>> No.623316

>>623302
>a modern Wizardry game with hyper-detailed character creation
Grimoire.

>> No.623318

>>623316
I will look this up.

>> No.623319

>>623310
>Quick map? In Wizardry 5? Explain.

that's a misunderstanding, anon. not Wiz5. I was talking about Llylgamyn Saga Wizardry 1-3 on PS.

>> No.623320

>>623302
>modern Wizardry game with hyper-detailed character creation
Well, there is Wizardry 8... unless you mean a Wizardry game that's like the Llylgamyn games. In that case, maybe you'd like Generation Xth: Code Hazard or Class of Heroes.
>>623312
>DOS versions
Fuck that shit. Fugly CGA graphics aside, having characters die to old game at ~21 because of retarded stat gaining balance is crap.

>> No.623324

>>623320
>playing the casualized SNES/PSX versions because real Wizardry is too hard for him

>> No.623326

>>623316
now I'm curious as I was immediately thinking about GrimGrimoire.

>> No.623329

>>623324
>playing the casualized SNES/PSX versions because real Wizardry is too hard for him

there are tons of people who think the snes and PS stuff are as hard as it gets already but I can't blame anybody who thinks that.

>> No.623330

>>623319
Oh. I was gonna say. I check that fucking talisman like every five steps. I get easily turned around, especially when all of the walls look the fucking same.

>> No.623334

Alright I really need to go to bed since it's 4:39 AM here. I hope this thread is still around tomorrow. It should be, /vr/ is pretty slow, though I wouldn't say that's necessarily a bad thing.

>> No.623337

>>623324
>implying that DOS is more hardcore because of a programming oversight
No, it's just more bullshit. The Apple II originals had normal stat gains, just like the SNES/PSX ones.

>> No.623339
File: 432 KB, 1024x768, Grimoire.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
623339

>>623318

>> No.623345

>>623334
OP here. I try to keep it up and alive and kicking!

>> No.623348

>>623337
The Apple II originals did not have Automapping.
Llygamyn Saga is pretty much easymode.

>> No.623354

>>623348
Automapping is just less tedious. Plus it only maps the spot you've actually walked on. Unless you want to visit every spot in the game, the only way to accurately map is to grab a sheet of paper either way.

>> No.623360

>>623348
does that mean you gotta draw the whole map yourself?

I find this intruiging but at the same time terrible since I'm too lazy for that nowadays.

>> No.623368

>>623354
>Automapping is just less tedious
No, it's pretty much easymode. Half the difficulty in the earliest Wizardries is figuring out the map tricks.
There are several other things that makes Llygamyn Saga significantly easier at that. Spellcasting by clicking comes to mind.

>> No.623376

>>623368
You can just play the FM Towns version then, if the automap bothers you that much. Or don't cast Dumapic ever.
>Spellcasting by clicking comes to mind.
As opposed to writing Dios 10 times before you can heal yourself? Fuck that. Writing spells down might be more "immersive", but it sure is neither more practical nor hardcore (since the spell formulas are known to you from the start anyway).

>> No.623384

>>623376
not him but I concur.

Fuck that. Writing spells down might be more "immersive", but it sure is neither more practical nor hardcore (since the spell formulas are known to you from the start anyway).

>> No.623387

>>623376
>You can just play the FM Towns version then
Or the Apple/DOS versions that don't casualize the game immensely.

>> No.623390

>>623157
that was some douchebag wizard. I just entered the hyperportal somewhere on the map. not far in yet, but I'm having fun.

>> No.623394

>>623387
The FM Towns version is functionally identical to the Apple one you dolt.

>> No.623406

>>623394
The FM-7 versions (Town was not released yet) are not all identical. Wiz 4 Apple II version has the ghost chase you in real time for instance.

>> No.623414

>>623113
The PC version of Llylgamyn Saga has a full English patch. I am certain I had it back in 2008 or so.

But it's not Wizardry, it's a what I call babbymake, what with the automap and all.

>> No.623415

>>623406
Who's talking about Wiz 4? And I didn't notice any notable differences inbetween the Wiz 5 on FM Towns and the Apple one. Besides the audiovisual ones, of course.

>> No.623419

>>623414
wtf? I didn't even know there is a PC version.
Is it the same version as the PS1 version or older?

>> No.623420

>>623419
From what I've heard, the PC looks uglier than the PS1 one and the saving system in it fucking sucks balls.

>> No.623428

>>623419
It's newer, I think. It was made in 2000 or so.

I've never played the PS1 version of Llylgamyn Saga, though, so I can't explain the differences.

The PC version has multiple movable windows for the map, characters, etc.. You can customize everything. A shitload of time ago there already was an English patch.

>> No.623445

>>623420
>>623428
huh. in any case, glad I picked PS1 then...

>The PC version has multiple movable windows for the map, characters, etc.. You can customize everything. A shitload of time ago there already was an English patch.

...but reading this makes me wanna try that too. I put it up next on my download list.

>> No.623446 [DELETED] 
File: 73 KB, 682x865, PUKE.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
623446

>>623113
What is this piece of shit.

Go pirate Wizardry 8 so you know why Sir Tech are forever.

>> No.623450

>>623446
>>>/v/

is that way, you fucking imbecile.

>> No.623452

>>623446
I can talk about anything Wizardry if I want. Any title. So could you. but instead you shit on a really great game without having it played for quite some time.

>> No.623453
File: 393 KB, 618x842, YOUR TEARS ARE DELICIOUS.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
623453

>>623450
You don't like it when someone suggest to you a superior game ?

FUCK YOU AND DEAL WITH IT!!!

>> No.623459

>>623453
you could have worded it at least differently and be more respectful about the games and point out why you like Wizardry 8 more instead of going full /v/faggot mode.

>> No.623469

So what does Llylgamyn Saga change? I was big on Wizardry back in the day when it was new, but why shouldn't I just play those on dosbox?

Also anyone play the Gameboy collection? I hear that's great.

>> No.623471

>>623452
The game is good but not great.
My humble opinion.
Lacks character.

>> No.623475

>>623446
>8
>not 7

>> No.623483

>>623469
>So what does Llylgamyn Saga change?
As mentioned it makes it easier by changing the stat increases, adding automapping and such.
Some graphical improvements as well if that's your thing.

>> No.623501

>>623469
man, I wish I could tell you concrete differences.
but the major ones are:

>automapping has been added.
>new monster models
>enhanced tile-set textures
>transfer option for your heroes between the three games
>enhanced everything

so it's really a very faithful remake of Dos version and Apple 2 mostly.

>> No.623503

>>623483
>>623501
>Automapping

Can you disable that? I liked making a map.

Anyway sounds cool, thanks gents. I might pick up the Saturn version.

>> No.623513

>>623503
I think you can change that. but I couldn't tell you unless you know japanese.

you could also just never look at the dungeon map at all. it's not on screen top left or elsewhere anyway.

>> No.623514
File: 7 KB, 207x243, Laughter.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
623514

>>623475
I'm a filthy casual and the voice acting simply gives me a boner.Can't help myself liking the combat in 8 as well.
Refresh my memory but can this happen in Wiz 7? ===>

One group of ranged enemies behind you one group of enemies infront of you.The rangeones shoot at you but miss and end up hitting the enemies infront.I LOLed so hard the first time this happened.

>> No.623519

>>623501
>so it's really a very faithful remake of Dos version and Apple 2 mostly
Aside from making the games far too easy.

>> No.623531

>>623514
That's not in any other Wiz game. They've had relatively standard first-person turn based combat. Wiz 8 combat was great but they've introduced many flaws into the system with that one, like level scaling and gimped multiclassing.

>> No.623532

>>623519
yeah that. oh boy, that reminds me about the discussions we had about FF1 and FF2 - Dawn of Souls for GBA and how it is all babby compared to NES versions.

I guess that's the fate of most retro games that get a remake. it "has" to be as accessible as possible and you gotta be into it easily and progress fast. I don't blame devs for that approach though but I think a difficulty slider would just be the best solution to retain the old challenge.

>> No.623536

>>623483
>changing the stat increases
Stat increases are identical to the Apple version IIRC. It's only the DOS version that's borked.

>> No.623538

>>623513
Well I guess I'll find out, thanks anyway.

>>623519
I'm honestly not too worried if it is easier, the original Wizardry was absolutely ball crushing. As long as it isn't as easy as Etrian Odyssey 4 then I should be fine.

>> No.623542

>>623538
>As long as it isn't as easy as Etrian Odyssey 4 then I should be fine.

it won't be. I can tell you that much already.

>> No.623549

>>623542
I don't think a dungeon crawler could get much easier than that disappointment, god damn.

If Llylganyn Saga is EO3 to Wizardry's EO1 then I think I'll be fine, although obviously EO1 is pretty easy before postgame.

Sage for offtopic.

>> No.623556

>>623549
WLS1,2,3 is much harder than something like SMT Strange Journey for example. and even that is considered challenging by nowadays standards.

I don't know EO games all that well so that's why compared it to SJ.

>> No.623557

>>623531
...gimped multiclassing?I love Wiz 8 multiclassing.You can go bananas and make crazy shit it like having a fighter with max stealth and criticals or a mage with regenerating health...the sky is the limit.

>> No.623564

>>623556
Alright, sounds like a good difficulty for me then, should be a fun ride.

Also try out EO if you dig these games, it's good shit. At least 1-3 are.

>> No.623570

>>623557
Compared to Wiz 7, multiclasses are not as viable. Wiz 7 literally allowed for absolute demigods had you happened to plan your character properly.

>> No.623576

>>623531
P.S lvl scaling is ok if you ask me .

>> No.623578

>>623564
>Also try out EO if you dig these games, it's good shit. At least 1-3 are.

will do. I totally wanted to look into them anyway after my backlog has become a bit smaller.

>> No.623594

You don't even need to rest at the in, your mages get all their spells back just from exiting the dungeon. Go to town, go back to dungeon, heal with spells, back to town. Too easy. Only use the inn to level up.

>> No.623598

>>623570
>Compared to Wiz 7, multiclasses are not as viable.
What do you mean?I multiclass all the time to great effect.

>> No.623602

>>623594
another hidden game mechanic. thanks for sharing it. I guess I probably would have never realized that unless I was hours upon hours in the game.

>> No.623630

>>623113
About your healing at inns issue, since I glanced over the thread and didn't notice anyone mention it yet, always take someone capable of healing with you, like a cleric, and just rest at the stables in the inn for free, you won't get health back but you will get all your MP back, and you just use your healer to restore your party back to full health.

Also you can level in the stable and time does not pass resting in the stables.

>> No.623645

>>623630
I do have a cleric. In fact, I had one from the very beginning. but sometimes he's as good as useless as the dios spell only heals like 4 hp in total sometimes. sometimes it's a bit more but it doesn't help much. thanks for the suggestions.

>> No.623690

another difficulty thing about this game: the grouping of your party is really important. first three ones can attack, all other need to parry or cast spells. always keep spellcasters in the back rows and your thief too.

>> No.623716

I'm so thankful for the automap as it displays hidden entrances or else you'd never know when to go through a wall.

>> No.623720

those creeping coin things are funny.
they help you gaining dosh and exp real fast but they are a chore to fight.

>> No.623725

>>623720
>creeping coins yelling for help

>> No.623728

>>623720
it's actually like a chance game. they don't appear often but if they appear you're in luck.

nice addition

>> No.623736

>>623725
>fight normal enemies
>all enemies run away
>you gain 0 exp.

>> No.623739

>>623736
>you meet a friendly group of undead kobolds
>Fight / Leave?

>> No.623749

>get poisoned
>4 floors below
>no spell points
>no potions

>> No.623753

is there actually a warp spell or warp item that takes you back to the city?

>> No.623754

>>623753
There is one. There is a catch though.
Your spellcaster forgets it once he casts it

>> No.623761

>>623754
you serious? fuck me. I better get the spell though.

>> No.623769

>>623753
you could go to the asshole wizard we talked about before too.

but it's kinda retarded to place him on floor 1.

>not placing him at floor 15 just to piss off players.

>> No.623929

jesus christ, low-level zombies and kimono-men are tough.

I found the elevator and I thought I'd be fine in floor nr. 4, yet I ignored the warning sign and got fucked in the ass. guess I should just flee from everything in the area.

>> No.623937

>>623929
enjoy your portals and dark clouds.

>> No.623972

>>623937
I will. believe it or not I reached level 6 already.

>> No.624228
File: 234 KB, 1280x1024, Wiz 8 allience.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
624228

>>623113
If you enjoy Wizardry games i would suggest Wizardry 8.It has superior combat,great story/puzzles and is fully voiced with some of the funniest lines you could hear in a RPG.

>> No.624285

>>624228
While Wiz 8 is of course a great game, it has a different sort of appeal from the early Wizardry games. You don't draw your own maps. There is more than one town, which doesn't lead to the dreadful atmosphere of being stranded deep in the dungeon at low HP. You only pass through the game with one set party (henchmen don't count). After a party dies, it's over - no chance of running in there with a few low-level blokes and a cleric for an emergency rescue mission. That's what I love about this series; it manages to be varied yet every innovation has been a great success on its own (we don't talk about Nemesis).

>> No.624294

>>624285
In fact, I'd go as far as say that the Wizardry games after 5 feel more like Might & Magic games. Probably the best M&M games there ever were, but still.

>> No.624427

>>623312
>>623324
>>623348
>>623368
>>623387
>>623519


your autism about some game being easy is showing. psst news flash aspie... not everyone is you and wants to grind and toil at a games mechanics for immershun! so stop being THAT autist asshole in the thread whining how easy it became over time with remakes.

>> No.624573

>>624228
I totally want to play that. but I got no time at the moment. it's on my backlog sitting there for one year now, damn.

>> No.624578

>>624573
Then give it a try for 30 minutes.

>> No.624640

as somebody new to the series, why did Sir-Tech stop making those games?

I would enjoyed seeing the series progress from early days until now.

>> No.624642

>>624427
The issue isn't grinding with the remakes, you're going have to grind to hell anyway.
The issues is automapping stripping away a significant part of both the Wizardry experience and the difficulty.

>> No.624651

>>624640
The company is defunct. As games got exponentially more expensive to produce, many companies disappeared.

Wizardry games are still being made though. A Japanese company has had the rights for quite a while now.

>> No.624657

>>624640
>why did Sir-Tech stop making those games?
Ultra-shitty management, bankruptcy and legal troubles iirc.

>> No.624661

>>624651
>Wizardry games are still being made though. A Japanese company has had the rights for quite a while now.

yeah? who are they and what is the latest entry?

>> No.624673

>>624661
Not /vr/ related, so google it. They are still oldschool style first person dungeon crawlers.

>> No.624683

>>624673
>They are still oldschool style first person dungeon crawlers.
Most of them are inferior to the proper series entries though.

>> No.624697

>>624661
Multiple companies have been making them. There have been dozens of japanese-exclusive Wizardry spinoffs over the years, most notably Wizardry: Tales of the Forsaken Land (also in english on PS2), Wizardry Gaiden series, Wizardry Empire series, Wizardry Xth series.

>> No.624718

>>624697
>Wizardry: Tales of the Forsaken Land (also in english on PS2)

I just read about that being listed as a spin-off in Wikipedia. I want to try out the PS2 version. could be intradesting.

>> No.624725

>>624697
at least there are games!
some franchises are fucking dead by now and we got nothing.

>> No.624738

>>624725
Might & Magic is alive too, just look at, uh... HoMM6, no wait... Clash of Heroes... oh who am I kidding.
At least Ultima's alive, right? Just look at Ultima Forever, I mean... blech, oh wait, at least LB has been busy working on Shroud of the Av-... no, that won't work either. Well I guess at least Wizardry's getting something.

>> No.624742

>>624661
They are bad anon.
The japs make good games , just not good wizardry games...and now the horrible MMO they have out.
>>624683
>Most of them are inferior to the proper series entries though.
What he said.
>>624657
>Ultra-shitty management, bankruptcy and legal troubles iirc
Well , at least they gave us the awesome wizardry series.
Bad at busines - good at making games.

>> No.624757

>>624742
>The japs make good games , just not good wizardry games...and now the horrible MMO they have out.
Can't speak for the others, but at least the Wizardry Xth series (the second one is better known as Class of Heroes for the PSP) is pretty good.

>> No.624763
File: 489 KB, 355x200, forever-weirded-out.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
624763

>>624742
>and now the horrible MMO they have out.
>MMO

>> No.625272

I wonder why the japs haven't been aping after Wizardry 6-8 instead? They've gotten them all, so it's not like they don't know of them.

>> No.625364

>>625272
I've heared rumors that there were major problems when the games were translated.People say that all the humor got butchered.

>> No.625392

>>625364
Maybe, but the games were more than just the humor. What happened to the devilish puzzles, the open world, the skill system?

>> No.625412

Is Labyrinth of Lost Souls good? Was about to get the demo from PSN

>> No.625418
File: 396 KB, 1400x805, Fun and Games.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
625418

>>625412
Yes very much so.

>> No.625421

>>625272
>>625364
Guessing it's the same deal with Ultima. The non-PC ports either didn't get made (seems to be the case with Wiz 8) or were much worse than the original.

>> No.625427

>>625421
But Wiz 6 got a very sexy port on the SNES... and they've already made an unofficial translation of Wiz 8.

>> No.625438

>>625427
>and they've already made an unofficial translation of Wiz 8.
"Already"? It's been a few years.
PC isn't exactly the most popular platform in Japan. (though not quite as neglected as people think)

>> No.625461
File: 368 KB, 736x853, Wizardry Gold.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
625461

>>625392
Don't be asking me i am not the one that bought the IP.If i was making the next Wizardry game i would simply get 6,7,8 mix them real good use this artstyle from the Wizardry Gold series the same setting but have the game go on a grander scale with travel and adventures on several planets in the same storyark have your own spaceship and evry dude in your party will have a second class that gives him controll on a specific ship subsystem.Stuff like that.

Your mage casting spells in space :P comandeering an enemy ship :D with your dudes as the boarding party.

>> No.625462

>>625438
Already, as in a point in the past.

>> No.625473

>>625461
When i say artstyle i mean the artstyle of the cover.

>> No.625475

>>625461
That sounds like a pretty awesome idea. I'd imagine the spaceship segments to be like a (very, very much) more polished Ultima 1.

>> No.625565

>>625475
Or about the same as the Gumi ship part's of Kingdom Hearts?

>> No.625567

I really enjoy the artwork of Llylgamyn Saga. a definitive step up from the Dos versions

>> No.625794

>>623113
OP have you tired Wizardry 6 or 7?

>> No.626079

>>625794
not yet. I was introduced to Wizardry the more I found out about it on /vr/. I'll definately get to it in the near future but I don't have much time for vidya at the moment as I'm about to graduate soon.

>> No.626107

Are portraits customizable in recent Wizardry games?
I like first person dungeon crawlers, but damn, those portraits...

>> No.626337

>>625565
No , and don't ever mention KH ever again.
Have you people no class?

>> No.626359
File: 11 KB, 280x169, daaaaaammmm.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
626359

>>625461
Vi is one hot piece of valkyrie ass.

>> No.626364

dont even read,but i need short ansvar,wizardry 8 vs 6,dramatic diferention in graphica,which one is betur

>> No.626421

>>626107
I believe they are. 8 surely is.
>>626364
Hard to say, both are great. 8 is more varied and has better balance, while 6 has better writing and is easier to break while being much harder on average.

>> No.626435

>>626364
>Hard to say, both are great. 8 is more varied and has better balance, while 6 has better writing and is easier to break while being much harder on average.

this.

>>626364
I don't care where you from but learn some english, dude.

>> No.629165

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2ZLdScOxvE

OP here, damn, I just watched this guy do really cool explanations and gives good advice on how to fight and what you can do best to progress.

it might be the SNES version but I figure there aren't many differences.

>> No.629219

how are the Wizardry Empire titles? they are retro too from what I've seen but no ratings or no reviews anywhere

>> No.629265

>>629219
I've heard Wizardry Empire 1 recommended a few times, but I don't know any details.

>> No.629690
File: 20 KB, 404x307, best of the best.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
629690

>>626421
Wizardry 8 THE BEST first person-turn based-party based combat out there.

>> No.629972
File: 26 KB, 225x225, so sad.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
629972

>>624742
>The japs make games , just not good games
I fixed it for you

>> No.629980

>>629690
It's not like it has a lot of competition in this area though. The vast majority of first-person combat in RPGs doesn't even have stuff like positioning. Albion (and the Amber saga by extent) and Thunderscape are the only ones that come to mind.
>>629972
Thanks for the shitpost.

>> No.630026

>>629980
I still don't understand why noone has stolen the combat system from Wizardry 8.With todays graphics/physics engines it could lead to a spectacular gaming experience.

>> No.630056

>>630026
Because first person dungeoncrawlers aren't in vogue.

>> No.630191

>>624742
I've had little problem with the japanese made wizardry games, there's a central company that owns the license that lends it out to developers/publishers to make wizardry games with, which has led to shit like the MMO and that is a horrible piece of crap. Not every game is perfect, but none of them are straight up shit like Wizardry Online

And it's been a long standing line I've heard for years now, "Sir-Tech revolutionized, the japanese refined.", it honestly sounds like you haven't played a japanese wizardry outside of the MMO.

>> No.630208

>>630191
Well I hope they'll "refine" Wiz 7 or 8 sometime soon then, because all I've seen from them so far is story-oriented clones of the Llylgamyn games.

>> No.630215

>>625412
The only problem I personally had with it was the main line quest, which goes along as DO THIS ONE SPECIFIC QUEST, then do a character specific quest, and then you have the final quest line which is a fucking nightmare without a guide since it requires you to search the entire dungeon of the game right back from the very beginning checking every tile to find the triggers required of the quest.

>> No.630248

>>629219
>>629265

I just started playing Wiz: Empire. but seriously. while it is certainly more animu than pure western medieval artstyle, it seems pretty okay yet you shouldn't fucking bother. there is no damn translation. at least I haven't seen shit. there is no options menu. there seems to be one once you load the iso the first time but that's it. like in Llylgamyn Saga I put everything to the right most option hoping it would result in having at least a bit english but nothing.

trying Empire II later as well and will report back.

>> No.630263

>>630191
they should just give it to a western dev. for once and see how it turns out. I feel most jRPG philosophies for this one hurt the whole game anyway.

first you have a WRPG and now it's animu the game.

>> No.630294

>>630263
But wizardry's mechanics were the basis for JRPGs in the first place, the only one that really broke away from it greatly was Wiz8.

>> No.630302

>>630248
So you know moon? Could you try out Wizardry 4 Reprise from the New Age of Llylgamyn remake collection then? I've been wondering what that one's about for a while, what does it have to do with the actual Wiz 4 that's on the same disc.

>> No.630385

>>630302
I don't know moon. that's what I'm trying to say. sorry.

I really should know moonrunes though. I still have those self-teach japanese langenscheidt courses at home and I never had the discipline to bother but now it would come in handy.

>> No.630423

>>630385
okay, I tried Empire II as well now. no english and even worse the game crushes for some reason whenever I try to leave the pub with my new party. what the hell?

but it looks like a real good game despite that.

>> No.630490

>>630302
interesting. wasn't there a fantranslation for "the new age of llylgamyn" on psx?

it's what I'll tackle next unless I find nothing I'll stick to the snes version or something.

>> No.630525

>>630490
>interesting. wasn't there a fantranslation for "the new age of llylgamyn" on psx?
Haven't heard of such a thing. But the default Wiz 4 and 5 have the standard english option like every other Wizardry port (except 6-7 ofc). There apparently is a bonus Werdna scenario of some sort in it though, as a "third game" in the collection, and I can't for the life of me figure out what that is exactly.

>> No.630557

>>630525
>Werdna
>Trebor

you now realize that those names are backwards for Andrew and Robert, the creators.

>> No.630562
File: 191 KB, 916x488, mindblown.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
630562

>>630557

>> No.630932

>>630562
I thought that was common knowledge?

>> No.630957

>>630208
fucking this
Sir-Tech refined the series far more than the various Japanese devs ever did, and they did it years ago.

>> No.631035

>>630957
so fucking true.
innovation is certainly not XSEEDs strength or whatever publishers they had, including starfish.

>> No.631040

>>631035
ah, fuck, I mean developers not publishers.

>> No.631051
File: 241 KB, 1280x1024, Anonbro.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
631051

>>630294
Sure , sure the basis for most JRPGs from first person perspective are the Wizardry series but they use them in the simplest form possible.Jeez the amount of interaction with the world , the puzzles and the quality of the story are practicaly close to nill.It's like they've transformed Wizardry into the linear crap FF is.

>the only one that really broke away from it greatly was Wiz8
And that is one of the reasons i love Wiz 8.
Wiz 6 and 7 are nice too but the gameplay in Wiz 8 is next generation FPRPG material.

>> No.631052

>>630932
It was. His head exploded spontaneously.

>> No.631093

>>631035
>using the same shitty grizzly bear enemy models for three fucking games in a row

>recolored and restyled anime portraits that look like one or another

It would be best if some dev. like Obsidian could make a remake or even something new.

after all, I think Interplay was publisher once for the Archives edition.

>> No.631105

>>630248
>>630423

man, they should really fucking get to a translation then. so many good JPN onry ps1 games and nothing is translated. fuck it all.

>> No.631280
File: 74 KB, 797x591, gxth1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
631280

>>631105
If it'll make you happier, a translation of a japanese spiritual sequel to the Wizardry Xth games, Generation Xth, is reaching completion.

>> No.631292

>>631093
>Obsidian

Their games suck.

>> No.631576

>>631292
you suck, dipshit.

>> No.631582

>>631280
cool. that's a start I guess.

>> No.631671

>>625427
The SNES Wiz 6 port may have looked sexy but when I tried to play it the mechanics seemed borked as hell... I remember every battle being round after round after round of every single attack missing (both player and enemy) until someone finally got a hit in. I admit that this was years and years ago on ZSNES... might have been an emulator bug (or the emulator triggering some copy protection programmed into the game).

>> No.631705

>>631051
I would love to talk about that game to death but alas, its too "young" for this board and too "old" everywhere else. The only thing I FUCKING hate about Wizardry 8 is the Rapax Castle the force sex with the demon bitch. At least if you know ahead of time, you can skip this. Then again, I wish this level and that forced sex was not included.

>> No.631713

>>631671
Me again. Forgot to mention that I own the Japanese PS version of Wiz7, I read Japanese fluently and I can assure you that the English-to-Japanese translation is utterly atrocious. It's easily Final Fantasy Tactics quality or even worse.

It's no wonder there's little love for the DWB Wizardry games in Japan given the quality of the versions they got.

>> No.631745
File: 1.90 MB, 1920x1200, nausicaa-of-the-valley-of-the-wind.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
631745

>>631280
More of the same generic anime JRPG crap.

Why can't we have awesome settings and old fashioned anime styles.

>Ni No Kuni
No , simply no.If i was 7 years old maybe.

>> No.631782

>>631705
Ok my memory is a little fuzzy... but i don't remember any forced sex.I remember killing her , that i did , no sex thow.

I will have to reinstall or find a youtube video.
I hate it when i miss out on stuff.

>> No.631809

>>631782
You have to have one of your male characters to fuck with Al-Sedexus (and then kill her) just to use the portal to the final area. And you have to kill the offspring.

>> No.631815

>>631671
>The SNES Wiz 6 port may have looked sexy but when I tried to play it the mechanics seemed borked as hell... I remember every battle being round after round after round of every single attack missing
That's what your characters are like in the original too, if you're low level.
>>631713
Well, that explains a lot... but still, the mechanics themselves should've sparked some interest, no?
>>631745
>writing off a game solely by artstyle
Go away. I too would like somebody to continue with the Wiz 8 line, but seriously.

>> No.631842

>>631815
Learn to read or maybe i am using the wrong word but when you read "setting" in a conversation about RPGs you shud be thinking "world/universe" am i wrong?

>> No.631846

>>631842
Still, it's a SPIRITUAL sequel. It wasn't even released under the same brand. And the setting is still pretty interesting, smells a bit of a SMT ripoff but for a dungeoncrawler it's pretty okay.

>> No.631863

>>631846
>smells a bit of a SMT ripoff

totally felt the same way. Isn't that this academy wizardry game for demon trainers? can't get more SMT than that, for fucks sake.

>> No.631867
File: 14 KB, 163x256, grll.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
631867

>>631809
And if i have no male characters ?

>> No.631879

>>631863
Well, the demons aren't implied to be negotiatable, are more like savage beasts and zombies, but otherwise... yeah, it's SMT.

>> No.631882

>>631867
Lesbian sex or robot sex with the extra Monk Savant Trooper you pick for experiences.

Seriously though, I rather just set a teleporting spell in Ascension Peak early on then to deal with the Rapax Castle and that demon bitch. I am sure you understand what I meant when you have to fight a fucking army of Rapax every few step in the castle ground.

>> No.631901

>>631846
Ah don't do that man.Don't be lowering your standarts , always expect more or you will end up playing bad games .

Developers/publishers will not be stimulated to rise quality since they can get away with shoving lower quality stuff down peoples throats.

>> No.631915

>>631882
No chameleon spell?

>> No.631925

>>631915
Sadly, no.

>> No.631957

>>631901
Again, I'm not saying that I'm perfectly content with what they've done with it, but bad setting is something I forgive a lot more than bad content. And it's not like Wizardry had interesting settings for more than 3 games... unless you count the goofy characters from Wiz 5 as a "setting".

>> No.631959

>>631925
Oh , i love me my chameleon spell.
It+Rengen vision and i used to walk around like a boss.

Now i have to play the series again.This time 6 to 7 to 8 with the same party so i can feel like a MAJOR BOSS!!!

>> No.632054

>>631957
>content
Ok what do you count as content separate from setting/artstyle.

-gameplay mechanics that we can separate into:
1.World interactions(puzzles , world exploration,movement)
2.Character interactions(Combat , conversations,story arcs)
-Imput and information output :
1.Controls sheme,controls configuration options.
2.UI , UI customisation,hud etc.

Do you think that any of those are done properly or you think that they are done "ok" enough to be "passable" ?

>> No.632130

>>632054
>content
Stuff like dungeon/monster designs, items, what you can do with them, balance, etc.
The mechanics aren't half bad either, a mix of Wiz 1-5 mechanics with the new races/classes from 6-7 and an item crafting system.
Story is rudimentary in comparison.

>> No.632249

>>632130
There are Umpani, T'Rang, Rattkin, Elves, Jastrodons, Exadi and Helazoid in that game?

>> No.632279

>>632249
No. It's not a Wizardry game.

>> No.632303

>>632279
>with the new races/classes from 6-7
Uhh??
>No. It's not a Wizardry game.
What???

>> No.632348

>>632303
I meant the selectable ones dude. They don't share the names, but are functionally the same.

>> No.632413
File: 111 KB, 209x327, ouhhh.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
632413

>>632348
They have acid breathing characters? Or ones that are icapable of wearing most armor/weapons in the game?

You know i am pulling your leg right?

>> No.632423

>>632413
P.S races i meant to say races

>> No.633895

Speaking of Mods anyone know of a list of them for Wizardry 8?

Can't seem to find any?

>> No.634041

>>633895
Google Flamestryke's Mod

>> No.634428

>>633895
http://www.zimlab.com/wizardry/wiz8mods.htm

Here a list.

>> No.635036

>>634428
Wait... wait... wait... a minute , there are mod tools out ? I gues i will make me some Wizardry 8 mods.

>> No.635418

So guys I was playing Wizardry V and changing class to samurai made the stats of the character reset.
I've read this happens when the stats are lower than racial minimums but I'm pretty sure they weren't.
I was level 10 anyway so I was wondering if it's worth it anyway?

>> No.635510

I must be the only one who dislikes the multiclassing in Wiz 6/7, at least when it gets to late game.

With Wiz6/7, you end up with a party of characters who are all near identical outside, feeling like it takes away the point of a strategic class set up. Everyone turns out to be homogeneous kirijutsu melee wizard gods capable of casting every spell in the game. One would only change classes for the sake of available equipment.

It's funny how JRPGs with class systems fail to escape this too. Final Fantasy V comes to mind, with how absolutely boring and overpowered Freelancers become near the end.

>> No.635763

>>635510
Play Wizardry 8 it is simple as that.

>> No.635781

>>635418
OP here. it's definately worth it.
watch >>629165

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2ZLdScO

this guy explains what stats all prestige classes need. in fact, you NEED to start over at one point and do so with higher HP and so forth.

it really kinda reminds me of the whole rebirth stuff they had in Ragnarok Online. it's like a new game + but for every single character. and make sure to grind up a fuckton of backup characters. this game is so friggin hard.

>> No.635784

>>635781
damn, ignore the link. copy and paste lost some of the URL.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2ZLdScOxvE

>> No.635790

>>631745
>No , simply no.If i was 7 years old maybe.
Ni no Kuni is actually fairly dark for being supposedly aimed at kids.
Japanese people tend to be pretty good about those things.

>> No.635791

>>635418
Samurai 15 STR 11 INT 10 PIE 14 VIT 10 AGI 9 LUC, alignment neutral or good

I think it needs to be exactly those stats and I doubt you had them all.

>> No.635805

>>635781
>this game is so friggin hard.

especially since there is this weird age progression. whenever you rest in an inn (not the stables) your characters age like 5 years straight. there is supposed to be a problem for memorizing new spells when they get too old.

>> No.635917

>>635510
>with how absolutely boring and overpowered Freelancers become near the end.

playing it right now. why not give all 4 characters just 2 jobs maximum? seems to be enough.
also what modern day FF game doesn't have all overpowered freelancers these days? they ditched classes for an entirely skillbased system which takes the wind out of the sails quite a bit.

as for Wizardry: In hands of western devs it would keep up having the approach of having clearly defined classes. I wish there were more prestige classes though. 12 would be a good amount. there is not a single one that is purely for mages.

>> No.635975

>>635917
Didn't that third and fourth "Class of heroes" games have assloads of classes. I'm gonna have to find a screenshot again of it but I remember the class list being absolutely gigantic, like 40 classes minimum.

>> No.636180

>>635975
>like 40 classes minimum.

please find it. this is always interesting.

>> No.636224

>>635975
Hm I thought it was 16?

>> No.636237

>>635784
tahnks, I'm checking it out.

>> No.636291

>>636237
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbvKZL4Ex08

this too. he speaks about bonus stat points in this episode.

>> No.636764

>>635975
>>636180
>>636224
I just checked out the character creation trailer for the 3DS one, and it had 30 classes in it, with 5 of them darkened out so they must unlock later in the game.

But that's alot still.

>> No.637662

>>623113
OP have you beaten all three game's?

>> No.637761

>>635510
At that point, you can consider the OP characters more as a reward for getting that far and finding out how to break the game though. Somehow at least for me, there's always a pretty immense feel of satisfaction in RPGs once you get to the point that you can steamroll all those frustrating asshole enemies that gave you troubles for so long and you get to basically snap the game in half over your knee.
>>637662
Obviously not, that's why he started the thread.

>> No.638039
File: 173 KB, 480x300, wiz2a.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
638039

>>637662
OP here, you kidding me, dude? I'm glad if I don't die in the middle of nowhere. still I'm having fun with it while working myself through the archives edition manual and writing down all spells and their effects as well as stats for classchanges and what not. I got to level 4 so far and no further and just started placing healing spot priests (thanks for that hint!) I'm already really curious about the Knights of Diamonds module afterwards. but there is no use doing it without beating Proving Grounds.

I'm curious how you guys are holding up (doesn't matter which Wizardry game, doesn't have to be Llylgamyn Saga, one guy did Wiz 5 from what I read and some were pretty hyped for doing Wiz 8)

so how is it looking guys?

>> No.638049

>>638039
Wiz 5 guy here, momentarily took a break from it to play Might & Magic: World of Xeen. With great success.

>> No.638070

>>638049
I can also recommend you reading the manual for classchanges and stats. just google it.
was the youtube video at least helpful? it helped me because it showed me the scope of what I've been getting myself into and stuff.

damn, I gotta play World of Xeen anytime soon. Always wanted to try it. I already added it to my backloggery so I don't forget about it.

>> No.638185
File: 32 KB, 450x338, Cheers.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
638185

>>631051
Cheers mate , Wiz 8 for life!!!

>> No.638946

>>635975
There's a fourth Class of Heroes game?

>> No.640662

>>638946
There's the first which we got in english, the second which is getting an english release soon, there was Class of heroes 3 which also had a 3DS version, and the fourth was "Final: The Freshman is a princess".

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