/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.6129107]

I can't imagine a single person that would enjoy grinding this game all the way to beat it

Dragon Warrior thread I guess

[Anonymous No.6129116]

I found DQ1 pretty enjoyable, but I quit the series after 2 and 3. Fuck hidden invisible items and fuck the the RNG enemies who randomly wipe out your party without warning.

[Anonymous No.6129118]

>>6129107
>eye cancer filter
>fucked up skewed aspect ratio
The line between bait and zoomers being zoomers blur more by the day

[Anonymous No.6129126]

>>6129107
I played it when it came out for GBC while commuting on the train and it was decently enjoyable but I wouldn't play it again.

[Anonymous No.6129135]

>>6129107
>KillMe.png
Anyway 1 is a nice little game easily done in a few hours.
Considering how much popular the braindead pokemon games are, I don't see any problem with DQ1.

[Anonymous No.6129138]

Your first reason to grind is to go further
Your second reason to grind is to save the princess, but in the end its a really short game:
You only really grind so you can beat the final boss.
Its not like other games where there is multiple grinds: You have ONE goal, realistically.

[Anonymous No.6129232]

It's the OG. The original. The big dick daddy. And while in many regards the systems and design methodology feel like proofs of a concept it also is spectacularly elegant and wholly complete. It's impossible to play a jrpg without acknowledging its influence and it's still a great game today.

[Anonymous No.6129254]

>>6129107
Idk, its kind of dumb that people think you have to grind. you're supposed to walk around and explore and not really know exactly where to go. Doing this will be enough encounters to get through the game.

[Anonymous No.6129270]

>>6129107
I unironically enjoyed the grind ama

[Anonymous No.6129273]

Even though it is very much a basic game, it still has a lot of charm. Even though I am just basically grinding so I can find some end-game items required to get to the final dungeon, it's still a very relaxing and fun game to sit through.

Or I could be biased, it was my first rpg.

[Anonymous No.6129329]

>>6129107
It's charming, historic, and archaic, that's the draw of it today. Back when released in '86 the draw was being an RPG on a home console.

If you can't enjoy things outside of "this fun" then you're a trash person in general.

[Anonymous No.6129343]

>>6129329
The problem is most people aren't playing the 86 version so they don't get the real experience.

[Anonymous No.6129347]

>>6129343
Nah, playing the new versions gives you the experience with the benefit of hindsight without sacrificing the originals good points and feel.

[Anonymous No.6129353]

>>6129347
I guess the important part is not to play it in English.

[Anonymous No.6129353,1]

OP is a low IQ guy too stupid to play the game.
the game is good and if you don't want to grind just go to the maou castle at LV 1 you can do it not that you are going to defeat it but you can do it and get the bad end as most americans that played the game for the first time.

[Anonymous No.6129431]

>Dragon quest 1 players who go buy every equipment item as soon as it's available, never go into the cursed necklace dungeon as second time, and don't try reaching the city that sells magic keys until they're 10 levels stronger than the monsters in that area because they forgot running away was a mechanic.

[Anonymous No.6129432]

>>6129353
Ugh.

[Anonymous No.6129528]

>>6129107
In 1987 my sister did the grind so hard that at one point the townspeople told her the equivalent of "Look asshole you're powerful enough. Go fight the Dragonlord."

[Anonymous No.6129595]

I decided to play Dragon Warrior III with the intention to finish it but fuck me this is one slow, grindy game. How could people play this without a fast-forward button?

[Anonymous No.6129619]

>>6129107
Grinding is fun when you're a kid.

[Anonymous No.6129638]

>>6129431
>Hendrick in silver armor
what is this sorcery?

[Anonymous No.6129662]

>>6129107
>that filter

[Anonymous No.6129885]

>>6129107
That filter is awful. I played this game a lot in the 90s and I almost beat it back in the day. It was awesome.

[Anonymous No.6129891]

>>6129107

[Anonymous No.6130427]

>>6129118
I'm positive it's just a bait picture, and you took the bait. Nobody would play like that, be serious.

[Anonymous No.6130432]

>>6129107
I knocked out the required grinding in a couple of hours in the ghost town. Worth it for one of the most classic games of all time. Simple yeah but fun.

[Anonymous No.6130784]

>>6129107
what if i told you i play this game every year and love grinding in it and i usually watch a tv show while i do it in the late game?

[Anonymous No.6130804]

>>6129107

I loved it as a kid. It was the first time I'd ever even thought about the possibility of anything like an RPG. It was mind-blowing. The simple choices the game gives you were more than enough to occupy me and make me feel like I was in an amazing new world.

Now, yeah, I have no interest in it. But it seems like you're saying you can't imagine that there could ever possibly be kids.

[Anonymous No.6130839]

>>6129107
I honestly enjoyed grinding through DW1. Up till then I hated grinding through RPGs, but it was until I was in my 20s that I played the grandaddy of all JRPGs and it finally clicked for me.

[Anonymous No.6130845]

>>6129107
that looks beautiful my guy

[Anonymous No.6130850]

>>6129595
By not being spastic.

[Anonymous No.6130917]

>>6129116
>Fuck hidden invisible
Like the ones in DQ1?

[Anonymous No.6130931]

>>6129107
DQ 1 is comfy though. Unrelated but related, how long has it taken you guys to finish DQ 2? I seem to be slagging along and probably have more than 30+ hours without even exiting the Cave to Rhone.

[Anonymous No.6131073]

>>6129107
I enjoyed the gameboy remake. I hate 2 though

[Anonymous No.6131076]

>>6130850
You've got a weird definition of spastic, friend. You need the patience of a rock to enjoy a game that is literally
>walk three steps
>random encounter against four enemies
>finish battle
>walk another step
>random encounter against five enemies

[Anonymous No.6131174]

I enjoy grinding.

[Anonymous No.6131263]

>>6131076
Use holy water or equivalent effects if you want to be left alone.

[Anonymous No.6131282]

I think this thread kind of embodies the worst aspects of /vr/. DQ1 is as close to an objectively bad JRPG as you can get with its nonexistent story, grindy one-dimensional gameplay, and mediocre at best everything else. But since this is /vr/, you have apologists of two kinds: "It's the grand daddy of JRPGs so you have to call it good!" or "I actually like that it sucks!". Nostalgia and braindead bias both.

I like retro games and retro gaming, but man, why do people have to let nostalgia and rose-tinted glasses rot their brain like this? If a game sucks it sucks. Just say that it sucks. Why go through all the song and dance of pretending a bad game is good just because it's old? It's pathetic.

Also, this is coming from someone who has DQ1's influence beat over his head every single day. I would never deny it is influential. But influential and good are very different things.

[Anonymous No.6131295]

>>6131282
I liked the game as a kid. It presented an adventure and a challenge that was appealing to me. A big part of the game was trying to maximize your grind and kill as many monsters as possible before having to go to the inn and spend money, all so you could afford new weapons and armor and items. The game was really unforgiving, but that just made the adventure feel more adventurous.
If you don’t like this game, that’s fine. There’s other games to play. But other people did enjoy it.

[Anonymous No.6131301]

>>6131295
Like many things, it's understandable for kids to enjoy bad games since they're sparkly eyed and don't know any better. DQ1 as a first JRPG could definitely be perceived to be good due to this combination of ignorance and boundless excitement. But adults should know better. I don't see anyone here talking about liking it as a kid or as a first JRPG, it's adults talking from the perspective of adults, and that's embarrassing for them.

[Anonymous No.6131319]

>>6131263
You need to level up, however, and that can only be done by engaging in multiple repetitive fights. And holy water doesn't work in dungeons.
>>6131282
Agree. Dragon Quest is a nice curiosity, but if Square Enix released that game today everyone would be saying it is shit. And that's because it simply is.

Which is why like you said this thread embodies the worst aspects of /vr/: you just don't know when to trust anons when their love for a given game could simply be chalked up to nostalgia.

[Anonymous No.6131330]

>>6131319
>Dragon Quest is a nice curiosity, but if Square Enix released that game today everyone would be saying it is shit. And that's because it simply is.
Or because video games have advanced and evolved over time. If you released the original Star Wars today, people would criticize the effects (probably by wrongly blaming CGI) and complain that the pacing is too slow, and say the story is too straight forward and bland with no twists and no new ideas. Complaining that an old game plays like an old game and stating that it wouldn't stand up to modern standards is ridiculous. You might as well be complaining that the game isn't in 3D or whatever.

[Anonymous No.6131332]

>>6131282
>objectively
Yeah nah you're an idiot. I bet you think games age too.

[Anonymous No.6131334]

>>6131330
The original Star Wars holds up REALLY well. I only watched the original trilogy really recently and didn’t really feel it was dated at all. It would fit right in with all the practical effect style moves coming out recently. But your point still stands, old game is bad today because things have gotten way better. DQ is good if you played it when it was the only thing out. Same with FF1. Playing it now is just a chore unless you go BALS TO THE WALL or WHTE POWR MAGE ONLY

[Anonymous No.6131341]

>>6131334
>DQ is good if you played it when it was the only thing out.
There were other RPGs out there, just not on consoles.

[Anonymous No.6131346]

>>6131330
I'm not complaining an old game plays like an old game, but rather that a lot of people are unable to judge a game for what it is today than what it was when it was released. Not all of us live with nostalgia goggles on.

Your example of Star Wars is not bad but it's not particularly good either. That's because there's a world of diference between Dragon Quest and, say, Persona 5 (which I haven't played, but it's a dramatic departure from what Dragon Quest was), compared to the difference between Star Wars and Rise of Skywalker. The biggest issues are the practical effects, but other than that? Not much. The film is pretty much as good, but we have seen enough sci-fi films to make Star Wars not as big a cultural phenomenon as it was back then.

[Anonymous No.6131351]

>>6131332
Yeah nah you're an idiot. I bet you think games don't age too.

[Anonymous No.6131352]

>>6131334
>The original Star Wars holds up REALLY well.
That's nostalgia talking. No, it doesn't. Little kids get bored as fuck after five minutes. Kind of like you with DQ1. And if you tried to show little kids the despecialized edition, they're going to also say it looks like shit, because it does. If it came out today, the original Star Wars would be panned as a "shitty, low budget GotG clone." This is why it's kind of dumb to judge movies and games by modern standards, because technology advances and shit changes.

[Anonymous No.6131353]

>>6131282
That's cool and all but have you considered that you don't have everything figured out like you think you do and that people having different opinions than you is not a conspiracy to artificially inflate the status of an old video game?
I like the simple premise, the way the dialogue is written, writing down clues and drawing maps, exploring the simple world, seeing an expensive item in a shop and slowly scrounging up enough gold to buy it, and only having to worry about a single character the whole time through. Getting strong enough that I can waltz through a dungeon as one dude and kill every monster before they can even touch me is fun. Also the monster designs are fucking sick eat my asshole retard

[Anonymous No.6131354]

>>6131341
Chances are that if you first RPG was Dragon Warrior, you had never touched a computer in your life.

Ironically a lot of the elements people praise about Dragon Quest III
>you could create an entire party of characters!
>you could pick jobs!
were already present in Wizardry. It's amazing how Yuji Horii got away with making people believe his games were improving over time, when all he was really doing was easing people in to the most "complex" mechanics present in Wizardry: first he gives you one character, then he gives you multiple characters with specialized roles (and poorly balanced to boot), and finally he lets you create your entire party from scratch (minus the Hero).

[Anonymous No.6131357]

>>6131353
I never said anything about a conspiracy. And I'm not surprised that someone who would use crude language like "eat my asshole retard" is stupid enough to need to write down clues and draw maps in what you yourself described as a simple world. All you're doing is cementing that adult DQ1 fans are dumb manchildren.

[Anonymous No.6131358]

>>6131352
>That's nostalgia talking.
Did you missed the part of their post when they said they saw the original trilogy recently?

[Anonymous No.6131359]

>>6131346
>The biggest issues are the practical effects, but other than that? Not much.
Star Wars 77 is so fucking slow and absolutely nothing happens compared to something like Rise of Skywalker where so much shit is constantly getting thrown at you. No, the only difference isn't "grayfics." There are fundamental differences when it comes to the pacing of the narrative between a movie from 1977 and a movie today. And there's fundamental differences when it comes to the pacing of a game from the 80s and a game from today.

[Anonymous No.6131362]

>>6131353
The problem is that everything you mention as a positive about Dragon Warrior is fine and all. But Dragon Warrior is literally grinding upon grinding. That's the crux of the matter: it's not about "how can people enjoy these graphics?" (akin to that Star Wars analogy), but rather, "how can people enjoy this kind of gameplay style that rightfully faded into oblivion mere years after it appeared?".

Because I'll be the first to admit that DQ has charming graphics and music, but the first DQ is so grindy any reasonable person is bound to ask themselves "why am I even doing this?".

[Anonymous No.6131364]

>>6131358
You can be nostalgic for shit you didn't experience thanks to pop culture osmosis. The original trilogy has been shoved so down all our throats and put on a pedestal that it's hard for anyone except kids who have yet to experience that to give it an objective viewing, hence why I was talking about me showing it to little kids (I taught English in China for a year after college and showed my students Star Wars: they all said it was shit and were bored in five minutes).

[Anonymous No.6131365]

The Star Wars analogy is interesting because the new Star Wars movies are fucking terrible

[Anonymous No.6131367]

>>6131362
>(akin to that Star Wars analogy)
That wasn't the analogy. The analogy was that that "beloved" movie is now seen as boringly slow, kind of like a game where it's "grinding upon grinding."

[Anonymous No.6131368]

>>6131365
Modern games are also terrible.

[Anonymous No.6131371]

>>6131367
I know people who won't watch any "old movies" because they're "boring and slow." They categorize old movies as anything made in the 1990s or older.

[Anonymous No.6131373]

>>6131359
I haven't seen Rise of Skywalker but I've seen films where so much shit is constantly getting thrown at you (namely something like Captain America: Civil War). And Star Wars' is simply paced better. That's because films weren't universally paced the same back then or now. Whereas JRPGs have nearly universally gotten rid of the extreme grind of Dragon Quest 1, where 95% of the game WAS the grind, because there literally wasn't nothing to do besides visit, what, 4 dungeons aside fom the castle?

1) The one where you find the tablet of Erdrick.
2) The one with the Harp.
3) The one where the Princess is being held prisoner.
4) The one where you get a ring.

Everything else was just grinding until you could get to the next town, find out where you were supposed to go next, and keep grinding so you wouldn't die.

[Anonymous No.6131380]

>>6131373
Star Wars 77 is literally a movie where people sit around and talk about farming water over cups of blue milk, and also gay robots bumbling around with zero point. And there's only, like, three locations in the movie in total (desert world, inside space ships, and forest world which we really don't get to see much of). Boring movie. So gland they started making good movies, like The Emoji Movie.

[Anonymous No.6131382]

>>6131367
>>6131364
>You can be nostalgic for shit you didn't experience thanks to pop culture osmosis.
I'm aware, but to say that anyone who thinks Star Wars has held up well is being nostalgic is disingenuous. I'm not a fan of Star Wars, but the first film works well enough that I'd rather watch that than the MCU abominations we are getting these past years. Really, I saw Civil War on TV a few times already and it's basically characters doing nothing but fighting and cracking jokes. Showing a film to kids and expect them to appreciate it is pretty dumb, to be honest.

The actual question is: who sees Star Wars as boringly slow? Because I sure don't think it is either. Movies like Star Wars ("boring" and "slow") are still being made today, very very often, and very very often those earn the most awards, while films like those of the MCU only rack up cash.

Meanwhile, you see no game that plays like Dragon Quest racking up awards. As traditional as the Dragon Quest franchise is, as far back as Dragon Quest II you didn't have to grind anywhere near as much to go anywhere at the beginning of the game (the balance was fucked later on, but still).

[Anonymous No.6131397]

Grinding, in and of itself, isn't inherently bad. What is bad is mindless grinding where there's no challenge, where you'd be better off macroing the game because you really don't need to see the screen or even be present because it's not like you'll ever really die killing level 1 rats or whatever.
As memory serves, Dragon Warrior 1 isn't a game like that. As you get higher level, lower level monsters will stop attacking as frequently (and encounters with them will often result in them running away before they ever attack), forcing you to move further into the game as you level up, with the end result being that the fights you have while grinding are going to challenge you in some way. I don't see the issue some people are having in the thread with this.

[Anonymous No.6131405]

>>6131382
>but to say that anyone who thinks Star Wars has held up well is being nostalgic is disingenuous.
It really isn't. The original Star Wars is held on such a high pedestal thanks to nostalgia. Do you know who really loves Star Wars these days? People in their 30s and 40s and up. People in their 20s generally don't give two fucks about Star Wars.
And no, adventure films paced like old Star Wars are most certainly not being made today. The MCU is not at all paced like old Star Wars, they're very much modern movies with modern pacing. You absolutely will not see a modern blockbuster with pacing as slow as the 1977 version of Star Wars. You're 100% wrong on that.

[Anonymous No.6131407]

>>6131397
Everything you said about the concept of grinding correct. However, Dragon Warrior only really gets difficult (for a short while) after you enter a new zone. Then it's only a matter of grinding mindlessly until you can survive the next.

Basically, it goes like this
>enter a new zone able to survive
>grind 25% until the zone goes from "difficult" to "very manageable".
>grind 75% until you can survive into the next zone
This means that any given zone overstays its welcome. That's 75% of grinding that can be macroed.

[Anonymous No.6131408]

>>6131397
It's still so simple that you can just mash buttons while watching TV or something, and that's what makes it bad in my opinion. All games with brainless grinding like that end up homogeneous in experience since you're always just mashing buttons while focusing your actual attention on something else. There's even a guy in this thread talking about how he watched TV while playing DQ1 and it's like, when the game is that unengaging, it's hard to defend it. You might as well be praising the TV show instead since that's what kept your attention.

[Anonymous No.6131409]

>>6131407
Maybe I just played it differently, but I never encountered this problem. If I got bored of a spot, I just moved on to a more challenging spot.

[Anonymous No.6131413]

>>6131408
You can just mash buttons while watching TV, but you'll die and lose half your gold or whatever.

[Anonymous No.6131415]

>>6131405
It's depressing that you're really holding up post-millennials and the Chinese as infallible film critics and expecting everyone to go along with it

[Anonymous No.6131420]

>>6131405
I'm a person in their 20s who doesn't give two fucks about Star Wars but I still think the first two films are good.
>You absolutely will not see a modern blockbuster with pacing as slow as the 1977 version of Star Wars. You're 100% wrong on that.
I can't think of films similar to Star Wars when it comes to the basic structure, where the story is the focus over the espectacle. Avatar, maybe? It mixes both story and high quality visuals, but without sacrificing the plot in favor of fights like the MCU films do. There are films like Interstellar, which are more philosophical in nature and thus slower than something like Star Wars, which is meant to be an adventure. But I think that's the key element here: how many films nowadays are genuinely adventures, and how many films back then were genuinely adventures?

Star Wars is a very unique film: it became a cultural phenomenom because there wasn't anything like it before (or since).

[Anonymous No.6131421]

>>6131409
I would do that too but more often than not, enemies could prove a ridiculous threat (Magic Wyverns) that would undo my valuable gold resources.

[Anonymous No.6131425]

>>6131413
You can pay enough attention to both as to enjoy the film and avoid dying in Dragon Quest. Trying to achieve something like that in Castlevania is impossible by the very virtue of its action gameplay, but many RPGs also require that you pay attention to your every move.

When you are basically doing the same fights over and over again, you know what to expect, and that's what grinding is at the most basic level: keep fighting over and over again in the same place to rack up experience.

[Anonymous No.6131430]

>>6131415
I never said they were right. I said that's their opinion based on changes in the medium. They're used to movies that are much faster where more shit happens. Fuck, the last Star Wars movie had a scene where they were hyperspace jumping over and over and over, and showing up at tons of different locations so fast that if you blinked, you'd literally miss it. Kind of a huge departure from the old movies. And let's not talk about the modern laser swordfights versus that fight where an old man shakes his lasersword at a cripple in a robot death suit who can also barely move.
Yeah modern games are fast paced and a lot of shit happens in them, so I can see why people would get bored by an older game in contrast.

[Anonymous No.6131436]

>>6131425
>but many RPGs also require that you pay attention to your every move.
So go ahead and name a few that were made before DQ1.

[Anonymous No.6131440]

>>6131421
That's a part of the challenge and what makes it fun.

[Anonymous No.6131448]

>>6131436
Wizardry. The same battle can go 10/10 or 1/10 if you are unlucky. In Dragon Quest, you need a ridiculous amount of bad luck for an otherwise very easy battle to go awfully bad (such as missing several hits in a row and your enemy landing several criticals in a row).

[Anonymous No.6131448,1]

>>6131430
they want everything instantly,for example in most modern games you have DLC,loot boxes,start overpowered and similar stuff,not only that in some games you die but is not really die since you can just pay to avoid the death this is why they don't tolerate to die in older games since they have to start everything again for example dying in dragon quest means you have to start all over again the dungeon and search for the items again and money you don't get that on modern games since is a struggle you have to plan everything each time you left town,predict what is the worst scenario,and similar stuff and it gives you a sensation you are doing something important something you don't get on modern games.
you mention the last star wars movie but that movie is shit (the latest 3) they barelly make sense not only that they are just a cheap copy of the first six since tar wars is the story of anakin skywalker from his beggining to the fall and the redemption.

[Anonymous No.6131461]

>>6131448
>In Dragon Quest, you need a ridiculous amount of bad luck for an otherwise very easy battle to go awfully bad (such as missing several hits in a row and your enemy landing several criticals in a row).
So stop farming low level monsters and move on earlier if you want a challenge. The issue isn't the game but how you're choosing to play it.

[Anonymous No.6131473]

>>6131461
You move on to the next zone. And what? All that changes is that you need to heal more often between battles. But the point still stands: every single battle is easily manageable, with the only genuine threats being the mobs that can put you to sleep.

[Anonymous No.6131482]

>>6131473
>You move on to the next zone. And what?
You're faced with more challenging encounters where you could die if you're not careful and don't pay attention. You know, the thing you were asking for.

[Anonymous No.6131486]

>>6131352
>>6131364
>>6131365
>>6131367
>>6131382
>>6131405
>>6131420
My toddlers really like them to. We watched the first three movies together over a weekend. I watched it because my 21 year old brother got really into the original trilogy. The franchise as a whole really but he loves the original trilogy. Me and my kids sat down and watched it as our weekend “activity” and all really enjoyed them. We’re going to watch the prequels at some point but the original movie’s cinematography is quite good. I don’t really think the moves are any “slower” than newer movies. But then again my kids know to not expect action to happen constantly in movies. I hate rapid fire crap that comes out. But that’s always been a thing.

[Anonymous No.6131491]

>>6131482
And like I said, these last for 25% of the new zone, with the 75% remaining being dedicating to grinding just so that you don't die to the first encounter you see in the next zone.

[Anonymous No.6131498]

>>6131482
That just isn’t how the whole series is. At all. They’re all very accessible games in a good way with good variety. The early games are very aged but they’re just old. It’s no fault of their own. To say the games provide significant challenge just isn’t true though

[Anonymous No.6131528]

>>6131491
And like I said, if you ever feel like you're grinding with zero challenge, you can just push forward. There's really nothing wrong here: if you get bored and shit is too easy, move on.
>>6131498
Everyone is talking about DQ1, not the series as a whole. The series as a whole is way different from game to game.
They actually do provide a challenge if you don't sit and farm low level monsters. Your complaint isn't with the game, it's with how you've chosen to play it. You can just play it differently, though.
It'd be like if I complained about grinding extra lives in Super Mario Bros. Yeah, you can do it, and yeah, I guess it technically makes the game easier, but you can also just move on and not grind easy 1-Ups to complete the game. If grinding easy monsters is boring to you, be a big boy and start fighting tougher monsters, where you actually have to pay attention and not just spam attack because if you just spam the attack, you're gonna die.

[Anonymous No.6131537]

Not with these horrible filters i wouldnt

But answering the subject the grind in DQI is calming, almost esoteric. The feeling of being strong enough to move to the next area soothes me. If anything felt lots better than grinding in other DQ games specially II, burn that final stretch of that game (Rhoe or whatever) with passion.

[Anonymous No.6131551]

>>6131528
Any game can have challenge if you force it to be challenging though. I don’t really get your point. People do no coin SMB runs, Pacifist Doom and similar challenges for other games that are normally quite easy. Of course you can impose arbitrary limitations on yourself to create challenge. But the first game just isn’t hard man. That isn’t insulting to it but it’s mostly just a grindy game without a lot of strategy even if you don’t grind. If they really didn’t want you doing that they would’ve properly scaled XP and created some diminishing returns. Why are you so defensive about it?

[Anonymous No.6131557]

>>6131551
>"this game isn't challenging, it's just an easy grind"
>just move on
>"but i don't want to move on i want an easy grind"
Also, you claim to hate repetitive grinds but are being very repetitively, constantly repeating the same gripe over and over despite your gripe having no merit when you can just literally move on to a more challenging spot if the spot you're at isn't challenging enough for you, so let's stop the conversation here and move on to something else.

[Anonymous No.6131562]

>>6131557
I don’t find pure challenge just for challenge fun. That’s retarded. There’s no strategy to the battles. They’re very black and white. I don’t see what you aren’t understanding about that. A game doesn’t have to be hard to be fun.

[Anonymous No.6131615]

I played the mobile version of DW1 and enjoyed it... it does cut a lot of the grinding, but I think the concept of the game is sound.

Speedrunning is cancer but this is really cool, guy manips the RNG in realtime (Run starts at 7:09):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bgh30BiWG58

[Anonymous No.6132039]

Art doesn't age. Written works, film, vidya, its the same now as when it was printed. If you think a silent film is bad now because of a change in movie making or that the cistine chapel is no longer beautiful then you are just a philistine. You'd rather believe there is a cabal of anonymous posters pretending something is good for clout than consider the possibility that your own tastes are immature. You can accept this and try and grow or continue being a close minded troglodyte.

[Anonymous No.6132283]

>>6131615
Holy autism.

[Anonymous No.6132336]

>>6132039
Autism

[BruceWayne5150 No.6132353]

>>6129107
I loved grinding in DW1. But was also doing lots of coke back then.

[Anonymous No.6132365]

>>6131352
>That's nostalgia talking. No, it doesn't. Little kids get bored as fuck after five minutes.
Imagine basing the quality of a film on how quickly 5 year olds get bored.

[Anonymous No.6132373]

>>6131448
>Wizardry. The same battle can go 10/10 or 1/10 if you are unlucky.
Which is why nobody actually grinds interesting encounters in Wizardry; eventually some mage is going to instakill fireball your whole party and you'll have to start over (assuming you're playing with "permadeath" as intended).

Which is why everyone just grinds that one easy ghost encounter on the first floor for hours before teleporting directly to the bottom floor to find Werdna. 95% of the game is empty halls of random encounters, none of which are as productive as just grinding on Floor 1. It's worse than Dragon Warrior.

[Anonymous No.6132384]

>>6132373
>play game as intended
>end up having to grind a ghost
lmao "intended"

[Anonymous No.6132458]

>>6132373
You don't have to start over after your party got wiped, you can retrieve and revive them. If you keep losing parties to spells then you are doing things wrong.
You don't have to grind at all and you're only talking about Wizardry 1.

[Anonymous No.6132465]

>>6130427
Nah, if you call out the bait it doesn't count as taking the bait. As long as they don't bump the thread they are just posting a warning to all the gullible children on this board.

[Anonymous No.6132519]

>>6129138
underrated post

[Anonymous No.6133291]

>>6131330
A New Hope >>>>>>> these crappy Disney Star Wars movies

[Anonymous No.6133302]

>>6131359
>Star Wars 77 is so fucking slow
No it isn't. It's popcorn movie-tier pacing just like a typical Spielberg movie.

>Rise of Skywalker
It's fucking shit. Kill yourself tranny.

[Anonymous No.6133308]

>>6129107
Only about half of the people who bought it on release.

[Anonymous No.6133314]

>>6129107
It's one of the best looking NES games, that's for sure.

[Anonymous No.6133318]

>>6129107
>playing turd-based jarpigs
Maybe with x100 sanic fast forward lmao shitty genre

[Anonymous No.6133319]

>>6133314
Not really when you have shit like the Mega Man series or Kirby's Adventure.

[Anonymous No.6133323]

>>6129138
Jarpigs are the only genre that rewards time spent in front of a screen instead of actually thinking and reacting.

[Anonymous No.6133834]

>>6132373
>Which is why nobody actually grinds interesting encounters in Wizardry; eventually some mage is going to instakill fireball your whole party and you'll have to start over (assuming you're playing with "permadeath" as intended).

I think the intended way to play the game is to cheat. In Wizardry, at least in the earlier games, there's zero way to avoid the RNG giving you a full party wipe in the later levels, sending your many hours of effort down the drain. No sane person would grind for hours to create a rescue party to save the dead characters. By the time your rescue party is sufficiently powerful to reach the area where your characters died, you don't even need your original party anymore. It makes no sense from a game play perspective. Compared to rogue-likes, rogue-likes at least give you a chance to handle dangerous encounters. With Wizardry, you basically have no chance to avoid/kill such enemies when they surprise you.

[Anonymous No.6134692]

>>6131359
You are an idiot if you think the pacing of Rise of skywalker is better than a new hope, end of story

[Anonymous No.6134767]

>>6133834
I've done it multiple times. The rescue party doesn't need to be as strong, just enough to get to the point and drag the bodies out.
An important part is equipment, characters can punch above their weight if they have access to equipment from the lower levels. You can also use a rotation system to have the necessary reserves ready.
The worst that can happen to you isn't character death or party wipe but level drain.

[Anonymous No.6135106]

>>6132373
I never said grinding was a fun, I only mentioned an example of a game that keeps you on your toes despite being a turn-based RPG. Wizardry's encounters are good because they discourage grinding, but the game itself is bad because it encourages grinding and gives you the means to do it.

No RPG should require grinding, which is why I like Fallout and the IE games design philosophy so much: much of the exp you gain is through quests, as opposed to by beating monsters over and over. This makes for a steady progression through the game without being curb stomped by enemies.

Wizardry could have achieved something similarly if the devs had put enough thought into it, e.g. by finding certain precious items in the dungeon, or even by making it to the next floor.

[Anonymous No.6135246]

>>6129107
This board is slacking today.

[Anonymous No.6135474]

>>6134692
That anon said they're different, not that one is better than the other. You're an idiot who can't read.

[Anonymous No.6135497]

>>6131357
lmao get a trip so I can follow your shitposts after this thread dies

[Anonymous No.6135506]

>>6135497
Where plebs foolishly praise the DQ series, I'll be there.

[Anonymous No.6135509]

>>6135506
absolute badass

[Anonymous No.6135537]

>>6135506
I think DQ1-3 are great fun even today. The modern updates with the dialects just make it even better for me. God, I love being me; I’m great

[Anonymous No.6135789]

Kind of surprised there's a salty fag in this thread hating on the first Dragon Warrior/Quest because it's a pretty good game.

[Anonymous No.6135794]

>>6129107
Looks like an Ultima clone.

[Anonymous No.6135957]

>>6129270
did you unironically enjoy the grind?

[Anonymous No.6136692]

Its outside the realm of veearr but I just finished Dragon Quest XI and liked it alot. Kind of want to check out the first game. I never play my NES ever so it'll be a cool change of pace.

[Anonymous No.6136694]

>>6135506
^^^^ fuckin' this

I'll join you in this epic battle against ignorance and evil. Only together can we smite the enemies of enlightenment and truth.

[Anonymous No.6136705]

>>6135506
>>6136694
What is it about “different opinions” that bother you so much then?

[Anonymous No.6136717]

>>6129107
Nah

[Anonymous No.6136849]

>>6133314
Doesn't look too bad, that's for sure.

[Anonymous No.6136851]

>>6135506
The romantic shitposter, bane of jrpgs.

[Anonymous No.6136882]

>>6129138
i agree with peter faulk.
when i played this game, it was new and i didnt know about grinding. it was like 88 or 89 and i was in 3rd grade (i think). i thought this game was amazing at the time.
also unrelated, check out "a woman under the influence" thats a really good movie

[Anonymous No.6137603]

>>6136692
Yeah, do it m8. It's a comfy super simple game. Short enough that its simplicity won't have time to bore you.

[Anonymous No.6137713]

http://shmuplations.com/dragonquest30th/

[Anonymous No.6137754]

>>6137713
Fucking nice.

[Anonymous No.6138584]

Tried DW1 on nes for a few minutes. Dropped it very quickly. Tried it again on GBC and beat it. Now I'm playing DQ2 on SNES, 15h in, great game. Don't play the nes/famicom versons, they're trash

[Anonymous No.6138590]

>>6131282
I'll take the bait. I finished DQ1 on gbc two weeks ago. It took something like 8 hours to finish it. The story is simple yet charming and cool. The adventure feels like an actual adventure with clues you get from NPCs in towns etc... It's a good game. Sure if it was release today it'd be considered as a bad game but for nes era, it's amazing.

t. 20yo zoomzoom

[Anonymous No.6138771]

>>6138590
DQ1 for the GBC cut down on the grinding a lot. It also fucked up the balance because as soon as you get the Fireball spell you can kill stuff in one hit that on the NES would require two. Thus grinding is cut down even more.

[Anonymous No.6138951]

>>6137713
Seems like a good watch, thanks for sharing!

[Anonymous No.6138958]

>>6137713
Why can't you post a link to the video instead of plugging that site?

[Anonymous No.6138964]

>>6138958
Not him, but they made the subs, so why not? shmuplations is a good site anyway, there's a lot of translated interviews, check out their other stuff.

[Anonymous No.6138968]

>>6138964
All I see is advertisement for their Patreon.
Why not link to NHK who made the actual video? Or to Enix who made the game? This reeks of marketing.

[Anonymous No.6138974]

>>6138968
You don't need to pay for anything though, they just accept donations.
>Why not link to NHK who made the actual video?
Not everyone knows japanese. Are you that anon that loves rubbing off in everyone's face that you know nihongo and anyone that plays the english version is a plebeian and not a "true fan"?

[Anonymous No.6138987]

>>6138974
They have English websites
https://www.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld-blog/english/
https://www.square-enix.com/

[Anonymous No.6138996]

>>6138987
Retaaaaaaard!

[Anonymous No.6139000]

>>6138987
You can't find this specific Special in those links, so what is the point?

[Anonymous No.6139006]

>>6139000
The point was the claim they deserved credit for the special.
You can find the special on Youtube.
It's time somebody reported those scammers for making money with the work of others and having the guts to advertise it everywhere.

[Anonymous No.6139008]

>tfw when you spend weeks grinding hoping to join the Dragonlord at his side and become evil as fuck but instead die instantly

[Anonymous No.6139014]

>>6139006
>The point was the claim they deserved credit for the special.
That was not the point of the claim.
They deserve credit for the subs, which are for a 48-minutes video, they allowed more fans to enjoy a Dragon Quest-related content, if you know japanese, good for you, but there's people out there that are grateful for these translations, it's not some conspiracy theory.

[Anonymous No.6139251]

>>6138590
I think as you play more games and acquire more nuanced taste you'll see how wrong you really are. DQ1 is so bereft of redeemable qualities that pretty much any functional game will meet the standards you impose, which is to say that your position at the moment does not rest on DQ1 actually being good, but on DQ1 being so barebones that it lacks superficial elements for the unintelligent to target - note that DQ1 absolutely does not have a "simple" story that's "charming" and "cool", it has no story. There's a gaping black hole where a story should be. To even suggest that DQ1 has a story and not just a few flimsy lines of generic narration is an insult to every JRPG ever made, which you would know if you had played more JRPGs, the ultimate conceit to all this. Come back and play DQ1 when you're more seasoned with JRPGs so you can make a more balanced assessment of it, rather than give it undeserved praise simply for being lacking enough to be a round ball without any potential edges. Unless, of course, you strive to enjoy games that lack redeemable qualities for fear of them challenging you or your expectations whatsoever, in which case please continue to enjoy playing with the tiny baby's ball that is DQ1 without ever growing wiser or more experienced.

Incidentally, I must confess that retro games in general tend to have a dearth in quality JRPGs due potentially im part to small storage sizes restricting the size of a game's script, so I will not have many recommendations to give to he who limits himself to the classics for reasons of pride and self-esteem. The JRPGs which I hold in the highest regard and are comfortable giving my full recommendation are, in fact, "not retro" and thus will not be posted here. This unfortunate fact, however, does not change that DQ1 is bottom of the barrel and anyone who likes it is varying degrees of ignorant and/or stupid.

[Anonymous No.6139261]

>>6139251
You talk like a fag and your shit's all retarded

[Anonymous No.6139275]

>>6139261
based

>>6139251
fuck off

[Anonymous No.6139276]

>>6139261
>>6139275
Not an argument. Looks like I win, kiddos.

[Anonymous No.6139280]

>>6139251
>Storytelling can only be done through dialogue
>My zoomer brain has so little imagination it’s impossible for me to get immersed unless the game has le shiny HD graphics and voice acting
>>>/v/

[Anonymous No.6139286]

>>6139280
Look man, if you want to project your own delusional fantasies onto a game and then call it good because you pretended it was something else, be my guest. Forgive me for expecting my games to be good on their own merits and not because I'm pretending they're good.

[Anonymous No.6139305]

>>6139286
It’s okay, zoomer. You can’t recognize nuance and other means of telling a story. I won’t fault you for being incapable of seeing the forest for the trees.

Just... don’t start preaching to those who can, okay? Ciao.

[Anonymous No.6139312]

>>6139305
Was that last line supposed to sound cool or impressive? Ouch.

But yeah, my bad, I should have accounted for the children past and present on this board being so easy to please that encountering the puff-puff girl or fighting some dragon accounts for an epic story of one's own devise instead of trifling non-events in the background of more nothing.

[Anonymous No.6139318]

>>6139312
Are you playing in Japanese? A lot of the nuance gets lost in translation.

[Anonymous No.6139321]

>>6139318
>It.. it’s better in Japanese
My favorite DQueer cope. Your shitty series is targeted towards children and regards; don’t act like it’s actually high art in any shape or form.

[Anonymous No.6139324]

>>6139318
>It.. it’s better in Japanese
My favorite DQueer cope. Your shitty series is targeted towards children and retards; don’t act like it’s actually high art in any shape or form.

[Anonymous No.6139347]

>>6139318
Actually, for what I've seen of DQ1 the translators were actually extremely competent (perhaps they had a good editor who knew how to write English well), so I think it's more enjoyable to read in English than in Japanese. This is because it's really easy to make text sound dramatic/old timey in Japanese with just a few sentence-enders and such, which makes it more bland and uninteresting, whereas the English has a more fresh and difficult to capture style. Just look at the JP script on Gamefaqs to compare both the original text to the TL, and the script provider's TL to the professional TL - it's clear as day that the NES script is better than both.

That said, we're not talking about anything amazing here, and the fancier prose of the English script can hardly support a plot as vapid as DQ1's. It is undoubtedly true that the "read in the original JP" argument holds true for a vast majority of JRPGs both classic and modern - with Final Fantasy, for instance, I would strongly recommend playing in Japanese for the PS1 trilogy. But DQ as a series is so bland and lacking that it really doesn't make a big difference.

[Anonymous No.6139357]

>>6139347
Ah, you’re a Final Fantasy drone. Makes perfect sense now. :)

[Anonymous No.6139382]

>>6139357
Please do not misinterpret my usage of a widely recognized series as anything but an attempt to assist understanding through familiar ground. It's just a fact that the English translations of FF7 and 9 are extremely lacking, and I think those are the games people are most likely to be familiar with the translation problems of.

That said, FF in general definitely dunks on DQ. One series is consistently trying new things in interesting ways, while the other is repeating largely the same formula for ten games straight. As someone interested in games as a whole and new experiences, FF is a much more enriching than DQ. This comparison is somewhat poisoned by all those who will jump to state that FF wouldn't exist without DQ and that DQ by coming first is superior to FF, but anyone foolish enough to put weight in arguments that fallacious are not worth discussing video games with.

[Anonymous No.6139392]

>>6139382
If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
This is the last reply I’ll give some pseudo-expert on game design and storytelling.

[Anonymous No.6139406]

>>6139392
I'm very familiar with the fact that babies can continue to play with colorful balls for hours at a time, and if their brain were to never grow that they would play with balls for the rest of their lives. However, this does not change that the more enlightened crave more from their entertainment, and I would advise you to not base your life positions on ignorance and stupidity if you would like other people to treat your opinions with respect. A child playing with his DQ toy need not join a high-level discussion beyond his comprehension.

[Anonymous No.6139412]

>>6139406
What’s your favorite RPG you pretentious faggot?

[Anonymous No.6139424]

>>6139412
I would not care to sully its pristine name by throwing pearls before swines, and I would especially not care to offer a recommendation fresh off insulting a beloved series, for fear of sending a horde of fanboys off to an unjust war. Just know that my favorite RPG is leagues above anything DQ has ever hoped to be. Not that being better than DQ is a particularly high order. Japanese reimaginings of DQ games (Such as ウォーターは俺の娘 for DQ5) are nigh universally superior to the originals, which really makes you think.

[Anonymous No.6139428]

>>6139424
>I’m too much of a bitch to expose what a fucking pleb I am and have you big mean DQ Chads deconstruct my shitty nu-JRPG
Also lmao if you think people will actually respect you more because of your taste in vidya. Top-tier delusions coming from someone who’s almost certainly overweight.

[Anonymous No.6139438]

>>6139428
Good to know that your thought process ultimately falls back to weight insults because that's the limit of your imagination and your world. Gambling on someone being overweight to hurt them (You were wrong, by the way) instead of deducing emotional weakness through subtle hints in their posts to attack is yet more evidence of your lacking intellect. Just stick to DQ, kid, and let the adults talk.

[Anonymous No.6139445]

>>6139438
>Still won’t name his favorite RPG
It’s pretty easy to deduce you’re a quivering vagina.

[Anonymous No.6139481]

This thread disappoints me.

[Anonymous No.6139610]

>>6139481
Edison should be Enix, since he only stole ideas to put his patent on them, like how Enix never actually developed any games.

[Anonymous No.6139614]

>>6139610
Lmao only on 4chan do you see this kind of stupid contrarianism.

[Anonymous No.6139893]

>>6139610
The brainlet is strong with this one

[Anonymous No.6140220]

>>6139481
Based

[Anonymous No.6140224]

>>6129107
>I can't imagine a single person that would enjoy grinding this game all the way to beat it
This dude would.

[Anonymous No.6140232]

>>6139481
It really do be like that

[Anonymous No.6140250]

I quit DQ1 because I went to every area 3 or 4 times over and made 0 progress.

[Anonymous No.6140264]

>>6129107
It's a boring Earthbound clone

[Anonymous No.6140269]

>>6140224
I don't know, you have to specifically enter the command to use stairs. I think he'd avoid it like the plague.

[Anonymous No.6140286]

>>6139481
This needs to be posted more. Fuck SquareSoft

[Anonymous No.6140906]

>Lmao only on 4chan do you see this kind of stupid contrarianism.

[Anonymous No.6140924]

>>6139481
>implying DQ wasn't born by ripping off Ultima and Wizardry
>implying DQ didn't went on to pass off its ripoffs as innovations in DQII and DQIII with multiple party members, character creation and classes

[Anonymous No.6141016]

>>6140924
How does it feel, being the one insufferable shitposter in a generally friendly board?

[Anonymous No.6141018]

I'm trying to grind out all the gold monster medals in pic related. yes I am autistic

[Anonymous No.6141086]

>>6137713
Soul.

[Anonymous No.6141096]

>>6129107
horrible filter aside, DW1 is just a bad game all around. Next to no strategy, all you do is spam Attack and Heal and maybe Stopspell a single enemy if you're lucky, not to mention being paired with the entire game being grind.
>dude just grind on 20-30exp monsters for an hour to get one level

[Anonymous No.6141102]

>>6141096
It’s a product of its time and space, fuck sake. It was perfectly engaging for a new console audience.

[Anonymous No.6141220]

>>6141102
Doesn't mean anybody has to like it now.

[Anonymous No.6141242]

>>6141016
How do you feel being a dumb jarpigger that doesn't know the history of his favorite franchise?

[Anonymous No.6141258]

>>6141220
You HAVE to like anything, I couldn’t give a fuck what your shitty taste is like

[Anonymous No.6141269]

What kind of faggot is butthurt over some old game for over a week?

[Anonymous No.6141375]

>>6141096
>not sleeping wolves
Overleveled spotted

[Anonymous No.6141380]

>>6129107
This is a grind fest sure, but when you know where the spots to grind are, it actually isnt too insufferable

[Anonymous No.6141397]

>>6139406
Holy shit you’re a raging faggot

[Anonymous No.6141640]

>>6129232
>it's still a great game today
I dunno about that. You're absolutely right that it's a hugely important piece of video-game history and definitely fascinating to play through, but the gameplay itself is just too basic to really call "good". In my view, a good JRPG is either one where you can keep the gameplay interesting by *not* grinding (forcing you to actually use the strategies that should exist in any well thought-out JRPG), or a game where character building is interesting enough that figuring out how to "solve" it and build OP characters is fun in and of itself. In DQ1, though, there's just nothing to it other than making sure your numbers are big enough to beat the enemy's so you can move on to the next enemy.

It's extremely charming though, and I'd certainly recommend that anyone with an interest in the genre check it out.

>>6131332
It's much rarer than some people will say, but some games do "age" -- usually ones that achieved something unique by pushing the hardware limitations of the time. DQ1 is a perfect example of that: At the time of its release, you weren't going to get a similar experience on a console. But everything it did has been improved and expanded upon as technology improved (hell, even as people learned to make better use of the same technology).

[Anonymous No.6142078]

>>6141397
Nice argument.

[Anonymous No.6142089]

>>6135506
Pretty based

[Anonymous No.6143226]

>>6135506
the hero /vr/ needs, but does not deserve.

[Anonymous No.6143309]

Start playing a game of DW1 in a good emulator and as soon as you exit the kings chamber, alter the memory at address 0xBE to FF. You now have all the best equipment in the game. Go marvel at just how far you have go before you need to grind for levels. You will probably be surprised.

[Anonymous No.6143467]

>>6137713
>woman under the influence
thank you for sharing this. Was really interesting

[Anonymous No.6144152]

>>6141640
I'll respond to both points since I'm actually the poster of both comments. As for the first one, taste is subjective friend, and you won't find a single person with identical tastes on the planet. I think the game is quite good and you aren't really going to convince me otherwise. I find the gameplay loop deeply satisfying. Exploring and investigating are better in DQ1 than a slew of modern games, and the combat loop ties in absolutely perfectly with this paradigm of wandering around and talking to people to figure out what to do. It's the tetris of jrpgs in that it is incredibly simple but very elegant and rewarding. I played it for the first time in 2019 by the way. As for your second point I see games as works of art and I take the position that any work of art cannot age. A film cannot age, a painting cannot age, a poem cannot age, a novel cannot age, and I don't believe games can age either. The flow of time can't make something that was once good less good. Examples: the Sistine chapel, the odyssey, Nosferatu, the fact that every single written work of significance in western canon is 100 years old. Standards and tastes can change but a piece of work cannot. DQ1 is just as good now as it was then. You of course as an individual have a different set of biases and personal experiences because you were not a part of the generation that grew up with the game, but examining any work of art through that lens is an extremely immature and fruitless endeavor. There's no value in it. It's like when people can't/refuse to enjoy silent films simply because they are silent. Abandoning that sort of prejudice is important to growing from a childish mindset to someone who is a true lover and patron of an art.

[Anonymous No.6144372]

>>6132039
It's a figure of speech.

[Anonymous No.6144375]

>I like DQ
>No you don't

[Anonymous No.6144376]

>>6129107
That's an easy thing to answer. The answer is that people enjoyed doing it before they had an unlimited amount of new stuff to keep looking at on the internet. Back in the 1980's when that game was released, it was an amazing experience just to be able to digitally interact with something on your TV with both audio and visual feedback.

tl;dr Perspective that kids today don't have

[Anonymous No.6144586]

>>6144152
Not the guy you responded to.
>As for your second point I see games as works of art and I take the position that any work of art cannot age.
>The flow of time can't make something that was once good less good.
You're wrong about this. It seems like you consider "good" (as in, aesthetic good) to be some sort of unchanging universal ideal, when that's definitely not the case. It wouldn't even make sense for that to be so. You said it yourself,
>Standards and tastes change
There is no other metric by which to judge whether a work of art is good except through standards and tastes, which are culture-specific and change over time. To think that there could be some sort of "aesthetic good" that exists out of culture is pretty ridiculous. It doesn't mean you can't have an appreciation for an older work of art or genuinely enjoy it, or that it's impossible for an older work of art to still have value, but all art changes in quality over time as new works of art reconfigure the aesthetic values of the culture from which they are born. Some works will age well, some won't.

TS Eliot presents this idea in his essay "Tradition and the Individual Talent":

>"What happens when a new work of art is created is something that happens simultaneously to all the works of art which preceded it. The existing monuments form an ideal order among themselves, which is modified by the introduction of the new (the really new) work of art among them. The existing order is complete before the new work arrives; for order to persist after the supervention of novelty, the whole existing order must be, if ever so slightly, altered; and so the relations, proportions, values of each work of art toward the whole are readjusted; and this is conformity between the old and the new."

A new work of art will inevitably cause us to re-evaluate the works of art that came before it. That's the inevitable result of working within a recognizable tradition.

[Anonymous No.6146234]

Dragon Quest is a good game.