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/vr/ - Retro Games

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File: 22 KB, 267x200, kirbys-dream-land-3.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
607881 No.607881 [Reply] [Original]

How could Kirby's Dreamland 3 be so bad when Kirby's Super Star was so good?

>> No.607891

It would have been OK, controls and art style were just clunky.

>> No.607901

Because Dreamland 3 is generic as fuck.

>> No.607918

>>607881
Super Star was Jackson Five, so Dream Land 3 is early MJ. So it's okay.

Some of the best music in the franchise, anyway.

>> No.607947

It wasn't bad though, just different. It's the most relaxing game in the series, for whatever that's worth.

>> No.607958

>>607947
Platformers aren't supposed to be relaxing.

>> No.607969

>One hit knocks your power out
>Powers only do one thing unless animal buddy
>2 player mode feels tacked on
>So slow
>animal gimmick not nearly as fun as Powers have multiple attacks and skills like Superstar

>> No.607984

>>607881
It was a clever idea, but the execution was quite awful.
The real reason though, was that this one and a few other Kirby games, 64 included, were created by the other Kirby guy who is not Sakurai. His Kirby games are storybookish and slow moving. They're okay, but they lack a certain special something that made Superstar so awesome.

>> No.607993

>>607958
If we're discussing Kirby then it's not like they're remotely challenging either

>> No.608008

Almost all the animals and powers did more harm than good and the clues for how to get the hearts were too vague.

>> No.608029

Dreamland 3 is a carbon copy of Dreamland 2, mixed with Yoshi´s Island without its fast paced action.
Although it has catchy music and corny graphics, is pretty meh.

>> No.608071

>The best kirby game
>Nothing but hate ITT

Never fails

>> No.608084

>>607958

Dude. It's Kirby. Kirby was made specifically to be an entry-level action-platformer.

>> No.608103
File: 148 KB, 512x512, shiggytime.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
608103

>>607958

>> No.608110

It's been a long time but I remember Dreamland 2 being a game that was actually very difficult to get 100% clear on, was I just too little? And is Dreamland 3 similar?

>> No.608120

I remember really liking dreamland 3 when I was a kid, I think I remember liking it even more than superstar.

I'm not sure how I'd feel if I went back and played it today, is it really as bad as you people are making it out to be?

>> No.608123

Didn't know there was so much criticism for Deamland 3... I personally thought the artstyle was gorgeous though.

>> No.608137

>>608120
No. It's just more slow paced, relaxing, and it's got a lot of puzzles. It's like the opposite of Super Star. I didn't really like super star

>> No.608141

>>608120
People are blowing it quite a bit out of proportion. It's slow controls take a bit to get used to, but once you do it's an excellent game.

>> No.608145

>>608137
Super Star was pretty relaxing.

>> No.608151

My only problem with it was it's vague objectives and lack of powers, which the partners almost make up for.

>> No.608157

>>608123
I feel the same, I liked the game.

Although the 'only one move per power' thing is really lame and I've always hated it, but I thought Super Star was the only awesome one.

>> No.608217

>>608120
It's fine. At least as good as Crystal Shards, which ripped it off wholesale.

>> No.608231
File: 763 KB, 450x255, catface.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
608231

>>608217
>There will never be another game with power mixing

>> No.608570
File: 9 KB, 256x224, kirby3b-1.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
608570

>Dat music
>Dat special graphics
>Dat difficulty to get all star-hearts
>Dose cameos in rob and samus
>All that variety in levels
>Dat final boss

I enjoyed the heck out of this game. Even did a good amount of levels on multiplayer. fuck you guys.

>> No.608578

>>608151
>7 abilities
>6 animal friends
>49 powers

>lack of powers

How?

>> No.608590
File: 128 KB, 816x832, 1367209640677.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
608590

>>607891
>clunky art-style

>> No.608915

>>607958
Why not?

>> No.609052

The way I see it, Kirby's Dreamland 2, Kirby's Dreamland 3, and Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards were very different from the rest of the series. They have significantly fewer powers than other games in the series, instead choosing to mix powers with animal companions or combine them, in the case of Kirby 64.

Ordinarily, I wouldn't mind this setup, but the problem is that all the powers and combinations royally suck. Many of them are unwieldy (especially in Kirby 64) or just plain useless (like the spike ability).

Personally, I prefer games like Super Star or Kirby's Adventure, which have a wide array of powerups, nearly all of which are useful in some way. Fortunately, Nintendo has made all their recent Kirby games in this style.

>> No.609070

>>607984
What other games did he work on? This is my favourite Kirby game. I like the story book feel

>> No.609137

Man, I prefer Super Star, Dream Land 2, Crystal Shards, and Adventure, but Dream Land 3 is not even remotely close to being a bad game.
I'm hard pressed to think of ANY Kirby game that is bad, really.
I mean, Squeak Squad was kind of mediocre... I guess...
Epic Yarn was decent the first time through, but there's pretty much no incentive to replay and that's disappointing...
That's the closest the series has ever been to "bad" as far as I can see.

>> No.609670

>>607881
>How could Kirby's Dreamland 3 be so bad when Kirby's Super Star was so good?
>How could Kirby's Dreamland 3 be so bad
wut

>> No.609756

>This thread
>Opinions

Also, because Kirby Superstar was "8 GAMES IN ONE!"
One thing you can say about Sakurai: The man values value.

>> No.609814

>Clunky art style
>The game with companion melding and secret environmental puzzles is generic in comparison to Super Star
>Too relaxing for a Kirby game.
Strange reasons /vr/.
It's totally okay if you just don't like it.

>> No.609843
File: 160 KB, 261x271, 1367133768822.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
609843

>>607891
I like the artstyle plenty.

It's just the fucking lack of controls. It's like someone said "SIMPLER IS ALWAYS BETTER, DON'T FUCKING ARGUE WITH ME. DON'T FUCKING ARGUE WITH MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE."

Yeah you got a large moveset, definitely. Spread out across different animal and ability combinations. Fuck that. Fuck animals. Just give me multi-skilled abilities, you FRAWDS.

>> No.609845

Dreamland 3 might be my favorite Kirby game.

>> No.609846

I beat it the whole way through, and I gotta say, the biggest problem is probably the extremely short recovery time.
If you ended up in a bad spot, you'd end up taking hit after hit until you weren't fit to complete the level.

>> No.609861

>>609845
Shut the fuck up. No it isn't.

You like Superstar better, unless you haven't played Superstar.

It's like a law of physics, dude. You can't like Dreamland 3 better in a practical sense.

>> No.609870

>>609861
That's not as funny as you think.

>> No.609871

>>609861

>stop liking what i dont like

>>>/v/

>> No.609873

>>609861
Not him, but what if I like Kirby's Dream Land 2 better?

>> No.609880

>>609870
Good thing I don't think it's funny.

>> No.609884

>>609880
>Good thing I don't think it's funny.
Oh God you where serious.

>> No.609893

>>609052
http://comments.deviantart.com/1/272560326/2312132836
Everyone needs to read this. This explains why we haven't seen the animal friends or had a game surrounding Dark Matter since 64.

>> No.609919

>>609893
This post is kind of bullshit though, Kirby Dreamland 2/3 isn't THAT different from more recent games. And Kirby has never been deep even at it's hardest. This guy makes it sound like MGS to Metal Gear Rising.

>> No.609938

>>609893
>Zero
>her
I always thought Zero was a sexless entity of malevolence.

>> No.609952
File: 780 KB, 817x791, KDL3Group.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
609952

>>609919
Actually, they are. There was this really stagnant drought after Nightmare in Dreamland where Kirby had to rely on rehashes to stay afloat. The one game that looked promising took several retoolings and almost missed two gens. Put it this way: Zero's blood will never be seen again in a future Kirby title if it appears again. Seriously, I'm sick of seeing just Dedede, Metaknight and the one-off that appears to have Kirby help him. And the anime flanderized Kirby into an unbearable mess.

>> No.609956

>>609919
Yeah, no, there haven't been any other Kirby games that really played or felt like Dream Land 2, 3, and Crystal Shards.

I do agree that Kirby has never had particularly deep gameplay though.

>> No.609963

Why don't we take the dreamland world, mixed powers and all, and combine it with Super Star gameplay with multiple attacks and the like?

>> No.609970

>>609893

I'm glad I read that, but I still prefer games in the vein of Adventure and Superstar. I find that the limited amount of abilities and the emphasis on animal companions makes the games less fun.

If the copy abilities were more fun to use, I might like the games better. Spark, stone, and spike, for instance, are rather redundant, and being unable to move while using them makes them less than entertaining. Plus, having to find an animal to use the combined abilities is annoying.

Kirby 64 was better about this--combining abilities expanded the possibilities, and got rid of the need for animal companions. However, many of those abilities just aren't that useful. Double cutter, for instance--throwing your face just isn't very helpful if it moves slowly and takes forever to come back to you. Fire and Ice, IIRC, has no effect at all.

I don't like that the series has become more homogeneous, but some of the Adventure/Superstar elements are welcome changes.

>> No.609978

>>609963

This.

>> No.609980

>>609963
That would be great if it can even be done.

>> No.609981

>>609970
>However, many of those abilities just aren't that useful.
Why is this a bad thing? They don't all have to have perfect balance. Some of them can just be gag junk.

>> No.610000

>>609981
Bomb+Fire

You will rarely need anything else. It's kinda bad game design overall.

>> No.610020
File: 16 KB, 196x215, 64.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
610020

>>610000
>You will rarely need anything else.
But you're allowed to. That's the fun.

>> No.610024

>>610000
How exactly are the powers in a game like Kirby Super Star not plagued by the same balance issues?
You going to tell me you ever need to use more than Plasma or Mirror to completely wreck the game?

>> No.610025

>>609981

Yeah, but that makes the game less fun. They could have used the slots they used for useless abilities and devoted them to abilities that were fun to use.

>> No.610030

>>609970

After reading your post, its clear you don't know what kirby is about

FUN

>> No.610032

>>610024
Plasma may be powerful but it doesn't have you covered at all times. Even when it literally has you covered. You have to charge it.

And how is Mirror broken? I'm very familiar with completing games with Mirror only. I don't think it's a game breaker.

>> No.610036
File: 187 KB, 615x519, 1367579710275.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
610036

>>610030
It's more fun to have more range with a single ability, you DINK.

But if it's a whuppin you're a wantin!!!

>> No.610045

>>610024

Plasma and mirror? I didn't know that those were broken.

I generally forego those abilities in favor of abilities I enjoy using. Sword, hammer, ninja, and wing are my favorites.

Incidentally, Dreamland, Dreamland 2, and 64 have none of those. Instead, we get to turn into a rock. Or better yet, use a fucking BROOM.

>> No.610052

>>610025
>Yeah, but that makes the game less fun
How is it not fun to be able to turn into statures of the animal companions from the other games, throw exploding suriken, become a little volcano or eat things with your arms?

>> No.610057

>>610036

Nah man. If that's how you have fun with the game, sure.

I just like to combine abilities and switch it up. Efficiency isn't really what kirby is about.

Spark+Rock was OP anyway

>> No.610058

>>610030

Exactly. Half of the abilities in 2, 3, and 64 aren't fun to use. I'd say the one I enjoy the most is cutter, and even that one's not that great. I'd rather just get the ability rather than have to hunt down a companion or have to mix and match.

Where's the ball ability? Where are things like UFO or sword? They're not there.

Maybe the overly-simple style is your thing, and that's fine, but it's not mine.

>> No.610061

>>610057
>Efficiency isn't really what kirby is about.
Exactly.

>> No.610062

>>610032
>And how is Mirror broken? I'm very familiar with completing games with Mirror only. I don't think it's a game breaker.
I guess I'm thinking more about fighting bosses, where you can just shield and only a small handful of bosses can even touch you.
Shielding is broken in general, but at least sometimes with other powers you took chip damage.

Plasma though, no dude, that power is just ridiculous.
Charging it is fucking nothing when you know you can do it while shielding.

>> No.610065

>>610052

It is fun. It is not fun, however, to turn into a refrigerator or set yourself on fire. It is rather amusing, though.

>> No.610073

>>610065
>It is rather amusing, though.
And that's the point of those powers.

>> No.610080

>>610062

I hardly ever shielded, personally, since I forgot that ability existed. I think the series can do without that ability.

>> No.610081
File: 43 KB, 188x141, dreamland3_scans_gooey2.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
610081

Can we at least agree that Dream Land 3 had the better music?

>> No.610084

>>607947
>Most relaxing
Up until you meet Zero.

>> No.610087

>>610084
Which is a lovely contrast that makes it stand out as a boss.

>> No.610093

>>610058

I like all the abilities in those games because they amuse me and are fun to use.

>no ufo
>no sword
>no ball

but you get shit like fridge and fire arrow and magneto rock shit

i mean fuck dude appreciate what the game tries differently. They made a kirby game that wasn't just more of the same powers-wise, and that's whats important

>> No.610105

>>610080
That's most of the point of Mirror, man. When you have Mirror, your shield reflects projectiles and I'm pretty sure you don't take chip damage.
Only things like Meta Knight's tornadoes or that giant laser Marx shoots can really do anything to you while you're shielding with Mirror.
It's pretty ridiculous.

>> No.610131

>>610080
>>610105
Oh, and I agree.
I not only think the series could do without shielding, it would probably be better off without it.
Although I could see shielding working if they made it like in Super Smash Bros., where timing mattered, you couldn't shield forever, and shielding for too long would have your shield break and leave you dazed and open to attack. That might be cool.

>> No.610169

>>610087
Agreed.

>> No.610197

>>610084
It's Zero-2, SIR.

God.

Check your facts, sir.

CHECKYOURFAX.

>> No.610206
File: 33 KB, 136x141, dreamland3_scans_kirby17.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
610206

>>610197

>> No.610246
File: 103 KB, 700x700, 1367292665278.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
610246

>>610093
>i mean fuck dude appreciate what the game tries differently. They made a kirby game that wasn't just more of the same powers-wise, and that's whats important
I want a Kirby game with every ability Kirby has ever had.

Every.
Single.
One.

Not a single skill missed. Redundant abilities like Fire and Fireball are fused, obviously.

And all of those abilities have multiple abilities, except for single-use abilities like Crash, Mike, Paint, etc. Every use an ability had in old games is somehow assimilated. Like how Stone in Kirby 64 would turn Kirby into a walkable golem. That isn't left out.

And all the classic villains are in it. None of this bullshit of leaving out Mr.Shine and Mr.Bright. Fuck that, put them in there. They're important staples. And the game doesn't split hairs between it's Marx approach to a villain and its Dark Matter approach. It has both somehow, and it's fine.

That's what I want. A magnum opus Kirby game that has -everything in it-. The FF6 of Kirby, if you will.

>> No.610258

>>610246
Oh and everything that seems like it should have an ability DOES have an ability.

Like how there were those Metaknight cronies with maces and tridents. There would be new mace and trident abilities, goddammit.

>> No.610296

>>610246
>>610258
That sounds awful.
The "everything and the kitchen sink" approach is never a good idea, especially when stuff is included for no other reason than "WELL, IT WAS IN THE OLDER GAMES, SO WHY NOT?"

>> No.610316
File: 31 KB, 585x428, 1367106509311.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
610316

>>610296
How about I slap your stupid shit?
I just shat a wall of text. You think you're gonna convince me with two lines of 'nuh uh'?

Rise to my level of effort, you fat fuck.
The everything and the kitchen sink is the greatest idea in this case. PROVE THAT IT ISN'T.

>> No.611325

>>608231
>squeak squad

>> No.611347
File: 14 KB, 600x403, 1293149714446.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
611347

I never knew 3's reception was so panned. I never had a problem with it. Though I guess I do prefer Super Star for various reasons (probably because it caters to my style of playing - I like playing games in short bursts)

>> No.611448

I actually liked Dreamland 3. It might not be challenging or has the huge amount of ability features like Super Star, but it is a very solid game otherwise.(Unlike some of the "dark ages" Kirby games like Squeak Squad)


It's too bad Kirby's Air Ride got panned upon release. They tried something completely different only to get shat on by everyone.(City Trial is still loads of fun with other players)

Sakurai used a lot of Air Ride's features in Brawl, by the way, like the menu layout and the challenge/achievement system.

>> No.611590

>>610316
>Rise to my level of effort, you fat fuck.
And what a high level it is.

>> No.611603

>>610081
It didn't.
Kirby 64 even managed to take tracks from it and make them better.

>> No.612528

>>611603
I meant between the games OP mentioned.

>> No.612680

>>610197
You are completely wrong. It's zero.

Zero 2 is the one in Kirby 64.

>> No.612712

>>610081
nope
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oL5QKNDT8g

but I like both

>> No.612753

>>612712
Nah, dude.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRjEBqGsI2o

>> No.612817

>>607881
Because instead of existing variety of powerups, you have only a few of them, and you have to mix them up with animals, which don't appear often.

It has shit gameplay, and even the art style isn't better than Kirby Superstar's.

>> No.612917

>>612817
The gameplay isn't even close to being shit, and the art-style is fantastic.

>> No.612920

I refuse to call any Kirby game bad.

>> No.612952

Crystal Shards master race reporting in.

>> No.612983

>>611325
I liked SS, but it's not really comparable. You could mix anything in 64, while you just had a handful of things in SS.

>> No.612987

>>607881

shut the fuck up retard

>> No.612994
File: 235 KB, 1600x1200, rainbow-kirby-1600x1200.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
612994

this my favorite game. i like how u can ride animals.

>> No.613005

>dl3 is bad

this board is suddednly the shittiest board on 4chan

pls delete

>> No.613028

>>612983
Yeah, all it was was sticking elements on bombs, swords... and maybe something else too, can't remember.

>> No.613038

mabey gameshark can fix slow walkingéruning

>> No.613082

>>610316
Fuck off stupid, he just told you that concept never works, and it's pretty much 100% true.

>> No.614879

>>613082
ADDRESS YOUR ARGUMENT YOU STUPID CLOD.

I'M RIGHT. YOU'RE WRONG.

FIGURE OUT WHAT HAPPENED AND THEN ADJUST YOUR LIFE.

>> No.616202

Top tier
-The bird
-The cat

Mid-tier
-The owl
-The hamster

Low-tier
-The fish (move up to top tier when in water)

Low-tier
-The pink blob

>> No.616315

The controls in Dreamland 3 are complete garbage compared to like every other Kirby games

>> No.616348

>>614879
>I'M RIGHT. YOU'RE WRONG.
>ADJUST YOUR LIFE
Oh wow. It's like a handbook for all the standard stupid angry responses on the internet.

>> No.617156

>>616348
Notice how no argument was addressed.

I win.

>> No.617317

>>616202
This isn't even opinion.