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2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/vr/ - Retro Games

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5978309 No.5978309 [Reply] [Original]

>Tanaka: Our earliest concept for the game revolved around our consideration of the state of RPGs today. We felt like mainstream RPGs had gotten kind of stale, only differing in the stories and scenarios they offer, but otherwise all having the same basic format.

>Trapped in the same old gameplay systems that have become “standard” for RPGs, only changing up the story… that’s boring. The RPG genre is supposed to be about being able to do anything you want. Was ignoring the gameplay systems and just focusing on story really the way to go…?

http://shmuplations.com/secretofmana/

>> No.5978313

>>5978309
If you wanted good gameplay systems, you wouldn't make an RPG in the first place.

>> No.5978320

>>5978313
>why bother with all the RPG mechanics—why didn’t you just make a pure, full-fledged action game?
>Tanaka: Good question. The thing is, if we had gone full action, it would create a gulf between skilled players and unskilled players. You’d run into problems like bad players never being able to defeat the final boss. That’s actually the greatest strength of traditional RPGs, is that anyone can clear them if they spend the time and energy. We absolutely did not want to throw that away.

>> No.5978345

When are people going to stop shilling that shitty blog?

>> No.5978354

>>5978320
>We want to ignore gameplay and for anyone to finish regardless of skill.
Just make a movie already.

>> No.5978396

>>5978345
nothing wrong with the site pal. We like to talk about retro games here.

>> No.5978421

>>5978320
The 2nd reason, is that if its a RPG its still fine that the combat is janky so long you can have the numbers game componsate.
Gameboy game is pretty action.
Seiken no Densetsu is is less action because of how janky the combat system is, but its polished to the exact point where it works as a action game, while its possible to grind on top of that.
And 3 is 3. It just goes further with enabling grinding.

>> No.5978429

>>5978345
Fuck off faggot. It’s not a blog, it’s not personal writings, they’re translations of interviews that would never see the light of day in English. Go back to Fortnite.

>> No.5978461

>>5978320
Irony that this man went on to design Final Fantasy XI and by extension that impossible boss Absolute Virtue.

>> No.5978531

>>5978309
props for trying something different, but the gameplay was still bleh

>> No.5978534
File: 67 KB, 503x755, spirits within.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5978534

>>5978354
oops

>> No.5978579

>>5978534
If you want to make a movie but make a game instead, it's going to play like ass. If you then want to make a movie and make a shit movie maybe someone else should get the job since you can't do games or movies.

>> No.5978624

>>5978429
Because he's sitting on the sources and refuses to release them in any form until people pay him on his Patreon. Even then it's only in English so nobody can point out blatant mistakes in the translation.

>> No.5978671

>>5978624
Just like go to Japan and scan the articles yourself.

>> No.5978690

>>5978534
i liked this movie, saw it in the cinema

>> No.5978696
File: 37 KB, 960x960, 0ba.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5978696

>>5978309
I'm just pissed that, after all the re-sales and re-makes, they never bothered to add all the stuff Square claims they had to cut because it would never be a SNES CD game after all

>> No.5978715

>>5978313
fpwp

>> No.5978846

>>5978309
>The RPG genre is supposed to be about being able to do anything you want. Was ignoring the gameplay systems and just focusing on story really the way to go…?
That's rich coming from somebody who worked and still works on Final Fantasy pretending it's the best thing ever since sliced bread.

>> No.5978881

>>5978624
He’s not “sitting on resources” like it’s some third world dictator withholding humanitarian aid. You have just as much access to those magazines as he does. Fucking buy them off ebay and translate them yourself. I don’t give the guy a dime but he still offers more to me than you do, dicksucker.

>> No.5978919

>>5978881
Why can't he dump the whole magazines instead of distributing tiny snippets?

>> No.5979009

>>5978919
To spite you, and only you personally.

>> No.5979012

The remake is better because it has more balanced gameplay.

>> No.5979034

>—Purim is a new kind of character we haven’t seen before in RPGs. There have been lots of stereotypical “tomboy” style characters in RPGs, where literally the only feature of their personality is that they are a tomboy, but Purim is different. She abandons her own home to go search for her beloved. Where did the idea for such a passionate character come from?

>Tanaka: Well, we didn’t really think about it that deeply. We just wanted to create a cute character, and it just so turned out that she is kind of unique amongst RPG characters.
Based old devs

>> No.5979087

>>5979034
One of the undersung merits of retro games. The extent to which developers were expected to pander to consumers wasn't as high. They just made the shit they liked.

>> No.5979096

>>5978919
Why can’t you do it?

>> No.5979105

>>5979096
So I have to buy the same magazines because a hoarder uses it to extort money out of idiots ?
Instead of using my resources to buy different things.

>> No.5979148

>>5979105
Yeah, why can’t you do it? Why are you sitting on your money? Buy them and translate them for us.

>> No.5981470

>>5978534
This is good schlock

>> No.5981491
File: 339 KB, 2000x2000, 64905Z[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5981491

>>5978309
This has been my favorite video game since 1993, and i make an effort to finish it at least once a year.

I still have the game/box/instructions/map all in near-mint condition, but I can't bring myself to read this stupid interview....

I even have this fucking CD lying around somewhere...

>> No.5981572

>>5978309
>only differing in the stories and scenarios they offer
>Was ignoring the gameplay systems and just focusing on story really the way to go…?
what an idiotic opinion this kind of mentality is the reason FF is dead while DQ is still going strong

>> No.5981626

>>5978320
>>5978354
>>5978421
>>5978579
>>5978846
There is literally no downside to a game being accessible to all players regardless of skill level. If anything, making a game that is enjoyable to players of all different levels of enthusiasm is a sign of good game design, not bad. You can not refute this.

>> No.5982325

>>5978309
>claims that he's making an RPG
>makes a Zelda clone instead
What did he mean by this?

>> No.5982410

>>5981626
>There is literally no downside to a game being accessible to all players regardless of skill level
Trying to pander to too many people inevitably ends up with a game that isn't good enough for anyone in particular. the problem is that it's exactly not enjoyable to players of different levels.

This has always been a problem for the Mana series since it couldn't count on the suits pushing it given how Final Fantasy already was the designed "cinematic experience for everyone", they didn't need nor could handle two of those, which is why despite its age and status, the series always faltered behind other Square franchises even in the SNES days.

>> No.5983323

>>5981626
>t. Kotaku (former) writer

>> No.5983327

My 2cc just don't be a faggot developer and add ram scrambling processes just to mess with cheat engine. Goddammit how I hate fuckers who do this.

>> No.5983330

>>5982410
I don't think you understand, there are people who only play shit like fighters and touhou on very easy mode for the story and characters. And those niggas are paying customers just like you, they are entitled to waste their life whatever the way they please.

>> No.5983345

>>5982325
Zelda crew thought they were making a rpg at first, too

>> No.5983348

>>5983330
Actually /jp/ DESERVES suffering and pain

>> No.5983430

>>5983330
>I don't think you understand
You're to one who doesn't understand why the series died in the first place, it's because the series has zero appeal to anyone who's even a tiny bit aware of the market and isn't a complete casual.
Even if you put aside the nonexistent challenge there's nothing that sets Mana aside from other franchises.
Zelda has a much bigger following and core mechanics that are much more simple and fluid, Ys has actual challenge when it comes to ARPGs, FF has the spectacle and drama and so on, and for those who want the more niche aspects like having multiple protagonists there's still other games that do that better, like its sister series SaGa.

The problem with Mana is that it doesn't have any real audience out there due to lacking any sort of strong selling point that sets it apart, and the almost complete lack of appeal on its game side is its biggest weakness, the only games that did manage to get some following on that were SD3 (because it finally polished the gameplay a bit and took the multiple MC formula from SaGa) and Legend (because Kawazu produced it and designed a lot of it, which appeals to a very specific kind of audience) and both were still too easy to make most of the systems matter, they're remembered for the graphics and atmosphere more than anything, and Legend in particular is also remembered precisely because it wasn't accessible to anyone.

Your entire reasoning is completely misplaced because you start from the base of having a strong core base to build on, which Mana always lacked, fighting games and Touhou managed to get a casual userbase because they had a strong core userbase that was drawn to those games precisely because it appealed specifically to them, and also offered a game part interesting enough to keep them interested, it wasn't the other way round.

>> No.5983457

>>5983430
Yup. Ultimately it didn't excel in any particular area. Other games had better gameplay, or a better story, or was a harder challenge. It was never the best at anything.

>> No.5983497

Weird that he's saying this when expressly asked about SD2. You'd think that would've come up when they made, I don't know, the first game?

>>5983345
Zelda itself is a deconstruction of RPG trappings with everything video game-ified rather than relying on any tabletop-inspired frameworks. Miyamoto flat-out said once that LoZ took its basic inspiration from Ultima.

>> No.5983536

>>5983497
I don't think Tanaka had anything to do with SD1, but I might be wrong on that.