/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.5803556]

I don't get it. How did anybody know what the fuck to do when this came out?

[Anonymous No.5803559]

They didn't. You were just supposed to wander around endlessly. This was how developers justified charging $60 for games that could be completed in 30 minutes. Not by adding more content, but by stretching the meager amount of content they gave you to it's breaking point.

[Anonymous No.5803563]

>>5803556
The instruction guide and shit like Nintendo Power. That's how a lot of games were back then. That's how they made their money. You buy the cryptic game, then you buy the tons of horse shit that told you how to play it.

[Anonymous No.5803576]

>>5803559
>>5803563
You're not wrong.

[Anonymous No.5803582]

>>5803556
Zoomer faggot.

[Anonymous No.5803583]

>>5803556
Gaming was even more of a social thing back then. You'd have to collaborate to beat confusing games like this. Unfortunately you will never know the feel of discussing the various hidden secrets in Zelda at the cafeteria.

[Anonymous No.5803587]

>>5803583
Or reading the back of a cereal box that told you "tips and tricks" that you likely already knew.

[Anonymous No.5803589]

>>5803582
Oh yeah, you magically guessed and knew how to find the bush you had to burn.

[Anonymous No.5803590]

in the middle of a challenge run, remembering basically nothing about the game from thirty years ago and reading only the manual. no problems finding dungeons or items. the dragon boss can get tricky in later iterations and blue wizzrobes can go fuck themselves, but that's about it for challenge.

what problems do people have with this game anyway?

[Anonymous No.5803621]

>>5803556
By calling Nintendo Power and hoping your parents didn't see the massive spike in their phone bill.

[Anonymous No.5803632]

>>5803556
Trial and error and hitting up Nintendo power when stuck.

[Anonymous No.5803639]

>>5803556
Word of mouth, school yard rumours, strategy guides, guesswork, not having everything mapped out and a little arrow that just points to where you have to go

[Anonymous No.5803716]

>>5803589
This always reminds me of people who say Super Metroid is a chore to play because it forces you to bomb every single surface in the game like an autist. I always believed Zelda 1 had you burn some random unassuming bush in a uniform row judging from peoples' description of how cryptic the game is before I actually took the time to play it all the way to the end and it baffled me how much that part is blown out of proportion. Curiosity and environmental awareness are gaming skills on the same level as hand-eye coordination. The game trains your ability to spot secrets the whole time you're playing and it expects you to have a good enough grasp on where to look for them by the time you're ready to tackle the second-to-last dungeon to figure out that that one bush you need to burn down sticks out like a sore thumb. Try paying attention to the game's visual language instead of drooling your way through it like a woman.

[Anonymous No.5803724]

>>5803556
It's almost like it's a game about exploration or something

[Anonymous No.5803735]

>>5803716
Based and incelled

[Anonymous No.5803761]

Nintendo tipline anyone?

[Anonymous No.5803804]

>>5803556
People played it, unlike most of you kids nowadays who only hang out on 4chan to shitpost about things they know nothing about.

[Anonymous No.5803814]

>>5803716
>it baffled me how much that part is blown out of proportion.
Give the "Second Quest" a try.

[Anonymous No.5803860]

>>5803814
It's significantly harder but still not that bad. The last level, for example, is in a place I tried bombing in the first quest because I was SURE there must be something there.
Basically, if you're someone who really loses their mind if they have to pay attention and keep track of screens they've bombed, maybe just satisfy yourself with completing the first quest and accept that this type of game design was not meant for someone like you. There's no special reward for completing the second quest other than knowing that you're not a scrub who can't handle a game for little kids.

[Anonymous No.5803880]

>look mom I posted it again
yawn

[Anonymous No.5803936]

GET CANDLE IN PARAPA PALACE
GO WEST

[Anonymous No.5803970]

>>5803860
I actually enjoy games like this a lot, the exploration and well hidden secrets are something that I lament the Legend of Zelda series toning down over time (and I was glad to feel it return in the recent "Breath of the Wild" thanks to much of the game's content being optional, allowing them to put in more cryptic puzzles and secrets).

But the original game's second quest requires you to not only autistically bomb every wall and burn every bush, but also add new strange rituals to your routine that the first quest mode never made you do, such as walking into dungeon walls to check if you can magically go through, or, trying the flute item on every screen in the overworld to see if it does anything in seemingly inconspicuous places like some random screen in the desert. Which, again, is something I actually kind of enjoy just for the surprising moments when these actually unexpectedly work, but isn't something I would expect the average person to ever think to try, especially in the 80's when the game first came out and people probably didn't have the same kind of highly trained "gamer intuition" that we have today from decades of experience that compels us to think to check for secrets like this.

[Anonymous No.5804089]

>>5803970
>people probably didn't have the same kind of highly trained "gamer intuition" that we have today from decades of experience that compels us to think to check for secrets like this.
After playing the first quest they absolutely should think to check for this kind of thing. Yes, the puzzles are trickier and some of the things are hidden in places that aren't blatantly obvious. It's actually the game at the difficulty level you might imagine it to be when you hear about "muh burn every bush" shit like OP.

As far as "gamer intuitions" go I almost think it's the opposite. Players in the 80s had the correct intuition which was to play the game and enjoy it for how fun it was to run around fighting and exploring and looking for secrets, rather than going through your "backlog" one game at a time, blowing through all the content as efficiently as possible then ticking the checkbox of completion before moving onto the next game. And if you've made it to the second quest, you know the whistle can open doors in the overworld, so that's something you will check. It's also something you use for fast-travel and in the 2nd quest, you should find the whistle right away. So it's not crazy to accidentally find secret doors with it. It doesn't require any special "gamer intuition" at all.

And yes, you do have to check for fake walls, but it's always a finite number of possible checks, AND you have to realize that the fake walls have an important functional difference from bombed walls, which is that they can be one-way. In the first quest, doors can shut behind you, but bombing a wall always yields a 2-way door. Fake walls are secrets that might leave you trapped. This raises the stakes and the difficulty of the mazes in the second quest.

[Anonymous No.5804156]

>>5803716
Dude most gamers have like zero game sense and can't follow simple logic. Whenever I end up watching a Mike Matei video when I'm really bored I end up screaming at my computer because of all the shit he misses right in front of his fucking face then says stupid shit like this game needs to do x. No Mike you stupid fuck you need to play it right

[Anonymous No.5804164]

>>5803556
There was literally this in the manual

[Anonymous No.5804167]

>>5804089
>Players in the 80s had the correct intuition which was to play the game and enjoy it for how fun it was to run around fighting and exploring and looking for secrets, rather than going through your "backlog" one game at a time, blowing through all the content as efficiently as possible then ticking the checkbox of completion before moving onto the next game.
A shame that so many casuals do this and fail to truly appreciate the experience of the individual game. While I understand the reasoning-- the value of time in a busy life and the increasingly overwhelming number of games there are to play that come out every year-- I've always found that immersing oneself in the depths of a game's content (or at least making an effort to do so) is the far more rewarding experience than simply rushing through the bare minimum just to see an end screen so that they may be able to claim that they "completed" it and move on to the next.

[Anonymous No.5804174]

>>5804089
>As far as "gamer intuitions" go I almost think it's the opposite. Players in the 80s had the correct intuition which was to play the game and enjoy it for how fun it was to run around fighting and exploring and looking for secrets, rather than going through your "backlog" one game at a time, blowing through all the content as efficiently as possible then ticking the checkbox of completion before moving onto the next game

This. Nobody back in the 80s went screaming "I've been stuck for 10 whole minutes, this game is terribly designed. Time to google a walkthrough" the way "hardcore gamers" do today. Back then, people enjoyed exploration and just plain playing games.

[Anonymous No.5804178]

>>5804164
Not in the original FDS version.

[Anonymous No.5804214]

>>5804164
Yeah but it was sealed with a message that said warning: only for shitters

[Anonymous No.5804217]

>>5804174
To be fair, it DID happen that I would get stuck on a game and give up in frustration. But not Zelda which had plenty to do no matter what.

[Anonymous No.5804226]

>>5804178
True. The FDS only had part of that. But if the US version had come out 18 months earlier they might not have included the whole thing. Developers were aware that burger babies are getting stupider by the minute. 30 years ago they needed a whole map. Today they can't even figure out how to find the map in the manual. I guess at some point they're become so stupid they don't even have the brainpower to breathe and will put of out of their misery.

[Anonymous No.5804231]

>>5803556
You read the instruction manual.

[Anonymous No.5804250]

First of all the manual and map included in the game explained most things.

Second of all it's meant to be an open ended game. You make progress by walking around, killing enemies, and discovering areas one by one. The world map really isn't that big, you can see every single area in no time at all.

[Anonymous No.5804407]

>>5803556
They played it.

[Anonymous No.5804419]

>A villain is on the rampage, but they left you instructions on what you will need to kill them and where you can find that equipment. Conveniently enough, they are on the far end of this lengthy road.

They were right to not tell you what to do. The most natural lifelike thing would be for play to have started on Link's home dirt farm, with no idea that there was any quest that needed to be quested at all. Leave home and at start picking up rumors about neighbors being attacked while traveling.

[Anonymous No.5804435]

>>5804419
>to have started on Link's home dirt farm, with no idea that there was any quest that needed to be quested at all. Leave home and at start picking up rumors about neighbors being attacked while traveling.
The fact that it does not do this is one of the reasons why it is not an RPG.
Hey Link!
1. Find the 8 pieces of Triforce
2. Defeat Ganon and Rescue Zelda
3. Go!
And then you're dumped into a gameplay park with special rules that are easy to figure out.

[Anonymous No.5804441]

>>5804419
The manual literally explains that Link is out traveling when he sees an old woman attacked by monsters. After saving her, she fills him in on a bunch of shit.

[Anonymous No.5804498]

Does the game show the player any hints about 1) Lost Woods/Hills pattern and 2) Walking through invisible walls (upper right map secret, quest 2 dungeon false walls)

[Anonymous No.5804501]

It came with a map

[Anonymous No.5804505]

>>5804435
Whatever you just tried to describe doesn't define what an rpg is or isn't

[Anonymous No.5804507]

>>5804498
1) yes and extremely easy to run into by accident
2) yes but more cryptic and difficult to understand and something you're likely to do on accident anyway while examining and exploring

[Anonymous No.5804519]

>>5803556
Nintendo Power, oversized instruction manuals (like Phantasy Star II), or tons of extra cards and feelies (just about any PC RPG). Anyone bragging about HURR I DIDN'T NEED GUIDES is lying, never played the played these games at release, and thinks constant trial and error just to figure out your main objective is part of the experience.

[Anonymous No.5804530]

[Anonymous No.5804534]

>>5804174
>Nobody back in the 80s went screaming "I've been stuck for 10 whole minutes, this game is terribly designed. Time to google a walkthrough" the way "hardcore gamers" do today. Back then, people
Looked in the manual that had the map, a copy of Nintendo Power that had tips, or asked a kid at school who was playing the game.

If think gamers weren't impatient 30 years ago, you're underage zoomer is showing .

[Anonymous No.5804541]

>>5804505
RPGs should portray a realistic or plausible (if fantastic) world. Zelda's world isn't.

[Anonymous No.5804546]

>>5804534
>t. larping zoomer

[Anonymous No.5804549]

>>5804541
Your definition gets rid of everything but GTA.

[Anonymous No.5804586]

>>5803559
>$60
It was $49.99 at release, which still terrible when you adjusted for inflation.

[Anonymous No.5804594]

>>5804549
Only if you're autistic and can't recognize the difference between a reasonable attempt to portray a roleplay world versus no attempt to do so at all.

WRPGs like Dark Queen of Krynn portray a partial section of a larger world (pic-related). Text descriptions are used to make the world feel more real. If Zelda had been made in this manner, the game would have begun with Link's encounter with Impa described in text. Note how even a gameplay-focused Dungeon Crawler like Eye of the Beholder establishes a realistic context. The opening cutscene has you in the city of Waterdeep, entering the sewers. Then, the ceiling collapses behind you and you're stuck with no option but to continue deeper.

JRPGs like Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest portray an abstract representation of an entire world with all of its cities, towns, deserts, mountains, and so on.

Zelda does neither. Zelda describes Hyrule in vague fairy tale terms and portays the world itself as entirely composed of gameplay challenges with no attempt whatsoever to make it feel anything like a world that could actually exist.

[Anonymous No.5804614]

>>5804594
Does any Nintendo first party game feel like a world that can exist? Besides the starting text was in the manual that came packaged with the game at release.

[Anonymous No.5804641]

>>5804594
The Zelda franchise gives distinct towns with homes and shops. Individual people have dialog and concerns. Are you on meth that you can't see them? Is this just your beating around the bush because you don't want to come out and admit that you are mad it isn't a turn based stat grinding game?

[Anonymous No.5804643]

I read the entire thread. I agree that bush/tree is like

>!!!--->burn me<---!!!

We need to DROP the complaints about the bush. It's basically asking for it.

HOWEVER...many of the in-game clues are written in Engrish. And many of us/our parents threw away our manuals and boxes (cringe) when we got a new game. It's fucking tragic but true. Might depend on where you live in the world, but where I'm at, this is true like 99% of the time. I NEVER KNEW THE MAP EXISTED.

https://legendsoflocalization.com/the-legend-of-zelda/first-quest/

It's been awhile since I read that webpage, but if I recall correctly (and it is entirely possible that I DO NOT recall correctly), he talks about how poorly some of these translations were and how much of the game would have made more sense given better translations. In addition to better clues (better does not mean easier or less cryptic necessarily), the game needs either 1.) an in-game map or 2.) a small name that appears at the bottom saying what area you're entering

These additions would IMO completely BTFO any naysayers.

Also, there needs to be at least SOME text at the beginning of the game that says, "you MIGHT want to try using inventory items including weapons in weird places...just saying"

That would make the game completely and 100% self-contained with no external knowledge required.

I'd kill to get to play a game like that. Imagine if we found some undiscovered/unreleased Zelda game that was supposed to come after Zelda 2 but goes back to its Zelda 1 roots. Kind of like the Japan version of Super Mario Bros. 2. instead of the Doki Doki Panic port we got.

[Anonymous No.5804648]

>>5803556
> How did anybody know what the fuck to do when this came out?
Kids lived up to different expectations.
The NES had two action buttons and the game was was about exploration. And every day at school you talked about it with your friends at lunch. For example I remember going straight to my friends house to tell him the moment I found the red ring in level 9. I just left the game paused and went straight to my bike.

[Anonymous No.5804649]

>>5804643
As a hypothetical project concept, a way to alter the original game experience with the least about of actually altering the game, would be to add on a tutorial level before you actual dump into the world. Make the player replace their dagger with a sword. Give them a bunch of trivia via npc text, and let them try some consumable resources out. Once they are ready to find their way out onto the actual map, they might be fully ready to never return to the tutorial village.

If you wanted to go over and beyond, you might be able to put in some safe villages on the world map without making much changes to the world. You just drop them between two existing squares that otherwise would have connected directly to each other.

[Anonymous No.5804654]

>>5804649
Easy to give the cave a back door. Player exits their home via the cave, meets the old man, and then leaves onto the world map from the front door of the cave.

[Anonymous No.5804657]

>>5803556
>>5803559
Oh, cool, amazing /v/-tier baitposting. Didn't even forget a 16:9 screenshot. I really hope you get banned.

[Anonymous No.5804661]

>>5804614
>Does any Nintendo first party game feel like a world that can exist?
Nope. Also none of them are RPGs. It's not a coincidence.
>>5804641
>The Zelda franchise
We're talking about the first game here.
> gives distinct towns with homes and shops. Individual people have dialog and concerns. Are you on meth that you can't see them
Yeah, random people in literal caves and old men hanging out in dungeons dispensing one-line hints.
ALTTP has Kakariko village which is this little fairy tale town. Haven't you ever noticed how the world map in ALTTP has clouds around it? Like it's a fairy tale world of legend that might exist in any place or any time? RPGs rarely, if ever, do this.

[Anonymous No.5804662]

>>5804643
Some of the translations are pretty clumsy, but the only cryptic ones are ones that were invented FOR the western release and have no actual Japanese equivalent. So it's not really a translation issue.

[Anonymous No.5804663]

>>5804643
>>5804649
>>5804654
Also could use an in-game encyclopedia with enemies, items, locations, etc.

And calling the dungeons Level-1, Level-2, etc. should be updated.

[Anonymous No.5804669]

>>5804662
Example?

[Anonymous No.5804675]

>>5804594
In Zelda, you arrive in a wilderness and explore it. There's no need to establish anything else: you have a vast mysterious region and must find the Triforce to save a cutieπ.

[Anonymous No.5804680]

>>5804594
>the game would have begun with Link's encounter with Impa described in text
It's in the manual instead of the cartridge

[Anonymous No.5804690]

READ THE FUCKING MANUAL NIGGER
IT LITERALLY TELLS YOU WHERE TO GO

[Anonymous No.5804698]

>>5804662
Dropping the word "lake" from the 7th dungeon hint is a straight downgrade in info tho

[Anonymous No.5804728]

>>5804669
EASTMOST PENINSULA IS THE SECRET and 10TH ENEMY HAS THE BOMB are both English-invented "hints" that are cryptic as fuck.
The Japanes equivalents were YOU CAN'T USE ARROWS UNLESS YOU HAVE MONEY and SEARCH FOR THE LION KEY, completely different and entirely understandable hints.

[Anonymous No.5804730]

>>5804728
Well, I should say that in addition to the translations there should have just been better hints period.

[Anonymous No.5804743]

>>5804730
And really you don't needs hints if there are just better environmental clues. I don't ever remember having trouble finding ANYTHING in Link to the Past.

I 100% that game without looking at a hint guide, walkthrough, game guide, nothing.

[Anonymous No.5804749]

>>5804680
I love this picture, my nephew had a copy of LoZ and he brought the manual over too. It was really cool to see that someone had taken the time to sculpt out the entire overworld. I wonder what happened to this after it was done, probably just trashed knowing how things operated back then.

[Anonymous No.5804767]

>>5804541
No, they shouldn't, also my opinion >>> shit >>> your opinion

[Anonymous No.5804771]

>>5804519
I literally didn't need guides and at seven years old I didn't even know guides existed outside of what came with the game. Fuck off with your revisionist bullshit.

[Anonymous No.5804897]

>>5804771
In other words, you resorted to trail and error to figure out basic shit that you were expected to read in the manual, and since have bullshited yourself into thinking that was part of the experience.
>>5804546
Yes, that's the audience who think old games didn't require some additional guide like a manual, or at least word another person, was needed to understand how to play adventure/roleplaying games.
>>5804743
We're talking about the first game. LttP was from a time when space limitations for text began to ease up

[Anonymous No.5804926]

>>5804435
FF7 isn't an RPG?

[Anonymous No.5804954]

>>5804594
How the fuck are there so many people on here who find a way to be both extremely pedantic and completely off the mark at the same time

[Anonymous No.5805203]

>>5804771
I feel proud of myself for actually starting to write a walk-through guide as I played through it, but I was like fourteen.

[Anonymous No.5805228]

>>5804217
>rented this game at blockbuster
>a previous renter had meticulously hand-drawn a map of the game on graph paper and stuck it into the manual
>blockbuster left it there
I wish i could meet you, map-drawing anon, you made me so happy.

[Anonymous No.5805232]

>>5804530
Kek, its this kind of handholding shit that got me to stop playing new games and get into the old stuff

[Anonymous No.5805386]

>>5805232
They need to remake this game with nav points.

[Anonymous No.5806336]

>>5804897
>We're talking about the first game. LttP was from a time when space limitations for text began to ease up
I know. I'm saying LttP doesn't have the problems the first one has. The environmental clues and map help tremendously. The env. clues always let you know what weapon for what enemies because you usually get the weapon in the dungeon with those enemies. And things that can be exploded look cracked. And lots of other hints throughout the game. Even Link's Awakening was a step in the right direction for the series. Zelda 1 is good, but it is flawed.

[Anonymous No.5806340]

>>5803589
Remember having school friends and talking to them about tips and secrets? Or were you born in the early 2000’s?

[Anonymous No.5806351]

>>5806340
Don't see how that's different from quick referencing a walkthrough, tb h.

[Anonymous No.5806354]

>>5806340
People here don't have friends.

[Anonymous No.5806356]

>>5806351
Soulless

[Anonymous No.5806357]

>>5806354
Adults don't have friends either.

[Anonymous No.5806358]

>>5806354
True, but that wasn’t what I was referring to. I’m sure they did in school as kids.

[Anonymous No.5806360]

>>5806354
Whoa buddy, not everybody here is a zoomer that grew up in the no friends era. We grew up in an era where even people with no friends had friends.

[Anonymous No.5806362]

>>5804897
>bullshitted yourself into thinking that was part of the experience
More like that is what the experience is and it triggers you so hard you're throwing as much shit at the wall as possible to see what sticks. /v/ is more your speed, go back you'll be happier.

[Anonymous No.5806367]

>>5806356
My middle school friends were assholes.

[Anonymous No.5806370]

>>5803556
The manual, trial/error and crowd sourcing info.

[Anonymous No.5806459]

>>5804648
those were the days...

[Anonymous No.5806463]

The first final fantasy did the same shit. It didn't tell you where to go or what to do. I wandered around for hours trying to figure out what to do. I remember being frustrated at the time but looking back its probably the most memorable thing about the game for me.

[Anonymous No.5806471]

>>5803589
You had a torch that burned bushes, you got 'stuck', you tried burning a bunch of bushes. Eventually you find the right one and you feel accomplished. Back in the day people actually tried stuff you know.

Of course you don't you're a fucking zoomer who hates doing any effort to get your rewards. Things must be handed to you in a silver plate and they need to be handed NOW or you lose interest and go back to fortnite

[Anonymous No.5806475]

>>5803563
still better than having to buy unfinished games, that get finished after years of DLC.

[Anonymous No.5806665]

>>5806471
>find the ONE BUSH in the WHOLE WORLD MAP

[Anonymous No.5806671]

>>5806475
I just hate not being able to buy a package of everything. Nowadays I wait for complete/gold/special title releases.

[Anonymous No.5806683]

>>5806463
People who see exploration as a hurdle rather than an integral part of the game seriously need to reconsider their hobbies

[Anonymous No.5806725]

>>5806665
Find every dungeon before you can attempt to beat it >>5806683

[Anonymous No.5806734]

>>5806683
Exploration =/= autism or guessing the one pixel in the world map

[Anonymous No.5806741]

>>5806734
You must've enjoyed the stone and shard of agony.
https://zelda.fandom.com/wiki/Stone_of_Agony

[Anonymous No.5806747]

>>5806665
>the whole world map being a bunch of screens

Oh the agony!

[Anonymous No.5806749]

>>5806741
>>5806747
You couldn't possibly have enjoyed using the candle on literally every single bush.

[Anonymous No.5806765]

>>5806749
Using the candle on every single bush is like going down every single word in a dictionary from A to Z until you find the one you're looking for

[Anonymous No.5806825]

>>5806765
Zelda 1 didn't have synonym searches?

[Anonymous No.5807161]

>>5803556
Because we read the manual.
And yes I was there when it came out.

[Anonymous No.5807172]

>>5807161
The original version or the American release?

[Anonymous No.5807456]

>>5803556
Use the map that came with the game to point you in the right direction at first, at least telling you where the first and maybe second and third dungeons were. Once you got the concept that there were 8 (9) dungeons scattered throughout the overworld, the rest of the pieces fell into place pretty quick -- go find these dungeons, turn them upside down, get the loot, use the loot to access more dungeons.

Ideally you kept a hand drawn map with you to denote the various locations you've discovered. I remember spending every afternoon after school for a week just traveling to different parts of the overworld and drawing what's there, mapped out the lake, the hills, the coast, everything except for death mountain because the enemies there were a pain in the ass until I got the wand. This is the only way I can see someone completing the game if they didn't have people to talk to about it (I didn't know anyone in my school who played video games, we only had about 600 students in total and only around 50 in my grade level.), you have to be methodical and take notes.

Trying to get modern gamers into these kinds of games can be difficult, most don't have the right mindset going in and treat them as N64+ era games. A friend of mine tried to play FF1 and got frustrated the king would only tell him to rescue his daughter rather than explaining where to go, despite the only other places on the world map you can travel at that point is the town for shopping and the temple of fiends.

[Anonymous No.5807539]

>>5807172
I'm american. Which do you think retard?

[Anonymous No.5807608]

>>5803556
the instruction book literally tells you exactly what to do to get to the first two dungeons, after that it provides a map and assumes you have a brain

[Anonymous No.5807751]

>>5803556
>I don't get it. How did anybody know what the fuck to do when this came out?
The game manual covered enough stuff to get you started, and gaming magazines like Nintendo Power used to include hints sections (Like Howard and Nester) or even full guides dedicated to beat a game.

Link relevant: Howard and Nester's comics http://www.hn.iodized.net/main.htm

[Anonymous No.5807810]

>>5807751
Funny enough, by time Nintendo Power started as a magazine, Zelda II was already on the horizon and any information about Zelda 1 was mostly focused on the second quest.

[Anonymous No.5807829]

>>5804586
wtf why would you adjust for inflation?

[Anonymous No.5807874]

>>5807829
So you know the true cost of the game?

[Anonymous No.5807892]

This game is actually not bad if you bother to read the instruction manual.

[Anonymous No.5807926]

>>5803716
It's that the toasty secrets are well-hidden. All the stuff essential to passing the game, not so much. So they conflate the two-- tricky secrets = bad game progression-- and then bitch about it.
>>5803556
Look. You can kill shit, it drops stuff, and sooner or later you figure out you can bomb surfaces to find entrances. The game presents everything you need, you just have to stumble into it.
The idea of aimlessly wandering to get your bearings and eventually start mapping on your own wasn't anathema back then, as it wasn't inherently expected yet that the game would come with everything needed, and that you might have to manually map out or keep track of things.

[Anonymous No.5808125]

>>5807892
How can a game that's not bad cripple the gaming industry for many many years?
>>5807926
I wonder if the most trouble was had with people suffering from ocd.

[Anonymous No.5808127]

>>5808125
It didn't cripple the industry. It's just a game that came out when Atari was at its lowest point.

[Anonymous No.5808140]

>>5808127
Maybe it gets undeserved flak? But I heard stories about how many copies of the game were buried in dumps.

[Anonymous No.5808153]

>>5803559
>Not by adding more content,
Zoomers don't know bout my VERY limited ROM sizes in the 80s.

You fucking dumbasses. Memory used to cost a fucking fortune.

[Anonymous No.5808154]

>>5808140
Unsold stock was thrown away when Atari crashed. Not just that game, but everything they had on hand. Atari had been in trouble for a long time. Management had pushed out the founder, and had turned to churning out shovel-ware. ET is a result, not a cause, and far from the worst game they were churning out. To make matters worse, there were so many games for the 2600 that nobody wanted to buy the replacement 5200 system that wouldn't play their existing 2600 game library. The 7800 came too late to help.

[Anonymous No.5808197]

>>5808140
>>5808154
Also the reason there's s many ET cart in that dump is because they produced way too many copies of it. Which they also kinda had to, since the license was so expensive they had to sell like 3 million carts just to break even on it.

It was still one of their best selling carts.

[Anonymous No.5808226]

>>5803860
was the NIntendo Game Nerd justified in saying simons quest 2 castlevania was a piece of shit?
or was it really cryptic? i never got into it, i tried but must of took too much time so i tried to have fun and saw myself going to be going around in circles

[Anonymous No.5808234]

>>5808226
The original NA game had a shit-tier translation, and the game was a little too easy/broken in some places, such as killing "Dracula"(I think that was Death in the OG J version) with the fire easily.
A little more work and a better translation would have made it one of the best games on the system, hands down.

[Anonymous No.5808274]

>>5803589

every screen didnt have bushes. it really didnt take that long to try each bush on screens that had them.

[Anonymous No.5808284]

>>5803556
Magazines and word of mouth, hotlines if you where feeling fancy.

[Anonymous No.5808723]

>>5808226
The "graveyard duck" thing is the only instance I can think of where nobody could possibly figure out what to do without external help and that's pretty much only a case of poor translation. And even then the way to move forward in that case is a really unintuitive thing that you only have to do this one time and that doesn't give you any feedback on whether you're doing something right or not so even a clearer hint may not have helped.

[Anonymous No.5808769]

>>5808723
The graveyard duck thing is a completely accurate translation. It's meant to be a misleading lie.

[Anonymous No.5808817]

>>5808769
/vr/ is such a psychotic board that I can never tell if posts like these are bait or not

[Anonymous No.5809897]

>>5804586
Surely you think far worse of paying for digital then
The only legal way of playing most games these days if by giving them a glorified donation for a download which is worth $0.

[Anonymous No.5809903]

>>5808817
No, it's true. In Japanese the villagers lie just as much as english-- it's just harder to parse since the US translation of the HELPFUL hints are a bit stilted.
https://legendsoflocalization.com/digging-up-castlevania-iis-graveyard-duck/

[Anonymous No.5809918]

>>5806671
Thats why I'm forced to pirate these days, most games are digital only. Even then digital being an option negatively affects the physical release if there is one - see patches, updates, DLC, etc. I'm willing to pay full price for a proper physical copy but I guess they don't want my money, I'd rather buy a physical copy than pirate, I would rather buy a physical copy than pirate even if piracy were legal. Some money is better than no money. Unfortunately for me there are enough brainwashed pay pigs that my voice doesn't matter.
Digital was pushed only so they can make more profit with less effort while releasing lower quality games which is obvious when you take into consideration the industry, Valve in particular, used literal brainwashing tactics to push it. Games made plenty of money when sold physical only so don't believe the industry's lie that games are only able to make money if they receive glorified donations for a fucking download.

[Anonymous No.5810053]

>>5803589
The bush you NEED to burn is obvious. And by the time you NEED to burn it, you have the red candle.

Quite honestly, on most people's first play through they didn't find all the bush secrets until they got the red candle because doing it with the blue was too tedious.

[Anonymous No.5810056]

>>5803814
> Judging a game by optional content that is intentionally hard.

I suppose next we're going to say that Doom on Nightmare is bullshit because enemies respawn.

[Anonymous No.5810059]

>>5810053
I honestly forgot the upgraded candle was a thing. sad.

[Anonymous No.5810067]

>>5808234
> The original NA game had a shit-tier translation
No, the people in that game were supposed to be spewing lies, half-truths, nonsense, and sometimes ominous threats.

A reasonably intelligent person could deduce from the half-truths some things to try. For example, the often-cited duck translation...there is in fact a silk bag in the graveyard. Ducking is required to progress in the game, but not in the graveyard.

[Anonymous No.5810080]

Best Zelda after lttp

[Anonymous No.5810156]

>>5808723
>the "irrelevant to clue" part is the only instance i can think of where nobody could possibly figure out what to do with the simple easy to understand rest of the clue
lel

>>5808817
Indeed. The irony of watching people who regularly lie, bullshit and spout seemingly random gibberish getting violently triggered when that happens in a game is thick and sweet.

[Anonymous No.5810243]

What is Graveyard Duck?

[Anonymous No.5810313]

>>5810067
>>5810243

>>5809903

[Anonymous No.5810348]

>>5810313
Well that's ..um... what's the word.
(lol)

[Anonymous No.5810384]

>>5803556
I don't understand the love for Zelda 1. If you grew up with it, sure, I'm happy for you.

But for a modern audience... I don't know man. I can't do it. It's just not fun for me. I know they're a generation removed but I get the same feeling from Zelda 1 on the NES as I do from Adventure on the 2600. I love a lot of NES games. I love a lot of 2600 games. I consider myself a pretty big fucking 2600 fan. I feel like I've played literally every 2600 game that's worth playing. And I don't really like Adventure. I love the way it looks, I love the duck dragons, I just don't like actually playing it.

Same thing with Zelda. There's just no hook for me. No reason to keep going.

I'm currently about to beat Sword of Hope for the Game Boy, a pretty stripped down point and click adventure rpg (except there's no pointing or clicking) where you make your own map. Loving it. I've really enjoyed every minute of it and I've put in around 20 hours or more so far. So it's not like I can't enjoy a simple adventure game.

I don't know why but Zelda 1 just doesn't click with me at all.

[Anonymous No.5810494]

>>5810384
>But for a modern audience... I don't know man.
Well since you admit you don't know, I'll tell you.
Fuck modern audiences. These shitheads slurp up Fortnite, Nu Wars, super hero tripe, and FPS games(instead of buying some actual guns and shooting the real things which is a whole HELL of a lot more fun than anything Counterstrike can provide). These modern audiences watch copy-pasta calarts trash, drink "craft beers" that all taste like hopped-up bile, smoke the same weed strains, and are all around fucking faggots/cunts. They all have the same cell phones, use the same social media platforms to get more dopamine out of their paltry addicted lives, wear the same shitty clothing, and have the same cosmetic trends. Not like back in our day when you had clashing groups with different tastes that still managed to cross over. Our MTG cards had both power AND defense and were so badass they're banned from almost all tournament play.

"people" like this do not get to have opinions. They get to buy and consume. Then they die.
For those of us who know better, Zelda scratches that little urge in our heads. The same thing that made our father love the crossword puzzle in the newspaper. Hell it's even grid-based!

[Anonymous No.5810537]

>>5803556
They didn't and that was the fucking point of the game. You were supposed to go in blind, actually explore the game's world and get satisfaction from finding things on your own knowing you accomplished something. Same concept applies to Metroid. It's also worth noting that back then it generally wasn't expected that you were able to beat a game you just bought in few days as it is nowadays and (at least in the mind of gamers back then) beating a game was kind of a big deal because of this.

Now what's up with people born in 90s or later being so afraid of any sort of exploration in video games? Is it simply they are used to linear as fuck games being the norm even in genres like RPGs and action adventure games that previously used to be about exploration or is there something else to this phenomenon?

[Anonymous No.5810561]

>>5810494
>>"people"
it's oozing all ovvver
>>5810537
>>Now what's up with people born in 90s or later being so afraid of any sort of exploration in video games? Is it simply they are used to linear as fuck games being the norm even in genres like RPGs and action adventure games that previously used to be about exploration or is there something else to this phenomenon?
So much generalizing and pent up teenage angst in har

[Anonymous No.5810572]

>>5810537
Indeed. I can't help but be reminded of times when I see people complaining about having to spend 40-50 hours in a game of FF7/8/9. I average 78 hours on my playthroughs of those despite knowing them extremely well. I'll put 400 hours into Morrowind or Skyrim and not beat them. I've never beaten an Elder Scrolls game yet I've never felt the need to. Gotten my money out of all of them. Hell, 35-40 hours for a run of Chrono Trigger is my norm.

Everyone's in a hurry and hates spending time at wasting time.

[Anonymous No.5810580]

>>5810572
Spending 400 hours in Morrowind seems easy enough, but how you managed to do it in Skyrim is a true blue mystery. You musta had a killer time with modifications.

[Anonymous No.5810610]

>>5810580
I just wandered around, searching various places for stuff to either add to my "money vaults" in one of my homesteads(gold/silver bars, coin, gems, etc), or more importantly, gathering items for weapon/armor crafting, etc. To me, crafting items in the game is as fun as routing out goblins from dwemer ruins. I usually had a pine-scented candle burning and the lights low in the house when playing the game.
Been a few years since I went through though. Mods make it even greater.

[Anonymous No.5810626]

>>5810610
I might give it another go soon, I at least need to do the two meaty expansions, maybe look for a mod or two that peaks my fancy. Skyrim only drew me in enough for the main quest back in 2011, I found most barren caves whenever I explored in it.

[Anonymous No.5810647]

>>5810537
it was a wonderful feeling for its time, but the novelty of exploration in this game has sort of worn off. i'd say it's not entirely lost in other retro games though.

[Anonymous No.5810660]

>>5810626
I find the rugged mountainous and cold world to be very alluring. I've always loved mountains and northerly climes. Stark contrast to my current home on the space coast.

[Anonymous No.5810909]

>>5810580
>tfw my dad has played vanilla skyrim on xbox 360 almost every day for like 4 years
>probably has over 6000 hours

[Anonymous No.5811930]

>>5803556
If you want it to not be a pain in the ass without referencing a walkthrough like a faggot.
Just play one of the Zelda Classic zclassic versions.
Not the default one, because they disable the map button, but if you play one of their non-default copies of the original Zelda, you can check the map of where you've been and it doesn't even spoil hidden secrets so you don't feel like a shit head for using a map.

[Anonymous No.5811960]

>>5810537
They made video games super hard in the old days, not because they give a fuck about vague concepts like satisfaction of the journey.
They made video games super hard so you would have to rent and re-rent and re-rent games.

Japanese games were super fuckin' easy by comparison.
>inb4 SMB2j
That was an outlier.
Battletoads and Bayou Billy were super fuckin' easy in Japan. Try their japanese versions yourself if you don't believe me.
If you look up most of the Konami games that never got released in America. Not even under the shell company Ultra Games, they were all piss easy shit. Some dumb shmup where basically nothing happens. All gay.

[Anonymous No.5811962]

>>5811960
>Japanese games were super fuckin' easy by comparison.
I forgot to mention. This is because renting is illegal in Japan.
Japs aren't going to buy a super hard game if they don't think it will be satisfying or fun. And if it's too hard, they're less likely to try, (or atleast that's what the companies thought).

[Anonymous No.5812020]

Didn't the game come with a map in the box?

[Anonymous No.5812030]

>>5804614
Fire Emblem? I guess?

[Anonymous No.5812086]

>>5811960
SMB2j not getting released in the west because it was "too hard" is an extremely modified truth. It wasn't released because it was essentially a harder level pack for SMB1. The words to focus on here are "level pack for SMB1", not "harder".

[Anonymous No.5812130]

>>5811960
Yes, but this thread is about Zelda 1.
The OG game and its sequel were both no easier on the FDS/FC than on the NES.

[Anonymous No.5812237]

>>5812130
>Yes, but this thread is about Zelda 1.
>The OG game and its sequel were both no easier on the FDS/FC than on the NES
You can defeat the big ear enemies by yelling into the microphone in Zelda 1 in japan.

You need the arrows for the NES

[Anonymous No.5812297]

>>5812237
Okay, and? They're still no easier.

[Anonymous No.5812676]

>>5812237
In either version of Zelda 1, the method used still kills them in one hit. That doesn't sound particularly more or less difficult.

[Anonymous No.5812687]

>>5812676
Blowing into the microphone for zero cost versus an arrow and proper aiming.

[Anonymous No.5812810]

>>5812676
>im retarded and like to show everyone how retarded I am
Whatever floats your boat kid

[Anonymous No.5812936]

>>5803556
You didn't play it like you would now. I know people who spent days exploring everything and making maps of the world and marking down where everything was.
>>5803559
This post is essentially correct, but it wasn't because they were trying to fuck over the consumer, they were trying to make a game you could spend a lot of time with and have fun exploring the world of.

[Anonymous No.5813864]

>>5808153
>You fucking dumbasses
isn't it ironic that it is always the lowest IQ monkey tries to insult people by refering to them as dumb?

how does this change the fact that the games were very much artificially stretched?
also see >>5812936

[Anonymous No.5813872]

>>5810537
>tfw 80 hour RPGs used to be about the gameplay and exploration
Now 80 hour RPGs are like 20 hours of gameplay and 60 hours of cutscenes.

[Anonymous No.5814019]

>>5813872
20 gameplay 20 cutscenes and 40 hours running simulation.

[Anonymous No.5814025]

>>5813864
>artificially
I agree ROM size is no excuse but Christ can't an anon make it one post without saying something utterly retarded?

[Anonymous No.5814904]

>>5814025
No. It's literally impossible to post on 4chan without being retarded.

[Anonymous No.5814914]

>>5810537
>exploration
walking simulation you mean

[Anonymous No.5814978]

>>5814914
He probably meant interacting with various things in the environment to see what happens.

[Anonymous No.5814986]

>>5803556
... The manual?

[Anonymous No.5815026]

>>5808197
And the game wasn't even that bad. It was actually pretty impressive imo

[Anonymous No.5815112]

>>5803556
exploring was fun. you had to use your imagination to play. it's a roleplaying game

[Anonymous No.5815117]

>>5803716

[Anonymous No.5815123]

>>5803590
challenge run?

[Anonymous No.5817617]

>>5814914
There is no walking simulation in Zelda 1.

[Anonymous No.5817751]

>>5813872
> 80 hour RPGs

These were never a thing, anon.

[Anonymous No.5817828]

>>5807874

I think anon is talking about balloons or something

[Anonymous No.5818994]

[Anonymous No.5819007]

>>5818994
90% of 4chinz

[Anonymous No.5821557]

>>5817751
Baldurs Gate 2

[Anonymous No.5822010]

>>5818994
GameFAQs.jpg

[Anonymous No.5822014]

>>5810909
Wanna meet that dad

[Anonymous No.5822017]

>>5817751
Persona 5

[Anonymous No.5822019]

>>5822014
I find that he was able to enjoy the single game that long endearing.

[Anonymous No.5822224]

>>5803716
based as fuck anon

[Anonymous No.5822259]

>>5822019
>>5822014
i think he's started over with multiple different characters over time, he likes trying out all kinds of different builds in RPGs. i question the level of depth involved with doing that in skyrim but he seems to enjoy it so w/e

[Anonymous No.5823025]

>>5807892
I had three games for atari.

This was one of them.

[Anonymous No.5823034]

>>5810561
If you want to be treated like people, you should probably start acting like human beings.

[Anonymous No.5823035]

>>5803556
It was supposed to start a whole genre where you'd read the manual to know where to go. Didn't quite catch up

[Anonymous No.5823076]

>>5806340
late to the party (born in 93) but i remember this one fucking liar in school who said in gta 3, if you hold in every button you spawn a helicopter, don't know how long i tried lel

[Anonymous No.5823135]

>>5823034
Irony

[Anonymous No.5823815]

>>5823135
weak comeback

[Anonymous No.5824062]

>>5823815
Now I'm aware of your low intelligence, congratulations.

[Anonymous No.5824160]

This thread topic is like a virus infecting /vr/, it got Alzheimer and has to repeat the same question over and over again.

[Anonymous No.5825127]

>>5810494
>copy-pasta calarts trash
I always get a chuckle from dullards who act like this is the first time in history that cartoons have a formulaic artstyle. Every cartoon on TV looked like Dexter's Lab not too long ago. And all of those mattel tie-in cartoons that 80's kids love to wax nostalgic about were aping Hannah Barbera stuff from the late 60's like 10 to 20 years after the fact, and I can guarantee you that none of that shit had an ounce of "soul". If I were 10 i'd want to watch Adventure Time over Captain Planet any time of the day

[Anonymous No.5826218]

>>5815123
three hearts, no ring, no bottle, no continuing, no saving after dying, and some other minor restrictions.
stuck on ganon. trivial on normal runs, but as-is he takes 15 hits and has a ohko touch (and 3hko fireballs).

[Anonymous No.5827038]

>>5825127
>Captain Planet
- Was a 90s cartoon, not 80s.
- Was always shit. Anyone at the time with half a brain recognized the show was retarded environmentalist propaganda.

Kids in the 90s watching cartoons watched stuff like Batman: The Aniamted Series.

[Anonymous No.5827051]

>>5826218
Bravery