/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.5778062]

You call them save states, I call them bullshit filter

[Anonymous No.5778067]

>>5778062
Just have your fun, no reason to so defensive, anon.

[Anonymous No.5778075]

>>5778062
a game that fucking huge needs a save system. even if it's a password entry screen. that's my biggest gripe with mario games pre-super mario world. super mario world was the first time i actually **enjoyed** a mario game

it was like..ok, this is hard, but as long as i can keep my progress, i am up for a challenge no matter how difficult. i'll put up with a lot of abuse if i can just keep what i've done

[Anonymous No.5778080]

>>5778075
this is why I play the SMAS version of the originals.

[Anonymous No.5778084]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with using savestates as means of returning to the game after you're done playing it for a while. However, when you start using them like PC gamers do, that is to bypass any punishment the game tries to give you, you have to be honest with yourself and admit that you're not getting the full experience and you're fucking with the difficulty curve.

[Anonymous No.5778087]

You call it difficulty, I call it casual filter

[Anonymous No.5778093]

>>5778084
I don't think you should use save states unless the game is being bullshitty. Playing the same level over and over again because the ending is evil is not my idea of fun

[Anonymous No.5778101]

>>5778062
>play flawlessly up until the bridge in world 8
>hand randomly takes you to levels with insane amounts of difficulty

fuck that god damn game

[Anonymous No.5778130]

You call these threads shitposts but I call it what it really is - ZOG INFILTRATION

[Anonymous No.5778137]

>>5778062
Hot opinion coming in. If a game isn't fun enough to play normally, it's not worth playing.

[Anonymous No.5778151]

>>5778101
kek, they only pull you in sometimes. if you die on one without clearing it, you can try to move past the rest of them
the airship after the hand stages is probably the hardest level in the game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2uWdAtpzuY

[Anonymous No.5778175]

>>5778146
What... the... hell... is... that...
And where can I get one

[Anonymous No.5778176]

>>5778062
I call them git-gud blockers

[Anonymous No.5778181]

Who the fuck needs save states to play unmodded Mario?

[Anonymous No.5778184]

>>5778062
I call them Restore Points. Just as Myahon-san intended.

[Anonymous No.5778217]

>>5778075
That's what warp whistles are for.

[Anonymous No.5778220]

>>5778101
>hand randomly takes you to levels with insane amounts of difficulty
What? There are some hard levels in World 8 (by the standards of me as a little kid) like the fast airship and the fortress (I always got lost super easily until I memorized it), but the hand levels are easy. I usually play the hand levels willingly just for the items they give you.
First hand level is not only easy but if you bring a fire flower then nothing in the level poses even a minor threat.
Second level is literally just podoboos and I can't fathom anyone dying in it.
Third level is probably the hardest of the three but it's also really easy to clear as long as you don't stop running.

[Anonymous No.5778327]

>>5778062
>there are people that can't beat Mario 3 without cheating
This is DSP levels of incompetence.

[Honestly, I Wish I Could Legal(...) No.5778358]

>>5778062
Wow! You're TOTALLY hardcore! 100%-ing every game in one sitting? WE'RE NOT WORTHY! Oh wait - some of us have better things to do than play video games all fucking day. Some of us actually have lives, and don't want to spend an inordinate amount of time festering in some mould/jizz covered, tattered old chair... Why do threads like this one keep appearing on this board? Get a fucking LIFE, you sad wankers.

[Anonymous No.5778423]

Nice

[Anonymous No.5778995]

>>5778075
>this is hard
lol no it wasn't

[Anonymous No.5779005]

>>5778062
Just don't claim to have beaten the game.

[Anonymous No.5779018]

>>5778062

[Anonymous No.5779206]

>>5779005
If you see the ending, you've beaten the game

:^)

[Anonymous No.5779479]

There's nothing wrong with save stating the beginning of a boss fight. You already proved you can make it there.

Save stating during the fight though is savescumming trash tier. Also SM3 isn't even that hard.

[Anonymous No.5779489]

>>5778220
There is not a single level that of Mario 3 that would qualify as difficult. The final stages have some challenge and resistance that's it, none of them cross the line into being difficult. In fact, there's not a single stage in the game that is as difficult as the second stage of Ninja Gaiden, the third stage of TMNT, third stage of Super Ghouls and Ghosts (all beginners / moderate stages in their own games)

It's not a pushover easy game but at no point becomes difficult either.

[Anonymous No.5779491]

>>5779479
If the developers had wanted you to start at the boss fight they would have started you at the boss fight. You have to go through the bits prior again. It's meant to be an enjoyable experience not something you are trying to beat as fast as possible.

[Anonymous No.5779493]

>>5779479
no, you didnt, you just got lucky, savestates only maybe at the start of the level.

[Anonymous No.5779524]

>>5779479
>There's nothing wrong
>you already proved
I hate to use this buzzword but this is the definition of cope. The game isn't broken up into stage and boss, the boss is part of the stage, and the challenge comes from playing the game at a high level with enough consistency so that you can beat the stage and its boss consecutively. The stage is part of the boss battle, it's a series of challenges meant to challenge you to keep your powerups and health for the final battle and the battle is part of the stage meant to test your concentration and ability to perform precise maneuvers in a high risk confined environment while battling the fatigue that comes from going through the stage and the nerves that come with being sent all the way to the beginning.

Plenty of games do start you at the boss battle when you die and other games don't. Plenty of well designed games have the latter philosophy and there's a reason for it, you didn't "prove anything" by save stating before the boss, all you've done is justify cheating and lazy zero skill play. In that case you're better off not even playing the game, it's not for you if you can't appreciate the challenge of beating stage and boss in one go.

[Anonymous No.5779590]

>>5779524
>the challenge comes from playing the game at a high level with enough consistency so that you can beat the stage and its boss consecutively

The challenge is memorizing the level and not much else past that because it plays out the exact same way each time. You are not growing as a player or proving anything by doing the same boring slog over and over.

[Princess Sevenleaf !IT2uZpX.Ic No.5779601]

Quicksave abuse actually makes games harder because you never learn how to not-die. The fear of death will make you stronger.

[Anonymous No.5779603]

>>5779601
unexpected based tranny post.

[Anonymous No.5779605]

>>5778062
None of the bosses in SMB3 are hard, though.

[Anonymous No.5779607]

>>5779605
They are if you aren't good reading their i-frames.
I remember losing a lot to them when I was a kid, anxiously jumping at them at the wrong time and getting fucked.
Also the heavy ones can stunt you on the floor if you don't jump when they land.

[Anonymous No.5779649]

>>5779607
>They are if you aren't good reading their i-frames.
Jump on their head when it's exposed, don't jump on them if you can't jump on their head.
>the heavy ones can stunt you on the floor if you don't jump when they land
So jump when they land.

I can understand a child having difficulty, I know I found those bosses tough when I was like 5 years old playing this game. But a full grown adult with any amount of video game experience should not have difficulty with any of the bosses in SMB3.

[Anonymous No.5779661]

>>5778217
Why use a warp whistle to arbitrarily take you to one part of the game instead of the end? Why need to play through the majority of the first world in order to access it? SMB3 was extremely ambitious for its time and adding a save function would have been challenging.

[Anonymous No.5779663]

>>5779590
>The challenge is memorizing the level and not much else past that because it plays out the exact same way each time. You are not growing as a player or proving anything by doing the same boring slog over and over.
Of course you are growing as a player, you are getting a lot better at the run through every time, this is particularly the case in games like SM3. You are proving something by being good enough to both get through the level and defeat the boss in the same run. Doing either one of those scenarios by itself could be done on a lucky run, but to do them both in the same run - the odds don't favour it unless you got pretty good at them. If you didn't get through them both you didn't beat the game. The words "boring slog" are your own, most people don't consider it "boring" or a "slog", it's meant to be fun. .

[Anonymous No.5779754]

>>5779661
>Why use a warp whistle to arbitrarily take you to one part of the game instead of the end?
Use a warp whistle on the warp screen to jump to World 8, then.

[Anonymous No.5779771]

We live in a decade where old games can be customized to virtually unlimited experiences on a per user basis. We can change the look, feel, and interactions with the game using a patcher. You can play with any controller you want, any translation, randomize the levels, play a remixed version of the game, even restore cut content or add content that's completely new. You don't need to defend yourself for trying any of these things, including save states. Don't try to impress purists. They are only impressed by their own talents.

[Anonymous No.5779775]

>>5779607
Good grief no they fucking aren't, they're not particularly fast, there's nothing else to worry about on the screen, their size is small relative to the screen as is the player giving lots of room for error in movements, and even their projectiles are very tame in terms of pattern and speed. You lost to them a lot as a kid I ran through them effortlessly as a kid and I was not very good games.

[Anonymous No.5779785]

>>5779590
This is especially retarded, you still have to execute even when memorized, the more obstacles you have to execute consecutively the higher probability of screwing one up is. If memorization were the only thing then nobody would ever die ever after a few times in any game. This is basic logic and you had to know this was a shitty argument the second you made it.

[Anonymous No.5779925]

>not save-stating wendy's pain state and hitting load over and over again until you blow your load

plebs ITT

[Anonymous No.5779991]

>>5779925
>spilling your seed for any purpose but procreation

[Anonymous No.5780000]

I just love that I can save in games that never originally supported it.
Nothing like jumping right into the action while you're on the shitter.

[Anonymous No.5780117]

>>5779661
>Why use a warp whistle to arbitrarily take you to one part of the game instead of the end?
So you can play all the levels? Like yeah you can skip most of the game if you want to, but then there's a ton of content you're missing.

[Anonymous No.5780164]

>>5779649
>has played the game from the young age
>surprised when a new player has trouble with bosses
SMB3 bosses are annoying and you have to REPLAY THE GODDAMN LEVEL if you lose

[Anonymous No.5780184]

>>5779479
Do you save state before every other obstacle in the stage too because you already proved you can get to that point?

[Anonymous No.5780230]

>>5780164
>>surprised when a new player has trouble with bosses
If the new player is an adult and has ANY experience with other platformers the bosses are not bad at all. I guess I'm ignoring the possibility that this could be the person's first ever video game, but why would such a person post on /vr/?

[Anonymous No.5780262]

>>5778062
Me too.

[Anonymous No.5780279]

>>5778062
I call you filthy zoomer.

[Anonymous No.5780341]

>>5778084
That is something I never thought of until one anon pointed out how using savestates in Ninja Gaiden will deliberately make the game look impossible as you reach the end. That's because the game assumes it is the 80s and you are playing the game on the NES, getting better as you die dozens upon dozens of time.

[Anonymous No.5780356]

>>5778084
I'd say save states as a way of returning to gameplay position due to having to leave or go to bed are fine and you can still say you beat the game. I know as a kid I'd sometimes shut off the TV but leave the console running when I had to go do something else.

At the end of the day, though, who cares, do what the fuck you want, as long as you have fun and don't try to make false brags of skill when you just cheated. I know I've savescummed through games that I didn't give a shit about clearing properly, like when I want to do a quick run through of an interesting prototype build or a game in order to spot differences and whatnot.

[Anonymous No.5780431]

>>5780164
>REPLAY THE GODDAMN LEVEL
wow dude 2-3 minutes? thats tough.

[Anonymous No.5782526]

Just save state before every mission/stage and things are alright

[Anonymous No.5782545]

>>5780431
>to try a boss 10 times you need to spend 20-30 minutes replaying the same level over and over again

[Anonymous No.5782547]

>>5782545
that's what you deserve for having trouble with smb3's bosses rofl

[Anonymous No.5782641]

There is literally nothing wrong with savestates provided you only use them at actual in-game checkpoints.

[Anonymous No.5782642]

>>5782545
>losing to a mario 3 boss 10 times

[Anonymous No.5782646]

>>5782642
I just have no patience

[Anonymous No.5782650]

>>5778075
Mario All Stars you pleb

[Anonymous No.5782662]

I used savestates in the first 3 Zelda games after clearing a dungeon, is that wrong?

[Anonymous No.5782671]

>>5782641
>There is literally nothing wrong with savestates provided you only use them at actual in-game checkpoints.
And don't use them to bypass game overs or similar punishments for losing. If you savestate on a checkpoint to come back to the game another time without losing progress, that's fine. If you load that savestate on every death, you're cheating and missing out on the full experience of the game.

[Anonymous No.5782731]

>>5782646
playing a nice game and practicing the virtue of patience.
two birds with one stone, a win win situation.

[Anonymous No.5782741]

>>5782662
Not if you had fun playing the game.

[Anonymous No.5782812]

>>5782662
It's not "wrong," but it's not the intended experience. The most important thing is enjoying yourself, and I can understand that not everyone likes the highly punishing nature of those older games. Walking from the starting temple back to where you died in Zelda 2 can be tedious and frustrating. As long as you're consciously aware that you're denying yourself the full experience, it's fine, but I do encourage everyone to at least try older games straight without savestates and the like. You might be surprised and find it more interesting that way.

[Anonymous No.5782865]

>>5778075
There's a hack out there now for SMB3 on NES that lets you save your game.
You don't need to play the inferior All-Stars version like others are suggesting.

[Anonymous No.5782870]

>>5778084
>owever, when you start using them like PC gamers do, that is to bypass any punishment the game tries to give you
This is not fair because PC games usually are designed with savescumming in mind.
Like there was never any save points in most old-school PC games.

[Anonymous No.5782884]

>>5778176
T H I S

I feel disgusted that I used to save-scum Contra and Super Contra on NES. Now I can no-miss clear the former and 1cc the latter without much of a problem.

You savestate you lose. Git gud.

[Anonymous No.5782885]

>>5782671
Some games are cunty though.
Like the end bosses in Mega Man X. If you fail you have climb back up for like a minute which is fucking annoying and if you run out of energy tanks you have to game over and go back to Armored Armadillo's stage to recharge your tanks(all while avoiding extra lives in case you fuck up again)

Better to just make a save state as soon as you start fighting the dog and save yourself all that wasted time.

[Anonymous No.5782915]

savestates are such a drastic measure
I mean
at least look at a walkthrough or someone else playing, cuz people did that. either they asked someone, checked a strategy guide, or watched it being done by a friend/relative.

[Anonymous No.5782931]

>>5779603
You know you're a fucking soiboi when a literal tranny is showing you up in gamer credibility.

[Anonymous No.5782998]

>>5778075
The whistles will allow you to access any world within a matter of minutes.

[Anonymous No.5783004]

>>5779661
His point was that you use the warp whistles as a sort of 'continue', because they literally let you choose which world to start from. This was lost on you, because you're a stupid fucking teenager.

[Anonymous No.5783047]

What's that, you ran out of continues?
You'd better start the whole goddamn game over again!

[Anonymous No.5783063]

>>5783047
What's a warp whistle, zoomer?

[Anonymous No.5783071]

>>5783063
>Implying I was only talking about Mario.
>Mario doesn't even have Continues

[Anonymous No.5783083]

>>5783071
>Implying I was only talking about Mario.
You posted a fucking image of Mario and Luigi, you jewish fuck.

[Anonymous No.5783094]

>>5778084
>like PC speed runners do
fixed

[Anonymous No.5783102]

>>5780184
no that's what rewind is for

[Anonymous No.5783112]

>>5783083
Stop overthinking things you fucking nerd.

[Anonymous No.5783116]

>>5783112
Ah, you're a jew.

[Anonymous No.5783132]

>>5782545
You should be forced to start the game over after the fifth time since you are so shit at games

[Anonymous No.5783160]

I understand. It seems like hard work getting to where you got the first time you play a game. 1)it's the first time so you're still getting used to the mechanics.
2) you're figuring out the levels. enemy placement, how to deal with them and where to get power ups
3) retro games recquire patience. scrolling the screen just a little bit to the right usually pays off
but by the time you play it again you already have an idea of progress. you learn where you can get an item, have a good idea of how much you've progressed through the stage and the game become the sum of the accomplishment of small goals. it's very neat when you play it again, specially after a good night of sleep, and breeze through an area you had trouble before and then say to yourself
>why did I even die at this easy place

[Anonymous No.5783269]

>>5782662
nah

[Anonymous No.5783279]

>>5783269
Jew.

[Anonymous No.5783387]

>>5783160
Lunatic.

[Anonymous No.5784756]

why not just watch a tas at that point

[Batowl No.5784770]

>>5778062
Eh it only gets hard at the end.

[Anonymous No.5785107]

>>5782885
Yeah, that seems fine to me. If the punishment for losing to the boss is having to spend 20+ minutes simply grinding for health with absolutely no challenge I don't see the problem in just saving yourself some wasted time there. Especially if there's not even a stage to replay and the game lets you jump straight to the boss after doing that grind.

[Anonymous No.5785113]

>>5778062
Acting like we wouldn't have abused the fuck out of these as kids back then is high horse nonsense. Hell most of us was doing it on pc anyway with quick saves and quick loads.

[Anonymous No.5785129]

>>5785113
>Hell most of us was doing it on pc anyway with quick saves and quick loads.
>tfw you accidentally quick save instead of quick load while falling down a pit

[Anonymous No.5785140]

Pic related is the definitive version of SMB3.
>get access to all items in the game from the start
>can use as many P-Wing, clouds to skip levels, whistles, any Mario powerup suit anytime, etc
It basically made you God. The only levels you couldn't skip were the ship/tank levels on world 8 which can't be skipped with the cloud, and the hammer bros/fire bros on the maps (but you could set them to sleep anytime with the music box).

[Anonymous No.5785147]

>>5785129
Got what you deserved.

[Anonymous No.5785371]

>>5778062

I mean, most of those games didn´t have save points because of the memory limitations not because "muh designed by brilliant perfect minds with supreme insight to play that way "

[Anonymous No.5785408]

>>5779206
i just watched a ton of ending sequences on youtube. I beat 100 games today!

[Anonymous No.5785463]

>>5778080
Based. SMAS makes NES Mario irrelevant.

[Anonymous No.5785567]

>>5778062
>you call them zoomer summerfag casuals, I call them me

[Anonymous No.5785584]

>>5785371
>games can't give you a password at the end of each stage because of memory limitations
Come the fuck on

[Anonymous No.5785597]

>>5783047
Yes anon, that's why they're called continues.

[Anonymous No.5785783]

>>5785371
>>5785584
It just wasn't a priority back then, it's probably hard to understand if you grew up in this era, it wasn't expected that you would be able to save your game, when a game did include a save function it was more of a rare bonus, and usually password systems were so convoluted people would just start from the beginning. I had millions of Punch Out passwords written down only to play from the beginning every time. It never took that long anyway.

There wasn't the same immediacy that you had to start with exactly where you left off like now with save states, going through a few stages in three minutes to get warp whistles was more than acceptable it was a rare bonus most games didn't even have.

[Anonymous No.5786571]

>>5779491
Repeating the same level over and over again is not an enjoyable experience.

[Anonymous No.5786584]

>>5785129
based

[Anonymous No.5786587]

>>5786571
It's not "over and over", it's a few times. You play through the same level a few times. Most people find this worth it and enjoyable. Now if you have a learning impediment or absolutely talentless at games then it may become "over and over" so go ahead, use savestates. But your experience will be somewhat different to how it was intended.

[Anonymous No.5786706]

>>5786571
Says the 12yo repeating 3rd grade over and over again

[Anonymous No.5786729]

>>5785584

Yes, they gave you a password because they didn`t want you to start all over, they wanted you to save your progress but could not simply incorporate a save state feature because of the memory limitations . The shitty password system was the only option to cope that and it sucked balls.

When you use a save state in an emulator instead of typing the password like a retard you are doing nothing wrong, and nothing the developers would not have wanted you to do anyways. Its only ruining the experience if you do it as an exploit for obstacles in the actual levels.

>>5785783
>it wasn't expected that you would be able to save your game

because of the limitations, it was not a design choice that made people happy, as soon as it became easier for the hardware to sustain save features in games it became a commonplace element of game design. It was definitely on everyone`s mind as soon as games started having levels and narratives and shit, that`s why passwords existed, of course you don`t need to save progress in Pong, but it was inmediatly a necessity shortly after gaming evolved from that.

[Anonymous No.5786762]

>can't use savestates if you use original hardware
this kills the emulating baby boy

[Anonymous No.5786764]

>>5783004
>something that's hidden and you have to discover is meant to be used as a primitive load feature
ok retard whatever you say

[Anonymous No.5786782]

>>5778075
I was allowed to leave the console on over night and during school time.

[Anonymous No.5786785]

It's ok to use save states when if you lose to final boss it let's you retry close to him one time but after that one time always drops you back to the very beginning.

Examples: Ninja Gaiden.
Anti-example: Shatterhand (do the boss rush as you are supposed to do it, pussy)

[Anonymous No.5786859]

>>5786785
gaiden games were beautiful and had amazing soundtracks

but they were god damn difficult

[Anonymous No.5786951]

more like "effort filter"

[Anonymous No.5786981]

>>5778062
I tend to only use them in games with limited continues and no password system, level select, etc. And of course, throwing up save states at any time other than some sort of established checkpoint means that you forfeit the right to say that you actually beat the game. The only exceptions might be the boss rushes at the end of the first two Ninja Gaidens, where I don't really see anything wrong with using a save state at the door to the boss rush.

[Anonymous No.5787558]

>>5786762
>being too retarded to use save states on original hardware
wew lad

[Anonymous No.5789128]

>>5782865
>inferior All-Stars version
looks better, plays the same. seething nostalgiacucks are so pathetic
>b-b-b-b-b-but the jump physics!!
are slightly different for mario 1, and nowhere else in the pack.
>b-b-b-but the missing star backgrounds!!!
those weren't stars dipshit. they were shiny rocks because you're in a cold dark cave. they straight up didn't have the graphic fidelity to make their cave look like a cave because the NES version is an obsolete relic.

[Anonymous No.5789241]

>>5778995
Anyone who struggled with this game is a legit retard or has deformed fingers or something.

[Anonymous No.5789621]

Mario 3 has no bullshit though especially Wendy o Koopa every boss is piss easy. I have no problems with save states but you shouldn't need them for that game, I hate to say it but git gud

[Anonymous No.5789627]

>>5786762
Bulju :DDD

[Anonymous No.5789651]

>>5789128
>looks worse
ftfy

>nostaligiacucks
Oh it was shitty "haha I'm a shitheel" posting from the beginning, back to /v/ it goes

[Anonymous No.5790189]

>>5779489
>there's not a single stage in the game that is as difficult as the second stage of Ninja Gaiden, the third stage of TMNT

Those aren't even the most difficult stages of these respective games though.

[Anonymous No.5790194]

I abused the fuck out of the save state feature on Ninja Gaiden stage 6-2 and you know what I don't feel the least bit guilty about it.

[Anonymous No.5790261]

>>5790189
yeah he said that, learn to read nigger

[Anonymous No.5790319]

I only have emulated a few things but here a few games I can remember off the top of my head

>Shantae
Save state summed the gem minigame with the little monkey and polls to farm enough gems to get all the fighter equipment
Don't feel bad about it because if I had it officially I would have just kept turning my system off and on to do the same thing since the save spot is just a little bit away from the game anyhow, they knew it could be exploited on official hardware and they left it in
Plus it doesn't make the game harder for me to stand in a field killing scarecrows for an hour, it's just silly not to use it at that point

>Mother1/2/3
Only used save states when I saved at the phone/ frogs because I was scared of something happening to my file otherwise no save-states

>Kirby dream land 2
no save states

so I'd have to say im anti save state and will make fun of you for using them in most cases

[Anonymous No.5790368]

>>5790194
T b h, 3-2 ruined the game for me. Any tips?