Feeling dizzy playing low-polygon FPS?

[Anonymous No.5760428]

Whenever I play a Build Engine game (or low-polygon half-3D first-person whatever like Ultima Underworld), I feels dizzy and want to hurl. Does anyone here experience the same thing as I do.

(I don't think the problem is the first-person view. I played a lot of Quake and it was fine.)

[Anonymous No.5760481]

>>5760428

Motion sickness. No clue why they would trigger you and Quake wouldn't. Quake is super fast movement and such. So dunno.

[Anonymous No.5760482]

>>5760428
Raise the FOV, console tard.

[Anonymous No.5760485]

>>5760428
I don't get it but I've known many who did.

[Anonymous No.5760536]

>>5760428
I don't feel dizzy or anything but I loathe the way the map warps when you look up or down in Build games. I'm not sure if others know what I mean by that but they don't seem to pan properly.

[Anonymous No.5760557]

>>5760428
I have it when I have to navigate "mazes" in games low poly games, I always get to a point where I get lost and then when trying to find an exit there's an autistic fuse in my head that pops and I get nauseas.

[Anonymous No.5760764]

>>5760428
Turn on vsync. Always play everything with it.

[Anonymous No.5760790]

>>5760428
>>5760481
> No clue why they would trigger you and Quake wouldn't.

It's either FOV, or if not that, I'm thinking it would have to be the stretching/skewing that occurs when looking up or down in early engines.

OP, try source ports that let you fix these issues.

[Anonymous No.5760820]

I know that feel, friend. I can't play Half-Life for more than 15 minutes without feeling my head spin.

[Anonymous No.5760835]

>>5760790
>I'm thinking it would have to be the stretching/skewing that occurs when looking up or down in early engines
Is there a reason Build does this so badly? It's something I've noticed as well.

[Anonymous No.5760841]

This is the reason why FPS have never gained traction in Asia. Too many people there have this problem.

[Anonymous No.5762320]

>>5760841
I am not very sure about that, mate. Behind LOL and DOTA, CS-clone are very big in my country.

[Anonymous No.5762328]

>>5760428
Everybodys brain diff.

[Anonymous No.5764324]

>>5760536
Cuz its not real 3d perspective it's just smooshing the walls together. Always looked shit

[Anonymous No.5764942]

>>5760536
>camera panning in the build engine causes map warps

You really ought to paste this at the end of all your posts from now on—y'know, just so people can safely ignore anything else you have to say.

[Anonymous No.5764998]

>>5760428
Build and other such limted-3D engines use viewplane panning to simulate loking up and down . Build engine also distorts it to simulate perspective which results in a barf-inducing effect if you attempt to play it with mouselook.

Only solution is to use sourceports with proper 3D renderer.

[Anonymous No.5765006]

Same. Modern FPS don't but I get nauseous playing or watching vids of Doom/Duke Nukem

[Anonymous No.5765028]

>>5764998
FFS!

[Anonymous No.5765029]

>>5765028
?

[Anonymous No.5765040]

>>5765029
>Build engine distorts viewplane panning

[Anonymous No.5765042]

>>5765029
>sourceports use a proper 3D renderer.

[Anonymous No.5765090]

>>5765040
sure it does you fucking retard

>>5765042
>what is polymer renderer

[Anonymous No.5765092]

>>5765040
>"woman" who doesen't know any better
>what are the odds
>>5765042
>posting wojak

[Anonymous No.5765425]

>>5764998
>The texture geometry isn't the same when panning vertically.
You silly sod.

[Anonymous No.5765434]

>>5765092
>posting wojak
posting green text dissent

[Anonymous No.5765445]

>>5765090
See >>5765425

[Anonymous No.5765448]

>>5765434
>posting on 4chan

[Anonymous No.5765492]

>>5760428
This used to happen to me a lot. It got so bad I quit playing shooters for a few years, wasn't just Build games. I think it was the resolution for me. It doesn't happen anymore and hasn't since the 90s but I remember it distinctly because it got so bad.

[Anonymous No.5765495]

>>5765445
You've got no heart for this sort of thing kiddo

[Anonymous No.5765507]

>>5760428
>>5760790

Backing up source port suggestion. Low resolution (and all that comes with it) Build engine / Wolf / Doom always makes me want to hurl, Quake too. But I'm always fine with source ports at 1920x1080.

[Anonymous No.5765512]

>>5765495
nshhgjeku ifkaeflshtp

[Anonymous No.5765746]

Ken Silverman's been going absolutely berserk in this thread. Leave his shitty engine alone or you'll get the brainlet treatment!

[Anonymous No.5765757]

>>5762320
Yeah its only japan that has an aversion to fps, all other east asians love stuff like crossfire and soldierfront.

[Anonymous No.5765930]

>>5760428
I think it comes down to low frame animation and general framerate.
In some games I just get headache from it and in some others I dont notice it that much.

[Anonymous No.5766162]

>>5760428
Try disabling headbobbing. I always have issues with heavy headbobbing causing motion sickness, but I'm perfectly fine without it.

[Anonymous No.5766168]

I've always had trouble with 3D games, they make me dizzy.

[Anonymous No.5766185]

>>5765746
Seriously why is there one autist flipping the fuck out and posting shitty memes to derail the thread, this is a genuine discussion for once

[Anonymous No.5766245]

>>5760835
it is this ! the worst about it is that it didnt use to make me feel sick in the 90's ! but after playing so many 3D fps ... going back to Duck Nukem or Blood original versions is doing it now -_- ! either i adapted or i devolved... i really don't know !

[Anonymous No.5766247]

>>5760835
>Is there a reason Build does this so badly? It's something I've noticed as well.

Build isn't a fully 3D engine, and it cuts a lot of mathematical corners to render the environment quickly.

Looking up and down in true 3D would mean rotating the camera, and with it, rotating the walls and floors. That would require a lot more calculations, so they fake it by just stretching and compressing at the top/bottom of the image depending on whether you're looking up or down.

[Anonymous No.5766268]

>>5766245
> it didnt use to make me feel sick in the 90's

Probably because you weren't playing with a mouse back then.

It's no problem if you're doing it with deliberate look up/look down buttons while standing still, but if you're running around in mouselook, it can be a confusing, disorienting mess of skewing that completely throws off your sense of direction and makes your mouse sensitivity feel totally fucked even when it isn't.

[Anonymous No.5766271]

>>5766245
It's definitely something I notice a LOT more nowadays than I used to, so it could be that we're used to games not doing that as you suggest.

>>5766247
Ahh that makes sense. I remember it being especially bad if you were looking up at a tall building for example.

[Anonymous No.5766280]

>>5766247
Funnily enough, the Saturn version of Duke 3D actually used a 3D engine. Until the release of Megaton/Anniversary which allowed you to use a 3D engine as well, the Saturn version was arguably the definitive version of the game.

[Anonymous No.5766289]

>>5766280
Or, you know. Use eduke32 like a normal person.

[Anonymous No.5766294]

>>5766271
> I remember it being especially bad if you were looking up at a tall building for example.

Yep, the steeper the angle you look up/down at, the more distorted it is

[Anonymous No.5766304]

>>5766289
Forgot about that, Saturn version still has a great soundtrack though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pepp4-TKavM

[Anonymous No.5766313]

>>5760428
I do if I play Wolf3D or Blake Stone for too long. Get dizzy and have headaches.

[Anonymous No.5768040]

>>5766304
Abretygud

[Anonymous No.5769948]

Don't worry, it just means you're a pussy.

[Anonymous No.5769968]

>>5760536
Nice catch there, eagle eyes.

[Anonymous No.5769976]

>>5769968
It's more of an issue in build engine than doom because build supports mouse look by default.

[Anonymous No.5770143]

>>5766247
That's not what happens. Build only updates its 3D projection on the horizontal axis. Looking up and down is a simple buffer pan, there is no stretching or compression involved, just the logical off-screen continuation of the visible vertices for that projection.

[Anonymous No.5770860]

Raise fov
Play at higher fps
STOP looking up and down in Build engine. You're not supposed to. Or play with a modern source port with a proper 3D renderer to eliminate that.

[Anonymous No.5772645]

>>5770143
But there is definitely strething involved. Look at >>5765090
You can confirm it for yourself by booting the game in dosbox and looking at anything that's supposed to be circular. IF you look up, it will stretch up slightly, the more you move, the more it stretches, meaning there's more than just panning that's going on.

In Heretic (first Doom engine game that allows looking up and down) there's only panning going on and the view/elements don't become stretched at all.

[Anonymous No.5773043]

>>5760428

try turning on vsync. playing these on modern systems yields a frame rate so high that you end up with multiple tears on screen at once. looking left and right makes vertical lines look like staircases. also, consider shrinking the window size, having that border around the view port can help.

[Anonymous No.5773268]

I've suffered from this shit my entire life. Tried so hard to play certain games I've always wanted to get through but I often just feel so sick like I am going to pass out. Sometimes FOV helps, most of the time nothing helps. This is pain.

[Anonymous No.5773294]

>>5760428
Motion Sickness

[Anonymous No.5773478]

Not the most elegant solution, but have you guys tried dramamine?

[Anonymous No.5774876]

>>5772645
That's not stretching, you didn't read my post properly.

[Anonymous No.5774894]

Build is a shit engine held together with bubble gum. It's known to all, even to its defenders who unironically say things like
>don't look up or down even though these games had mouselook to do precisely that
They cannot or will not accept it as a flaw

[Anonymous No.5774908]

>>5774876
That IS stretching though. Vertical stretching happens alongside vertical panning.

[Anonymous No.5774947]

>>5774908
What you refer as "stretching" is a byproduct of the rendering method and the projection that was used. That "stretched" part is constantly being rendered even when you don't look up and down, it does not just come to life when you decide to enable mouselook. The only thing the game does is pan the buffer up and down.

[Anonymous No.5774973]

>>5774947
Heretic pans buffer.
Build also stretches it vertically.
You can easily see that in the image I provided, I even set the cropped parts together. They are clearly of different proportions. Taken while facing exact same direction and pressing "look down" key
You can easily test that yourself and see the stretching.

[Anonymous No.5775013]

>>5774973
>Build also stretches it vertically.
But what does that even mean though.
>They are clearly of different proportions.
Do you know how perspective works? Have you ever drawn a room with a defined vanishing point?

[Anonymous No.5775037]

>>5775013
are you a fucking idiot

[Anonymous No.5775042]

>>5775013
I know what a panning is, retard
I know how it works
I know how it looks

Doom engine (Heretic, Hexen, Strife) does simple panning up and down of the view port.
In center view if you see part of the floor, that part of the floor remains unchanged as you PAN your view up and down

In build engine like Blood or Duke when you look down, it both PANS the view and STRETCHES the result, which can clearly be seen if you boot up dosbox for yourself

[Anonymous No.5775169]

>>5760428
Try it without mouse-look (up and down, at least). I never played these games with vertical looking as a kid because it fucks with the view so much, and don't even today when I replay them

[Anonymous No.5775191]

>>5775037
>>5775042
Hope this doesn't go over your brainlet heads. Please excuse the resolution, but this is a bitch to compress and still stay above this board's requirements.

[Anonymous No.5775518]

>>5775191
that's not panning you fucking mongoloid

[Anonymous No.5775560]

>>5775518
Don't you dare speak to me again.

[Anonymous No.5776234]

who here /blakestone/?

[Anonymous No.5776372]

>>5764942
would've made more sense if he said "map panning causes camera warps"

[Anonymous No.5778236]

>>5775042
>>5775191
>>5775560
I was so very confused by this thread (still am really), so I had to test this myself using the version of Duke3D I had back in the 90s on DosBox.
For me, this is definitive proof that Duke DOES NOT do perspective warping on look up/down. It's simply offsetting the projection. Like it's rendering at 3 times your vertical resolution and just sliding (or panning, kek) the display port up and down. It's not literally doing that, just effectively doing that. If the engine was scaling the render to simulate perspective warping you would expect to see the vertical lines of the door taper slightly, but they don't, not even a tiny bit.

That's because the "stretching" you see is just the natural result of the perspective projection used by duke. eduke's 3d renderer replaces up/down camera motion with an actual rotating camera so you'll see non-parallel lines.

So the guy posting the webms is correct, however since he just affected the vertical field of view whilst squishing the horizontal field of view, it confused the issue for me. Looking up and down and comparing that to a sliding framebuffer on a 320x720 forced perspective render would be irrefutable. I dunno how to do that though, so I'll make do with a recording that shows the vertical lines don't budge a single pixel when they WOULD if build was stretching/distorting the render to simulate a rotating camera view.

As for Hexen and Heretic, the technique is IDENTICAL, it's just that they don't let you look up and down at quick such acute "angles". I suspect because whoever implemented it didn't like the effect.

I feel I should point out, just for completeness' sake that while DUKE/HEXEN's method is identical, NEITHER is "correct". You can't just move the crop window on a simulated larger frame, that's not how a scene should look when you adjust the pitch of a camera. So it's quite natural to feel the rendering is "off" when you look up and down in duke.

[Anonymous No.5779310]

>>5778236
>>5775560
>>5775191
>they do not know