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/vr/ - Retro Games

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File: 64 KB, 480x240, 1541324598351.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5564962 No.5564962 [Reply] [Original]

So, let's make it clear.
Is the right one supposed to look better? Seriously?

>> No.5564971

>>5564962
that does not make it look clear at all

>> No.5564979

>>5564962
Non shit post answer is that it depends what style you prefer. I think sharp pixels look like shit. I'll have to see, but I don't remember Samus being that desaturated.

>> No.5564982

That's not how it looks irl on a CRT.

>> No.5564987

works on my tv

>> No.5565001
File: 2.85 MB, 3264x2448, WlguCQM.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5565001

>>5564982
Indeed. Look at that visor reflection. Actually looks like one rather than just two pixels.

>> No.5565003

>>5564962
You blur it so much your mind fills the holes

>> No.5565006

>>5565001
This is way worse than both on the OP

>> No.5565013

>>5564962
God NES looks like shit in nearest neighbor

>> No.5565019

>>5564962
Yes. Because it does. Seriously.

>> No.5565021

>>5565001
photos of CRTs never do justice to the real thing.

>> No.5565115
File: 364 KB, 922x424, 1528047524144.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5565115

>>5564962
yes

>> No.5565124

>>5565001
this looks beautiful

>> No.5565129

>>5564962
Is Metroid the ugliest game Nintendo ever made?

>> No.5565132
File: 88 KB, 500x500, tumblr_inline_phiwexvGTu1w169t0_500.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5565132

>>5564962
Neither.

Correct example in attachment.

https://vgdensetsu.tumblr.com/post/179656817318/designing-2d-graphics-in-the-japanese-industry

>> No.5565181
File: 2.29 MB, 1366x2304, crt-faker.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5565181

raw output, crt-faker, crt-faker-glow

>> No.5565184

>>5564982
>no true scotsman

>> No.5565271

>>5565184
taking a picture of a crt is not the same as it looks to the naked eye

no true scotman is another thing. bet you browse /pol/ too

>> No.5565323

>>5565129
It's gorgeous by willyvania standards

>> No.5565340

Pixels are infinitesimal point samples. Big squares are an arbitrary abstraction that make them easier to work with. It's not like the game tells the display to draw the points as big squares.

>> No.5565367

>>5565271
>>5565184
>>5564982
>>5565115
>RF is the only input one can have

>> No.5565374

>>5565367
Until sixth gen, nearly all yanks used what came in the box.

>> No.5566536

>>5564962
No, because the image on the right is from a ancient/just crap CRT. My 20 year-old Toshiba was a £200 model at the time, and the picture quality was waaaay better than that shit.

>> No.5566616

>>5565001
my condolences on the hair loss

>> No.5566625

>>5565184
>straw man

>> No.5566659

>>5566625
I doubt you know what that term means.

>> No.5566660

>>5566536
Why do I hear this every time someone posts CRT images?
Do these mythical good CRTs even exist?

>> No.5566830

>>5566660
Yup. The Toshiba 2987DB 28" 4:3 CRT. Find footage of it running, and you'll see for yourself how good it is. Though, I was actually referring to the, I believe, 14" model that was in the spare room at the time. I just think you've bought shit boxes. Probably Zeniths... :P

>> No.5566913

>>5565181
What shader is this? I doubt it's really called crt-faker.

>> No.5567050

>>5564962
Not at that distance.
From any normal distance (4 to 8 feet away) even the shittiest CRT turns out good results.

>> No.5567151

>>5565181
this looks fucking horrible. how do emufags even cope?

>> No.5567437

Why are you all so obsessed about what TV to use for your game? Just fucking play it, jesus christ.

>> No.5567713

>>5567437
Quite a lot of games were made with CRT televisions in mind. Sonic the Hedgehog on the Mega Drive is the most famous example of this, I think. You should look it up; you'll probably have some understanding of why more and more old skool gamefags are opting for CRT/PVM displays over flatscreens.

>> No.5568696

>>5566913
It is, i made it as an attempt to fake crt on low resources systems, like a raspberry pi.

>> No.5568772

>>5564962
Left is a jagged mess of nonsense it almost looks formless; right is a visage, almost like a monet painting, that conjures a very clear image and feeling for the player in the context of the greater world the character is in.

>> No.5568941

>>5568696
Is there a link or something? I kinda like it.

>> No.5569187
File: 560 KB, 1366x768, Screenshot at 2019-05-12 01-16-24.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5569187

>>5568941
just tweaked the gamma on faker-glow, you can grab it from my github

https://github.com/eylles/glsl-shaders

>> No.5569205

>>5567713
Oh no, how will anybody live without a single waterfall dithering effect? My game experience has been completely ruined by not having this.

>> No.5569373

>>5568772
Someone wrote this.

>> No.5569670

>>5567713
Except PVM autists don't get that effect. You don't get the fake transparencies on a RGB PVM. You don't even get the fake transparencies on a consumer set through anything other than composite. Because the effect isn't caused by a CRT screen, it is caused by the composite signal.

I like my tube because it scrolls smoother than an HDTV, everything is naturally in the proper resolution, and I don't need to buy a $500 scaler. I don't run anything to it through composite.

>> No.5569682

>>5564962
It's frequently not possible to separate art from both the cultural context in which it was produced AND the cultural context in which we experience it today. I don't know what I would think of the two images "in a void". I do know that the left style has been appropriated by shitty indie hipster bugmen and has essentially been ruined for me, so in order to make a statement, I prefer the right style.

>> No.5569683

>>5569373
How is he wrong though

>> No.5569686

Just as a note, the left is what games looked like if you were fortunate enough to have a PC. I had a PC and SNES and thought my SNES games looked way better because they looked like the right image.

>> No.5569847

all those people itt who never used a RGB cable, damn

>> No.5570191

>>5569187
I don't know what I'm doing wrong, but it is very red. Thanks anyway.

>> No.5570229

>>5564962
This might be shocking to zoomers but you're not supposed to have a viewing distance of inches

>> No.5570281

>>5570191
It's red? are you using it on NES games? i dunno why but for some weird reason retroarch makes faker-glow to have a overbearing red tint on NES games, but the regular crt-faker looks nice, also if you have snes9x as a standalone both shaders work perfectly there, haven't tested on nestopia tho

>> No.5570987 [DELETED] 

How do some basic shapes on the skeleton's shield become a face with a triforce of three dots above its head

>> No.5570994

>>5565132
How do some basic shapes on the skeleton's shield become a face with eyes and a triforce of three dots above its head

>> No.5571007

I play my shoddy Model 2 Genesis with an RF cable on a 30 year old RCA

>> No.5571040

>>5570994
It's because the graphics were made for a crt recieving the signal through rf, dithering, flicker, fringe, artifacts, shadow mask, scanlines, all were taken on account and the designer exploited every aspect of it to make a detailed graphic with simple techniques such as the half pixel or 0.5px, which exploits color interference and bleeding.

tl;dr that dirty jap did draw directly on software displaying the sprite on a crt, without the imperfections of the crt you get the ugly simple shapes.

>> No.5571053
File: 50 KB, 480x240, 1557519937208.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5571053

All of the supposed benefits of CRT boil down to blur and texture.

>> No.5571065

>>5564962
For anyone who is old enough to remember: CRT blurring/scalines are the reason why you remember video games looking better than when you see them again a decade or more later on emulation. It's because the relative primitiveness of the earlier technology actually had the strange unintended effect of making it look better. Like a kind of ancient anti-aliasing.

>> No.5571164

>>5571065
Anti-aliasing is shit.

>> No.5571167

>>5571065
>Like a kind of ancient anti-aliasing.
More like cognitive anti-aliasing.

>> No.5571170

>>5571065
But I find the games look even better now than they did back on my crummy old CRT. A lot better actually.

>> No.5571172
File: 1.24 MB, 2560x1440, 20190201_224528.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5571172

>>5564962
Maybe if you actually tuned the colors and sharpness properly. CRTs are incredibly sensitive to tuning, if you don't shoot a set of test patterns and adjust your set properly, yeah it's going to look like garbage. Pic related.

>> No.5571175

>>5571172
Caca

>> No.5571176

>>5571164
Missing the point

>>5571167
Not really... we're remembering what we saw correctly, so it has nothing to do with cognition, and everything to do with the way CRT reproduces images from a console's graphical hardware. When most people see emulated games on their 1080p LCD or whatever monitor, and they think 'Wow this looks bad, I remember it looking better', it's not an error in your mind. Your mind remembered what it saw. But most people might not make that connection, and that's my point.

>> No.5571196

>>5571167
>cognitive anti-aliasing

This should be a go-to term in these threads.

>> No.5571264

>>5571176
>>5571065
Replying to my own posts here because /vr/ doesn't have IDs. If anyone actually understood what I wrote, let me know. I hope there's at least one of you out there.

>> No.5571425

>>5571176
>>5571264
The image was blurry. Your mind filled in the (many) blanks. It's as simple as that.

Now, if you want to talk about developer intentionality regarding graphics and CRT displays, we can have that conversation. However, the previous point remains: it's cognitive anti-aliasing.

>> No.5571452

>>5571425
I am not convinced you understood what I said. I just tried to explain why that is not the case. It's not that you're remembering something different, it's that the hardware you saw it on was different, unless you are one of the rare people who do retro gaming with actual old TV/monitor hardware.

>When most people see emulated games on their 1080p LCD or whatever monitor, and they think 'Wow this looks bad, I remember it looking better', it's not an error in your mind. Your mind remembered what it saw.

We don't get that artistic blurring like >>5565001 pointed out on a modern gaming PC running an emulator, unless maybe those effects themselves are also emulated.

>> No.5571458

>>5564962
Calibrate the fucking set right.

>> No.5571471

>>5571425
And the other image is overly sharp which not only greater exposes, but highlights the imperfections in it, adding visual noise to the image that detracts away from what the image is trying to convey. These sprites aren't photographs, they an approximation of an image made up of tiny colored pixels by people trying to get as close as possible to something resembling a relatable image. The closer and sharper you get, the less it looks like anything but a mess of colored squares; likewise, if it's too blurry you also cannot make out the image as there is far too much information loss. Much like almost everything in life, there is a sweet spot in between hiding some of the data of the image and showing all of the data image which creates the best visual result, and it seems like a lot of people are being purposely obtuse about this very simple concept.

>> No.5571729

>>5571053
only if you use RF or composhit

>> No.5572335

>>5571053
nope
The images shiny through the screen.

Images don't do CRT justice.

>> No.5572862

>>5571264
While it's true we looked at these games with the proper screens back then, our minds also reconstruct memories to an extent. It happens with memories of our personal experiences, movies we've seen, and videogames. We forget some things and our brain fills in the blanks to retain coherence. I recently played N64 on a CRT and it looks horrid, and I don't remember it looking like that then, but it did, in fact it even seemed high quality coming from the SNES' RF.

>> No.5572869

Do any filters on OSSC look good?

>> No.5572885

metroid does not look right with the hard pixels

>> No.5573143

>>5572862
I'm pretty sure that's schizophrenia or some other mental disorder, not a regular function of human memory.

>> No.5573146

>>5569686
DOS games on my 386 never looked like that on my shadow mask monitor.

>> No.5573151

>>5571729
That's only part of it. Pixels do not map directly to phosphors so any kind of CRT smooths the image a bit.

Compare this to the blocky mess you get playing a SNES mini or other emulator on an LCD:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLsU7YzLbnE

>> No.5573342

>>5571065
No, its more like taking advantage of how the human eye blends colors together, which depending on the layout creates the illusion of more color/detail (with the blank/space creating the illusion of levels of shading)

>> No.5573398

>>5564962
right looks a lot better to me OP. what shaderr is it? doesnt look like anything mesen has

>> No.5573409

>>5571471
+1