Do NOT use FirebrandX palettes

[Anonymous No.5361648]

Accurate my ass! It looks so washed out and shitty!
You can’t accurately recreate the NES color palette using RBG values, anyway. So why settle for a shitty approximation when you can use something nice and vibrant like Sony CXA?

[Anonymous No.5361652]

>palettes
What? I don't get to choose a palette when I plug my NES into the TV

[Anonymous No.5361653]

>>5361648
Yeah those look like ass

[Anonymous No.5361654]

>>5361652
Haha lol :)

[Anonymous No.5361670]

>>5361652
Holy shit, you're an epic retro gamer just like me! Upvoted

[Anonymous No.5361678]

>>5361652
haha badass bro
i have a real nintendo too

[Anonymous No.5361693]

>>5361652
Can I have your autograph?

[Anonymous No.5362234]

Yeah the NES had butt-ugly colors. Much like with scamlines, I couldn’t care less about what’s accurate. I wanted to see the pixels back then and now I finally can. I’m not going to dull the image with shit colors or reduce the clarity with meme lines.

[Anonymous No.5362251]

>>5361648
It looks pretty accurate to my Trinitron honestly.

[Anonymous No.5362259]

>>5361648
>needs his NES games to be top GRAFFIX
>instead of playing video games, he's here complaining
Fucking disgrace

[Anonymous No.5362268]

So why are palettes such a pain in the ass with NES emulation?

[Anonymous No.5362273]

>>5362268
Autism, basically.

[Anonymous No.5362296]

>>5361670
>>5361654
>>5361693
>>5361678
>this level of seething from zoomers

[Anonymous No.5362406]

>>5362268
unless you use the analogue inputs with the console, there is no real rgb pallate in the NES. The only closest you got was the playchoice 10 pallete and it looked a little weird at times.

Most times, the emulation uses custom palletes iirc and tries to best match the real NES results.

[Anonymous No.5363625]

>>5361648
I did not know this was a thing but now I will use it

[Anonymous No.5363630]

Just use wavebeam palette

[Anonymous No.5363743]

>>5361648
Just use the pallet you like. There IS NO definitive color representation and thats by the very nature of NTSC and also the way that the NES generates it's analog signal.

NTSC, aka, "Never The Same Color" twice.

[Anonymous No.5363848]

>>5361648
Everyday I browse /vr/, I learn something new that never bothered me before or I didn't even know about. I love this board.

[Anonymous No.5363923]

>>5361648
Those are 100 times more accurate than that fucking Sony CXA palette you rube.

[Anonymous No.5364069]

>>5363923
And look 100 times shittier, cock-licker.

[Anonymous No.5364143]

Why can't we just look at the video output of a PAL NES?

[Anonymous No.5364153]

>>5364143
That isn't the problem. We know how to decode NTSC video into RGB. The problem is that some of the resulting colors (such as the sky color) don't actually fit in the RGB colorspace. The other problem is that some people don't actually like accurate colors.

If we just wanted an "official" RGB palette there are plenty to choose from.

[Anonymous No.5364167]

>>5364153
Then why isn't this an issue for any other NTSC home console?

[Princess Sevenleaf !IT2uZpX.Ic No.5364170]

Why not just:

>plug a real NES into a TV
>plug a computer with Retroarch into the same TV using a splitter
>adjust the NES palette in Retroarch and then keep switching back to the real NES for comparison
>keep adjusting Retroarch's palette until it's impossible to tell the difference

... Why has nobody done this?

Pic related, it's y'all's faces when you realize how smart I am.

[Anonymous No.5364180]

>>5364170
they already have. look up ntsc palette

[Anonymous No.5364182]

>>5364167
It is. You just don't see /vr/ arguing about Atari 2600 palettes or Commodore 64 palettes or whatever because they're not as popular as the NES is here.

[Anonymous No.5364184]

>>5361648
joke's on you I'm WAY too colorblind to care about any of this shit

[Anonymous No.5364187]

>>5364170
That's exactly how FirebrandX made his NTSC hardware palette. It will never be perfect, though, because again, some of the colors simply don't fit in the RGB colorspace.

[Anonymous No.5365291]

>>5364170
Fuck me. Please.

[Anonymous No.5365305]

>>5361648
What is this and why should I care?

[Anonymous No.5365327]

>>5364187
>That's exactly how FirebrandX made his NTSC hardware palette. It will never be perfect, though, because again, some of the colors simply don't fit in the RGB colorspace.

He's using a simple upscaler. Why should he assume that this upscaler is the perfect representation of the "real" colors? That's the entire fallacy of his endeaver. It's just another arbitrary palette.

Palettes in the Consumer range are the best because they're at least based on old CRT TV line from Sony. That's close to what most Japanese deveopers would have used to test the games. There's various palettes based on consumer, like Mega Man 9-10, FCEUX improved or Wavebeam. The exact ones don't matter too much. But consumer range doesn't give obvious errors like purple bricks in Castlevania.

[Anonymous No.5365452]

>>5365327
>He's using a simple upscaler
Where did you hear this?

[Anonymous No.5365535]

>>5361648
Another faggot that is bitching and moaning.

[Anonymous No.5365571]

this thread reminds me of that scene in the matrix where the crew debates whether the chicken they taste in the matrix is really how chicken tastes in real life or not

[Anonymous No.5365810]

>>5365571
woah

[Anonymous No.5365830]

What if everyone just used whatever palette they think looks nice for their own setup, which doesn't affect anyone else?

[Anonymous No.5365835]

>>5365830
hippie

[Anonymous No.5365941]

>>5365327
>He's using a simple upscaler.
Only his very first palette. His NTSC hardware palette was created by comparing them on his calibrated PVM.
>Palettes in the Consumer range are the best because they're at least based on old CRT TV line from Sony.
Loosely. There's evidence to suggest that whoever made that palette didn't plug the right numbers into that Sony decoder matrix, so it doesn't actually correspond to any real TV. There's another version of the palette floating around that's based on plugging more accurate numbers into the matrix of that Sony decoder and the results are very different. And anyway, my actual consumer Sony TV looks more similar to the FBX NTSC hardware palette than it does to the "consumer" one.
>But consumer range doesn't give obvious errors like purple bricks in Castlevania.
That's not really an error. It appears in some palettes but not others because of subtle differences between NTSC-J and NTSC-U.

[Anonymous No.5366738]

>>5365941
What is his very first palette? Composite-direct?

[Anonymous No.5366741]

>>5365941
What is his very first palette? Composite Direct?

[Anonymous No.5366749]

>>5361648
>Sony CXA?
isn't that a firebrand palette? i know i got it from his pack

[Anonymous No.5366778]

>>5366741
It's what became Composite Direct, yes. Originally it was called Unsaturated and went through several revisions.

>>5366749
No one seems to be sure who originally made it. It wasn't FBX.

[Anonymous No.5366871]

>>5362234
>I wanted to see the pixels...
Said nobody back then

[Anonymous No.5366893]

>>5366871
I was always annoyed how games looked crisper in the commercials than when actually played, I mean what the fuck? It's the same tv! the best example of this I can recall was that first xmen game for genesis. fucking bullshots been here from the beginning man

[Anonymous No.5366894]

>>5366871
You obviously never went to arcades.

[Anonymous No.5366901]

what nes palette do you guys think I should use in my game? currently using that sony pvm one. I could allow people to select a palette, but not sure it's worth the trouble

[Anonymous No.5366918]

>>5366901
Doesn't matter which one you pick, your game will still look like garbage.

[Anonymous No.5366927]

>>5366918
you will love my game

[Anonymous No.5366936]

>>5366927
I don't play indie trash.

[Anonymous No.5366939]

Radical Palette Anarchy. Use whatever palette looks best to you, make Mario's overalls blue if it tickles your fancy. Retro purists are autistic as fuck and need to kill themselves.

[Anonymous No.5366948]

>>5366936
im not independent i still live with my mom

[Anonymous No.5367048]

>>5361648
There is nothing wrong with purple skies

[Anonymous No.5367085]

>>5366871
http://www.firebrandx.com/pixelpurist.html

Said a lot of people, zoomy.

[Anonymous No.5367131]

i can use whatever the fuck i want to nigga
suck my dick lol

[Anonymous No.5367234]

>>5367085
Bitch, I'm likely older than you. Back then we wanted shit to "look just like a cartoon" or just like a drawing. Pixels were already a sign of aging tech and we were ready for better graphics and colors.

[Anonymous No.5367247]

>>5367234
>Bitch, I'm likely older than you
prove it, nigger.
>protip: if your birthyear starts with '198', you won't win

[Anonymous No.5367974]

>>5367048
Nice pape. Thanks anon

[Anonymous No.5368090]

>>5361648
>tfw the most-recent NESRGB 2.0 comes with FBX's palette pre-activated
KEK

[Anonymous No.5368935]

>>5367247
>>protip: if your birthyear starts with '198', you won't win
that's where you're wrong cattle. I was born one hundred and ninety-eight years after the birth of your pathetic lord.

[Anonymous No.5369112]

>>5368935

[Anonymous No.5369126]

>>5365830
>b-b-but you're ruining the designer's VISION and you gotta RESPEKT that!!!1!1

[Anonymous No.5369235]

>>5369112
I will consume your soul wretched cat poster

[Anonymous No.5370687]

>>5366936
>>5366918
What game have you made, anon. I'm waiting.

[Anonymous No.5372124]

>>5369235
that's a yikes from me

[Anonymous No.5374098]

>>5361652
fucking based

[Anonymous No.5374134]

>>5361648
The jap who designed the NES PPU around the NTSC signal directly for the color palette is probably laughing to this day, alive or not.
Based palette autists.

[Anonymous No.5374194]

>>5374134
This is why I love the movie The Wizard, it is pure 100% Nintendo propaganda and virtually every kid plays Nintendo on a shitty 13 inch TV. This is how Nintendo imagined 99.9% of their customers playing. Nothing irritates me more than all these PVM fags screaming about authenticity. Playing vidya on a PVM is about as authentic to the day as the .001% of people who got to enjoy vinyl records on a rare and expensive laser player in the 80s. It’s not real dude, it’s cool you can enjoy $10k tech for the price of a 32” flat screen now but it’s not a real vintage experience.

[Anonymous No.5375749]

>>5374194
They literally made their games on PVMs

[Anonymous No.5375770]

>>5375749

So your goal is to feel like a Nintendo developer?

[Anonymous No.5375780]

>>5375770
vintage luxury experience
in any field, nothing beats professional gear

[Anonymous No.5375785]

>>5374194
I don't think anyone using a PVM or trying to use a PVM is going for authenticity.

[Anonymous No.5375917]

>>5375785
a lot of misguided idiots think it's authentic, same with scanlines even though a soft consumer set didn't have visible black lines in the picture.

[Anonymous No.5375945]

>>5375785
Most of the people on this board are anon. Just like most people don’t realize that a NES hooked up to most TVs has purple skies. Does it look as good as blue? No. But when discussing accuracy the firebrand pallet is how I remember my games looking. I don’t use it because it looks like butt and games can look better through the magic of emulation.

[Anonymous No.5375986]

>>5375770
>>5375749
>>5374194
>>5375785
Eat shit, that's want Nintendo wants you to do

[Anonymous No.5376029]

>>5375749
No they didn’t you retarded faggot.

[Anonymous No.5376058]

>>5376029
You’re fucking delusional lmao. You think they used blurry ass consumer sets?

[Anonymous No.5377283]

>>5376029
>professionals didn't use professional equipment
Look up pictures of old game dev offices. They're using pro monitors because of course they fucking would.

[Anonymous No.5377302]

>>5361648
Wait, anon. You're not one of those incels I hear about that doesn't prefer Castlevania 2, are you?

[Anonymous No.5377335]

>>5375917
wut? every CRT has scanlines

[Anonymous No.5377338]

>>5362296
Bbbut I plug my NES into my TV too
and i'm a 28 yr o boomer

[Anonymous No.5377342]

>>5364143
>PAL
eueeijgegh
gross

[Anonymous No.5378774]

>>5364187
>some of the colors simply don't fit in the RGB colorspace.
But a TV makes its colours from RGB so by definition any NTSC colour is being converted to RGB when displayed (i.e. there is an intensity for red, green and blue for any given pixel).So how can any colour it deals with be outside RGB?

[Anonymous No.5378985]

>>5378774
Decoded YIQ can go well beyond the defined range of standard RGB signals. For example, the color of the sky in SMB1 might drive the blue gun at the same level that an RGB input with a blue level of 0.9Vp-p would (I'm making up numbers here). But whoops! The maximum level for RGB inputs is only 0.7Vp-p. The sky is effectively "bluer than blue" from an RGB perspective. This sounds weird and unintuitive at first, but once you grasp how colorspace transformations work it makes sense.

The upshot is that if you try to digitize this out-of-gamut color to 8bpp digital RGB, the blue channel will get clipped to 255, whereas the ideal value would be more like 328. The red and green channels don't get clipped because they're still within the defined range, so you end up with a hue shift and desaturation. That's why the sky appears more pale and purplish when digitized by an HDTV or capture card than it does when viewed directly on a CRT.

There are a few different ways you can deal with this issue when making an RGB NES palette. First, you can simply clip the out-of-gamut colors the same way a capture card would. Second, you can darken the out-of-gamut colors until they fit within the defined range, which gives you vibrant colors with correct hues but screws with gradients and looks rather strange. Third, you can desaturate the out-of-gamut colors, which leaves you with dull-looking colors but correct hues and luminance values. Or you can take a hybrid approach plus a dash of artistic judgement to try to create balanced and pleasing colors. But no matter what you do, you won't be able to perfectly recreate the original colors in standard RGB.