Quantcast
[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / g / ic / jp / lit / sci / tg / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports / report a bug ] [ 4plebs / archived.moe / rbt ]

/vt/ is now archived.Become a Patron!

/vr/ - Retro Games


View post   

[ Toggle deleted replies ]
File: 15 KB, 300x300, 0005414394_23.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5291741 No.5291741 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

Have you ever tried speedrunning a game?

>> No.5291745
File: 347 KB, 1298x1003, Sem título.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5291745

Sure, but not "for real". I don't keep a running clock or look into ultra advanced tricks you'd need hundreds of hours of practice. I just run through games I love as fast as possible to keep it fresh.

>> No.5291791

>>5291741
Yeah, REs and DC back in the 90's. Had a top speed on the official forums for a while, but it was completely laughable by todays speedrunning standards.

Back when speedrunning =/= autism, just the result of replaying your favorite games over and over.

>> No.5291794

Speedrunning is cancer.

>> No.5291819

I played a game fast once and felt a strange urge to wear women's clothes

>> No.5291830

>>5291745
Came here to post this.
Sometimes it is not even that fast, just doing it without dying, which usually involves not losing much time around, so not that different from 1cc.
I got in a top chart in a non-vr game by pure accident, going for world records involves too much dedication for my tastes.

>> No.5291834

Yeah in racing games.

>> No.5291835

no

>> No.5291850

>>5291830

Yeah, I usually go for no saves/deaths/ best ranking. Aside from RE games, I run DKC and MGS games, though Big Boss ranks with 0 saves require too much practice, so I save here and there.

>> No.5291867

>>5291794
So is playing it on 'normal' speed cancer, just less cancer?

>> No.5291876

>>5291741
I'm neither a trannie nor autistic, so i would say no.

>> No.5291904
File: 69 KB, 1440x1080, my-nigga.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5291904

>>5291745
>>5291830
Exactly. Some speedrunning is cancer for sure, a lot of that community is cancer. But let's not go overboard.

>> No.5291990

Mario 64, and I love it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WBK_B0Jvss

>> No.5292012

>>5291904
This.

I speed run games for my own amusement, as a challenge run. Like, if I'm on an RE3 kick, I'll do a speed run, then a no gun powder run and then a few more. Just to get the most out of my usually week long binge with a game like that. But it's all based on my normal level knowledge of whatever game and I have fun doing it.

The "comunity" is literally just a bunch of statistic obsessed, attention whoring shitters who obsessively practice too much, and only have fun when people are praising them. It's pure cancer at that point.

>> No.5292017

>board who loves skill penis waving hates speedruns
Hmmm

>> No.5292019
File: 633 KB, 960x585, ms2pyz3jv4901.png?width=960&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=f50c337c503ba78ddcaafad4b13637f77477feef.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5292019

Why would I do that to myself?

>> No.5292037

I can do SMB in about 25 mins....happy enough with that.

>> No.5292040

>>5292019
Completely heterosexual male with no knowledge of trannies whatsoever. Who’s 110%? Bailey something, I think..

>> No.5292046

>>5292012
The Quake 2-speedrunners are great btw. No drama, just some silly memes, and my own terrible 40+ minute "runs" I am ashamed of uploading for verification.

>> No.5292047

>>5292012

>OOT 100 percent blindfolded

Some people REALLY have too much fucking time on their hands. There's practice an there's... this

>> No.5292056

>>5292040
Bailey Jay
enjoy your fap(s)

>> No.5292106

I was a speedrunner in the mid 2000s, before the hobby really took off. One of the reasons my early 20s were wasted. Made a few world records, including on big name titles. But the hobby was sort of a life suck. The high of setting a record was great, but inevitably comes with a low of losing it. Eventually moved on.

>> No.5292123

I only really speedrun for fun and have only really done one.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eesd-ubWMuc
Overall I think it's fine so long as you dont get too heavily involved in the "community". If you wanna do it, do it for yourself not because you want to look cool to forum posters.

>> No.5292127

Well, no, because I'm not mentally ill and I didn't grow up eating ritalyn.

>> No.5292138

>>5291741
Yes. I was into speedrunning ff7 in 2013/2014, though not attempting anywhere near WR attempts. I was having a lot of fun finishing the game in ~12 hours with Cloud, Tifa and Yuffie. It was more me having a lot of fun doing low level runs with Tifa's Powersoul mechanics and Yuffie dumpstering Sephiroth with Conformer. Also enjoy the occasional RE3 speedrun. I can do it in under 1 hour and 20 minutes, but I waste a lot of time autistically organizing the item box.

>> No.5292196

>>5292017
Hating on speedruns is a meme. The people who do so didn't even know what speedrunning was before twitch.

>> No.5292252

>>5292196
MTF?

>> No.5292258

>>5292017
Who doesn't love penis waving?

>> No.5292269

>>5292196
Not true.

>> No.5292275

>>5292196
Hating on speedruns is nothing new. The platform it is on or where is scores/times are kept mean nothing. There is nothing new about people making fun of autistics. Be real, only autistic people would play the same game 100 times over.

>> No.5292278

>>5292269
Nah, it's true. Notice how 90% of all "criticisms" have to do with things that aren't even gameplay. They don't care about the gameplay or the strats involved. They just want to shitpost about the people running.

>> No.5292280

>>5292275
>There is nothing new about people making fun of autistics. Be real, only autistic people would play the same game 100 times over.
Well that is ironic coming from /vr/.

>> No.5292281

>>5292275
>Be real, only autistic people would play the same game 100 times over.
There's some great irony about posting this on a board that's about old games, especially one that talks about the same 20 games for weeks on end.

>> No.5292306

>>5292278
Shut the fuck up. Hating on some speedrunning communities is NOT a meme, it is well grounded in reality and it's well deserved conviction. I don't know where YOU have been the past few years you didn't know this. I even wrote a post saying not all speedrunning is bad above, but to say that the whole thing is a meme is plain misinformation.

You're wrong about 90% of the criticisms to do with gameplay, but even if there are shitposters, that doesn't mean people can't dislike a community that turns games into something else completely. Another thing is there are many controversies and reasons to hate the speedrunning community - their activism, their banning of people, and yes their hugely disproportionate transgender community - those don't have anything to do with gameplay, they have to do with the community, that's why people hate on the community, that's perfectly logical and valid, where's the flaw? So just to confirm your original post was bullshit, and I have a hard time thinking how someone could come up with that.

>> No.5292315

>>5292017
>let's play the same game 1 trillion times to get 10 seconds faster

autism

>> No.5292324
File: 204 KB, 960x960, meirl.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5292324

>playing retro games for fun/capturing childhood nostalgia/atmosphere

Soul

>playing retro games to break them down into a mechanical formula of rote memorization and completely ignoring the spirit of the original game

Soulless

>> No.5292353

Only Majora's Mask, and it's not really a "true" speedrun. I just keep a savefile at the start of the second cycle, and see how fast i can beat all 4 dungeons without playing the Song of Time, going by ingame time

>> No.5292357

>>5292324
>soul/soulless

Worthless post.

>> No.5292367

>>5291741
no because I can't do that frame perfect, blind jumping nonsense.
if I did I might pick an obscure game (like Fur Fighters) because it would be a niche. Do an efficient playthrough rather than something really tricky.

>> No.5292368

>>5291741
I learned how to beat Dark Souls pretty damn fast to make different builds when I played PVP in 2012-13, but that's not /vr/.

>> No.5292394

>>5292357
>no argument

trash

>> No.5292395

>>5292324
>>5292394
soul
>>5292357
soulless

>> No.5292401

>>5291741
of course not, why play the games faster without all the fun?

>> No.5292493

>>5292401
gotta go fast

>> No.5292794

>>5292106
>Made a few world records
no one called them world records in the mid 2000s. there were no leaderboards, just a list of runs SDA put on their site. the concept of a world record and "going for" a world record started in the late justintv era.

>> No.5292795

>>5292306
>their activism, their banning of people, and yes their hugely disproportionate transgender community
all of these things are GDQ centric and are barely related to the broader speedrunning community.

>> No.5292802

>>5292795
They aren't even really GDQ centric, honestly.

>> No.5293003

>>5291741
Sure thing. BRB, gotta dilate.

>> No.5293023

Yeah I have speedrun.

It can be fun, but it also sucks a big one.

Once you learn how to speedrun, it destroys your ability to play a game casually because whats the point?

If I know how to speedrun Mega Man X, theres never a reason to play it casually because I know the superior strategies.

>> No.5293026

>>5291741
I only speedrun Quake on easy because it's fun. Took me a while to learn the proper bunnyhopping technique though. It's much more difficult than most games that came after it and seems to demand a certain rhytm

>> No.5293046

>>5293023
>Once you learn how to speedrun, it destroys your ability to play a game casually because whats the point?
How? I can still play the game and explore all the locations/features the speedrun has no use for. I can also do this very well which would make the playthrough more enjoyable. I can also play the game modded with a whole list of new features.

It's all about your willingness to do the things you want to do. Don't fault speedrunning for something you're unwilling to do because you think it'd be unenjoyable.

>> No.5293053

>>5293026
Quake and HL1 have god-tier movement desu

>> No.5293065

>>5293053
Agreed

>> No.5293075

>>5291741
suikoden 2. after recruiting clive you have to race to the end of the game then exit the final dungeon and go i want to say north west but it might be south west and find this little town and then you get clives story ending with him shooting the lady who shot his brother. all 3 in "the guild" which are the only ones with guns. also when the names of all the 108 stars (and extra cast) are shown with that epilogue sentence or 2 his is different

in order to do this you have to beat the entire game pretty much in like less than 50 minutes. no point in lolly gaging after you see the sequence with him killing the lady because all the chapters are over except the last and you cant recruit any one. so you basically only have clive and required cast to beat the game with and no real monster levels on any one

>> No.5293097

>>5292019
"any% bad ending" still cracks me up

>> No.5293107

>>5293075
It's not speedrunning if you're just going for an alternate ending, anon

>> No.5293110

>>5293097
Laughing at someone's image?

>> No.5293147

>>5293023
That's cause it's Megaman X, the game's practically begging you to go fast by giving you all those movement tools to work with and punishing overly defensive play. If you play a game where speedrunning and playing normally are very distinct playstyles like say Doom or some open world WRPG's I doubt you'll have that problem.

>> No.5293165

>>5292794
>no one called them world records in the mid 2000s. there were no leaderboards, just a list of runs SDA put on their site.
Wrong. The speedrunning scene was broader than just SDA. You clearly weren't involved much back then or don't know much.

>> No.5293192

>>5293165
Didn't Doom have demo runs and "world records" as far back as the 90s? It's always just pointing at the trannies in the gdq on this website. Dumb asses all around.

>> No.5293715

>>5293023
>Once you learn how to speedrun, it destroys your ability to play a game casually because whats the point?
Learning to speedrun SM64 has only made doing random freerun parkour shit 10x funner. It's gotten so much more replay value out of the game for me even outside of the speedrun itself.

>> No.5293756

>>5293003
I wish I could teleport to a time before I knew what that was.

>> No.5293760

>>5293192
Obviously yes. I'm more familiar with Mario Kart 64 and Goldeneye world records back in 1997/1998. What people need to understand is that an anonymous board open to trolling will draw legitimately mentally disabled people to it, or children who weren't even around in the year 2000. And when you correct it it's like you're feeding them. It's sad that you can't trust a single thing anyone here says but it's true.

>> No.5293762

>>5292794
I remember Game Informer publishing an article about how someone set the Vice City world record in 2hrs 17 mins as a kid and being mindblown because that shit took me months to beat.

>> No.5293923

>>5291867
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08Ju7nel5cQ&t=4s

>> No.5293957

Nah, speedrunning is lame

>> No.5293972

>>5293923
But isnt the same true for almost everything you do? Who can really say one does something so special that it influences the masses. When going to work and filling up some shitty bag with dog biscuits or put in numbers into a Excel file, you only do it to get money and recognition, and money can buy you recognition. Not say that speedrunning is glorious, but everything that has other people involved mostly has a high degree of feeling recognized. Even Power is a Form of recognition, people having to Listen to what you say

>> No.5294041

I did a speedrun of the Saturn version of Exhumed. The fun part was that nobody did it before, there was a speedrun of the PS1 version but it's completely different (none of the tricks from one version work in the other and vice versa, current PS1 speedrun takes 2-3 times longer to beat than mine)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nfxUZqHWcw

I was getting obsessed with the game, and when I started having fun with the bomb jumping I found tons of ways to sequence break the game.
Thanks to this I also found an oversight in the code that lets you beat the game without all the supposed requirements for it (finding all artifacts). That's when I decided to speedrun the game.
After that I found more tricks, like before getting the bomb, using other explosions to jump or using sprites to help make some impossible jumps to find shortcuts (sprite pushes you away when you're on top of them so this is supposed to be impossible, but done in a certain way, you can get pushed forward instead, which coupled with how the game is leniant on jumping and if you fail a jump you can climb back ledges, allows those shortcuts).

I also optimized bomb-jumping to the max of its potential, as well as found out that the PAL version of the game WAS optimized for 50hz but on top of this has differences which include an extra glitch that lets you skip one of the later, longer, levels.

All in all figuring it all out was tons of fun because it was unknown territory.
Saturn version of the game is fantastic, PS1 version took out jumping, and these days people play the shitty PC fan made remake of the PS1 version which has even more stuff lost in translation. They have no idea how fun the original Saturn game was.

>>5292106
Funny how I always hear people say it was a waste of time....
I'm not actually "a speedrunner" so I wouldn't know, I do like to finish games fast, but not in a speedrun way most of the times, but with my own rules I consider fun, not doing stuff like taking dmg to save time.

>> No.5294042

>>5294041
>PS1 version took out jumping

took out BOMB jumping. No fun allowed.

>> No.5294863

>>5293923
Reminder that this guy picks his nose and eats it, goes without brushing his teeth for years at a time until his molars rot out of his face, and is an unironic white nationalist.

>> No.5294879

>>5294863
Sounds like the average 4channer.

>> No.5294901

>>5294863
>im gonna disguise my lib post with some ad hominem first, no one will ever notice

>> No.5294915

>>5294901
>lib post
lmao yeah, republicans are well known for their love of nazis.

>> No.5294920

>>5294863
>Reminder that this guy picks his nose and eats it, goes without brushing his teeth for years at a time until his molars rot out of his face, and is an unironic white nationalist.

Sounds like the average speedrunner. Just replace white nationalism with autogynephilia.

>> No.5294928

>>5294920
>Sounds like the average speedrunner
Nah, it's just goose.

>> No.5294935

>>5293923

He's based and redpilled.

>> No.5295346 [DELETED] 

>>5293972
>>5293923
That's RWhiteGoose, one of the most prolific speedrunning commentator in the world to this day. This is just his way of saying "dumb game", or "this is a bullshit waste of time"... Goose just has to turn it into a blog.

>> No.5295352

>>5293972
>>5293923
That's RWhiteGoose, one of the most prolific speedrunning commentator in the world to this day. What sounds like a dramatic speech is just Goose's way of saying "that's bullshit, fuck this game!".

>> No.5295467

>>5291741
I'm not a tranny or otherwise desperate for attention, why would i?

>> No.5295597

dont care for proper speedrunning but i do enjoy beating a short game in 1 sitting like the sonic games.

>> No.5295604

>>5295467
You know you are, you prancing homo

>> No.5295605
File: 97 KB, 1017x665, IMG_4202.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5295605

>>5294928
Tell me you can't smell these people through your screen.

>> No.5295639

>>5295605
None of these people are noteworthy speedrunners.

>> No.5295686

>>5295639
Having your own commentary panels at the largest speed running event isn't note worthy?

>> No.5295716

>>5295605
why are those guys crossdressing. is it a convention or something?

>> No.5295727

>>5291741
No and I can't ever be bothered to.

>> No.5295745

I can only do a few Sonic 2 stages really fast or beat SMW in 12 or 13 minutes, it's fine to impress normal people I guess

>> No.5295808

>>5295745
So do you ever invite ppl to your home and force them to be 'impressed'?

>> No.5295836

It’s only when it breaks the spirit of the game that I take issue with it. Doing it with glitches, or exploits that clearly go against the intent behind the game’s design is pointless to me. You might as well activate noclip or something if you’re going to do that kind of stuff.

I also believe you cannot “speedrun” some games, especially like, racing games. That’s already the point of the game. If your speedrun criteria also involve micromanaging menus and the hub area or something, you have problems.

>> No.5295859

>>5291741
only for my own amusement in games I really enjoy. I am not extremely good though, and Ive rarely tried in the past year, but I can any% SMW in 11min (no glitching). In CV1 I can do pretty much everything perfect all the way to the last stage, but I just plain hate that final stage so I usually just end it there ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
>>5291791
Also like this guy said, back in the day I had a few games like starfox64 and mario64 that I played nonstop because I loved them so much and was pretty heckin good at them but the thought of timing myself or using strats never really crossed my mind back then

>> No.5295863

>>5295686
No, it really isn't.

>> No.5295931

>>5295686
Literally anyone can book a panel you mongoloid.

>> No.5295937

>>5295836
This post is the dumbest thing I've ever read.

>> No.5296065

>>5295931
>t-t-the most famous speed runners who lead panels aren't actually speed runners

Pathetic. Absolutely soulless.

>> No.5296078

>>5296065
You didn't read my post. Literally anyone can submit a panel at GDQ and get it accepted. You don't even need to be a speedrunner.

Moreover, being at GDQ doesn't make you a noteworthy speedrunner. The place is filled with literal whos who suck shit at literal who games, just like every single tranny in that image. I bet you can't tell me what game any of them run, or their standing on the leaderboard, or any of their contributions to the meta for their game. Why? Because none of them have ever done anything noteworthy in speedrunning.

>> No.5296084

>>5296078
Tasbot is pretty cool.

>> No.5296090

>>5296078
>I bet you can't tell me what game any of them run, or their standing on the leaderboard, or any of their contributions to the meta for their game. Why? Because none of them have ever done anything noteworthy in speed run

Because I literally don't give a shit. Like it or not, these people are the face of speed running to the general public though.

>> No.5296092
File: 2.91 MB, 294x227, 65552e0b-4871-42aa-b9a9-416948365024.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5296092

>>5291741
I missed when speedrunning was about playing games fast and not fucking drama and gossip and politics. this is a /v/ thread basically please stop this retarded shit

>> No.5296093

>>5296090
>Because I literally don't give a shit.
You give enough of a shit to come onto anonymous imageboards and tell lies about them.
>Like it or not, these people are the face of speed running to the general public though.
This has nothing to do with whether or not they are noteworthy speedrunners.

>> No.5296094

>>5296092
>internet community
>not overtaken by drama
Maybe you're new?

>> No.5296095

>>5296093
Because that wasn't my original point dummy. My original point was that speed runners are stinky autismos and I stand by that.

>> No.5296102

>>5296095
>My original point was that speed runners are stinky autismos and I stand by that.
What a rare and nuanced opinion.

>> No.5296106

>>5296102
Of it's a common opinion, then perhaps there's some veracity to the claim....

Makes you think....

>> No.5296109

>>5296106
Good point. Popular opinion is always the correct one.

>> No.5296115

>>5296109
If everyone else agrees you're an idiot, chances are...

>> No.5296232

>>5296115
4chan's opinions on anything don't matter because you people are insular and not representative of actual society.

>> No.5296370

>>5292019
That pic of PMG giving a thumbs-up never fails to make me smile <3

>> No.5296403
File: 36 KB, 800x450, IMG_4177.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5296403

>i-if I add a heart at the end ill sound like a real woman
>because this is how women on 4chan always talk

>> No.5296469

>>5291741
I've considered trying to speedrun Lala The Magical but haven't tried yet

>> No.5296514

>>5296370
Figures you arent a passable tranny.

>> No.5296534

>>5295836
its pretty boring to watch a sonic 2 speedrun where they use gliches to warp to the end of the level

>>5291741
I can beat golden axe on genesis in under 15 mins and I can do decent in leaderboard golf on sms
I've also tried doom and I'm learning battletoads

>> No.5296567

>>5292324
Even speedrunners say this thing a lot. I've heard "don't speedrun a game you like" from various people because they admit that it'll ruin the game for you

>> No.5296570

>>5295836
You should watch an Ocarina of Time 100% speedrun

>> No.5296574

>>5295605
why does each table have a screen?

>> No.5296581

>>5296567
Too late :(

Though I did everything I could to squeeze everything out of the game before speedrunning it.

>> No.5296602

>>5296574
Easier for them to order from. Doubt the waiters and waitresses would want to deal with weaponized autism.

>> No.5296710

>>5296567
>I've heard "don't speedrun a game you like" from various people because they admit that it'll ruin the game for you
This is a pretty uncommon opinion for speedrunners to have. Most of the time they will tell you to speedrun a game you DO like, even the game you like the most, because you'll be playing it so much.

>> No.5296712
File: 2.11 MB, 720x480, rainbowroadfzx.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5296712

>>5295836
>the point of racing games is to speedrun them
>so you can't speedrun them

>> No.5296717

>>5295808
kek, my house is a mess so I never call anyone here, I remember doing this shit when I went to a friend's house years ago and had nothing else to do as I woke up very early that day

>> No.5296730

>>5296712
The term speedrunning loses all meaning when applied to racing games because there is no "normal/casual play" or "speedrunning" distinctions, the whole point of the games is going fast. And it's fucking retarded when you actually say it out loud, nobody says "I'm going to speedrun this rally" or "I'm going to speedrun this marathon", it's stupid.

>> No.5296934

>>5296730
>because there is no "normal/casual play" or "speedrunning" distinctions
Sure there is. The webm demonstrates that fully. To beat Mario Kart casually, all you have to do is come in 1st. To speedrun it, you push it far beyond first.

It makes perfect sense to anyone who isn't a pedant.

>> No.5296946

>>5296934
No that's just called playing the game well, and is necessary to win against any half decent player in mp or later online anyway. Don't be stupid

>> No.5296948

>>5296946
>No that's just called playing the game well
Commonly referred to as speedrunning.

I bet you sperg out like a baby when people call no-name tissue paper "kleenex".

>> No.5296950

>>5296946
not that anon, but this logic would apply to a super mario game as well, you 'play the game well' and use glitches to beat it in two minutes.... what's the difference? The term speedrun by your logic loses all meaning, since it is equivalent with beating a game.

>> No.5296954

>>5296948
>Commonly referred to as speedrunning.

lol what. There are countless games where objectives either have nothing to do with speed or require you to actively take more time doing things like side objectives, exploration, scoring. Speedrunning then isn't "playing the game well", it's doing one very specific self imposed challenge well, that can even be far less demanding skill-wise than taking your time.

And the only people calling it speedrunning in racing games are retarded nintendo manchildren. It's telling that you used F-Zero and Mario Shart in your examples.

>> No.5296957

>>5296946
Speedrunning is a synonymous term to "real time attack", which means playing through the entire game as fast as possible, measured with an external timer. Racing games do not measure this intrinsically, so the definition of speedrunning in this context holds value.

For individual courses, which is what the game actually measures and keeps track of, speedrunners use the term "time trials".

>> No.5296961

>>5291819
Cosmo?

>> No.5296964

>>5296957
>Speedrunning is a synonymous term to "real time attack"
No it isn't, wut? Lots of speedruns use the ingame timer

>> No.5296969

>>5296954
why are you so hung up on pointless semantics when literally everyone knows what "speedrunning a racing game" means?
>And the only people calling it speedrunning in racing games are retarded nintendo manchildren. It's telling that you used F-Zero and Mario Shart in your examples.
it's telling that you would force embarrassing console war shit in your turbo-autismo pedantic crusade against wrongspeech.

>> No.5296978

>>5296954
>And the only people calling it speedrunning in racing games are retarded nintendo manchildren
It literally took 3 seconds to do the research to demonstrate this false. Guess this tells us how disingenuous you are.

https://www.speedrun.com/games#genre=9&sorting=activePlayers&direction_sort=on

>> No.5296981

>>5296969
Everyone knows what getting good times in a racing game means too and have before proto-trannies came up with some redundant dumb-sounding replacement. And I'm pointing out a trend, it's really stemming from idiots who play Mario Shart and other similar abortions, sad thing is that people have to tag their normal playthroughs as "speedruns" to try and fit in

>> No.5296982

>>5296964
by "lots" you mean, "almost none".

>> No.5296984
File: 575 KB, 640x640, IMG_4194.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5296984

>>5296570
Speed running Orcarina if Time? I suppose some people would want to find a way to power through one of the dullest experiences of their life as quickly as possible. Seriously each episode following the boy "adventurer" and his pals from Hyrule as they fight assorted villains has been indistinguishable from the others. Aside from the cartoonish imagery, the series’ only consistency has been its lack of excitement and ineffective use of repetitive puzzles, all to make magic unmagical, to make action seem inert.
Perhaps the die was cast when Nintendo vetoed the idea of a third party producing the games; Miyanoto made sure the series would never be mistaken for a work of art that meant anything to anybody- just ridiculously profitable cross-promotion for their annual "party games". The Zelda series might be anti-Sony (or not), but it’s certainly the anti-Spyro series in its refusal of wonder, beauty and excitement.

>a-at least the platforming elements were good though

"No!"

The writing is dreadful; the exploration was nonexistent. As I played, I noticed that every time Link went to "explore" a largely empty world, Nintendo shoehorned in some repetitive puzzles to pad out the game. I began marking on the back of a Nintendo Power magazine every time I came to the same rehashed box pushing/lever pulling puzzles. I stopped only after I had marked the envelope several dozen times. I was incredulous. Nintendo's team is so governed by cliches and milking tired franchises ad nauseum that they have no other style of development. Later I watched a lavish, loving Let's Play of The Ocarina of Time by some YouTube manchild. He said something to the effect of, "If these kids are playing Ocarina of Time at 11 or 12, then when they get older they will go on to owning a Nintendo Switch." And he was quite right. He was not being ironic. When you play The Ocarina of Time you are, in fact, trained to play the same dull Nintendo rehashes decade after decade.

>> No.5296989

>>5296978
If anything this proves my point, the first page of both active and total players is filled with nintendo/kiddy shit and non-racers while everything else is tiny in comparison, Trackmania being the main exception

>> No.5296991

>>5296981
>sad thing is that people have to tag their normal playthroughs as "speedruns" to try and fit in
Speedrunning racing games is a very distinct exercise from playing through them normally. I'm not sure how something so simple is lost on you. Normal playthroughs don't use RTA, normal playthroughs don't have leaderboards, normal playthroughs don't have specific track routes and optimization, normal playthroughs don't utilize unintended tech.

Every single person in the world knows what speedrunning means in the context of a racing game. You are trying to make a distinction when there is no valuable reason to make one.

>> No.5296996

>>5296989
You mean the most popular racing games have the most players? How shocking.

>> No.5296998

>>5296984
Based 3rd gen pasta

>> No.5297000

>>5296989
>If anything this proves my point, the first page of both active and total players is filled with nintendo/kiddy shit and non-racers while everything else is tiny in comparison, Trackmania being the main exception
considering how overwhelmingly popular mario kart is compared to those other games, it's not surprising there are more runners.

ironically, the ratio of speedrunners to game sales is significantly higher in non-nintendo games.

>> No.5297001

>>5296991
>normal playthroughs don't have leaderboards, normal playthroughs don't have specific track routes and optimization, normal playthroughs don't utilize unintended tech.

LMAO are you for real? Yes they have leaderboards depending on the game, but basically any arcade racer will have them look at Sega Rally, SCUD, Daytona, whatever. YES they have track routes and optimization you fucking moron, that's how you get good. And unintended tech is obviously utilized when you're competing with others for times. Do you even play racing games outside of fat plumber and captain spandex?

>> No.5297003

>>5297001
>if i leave out the parts of the quote i don't like, i won't have to address them!

>> No.5297006

>>5296996
>>5297000
Yet the likes of Forza and Dirt Rally have massive highly competitive playerbases that don't touch this dumbass community at all. They're way more popular than F-Zero and Diddy Kong shit, get outta here.

>> No.5297007

>>5297001
Which arcade racer has intrinsic full game RTA leaderboards?

>> No.5297009

>>5297003
Yes you're literally only left with external timers which aren't even important in racing games since they keep track of individual race times perfectly and you can total them easily. Don't try to associate racers with your trash community pls thnx

>> No.5297010

Imagine losing your mind like a spastic because you don't understand what it means to speedrun a racing game.

>> No.5297013

>>5297009
>Don't try to associate racers with your trash community pls thnx
I don't need to associate them with it. They're associated with it by default. They can pretend all day that they aren't speedrunners, but at the end of the day, they're still speedrunners. Just extremely pedantic ones.

>> No.5297014

>>5297007
RTA isn't even necessary for speedrunning you dumbshit, players can and do use ingame timers and with racers there's no reason not to. If RTA is THE justification you have for your idiot category then you can't really be reasoned with

>> No.5297016

>>5297014
Not using RTA leads to things like Dark Souls where they abuse the in game timer, taking longer to do things in real time just so they can save imaginary in game time.

>> No.5297018

>>5297014
>RTA isn't even necessary for speedrunning you dumbshit
so you think pausing in the middle of the run, taking a nap and then continuing later, should be permitted in speedrunning?

>> No.5297020

>>5297016
Yet people still speedrun using ingame timers, even broken ones. Your RTA argument is gay

>> No.5297026

>>5297018
Depends on which kind of speedrun doesn't it you dumbass, what good is that gonna do when you're playing a 4 minute game?

>> No.5297029

>>5297020
Good point. If some people do it, it couldn't possibly be a bad idea.

>> No.5297037

>>5297029
Don't care if it's a bad idea or not this has to be judged on a game-by-game basis, but it shows that RTA is a useful tool rather than one that's synonymous with speedrunning. And a tool that exists because in-game timers are generally shit, which isn't true of racing games

>> No.5297041

>>5297010
This, it's just ridiculous

>> No.5297048

>>5297009
>Yes you're literally only left with external timers which aren't even important in racing games since they keep track of individual race times perfectly and you can total them easily.
Adding up your best time trials doesn't really give you a good picture of what your RTA time across all tracks would be. Totally different strats are used based on consistency when you have to do it all at once instead of grinding 1 minute levels.

>> No.5297054

>>5297048
>Adding up your best time trials doesn't really give you a good picture of what your RTA time across all tracks would be.

Well no fucking shit that's why there's championships including custom ones where you can drive on several tracks in a row, or arcade racers like Sega Rally where it's a continuous race through several tracks from start to finish. Do you play racing games?

>> No.5297069

>>5297054
Ah, yes, I forgot that all racing games have a mode that times your execution of all tracks in a row.

>> No.5297073

>it's a racing sim autist pretends he isn't a speedrunner episode

>> No.5297082

>>5297069
Not my fault your memory's garbage. Arcade racers you fucking idiot, ever heard of Sega Rally, Outrun, Super Hang On, etc? Also
>write down race times and add them at the end
>you're now not playing the game normally and are instead speedrunning
Whatever u say homo

>> No.5297086

>>5297082
>the racing games i like have special modes like this
>therefore, RTA isn't valuable in any racing game

>> No.5297090

>>5297082
>write down race times and add them at the end
Why would you waste time doing this when you could just do RTA?

>> No.5297091

>>5297086
>only way to play a game
>special modes
What a fucking moron
>>5297090
How's it a waste of time? You don't even have to write down a thing and can just record a video, easy as piss

>> No.5297098

>>5292324
>>playing retro games for fun/capturing childhood nostalgia/atmosphere

man child scared of growing up

>>playing retro games to break them down into a mechanical formula of rote memorization and completely ignoring the spirit of the original game

A new found life adding a competition element and potentially endless replay value to games you love

>> No.5297101

>>5297091
>start run
>no simple way to tell what your pace is vs previous run
>waste a bunch of time watching video timestamps after each course
>do this across hundreds/thousands of resets
yeah sounds totally practical.

>> No.5297106

>>5297091
You're reaching hard to try and make this seem like an attractive alternative to RTA, but it isn't working. RTA is the simplest method of recording all tracks in a row unless there's a mode that specifically does this in game.

>> No.5297108

>>5291741
no, i like taking my time and getting comfy.

>> No.5297112

>>5297037
>because in-game timers are generally shit, which isn't true of racing games
It's true for all kinds of old racing games, especially laggier ones that have timers fixed to framerate. Imagine being okay with lag making your run slower, but it not mattering because the in game time doesn't factor in that time loss.

>> No.5297114

>>5291741
Yes I did. It can be fun to replay some of your favorite games as long as you don't try to get world record or become so autistic that you have to use original hardware and a CRT monitor because it induces too much lag to you. Some runners actually believe it's such a big deal while even WR holders don't get frame perfect tricks most of the time despite before mentioned requirements.

Just ignore those internet attention whores and do speedruns like you feel you want to if you wanna try it.

>> No.5297116

>>5297101
What the fuck are you talking about? You should know your good course times and measure your current performance vs that and know when you're doing well vs badly using that, then check videos for your good run. Besides RTA timing does not equal speedrunning as we already established, it's just a tool to measure time

>> No.5297119

>>5297106
That "mode" is the default of damn near every arcade racer you stupid shit
>>5297112
Name 5

>> No.5297121

>>5297116
>You should know your good course times and measure your current performance vs that and know when you're doing well vs badly using that, then check videos for your good run.
You really fail to see how this is less convenient than a splits timer that just shows you the exact number?

You really fail to see how checking video time stamps to see multiple previous courses, and doing the math to add them all up, would be more time consuming across thousands of resets than having splits software that does it automatically?

I'm not saying your method is hard. I'm saying RTA splits are objectively easier.

>> No.5297126

>>5297119
>Name 5
Every NES racing game. If you try to claim that NES timers are accurate to real time, you're delusional and don't know what you're talking about.

>> No.5297134

>>5297121
What's your point though? I can use RTA timing to measure it and that still won't change much...or play the shitton of arcade racers that show course times. Gameplay's the same, just a little bit of extra convenience is all.
>>5297126
What, you mean consistently inaccurate ingame timers? How the fuck is that a problem if they're consistent across the board, it's just a number that's meaningless without context either way

>> No.5297136

>>5291830
1cc > speedrun

>> No.5297141

>>5297134
>How the fuck is that a problem if they're consistent across the board
Because they aren't. They lag. This is a huge issue in SNES and N64 games too.
>it's just a number that's meaningless without context either way
Real time is meaningful to everyone. Imaginary made up time has no meaning to anyone.

>> No.5297143

>>5297134
>What's your point though?
Are you illiterate? When you're resetting a game a lot, it's pragmatic to spend as little time fucking around with math and videos so you can spend more time actually playing the fucking game.

>> No.5297148

>>5297143
>as little time fucking around with math and videos
as possible*

>> No.5297152

>>5297141
Ok let me get this straight, you're saying that two people playing the same NES racing game exactly the same way can get different times because of lag? Examples? Also timers can have inaccuracies at every level from hardware to how they're programmed, as long as they are consistent for all people across the board nobody cares. Real time isn't meaningful to anyone, if I tell you that I have a 4 minute run in a game you've never played you won't understand the significance of it.

>> No.5297165

>>5297143
What's your point beyond that? Yes it's more convenient, no it isn't the additional factor that turns normal play into a speedrun like you or some other guy seemed to suggest

>> No.5297169

>>5297152
>you're saying that two people playing the same NES racing game exactly the same way can get different times because of lag?
No, that's not what I said. I said that lag makes the timing inconsistent, because timers are frequently tied to framerate.

Here's a hypothetical example: Guy #1 and Guy #2 do a time trial on the same course. Guy #1 executes everything correctly and gets 1:00 in game time. Guy #1 executes something wrong, causing his game to lag - he gets 1:00 in game time too, despite his run being slower, because the lag slowed his timer down.

In-game-time frequently makes literal time loss irrelevant because of this. It's one of the massive benefits of using RTA.
>Examples?
Literally any slightly laggy racing game in which the timer is tied to frame rate. There are probably hundreds of these across the 4th to 6th gen.
>Real time isn't meaningful to anyone
Everyone in the world has a frame of reference for what real time means.

>> No.5297173

>>5297169
>Guy #1 executes something wrong
guy #2* god damn it.

>> No.5297174

>>5297165
>RTA isn't speedrunning
kek

>> No.5297182

>>5297174
It isn't you brainlet otherwise categories and games using ingame timer wouldn't exist

>> No.5297185

>>5297182
>categories and games using ingame timer wouldn't exist
Those are speedrunning too.

>> No.5297203

>>5297169
>Literally any slightly laggy racing game in which the timer is tied to frame rate.
Such as? Should be easy for you to find such an example among the hundreds of games. Even laggy clusterfucks like Jet Moto don't have this problem
>Everyone in the world has a frame of reference for what real time means.
Not in the context of a game. Is 4 minutes fast? Is 4 minutes slow? Who the hell knows without knowing the speeds, game length and countless other factors. I might as well give you a score.

>> No.5297214

>>5297203
>Jet Moto
I loaded up a video of this and the inconsistency in the timer is so obvious as to be laughable. I'm not sure how I can convince you if Jet Moto isn't enough.

>> No.5297219
File: 43 KB, 645x729, 1589842349536389494.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5297219

>>5297203
>Even laggy clusterfucks like Jet Moto don't have this problem
https://youtu.be/N0Kj5dmQJ3o?t=28

>> No.5297224

>>5297214
Let me get this straight, you measured inconsistency by watching ONE video? Are you mentally handicapped? If the timer slows down the game slows down, two players will always get the same times because they slow down at the same rates and there's no way to game the timer. Back to dilation

>> No.5297225

>>5297224
>you measured inconsistency by watching ONE video?
You can see the timer slowing down when the game lags. You can watch another video of the same course to see that it doesn't always lag in the same spots.

This isn't hard, you're just a moron who is willing to do any mental gymnastics required to defend in game time.

>> No.5297232

>>5297225
>You can watch another video of the same course to see that it doesn't always lag in the same spots.
Hence the timer won't slow down and both players will have the same total time, meaning it's not a problem at all. Are you fucking retarded? Jesus lol

>> No.5297238

>>5297232
>explain in exceedingly clear detail that the timer slows down inconsistently
>can clearly see in the video that it depends on how you move your character and what you allow to render on screen
>"lol but the timer won't slow down!!!"

>> No.5297242

>>5297232
if the timer doesn't always slow down at the exact same spots, no matter who is racing, then the timer is inconsistent enough for IGT to be shit. this is so fucking easy to understand, what is wrong with you?

>> No.5297243

>>5297238
Who says it won't slow down? I'm saying that if the game doesn't slow down, the timer doesn't. If the game does slow down, then the timer doesn't. Both slow down and speed up together, hence there is no way to game the system and both players are on equal footing making competition perfectly viable and making timing in real time unnecessary. How's this hard to get, you halfwit?

>> No.5297249

>>5297242
Shit for fucking what? Because it doesn't harm competition what-so-ever, and moreover enhances it since you can just play the game instead of saving ms by trying to avoid artifacts of shitty hardware in dumb unintuitive ways

>> No.5297253

>>5297249
>someone with a slower run being ranked the same as someone with a faster run doesn't harm competition
Jesus fuck, I'm just about done here.

>> No.5297262

>>5297253
Slower and faster is defined within the parameters of the game dipshit, whoever has the better lines and a mastery of game mechanics will win no matter what. No need for idiotic slowdown manipulation because you chose to use an external timer for whatever the fuck reason

>> No.5297270

>>5297262
>slower and faster is defined within the parameters of the game
>except when lag makes the game slower, then the parameters of the game are irrelevant and you should just ignore them
lmao

>> No.5297279

>>5297262
>whoever has the better lines and a mastery of game mechanics will win no matter what
Lag is a part of the game. What you're suggesting now is bordering on "glitches are cheating" tier nonsense.

>> No.5297283

>>5297270
Fucking what? The example is playing within the parameters of the game you mongoloid lmao, the GAME becomes slower not you within the game. If you use a timer to break out of the parameters of the game then yeah you will be slower but there is no reason to do that you nincompoop. Also god forbid hardware differences lead to different amounts of lag, shit completely breaks RTA while it does fuckall as far as ingame timer is concerned. Gotta love building the meta around slowdown manipulation and specific hardware

>> No.5297296

>>5297279
Lag is part of the game, lag manipulation to reach better times isn't. And thank fuck for that

>> No.5297302

>>5297283
>the GAME becomes slower not you within the game
this right here is the difference between speedrunning and playing a racing game normally. congrats, after all that shit you figured it out.

>> No.5297306

>>5297296
I'm a much bigger fan of beating games objectively faster than I am of beating them arbitrarily faster.

>> No.5297310

>>5297306
So am I that's why I'm using the in-game rules rather than my own

>> No.5297316

>>5297310
So you're an anti-glitch autist. Pretty much what I expected.

>> No.5297317

>>5297310
The in game timer is arbitrary. Real time is objective.

>> No.5297318

>>5297302
No that's the difference between using real time and in-game time. Do you really want to make speedrunning synonymous with real time runs instead of a blanket term for a specific kind of playstyle that can use different types of timers?

>> No.5297321

>>5297318
>Do you really want to make speedrunning synonymous with real time runs instead of a blanket term for a specific kind of playstyle that can use different types of timers?
Yes. In-game-time sucks shit, and there are very good reasons that it is rarely used.

>> No.5297325

>>5297316
???
Glitches are part of the game, external timers are not. Speedrunners sure are low IQ ain't they

>> No.5297334

>>5297317
You better be for keeping track of load times in PC games where they're highly variable then kek

>> No.5297335

>>5297325
>Glitches are part of the game
Alright then. Let me just use this glitch that slows down the in game timer. Hey look, I beat this game in 1 second. Look at me, mom, I'm objectively faster because I used the in-game rules!

>> No.5297338

>>5297334
This hasn't been an issue in years. There are plugins for splits that pause the timer on every loading screen.

>> No.5297340

>>5297335
Sure you have the better time, that hypothetical game is poorly designed and you probably can't even find an example, but it's true. In that case it's better go to with an arbitrary timer because it makes the competition less retarded...same as it's better to go with an in-game timer because it removes dumb shit like slowdown manipulation.

>> No.5297345

>>5297340
>and you probably can't even find an example
Dark Souls pulls all kinds of dirty shit like that. Not as extreme, obviously, but the IGT route is significantly slower than the RTA route in real time. It's completely retarded, makes the run boring and tedious as fuck, and should be banned.

>> No.5297349

>>5297345
I meant for racing games but yes there are games that have this kind of dumb shit going on with in-game timers and in that case RTA is a completely rational choice

>> No.5297350

>>5297340
>In that case it's better go to with an arbitrary timer
by that you mean an objective timer, and yes, they should. just like they should with games that have laggy in game timers, because it's the same thing, just less extreme.

>> No.5297354

>>5297338
Why do that arbitrary shit if your concern is measuring Objective Real Time™? It's almost like that's not a concern at all and people go with whatever fits the game. In the case of racers there's just no reason to use RTA unless you actually like slowdown manipulation for whatever fucking reason, or maybe the edge case broken timer that can be abused via glitches that I haven't seen examples of

>> No.5297356

This thread became just as bad as AGDQ's policies, and supposedly the people posting here consider themselves above that kind of shit.

>> No.5297358

>>5297354
>Why do that arbitrary shit if your concern is measuring Objective Real Time™?
Because it does measure objective real time. Loading screens aren't affected by gameplay, and they shouldn't be measured unless they're consistent.

>> No.5297360

>>5297350
It's not the same thing at all. Laggy in-game timers are the same across the board, you can't game them to get a better time like you can with reloading an RPG or something. RTA in games with slowdown is more comparable because then slowdown manipulation (or god forbid hardware variation) comes into play and things get very stupid

>> No.5297362

>>5297356
it's a sim racer furiously trying to convince everyone that he isn't a speedrunner.

>> No.5297364

>>5297360
>using intrinsic game mechanics to make in game time faster than real time
>not the same

>> No.5297369

>>5297364
Yeah it's a non-issue that has no negative effect on competition or the gameplay, the glitch that fucks up the timer and slowdown manipulation potentially make the actual gameplay stupid though if major enough.

>> No.5297373

>>5296730
>The term speedrunning loses all meaning when applied to racing games because there is no "normal/casual play" or "speedrunning" distinctions, the whole point of the games is going fast.
what about non-racing games that are built around speedrunning, like Celeste or Dustforce?

>> No.5297380

OP here, feel like I have unleashed some hidden autism on this Board, sorry for that

>> No.5297381

>>5297369
ah, so the distinction pivots on whether or not you like what it introduces. i'm really not a fan of that mentality because it's a slippery slope that leads to people banning "boring" glitches from any% runs.

>> No.5297383

>>5297373
Those are just racing games without cars, or at least Dustforce is never played Celeste. Speedrunner autism has to categorize them differently though for whatever reason

>> No.5297387

>>5297383
The devs for both games refer to them as games designed for speedrunning.

>> No.5297394

>>5297383
>Those are just racing games without cars
wtf? they're both distinctly platformers. they lack literally every feature a racing game would normally have except for timers.

>> No.5297398

>>5297387
Where did Dustforce devs actually say that? Besides that just makes them idiots since the fundamental concept is exactly the same as car racing games which predate speedrunning and are almost as old as video games themselves.

>> No.5297402

>>5297394
Racing is literally a time based challenge or competition, that's the core of what racing is which is why you can do races for any kind of activity. Just because car games are the most popular kinds of racing games doesn't mean they're the only type wtf

>> No.5297405

>>5297398
>the fundamental concept is exactly the same as car racing games
You don't race anyone in Dustforce. You don't do laps. You have to collect arbitrary pickups, which is uncommon in racers.

Most importantly, there is no inherent reason to go fast. The games are designed for speedrunning post-mastery, but you can completely ignore the timer as a casual player and still beat every level as if it were a normal platformer. You don't have to win any races.

>> No.5297408

>Dustforce is a racing game
yep, that's enough internet for today.

>> No.5297413

>>5297405
Yes you do, you race people on the leaderboards and you race the clock, you don't do laps but you also don't do laps in Sega Rally or Outrun, arbitrary pickups sure but that just means it borrows elements from other genres at its core it's very much a racer. There is an inherent reason to go fast in Dustforce, if you don't then your combo meter will break and you will get a shit rank, not being allowed to proceed. Same as in a racer you can go slow and finish a race but you will get last place and not be able to progress.

>> No.5297426

>>5297413
>There is an inherent reason to go fast in Dustforce, if you don't then your combo meter will break and you will get a shit rank, not being allowed to proceed.
This isn't the case in Celeste. The timer isn't even on by default.

>> No.5297429

>>5297426
Well as I said I never played that one, guess it's just a platformer with an optional speedrunner friendly mode

>> No.5297525

>>5297098
Only a robot or autistic could find this fun.

>> No.5297542

The second half of this thread is exactly why everyone thinks speed runners are autistic

>> No.5297574

>>5297542
Because they discuss games and concepts in depth?

>> No.5297783
File: 2.34 MB, 1920x1080, ImpressionableSereneHoneyeater.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5297783

>> No.5297895

>>5297574
It's arguing pointless semantics you sp*ed run appologist

>> No.5298254

Kinda? Me and a friend set out to beat SMW including every hidden level etc. Until we were finished, cant remember how long it took but we started at on a saturday night and were done by noon the next day but not playing the entire time

>> No.5298752

>>5291741
Unfortunately, I have never had the patience enough to do it.

>> No.5299443

>>5297895
Yeah, that was pointed out early on. The racing sim autist who hangs around here has an inferiority complex and is absolutely butthurt that people consider him a speedrunner lmao.

>> No.5299447
File: 209 KB, 1024x678, 14065999554_d3943dd7c0_b.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5299447

>>5292019
Yo that any% looks like Troy Gentile

>> No.5299556

>>5298752
unfortunately? dedication and discipline are a choice, you choose to make excuses and not put the effort in, anyone can train themselves in this regard. i bet you're a fat cunt aswell.

>> No.5299576

>>5298752
Speedrunning doesn't require as much patience or dedication as people meme about unless you're going for top times in competitive games.

If you can put enough time into a game like Meatboy to get the golden god achievement, you already have more than enough patience for speedrunning.

>> No.5299629

>>5292019
PMG is gross but sHE is a legit commentator

>> No.5299692

>>5299443
This hobby brings out the absolute worst types.

>> No.5299752

>>5299692
It doesn't.

>> No.5300013 [DELETED] 
File: 40 KB, 728x567, 1011-lil-xan-tmz-3.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5300013

>>5299692
true. much better than the "music" hobby, that brings out 16 year olds who got addicted to their mom's xanax and think face tattoos are cool.

>> No.5300020
File: 40 KB, 728x567, 1011-lil-xan-tmz-3.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5300020

>>5299692
true. much worse than the "music" hobby, that brings out 16 year olds who got addicted to their mom's xanax and think face tattoos are cool.

>>
Name (leave empty)
Comment (leave empty)
Name
E-mail
Subject
Comment
Password [?]Password used for file deletion.
Captcha
Action