/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.5194008]

ITT: the moment good franchises started to die

[Anonymous No.5194079]

This fucking game. I remember one of the final levels where all you did was grind rails and jump from rail to rail. One mistake and you'd fall into a bottomless pit. The knuckles and Rouge levels were also boring af.

[Anonymous No.5194087]

Adventure 1 was no better, and in fact in many ways it was much worse. At least 2 cut down on the amount of bullshit shoehorned into the game for the purpose of padding the estimated play time of the game.

[Anonymous No.5194092]

[Anonymous No.5194138]

At least Adventure 2 had the Chao Garden and the multiplayer on Battle.

[Anonymous No.5194161]

>>5194087
I disagree, Adventure 1 kept its alternate gameplay types pretty short, so the novelty didn't wear off, while the core running gameplay was pretty well represented with sonic and tails.

Adventure 2's campaign is a fucking slog, the althernate play styles like Knuckles stages and teh gunning segments are much, much longer than in adventure 1, and there is more of them. Also added is an annoying buzzing sound when you're doing the gunning stuff, which is frankly ridiculous.

[Anonymous No.5194170]

>>5194087
But froggy...

[Anonymous No.5194214]

>>5194161
>Adventure 1 has Big the Cat
>Adventure 2 does not have big the Cat
Explain again how 1 is better?

[Anonymous No.5194216]

>>5194092
To be fair LttP came after this and is the GOAT zelda

[Anonymous No.5194232]

>>5194214
Big the cat being bad is a game grumps faux retro gamer meme, no one gave two shits about the BIg the Cat segments back in the day, it's perfectly fine.

[Anonymous No.5194239]

>>5194232
Actually I hate Big the Cat enough it ruined it for me. And I’ve never watched this show you’re talking about.

[Anonymous No.5194246]

>>5194008
Symphony of the Night, the final nail in the coffin of Truevania

[Anonymous No.5194275]

Fuck you guys, Heroes is when Sonic really started to die.

[Anonymous No.5194641]

>>5194275
I remember Heroes being pretty good though. It was much more focused on what really matters in a Sonic game than Adventure 1 and 2.

[Anonymous No.5194657]

>>5194246

This. Also Resident Evil 4.

[Anonymous No.5194740]

>>5194641
Heroes was the point in which the games shifted from speed to primarily combat focused, which killed the flow of the game. Heroes was also the point where the series started to decline critically as well. It also had substantially less overall content than SA2.

[Anonymous No.5195484]

>>5194008
Hate to break it to you, but sonic was never good. The music is always great though

[Anonymous No.5195504]

>>5194740
Heroes really should have been the best Sonic game when you think about it. Sonic Team had actually found a way to both have a large cast of characters while also having a single cohesive gameplay style.

But as you said, it just wasn't as good as the Adventure games. The control was a bit off, and some of the levels were way too long. And as much as I love Team Chaotix's theme song, their story mode was awful.

[Anonymous No.5195532]

>>5194008
I have a pretty good example of that.

For me, Mary-Kate and Ashley: Magical Mystery Mall in 2000 for the Playstation was the downfall of the series. Everything up until that point was stellar including Mary-Kate and Ashley: Get a Clue which stands to be one of my favorite games of all time. The dressing mechanic ruined Magical Mystery Mall for me. Instead of shopping for new clothes, the game had you trying on different kinds of jewelry that just didn't fit the series. Since then, it's all been downhill. Im sure most other people here would agree

[Anonymous No.5195535]

>>5194008

[Anonymous No.5195620]

>>5194232
I never liked Big the Cat, and the first time I played was like 15 years ago. He wasn't bad enough to ruin the game, but his stages felt really out of place.

[Anonymous No.5195629]

[Anonymous No.5195686]

>>5194275
This, Adventure 1 and 2 were a lot of fun.
I quit Heroes after fucking Rail Canyon.

[Anonymous No.5195702]

>>5194008

[Anonymous No.5195818]

>>5194246
Rondo got even more popular after that game and the sequels all included a Belmont mode of somekind. Plus Adventure Rebirth came out so fucking stop whing already

[Anonymous No.5195819]

>>5194214
Big's whole part of the game is like 15-20 minutes long unless you're retarded.
the shitty parts of 2 are most of the game.

[Anonymous No.5195821]

>>5194138
1 had chao garden too and none ever fucking played Sonic Adventure 2 for the multiplayer.
Its also ironic that the whole "battle" thing was supposed to denote the expanded multiplayer aspect yet it actually has LESS content than the Dramcast version.

[Anonymous No.5195840]

>>5195818
Yeah the IGAvanias only helped increase the popularity of classivania but manchildren need to desperately create a boogeyman that they can pretend to fight.

[Anonymous No.5196176]

>>5195629
I think it was much before that, anon

[Anonymous No.5196181]

Street Fighter 4, 3rd Strike was the last great SF game, after that they got painfully mediocre.

[Anonymous No.5196207]

>>5196181
Well, sure, it's kind of hard to continue the frame perfect, ultra competitve street fighter 3 model when everyone is switching to high latency flatscreens, let alone that the primary playtype was switching to online play. Even the street figther 3 online ports need to account for this with latency callibration, which doesn't carry between sets. Honestly, unless everyone adopts high end low latency displays (which is unlikely, as most modern mid range tv's would rather sacrifice this for price) you probably won't see anything close to street fighter 3 again.

[Anonymous No.5196213]

[Anonymous No.5196216]

>>5194092
Zelda 2 aged much more gracefully than the first game.

[Anonymous No.5196217]

[Anonymous No.5196232]

>>5196207
I'm only a casual player so I couldn't care less for all the ultra hardcore details, I just hate what Ono's done with the series by getting rid of the bitchin anime aesthetic and making everything dull and ugly as well as making the games feel dull to play with World Warrior tier gameplay speed.

[Anonymous No.5196236]

>>5196217

That's not 4.

[Anonymous No.5196253]

>>5196232
I'd kill for an Alpha 4 honestly, I love the Anime aesthetic of that era as well.

[Anonymous No.5196292]

>>5196236
Everything was already shit in 3. They changed the gameplay to be like the future games and the characters were all boring and nothing like in MGS1 and 2.

[Anonymous No.5196349]

>>5194008
Happened before that game OP

[Anonymous No.5196356]

Yes. But not because the game itself is bad. It was well received, well liked despite its flaws. The death of the Dreamcast due to the fialings of the Saturn meant Sega had to either shut down or gut their existing studios one by one, and even Sonic Team took the hit. Its barely recognisable today from what it was like back then. Sonic will never be great again because Sonic Team is an unfocused mess. Sonic Mania proves that in spades.

[Anonymous No.5196358]

>>5196292
Not sure if we played the same game. I'm a huge MGSfag and MGS2 is my favorite game of all time. MGS2 should've been the last MGS game for multiple reasons, but MGS3 is fantastic. Its the best one gameplay wise, and the safer story and characters were a bit of a response for the bad feedback 2 got. And unlike 4 and beyond, it didn't hurt the canon at all.

[Anonymous No.5196429]

>>5196349
SA1 was good though.

[Anonymous No.5196515]

>>5196429
Don't say things you can't take back.

[Anonymous No.5196519]

>>5194008
I actually liked SA2, but then again, I was 14 when I played it.

[Anonymous No.5196534]

>>5194008
>the moment good franchises died

[Anonymous No.5196537]

>>5194008
I honestly with all my being want EA to burn in hell

[Anonymous No.5196540]

>>5196236
you mean Survive

[Anonymous No.5196546]

[Anonymous No.5196552]

>>5196358
MGS4 may not have been the best but I still cant believe they made a game that looked that good at the time on a PS3 while most the other games running on PS3 looked like garbo. I personally liked the camo system in MGS3 and MGS4

[Anonymous No.5196563]

>>5194008
That's not Sonic Heroes.

[Anonymous No.5196580]

>>5196552

It did look really fucking good for 2008. And the octo camo was a great solution for the cumbersome camo menu in 3. That's about as much praise I can give it, though. I bought a PS3 exclusively for MGS4 when it came out, and liked it at the time. Once the honeymoon effect ended I started to see what a gigantic disaster it was.

[Anonymous No.5196598]

>>5196213
so true

[Anonymous No.5196609]

With the Orcarina of Time, Nintendo betrayed what the series had built up on the NES and SNES and created one of the dullest entries in a dying franchise. Seriously each episode following the boy "adventurer" and his pals from Hyrule as they fight assorted villains has been indistinguishable from the others. Aside from the cartoonish imagery, the series’ only consistency has been its lack of excitement and ineffective use of repetitive puzzles, all to make magic unmagical, to make action seem inert.
Perhaps the die was cast when Nintendo vetoed the idea of a third party producing the games; Miyanoto made sure the series would never be mistaken for a work of art that meant anything to anybody- just ridiculously profitable cross-promotion for their annual "party games" and childish fighting franchise. The Zelda series might be anti-Sony (or not), but it’s certainly the anti-Spyro series in its refusal of wonder, beauty and excitement.

>a-at least the platforming elements were good though

"No!"

The writing is dreadful; the exploration was nonexistent. As I played, I noticed that every time Link went to "explore" a largely empty world, Nintendo shoehorned in some repetitive puzzles to pad out the game. I began marking on the back of a Nintendo Power magazine every time I came to the same rehashed box pushing/lever pulling puzzles. I stopped only after I had marked the envelope several dozen times. I was incredulous. Nintendo's team is so governed by cliches and milking tired franchises ad nauseum that they have no other style of development. Later I watched a lavish, loving Let's Play of The Ocarina of Time by some YouTube manchild. He said something to the effect of, "If these kids are playing Ocarina of Time at 11 or 12, then when they get older they will go on to owning a Nintendo Switch." And he was quite right. He was not being ironic. When you play The Ocarina of Time you are, in fact, trained to play the same dull Nintendo rehashes decade after decade.

[Anonymous No.5196613]

>>5196176
This tbqhwy

[Anonymous No.5196626]

Yoshi's Story and Smash killed the character forever for me. I loved Yoshi from the cartoon and the SNES.

[Anonymous No.5196628]

>>5194008

[Anonymous No.5196634]

>>5196429

[Anonymous No.5196637]

>>5194008
Skyrim killed ES

Fallout 4 killed Fallout

Starcraft dead
Diablo dead

But nothing worse than chrono cross

[Anonymous No.5196645]

>>5194008
Pic unrelated. You meant to post Sonic Heroes.

[Anonymous No.5196648]

>>5196515
>>5196634
>mario 64 is such a good game, sonic fags btfo

[Anonymous No.5196758]

>>5196648
>has nothing to contribute and deflects the topic at hand with another game that wasnt discussed, and uses a shitty meme from /pol/

[Anonymous No.5196761]

>>5196758
t. NPC

[Anonymous No.5196762]

Who am I kidding? This series was never good to begin with.

[Anonymous No.5196763]

>>5196762

cringe.

[Anonymous No.5196768]

>>5196761
And you proved my point. Way to go!

[Anonymous No.5196774]

>>5196768
t. NPC

[Anonymous No.5196779]

>>5196609
Check out the hot take

>engineering marvel to make the N64 even run 3D games
>bitch about the game design

This is about series dying, not about individual entries not measuring up to the rest.

[Anonymous No.5196780]

>>5196762
This belongs in /ogg/

[Anonymous No.5196794]

>>5196779
>tech demo
>good game
Pick one. Just because something was a leap forward that doesn't mean that it should be judged by different standards.

[Anonymous No.5196803]

>>5196176
Horrible opinion

[Anonymous No.5196814]

>>5196779
Why would you reply to obvious copypasta?

[Anonymous No.5196849]

>>5196176
this

[Anonymous No.5196894]

>>5196814
Fuck, I thought I remembered seeing that before.

[Anonymous No.5196917]

>>5196609
Is this icycalm?

[Anonymous No.5196956]

>>5196758
>>5196768
Grr /pol/ bad!
*posts multiple low quality gifs taken directly from twitter*

[Anonymous No.5196960]

>>5196537
>that pic is not deleted
jannies confirmed chums with the dungeon keeper

[Anonymous No.5197002]

>>5195535

Wooly world was great tho

[Anonymous No.5197008]

Don't see the point in deleting all the posts of the non retro games in here? Reminiscing a series' golden age' in the retro era and pointing out the point it died afterwards seems on topic enough to me. Otherwise you just have to outright lie for some of these, ie pokemon which sure as hell didn't die with gsc

[Anonymous No.5197024]

>>5197002
Thanks to based goemon devs

[Anonymous No.5197035]

>>5195535
Even though I love Yoshi's Island, I love this game, too. I honestly also don't think it's a bad game, just short and easy.
>>5197002
Also, this. Hopefully Crafted World will be great, too.

[Anonymous No.5197038]

>>5196626
Never have a problem with the character's changes at all and I was first exposed to him since SMW. He's always been the same to me, just more cute and, like everyone else in the Mario series, with an actual "voice".

[Anonymous No.5197041]

>>5197038
yoshi voice made sense in story when they were supposed to be babies but using the baby voice for grown ass yoshi makes him gay

[Anonymous No.5197050]

>>5194008
Shadow the Hedgehog game was the start for me that the series was going downhill and for turning Shadow into what he is today. Shadow was a great character who actually has some personality in SA2 while his game turned him into edgy tryhard that people sees him to this day.
>>5195535
>>5196626
I actually like Yoshi's Story, it's better than most other Yoshi games besides Woolly World. Old Yoshi is better, but the current isn't really that bad

[Anonymous No.5197062]

>>5197041
>but using the baby voice for grown ass yoshi makes him gay
I seriously don't see how, though. Even back then before his changes, he always comes off as a childish/cutesy/kid-appeal character. Hell, the cartoon has even portrayed him a child anyways. His current voice isn't even out of place for him, for both classic and current. Plus it wouldn't make sense how a baby yoshi can actually make more sounds than a adult one anyways.

[Anonymous No.5197072]

>>5196645
You mean Shadow

[Anonymous No.5197075]

>>5194008
Star Fox Adventures

[Anonymous No.5197086]

>>5197041
THEEEE ASSSSSHOOOOOOOOOOOLE

[Anonymous No.5197087]

[Anonymous No.5197097]

>>5197086
I'm pretty sure they were saying "the end-o" or something similar to that in Japanese according to some people

[Anonymous No.5197110]

>>5195535
I be lying if I didn't say love this game's soundtrack.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9ZvQWNpyc4&t=120s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-PBJ5PSkyU
I hope to God that Crafted World still get good music despite the original composer has left

[Anonymous No.5197130]

>>5197086
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaSg-4nZTbk
looks like yoshi been calling you "an asshole" this whole time

[Anonymous No.5197131]

Other M and Donkey Kong Jungle Beat

[Anonymous No.5197138]

>>5194008
>Nobody says 06
>Everyone says SA1/SA2 has ruined the series
What's wrong with you, fags?

[Anonymous No.5197141]

>>5196537
>kills dungeon keeper and mythic entertainment in one fell swoop
T-thanks, EA.

[Anonymous No.5197143]

>>5197138
Uh I don't know maybe it's NOT RETRO you idiot.

[Anonymous No.5197160]

>>5197143
Doesn't change the fact that you retards really think any of these games ruined this franchise. Have fun with your shit taste.

[Anonymous No.5197164]

>>5195535
Maybe, but I still had fun with this game. Glad Woolly World took some inspiration of this game in visual design

[Anonymous No.5197169]

>>5197160
Read the OP, you mongoloid, the thread is about the moment good franchises "started to die" not "when they died".

[Anonymous No.5197192]

>>5196779
It was still a step down from LLTP and the series never reached the heights of the first three games again.

[Anonymous No.5197206]

>>5196894
haha it's a different version of some lit professors comments about harry potter

[Anonymous No.5197209]

>>5197169
Does that mean the game that began the trend of the series quality drop? Or the last good game?

[Anonymous No.5197225]

>>5197087

youre not wrong

[Anonymous No.5197259]

>>5194232
People were shitting on Big the Cat ages ago. I remember Nintendo Power and Game Informer shitting on Big the Cat when I was a kid

[Anonymous No.5197265]

>>5194232
I can't tell if you're being a revisionist or we're actually too young to have been around back then, but Big was always despised.

[Anonymous No.5197357]

>>5196609
This but unironically.

[Anonymous No.5197516]

>>5195535
Meh. It's no Yoshi's Island, but I like it. The game actually have a lot of secrets and actual challenges when you're not trying to collect every single fruit you see just to get to the next level already. The soundtrack was great, too.
>>5196626
I also miss classic Yoshi, but this image screams Soul vs Soulless meme bullshit.

[Anonymous No.5197731]

>>5195821
>1 had chao garden too
It was fucking shit in comparison anon.

[Anonymous No.5197734]

>>5195535
literally for babies for soft brains

[Anonymous No.5197778]

>>5196216
retard

[Anonymous No.5197857]

Shadow the Hedgehog was so shit. Not bad in retrospect.

[Anonymous No.5197860]

>>5195535

I'd take Yoshi's Story over any other Yoshi game easily. I don't want to play the same platform game for 40 hours.

Give me a straight forward 8-10 hour experience that I can come back to every now and again.

[Anonymous No.5198257]

>>5197138
06 was supposed to a return to form because the series had sank so low. That's why it was just called Sonic the Hedgehog with no number or subtitle. It was a new start to set the series back on track
lol

[Anonymous No.5198268]

>>5194008
This game was the tits to play with friends. Something I never understood about this game was that it had 2 in the title.

Was there a first one?

[Anonymous No.5200304]

I can't agree with any entree in this thread sofar except the ea dungeon keeper one...

They are all good games, maybe not great, but acceptable to pass your time with them at least.

[Anonymous No.5200319]

>>5194232
Retarded faggot.

[Anonymous No.5201728]

>>5197097
Nin-ten-do

[Anonymous No.5201742]

>>5197087
W-what was wrong with it?

[Anonymous No.5202136]

>>5198268
maybe

[Anonymous No.5203068]

>>5194008
a1 had heart. full of charmy stuff and 11/10 music

a2 was for edgy anime-metalheads otaku fucks.

simply as that

[Anonymous No.5203225]

>>5196628
Wasn't this a reskin of another game just to get it to sell in the west?

[Anonymous No.5203229]

>>5203225
yes and no, it was changed quite a bit though

[Anonymous No.5205568]

>>5196628
You take that back! It's one of the greatest games ever created period.

[Anonymous No.5205621]

>>5196609
tl;dr

[Anonymous No.5205774]

>>5196609
Whats with the quotation marks around "adventurer" and "party games" and "explore"?

[Anonymous No.5205810]

>>5196628
best nes mario game

[Anonymous No.5205841]

>>5194008
Totally disagree. This game has tons of replay value, and Sonic Heroes is where I took a step back and realized that this franchise wasn't for me anymore.
>>5194079
That was Final Rush, one of the more non-linear stages in the game. You could choose to grind on rails, but there was a bunch of platforming as well and if you know how to use Sonic's moves you can make a lot of shortcuts.

[Anonymous No.5205861]

>>5196216
> implying the original Zelda has aged even a day

[Anonymous No.5205865]

>>5194008
>relocate to america
>all your games become shit

[Anonymous No.5205875]

>>5196216
>aged

[Anonymous No.5205969]

>>5195532
Here's your (you) since noone else is taking your bait

[Anonymous No.5206594]

>>5205865
Sonic 2, the best sonic game was made by Sega's American division though

[Anonymous No.5206597]

>>5206594
It was a joint venture and most of the American team only did graphical work.

[Anonymous No.5206602]

>>5205774
What do 'you' mean?

[Anonymous No.5206627]

[Anonymous No.5206820]

>>5206594
Look at him go!

[Anonymous No.5206937]

>>5196609
>Watches let's plays
Opinion Invalidated

[Anonymous No.5206962]

>>5206627
troll

[Anonymous No.5207056]

Killed the timeless vibe and humor of the first two games, and signaled the Atari's milking and mishandling of the series.

[Anonymous No.5207676]

>>5194079
>bottomless pit

At least it wasn't a bottomless pit so much as you would see Sonic fall down into the atmosphere of the Earth below and Sonic would burst into flames upon entry. A nice touch. Still did nothing to douse my anger.

[Anonymous No.5207683]

>>5194246
>Symphony of the Night
Well, the final nail was when they tried to make the N64 games and they turned out so, so much worse that they had to start going in the SotN direction.

[Anonymous No.5207686]

>>5195620
He didn't even let you use the fishing controller...

>>5196637
Skyrim could have been recovered from. But not after everything that has happened since.

[Anonymous No.5207703]

>>5205865
Sega of Japan killed Sega

[Anonymous No.5207732]

>>5196637
>>5207686
Skyrim is fun with mods

[Anonymous No.5207826]

>>5207732
Yeah, I enjoyed Skyrim but felt if they went any further in that direction it could pass the breaking point for me. And I've never been able to get into Fallout 4... except on maybe my 3rd or 4th try I was getting into it until the main quest completely bugged in the museum (still so damn early in the game).

If it was Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, Fallout 3, or New Vegas, I'm pretty sure I could have fixed it in console with something like pcsetstage as I have learned to do, but I couldn't find a fix for the particular war Fallout 4 broke for me.

[Anonymous No.5207832]

Link to the past was the low point of the series.

Rather than innovating or evolving, the game just rests on its laurels. The enemies are pushovers, The bosses are underwhelming, and the world is insignificant.
The dungeons are beyond bland, and sparsely populated with the most generic enemies in the entire series. And most of the enemies are just copied from the first game anyway.
It has terrible presentation as well. The game reveals everything to the player right from the start. This immediately removes any excitement and anticipation that they had. The master sword being the worst example. Shown right away, but can't be used, until the player jumps through some hoops.
Every dungeon is the same, the overworld is a square, And the puzzles are so easy they might as well solve themselves.

That's all I can think of for now.

[Anonymous No.5207991]

>>5207703
This is 100% truth.

Sega of Japan is responsible for nearly all of the huge blunders Sega made in the 90's. Had SOJ gave Sega of America more independence it's possible that Sega would still be a big player in the industry. The only system of Sega's that actually did amazing in Japan was the Saturn. Sega's #1 market was the west and SOJ pretty much refused to acknowledge this.

[Anonymous No.5209214]

Arguably the previous game but it had enough good in it so it's not like the franchise was "starting to die." Pic related however...

[Anonymous No.5209556]

>>5194079
not surprising that the people who hated it are simply just shit at video games

[Anonymous No.5209798]

>>5209556
Or just too old when it came out to be impressed

[Anonymous No.5209813]

>>5205774
Because his "adventures" are simplistic puzzles in an empty world, if you whip out Mario Party at an actual party you may be autistic, and there is no sense of exploration because the map is either empty and devoid of enemies or a hallway simulator.

[Anonymous No.5209817]

>>5207832
Is this the birth of a new pasta?