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/vr/ - Retro Games

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5086083 No.5086083 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

>tfw "Sonic was never good" has fully transitioned into "Sega as a whole was never good"

>> No.5086092

Segafags are bottom tier humans

>> No.5086093

video games were never good

>> No.5086096 [DELETED] 


>> No.5086131

Meanwhile, Nintendo continues being healthy and innovating because they CAN learn from their fuckups.
Yeah, they have made some epic blunders. The fact they didn't share Sega's fate speaks volumes about how different both companies can be.

>> No.5086153

>Be Sega
>Be unironically innovative a boundary pushing

>Be Nintendo
>Be the most conservative company ever
>Be praised as huge innovators

So history really is written by the winners

>> No.5086174

Sega made good games, but they didn't make good decisions.

>> No.5086175

This is the saddest part. Ninty have been making the same games for the past 20 years and every console since the wii has been the same accompanied by some gimmicky tact-on poop and people call them innovative?

>> No.5086178
File: 25 KB, 600x400, pino72.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]


Gaming's death... Playstation
Gaming's death... Square
Gaming's death... Bandai

>> No.5086182


When I think of intelligent innovation, I think of the 32X and the Dreamcast

>> No.5086219

I'm so glad that all the plebs cling to Nintendo. I really don't want Bowsette fags liking the same things as me.

>> No.5086224

I feel you anon. Much better to have Sonic x Tails porno rather than that ugly reptilian bitch.
Plebs just don't know.

>> No.5086226

>This is the saddest part. Ninty have been making the same games for the past 20 years
Nintendo is smart enough to know to NOT tamper with the gaming formula that worked the best for them.

>> No.5086235


oh please, the n64 controller was boundary pushing and innvoative and not only that, you could plug in 4 controllers at a time and there was actually a good selection of 4 player games that were better with 4 players.

>> No.5086240

No shit?

At best, ninty made gimmick of the month decisions for the oast 25 years, and they've gotten nothing but praise for it since wii was a huge fad for a minute.

Hell, switch isn't a sales record breaker by any means, and both sega and sony beat them to the punch with console/handheald hybreds (nomad, psp and pstv), yet they get all this credit and praise for being so inmovative.

It's status quo bullshit.

>> No.5086242

Sonic and Tails porno was innovative and fascinating degeneracy. Bowsette fags are just jumping on the trap fad because it's popular now in much the same way they praise Nintendo because it's what they were told was good by uninformed fake gamers. It's all just beyond pathetic.

>> No.5086245

it is true, segautists are the worst

>> No.5086246

look at these individual and small examples nintento is difintely the more innovative compwny

do some research. sega is insane.

>> No.5086250

>my degeneracy is better than yours
I love you anon

>> No.5086320

Sega had at least two great hardware releases when it comes to home console. To this day I champion the Genesis over the SNES for the simple fact that 99% of its games run at a higher resolution and don't run like they're stuck in molasses. I think they had incredible first party development teams too. The problem is a lot of their hardware releases can't be viewed as anything but failures. Sega CD was acceptable, but 32x and Saturn flopped hard in the west, and the Dreamcast made a good effort but clearly failed to meet projected sales with the heavy shadow of the PS2 looming over its head. I get why zoomers think Sega is bad; because they're fucking retarded and can only look at the failures while dismissing or ignoring anything good they ever did.

>> No.5086337

Reminder that sega means service games, a cancerous name for a shitty game company

>> No.5086345

>a cancerous name
>reaching this hard
Try making valid complaints next time, sweetie

>> No.5086346

Pretty much this
Prove him wrong
You can't

>> No.5086353

Both were innovative in different ways, and both are praised as such.

>> No.5086354

Sega is only good if you have a friend to play with you
Super Nintendo and NES are better for forever alones

>> No.5086360

I remember playing tons of multiplayer with NES, SNES and Mega Drive.

>> No.5086361

Outrun, Golden Axe... Those 2 games alone means they were great.

>> No.5086362

Basically this. Sega made some good games, and they had some great ideas, but when they fucked up, they fucked up bad, and they never learned from their mistakes.

>> No.5086367
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You cant judge the success of a game by the success of a game.

>> No.5086375
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>Nintendo continues being healthy and innovating because they CAN learn from their fuckups
Ha, try saying that to the Paper Mario fanbase

>> No.5086381


LOL, the only reason they survive is because nostalgia sells their 35 year old IPs which would be considered mediocre shit (certainly not enough to float an entire console) if they were released as new today.

Sega Genesis had a more innovative library than the Game Cube, Wii, Wiiu, and Switch.

>> No.5086385

Splatoon is one of their best current IPs though, but not /vr/.
>muh Sega vs Nintendo!
Both sides are sad.

>> No.5086429

I think that the difference here is that the Switch is actually good.

>> No.5086450


Imagine going to the arcade in 1996 and seeing this. What made Sega great isn't their consoles, but how damn far they were willing to push 3D technology. The sheer amount of rendering techniques they pioneered was ridiculous. Hell, in 1999 they made a new arcade board for the sole purpose of proving that real-time phong shading could be done, a technique that nearly every modern 3D game uses in some capacity. They were the frontrunners during the formative years of 3D gaming, pushing the limits of what was believed to be possible over and over and over. Hell, even on console, the Dreamcast was doing things like cel shading and primitive phong shading during a time period when most didn't believe we had the technology for it yet.

The only developers who contributed more to the overall advancement of video games were the big names from the 70s and early 80s that pioneered things like color and sound in video games. Sega was a big fucking deal and sure as hell wasn't because of the Genesis.

>> No.5086453

What? The "Sonic was never good" meme died when Sonic Mania came out and shut sites like IGN up. I never heard this "Sega was never good" thing. I have no idea what you are talking about OP.

>> No.5086459


>> No.5086460

Yeah, Paper Mario was the fuck up because they thought it could replace Super Mario RPG.

>> No.5086496
File: 451 KB, 800x1280, Screenshot_20181006-195611.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

This seems like the right post in the right thread to reply to with this gore I just spotted this afternoon

>> No.5086507

This is why I will never be degenerate enough to all myself a gamer

>> No.5086525

Sega can't even survive from their nostalgia so what the fuck are you talking about.

Don't talk like Nintendo is bad or something, you can't fight the facts. We have two companies. One died and is making games for the other. One was always a mess, thought it was cool and attacked the competition by name.

Sony isn't bad either but it's just... there. They think having the latest technology on point is good enough but the games are boring and all look the gritty same.

If I were oblivious to games I'd still pick Nintendo because their console and games still point to the main thing a videogame should do: bring you fun.

>> No.5086537
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In the end, the only reason each and every person on this god forsaken board, me included, enjoys them is because it distracts them from their shitty future-less life without anyone who cares about them anyways

>> No.5086547

And yet it ended up becoming better than RPG, for the first 2 games of the series at least

>> No.5086569

I mean that's like literally the definition of projection amirite?

>> No.5086572

Well, I did say "me included" to be fair

>> No.5086573

Well yeah otherwise it'd just be mean

>> No.5086947
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Most of the people who make this statement exclusively refer to Sega's console games.

Sega was not a console gaming company. Sega was an arcade gaming company that had a console division.

If you want to talk about Sega you talk about arcade games. You talk about games like this:


Sega was a company that took video games to a level few others would. They built giant and very expensive dedicated cabs for games that took multiple system boards working together to create gaming experiences that were years and years ahead of where consoles were at the time.

In addition to this Sega had an extreme dedication to games being played at a very high level. Virtua Fighter fighter exemplifies this.

Fat 30-something dudes with red neckbeards will write essays about how games need more story and needs to "say something" about society or some bullshit like that because they have never won a match of a fighting game in an arcade in their lives.

>> No.5086951

Fucking this right here. I'm actually kind of mad right now.

N64 was the only time when Nintendo was really on the cutting edge, and that was mostly due to the partnership with SGI.

>> No.5086956

Nah, that's your pitiful self-hate m8. My life is not shitty.

>> No.5086957


>> No.5086961

Funny how the only time Nintendo actually tried to do something different (gamecube with mario sunshine, a very different mario kart, etc) they got "less success" (for nintendo standarts) and end up backpedaling to "the basics".

>> No.5086981

First, Super Mario RPG was made. It was partnered with Square though, and Nintendo couldn't depend on a third party for development for a major character more than once. When they decided to make another Mario RPG, they decided to take one of Miyamoto's crazy ideas and turn it into their new RPG series. A couple years later, they also made another RPG series for the GBA known as Mario and Luigi RPG. After Thousand Year Door and Super Paper Mario's under-performance compared to the Mario and Luigi RPG Series, Miyamoto declared that there should only be one Mario RPG series, and thus we got stuck with the trash that is Sticker Star and Color Splash. What's even worse is that Paper Jam, the newest Mario and Luigi RPG, is shit and Nintendo might take it as a sign to stop making Mario RPG series altogether, except to keep remastering games that aren't even 10 years old and are only 1 generation old.

>> No.5086989

Nintendo is an arrogant company that has been riding on nostalgia for the last 30 years, they believe they don't have to compete in their chosen industry and they demonstrate this by selling underpowered, overpriced and gimmicky game consoles. They have consistently been anticonsumer and anti third party which is why they have had the smallest line up of games since the fifth generation.

>> No.5086994

Maybe all the effort, energy and money spent on changing old shit in ways no one wanted would have been better spent on new IPs.

>> No.5087052

The only good things to come from Sega are Panzer Dragoon and Virtual On Cybertroopers.

>> No.5087060

Sega was like a Greek tragedy except you had no sympathy for the main character.

>> No.5087063

Yeah, of course. Also the wrong side won WW2. If you think I'm joking or being edgy, you fell for the propaganda, too.

>> No.5087071

Sega always made mediocre games on impressive hardware.

>> No.5087083

The Thunderforce IV soundtrack alone justifies Sega

>> No.5087106

Sega doesn't exist anymore. Sega went bankrupt in 2004 after they pulled the Dreamcast. They were then bought out by Sammy, their biggest competitor (yea, even bigger than Nintendo), then started using the Sega name for their Console games development division.

The only new good new IP that came out of Sega Sammy is Yakuza, but they didn't want to advertise it in favor of new shitty Sonic games/ports of Genesis games.

>> No.5087140

What matters to you the most: if a game is fun or if a console is more powerful than life?

>> No.5087145

I'll give you that. Sega's hardware was good for its time... too good for its own good, sadly. We all know why the Saturn and DC failed, no one knew how to program for the damn things.

>> No.5087201

>Sega was not a console gaming company.
You can see this in their genesis games.
Every single one plays better with and arcade stick.
Its like it was made for it.

>> No.5087206

They were an arcade company and still are they offer you services not products
Now they even make phone trash which is cancerous as fuck
I hope you enjoy your favorite series revived as a phone game like it has happened many times already

>> No.5087207

I should remind you Nintendo also made Mario Run, Pokemon Go and that Fire Emblem spin off for phones.

>> No.5087209
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>Now they even make phone trash which is cancerous as fuck
>not like based Nintendo
I hope you enjoy being a cancerous faggot for the rest of your life

>> No.5087227

sorry kids I stopped buying nintendo stuff when they announced the wii, dont care about the shit they do nowadays

>> No.5087235

Sonic 1,2,3,K,3&K for Genesis (I consider it a different game) WERE good. The other Sonic games, like the non-Genesis games, CD and spinball were mediocre.

>> No.5087245


The point still stands, everyone is doing cellphones now, companies don't care about creative integrity they just want easy money.

>> No.5087254

I was just making clear that I am not a nintedie anymore or that I care about the new nintendo
Weird that bith of you brought up nintendo for no reason
And yes nintendo is shit now

>> No.5087256

It's not just Nintendo EVERYONE is doing cellphone games. Catch up on the conversation.

>> No.5087272

Fun, but I'm not into the same six-seven platformer IPs ad nauseum

>> No.5087275
File: 37 KB, 600x412, wii is not the norm.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>Meanwhile, Nintendo continues being healthy and innovating because they CAN learn from their fuckups.


>> No.5087283

There was no transition. Go read any multiplatform gaming mag from the 90s: Sega gets little praise. And most of their few good games came from third party devs that they just published or owned the IP for - Streets of Rage was made by Ancient, Shining Force by Camelot, Vectorman by Bluesky, and so on. The only good first party dev Sega had was Andromeda and STI.

>> No.5087296

The difference is that Nintendo was good at business while Sega wasn't. If Sega's games weren't so innovative and good they would have bowed out of the console market MUCH earlier. The Genesis was the only time when they ever got business right, and only for a short amount of time.

>> No.5087314

I never liked Sonic, but I would neved say Sega didn't have good games.

>> No.5087335
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It's the future you chose.

>> No.5087338

>Be Sega
>Push out gimmick console addon before your next console comes out
>Realize that while everyone is buying the 32X that means they won't buy the Saturn
>Burn bridges with retailers by announcing the release of the Saturn at E3 THE SAME FUCKING DAY YOU SHIPPED THEM TO STORES
> Wonder why no one makes Saturn games or buys them
>Creates the Dreamcast (a console ahead of it's time) to accomidate for that an pour all R&D costs into it
>It actually does decently, but it's too little too late. The PS2 announcement cut off the rest of your profit margin and so did the announcement of the Xbox later on
>Drop out of the console market because of dumbass mistakes

>Be Nintendo
>Other than hashing out the same shit, do none of that by not taking excessive risks and cutting off the profit margins of you new consoles by "innovating" old ones
>Still be in the console market in 2018

>> No.5087376

Anyone who says Sonic or SEGA for that matter was never good are cucks, plain and simple. Sonic 1, 2, CD and 3&K are fucking masterpieces and so is a ton of SEGA's old library. Don't let that get you mad, after all a Lion does not care of what Sheeps think.

>> No.5087381

Sega actually was good at making games (ESPECIALLY the 2D Sonic games and Phantasy Star games (up to the Dreamcast/Gamecube) ) I can't deny that. They were shit at the hardware apart from the Dreamcast though.

>> No.5087386

>Anyone who says Sonic or SEGA for that matter was never good are cucks, plain and simple.
This but unironically

>> No.5087389

The Genesis was a good piece of Hardware in 1989 and it still had advantages over the SNES which showed in fast action games. The SEGA CD was a great addition for the Genesis and while filled with shitty FMV games it had a good collection of fantastic games on it. The 32x does suck and the Saturn while different was a 2D beast.

>> No.5087393

>Learning from fuck-ups
They are just as bad as Sega in terms of never learning anything from the past. They simply had more money to burn during said fuck-ups to stay afloat despite them.

>> No.5087401

That's the thing though. They should have let the Genesis die a natural death and start promoting the Saturn when they were about to finish developing it/ start getting the shipping contracts ready. I can't shit on the Genesis at all or the Sega CD, but I can shit on the 32x since it's a blatant attempt to keep the past alive when the 16-bit era was starting to end and it actively hindered the Saturn by shrinking the pool of customers they could sell it to (E3 1995 didn't do Sega any favors either. Or rather, Sega didn't do themselves any favors at E3 1995). They should have stopped caring about the Genesis and focus all of their attention on the Saturn instead of autistically adding an addon at the death of a console's lifespan.

>> No.5087424

>enjoys them
haha no

>> No.5087490

>A small dip that flattens out as the number of real consoles on the market expands
>One huge spike upwards
It's over, Nintendo is finished.

>> No.5087569

>Hating SEGA
Fuck off, reddit.

>> No.5087725

I love how the people who know Sega for their arcade games are the only people in the thread who sound like they know what they're talking about.

>> No.5087731

Have we fully entered the era of no one thinking for themselves? Some stranger on the world wide web tells you they don't like Sega so you think it means you're not allowed to anymore or something? Grow up, think for yourself and stop crying. This would be funny if it weren't so sad.

>> No.5087735

Ask him to also post the portable consoles sales and you will get a surprise.

>> No.5087739

You are scum if you dont play sega games.

>> No.5087740

> muh breath of the wild

>> No.5087768


>> No.5087815

>Sonic 1, 2, CD and 3&K are fucking masterpieces

lol no. Sonic 2 is the only good one out of those. Sonic 1 is also good, but outdated after Sonic 2.

CD has boring as shit level design and 3&K is just way too easy + too long.

2 has the nice middle spot between speed and platforming, without having too huge levels (Metropolis being the only exception, but it gets the pass because it is one of the final levels - it is supposed to be difficult).

>> No.5087852

Sega is secretly the best game developer in the world.

>> No.5088301

>Sonic 1, 2, CD and 3&K are fucking masterpieces
You only believe that because that's what you were taught to believe.

>> No.5088315

Nintendo doesn't innovate, but they are very good at refining. Every "breakthrough" attributed to them has been done before.

>> No.5088318

The Dreamcast WAS innovative, dumbass.

>> No.5088324

The analog stick was done over a decade before by the 5200 and Vectrex.

>> No.5088328

It was a piece of shit though, nothing compared to modern analogues

>> No.5088356

Sega was always great.......in the arcades.

>> No.5088359

SoJ demanded another Genesis add-on because they got spooked by the fucking Jaguar of all things.

I still think that because the Saturn was so ball-bustingly expensive that the 32X could've worked if they doubled down on it and positioned it as a low-cost option.

>> No.5088429

Computer joysticks started out as analog sticks

The Vectrex analog is great I dunno what made you think it isn't. The 5200s analog stick relies on Atari's trademark rubber dildo sleeve auto-centering method that just wears out on its own with time as the rubber dries out but I don't know what miraculous "modern" analog stick type talking about that has perfect durability and doesn't start drifting towards 10 o'clock

>> No.5088434

Unironically this. Sega was bad is pure reddit cancer. Bunch of fucking kids who never learned how to stop sucking down the Nintendo kool aid and expand their horizons.

>> No.5088513

>if someone shits on Sega, it MUST be a nintendo fanboy!
You're not helping. The kids you're talking about are bored /v/ kids who aren't either sega or nintendo fans and just throw 1/10 bait you losers keep picking.

>> No.5088526
File: 235 KB, 500x332, laughing sailors.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

You people really are a bunch of niggers

>> No.5088552

t. mad redditors

>> No.5088556

How am I mad? Just telling it how it is, you're getting triggered by literal /v/ kids.

>> No.5088775

So... pointing out Sega was managed by idiots making retarded mistakes makes me... Nintendo fanboy? How's that even supposed to work?

>> No.5088808

Same thing could be said of SEGA, excluding the "refining" bit. I'd give them online console play but beyond that everything else was a "me too!" addition in response to something done before.
This, though I'd still take a Genesis/MD and it's peripherals as my 4th gen console of choice.

>> No.5088820 [DELETED] 

When their arcade division gave in to otaku memes like KanColle and FGO, you know that the arcade division no longer drew a dime. Daytona Championship USA was a quick-buck product (4-gear shifter was not a standard option) while SWDC appealed to hardcore simracers

They should have split anyway the second Sammy bought it - one for arcade IPs, one for console IPs (including the consoles themselves) and another for Sonic.

>> No.5088825

Honesty this is true to lesser extent for Capcom and Konami, too. They might not have had the huge fancy cabinets with all sorts of peripherals and such, but they both started out as arcade companies, gradually got into the console market over the decade form the mid 80s to the mid 90s, but didn't really fully focus on consoles until they got their respective cinematic hits on the Playstation in the mid-late 90s. But arcades seem to becoming less and less remembered by the retro gaming crowd as time goes on, so these companies' legacies as forgotten.

>> No.5088840


>> No.5088843

Deal with it Zoomers.

>> No.5088848

Consoles are basically budget arcades to have at home. Many consoles got arcade games.

>> No.5088883

hurr durr Sonic was never good. *farts*

>> No.5089525

Nintendo was always the Disney of games. Sega just gotten upstaged by Sony and hoisted by its own petards.

>> No.5089574

Yes, that's the kind of thinking that sites like youtube, reddit, and wikipedia encourage. People want to impress each other with their secondhand knowledge of games they've only experienced vicariously through others, so they repeat whatever stupid opinions they've heard from their favorite youtuber, or the "Reception" part of the Wikipedia page, or some other uninformed fuckwad who got upvoted on reddit.

>> No.5089587

>Nintendo can learn from their fuck ups
>literally made a detachable Wii U game pad
>literally brought back waggle wiimotes
>literlaly copied half chink transforming tablet half docked PSP Go
>Paper Mario still fucking sucks
>Yoshi still fucking sucks
>Kirby still fucking sucks
>Mario Party still fucking sucks

>> No.5089589

Excuse me I forgot
>Pokemon still fucking sucks

>> No.5089591

Don't forget about the cardboard.

>> No.5089601

That goes with the innovation part but I wanted to stick to fuck ups

>> No.5089609

Yeah, those plebs really should be remembering ol' Alex Kidd as a great nostalgic icon instead.

>> No.5089683

What a shitty /v/ tier thread. I bet you never even played a sega arcade game.

>> No.5089872

>literally made a detachable Wii U game pad
>literally brought back waggle wiimotes

that was less "failing to learn from mistake" and more "trying to bank off success" as shown here >>5087275

>> No.5090253

Glad to see folks are finally realizing the truth. Took them long enough.

>> No.5090269

You're almost as bad for thinking that opinions that don't line up with yours are stupid. Someone says X about a game and if it doesn't mesh with your opinion, you decide for yourself they're just an idiot parroting so on both sides actual discussion never happens.

>> No.5090326

Cardboard isn't even a new thing. Rhythm game players have been building makeshift controllers out of cardboard for years, because of how damn expensive the real ones can get.

>> No.5090348

I never had a Sega system growing up, but they've got some fun games even if they all sound like farts...I'm more pissed at Sega as a company now due to stupid decisions with handling P+ titles.

They took like a year to release Bayonetta and Anarchy Reigns outside of Japan...AR was dead by this point so they could only charge $30 for it...then they passed up Bayonetta 2 entirely so now Nintendo owns that shit and I had to borrow someone's WiiU to play it, so now they no longer hold anything to ransom me into buying their garbage systems with until Bayo 3.

>> No.5090993


do you need to talk, man? I care about you and hope you’re alright

>> No.5091063

I thought the new Kirby games were good?

>> No.5091336

That's a yikes from me, buds.

>> No.5091341

Paper Mario always sucked.

>> No.5091352
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>> No.5091397

The Sega Genesis was the "true successor" to the NES. Prove me wrong

>> No.5091757

The PC-Engine/TG-16 was the most like a souped up NES

>> No.5091806

>Yeah, they have made some epic blunders
Nintendo hasn't made a single bad game.

>> No.5091920

Gramps is right. The Atari 2600, NES, TG16, and SNES are all based off of the MOS 6502. The SNES was the "ultimate" system based on that hardware.

On the other hard the Genesis is based off of the Motorola 68000 CPU, but it's a very gimped version of it compared to the Neo Geo, System 16, and CPS 1/2.

Comparing the SNES and Genesis against each other is a strange comparison from a hardware point of view.

>> No.5093416

Sega was the better company. They just fucked up completely in the worst way during the most pivotal moment of the 90s. It was a race to have the first big budget fully 3D platformer and Mario 64 was so good that Sega was too embarassed to continue working on the shitty 3D Sonic game they had in development. Even if they had released a shitty Sonic game... anything would have been better than nothing. Cold feet killed them.

>> No.5093440

Back in the day Sega built a lot of its games for arcades first, which led to certain games being innovative or just riskier in general. The arcade scene allowed Sega to try new ideas before moving on to home consoles. Once the arcade industry started to slow down that hit Sega kind of hard, forcing them to work on more console related projects while still pursuing its more risky business tactics which ended up hurting them in the end. I feel like a lot of the Sega hate comes from the companies recent track record and the forgotten arcade scene that Sega used to preform very well in.

>> No.5093450
File: 473 KB, 200x200, rememberme.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>not a single bad game
I remember one

>> No.5093451

Stack the top 10 Sega Genesis games up next to the top SNES games... that's why Sega was sooo bad.

>> No.5093581

SNES' good games are all RPGs basically. SMW is inferior to Mario 3 and has lazy gimmicks, SMRPG is easy babby's first RPG, people just pretend to like Pilotwings, F-Zero is overrated, LttP is barely better than Zelda 1 inferior to Zelda 2, Mario Kart, Super Metroid and Star Fox are legitimately good though. Everything else that SNES had that was good was multiplatform.

>> No.5093595

Oh and anyone that prefers Final Fight over Streets of Rage should just honestly go ahead and amputate both of their hands.

>> No.5093601

Metal Warriors, Super GnG, Demon's Crest, Hagane, Cybernator... SNES isn't the action machine the Genesis is but it still has more awesome games that aren't RPGs than RPGs.

>> No.5093606


This is your brain on Nintendo.

>> No.5095403

They both suck.

>> No.5095541

That's not true at all. Sega is still one of the arcade kings in Japan. During the Dreamcast years, Midway Games was already beginning to pull out of the arcade scene, leaving Sega mostly uncontested to rule it. EVERY arcade during that era had Jurassic Park: The Lost World, Daytona USA 2, Crazy Taxi, and Star Wars Trilogy.

It was the Dreamcast's failure that largely dragged Sega's arcade presence down and not the other way around.

>> No.5095545

There should be an "Even in America during the Dreamcast years," at the start of the second sentence.

>> No.5095592

It's not just about people having different opinions. You can tell when somebody doesn't know what they're talking about if you've played the fucking game and they haven't. And if you watch any of the popular (((youtubers))), you'll notice that whenever they say something retarded it suddenly gets parroted all over the internet.

>> No.5095816

Streets of rage was laughably bad even back then.

>> No.5095843

>They were shit at the hardware apart from the Dreamcast though
You can make a good argument that the Saturn was over-engineered and/or under-powered, but the Mega Drive was a pretty great console hardware wise.

Arguably it only had two design flaws, and the first one doesn't affect the base console. That flaw is that Sega didn't optimize the audio CPU (Z80) to playback PCM. The other design flaw is Sega didn't integrate expandability very well, but obviously that's not a base-console issue. There's the low color count, but that was merely a technological one (couldn't fit in enough palette cache) - they ran out of die space cramming in the other features at their price point.

Here's how it stacks up against the Super Famicom which was released over 2 years later at a slightly higher price.

>SFC: Variable speed CPU due to Nintendo cheaping out. Only runs at 3.58 MHz when accessing FastROM cartridges or internal registers, but 2.68 MHz when accessing RAM or SlowROM cartridges, and 1.79 MHz when accessing some external registers. Because it can't do register-to-register operations, it only ever actually runs at 3.58 MHz when doing an op between FastROM and an internal register, otherwise it'll always be slower than that.
>MD: Fixed speed at 7.6 MHz, can do register-to-register operations, has a fuckload more and bigger registers than the SFC CPU, and a much bigger and more versatile instruction set (even 32-bit instructions are supported).

>SFC: Work RAM is on an 8-bit bus, VRAM on a 16-bit bus.
>MD: Work RAM is on a 16-bit bus at a similar clock speed, for effectively double the bandwidth. Not so big of a bandwidth advantage for the CPU, but a massive benefit for the VDP when it does DMA. MD uses dual-ported 8-bit VRAM at a slightly higher clock speed, so overall it has a slightly higher bandwidth than SFC VRAM.

>> No.5095856

Now the SFC PPU is generally praised as representing a technological step forward over the older MD VPU, but it isn't that simple either.

>SFC: Can only do vertical tile scrolling in 2 layer/low-color modes (essentially when it enters "Mega Drive mode")
>MD: Can do vertical tile-scrolling in all modes.

>SFC: Can display up to 128 sprites on-screen.
>MD: Can display up to 80 sprites on-screen. However, both consoles are VRAM limited in how many sprites they can display. In practice, neither the SFC or MD can display up to 80 sprites simultaneously, but the MD can get closer to it due to having slightly faster VRAM.

>SFC: Can display maximum sprite size of 64x64, however, all sprite sizes MUST be square shaped, so any sprite that isn't square shaped basically wastes VRAM space/bandwidth with blank data. Also, only two sprite sizes out of the list of supported sizes can be displayed simultaneously (so if you use 64x64 sprites and 32x32 sprites, you cannot have 16x16 sprites or any other size on-screen unless you waste VRAM with more empty data).
>MD: Supports sprites of any size, for significantly greater efficiency. Any combination of sprite sizes can be mixed and matched on-screen.

>PPU: Has a massive set of registers, half of which aren't useful giving programmers a huge headache.
>MD: Clean and minimal, easy to program. No ridiculously limited sprite system to worry about.

>SFC: Actually attempted an entirely PCM based sound system in an era where cartridges had fuck-all memory, so PCM samples eat up precious cartridge room. All sounds currently being played have to fit in 64 KB of audio RAM. Impressive technology, but used too prematurely. At least it's easy to use.
>MD: Uses arcade quality 4-operator FM channels (albeit with less channels than arcade machines) which sound crisp and take up minimal space. Theoretically has more "voices" than SFC due to Master System channels also being available. Unfortunately, FM is very hard to do "right".

>> No.5095862

>SFC: Audio CPU cannot "see" anything outside of the sound module making it ineffective as anything but an audio manger. It can't even copy audio samples into the audio RAM. The main CPU has to be halted and do it itself.
>MD: The audio CPU can access the cartridge ROM and main RAM independently of the main CPU, though it can't access a piece of memory simultaneously with it. However, this means that streaming PCM into audio RAM is easy since if the main CPU isn't touching the cartridge ROM, the audio CPU can freely load data from it.

>SFC: Tried and failed to integrate NES backwards compatibility
>MD: Actually got Master System backwards compatibility working

So as you can see, the Mega Drive is much better designed hardware overall than the SFC. That's not to say the Mega Drive was "more powerful" than the SFC (though there's a reasonable argument for that), or that the Mega Drive is perfect, but it was definitely great hardware from Sega.

>> No.5097194

>be me
>be Sega fag
>Search Sega
>Be pleased

>> No.5097203

Sega wojak sucks someone create a new one

>> No.5097212

The history is written by the winners thing is true, but in this case it more like its written by their fans.

>> No.5097516

id rather ride atari dick than be a nintedo faggot

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