/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.5056031]

Does Final Fantasy 9 use too many references from past games?

[Anonymous No.5056032]

What the actual fuck do you expect from a game designed to be an homage?

[Anonymous No.5056039]

>>5056031
Yes.

>>5056032
>homage
Weird way of saying "they got lazy and just lifted the plot and gameplay wholesale from the older games". I'm glad FF9 was the worst-selling of the PS1 FFs.

[Anonymous No.5056043]

I honestly never thought it did it any more than the other FFs. I mean look at Tactics, they just like... literally put Cloud and Aeris in there.

[Anonymous No.5056047]

>>5056031
Not really. The main problem with FFIX is it's total lack of freedom.

You can't customize very much, you can't pick who's in your party for like the first 20 hours and there's barely any sidequests for that period as well. It's the "on rails shooter" of the JRPG genre.

[Anonymous No.5056061]

>>5056047
"I don't like the game because it's not how I like games"

[Anonymous No.5056081]

>>5056061
Ok, so your problem with my post os that I have an opinion of my own?

Literally: I don't like your opinion, because it's different than mine.

Learn how to argue, rather than make assumptions and spout a counter point that basically counters itself, idiot.

Notice that I never said I don't like FFIX.
I actually do enjoy it, because while there's no freedom in it, it's very well polished, oozes charm and is actually fun in spite of it's short comings.

I just responded to OP based upon the conversation he was looking to have. IE: staying on topic.

Try it, retard.

[Anonymous No.5056109]

>>5056043

This. Not to mention Kingdom Hearts and other such bullshit that followed, FF9's historical references were perhaps a sign of things to come but are pretty harmless themselves.

[Anonymous No.5056136]

>>5056031
yes, it's annoying.

[Anonymous No.5056142]

>>5056039
Hey OP

[Anonymous No.5056157]

>>5056031
did anybody play the game, when it actually came out? I played nearly every FF that had been released in the US. never got into FF2, or the gameboy games, but I was there for the series deep dive into Sci Fi and bullshit drama.

FF9 was a revelation, for me, because it was a return to the things that got me into Final Fantasy. It had a shitload of fantasy! More than that, the game was a conscious appology for the last two FFs. it shoved in every beloved mechanic, every plot element, every reference, every trope. More than just a catalog of old shit, it actually executed most of them pretty well.

FF is a game where Ninjas throw swords, Chocobos go "kweh", Cid builds stuff (mostly airships), and the Great Crystal (source of all magic) is imperiled by an ancient evil. At one point, we were a little unsure about this stuff. FF9 was a bold affirmation that this was still the case

[Anonymous No.5056172]

>>5056157
>the game was a conscious appology for the last two FFs
Not good enough, should have been for the last 7.

[Anonymous No.5056184]

>>5056032
I remember the back of the CD case had this tagline, "the crystal's back!" I can vaguely remember a crystal at the very end of the game, but I can't remember what it was, or if it was important.

[Anonymous No.5056197]

>>5056172

In that case I'm not sure you were ever actually a fan dude, play some Dragon Quest.

[Anonymous No.5056203]

>>5056031
Does FFI have too many references to Dragon Quest?

[Anonymous No.5056214]

>>5056142
>everybody who holds the correct opinion is the same person
You wish. FF9 was trash, the franchise peaked with VII.

[Anonymous No.5056273]

>>5056203
Didn't FF1 had one grave with Link's name on it?

[Anonymous No.5056276]

>>5056031
I KNOW THIS!!
*CLAPS*

[Anonymous No.5056290]

>>5056273
Yes

[Anonymous No.5056551]

>>5056031
Does Legend of Dragoon LITERALLY rip FF VII the flying fucks out?
Does first Legend of Legaia LITERALLY rip FF VII's super-deformed models AND a shitton of animations? And also Dragon Ball...

[Anonymous No.5056569]

>>5056039
>I'm glad FF9 was the worst-selling of the PS1 FFs
odd thing to be glad about

[Anonymous No.5056607]

>>5056569
There are some real maniacs here on /vr/.

[Anonymous No.5056610]

the oddest reference was making the slowest game in the series given how snappy the previous 8 entries were

[Anonymous No.5056652]

>>5056569
The game is awful garbage that gets overhyped and overpraised for no good reason whatsoever at all. Nothing odd in being glad it flopped financially.

[Anonymous No.5056653]

No all FFs after 3 are pretty referential to their own series, it's just that IX gets scrutinised way more.

When IV was released Japanese players actually thought it was a remake or at least a sequel to II. There's a whole bunch of parallels with great sea serpents, ultimate spell Meteo, some even suggesting that the sword you get in Fabul is Leon's.

The same can be seen in III and V, Job classes, riding a dragon, "unlocking" bahamut, ultimate weapons sealed away and a submarine. Take another skip in he series line to VII and what do you know? Another submarine. VII also brings back the ultimate magic Meteo[r], Demon Wall from IV, much of the final bosses of VI would go on to be used again as ideas for VII and also Xenogears showing they were already highly influenced by Judaic mysticism and New Platonism influenced Christianity and Gnosticism.

When you really examine some of them you can see ideas appear all over like an FF DNA.

[Anonymous No.5056845]

>>5056610
>how snappy the previous 8 entries were

Have you played the original famicom/nes versions of I or II?

[Anonymous No.5056858]

>>5056081
I completely agree. FFIX is very restricting for the first two thirds of the game. And it seems restricting at every possible moment. Even just arriving at a new town, everyone splits up for AT Events and you're kind of stuck there until you complete whatever story objective is needed to move forward. Unlike the old FF games where a new town usually meant a new home base for countryside/dungeon exploration for the next few hours.

[Anonymous No.5056874]

I love IX for the characters and presentation, but the combat system and exploration aspects fall flat. It's not the best game in the series, but it's still better than VIII by a country mile

[Anonymous No.5056920]

>>5056653
>No all FFs after 3 are pretty referential to their own series,
> it's just that IX gets scrutinised way more.
Oh please. FFIX is scrutinized more because it has way more references and easter eggs than any other game in the series . Yes, the Final Fantasy series reuses many tropes. That's part of how it maintains its identity. FFIX is on a whole different level though. The entire game is full of references, and not just in a funny little side mechanic like the proposition missions in FF Tactics.

One of the primary villains is named Garland (FF1) whose castle is called Pandemonium (FF2) and flies around in an airship called the Invincible (FF3). The Four Fiends of the Elements (FF1, FF4) work for him. There's a location called "Gulug" Volcano which uses a variation of the music from "Gulg" Volcano in FF1. The Dwarves in Condie Petie say "Rally-Ho" just like the dwarves from FF4 (ok "Lali-ho"). The tame Antlion suddenly turns vicious in Cleyra, just like the tame Antlion attacks Cecil, Edward, and Rydia in FF4. One of Freya's best lances is called "Kain's Lance."

...And the list goes on and on. No other game in the series comes close to the number and blatant nature of references, unless you count the propositions in FF Tactics which are entirely optional. Sure, at some point people are likely to start seeing parallels that weren't intended, but most of this is just blatantly obvious. No one who knows the story of FF4 will fail to see the deliberate reference regarding the Antlion.

[Anonymous No.5056934]

>>5056043
> look at Tactics, they just like... literally put Cloud and Aeris in there
This was a case of an obvious cross-marketing tie-in. FFT was released half a year after FF7 which was the biggest most successful game in the franchise. Cloud is a hidden character in the game who is clearly out of place in the setting (he is literally summoned from another dimension in fact, in one of the rare lighthearted and goofy cutscenes in the game).

FFT also has the propositions, where there is indeed a great many FF-series references. Basically, the propositions are meant to give you an opportunity to uncover lore and trivia about Ivalice, and they populated this lore substantially with FF series lore. None of it ever shows up in the main story.

>I honestly never thought it did it any more than the other FFs
I seriously doubt you've played enough of the other games to recognize how FF9 is different in this regard.

[Anonymous No.5056942]

>>5056214

>You wish. FF9 was trash, the franchise peaked with VI.

ftfy

[Anonymous No.5056943]

>>5056610
yep, this game is slow as hell. I quit and switched to another game, Breath of Fire IV, because I grew tired of the loading and waiting.

[Anonymous No.5057115]

>>5056214
>the franchise peaked with VIII
Exactly.

[Anonymous No.5057124]

>>5056047
Uhhhh... You're stating this stuff as facts when it's clearly an opinion. Maybe before you get mad at someone for calling your piss poor wording out you'll realize you're a basement dweller

[Anonymous No.5057997]

>>5056039
>I'm glad FF9 was the worst-selling of the PS1 FFs.
That's 8's fault. Most of FF7's fans were newfags to both the franchise and RPGs in general. So 8 committed the sin of being not 7 and said newfags washed their hands of the series, leaving just the actual FF fans once 9 came around.

[Anonymous No.5058007]

>>5056031
Putting the fantasy back in Final Fantasy is kind of the point. It's supposed to be a nod to the series. Though admittedly, 9 is my favorite because it's the cutest.

[Anonymous No.5058026]

>>5056920
I see your complaints. the thing I don't understand is, that was the point of the game! It was a deliberate return to "classic" FF. More than that, it was an attempt to be a nostalgia bomb. think of it as Ready Player One, but for FInal Fantasy. Except, with a good story and great characters.

seriously, you are complaining about a bicycle because it only has two wheels and no engine.

[Anonymous No.5058297]

>>5056031
The references themselves aren't a bad thing but 9 was too much on the nose with them and were generally pointless. Take FF5 where the references to all the past games before it were either subtle and/or woven into its plot naturally with doing something new with the ideas.

[Anonymous No.5058520]

>>5057997
This shithead knows what's up. FF VIII was SO PERFECT it LITERALLY cleared the stage off of all normie shit.

[Anonymous No.5058528]

>>5056039
It wasnt even going to be a main series game at first. You need to relax. You are clearly upset.

[Anonymous No.5058591]

>>5056934
>I seriously doubt you've played enough of the other games to recognize how FF9 is different in this regard.

I know you think FF9 is more artful about its throwbacks, but it's not. This isn't to say it's not an artful game in general, but the self-referential aspects are still mostly just namedrops and straight inserts. It has a greater number of these references overall, sure -- but more work just went into the size, scope, mechanics, etc. as it was, which just naturally led to opportunities for more of these minor details.

[Anonymous No.5058875]

>>5056214
shit taste

[Anonymous No.5058920]

>>5058520

Then literally the exact same thing happened with X and X-2, hence why most random fuckers you meet played VII or X. The games have never been good at carrying momentum forward but I guess it's not really that kind of series.

[Anonymous No.5059261]

>>5058520
based

[Anonymous No.5059320]

>>5056920

And that makes it a bad game, because...

[Anonymous No.5060286]

>>5056031
absolutely not. it was a perfect swan song. it should have been the end of the series.

[Anonymous No.5060301]

This thread is buzzword hell

[Princess Sevenleaf !IT2uZpX.Ic No.5060472]

>>5056157
>FF is a game where Ninjas throw swords, Chocobos go "kweh", Cid builds stuff (mostly airships), and the Great Crystal (source of all magic) is imperiled by an ancient evil

Final Fantasy VII had basically of this, though? It had a ninja who likes to throw shuriken and other weapons, there's chocobo racing and even breeding, there's an airship captain named Cid... and like, the four Huge Materia are pretty blatantly the four elemental crystals from classic FF.

>>5056109
>Kingdom Hearts
>bullshit
you're just mad that you don't have anyone to eat sea salt ice cream with >:T

[Anonymous No.5060487]

>>5056942
>the game you grew up with you only like because of nostalgia
>the game which was REALLY great was the one which I grew up playing
You VI fags are all the same

[Anonymous No.5061301]

>>5056920
You've amazingly overlooked what I pointed out, let's just use FF7 as an example.

>One of the primary villains is named Garland (FF1)
One of the primary villains is named Sephiroth (Fiend) his design would essentially be reused for Bizzaro Sephiroth (FF6)

>whose castle is called Pandemonium (FF2)
Whose final dungeon is underground at the core (FF4)

>flies around in an airship called the Invincible (FF3)
flies around in an airship called the Highwind (FF2 Ricard Highwind)

>The Four Fiends of the Elements (FF1, FF4)
Granted but this is a trope across a lot of Asian media called 四天王, you could make the argument that the Turks are a version of this (with poor Tseng left out).

>The tame Antlion suddenly turns vicious in Cleyra, just like the tame Antlion attacks Cecil, Edward, and Rydia in FF4.
A Demon Wall starts to attack your party as you leave the Temple of the Ancients, just like Demon wall attacks your party when you try to leave the Sealed Cave.

>One of Freya's best lances is called "Kain's Lance.
One of Cid's lances is called "Dragoon Lance" despite him not being one or there being any Dragoon class people in the FFVII world

Also Huge Materia = Crystals.

Vincent's final limit break is "Chaos" and is a humanoid with batwings like Chaos.

I'm not denying the opaque homages IX has for I, and I would go further with saying that it's attempts to merge the plots of III and IV into IX's is to it's detriment especially in the case of shoehorning in the Xande=Kuja - Cloud of Darkness=Necron/Pepsiman which just made Kuja a terrible villain.

But the point is the reference to pervious games is something not new and you can argue IV is as referentially to it's previous 3 games, job classes are just set, Ricard Highwind from II, Leviathan eats a ship, 4 fiends etc.

[Anonymous No.5061318]

>>5061301
>flies around in an airship called the Highwind (FF2 Ricard Highwind)

Also, y'know, Cid Highwind

[Anonymous No.5061962]

>>5057997
Damn normies always ruining great stuff.