/vr/ - Retro Games

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Anonymous Mon Jun 25 05:48:10 2018 No.4860903 [Reply] [Original]

With the start of the cringe fest that is games done quickly, I have to ask, why the fuck does the speedrunning community only focus on consoles? Why don't they play games from the Commodores, Sinclairs, Amstrads, etc? I know that in America the consoles were king, but in Europe the microcomputers were king, so it's weird not to see the speedrunners play microcomputer games as well.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 05:58:45 2018 No.4860915 Same reason they'd rather play shitty watered down console ports of arcade games than the superior originals, because the viewer base grew up with console shit and they're the ones giving the speedrunners views, money and attention.

Anonymous Mon Jun 25 06:27:46 2018 No.4860936

it's easier to set up the stream with

as soon as you go outside their comfort zone the setup starts taking ridiculous amounts of time (like when they did the arcade tetris blocks) whereas setting up a SNES or playstation game for the stream is really easy

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 06:32:18 2018 No.4860940 old pc games a forgotten for better or worse

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 06:33:58 2018 No.4860942 Because all of euro stuff is complete shit.

Anonymous Mon Jun 25 06:38:08 2018 No.4860945

>>4860903
They play stuff like the bad GnG NES port instead of the arcade original available in stuff like Capcom Classics Collection. They're all about picking the most popular stuff to get views and donations, and making easy games hard instead of just playing hard games.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 06:40:16 2018 No.4860947 File: 38 KB, 398x399, 1330082852680.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4860942

Anonymous Mon Jun 25 06:59:08 2018 No.4860970

>>4860936
>it's easier to set up the stream with
oh complete fucking nonsense. the real reasons are:

- most speed runners are from lamerica, every home computer NTSC title is fucking garbage in comparison to their PAL counterparts. you only have to look at the NTSC c64 to realize how little american programmers gave a fuck about a machine made in america. same applied to the amiga. europeans developed titles people wanted, americans developed nothing but boring simulators, role playing games and endless amounts of shovelware and useless shareware nobody wanted.

- none of these speed runners have any experience playing games on machines that aren't jap consoles. they all play the same fucking boring games where everybody already knew the cheats but boy do they show off like they're like some kind of fucking genius because they found a guide on google.

TL;DR: speedrunning is full of neckbearded lamericans that have no idea about what goes on outside their shithole of a nation.

>>4860942
> be ameritarded
> limited to NTSC garbage
> autism: rising
> no demoscene
> an excellent cracking scene that peaked in the late 80s and then just fucking died.

GOD BLESS LAMERICA. makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside every time i see a lamerican crying.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 07:30:59 2018 No.4861006 I honestly would love to see a speedrun of the Amiga versions of the Shadow of the Beast trilogy. That would be fun to watch.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 07:33:20 2018 No.4861012 >>4860915 sure let me drag out insert extremely rare and expensive board to the speedrun avenue and set it up right this instant

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 07:38:02 2018 No.4861020 >>4861012 Ignorant, there are many 1:1 arcade ports. GnG has one for the PS2 in a collection. Yet they play clearly downgraded versions cuz muh NES muh memes!!

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 10:39:14 2018 No.4861268 >>4860970 this post is correct. the only one to blame here is ESA. europeans should be giving their videogame history more love.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 10:43:10 2018 No.4861270 Here's an idea: You do it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 10:48:07 2018 No.4861278 >>4861270 The truth is that the games are garbage so he wont be able to stomach playing them seriously

babbage's gramps !RATGzMALLY Mon Jun 25 16:03:38 2018 No.4861874 [DELETED]

File: 177 KB, 1200x675, Far_Cry_5_Key_Art_Wide_1495770936.0[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

This is the kind of thread I get a one-day ban for posting my opinions about the european retro gaming scene and european retro gamers in because they report posts while also making the type of anti-american posts this thread is full of that we just laugh off since they're clearly ridiculous.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 16:06:48 2018 No.4861879 >>4860970 Do you have a license to post this, lad?

Anonymous Mon Jun 25 16:09:39 2018 No.4861885
File: 240 KB, 925x1050, g78r488833.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>4860970
>most speed runners are from lamerica, every home computer NTSC title is fucking garbage in comparison to their PAL counterparts. you only have to look at the NTSC c64 to realize how little american programmers gave a fuck about a machine made in america. same applied to the amiga. europeans developed titles people wanted, americans developed nothing but boring simulators, role playing games and endless amounts of shovelware and useless shareware nobody wanted.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 16:12:55 2018 No.4861892 >>4860970 >PAL >Good Choose one. Fucking sub 60hz eurotrash

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 16:15:26 2018 No.4861897 Because they're plebs

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 16:15:48 2018 No.4861898 It's pretty hard to do speedruns with games that are often bugged and not completable. Some of these things literally just crash when you reach a certain point.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 16:22:22 2018 No.4861910 Brits had very low budgets and few competent programmers; they had no ability to do anything but poor quality clones of arcade and console games.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jun 25 16:24:03 2018 No.4861916 >>4860970 > Speedrunners are all American why don't American speedrunners speedrun my shitty European games? Also there are Japanese speedrunners. All that standards shit no one cares about is just deflection.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 00:01:14 2018 No.4862797 >>4860970 >he prefers playing games at 83% speed

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 04:12:02 2018 No.4863084 >>4860903 It's simple. Popular games attract speedrunners. Microcomputer games aren't popular (mostly because they're total shit), so they don't attract speedrunners.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 15:36:30 2018 No.4863905 >>4863084 You will immediately cease and not continue to access the site if you are under the age of 18.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 15:46:50 2018 No.4863932 >>4863905 Just stating the truth. Sorry Eurocucks are too emotionally fragile to handle it.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 16:51:47 2018 No.4864071 >>4863932 I'm not a Euro though.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 17:19:33 2018 No.4864114 >>4861020 you can either run it yourself and set a new world record in an empty category, or you can sit here whining about the popularity of the NES.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 17:36:29 2018 No.4864132 Of course I would think microcomputer games were shit if all I had was ZX Spectrum shovelware made on a $30 budget. But I don't because I'm American and we had real developers like Microprose and SSI.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jun 26 17:56:22 2018 No.4864163 This thread is literally people upset about other people are playing whatever game they want This thread is the most /vr/ thread ever

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 05:55:03 2018 No.4865010

>>4861910
>Brits had very low budgets and few competent programmers; they had no ability to do anything but poor quality clones of arcade and console games.

The first is true but the second is certainly not. European and especially British home computer programmers were on a different planet compared to the static simplistic D&D inspired stuff from the USA. The USA never produced anything as complex and forward looking as Elite or Exile. The real gems of the European home computer movement were games like this, the likes of Lords of Midnight, LaserSquad, Mercenary, etc.
It's true arcade inspired games from Europe were terrible compared to what the Japanese put out, but the USA was even worse when it came to this, and much less technically competent to boot (case in point: USA port of C64 Bionic Commando compared to the UK one, absolutely hilarious stuff). Jazz jackrabbit and Commander Keen are every bit as lame as Superfrog but don't get the kicking they deserve (Christ, Duke Nukem games even stole graphics from the likes of Turrican that they were clearly envious of). The USA only produced technically competent games worth playing with the advent of texture mapped 3D in Wing Commander and Doom.

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 06:11:03 2018 No.4865027 [DELETED]

>>4865010
>The first is true but the second is certainly not. European and especially British home computer programmers were on a different planet compared to the static simplistic D&D inspired stuff from the USA. The USA never produced anything as complex and forward looking as Elite or Exile.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DHnOOJO1Yg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bL35HvTIMmw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5Uh8O_Og18
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RDgt26Zcio
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ub-CiNsRRDo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx-ygKNOUik
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cs8ReVVgjVI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntEz4o5eq7k

Ah, the excellence of British game development. I would trade Ultima and Pirates! for these gems any day. How could NTSC devs compete?

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 06:17:36 2018 No.4865032

>>4865010
>The first is true but the second is certainly not. European and especially British home computer programmers were on a different planet compared to the static simplistic D&D inspired stuff from the USA. The USA never produced anything as complex and forward looking as Elite or Exile.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DHnOOJO1Yg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bL35HvTIMmw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5Uh8O_Og18
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RDgt26Zcio
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ub-CiNsRRDo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx-ygKNOUik
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cs8ReVVgjVI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlLYOyZ8JpI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntEz4o5eq7k

Ah yes, the excellence of British game development. I would trade Ultima and Pirates! for these gems any day. How could NTSC devs compete?

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 06:18:55 2018 No.4865034

>>4865027
Yeah, nice choice of games retard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltsqeUbPuEM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSJ5Iuv-0gU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7w_0yP5RwU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao9YXuFGAKY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAyDCti2XAc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UW4CDWyhxLw

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:01:51 2018 No.4865756 Nearly every game genre of importance was invented in the US, from text adventures to RPGs to graphical adventures to war games to sims to shmups and more. Europe hardly invented anything.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:05:48 2018 No.4865763 >>4865756 Shmups were DEFINITELY refined by the Japanese tho

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:07:19 2018 No.4865764 Arguably one could say that of other genres too, although to a lesser extent RPGs since the Japanese have never really evolved beyond the 80s Ultima/Wizardry format while WRPGs have developed in all kinds of directions since them.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:11:59 2018 No.4865770 >>4865764 It's mostly for arcade genres where the Japanese refined them. Most arcade genres are Japanese-dominated. There's an interesting exception: beat em up have IGS, a Taiwanese company, as one of the best.

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:13:39 2018 No.4865773

>>4865032
>Ultima and Pirates!
These are good examples of what I mean, solid game design but utterly uninteresting technically. Pirates is also great as it's about the only Microscope game of any interest today. Oh wait, there is the Daddy of them all: UFO Enemy Unknown, a game so superlative there are still people obsessed with it and forum posts about it to this day, even on /vr/. It's also made by the same British team as one of the games I already listed, fancy that!

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:16:08 2018 No.4865775
File: 29 KB, 512x384, Squidward_Design_2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>4865773
>These are good examples of what I mean, solid game design but utterly uninteresting technically

So just what's technically interesting about Bionic Granny and Karnov?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:19:53 2018 No.4865779 >>4865775 Europeans were often good programmers but they were seldom good game designers. A good example is Turrican which looks cool but the gameplay and level design is pretty bad compared with Mega Man or the other console games it copies.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:26:38 2018 No.4865783 >>4865779 That's a little unfair because the NES had some of the best game developers in the world with extremely tight Q/C standards.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:30:37 2018 No.4865792 American devs in the late 80s really didn't know how to code arcade games for shit, although this was probably an effect of the video game crash.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:32:15 2018 No.4865796 >>4865792 With very few exceptions (like Eugene Jarvis) they never recovered, after the early 80's the arcades were Japanese-dominated both in quantity and quality.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:34:11 2018 No.4865802 >>4865756 Where do platformers, hack and slash, and run and gun originate from? >>4865770 >arcade genres Such as?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:35:25 2018 No.4865805 >>4865779 It's the equivalent of selling the sizzle without the steak.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:36:29 2018 No.4865807 >>4865802 Space Panic is considered the first platformer and it was American. The first side scrolling platformer was Pac-Land (Japanese).

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:39:30 2018 No.4865810

>>4865802
Genres that are meant to be profitable in the arcade format. So stuff like shmups, beat em ups, fighting games, arcade puzzlers/racers, challenging platformers like Ghost n Goblins...
They're defined by needing to be both hard (usually with some memorization required to beat) as well as easy to pick up and play for the basics, with no time to pause (there's a queue behind you waiting to play)

For instance, stuff like the DKC games aren't arcade platformers since they have save points, you can grind for 1ups, there's a collect-a-thon aspect to them, etc. An arcade platformer would have both a time limit and just be about straight up platforming.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:41:28 2018 No.4865815 >>4865792 Late 80s home computer arcade ports were usually done by European devs except on the PC and Apple II, because they were business computers in Europe and nobody played games on them.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:44:31 2018 No.4865817 >>4865032 Someone from Binary Design recalled that the C64 Double Dragon was "done on an impossibly short deadline by a group of programmers with little practical experience on the C64, but they were cheap and readily available."

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 17:59:35 2018 No.4865835

>>4865807
>>4865810
Thank you for the information. I take it games that have qualities of both arcade and console styles are just considered mixed, or does it depend on which it exhibits more of? What defines hard, makes a game difficult? And lastly, if one wants to play arcade games, is the most reasonable and easiest way to do so still just grabbing MAME?

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 18:07:35 2018 No.4865839

>>4865835
>I take it games that have qualities of both arcade and console styles are just considered mixed
Yeah, there are plenty made-for-console games of acade genres.
I'll give an example: R-Type III is a console sequel to an arcade series. It's a good and challenging game. However, the first stage is just too long, easy and boring, this kills replay value and the game definitely wouldn't have been released like this if it was an arcade game, where replay value is king so that players return to the machine to play from the beginning over and over.
>What defines hard, makes a game difficult?
A game that can't be beaten by the average person without putting some effort. Arcades are made to be like this: casual players won't last more than a couple of minutes with a coin (they still have to be made so they've had their fun in this time tho, this is why a good beginning is key. Psikyo has a set of randomized stages so the first stage can be one of 3 or 4 different ones, with appropiate difficulty scaling so that casuals get a more varied experience), but since it rewards you with play time by playing better they encourage you to get better if you aren't a casual player.
>And lastly, if one wants to play arcade games, is the most reasonable and easiest way to do so still just grabbing MAME?
PCBs are expensive so yes. Most games have been accurately ported over the years, but not all of them. MAME also has stuff like save state support to practice parts, or custom autofire buttons, etc.

Anonymous Wed Jun 27 18:11:09 2018 No.4865845

Because consolefags don't know anything about computer gaming, certainly before the mid-90s. They are just completely clueless, they don't know the history, the worthwhile games, which versions they should play for various games etc. I sort of had the same deal in reverse, I grew up with DOS/Windows as a kid and knew nothing about Nintendo. Hell, I think I discovered what the fuck Zelda was when I was 20. The difference is, I don't pretend to be an expert on console games or call them shit.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 20:10:51 2018 No.4866043 >>4865032 I wish they'd done Hard Drivin' on the Atari 8-bit; they were better at this kind of game than the C64.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 20:27:59 2018 No.4866067 >>4860903 They don't.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 20:31:59 2018 No.4866076 >>4860903 >Why don't they play games from the Commodores, Sinclairs, Amstrads, etc? Because nobody wants to wait through 30 minutes of ear-splitting noise while the game loads for the run to start.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 21:09:52 2018 No.4866141 File: 62 KB, 564x760, 5787364.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4860903 Do you still like my little game?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 21:16:05 2018 No.4866148 >>4860947 Correction: Because 99.999% of 8- and 16-bit computer games are shit.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jun 27 21:27:08 2018 No.4866164 >>4866148 You must be 18 to use this website.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 01:47:50 2018 No.4866663 >>4860903 >why do autistic attention whores do what they do? reasons

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 01:54:01 2018 No.4866675 >>4862797 You do realise that people in Europe made their own games, right? They didn't rely on Japs like the US did.

Anonymous Thu Jun 28 02:46:24 2018 No.4866761

>>4865032
>How could NTSC devs compete?
they didn't bother competing. they did what the japanese did: made terrible games for their own regions, claim to be the best, and sit in a circle jerk for three decades, while the rest of the world laughed their asses off.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 02:48:31 2018 No.4866768 still amazing to see americans with inferiority complexes all these years later. absolutely wonderful.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 02:52:40 2018 No.4866775 >>4866761 >made terrible games for their own regions Such as? >the rest of the world Who? >>4866768 >inferiority complexes About what?

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 03:02:05 2018 No.4866796 >>4866675 Well not really since Europeans just made poor quality clones of Japanese arcade games.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 03:47:50 2018 No.4866874 File: 130 KB, 1180x1100, dd.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4866076

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 03:51:51 2018 No.4866882 File: 45 KB, 1280x720, toothless.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4866141 >not posting how he looks today

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 03:57:58 2018 No.4866893 File: 262 KB, 1200x629, 18.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4866148

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 04:58:53 2018 No.4866940 >>4866141 Freaking Robert Smith wannabe.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 05:08:15 2018 No.4866946 >>4866141 He probably used the TRS-80s as development machines for the Spectrum.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 08:58:36 2018 No.4867204 >>4866882 he can get teeth fixed/replaced. but nothing will ever fix your down syndrome.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 08:59:39 2018 No.4867208 >>4866946 he did exactly that. good guess.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jun 28 17:57:13 2018 No.4867974 >>4866946 It's very easy. You can just use the TRS-80's cassette output to copy program code to a tape to be read by the Speccy.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jun 29 04:23:58 2018 No.4868984 File: 13 KB, 480x359, 70.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4865773 >Pirates is also great as it's about the only Microscope game of any interest today.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jun 29 17:23:35 2018 No.4870230 >>4866675 >japan's "greatest" vidya genre directly taken from us software >relied on japs What did he mean by this?

>>	Anonymous Fri Jun 29 17:34:29 2018 No.4870254 >>4860915 They have run arcade games on superguns a few times before though. Violent Storm, AVP, and Ninja Baseball Batman all come to mind.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jun 29 17:38:15 2018 No.4870263 >>4870230 >"greatest" I don't get it. Also, which genre are you talking about?

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