/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.4824541]

Final Fantasy VII isn't actually that good or that important to gaming culture as a whole. It's a very basic JRPG. It does not do anything to push the envelope. Its characters are nothing special. The game was pretty in it's day, the graphics and FMVs are what carried it and why you noticed it.

Other JRPGs, such as Vagrant Story, earlier FF games, Live-A-Live, or even Earthbound are better with more interesting characters and plots. Not to mention themes.

It's not that Final Fantasy VII(FF7) is a good JRPG, it's just the first one you paid attention to because of its top of the line graphics, easily digestable plot, dramatic cinematics such as in the death of Aries and soap opera drama.

Also, it is a masterstroke of game design to make unskippable cut scenes in the middle of battle. Bravo, brave indeed.

Basically: the COD of JRPGs.

[Anonymous No.4824543]

>>4824541
>it's just the first one you paid attention to because of its top of the line graphics, easily digestable plot, dramatic cinematics
And that's exactly what makes it important to gaming culture.

[Anonymous No.4824547]

>>4824543

Are you saying gamers are a bunch of plebs that can be suckered into thinking a hack plot is revolutionary because of pretty graphics?

[Anonymous No.4824578]

>>4824547
They certainly were in 1997, anyway.

[Anonymous No.4824603]

I agree

[Anonymous No.4824629]

>>4824541
Dumbass nigga like you.
It is incredibly important to gaming culture.
Doesn't mean its very good.

[Anonymous No.4824632]

I wonder what it's like to be a teenager like OP and not experience these seminal games when they were new and understand the zeitgeist that surrounds them. I bet every classic game looks like shit when your first console was a PS3.

[Anonymous No.4824645]

>>4824632

You're correct that I didn't experience FF7 in it's heyday. I avoided the hype. I could see through the facade for what it actually was. I'm sure one day you'll get there too.

[Anonymous No.4824647]

>>4824541
I liked it. Good array of characters, equipment, materia (and stealing enemy materia), plot was interesting to me although not sure I completely understood it. The graphics for its time were quality.

I think you're falling victim to calling a game overrated (it probably is) when it's the series that gains too much accolades for what it is.
IV, VI, VII, VIII, IX, X kept my attention at least. The lesser-played-in-U.S. I, II, III, V I never finished actually. I own X-2 and XII and haven't finished those either. FF7 stand alone is a solid RPG for its time.

[Anonymous No.4824650]

>>4824645
It's pretty easy to avoid the hype of a game that came out three years before you were born.

[Anonymous No.4824662]

revolutionary opinion

[Anonymous No.4824675]

>>4824650
This. OP confirmed for PS3 baby.

[Anonymous No.4824716]

>>4824541
>Earthbound
>more interesting characters
hmm

[Anonymous No.4824790]

>>4824541
The opening 15 minutes is a great example of how to introduce an RPG.

2 minutes of FMV to establish the setting and introduce the game, with visuals of the giant Mako reactors. Then you're in control of the main character, fighting actual enemies in the games' real combat system, not some dumbed-down tutorial bullshit. The dialog is above-average in terms of blending exposition with endearing characterization (not amazing, but definitely good). The dialog is interspersed between gameplay segments and tends to be brief until the mission ends. The mission itself is exciting, and ends with your team destroying one of the city's Mako reactors and cuts to a full-city view similar to the one in the opening, giving a little extra appreciation for exactly what just happened.

I can't think of any RPGs (J or otherwise) with a better introduction than Final Fantasy VII. The FMVs are a key part of it, but only part, It's only drooling retards who know nothing about gameplay or presentation that think the only thing FF7 has going for it are the flashy-for-the-time graphics.

[Anonymous No.4824795]

>>4824647
>I think you're falling victim to calling a game overrated (it probably is) when it's the series that gains too much accolades for what it is.
I'll bet you 10 to 1 this is the same progress systems fag that whines about RPGs in every other thread he posts in (whether the thread is about RPGs or not).

[Anonymous No.4824813]

>>4824790
>>4824647

Gotta admit I didn't expect so many actual responses with points let alone good faith arguments. FF7 was a pretty good time, though I'm surprised nobody called out the pic of tidus. Nobody takes Tidus seriously. Tidus dosen't take Tidus seriously. Hell if memory serves Tidus's greatest achievement was to cease existing.

[Anonymous No.4824858]

>>4824541
these kinds of comments about FFVII don't have as much of an impact now as they did over a decade ago, no one cares

[Anonymous No.4824923]

>>4824541
Final Fantasy VIII is better than VII in every way. VII gets by on one of the biggest nostalgia boners of all time that has ever been had by fans, and the floodgate opening effect it had on JRPGs in the west.

[Anonymous No.4824926]

>>4824543
You aren't differentiating the fact that it was the "first" with whether or not it was truly that good though. And yes I was there to play it back in the day and thought it was really impressive.

[Anonymous No.4824930]

>>4824813
Tidus is one of the best characters in all of FF, though.
>totally fine with ceasing to exist if it means he can protect his girl
>that final scene where he tries to hug her even though they both know he can't

[Anonymous No.4824967]

Hey look it's another (insert classic masterpiece) is actually shit thread!

[Anonymous No.4825057]

>>4824795
I rarely post outside v and pol so probably not

[Anonymous No.4825059]

>>4824930

Yep. Never actually played that game.

[Anonymous No.4825190]

>>4824930
If anything, FFXIII certainly demonstrated why Tidus was a good character.

[Anonymous No.4825196]

>>4824795
Nope, I wouldn't praise a GAME for its characters or plot, nor would say shit like "for its time" muh grafxxx. Also, not a fan of later Final Fantasy at ALL, if anything they are the easiest example of what I dislike in games. Bad deduction skills

[Anonymous No.4826876]

7 has the best world building but the characters suck. 8 sucks at everything. 9 doesn't seem like a modern FF. 10 has the best characters by far. Everything after 10 is shit.

[Anonymous No.4826901]

>le contrarian you're not actually having fun cinematics are bad face

[Anonymous No.4826918]

>>4824541
>Final Fantasy VII isn't actually that important to gaming culture as a whole.
You must have been asleep when it came out.

[Anonymous No.4828228]

>>4824541

FF7 is the Beatles of RPGs

[Anonymous No.4828332]

>>4824813
lmao only faggots think Tidus is shit, you afraid of playing as japanese chad or something?

[Anonymous No.4828496]

>>4828332

HA HA HA HA HA HA

[Anonymous No.4828530]

>>4824632
I was a teenager until recently, and still loved discovering the game in 2014 or so. For many people, there's certainly the plain nostalgia factor, but I feel it's more that the game evokes a sense of wonder which most people associate with childhood. The world borrows heavily from real life while removing all the history and surrounding context, so it's almost like seeing them for the first time again. Costa Del Sol and Wutai in particular gave me feelings of awe which I had not felt since a very young age, and I've heard the same from others. So I would say that the zeitgeist is only part of it, and that almost all classics can be very enjoyable once you get what they're going for.

[Anonymous No.4828565]

>>4828496
The shitty laugh was deliberate. Tidus gets more character development than any FF protagonist.

[Anonymous No.4828580]

>>4828565

But can anything truly make up for that laugh?

[Anonymous No.4828586]

>>4828565
I guess now I have more mixed feelings about this.

So everyone with half a brain knows that the point of the scene is to be awkward (hell, even the rest of the party makes fun of them), and through their awkwardness Yuna and Tidus break down some boundaries and bond.

But that said, it is still justifiable to attack that scene if it went overboard, which I think is the crux of the issue.

[Anonymous No.4828589]

10 was the only FF game I've ever played and I do not plan on ever playing another if you guys think tidus was a good main character

[Anonymous No.4828596]

>>4828589
Well that's too bad, cause Tidus was a good main character.

[Anonymous No.4828608]

>>4828596
Are you kidding me? He doesn't have any emotions besides scared/concerned and weirdly indistinctly passionate, varying between them the entire game. Even his backstory is vague and stupid. It's been many years but I honestly don't think there was some subtlety to that game I missed..

[Anonymous No.4828616]

>>4828596
>>4828565
>>4828586

[Anonymous No.4828624]

>>4828608
>He doesn't have any emotions besides scared/concerned and weirdly indistinctly passionate, varying between them the entire game.

He starts out the game cocky, even a little spoilt, given his star-athlete background.

He is shocked and overwhelmed when his city gets destroyed, but Uncle Auron shows up and tells him it's all okay. (While being mad at Auron for not explaining shit).

He's desperate and afraid when he's trapped in the cave.

He's still shellshocked when captured by the Al-Bheds, but finds a little comfort in familiarity with Rikku, the first person in the real world he can actually connect with. He starts to regain some of his composure when he's able to be useful in the Al-Bhed team. Then Sin attacks.

When he lands ashore on Besaid, he sees a Blitzball, and finally finds the first properly familiar thing in this world, along with his first "friend" Wakka, a bro-ey captain, and is genuinely ebullient. This will be juxtaposed by the weird religious shit he's about to get introduced to.

You know, what, I'm not even going to continue at this point. This was just the first hour. You clearly haven't played the game is several years and have forgotten most of this.

>Even his backstory is vague and stupid.
His back story is fleshed out perfectly to explain his character and relationship with his dad. Other than that, he's a civilian. What, you want to know what high school he went to?

He hates his distant asshole star-athlete father, even while admiring his skills.
He thinks his father ran away and hates him even more.
He grew up to be an athlete just like him.

What, you want to tell me what the heck Cecil's backstory is, other than "I was a Dark Knight"?

[Anonymous No.4828625]

>>4824541
I remember always being a PC fag back in that day... one day I got to play 7 and 8, years afterwards both thier realeases. I only could play 7 once, and only was driven to get to the end cos of the story, I played 8 about 3 times just because I loved messing around with its mechanics.

[Anonymous No.4828650]

>>4824541
I think Final Fantasy VII was a good game, particularly for its time, but unfortunately Square learned all the wrong lessons from it. They decided FMVs etc were what sold a game, and their follow-up ones showed it with more FMVs, lengthy summons, etc.

[Anonymous No.4828716]

>>4824632
Someday somebody is going to say this about Skyrim.

[Anonymous No.4828736]

>>4828624
You had to use the word "shock" twice to describe how the character acts in that and I hope you'll admit the range of emotions he displays over the game is not exactly enormous. You're right it's been a long time since I played it but I distinctly remember thinking tidus was a shitty one dimensional character, as opposed to wakka who is a good one dimensional character

I feel like there's something about FF games I just don't get cause 10 was like a flatline

[Anonymous No.4828740]

>>4828736
>You had to use the word "shock" twice to describe how the character acts

Ah yes, you're right. It is bad writing for a character to experience the same emotion twice.

[Anonymous No.4828769]

>>4828740

>Ah yes, you're right. It is bad writing for a character to experience the same emotion twice.
cmon man I'm just pointing out you said basically "he's shocked, and then something else happens and then he's shocked again", and that's in the first hour which I remember being fairly eventful compared to the rest of the game

If he had been a little cockier and had more of a stereotypical athlete personality or something, fucking anything I would have probably liked the game more. Or go the opposite way and make him super serious and angry because his father left and is the bad guy. As it is the guy is like a blank slate, maybe that's on purpose but that didn't work right for me I guess. I quoted your post so people can follow the conversation

[Anonymous No.4828778]

People who grew up with the game and have been waiting for a true follow up ever since don't want to admit this, but the game was super popular because it had one of the biggest and most expensive marketing campaigns in vidya history up to that point.

I'm not saying it isn't a good game, it is a good game, but the only reason it's the most popular PS1 era JRPG when there were so many better ones is because there was a ton of advertising for it and everybody knew about it.

[Anonymous No.4828952]

>>4824926
Because that's irrelevant. It introduced RPGS to a whole new generation of gamer, and it was the first to THEM. Whether or not you think it's a good game is completely out of the picture here.