/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.4788003]

Does Brutal Doom help or hurt the OG Doom and Doom II games? I hear conflicting reports that it either brings awareness to a 20+ old game but that it also messes with something that was great to play as originally intended.

What's /vr/'s take?

[Anonymous No.4788010]

>>4788003

SGTMarkIV is pretty fucked in the head, that's a start

[Anonymous No.4788014]

Brutal Doom is fun for 5 minutes but gets old fast, it is absolutely retarded to have full-aiming in a game where most monsters are on a single line-of-sight.

[Anonymous No.4788037]

>>4788003
Brutal Doom got me back into Doom but I don't think its a good mod in any way. It's bloated as fuck and uses stolen assets. The author is also a jackass.
Brutal Doom has made an influx of children who only play with Brutal Doom and spam forums asking for unrelated mods to support it. I also dislike how people misattribute source port advancements with Brutal Doom features. That just triggers my autism.
All in all, it's okay, but I refuse to use it out of principle.

[Anonymous No.4788048]

>>4788003

It's excellent. I like OG DOOM too but brutal just makes it more playable IMO. Mainly having the ability to jump.

[Anonymous No.4788051]

Others already touched on my view of Brutal Doom so I'll just say the creator is an asshole who can't optomize his shit mod when there's too many enemies on screen (gpu/cpu is not an issue) but BD has given Doom a second life so for that i'm thankful.

I just wish other mods got as much reconition as this one did. Project Brutality is another that comes to mind for example.

[Anonymous No.4788064]

>Expected ’,’
>got ‘l’.

[Anonymous No.4788072]

>>4788051

>assuming all Doom creators aren't assholes

[Anonymous No.4788078]

I think it gets way too much importance placed on it. It's just another gameplay mod in the end. It can be fun, it can be bullshit, and it is really, really bad about flopping into the bullshit category constantly.

I mean I still played a fuckton of it but I like seeing different mods do different things.

[Anonymous No.4788083]

It's pretty good but it'd be better if there were simply a mod with all of Brutal's effects and animations but without gameplay changes so we could run what we want with it. There's BD monsters only and BD lite but that shit doesn't work right. Not like it does in Brutal Doom, it's not all the same stuff. I've always been big on blood and gore in games so it's right up my alley, I just feel too limited when the only things I can play that have that level of detail are Brutal Doom and Project Brutality. I think Project Brutality's traditional mode is best.

[Anonymous No.4788089]

>>4788064
Ketchup v5? There's a fixed version on moddb.

[Anonymous No.4788092]

>>4788003
So is this basically a mod for Doom babbies? The full body Icon of Sin looked kinda neat, at least.

[Anonymous No.4788094]

>>4788003
Other than Brutal Doom's creator being a piece of shit of a human from what i've hear, the mod itself though isn't bad.

[Anonymous No.4788104]

Brutal Doom is one great mod out of hundreds. It's not something that outclasses the original Doom, it's not "the way Doom is meant to be played" or whatever stupid shit the press says about it.

>Does Brutal Doom help or hurt the OG Doom and Doom II games?

Hard to say. It's attracted people to the old games, but BD's lack of compatibility with other mods may have created a walled garden that otherwise wouldn't be there. Some BD fans get pissed when a gameplay mod isn't BD compatible, which shows they at least have knowledge of other mods. But the question is how many of them are willing to leave their BD comfort zone and try something different. http://terminusest13.tumblr.com/day/2017/12/08

If nothing else, I think the only reason D44m played anywhere close to the original games was because of BD's popularity.

[Anonymous No.4788110]

>>4788003
I liked it only for the additional effects. Lighting, blood, gore, interpolated animations etc. The rest of it only hurts the game. My personal preference is just to get SmoothDoom and then whatever the latest gore mod is, I previously used Ketchup but I heard there’s a new one. This keeps the classic gameplay but adds all the lighting and gore + smoothness back, just essentially brings Doom up to modern effects but the gameplay stays the same.

[Anonymous No.4788545]

>>4788048
Here's the response (you) were looking for.

[Anonymous No.4788570]

>>4788064
Based Gzdoom

[Anonymous No.4788601]

>>4788545

>being this autistic that you don't think others could have different preferences in video games.

Keep shining anon!

[Anonymous No.4788747]

>>4788094
>>4788051
>>4788010
Can somebody give me a quick rundown on why everybody hates sgtmkiv? I keep hearing that he's "a shitty person" but that's not really a convincing argument.
What did he do specifically? Punch a kitten?

[Anonymous No.4788789]

>>4788747
As far as I know he told a suicidal person to go kill himself with detailed instructions. Plus stealing assets but most modders do that so meh.

[Anonymous No.4788812]

>>4788789
So... a standard 4chan post?

[Anonymous No.4788837]

>>4788789
As somebody who has been on the verge of doing it once or twice I will say that anyone who posts about it on the internet is not actually suicidal, they are an attention whore.
If this guy called out a manipulative attention whore on the internet and embarrassed them in front of the world then that is a +1 in my opinion, regardless of whether or not his mod is shit.
Never played it myself but the vid of it running on ChexQuest was pretty funny

[Anonymous No.4788867]

I'll be honest I always have it on along with the idkfa metal remake. I just love the more visceral audio/gore.

[Anonymous No.4788887]

>>4788812
Were all assholes here.

[Anonymous No.4788889]

>>4788789
Every single person that publicly states he's gonna kill himself is not actually suicidal. Mark just called out an attention whore and that's not a bad thing, but the zdoom community is...well, consider they protect people like Eevee, a weirdo who draws very unsavory furry fetish things (and has no reservations on linking to that nightmare-inducing stuff publicly).

That whole thing is just scapegoating. People were just jealous of him for hitting the mainstream while they couldn't, or ANGERY at him for daring deface muh Doom purity. That thing was a convenient excuse to boot him and pretend they had the moral high ground.

The mod itself is okay. Notoriously poorly coded, but it's at least a tangible thing you can play. I wouldn't dare to say it's the best mod ever, but it's at least worth a run or two. The support maps are interesting.

[Anonymous No.4788998]

>>4788747
>>4788789
>>4788812
He's an edgelord and a turbofaggot /pol/tard all at once. I'm sure a few people will find that to be a plus but he's basically doing it for no other reason than to be edgy and to drum up controversy over BD.

[Anonymous No.4789021]

>>4788003
It's existence doesn't really hurt anything, it's the rabbid fans who shit things up at the time.

The only reason why it brought awareness to anything was because of media/Bethesda hype. On that end, some good does come out of BD in that it got some modders genuinely interested in what the modern source port could do. Unfortunately some of them want to ONLY make things for BD or play only WADs that will work with BD.

All I have to say is that it's OK if you like it, but don't only play it. There are more fun experiences out there.

[Anonymous No.4789026]

>>4789021
*but don't play it alone

Whoops.

[Anonymous No.4789029]

>>4788003
Does neither. Brutal fanboys hang in their own circle and those who think it's alright or don't care for it hang in theirs.

[Anonymous No.4789065]

>>4788003
It adds a great level of detail in terms of sprite animations and variation of enemy deaths, something even Ketchup DOOM cannot match. /vr/ may crucify me, but I greatly enjoy blowing an imp's head of or watching as a caco gets smaller and smaller as I shoot it with a shotgun until there's nothing left. Beats the boring alt death mods that are out there.

HOWEVER, that's about all the positives that can be said.

It fucks with balancing on a whole new level to where anything past Ultra Violence will fuck with things tremendously. Which in itself wouldn't be half bad except weapon balance is shit as well. Shotgun is the best option over everything else except the BFG. Chaingun is shit.

Enemies go from being fair to just cheap. Increasing speed and damage is a lazy attempt to increase the difficulty. Play the Taggart Difficulty Mod if you want a real, yet fair, challenge. This isn't so bad in DOOM 1, but in DOOM 2 when you get to a shit map it becomes 10x as bad due to all the shit happening on screen

Sound-wise the weapons sound good, but enemies are absolute ear-rape. SgtMarkIV got it right with v20b, but words cannot descirbe how fucking terrible it can get. Earlier versions suffered from this as well. Again, IDK why Mark decided to fuck it all up with the recent version.

Mark is also a HUEHUE that stole most of the content in his mods from the gore, weapons sprites, and so on nor can he code. Multiple people have pointed out bugs in Ketchup DOOM yet nothing has been done nearly 2+ years later when it would take 5 minutes tops to fix. Being an edgelord doesn't help as well. Like several DOOM forums have banned him.

All in all, for me anyways, I want someone to take all the detail that goes into the gore and make it its own separate mod. None of this discount Ketchup Doom shit. Otherwise, IDGAF about it any more. Project Brutality is better

[Anonymous No.4789092]

>>4788789
>>4788812
He's a lot like what you'd see on here, the difference being most other places won't put up with your shit if you act like that, so he has a nasty reputation for shitting up other communities.

[Anonymous No.4789447]

>>4788747
He deliberately made it so that if his custom Doom campaign (Hell On Earth Starter Pack) was run with a specific sub-mod (Project Brutality) it would crash Doom and possibly your computer. He openly admitted to doing this out of spite because someone from Project Brutality's dev team did something he did not like.

He's a cunt.

[Anonymous No.4789451]

>>4788104
what ugly monstrosity is this

[Anonymous No.4789474]

>>4788003
While it's nice that it brought attention to classic Doom, it's also a poorly-coded and badly-balanced mess that steals attention from more deserving gameplay mods, and is developed by a lazy piece of shit human being to boot.

[Anonymous No.4789481]

>>4788003
>Does Brutal Doom help or hurt the OG Doom and Doom II games?
It makes them different.
YMMV. Try it.

[Anonymous No.4789689]

>>4788003
Brutal Doom is shit...I use Smooth Doom because it keeps the gameplay intact while adding new cosmetic things.

[Anonymous No.4789725]

>>4788003
I'd say it helped breathe new life into the games and it only hurt them if you let it do so like alot of people here.

most of the animosity towards BD I've seen usually either comes off as sour grapes from other modders or it's from purists who were never even gonna touch the mod in the first place.

I'm sure there's more legit reasons beyond those but they always seem like the most common to me.

>>4788072
most mod creators are no matter what game they mod for. hell, look at all the drama from fallout or TES modding or how about the guy who put malware in his sonic fangame as DRM to prevent people from "stealing" his sprites.

[Anonymous No.4789737]

>>4789447
I've ran PB with hell on earth and nothing ever happened like that.

did he do this recently? or is this something that newer sourceports catch?

[Anonymous No.4789980]

>>4788003
Consensus is, to my understanding:
Brutal Doom is a fun mod, but it changes too much from vanilla Doom. This is a problem because many people play ONLY Brutal Doom and refuse to play anything else.
Similarly, BD is pretty glitchy mess of spaghetti code that doesn't play well with other mods or mapsets.

At the same time, worst part of Brutal Doom is SGT Mark IV - a weirdo and a creep. Notably he:
- told a suicidal person to kill themselves with instructions
- stole content from other people without even crediting them
- used pictures of real gore in Brutal Doom - and as cherry on top he didn't even credit the photographers!
- also he is racist, sexist, homophobic, you name it.
- he responds terribly to criticism calling everyone who critizes him noob or a hater
- last but not least, he's a creepy weirdo. I saw him mention in a thread once that after adding a female player sprite to Brutal Doom, he considered letting Baron of Hell rape the female Doomguy (Doomgirl?) as a fatality.

Mark is easily the worst thing about BD, and he is infinitely hateable.

[Anonymous No.4790002]

>>4788003
It's just a novelty at best. If you want the real doom experience you need to play it vanilla.

[Anonymous No.4790012]

>>4788003
BD is shit and runs like shit, and it's code is s fucking mess (last time I looked at it, his DECORATE files weren't even specifically named. it was just DECORATE DECORATE DECORATE LOLOL DECORATE for like a dozen files in a row, how the fuck can you find anything)

Also he's a fucking moron for having FUCTON BILLIONS of particles/decals/gib objects/etc. laying all over maps where every single sector is constantly looping and checking for changes in every single frame, causing even beefy machines to perform like garbage.

[Anonymous No.4790016]

>>4789980

>borrows from schmucks who give their shit away and don't file copyrights but act like it's legally protected IP and cry
>tells drama queens to hurry up and neck themselves -- good, either do it or shut the fuck up about your problems to us
>Willing to represent true gender equality by showing roasties get the guro too after years of Doom Guy male being mercilessly turned into raw meat

SGT Mark IV is definitely /ourguy/

[Anonymous No.4790146]

>>4790016
God, shut the fuck up, edgelord. We know you're 14.

[Anonymous No.4791261]

>>4789725
>I'm sure there's more legit reasons beyond those but they always seem like the most common to me.
The Brutal Doom fanbase is pretty obnoxious, it gets tiring seeing people demand Brutal compat with every other mod project out there, his codework is pretty bad, he's got a nasty habit of taking stuff from other mods but not really crediting them, balance is really off-kilter in BD with the headshot system and how crippled hitscanners are. There was also the debacle where he was convinced Id had stolen from him for Doom 4 and he got WAY bent out of shape from it, it was kinda funny.
It's also frustrating that he just keeps stacking more shit into his mod rather than just finishing it and moving on, but he's kinda trapped himself as "the brutal doom guy" So he's got just keep spinning his wheels, and he hasn't grown much over the years because of it.

[Anonymous No.4791961]

Brutal DOOM is a lot of fun to play for 10 minutes after work if I just want to rip shit apart and flip off a pile of dripping guts on the ground and be an edgelord, but it's too easy.

I always end up playing unmodded doom after and enjoying that much more.

I do have a mod combination where I mix the Brutal DOOM pk3 file with the Goldeneye DOOM .Wad and pretend that james bond is ripping russians apart and telling them go fuck themselves, it's a lot of fun after a day of dealing with customers.

[Anonymous No.4791969]

Daily reminder that Admiral Alejandro VIII has done nothing wrong.

[Anonymous No.4792518]

It's an okay mod. I don't really understand all the hate it gets since there are so many mods you can play something else. That's the whole point of mods, play it the way you want to play it. Disliking its fans or creator is pretty irrelevant to the mod itself so those are nonsensical things to even bring up.

[Anonymous No.4792528]

>>4788037
go back to your hole please

[Anonymous No.4792541]

>>4788003.
brutal doom is both good and bad
it got people to play doom who wouldn't normally, but said players don't care about vanilla or other mods.

its funny that it eventually got so popular to cause drama in the doom community. you can even argue doom 4 is based on it.

[Anonymous No.4792624]

>>4790012
>Also he's a fucking moron for having FUCTON BILLIONS of particles/decals/gib objects/etc. laying all over maps where every single sector is constantly looping and checking for changes in every single frame, causing even beefy machines to perform like garbage.

This is my biggest gripe with BD. I have to enable janitor mode and make the bullet casings dissapear to even run at a stable framerate when shit hits the fan. My computer isn't outdated and the framerate took a shit until I made those changes.

Also for those who aren't fond of Brutal Doom, what do you reccomend?

[Anonymous No.4792660]

>>4790012

I'm willing to forgive shit performance if the mod is fun. Reelism is GOAT but it can drop to 5fps in a worse case scenario.

[Anonymous No.4792692]

>>4788998
>>4790146
>MUH POL ;____; ;____;
Kill yourself, you Kike.

[Anonymous No.4793913]

I think BD is great, Hell on Earth is one the few Doom Maps that actually feels like Hell is invading the Earth. Also the Hell maps he made were pretty fucking disturbing in a good shocking way. Sacrificial grounds was a great map and one the most atmospheric hell maps with the tortured marines and pools of gore/blood. There are very few vannila or modded wads that actually make you feel like you're in Hell in all its horror.
>>4788010
>>4788037
>>4788094
>>4788998
ITT: Post GG Triggered nu males mad over someone saying "problematic" things about minorities on a "electro-mechanical shooter arcade board".
I and most people could give a fuck about MrkV being a Nazi that gases Jews while jerking off in a fursuit or whatever it is.
Considering the usual drama that seems to come with typical pedantic doom modders over status and e-fame he's the least autistic in comparison.

[Anonymous No.4793950]

>>4788003
it recaptured the shock factor the original doom had. I'll give it that.

[Anonymous No.4793954]

>Mad janitor deletes my post because I mentioned how immature it is to complain about Mark IV being some edgy nazi despite the whole mod being the very definition of edgy.

Speaking of edgy I like BD more for the atmospheric levels then anything. Hell on Earth and map 23(?) Sacrificial grounds was one of the few maps that I've played that really make you feel like you're in Hell, with the torture/40k style chaos you would expect.
You have remember doom guy is a bad ass bad enough to survive a dimension of unimaginable cruelty and unspeakable horror.

[Anonymous No.4793960]

>>4793954
wow, it's almost like off-topic forum drama is off-topic forum drama

but yea i'm sure your own hot take is special

[Anonymous No.4793969]

>>4793960
if that's the case then you would only judge the mod for its game play/content. Not because the author is a "Problematic" alt-right nazi or whatever the fuck he is/accused of being.

[Anonymous No.4793989]

>>4793969
that's exactly what i do??

but yea i'm sure your own hot take is special

[Anonymous No.4794353]

>>4789737
He patched it out after the code was fo8und by the Project Brutality devs and people started calling him out on it.

[Anonymous No.4794851]

>>4788003
Brutal DOOM is literally the worst way to play DOOM, and anyone who really played the game in the 90's will tell you the same, 90% of stuff added in the Brutal doom is useless and kills the gameplay.

[Anonymous No.4794854]

>>4794851
>butt mad vanilla player having fits over change.

[Anonymous No.4795118]

>>4794851
Was around in the 90's when Doom blew up and still think BD is worth checking out. It chugs at times due to all the shit happening on screen, regardless of your setup, but it's fun to revisit and take it for what it's worth.

[Anonymous No.4795362]

>>4788010
stay gay

[Anonymous No.4795372]

>>4789689
I saw the trailer, very interesting.

[Anonymous No.4795398]

>>4795362
Ouch, he strike a nerve, Mark?

[Anonymous No.4795460]

>>4788014
There's a brutal mod of Doom 64, where full aim makes a lot more sense. Also goddamn is Doom 64 good with a mouse and keyboard.

[Anonymous No.4795773]

>>4795398
Fucking
>DOMINATED

[Anonymous No.4795819]

It's a pretty good audio/visual update, but virtually all of the gameplay changes are just flat out bad.

The melee kill 'cutsenes', the needless iron sight shit, and 'go fuck yourself!' taunt are all retarded dumb shit that only appeals to people too young to have played the original game.

I hate it, but I can't deny that it put doom back on the map for a lot of people who had forgotten about it, or never experienced it - I feel almost exactly the same way about it that I feel about Megaman 8bit Deathmatch.

Over all I think it's a net gain for the community.

[Anonymous No.4795859]

>>4795773
>>DOMINATED

Don't you mean
>DOOMINATED?

[Anonymous No.4795876]

I never really got the appeal of playing the original Doom episodes with a mod that doesn't suit them. Are the new maps good enough to make me play it if I don't actually care for the concept? Do people make maps balanced for Brutal?

[Anonymous No.4796441]

>>4795876
There's an official campaign to go with the mod now. It's decent enough, but it's much more Duke 3D than Doom.

[Anonymous No.4796573]

Seriously? We, or rather, this entire board, have a general for this. I go and make a thread for intellectual discussion on FF7, and you school shooter meme lovers push it off the catalog because ONE meme thread isn’t enough, amirite guis?

[Anonymous No.4796601]

>>4796573
There are eleven Final Fantasy oriented threads in the catalog, and at least 4 of them are specifically for the seventh installment. Generals are cancer, but at least the FPS people have the decency to stay together. You and the SOTN faggots are the worst, always shutting up the front page with trivial and inane questions.

[Anonymous No.4797439]

>>4796573
>intellectual FF7 discussion

[Anonymous No.4798035]

>>4796573
>intellectual discussion
>FF7

[Anonymous No.4798107]

>>4788003
Try beautiful doom, it's true original doom with small enchancements.
http://www.mediafire.com/file/my9k1bo6ill46wi/Beautiful+Doom.exe