Final Fantasy 7's story is flawed

[Anonymous No.4665572]

Midgar was the best part of Final Fantasy 7. The rest of the game is typical RPG trash.

Squaresoft fucks you by making you think this sick ass steampunk world is going to be the focus of the whole game, this dark, depressing atmosphere of bounty hunters, terrorists, and ogliarchs duking it out and fighting for their ideals. Grey and grey morality is king, and you don't even know if you're the good guys.

In the beginning AVALANCHE aren't even really characterized as the good guys because they still destroyed entire sectors of Midgar, destroying infrastructure and people's livelihood.

Admit it, the shiny golden wire of hope is the best part of the entire game. Seeing Shinra corporation up close and really grasping what you're up against? Memorable as fuck. Storming Shinra headquarters? Memorable as fuck.

Then you get outside into the overworld and the game completely halts the pace to zero with the fucking Kalm flashback. The story after that grinds to a complete halt. The game lost it's focus and didn't get it back until the end of motherfucking Disk 3.

If this game wasn't your childhoods you'd see it was a damn mess. Pretty ambitious and fun to play, but the story and setting needed a lot more work.

[Anonymous No.4665594]

>>4665572
Midgar is cool the first time you play the game, but it's absolute torture on subsequent playthroughs and the reason I don't really replay the game. It takes fucking forever to get to the overworld
an entire game like that would've been crap

[Anonymous No.4665605]

>>4665572
>>4665594
You're both somewhat right.
>overworld sucks
You wanted the flagship JRPG to not be a flagship JRPG? Naive. Look at what XIII and XV have done to the series.
>Midgar sucks
It's boring on successive playthroughs, to be sure, but once you climb the plate it's pretty much all diamonds.
>not just playing FFVIII

[Anonymous No.4665613]

>>4665605
I'd rather play solo WM Final Fantasy 1 than deal with that janky system again

[Anonymous No.4665643]

>>4665572
It all sort of comes back to what kind of narrative a video game needs.
Does it need an airtight story to be good?
I don't think so.
I mean, your example is perfect. The story is kind of bullshit and it's not very consistent.
But the gameplay is incredible (combat, materia, exploration) and we get involved in some very interesting scenarios for a video game.
But does the story need to make sense at all?
I don't think so.
As long as it plays (mostly) by the rules it sets within it's own universe then I think it's okay.
I agree with your overall point that the story is pretty much a mess, but I slightly disagree that Kalm is bad. I liked the sense of chasing Sephiroth and globetrotting in the process.

[Anonymous No.4665648]

>>4665572
>steampunk

It's "anime cyberpunk". It looks very similar to Akira's world, with some of the art deco from Blade Runner.

[Anonymous No.4665653]

>>4665572
The vast majority of square rpgs were melodrama for teens

[Anonymous No.4665726]

>>4665643
>gameplay is incredible
In a mainline Final Fantasy? Did i read that right? The games with the least gameplay on the console?
>combat
3 chara rpg fare with attack spam for 90% of battles
>materia
stick spell ball in weapon slot to use spell. Combination and special effects are only allowed in endgame. Only a handful of useful spells that go back to ancient "heal while spamming strongest attack" gameplay.
>exploration
In a linear game? One submarine cave and an extra dungeon for 80+ hours of game don't qualify as "exploration". Even the overworld is painfully linear (being far inferior to even FF2!) until endgame.

Jesus the stories people invent about the merits of this game. Why can't you all just admit it was overhyped by your peers and the commercials, you liked tifa's tits and you wanted to be cool and edgy like sephiroth. That's the whole appeal.

[Anonymous No.4665736]

>>4665726
>Why can't you all just admit
boy I love it when underage retards tell my why I actually like something

[Anonymous No.4665739]

>>4665572
>Squaresoft fucks you by making you think this sick ass steampunk world is going to be the focus of the whole game, this dark, depressing atmosphere of bounty hunters, terrorists, and ogliarchs duking it out and fighting for their ideals. Grey and grey morality is king, and you don't even know if you're the good guys.
Did you see the rest of the World where you see the cost of that "sick ass steampunk world"?
Shinra's Cyberpunk metropolis is built on the depressing ruins of Gongaga and North Corel, the facade of Nibelheim, the broken dreams of Rocket Town, abased Wutai, and Junon trod into the dirt by the military boot.

[Anonymous No.4665748]

>>4665739
but dude, like, those places don't look like they're ripped off from blade runner so whatever

[Anonymous No.4665749]

>>4665572
>>4665648
FF7 is dieselpunk.

[Anonymous No.4665756]

>>4665749
>FF7 is dieselpunk.

It's your a dumb nigger punk. They don't even use steam energy you stupid shit. They use Mako, which is a stand-in for Nuclear power, and continue's Japan's demoniation of nuclear power.

[Anonymous No.4665780]

>>4665756
>Mako energy = nuclear
Mako's more akin to Geothermal. The whole message is about spiritualism and nature.
>They don't even use steam energy you stupid shit.
It's not about energy, it's about aesthetic. Read a book nigglet.

[Anonymous No.4665791]

>>4665756
Japan demonizes nuclear weapons, not nuclear power.

[Anonymous No.4665831]

>>4665572
actually it's a game about a twink chasing another twink to the end of the world.

but seriously it's a game full of flaws if you want to a nitpicking killjoy. but i think it's amazing. i'm currently replaying it.

on recent replays i'm struck by what a great character aeris is. everything about her, the church scene, her house and garden, her dialogue, her wonderful theme of course, all of these elements make for a genuinely poignant character. i find it hard not to cry when listening to her theme.

and then of course they have her killed, she who was the very embodiment of kindess, it's pretty damn brutal. and that's cool, i like the grim tone of the game too.

i'm not doing a great job or articulating this, maybe it's just a dumb game about putting orbs in slots and mashing buttons, but it gives me the feels.

[Anonymous No.4665859]

>>4665726
I don't know. I feel like you're grossly simplifying a lot of things here.
Also, a big part of the legacy of this game is because when it came out, nothing like it really existed. Don't green text that statement; sure other jrpgs were similar but nothing combined story, production value, marketing, music, etc in the way FF7 did. Sure, by today's standards it's pretty garbage but... it didn't come out today. Know what I mean?
A lot of this stuff I don't agree with; you can combine materia very early in the game. And endgame stuff is pretty great once you start getting the weirder materia.
And there was more than just the submarine cave. I think you know you're being hyperbolic, anon. Getting KotR, Vincent, defeating Ruby/Emerald, finding the best materia, (maybe a few other things) and by that point you're already like 60 hours in.
I agree with a little of what you're saying but you have to understand that some people have different preferences.
Could be that jrpgs are not for you. Or maybe, specifically SE jrpgs. I dunno.

[Anonymous No.4665864]

>>4665572
>If this game wasn't your childhoods you'd see it was a damn mess. Pretty ambitious and fun to play, but the story and setting needed a lot more work.

And if you are old enough to have been on gaming forums back then you would remember that was exactly the reaction.

[Anonymous No.4665873]

>>4665859
>Could be that jrpgs are not for you. Or maybe, specifically SE jrpgs. I dunno.

Shin Megami Tensei is everything Final Fantasy ever wanted to be. More atmospheric, more story driven, actually good fighting system (Press Turn > ATB and you know it) and provides a challenge beyond mashing circle to win.

Even the old SMT games blow FF7 out of the water with the story, presentation, enemy variety and design, AND music.

[Anonymous No.4665884]

>>4665572
>fun to play
It's not even fit to be called babbys first JRPG. the system itself is completely brainless with obvious solutions to problems and some awful design like KOTR summon shits on the entire game.

[Anonymous No.4665885]

>>4665873
Again, that's your preference.
And it's sort of an unfair comparison; nocturne is a whole generation (ps2) later than FFVII.
It had hundreds more (maybe not hundreds but a lot more) RPGs to draw inspiration from (including 7).
Are the older, black and white films better than todays? Mostly not.
Are older cars more efficient and easier to handle than today? Probably no.
You see what I mean?
FFVII is broken, flawed, unbalance and messy. But it's legendary because it influenced the industry and helped change the landscape of gaming.
By today's standards it falls apart but it helped to define those standards in the first place.

[Anonymous No.4665892]

>>4665885
Not him but Persona 1 is much better than FFVII and Soul Hackers is even better. There's also a lot that isn't great about the SMT games. But there's a ton that isn't great about FFVII as well.

[Anonymous No.4665897]

>>4665892
>running around some featureless empty dungeon crawl map is better than a game with actual world

[Anonymous No.4665898]

>>4665892
>Persona 1 is much better than FFVII
Besides a fundamental genre, there's nothing to compare as they're nothing alike.

[Anonymous No.4665921]

>>4665898
I find it much more interesting mechanically and story wise which are the two things I care about for the genre. But certainly tastes vary.

[Anonymous No.4665952]

>>4665859
>sure other jrpgs were similar but nothing combined story, production value, marketing, music, etc in the way FF7 did

What is a 'Chrono Trigger'?

[Anonymous No.4665967]

>>4665952
3D was cutting edge back then. Even if it was sparingly used in 7 with the prerendered backgrounds and everything. Chrono Trigger was a whole gen behind.
But goddamn I should replay Chrono Trigger.

[Anonymous No.4665989]

>people get bored of trying to pretend FF9 is shit
>gotta find a new game to pretend is shit
>throw dart at a board
>WE HATE FF7 NOW REEEEEE XDDDDD
go away newfags

[Anonymous No.4665995]

>>4665572
Didn’t read but maybe you should do something else with your time aside from pretending you write for polygon

[Anonymous No.4665996]

>>4665989
- hyped by unprecedentedly huge marketing budget
- hyped by gamers and reviewers who HAD NEVER PLAYED A SINGLE RPG BEFORE IN THEIR LIFE
- credited for inventing RPG tropes that had already existed for years
- credited for being the first 3D RPG when such games had already existed for years
- credited for being the first RPG to have such in-depth storytelling when even earlier FFs had done better years before
- credited for groundbreaking graphics when games with far superior graphics (in-game and cutscenes) had already existed for years across all systems
- credited for creating such in-depth customization when far more in-depth RPGs had existed for years, especially on PC
- overlooking of major gameplay flaws
- overlooking of major story issues
- over 20 years later, still gets all this misplaced credit and excuses for its flaws from the mainstream

Fuck you.

[Anonymous No.4666002]

>>4665996
More than half of your "points" are conjecture, obviously made up bullshit or assuming that people are "crediting" FF7 for doing any of these things. Stop being such a faggot, FF7 might not be the best JRPG ever, but it certainly does a lot right, and I say this as an FFVIfag.

[Anonymous No.4666004]

>>4665996
>WAAAAH PEOPLE CARE MORE ABOUT FFVII THAN MY FAVOURITE GAME ABLOO BLOO
cry more

[Anonymous No.4666008]

>>4665726
>>4665996
This. Playing FF7 without nostalgia goggles was one of the biggest disappointments of my life.

[Anonymous No.4666026]

>>4665739
Look up "theory of the mind" and how it relates to Asperger's. OP literally can't understand a story past surface-level attributes such as the setting and how that fits.

[Anonymous No.4666030]

>>4665996
>>4666008
I played it originally without nostalgia goggles and it was one of the greatest joys of my life.

[Anonymous No.4666032]

How do you guys come out and solve the secrets and the correct strategy to win some bosses
I feel dummy because time to time i recure to guides :(

[Anonymous No.4666206]

Ff7 sucks dick. I'd rather play Chrono Trigger anyday.

[Anonymous No.4666212]

>>4665572
I've never seen this pasta

[Anonymous No.4666317]

>>4665884
To be fair, KOTR feels a lot like optional content to me. Not many people got it on their first playthrough, and plenty probably never bothered.

[Anonymous No.4666326]

>>4665572
REEEE Final fantasy! XD

[Anonymous No.4666382]

>>4665572
>a 21 year old game whose genre is notorious for having bad writing has a flawed story.
Wow did you work that out all by yourself, anon?

[Anonymous No.4666489]

>>4665572
Wow I actually somewhat agree. Yeah it's like you step into an almost entirely different game once you leave Midgar, since nowhere else besides Junon actually shows the influence by Shinra. I really wish the rest of the game maintained that gritty dystopial feel.

>>4665605
>not just playing FFVIII

Why would I play the nadir of the golden age FFs?

[Anonymous No.4666515]

The game's great

but the combat system really wasn't all that good then and now and the main reason for that is the materia.

[babbage's gramps !RATGzMALLY No.4666609]

>>4665892
>Persona 1 is much better than FFVII
Imagine walking around smugly believing something like this. I was even one of Persona's biggest fans but come on. Contrarianism has damaged your brain.

[Anonymous No.4666659]

>>4665892

Holy crap. I played the shit out of Persona 1 the day it came out but to call it much better than FFVII is fucking delusional. This website has rotted your mind.

[Anon No.4666662]

Came to this thread to say i love ff7

[Anonymous No.4666676]

>>4665572
Midgar is definitely full of high points for the game.

However...
>Golden Saucer
>The date that can end in Tifa punching everyone
>creepy ancient forest
>spooky puzzle rooms
>getting lost in the snow drifts and finding secrets
>that flying the highwind music
>the weird vibe in their hometown

Also golden wire and not the Wall Market really?

You are confusing the word Story with Setting in the context you are using it. And yea I can grant you the steampunk setting early on has a lot of memory too it, but I like the variety in the game. I like that it builds Shinra up as badass and replaces it with a bigger badass early in the game not at the end like other games do.

Storywise its not really flawed because its not really complicated. Its about as basic as it gets standard anime super soldier goes nuts ends the world. Its not deep but its done well and built up over time.

[Anonymous No.4667003]

>>4665996
it's only good because ''muh childhood''

[Anonymous No.4667012]

>>4665572
>If this game wasn't your childhoods

Get a fucking clue yourself idiot. Funny how so many of you people can see things one way yet seem to completely miss these same things you notice if you just interpret things a bit differently.

Yes retard, because so many people, most people who played it probably, were in fact young at the time when this game came out. So while you as an edge lord adult wanted the game to be so called darker in tone with the shinra plot kids back then didn't mind because they are fucking kids you moron. None of us were subjected to all the media we have consumed into adulthood when we were kids.

For most kids things like Jenova and Sephiroth were cool as fuck and added to the whole epicness of FFVII. They weren't thinking of edgy grey morality shit. There is nothing wrong with this. Get the fuck over it and deal with it.

So no I disagree. FFVII wouldn't have been better the way you wanted it. Its perfectly fine the way it is and clearly worked very well since even people born years later have played and enjoyed it.

[Anonymous No.4667082]

>>4665572
If you want to talk about games with falsely advertised stories, let's talk about the Star Ocean series.

[Anonymous No.4667095]

>>4665572
The game's intended audience were kids.

[Anonymous No.4667110]

>>4665572
Um, the story isn't very complex, but it appears to have flown completely over your head. The contrast between Shinra and the rest of the world is a major element of the story.

[Anonymous No.4667398]

It's the atmosphere that makes it decent.

[Anonymous No.4667448]

>>4665572
Maybe chans for discussing any topic, inlcuding as trivial as video games, wasa mistake. As a heads up, I'm not protecting/bashing FF7 in any way.
>Midgar was the best part of Final Fantasy 7. The rest of the game is typical RPG trash.
There was no such thing, and there is no such thing, as typical RPG trash. So the entire statement is made around false theory.

In the beginning AVALANCHE aren't even really characterized as the good guys because they still destroyed entire sectors of Midgar, destroying infrastructure and people's livelihood.
You haven't been paying attention, because there were remarks about moral ambiguity of Avalanche after Midgar.

[Anonymous No.4667450]

>>4666662
This. Re-played it a few weeks ago for the first time in a decade and I wasn't disappointed. That part where you fight Jenova with Areith's music playing still gets me.

[Anonymous No.4668306]

>>4667082
Go on...

[Anonymous No.4668475]

>>4665572
I've played the game for the first time last year expecting it to be mediocre and absolutely loved it. The game gets its praise deservedly.

The only that one can levy against the story is the absolute lack of closure. Cloud gets his moment defeating Sephiroth (even if it's only in his mind?), but we don't get any closure on the rest of them. Does Barrett see Marlene again? What is the world gonna be like that she's going to grow up in? Do Cloud and Tifa get together after they mourn for Aeris? Why is the ending so lacking in regard to Aeris anyway? What does Cait Shit do?

I had so many questions, and the Northern Crater being the ending of the game caught me off-guard pretty badly. Getting there in the Steam version of the game unlocks the "get to the second part of the game" achievement. Usually you'd think that means there's still half a game to go, but all you do is go through a final dungeon, beat the the end boss and that's it.

The end cutscene with Nanaki overlooking a retaken-by-nature Midgar was powerful, but I would have preferred a more slowly paced ending than the rushed one we got.

[Anonymous No.4668481]

>>4668475
Haters gonna hate. FF7 is great.

The ending was even worse before all this FF7 extended universe crap though. I mean, all of it is bad, but it does establish that humanity survived, which the game does not.

[Anonymous No.4668552]

>>4668481
I got the impression that Aerith was responsible for the extinction of humanity. She was corrupted in the Lifestream by the planet, turning into the planet's "weapons". Although she stopped the meteor, she also subsequently killed all humans on the planet because it was threatening the planet's survival.

[Anonymous No.4668562]

>>4668552
I mean, that's one way you could take it. All you see is Red XIII, who isn't a human, in the ruins of human civilization. Holy killed all the humans for all we know.

[Anonymous No.4668850]

>>4665572
>Midgar was the best part of Final Fantasy 7. The rest of the game is typical RPG trash.
/thread

[Anonymous No.4669358]

>>4668306
Star Ocean games bait-and-fail on two levels.

1. You start out thinking this is some space-fantasy adventure. Nope, every game just has you start stranded on some primitive planet, and you need to find a way back to space. You are also forced to use swords instead of LASERS because reasons. You are here for at least half the game, with almost no exceptions.

2. Okay, so suppose we buy in to the fact that Star Ocean really is just about fun adventures on a primitive planet, before you go off to save the universe in the second half. At least the characters and world are charming! Well too bad, every SO's story falls fucking apart in the second half (coinciding with just about the time you learn about the SPACE WEAPON that is threatening the UNIVERSE). The beloved SO2? Story falls apart. The meta SO3? Story falls apart. Whatever the fuck SO4 is supposed to be? Story falls apart. Every fucking time, the story goes shit-tier in the second half, where somehow the primitive planet you were trapped on is PIVOTAL to saving the Universe, by some cosmic coincidence. Which is just more excuses for you to spend time on the primitive planet, even though you've regained the ability to traverse galaxies.

Basically, just play Rogue Legacy instead.

Or just play SO for the kick-ass battle system and musics.

[Anonymous No.4670123]

>>4669358
You mean Rogue Galaxy?

[Anonymous No.4670124]

>>4670123
Er yes. My bad.

[Anonymous No.4670132]

>>4667448
>There was no such thing, and there is no such thing, as typical RPG trash. So the entire statement is made around false theory.
Yes there is. Protip: actually try playing some JRPGs and you'll see they all regurgitate the same clichés.

[Anonymous No.4670151]

>>4670123
>>4670124
A mistake, but Rogue Legacy is a much better game.

[Anonymous No.4670201]

>>4670132
That's not a bad thing on itself. Everything is a bit clichéd nowadays, at times a derivative story full of clichés can be entertaining nonetheless. Depends on approach, how entertaining the whole package is, and personal style.
Just playing devil's advocate here, but, I don't think it's wrong to enjoy a game with a story that is derivative, poorly written or even nonsensical as long as it has its moments or the game is fun to play.
We can argue the games such as Illusion of Gaia or Terranigma which have stories that try to be deep but, as a whole, do a lot of ass pulls, sudden twists with little warning or scenes that are pretty much non-sequiturs, but the gameplay was entertaining and a lot of said scenes were enjoyable because they were memorable for one reason or another. Or games such as Paladin's Quest that in general suck but you can't help but chuckle at the idea that the entire plot was because a dude got cucked and raged too hard, or Lufia 2 that is hugely formulaic "new town, go to dungeon, fight boss", but it had the Ancient Cave and puzzles and a casino and shit and as weirdly episodic as the plot is, there are a few moments that leave some impact anyway.
We also have cases where translation mishaps or cuts during development ending up with the game being a total mess of plot (breath of fire 2, secret of mana, saga frontier) and the games are still likable (flawed as they are).
Then there's stuff where the plot is pretty much in the manual, or the system is too limited for dialogue (the oldest stuff like wizardry, FF1, or stuff like saga or even pokemon on GB) but the games are just fun as long as you like that older no-frills flavor (which might not be your thing but hey you know that for some people grinding is relaxing).
Dunno, this is personal opinion entirely, but I think the plot is kind of secondary. A good game can have a shitty plot, and a bad game can have a kickass plot, I think it's more a matter of how things balance each other.

[Anonymous No.4670508]

>>4670132
>JRPGs
He mentioned RPG, not JRPG.

[Anonymous No.4670765]

>>4667110
>The contrast between Shinra and the rest of the world is a major element of the story
this

[Anonymous No.4670767]

>>4668475
It's an open-ending. I wouldn't say it was rushed because it was an artistic and thematic choice.

Which is why the compilation sequels are fucking retarded because they ruined the ending's ambiguity

[Anonymous No.4670779]

>>4670201
I'm not gonna read all that.

[Anonymous No.4670831]

>>4670779
>being stupid

[Anonymous No.4670848]

>>4668481

You hear laughing children at the end though. Powerful, but also creepy when you look over nature retaking Midgar.

>>4670767
Well I'd have to research this gain but I'm pretty sure I read that they rushed the ending because of budget reasons and time constraint. They wanted to make FF8, essentially.

That would explain why everyone is all of a sudden back on the Highwind even though they were just on the Crater, then the big bang happens and poof. I heard they wanted to include a scene were you meet up with Marlene again, and had an ending where Cloud and Tifa hooked up.

It's just a minor complaint, but the lack of closure on a character level burns like a searing scar in my chest. I grew ATTACHED to these characters. I haven't done that in regard to any game for years. No wonder FF7 has sparked all these weird attachment games.

That said, it's still a great ending. I teared up at the end when we basically saw that the planet was retaking Midgar, and now only Nanaki lives to see it all.

I don't think there's been a game that's inspired me more to get my shit sorted out in life and live a good life. And that's great for a game to do.

[Anonymous No.4672065]

>>4670201
>Everything is a bit clichéd nowadays
Lol

[Anonymous No.4672537]

>>4665572
>Final Fantasy 7's story is flawed
Whaaa really I thought it was literally and objectively the one true perfect story you just blew my mind, OP.

[Anonymous No.4672541]

>>4665594
>an entire game like that would've been crap
Breath of Fire 5 was pretty shitty I agree.

If OP really wants a setting bait and switch, he should try Star Ocean 2. Or 3 if he really wants to be jerked around.

[Anonymous No.4673638]

>>4665831
yeah flowers blooming in the church really chokes me up too man

[Anonymous No.4673687]

>>4673638
the church represents purity in the midst of the seedy slums. the flowers represent life miraculously blooming under the shadow of the midgar plate.

it's corny but i can forgive corniness in a jrpg, the clichés are part of the charm.

it's just one of my favorite scenes. i like that damn church and mostly i love that damn theme.

[Anonymous No.4673759]

>>4665594
You must have hated FF10 with a passion then. Otherwise you're a massive fucking hypocrite.

[Anonymous No.4675803]

>>4665572
>Grey and grey morality is king, and you don't even know if you're the good guys.
That's still true by the end of the third disc. What game did you play, faggot?

[Anonymous No.4676178]

>>4673759
I hate FF10

[Anonymous No.4676186]

>>4676178
>>4673759
I dunno, I liked ff10. Maybe it's because I like linear RPGs that give you heavy direction. Most FF overworlds are just finding the magic tile that will progress the story.

[Anonymous No.4676374]

>>4673759
the lack of an overworld or controllable airship were both big minuses, but I liked the combat, character and ost
equipment customizing was cool too, but yeah the game felt way too claustrophobic

[Anonymous No.4678107]

>>4676178
This what hatched from Norg's egg?

[Anonymous No.4679749]

>>4675803
One that he's too stupid to understand because the villain is a bishonen so "IT MUST BE SHALLOW"

[Anonymous No.4680115]

>>4665892
Shit man, I fucking hate FF7 but even I can see its merits and admit Persona 1 is a whole different thing and not fair to compare.

[Anonymous No.4680575]

>>4665892
>Not him but Persona 1 is much better than FFVII

You've clearly never played either game if you unironically believe this.

[Anonymous No.4680594]

>>4665726
>In a linear game? One submarine cave and an extra dungeon for 80+ hours of game don't qualify as "exploration". Even the overworld is painfully linear (being far inferior to even FF2!) until endgame.

Nigga every fucking FF is linear, except for the second half of 6.

[Anonymous No.4680678]

>>4680594
Not him but extreme linearity in an RPG is fault, the fact that most JRPGs do this does not negate it.

His faults against the game, that exploration sucks, that combat is simple and repetative, and that character development leads little beyond tweaking the formula of spamming out one or two attacks and occasionally healing, these things are all valid.

JRPGs in general constitute weak games. Their visual style has merit.

[Anonymous No.4681275]

>>4680678
>and that character development leads little beyond tweaking the formula of spamming out one or two attacks and occasionally healing

wat

[Anonymous No.4681789]

LMAO you've got to be pretty stupid to fail to understand the juxtaposition Kalm presents and how the worldbuilding pivots from it to portrait the consequences of Midgar's existence.

[Anonymous No.4682806]

>>4668475
You are absolutely right, it didn't help that all the Compilation material is crap that doesn't do the single thing everyone wants it to do, give the characters some closure, it might as well not exist and have Square use their goddamn Twitter account to clear things up instead.

The series has never been too explicit about what happens to the characters after the end but other endings in the series have felt much better.

[Anonymous No.4682850]

>>4665572
The remake will be superior.

[Anonymous No.4682894]

>>4682850
It isn't out yet? I haven't paid attention to that in like 6 months