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/vr/ - Retro Games

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4491363 No.4491363 [Reply] [Original]

Everyone remembers this guy

>> No.4491370

That’s not the fisherman trainer I remember... but I do feel like I’ve seen it before.

Which route? Is he on one of the sea foam islands?

>> No.4491398

>>4491363
Is that the guy with SIX Magikarps?

Honestly, I wish more trainers had bigger teams, because it sucks when you're fighting a bunch of people who only have one or two Pokemon.

>> No.4491520

>>4491398
Well, considering most people are not dedicated trainers, it makes sense to have only one or two mons. They just have a pet and and too much unwarranted self-importance.

>> No.4491553

>>4491520
It's kind of insulting to walk into a gym and see a leader that only has two or three, though.

>> No.4491565

>>4491553
I like the explanation, hinted at in the pokemon origins limited series, that the gym leaders are basically handicapping the fight to give you a fair shot. Otherwise it doesn't make any sense that Brock has pokemon 30 levels lower than other gym leaders.

>> No.4491576

>>4491553
I always thought that you should be restricted to the same number of pokemon as the leader

>> No.4491604

>>4491520
Even the self-proclaimed Cooltrainers/Ace Trainers? They seem to be a little more dedicated to the craft, and yet they still only carry 2-3 Pokemon. Especially in modern games.

>> No.4491606

>>4491553
It's even more insulting when the gym leader's underlings forget what the gym is based around.

Koga grunt 1: We're supposed to be psychic trainers, right?
Koga grunt 2: Yeah, probably.

>> No.4491607

>>4491363
How many other trainers have a full complement of 6? Is he the only non-named npc who does?

>> No.4491847

>>4491363
Based. Just imagine how much of a badass you'd have to be to see some clearly dedicated trainer and just fuck with him by sending out 6 of the same completely worthless Pokemon.

Would've been a fun joke to have him in G/S with a team of six level 80 Gyarados or something.

>> No.4491956

>>4491363
>I don't see what's the problem he looks like a normal fishe-
>notice the six pokeballs

I think you opened a repressed memory

>> No.4491961

>>4491565
It's also hinted at Gen 2 onward with the gym rematches

>> No.4491982

>>4491565
So why does Brock handicap himself when I walk into his gym with a squirtle that can KO both of his pokemon with one attack? Why's Lt. Surge letting me sweep him effortlessly with the level 30 dugtrio I just caught 2 minutes before the match and didn't even personally train? I wish the gym leaders really did have their teams change based on what you're challenging them with

>> No.4492035

>>4491982
I mean, the true answer is because the game is way too simplistic for that. You need to use your imagination, but every kid playing pokemon for the first time understood that implicitly. They also say things like "raise your pokemon with love" even though all you really need to do is walk around with them a lot.

Maybe they could have done something like making the gym leaders have different teams depending on how many badges you have. Since the midgame gyms can be done in any order, they could make it so that e.g. Sabrina is weaker if you fight her before Koga, or whatever. I think even that would have required them to store multiple separate "versions" of each gym though--much more straightforward to just enforce a certain linearity. I think they did the best they could do with the very limited resources.

>> No.4492052

>>4492035
>You need to use your imagination, but every kid playing pokemon for the first time understood that implicitly
Me nor anyone I ever knew thought this. The most intuitive explanation is that some gym leaders are just tougher than others, which you find out as you travel around battling them. That'd also be why the Elite 4 have better teams than the gym leaders. They aren't holding back to give challengers an easier time of becoming champion; they're the Elite 4 because their teams are stronger than other trainers'.

>> No.4492067

>>4492052
>The most intuitive explanation is that some gym leaders are just tougher than others
No, sorry. That means you're fucked if you're not born near pallet town.

>> No.4492071

>>4492067
Just like real life. Detroit is a tougher city than Fargo.

>> No.4492092

>>4492052
>Me nor anyone I ever knew thought this.
I don't mean about that specifically, just in general. Playing pokemon as a kid, the logical flaws didn't stand out and you just enjoyed playing it. The game really leaves a lot to the imagination since it is so simplistic. I remember not even realizing that the game was monochrome until the second time I played it. I played blue version on a GBC and had a guidebook with full color illustrations of all the pokemon, so my childhood mind just saw them the way I imagined them.

They say the mind of a child is more similar to an adult on hallucinogens than anything else. Pokemon seemed to tap into that directly.

>> No.4492103

As a kid, I used to wonder how the hell people travel to and from Cerulean. Once you get there, you're trapped until Team Rocket blows up the wall in some guy's house. There's no accessible road leading to and from the city.

>> No.4492114

>>4492071
I mean, OK, that's your "headcanon" I guess. But in that case, why doesn't some random trainer from one of the very nearby high-level areas just wander into Pewter City and dethrone Brock?
The game doesn't fully make sense because it is a simplistic fantasy game. You can't explain everything--how come you never see a person other than the player surfing on a pokemon? How come you can send newly caught pokemon directly to the PC from the field, but not deposit any of your party or withdraw anything? How can Alakazam have an IQ "over 5000" but not take over the world?
Like any game, pokemon is a set of rules and some set dressing around them. It isn't obligated to make sense any more than the economy of the board game Monopoly.

>> No.4492117

>>4491982
Try STADIUM/2. With rentals.

>> No.4492337

This guy became a lot cooler in the later games, once EV Training was a thing.

>Throw a Macho Brace/Power Item on
>Vs. Seeker ready
>grind this one trainer endlessly to easily keep track of your EVs

>> No.4492340

>>4491606
The worst part about Koga's Gym is that Gen I has the most poison type pokemon of all generations, it's the most common type out of all the types. With Brock and Sabrina (and Giovanni since that was more of a final Rocket base than a Gym) it was kind of understandable, but for Koga? Nah, fuck that.

>> No.4492461

>>4491370
He is the guy with 6 magikarps on the path from pallet town to cinnabar island

>> No.4492562

>>4491961
>gen 2

>> No.4493004

>>4492114
> But in that case, why doesn't some random trainer from one of the very nearby high-level areas just wander into Pewter City and dethrone Brock?
Because the gym leader is chosen by the pokemon league. Trainers have defeated Brock and gotten the boulder badge, but that's not how you become the new leader of the gym. That's just how you earn the badge.

As for your idea, do you think wild pokemon are handicapping themselves too? Near Pallet Town, you have level 2-3 pidgeys and rattatas. Near Fuschia City, you have level 25+ fearows and raticates. Do you think it makes more sense that all the higher-leveled pokemon are watching your progress and waiting for you to be strong enough to battle and catch them, or that pokemon in different areas have different power levels, and for practical video game design reasons your journey happens to start in a low level zone and continue in a way where you're entering more dangerous areas at a safe pace?

>> No.4493025

>>4491363
Is that one of the motherfuckers that is always calling?

>> No.4493104

>>4491553
>Bugsy, the bug Pokemon gym leader
>he only has three Pokemon
>including a fucking Metapod and Kakuna

>> No.4493110

>>4491363
stop making threads on vr and stop talking like an imbecile

>> No.4493709

>>4493025

Lmfao! Good one!

>> No.4493824

>>4492067
Well I don't see any pokemon champions from anywhere else, so yep!

>> No.4493825

>>4492114
You're getting really aspergers about what is essentially your own fan theory because someone doesn't agree.

>> No.4493896

>>4491398
Well, most Pokémon games have a guy with six karps. Outside of that, yeah, it's disappointing.

>> No.4493907

>>4493896
Ah, I didn't know it was a common thing. I played gen 1 the most, and played through Gold once, so I don't really know much about gen 2 onward.

>> No.4495063
File: 25 KB, 297x336, 1390022148686.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4495063

>>4492340
In Koga's defense, a lot of Poison-types were paired with secondary typings that grabbed the attention of other gym leaders.
>Bulbasaur line, Bellsprout line, and Oddish line for Erika's gym
>Venomoth was taken by Sabrina for some reason
>Nidoqueen/Nidoking reserved for Giovanni
>Agatha has the monopoly on the Gastly line
>they probably didn't want to give him Tentacruel because of Misty
The lack of Golbat was inexcusable though. Even Beedrill would've been a nice addition.

>> No.4495461

>>4491565
Didn't Black and White 2 specifically say that gym leaders only use a certain number of pokemon based on the number of badges the challenger has?

>> No.4495483
File: 63 KB, 250x323, 1512043654707.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4495483

>>4491847
Kek

>> No.4495494

>>4495461
Don't know, never played a pokemon game after Crystal. Obviously the gen 1 and 2 games are too rudimentary to actually react to the player's status like that, but it's still as good an explanation for the progression of gym leaders as anything else.

>> No.4495497

>>4495494
Not really, the game would just need to check how many badges you have before a Gym battle. Basically level scaling in other RPGs, but with the entire encounter.

>> No.4495502
File: 150 KB, 624x616, 025-624x616.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4495502

>>4491398
I keep wishing for a harder Pokemon game but they keep getting easier, the closest I'll ever get is ROM hacks.

>> No.4495504

>>4495497
The thing is, if they did this them and their teams would be a lot less memorable.

>> No.4495506

>>4495504
Howso? They'd still have a signature Pokemon and a couple other consistent ones, they'd just have other Pokemon in them as well, depending on when you battled them.

>> No.4495508

>>4495504
This, and it doesn't really make sense to have 'X' amount of Pokemon just because of badges. Leveling makes more sense, that's the reason your Pokemon don't listen to you if you don't have enough badges. So if you have 2 badges then gym leader won't go above whatever level 2 badges is.

>> No.4495527

>>4495497
There is no mechanism to change an NPCs team dynamically like that. "Trainers" like your rival or jesse and james in yellow version are actually a separate trainer every time you fight them. They would have had to program in 8 different versions of every gym leader's team, and these games already barely fit on a cartridge. I'm sure somebody will shoot back at me with a technical argument about how it could be done simply, but I would just point out that enforcing linearity (you have to fight Brock first) basically eliminates the need for a dynamic system in a much easier way that also won't produce new bugs.

>> No.4495530

>>4495527
>There is no mechanism to change an NPCs team dynamically like that.
Because they didn't make one. Duh.

>> No.4495537

>>4495530
I don't know how the AI works, but I wonder if changing gym leader's teams would make their AIs perform incorrectly.

>> No.4495539

>>4495537
The AI in RBY was literally a roulette. There was no AI.

>> No.4495593

>>4495539
No, I'm certain it has some rules at the very least. For instance there is a bug you can exploit in which the AI will always try to use a move with super-effective type advantage over your pokemon, even if the move doesn't deal damage.

>> No.4495595

>>4495593
And how would that change if there were multiple teams?

>> No.4495616
File: 3 KB, 159x144, Move_AI_flaw[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4495616

>>4495595
It wouldn't, what are you talking about? I'm just saying the AI isn't "literally roulette," pic related.

>> No.4495640

>>4495616

Not him, but isn't that roulette in your pic? The Dragonair is picking a move at random and is easily picking the wrong one.

>> No.4495642

>>4495640
It's using a psychic move on a poison type pokemon even though the psychic move does no damage

>> No.4495650

>>4495497
There's a hack that levelscales. You can start your journey in any city, with different starters.
Yes, even the island.

>> No.4495654

>>4495508
>Leveling makes more sense, that's the reason your Pokemon don't listen to you if you don't have enough badges
Isn't that just for traded pokemon?

>> No.4495656

>>4495650
gib

>> No.4495661

>>4495654
>Isn't that just for traded pokemon?
It is, but for some reason, a lot of NPCs imply that it applies to all of them, and not just Pokemon you got from trades.

>> No.4495668

>>4495661
Are you an NPC? Because you were implying the same thing they do.

>> No.4495672

>>4495595
That particular rule wouldn't matter, but different gym leaders use different AIs, see:
http://wiki.pokemonspeedruns.com/index.php/Pok%C3%A9mon_Red/Blue/Yellow_Trainer_AI
If, for example, you wanted to fight Brock last and you wanted him to have 6 pokemon, he would never switch out since that isn't part of his AI rules. The AIs for later gym leaders and elite four trainers give them different abilities that are appropriate for the point in the game where they appear.

>> No.4495674

>>4495668
I'm not >>4495508, I should have clarified.

>> No.4495706

>>4495672
interesting

> The fact that the above preferences apply only to exactly the second turn is presumed to be an off-by-one error, being intended to apply only to exactly the first turn.
just

>> No.4495969

>>4495502
Ye but the Hardversions of Blue and Red were really crappy imo.
Enemymonster always a bit higher than your mainpokemon.
I stuck at Alakazam i think. They also disabled cinnabar trick.

>> No.4496002

>>4491553
Well, remember that the gym leaders are the fucking strongest of their type, so using their actual mons they would steamroll you, so they just use their actual pets for the noobs.
Also, couldn't you rematch the gym leaders in later games where they had full teams and evolved mons and such?

>> No.4496412

>>4496002
>couldn't you rematch the gym leaders in later games
NOT RETRO

>> No.4496509
File: 33 KB, 111x192, 1460303182816.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4496509

>>4496412
And? Discussing it within the context of the entire series is acceptable.

>> No.4496731

>>4491607
I swear there’s a bug catcher guy with a pretty full team

>> No.4496757

>>4495640
>>4495642
To clarify, Dragonair is stuck in a loop and will CONTINUE to use Agility in a vain attempt to kill Golbat, just because Agility has the Psychic typing. The game only checks that the move would theoretically be super-effective if it were a damaging move.

Inversely, if it were something like Psybeam, the Dragonair would never stop using it until Golbat switched out or died.

>> No.4496759

>>4496757
*Zubat, not Golbat. My bad.