Goldeneye 007

File: 895 KB, 1196x827, GoldenEye_007_cover.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Goldeneye 007 Anonymous Sat Dec 16 16:12:10 2017 No.4464838 [Reply] [Original]

Would it have been better on PlayStation or PC instead of N64?

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 16:15:11 2017 No.4464843 It could only have been on the N64. 4 player local multiplayer was what it was all about.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 16:28:35 2017 No.4464868 >>4464838 No, game is overrated as fuck. PC already had vastly superior shooters by the time this came out, only normies lifted this game up to success like it did.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 16:52:29 2017 No.4464925 >>4464838 It would have sucked on the ps1.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 16:55:07 2017 No.4464932 >>4464843 This A very generic (albeit licensed) spy FPS on PC would have been forgotten about within 6 months.

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 16:55:39 2017 No.4464935

>>4464838
Unless they completely redesigned the shooting to make the levels not tiny tubes. Than redesigned the ai to take be able to combat a player with better aim, better turning, and better view distance. Than all the that a PC port would do is give you slightly better graphics.

It woulds till be a turd compared Half-Life and Unreal. Fuck even if they improved the horrible mechanics, level design, ai and controls the game would still be incredibly fucking ugly.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 17:24:04 2017 No.4464994 Psx could not run it. PC already had fps

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 17:27:29 2017 No.4465005 why does this place hate so much this game

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 17:28:31 2017 No.4465006 >>4465005 Bitter kids whose parents didn't buy them an N64.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 17:41:02 2017 No.4465028 >>4464838 No, the N64 was made for FPSs, too bad Nintendo dropped the ball after that. PC FPS were doing different things so it wouldn't have been better, it would've been another Quake clone.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 17:41:55 2017 No.4465030 >>4465006 >buy them an N64 I'd be bitter with only 20 games, too.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 17:53:33 2017 No.4465048 >>4465030 steam wasn't invented then, most kids would be lucky to have 20 games

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 19:19:30 2017 No.4465171 >>4464838 it really would have only been made on the 64

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 20:08:04 2017 No.4465249

>>4464868
>PC already had vastly superior shooters by the time this came out

My mom was (and still is) a bitch, and she didn't allow me to play M rated titles.

GoldenEye was like the only shooter I could play, and we only had one PC at the time.

On a slightly unrelated note, I was getting carded at video game shops when I bought M rated titles until I turned like 25. It's why I switched to buying through amazon and ebay.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 20:08:13 2017 No.4465251 >>4464838 Playstation? Fuck no. And PC already had other FPS games so what would be the point

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 20:12:42 2017 No.4465263

Most games at that time would be better on PC than on consoles, I'm not even being a faggot "le master race xD", we had plenty of way superior PC versions at that time from lots of titles, Goldeneye could have been benefitted from mouse controls, higher resolution, better framerate, online gameplay, mods etc

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 20:20:22 2017 No.4465285 >>4464932 Not with mods. Could have been another Half-Life

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 20:40:58 2017 No.4465342 PSX would have been dog shit. PC would been fine for long term mod support that you see games like Doom, Quake, and Duke hav >>4465263 At the time apparently was perfect for Golden Eye. Couch coop used to be a big selling point back then.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 20:42:33 2017 No.4465351 >>4465285 Then why wasn’t literally every other PC FPS another Half-Life?

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:03:34 2017 No.4465398

>>4465351
You know that more games than just Half life had mods, right? I remember modding Tiberian Sun way back then since I played RTS's and not FPS. Most games had some modding scene, even if they didn't monetize it like Valve did or was on the scale as Half Life.

Ironically PCs also have tremendously helped with the console game romhacking scene. Emulators and romhackers are why we have SD3 in english.

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:05:43 2017 No.4465403

>>4465351
They were, half life came out in very late 1998, basically 1999, and by the early 2000s, heavily scripted halflife clones were starting to blight gaming.

>>4465263
Have you ever played a multiplayer first person shooter on a dial up modem? 4 player goldeneye is much better.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:17:05 2017 No.4465421 >>4465403 Why are you comparing it dial up? Why not compare it to LAN?

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:20:13 2017 No.4465427 >>4465421 Because I didn't any LAN gaming when Goldeneye was the hot thing, but I was doing lots of online gaming with shooters like Jedi Knight.

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:34:08 2017 No.4465449

>>4465403
Yes, I played Quake extensively this way. It was fucking awesome. Then I went back to DOOM and played that over tcp/ip as well and it was equally awesome.
Are you trying to imply that multiplayer goldeneye is less laggy or something? If so, I would remind you that the framerate of GoldenEye frequently drops into single digits, especially in multiplayer when an explosion occurs.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:36:39 2017 No.4465451 >>4464838 Playstation can have multitap but it cannot do insane draw distance due to the need to subdivide the shit out of everything

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:38:52 2017 No.4465453 >>4464838 I still see it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:40:09 2017 No.4465457 >>4464838 It would have aged far better and prolly still be a living franchise if it had a PC release within 3-4 years. Also Im sad they didn't let Jimmy get in smash bros

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:46:00 2017 No.4465470

>>4465449
Issue wasn't the framerate on PC, it was latency. Before broadband internet, it was severe. I played it anyway, because it was better than not playing, but there was all sorts of bullshit revolving around it. Not a shooter, but in Age of Empires, which was out around the same time, the guy with the fastest internet connection actually got a headstart to building his base.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:48:00 2017 No.4465474 I'd add that I'm not shilling for Goldeneye, it probably doesn't even make my top 10 shooters. But the idea that there were tons of better shooters out on PC in 1997 isn't true. There were a handful.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:51:28 2017 No.4465480 >>4465457 That would have been a copyright nightmare. Not to mention likeness issues, cuz I doubt Brosnan would agree to it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:52:16 2017 No.4465482 >>4465480 They could have just made an amalgamation Bond, like they did in the PS2 one.

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:56:21 2017 No.4465491

>>4464838
Not at all on PS1, I don't know anything about technical differences. It let's say the game played the same way exactly it still wouldn't have had as accessible 4player functionality which was a big deal.

It might have benefited from a PC release but as others have said there were better FPS games on pc at the time so this would have been largely overlooked.

It was a hit because of the console it came out on.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 21:58:50 2017 No.4465496 >>4465482 I always thought there was some contractual thing which meant that whoever was Bond at the time in the movies was also Bond in the games. But yeah Agent Under Fire does call that into question.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 22:06:38 2017 No.4465508 >>4465249 >My mom was (and still is) a bitch, and she didn't allow me to play M rated titles. owtheedge.jpg

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 22:33:07 2017 No.4465565

>>4464843
No one wanted to play this 4 player. Well my friends didnt as the controls where shit and you needed to spend a week to learn them. My brothers where fun to play with as they had time to practice.

Pc would have been better obviously.

Ps1 still had pretty none intuitive controls at the time too.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 22:37:15 2017 No.4465572 >>4465427 But other people did which is why Golden Eye is regarded as inferior to PC shooters.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 22:45:07 2017 No.4465586 >>4465005 It was popular/reviewed well despite being technically inferior to PC shooters and /Vr/ won't stand for it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 22:51:58 2017 No.4465604 >>4465586 How dare they care about standards of quality! Next thing you'll be saying we shouldn't be upset when people attempt historical revisionism about what gaming was like.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 22:56:56 2017 No.4465610 >>4465006 This.

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 22:57:53 2017 No.4465612

>>4465604
Claiming that Goldeneye wasn't wildly popular and enjoyed by most is actual historical revisionism. It is the PC gaming secret club in damage control mode trying to obscure the fact that more people were enjoying first person shooters on their nintendo.

Anonymous Sat Dec 16 23:02:26 2017 No.4465620

>>4465572
Some did. I didn't have my own computer that I could just take around with me in 1998, so I didn't LAN until the early 2000s. But when I did, it was a great experience. And guess what? Playing Time Splitters 2 or James Bond on the PS2 was just as good of a time.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 16 23:27:47 2017 No.4465649 >>4465006 That explains a lot N64 is tons of fun T. Didnt have an N64 until 2016 and was jealous of friends that had one back in the day

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 01:52:40 2017 No.4465875 >>4464868 >PC already had vastly superior shooters by the time this came out Such as?

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 02:32:49 2017 No.4465909 >>4465006 >>4465005 /vr/ is full of resentful sony-negros, sega edgelords and hardcore doom etilists that only play with mouse and won't accept something different even for the time. The game is great and this thread is dumb as fuck.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 03:01:22 2017 No.4465943 >>4465572 Every console shooter is inferior to pc shooters. Its remembered because its a decent spy game with a kickass soundtrack.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 03:09:57 2017 No.4465948

>>4465943
No One Lives Forever and Perfect Dark were massively massively better spy shooters, you can say that Golden Eye influenced them but they still surpassed it by leaps and bonds.

Golden Eye is remembered because it was a console game. For many people it was the best multiplayer experience they could get without a PC. It was also on a console that itself had very few games so everyone fucking played it. If you didn't own it one of your friends probably did.

I'll give you the soundtrack

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 03:12:25 2017 No.4465950

>>4465006

It's the opposite.

My dad got us an N64 and Goldeneye, it was the only time he would spend time with his sons cause he worked so much.

Yeah they're good memories but it's not like I pretend the game itself is any good. It's a dumb as fuck shooter that had four player around one TV.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 03:12:42 2017 No.4465951 >>4464838 A better question to ask is would it have been possible on Playstation. No it would not have. PC yeah of course it was possible. It would have been way better on PC.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 03:15:48 2017 No.4465956

>>4465951
The playstation would have had to have load times. This means multiplayer would have been impossible. It would also disrupt the pacing of missions as they would need to stick loading screens in areas, this would be magnfied every time the player died as he would need to walk through the loading screens all over again.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 03:17:57 2017 No.4465958

>>4465956

PSX gamers were fine with loading times, though.

I don't see how it'd affect multiplayer outside of the initial load, though it'd limit the size of the levels and number of weapons on each.

I think it'd just be the fact that the system was weaker and isn't capable of four player out of the box.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 03:23:06 2017 No.4465965

>>4465958
The system was weaker than N64 meaning the game as we know it would be way too watered down. Some of its campaign levels are way too big for PS1 as well. It is simply fantasy to think Goldeneye could have worked for Playstation. It would be far different if it were made for Playstation in mind. Just like how Square's Final Fantasy games couldn't fit on N64. Both consoles were too different to each other.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 05:23:44 2017 No.4466072 >>4464838 Not a single N64 game would have been better if it had been on PSX instead. Or well, maybe a few simple ones that could have benefited from CD audio with few trade-offs elsewhere.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 06:28:11 2017 No.4466126 >>4465612 This, we're reaching "Sonic was never good" levels of fake news ITT.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 06:31:38 2017 No.4466129 >>4465958 >the system was weaker and isn't capable of four player out of the box Also don't forget the original PS1 controllers with no analog sticks.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 07:40:27 2017 No.4466182 >>4465398 you should answer his question instead of evading it >>4465285 yeah just like nolf 1 and 2 were, nah they were largely forgotten like the mediocre shooters they were.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 09:37:13 2017 No.4466298

>>4464932
>A very generic (albeit licensed) spy FPS
>generic
You know Goldeneye was the first (popular) non-Doom clone FPS right?

>>4464935
>Unless they completely redesigned the shooting to make the levels not tiny tube
Name an FPS released in 1997 that has more ‘open’ levels than Goldeneye’s Surface.

>It woulds till be a turd compared Half-Life and Unreal.
Games that were released the following year. Rumor even has it that Goldeneye was the reason Half-Life received a 12 months delay in release, cause Gabe panicked when he saw it.

>>4465948
>No One Lives Forever and Perfect Dark were massively massively better spy shooters
I’d hope so since they were both released 3 years later. But it’s not really true. Perfect Dark improved the multi undeniability, but the single player lacks the tight level design of Goldeneye. NOLF had much better presentation, but the gameplay has always been fairly unremarkable which is why it’s only a minor classic.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:15:27 2017 No.4466347 goldeneye was the halo of the gen 3, it took something that was done better on PC and casualized as shit and ran poorly but console players thought it was amazing since they don't know any better

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:25:20 2017 No.4466354

>>4466347
>it took something that was done better on PC
Which spy FPSs could I buy on PC in 1997 cause I must have missed them?

>casualized as shit
You mean the game that doesn't even have fucking health packs?

>ran poorly
Most new PC games ran poorly at that time unless you had top-tier gear installed. The upgrade cycle was ridiculously brutal. Even Voodoo 2 made Voodoo 1 obsolete overnight, and that's for people that actually had an accelerator.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:28:31 2017 No.4466360 >>4466347 Technically it is gen 5. >The fifth-generation era (also known as the 32-bit era, the 64-bit era and the 3D era) refers to computer and video games, video game consoles and video game handhelds from approximately 1993 to 2001.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:31:22 2017 No.4466363 >>4466354 lol at this nub who wasn't running half life or quake on software also nice trying to aim and move at the same time

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:35:35 2017 No.4466367 >>4466363 >also nice trying to aim and move at the same time >what is 1.2 Solitaire

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:37:45 2017 No.4466370 File: 90 KB, 666x408, quake bench.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4466363 >quake on software Really gets the ol' noggin accelerating

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:39:03 2017 No.4466372 better fps of the time: quake, quake 2, unreal tournament, quake 3, half life, doom, duke nukem, blood

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:42:43 2017 No.4466378 >>4466372 half of those weren’t even out at the time

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:47:59 2017 No.4466385 >>4466370 sorry what fps does goldeneye run at again?

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 10:49:59 2017 No.4466386 >>4466385 Around 20 FPS at a higher resolution + sound and better graphics.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:14:18 2017 No.4466417 quake 2 came out shortly after also goldeneye's resolution was also 320

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:16:05 2017 No.4466424 >>4466417 by 240

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:21:10 2017 No.4466436 >>4466424 220 https://tcrf.net/GoldenEye_007_(Nintendo_64) an entry level pc in 1997 would have run quake a lot better than an n64 did golden eye

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:25:39 2017 No.4466441 >>4466372 Pleb as fuck list, including games that weren't even out for a year+ later. Goldeneye is so sophisticated compared to Quake 1 it isn't even funny. Actual games better than Goldeneye at the time: Doom, Jedi Knight, and Duke.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:37:24 2017 No.4466458

>>4466436
Still more than Quake in that benchmark. Also the PAL version runs at 320x270 (no borders), with no significant difference in framerate since they both run under 25 on average anyway.

An entry level PC in 1997 would have cost ~8x more than an N64. And while it would have run a little better, its software mode technology is still far behind real 3D acceleration. Barely any draw distance, no filtering, imperfect perspective correction, no anti-aliasing, no depth of field effects, low color depth, etc.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:40:25 2017 No.4466459 >>4466458 Don't shit on software rendering. Quake is an inherently ugly as sin game.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:45:07 2017 No.4466470

>>4466459
Not shitting on it, just saying it’s lower horsepower tech.

desu Goldeneye’s engine wasn’t nearly as efficiently programmed as Quake. Goldeneye was coded by a team who never made a game before, while Quake was coded by John Carmack. He probably could have got GE007 to run at a stable 30 FPS on N64 if he wrote the engine

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 11:55:10 2017 No.4466485

>>4466470
Quake's engine is great. And yeah, I remember playing it at acceptable framerates on a 90 mhz laptop (actually that's the only way I played it since I pirated it from a friend to that PC). That laptop didn't have the RAM to play Fallout for shit (took 10 minutes to load a level) and wouldn't even display Diablo. But Quake ran just fine.

But in terms of graphics, it is ugly as sin. Just a pixelated, brown mess. Whereas (much later game I know) Unreal looks beautiful in software rendered mode.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 16:05:18 2017 No.4467073

>>4466298
>Name an FPS released in 1997 that has more ‘open’ levels than Goldeneye’s Surface.

Surface was basically empty space until you get to a tiny little combat arena. It was a lousy level. It really demonstrated why Golden Eye could only work with tiny little tubes which is what the vast majority of their levels were. They were not even particularly open tubes because the view distance sucked (that's also why Surface sucked).

Fucking Duke Nukem 3D had more open levels LOL

>Rumor even has it that Goldeneye was the reason Half-Life received a 12 months delay in release, cause Gabe panicked when he saw it.

LOL Where do you get this garbage?

>But it’s not really true. Perfect Dark improved the multi undeniability, but the single player lacks the tight level design of Goldeneye

Golden Eye level design is to just stick guards in fucking tubes and randomly place widgets that require you to pull out a gadget and press the interact button near it. The game had atroscious level design. As well as horrible shooting. The only thing I can think of that it did well was the guard reactions. It's fine by console standards which is why it was a hit.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 16:10:08 2017 No.4467094 >>4467073 Have you played Goldeneye? Cause your post doesn't seem to indicate you've played it. You're just making shit up.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 16:14:29 2017 No.4467113 >>4465909 Thank god Doom has it's own general

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 16:18:05 2017 No.4467121 >>4466129 Don't worry man, PSX supports system-link (yes, really). You could plug in 2 Playstations to 2 TVs and the combined power might be enough to handle 4 player Goldeneye.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 19:11:18 2017 No.4467458

>>4466298
>Rumor even has it that Goldeneye was the reason Half-Life received a 12 months delay in release, cause Gabe panicked when he saw it.
This is quite plausible, but do you have any references? It is a strange coincidence how Half-Life was scrapped and remade right after GoldenEye's final version was revealed.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 19:26:29 2017 No.4467497

>>4466363
1.2 Solitaire allows aiming and moving. Half-Life wasn't out til' a year later, and nicked a fair few things from Goldeneye 007.

Quake is great and what it did for Online Multi is undeniable, as well as its engine. But it's a fucking boring game with no personality, DOOM is the king of FPS and will remain towering over Quake.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 19:40:26 2017 No.4467543 >>4465909 I play doom and goldeneye fuck, I played the goldeneye doom mod

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 19:43:16 2017 No.4467552 >>4464932 Goldeneye's campaign still hasn't been topped.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 19:43:59 2017 No.4467553 >>4467552 not retro but Timesplitters 2 deserves a shout

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 21:47:40 2017 No.4467785 >>4467497 Aiming while moving on Golden Eye still fucking sucked. Worst than any PC game that supported aiming (which if you count mods was probabaly all of them)

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 17 22:11:56 2017 No.4467825 >>4466182 >you should answer his question instead of evading it I did answer his question. The answer is yes, every game was a half life since every game had a modding scene

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 22:16:05 2017 No.4467828

>>4464838
Real answer here.

PSX graphics were just garbage and would've been a jumbled, crooked mess especially with 4 player multiplayer. Just take a look at Medal of Honor and you'll see what I mean. Part of what made this game so successful is that it looked better than any other game out at the moment.

If it were to come out on PC, it still wouldn't have played like it did with mouse and keyboard. The way Rare made controllers usable for a FPS game was a huge accomplishment in itself.

Anonymous Sun Dec 17 22:18:01 2017 No.4467832

>>4467828
Continuing

There are goldeneye mods out right now that you can play on PC, but again it still misses that "magic" that only could be had playing on N64 back in the days sitting in front of a TV with a group of 6 friends playing 4-player multiplayer all night while taking turns and eating cheetos.

Anonymous Mon Dec 18 00:38:25 2017 No.4468031

>>4467458
I remember reading it as supposed inside info on a user group way back. Basically Gabe desperately wanted HL to be the next big step in FPS design, but cause Goldeneye shook shit up so much he realized that the then version of HL didn’t go far enough so he had it redesigned.

Anonymous Mon Dec 18 00:47:40 2017 No.4468058

>>4468031
Well it sounds like hot air. Half Life wasn't a console game so Gabe wouldn't care if it was a big success on the n64. Half-life was a PC game and wouldn't be on any console that gen. So they weren't competing over the same audience. The PC crowd didn't take much interest in Golden Eye anyway.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 00:53:01 2017 No.4468068 >>4468058 I think it’s more of the fact that Goldeneye was selling like crazy, so it was proof to Gabe that you could almost entirely abandon Doom-like game structure and still make good dosh. He wasn’t actually trying to compete with the game.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 01:00:16 2017 No.4468079 >>4465285 Half-life was great on its own and had a great engine that allowed for many creative mods to be made. Goldeneye is not like that.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 01:16:51 2017 No.4468109 >>4468068 That makes more sense.

Anonymous Mon Dec 18 01:39:44 2017 No.4468135

>>4466354
>You mean the game that doesn't even have fucking health packs?
You shouldn't need them. Enemies take 5 seconds to complete their dramatic "I'm going to begin shooting you now" animation and your gun aims directly at their chest automatically if they're within 60% of the center screen space.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 01:44:35 2017 No.4468142 >>4468135 t. agent player

Anonymous Mon Dec 18 01:48:32 2017 No.4468147

>>4464838
Why would it be better on the PS1? Its main flaw, shitty console controls, would still be present.
Also people are saying it'd be forgotten if it was released on the PC, but I disagree. It was an early objectives FPS (as opposed to switch/key hunts like Doom and Quake) and would be remembered for that.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 01:58:27 2017 No.4468165 File: 195 KB, 888x556, ge_difficulty.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4468135 Why does literally everybody that shits on Goldeneye always blatantly reveal that they played the game on Easy?

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 02:10:42 2017 No.4468195 >>4468165 The guards suck on 00 agent too. It's there to offset the atroscious aiming. Apart from that the extra objectives were fucking annoying. It's almost at the level of WoW quests with how fucking shitty they are.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 02:12:50 2017 No.4468197 File: 287 KB, 499x495, 151153728511.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4468195 >It's almost at the level of WoW quests with how fucking shitty they are. holy shit I really hope this is a mustard parody

Anonymous Mon Dec 18 09:22:24 2017 No.4468661

>>4468165
>>4468142
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyNvBhC6bK4
Those look like quick reaction times to you?

Look at :58. The guy has enough time to walk past the guard, hit the gate button, and turn around to shoot the guard before the guard has even faced his direction, let alone raised its gun to shoot. Every other guard he kills as he turns a corner and they rarely even manage to target him. If he goes down a hallway where a guard will inevitably see, you don't see gunfire until seconds down the pathway.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 18 09:24:38 2017 No.4468667 >>4464838 On ps1? No, the controller was awful for fps games. On pc? Definitely.

Anonymous Mon Dec 18 09:36:12 2017 No.4468678

>>4468661
The guards do react fairly quickly on 00 Agent. What's happening there is that in Goldeneye guards commit to their attacks - once they shoot a burst in a particular direction they don't self-cancel out of it until the next burst. It's a great system because the game doesn't suffer from hitscan bullshit, meaning when you get surrounded by guards it's not a damage penalty but one of gunfire spatial coverage, meaning you're just way more likely to get hit.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 01:53:27 2017 No.4470492

>>4468678
I love how movie-like this results the action in being. You're rewarded for firing at the enemy before they do, running past the area guards to new cover while they spray bullets etc. and won't get hit unless you actually screw up somewhere.

It's one of those things that rarely feels right in most PC shooters in comparison, everyone feels like bags of meat firing into each other.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 02:58:31 2017 No.4470567 >>4466298 >First popular non-doomclone fps Quake wasn't a Doom clone and came out a year prior.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 03:20:32 2017 No.4470595 Quake was well above the level of N64 FPSes, sure, but I don't think it's a fair comparison to pit a $200 console against a >$2000 PC.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 03:25:32 2017 No.4470607

>>4470595
>but I don't think it's a fair comparison to pit a $200 console against a >$2000 PC.

Than let's not compare the N64 to the fucking atari and say that Ocarina of Time is better than Frogger. Fucking idiot. A better game is a better game. Period, end of story.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 03:37:27 2017 No.4470619 >>4470607 >Than let's not compare the N64 to the fucking atari and say that Ocarina of Time is better than Frogger They're total apples & oranges

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 03:41:46 2017 No.4470621 >>4470567 >Quake wasn't a Doom clone LMAO

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 03:44:29 2017 No.4470626

>>4470619
Yeah. Let's not compare anything dude. After all we might end up with the conclusion one was better than the other.....like you argueign that quake shouldn't be compared to golden eye (probably because it's obvious that Quake was the better game and GE was at best an early prototype for ideas that would be handled way better by other games that quickly succeeded it)

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 03:56:06 2017 No.4470639 >>4470626 Guess that’s why everybody forgot about Goldeneye the moment Quake 64 came out. Oh wait...

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 04:01:02 2017 No.4470645 >>4470639 I can't possible imagine quake being fun with a fucking n64 controller. Very few people with a PC even cared Golden Eye existed. While the n64 playeres were impressed by many things because their system had so few games.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 04:03:05 2017 No.4470648
File: 112 KB, 666x275, thief_goldeneye.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>4470645
>I can't possible imagine quake being fun with a fucking n64 controller.
Yep, so as usual, your argument just boils down to well worn mustard.

>Very few people with a PC even cared Golden Eye existed.
Pic related

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 04:09:01 2017 No.4470656

>>4470648
Like I said. At best Golden Eye was a proto-type. A weak game with some nice concepted that were handled much better later on. Ok the objective thing was kind of cool. But it wasn't done very well and it wasn't worth puttign up molasses slow movement speed, aiming with the fucking c-buttons and ugly graphics....unless you only had a n64 than you took what you could get.

The average PC player had half-life and Tomb Raider at almost the same time. And even before than they had quake or Duke 3D which were better than Golden Eye at nearly every single aspect. Hell he did the whole 'open ended first person 3D enviroment' in System Shock and Ultima underworld years before Golden Eye.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 04:17:50 2017 No.4470668

>>4470645
>Very few people with a PC even cared Golden Eye existed.
Pretty much the entire gaming industry on PC was obsessed with the game. Why do you think System Shock 2 has the exact same weapon reloading system?

>>4470656
>But it wasn't done very well and it wasn't worth puttign up molasses slow movement speed, aiming with the fucking c-buttons and ugly graphics....unless you only had a n64 than you took what you could get.
Name a single James Bond FPS with fast movement speed. They're spy games. You're supposed to move quite slowly. Also, why would you aim with the C-buttons and not the analogue stick?

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 04:29:35 2017 No.4470679

>>4470668
>Also, why would you aim with the C-buttons and not the analogue stick?
Do you think the stick is good?

>Name a single James Bond FPS with fast movement speed. They're spy games. You're supposed to move quite slowly.

It felt like crap, there's good slow and there's bad slow. Golden Eye has terribly programmed movement. Just to give you an idea. If you move on the X axis that applies speed, if you move on the Y axis that also applies speed. If you move on both X and Y Axis you get the speed from both. The result was that you mvoe literally twice as fast while moving diagonally encouraging stupid zigzaggy movement that is anyhting but spy-like.

This is a lousy ameturish mistake, PC games much older learned not to make this basic mistake. It's a fucking beginner mistake.

>Pretty much the entire gaming industry on PC was obsessed with the game.
LOL Every person I talked to thought nothing of it. Seriously why the hell would the game be interesting to you if you played PC games? You played FPS with better exploring in Duke 3D, System Shock and even Tomb Raider and Ultima Underworld (granted those were not FPS). Every FPS on your console has better shooting and most had better graphics. Every FPS you ever owned with multiplayer shit on Golden Eye's multiplayer. And unless it's the fucking year Golden Eye is released you also played half-life. Why the hell would they care about Golden Eye?

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 04:44:12 2017 No.4470703

>>4470679
>Just to give you an idea. If you move on the X axis that applies speed, if you move on the Y axis that also applies speed. If you move on both X and Y Axis you get the speed from both. The result was that you mvoe literally twice as fast while moving diagonally encouraging stupid zigzaggy movement that is anyhting but spy-like.
This was kind of intentional, particularly in Perfect Dark's heavily overhauled engine, since it was useful for speedrunning. When Perfect Dark was remade for Xbox 360, the team were careful to preserve that quirk.
>Do you think the stick is good?
It's serviceable.
>LOL Every person I talked to thought nothing of it. Seriously why the hell would the game be interesting to you if you played PC games?
Because there was literally nothing like it on PC at the time. It says more about the people you talked to than anything else.
>And unless it's the fucking year Golden Eye is released you also played half-life.
Half-Life has absolutely shit combat, though. Valve couldn't design good singleplayer combat if their lives depended on it.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 05:00:13 2017 No.4470721

>>4470703

>This was kind of intentional, particularly in Perfect Dark's heavily overhauled engine, since it was useful for speedrunning.
Either you made a very poorly constructed sentence or you are implying that they intionally made their movement system some unimersive zig-zagging (so much for it being a James Bond simulator) nonsense in order for the sake of autistic trannies . The possibility that they were just shitty programmers making a basic mistake is actually less detrimental than what you are proposing.

>It's serviceable.
AKA it was extremely good for consoles and fucking miserable for anyone used to the more satisfying mouse.

>Half-life
I would literally rather play the first 20% of Half-life than the entirity of Golden Eye. And yes the combat was better. Why? If for no other than reason than you could use a mouse. Every PC FPS past Wolf 3D shits on Golden Eye's combat. There's other reasons such as better enemy variety, more satisfying guns, but even without those things the shitty movement and aiming already makes the game drek. And of course very other aspect of Halflife is also better than Golden Eye.

The best thing you can say about Golden Eye was that it gave console players a fun FPS experience and it experimented with some mechanics (all poorly implemented and almost immediately upgraded by the new games that came out).

If you wanted to make a pitch N64 FPS being compared to PC gaming I'd go with Perfect Dark. The environments in that game were actually cool.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 07:21:34 2017 No.4470892

>>4470679
>Do you think the stick is good?

Kek, so the idiot reveals himself. You're actually judging the game based on Honey 1.1 controls.

> If for no other than reason than you could use a mouse.

This seems to be the whole basis for your argument. Even thought the game is designed around the player carefully picking their shots.

>experimented with some mechanics (all poorly implemented

There's barely anything much at all the properly integrates stealth with the ability to run and gun at will as well, let along anything like it at the time. It defined what 'realistic' shooters would play like for years to come.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 17:32:50 2017 No.4471691

>>4470892
I've seen this fucking routine played out a million times. The point is the n64 controller sticks. There is no aiming mode with it that isn't drastically inferior to mouse aiming. And even if you do use the mods which support mouse aiming now you are still left with a game that was designed around shit aiminng in how they placed the enemies, the ai they gave them, what the enemies are capable of doing, etc.

>This seems to be the whole basis for your argument
No it's the one part of the arguement you tunnel vision because every Golden Eye fag seems fucking programmed to say the only problem with their game is what control method they had. You tunnel vision on it so much you ignored that I bashed every other fucking aspect.

Let me bring this away from your autism and boil it down to this. It's the late 90s you're a PC gamer. Why the hell do you want to play Golden Eye rather than anything else you have? What would make it hold your attention for any great length of time?

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 18:05:42 2017 No.4471729 >>4464838 >>4464925 It would have sucked a fat penis on playstation. Would have absolutely huffed on the big one. Fuckin playstation sucked dick for shooters. Big cock.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 18:09:50 2017 No.4471735 >>4465565 >Ps1 still had pretty none intuitive controls at the time too. That's pretty harsh regarding how bad the N64 controls are

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 18:44:26 2017 No.4471769

>>4471691
>There is no aiming mode with it that isn't drastically inferior to mouse aiming.
Yes aiming is more difficult and you have to carefully pick your shots. You can hate this, but it doesn't result in bad gameplay at all. You still don't deny that you just used the default controls though, which is funny considering the game actually supports dual analog natively.

> you are still left with a game that was designed around shit aiming in how they placed the enemies, the AI they gave them, what the enemies are capable of doing

Yes, you're right about this, and I flat out don't consider this a flaw. The game is based around the idea that aiming is hard, shots have to be committed to and getting hit interrupts animations. The AI is balanced between being simple and predictable enough that you can reliably set up routes and assume guards will behave a certain way and chaotic enough that you have to account for contingencies.

Altering any of these things would change the game into something different (and not necessarily better) and would have to be redesigned, as you acknowledge.

>Why the hell do you want to play Golden Eye rather than anything else you have?

What's hilarious to me is that so many PC gamers will defend games with absolutely garbage gunplay like Half-Life 2 and yet act like Goldeneye/PD are somehow unplayable. The original Doom and Half-life have comparably great design, but there are barely any PC FPS like Ge with both stealth/satisfying light-gun-ish shooting (Deus Ex is much less solid here).

>What would make it hold your attention for any great length of time?

The fact that is has very solid, well constructed gameplay that has a high skill ceasing is satisfying to master. Do you deny this? Keep in mind that I'm largely talking about the single player, as opposed to couch multiplayer (which I'll happily admit is inferior to what the PC offered).

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 19:21:10 2017 No.4471815

>>4471769
I have no idea what controll I used. That was at least a decade ago and the last time I played was with a mouse.

>What's hilarious to me is that so many PC gamers will defend games with absolutely garbage gunplay like Half-Life 2 and yet act like Goldeneye/PD are somehow unplayable

Half Life 2 is divine though. It has a world that feels much more real than just about any other FPS and an increible imagative world at that. Not to mention it was absolutly incredible looking for the time. A great variety of enemies and a fun roster of guns with great variety (the only gun that sucks is the pistol). It also had the single most fun weapon ever made in an FPS the gravity gun which was so fun that to this day games still have physics toys.

>The fact that is has very solid, well constructed gameplay that has a high skill ceasing is satisfying to master. Do you deny this?

The level lay-out is good. They feel like actual locations and the objectives, despite being shitty (it basically boiled down to 'equip a gadget and press the interact button, or collect this widgit) helped make it feel like a place. The guards were amusing in their antics.

I maybe played half the levels before I got bored of it so I really don't care what the skill ceiling is because it couldn't hold my interest. The enviroments are fucking ugly which really means I didn't want to spend a lot of time in the world. The combat is way too samey. Guards are fucking dumb (this is a result of you having weak aiming) and they are really the only enemy (while your Duke 3D or quake had many types of enemies). This would be fine if the enemy was very smart and could surprise you. You also have weak gun variety, there's a few explosives and some hit-scans that differ in damage and fire speed. The scifi FPS had great shooting variety and later 'realistic' FPS would compensate for the weak firing variety by having recoil which made shooting a lot more demanding.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 19:26:41 2017 No.4471825 >>4471815 HL 2 is just like Unreal. Sure, the world building is great and the setting is superb. But they are both rather boring games.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 19:38:07 2017 No.4471847

>>4471825
I'd consider HL2 and Unreal 2 of the top 5 best games ever made.

World is fucking huge in an FPS. It's probably the genre that gets the most mileage out of it (a platformer set in the Unreal world for instance would not have nearly the same impact). Both games also were technological power houses for their time and featured at least above average if not excellent combat.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 19:42:53 2017 No.4471859 >>4471825 >>4471847 WRONG, Unreal is great. HL2 isn't

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 19:49:34 2017 No.4471868

>>4471815
>Half Life 2 is divine though. It has a world that feels much more real than just about any other FPS and an increible imagative world at that. Not to mention it was absolutly incredible looking for the time. A great variety of enemies and a fun roster of guns with great variety (the only gun that sucks is the pistol). It also had the single most fun weapon ever made in an FPS the gravity gun which was so fun that to this day games still have physics toys.
Half-Life 2 has terrible gunplay and terrible bullet sponge enemies that don't respond to being shot.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 19:50:28 2017 No.4471869 >>4471868 Just like Unreal.

>>	Anonymous Tue Dec 19 19:53:25 2017 No.4471875 >>4471868 Do you mean the guard's covered from head to toe in armor? Use something other than the pistol or if you do use the pistol aim for the head.

Anonymous Tue Dec 19 22:17:25 2017 No.4472076

>>4470621
I get that it's (not) Doom. It was pretty much just Doom in essence. But it does play differently, it has different guns, it has different enemies and I'm not just saying in model difference only. It's a very different game, even if it is pretty much Doom in 3D.
Feel free to disagree, but Quake brought quite a bit to the table that Doom didn't at the time.

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 00:55:28 2017 No.4472317 >>4472076 >doom >collect keycards to get to the gate out of the level >quake >collect keys to get to the slipgate out of the level

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 00:58:26 2017 No.4472321 >>4472317 Quake puts less of an emphasis on exploring and focuses on fighting fewer tougher enemies. Quake 2 is even further in this direction.

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 01:10:41 2017 No.4472347 >>4472321 But you can see how it's clearly a DOOM clone. It's not literally the exact same game but it's clearly a clone with the same concept and quite similar gameplay.

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 12:37:45 2017 No.4473106 >>4468197 >Archive objectives: >Rescue Natalya >kill 30 guards and collect Mishkin's Beard >Mishkin's Beard - 10% drop rate (Mishkin - RARE SPAWN)

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 13:03:19 2017 No.4473164 >>4473106 Silo Collect X data Rescue Y scientists Plant Z bombs Find bad-man and bring me his briefcase Find the sateliate and activate the camera

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 14:53:28 2017 No.4473385

>>4472347
Sure, it's got some similarities, but Quake is pretty different. Sure, if you boil it down to guns and key cards to get through a level, it's the same, but the games play very differently.
But hey, y'know, it doesn't matter that I literally said "In essence, it's Doom" you're still just going to say that it's totally just a Doom clone, even though it's got quite a bit that separates it. Keep being pedantic, it doesn't change the fact that different gameplay denotes a different game.

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 14:58:37 2017 No.4473395 >>4472317 I don't remember being able to aim up or down or having mouselook in doom

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 15:29:35 2017 No.4473479

>>4473385
As I said, just because the two games don't share identical assets and engines doesn't mean it's not clearly modeled on the same template. One is more 3D, the other more 2D. As >>4473395 tries to make a point of, I disagree that the ability to look up and down makes for a large overall distinction. You make it seem like if you can tell which game you're playing, then they're significantly different. In fact, they're very similar.

You were right about Quake 2 being different, although that came out after Goldeneye.

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 19:48:26 2017 No.4473889 >>4471875 >Do you mean the guard's covered from head to toe in armor? Use something other than the pistol or if you do use the pistol aim for the head. HL2 enemies require multiple headshots to kill.

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 20:16:50 2017 No.4473932 >>4464935 >Than all the that a PC port would do is give you slightly better graphics. bro, mouse and keyboard controls alone would shoot this game into top 5 fps of all time, easy

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 20:20:22 2017 No.4473937 >>4473932 We've had mouse and keyboard controls for some time now. It breaks the fucking game, it's like cheating. The entire game would need to be reconctupualized if it were balanced around mouse and keyboard.

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 20:28:12 2017 No.4473951

>>4473937
what im saying is, if it were m+kb and redone around that, it would be goat.

also cheating wtf? if we gave mario 64 a decent c-stick camera that went fully 360 would that be cheating too? a needed improvement from future knowledge and experience would only add to the game. all youd have to "reconceptualize" is the ai aim.. which is simple as changing a couple values in the game code.

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 21:05:09 2017 No.4474018

>>4473951
Golden Eye guards do not move much, are almost never behind cover. They are made ridiculously easy to hit because you either used auto aim or a horrible analog to aim. With a mouse you can just shoot them in the head before they can do anything. You can literally headshot guards before they can even see you, and you don't even need to stop moving to do it.

I've played it with a mouse and keyboard. It breaks nearly all the challenge.

>all youd have to "reconceptualize" is the ai aim.. which is simple as changing a couple values in the game code.

Why don't you try Perfect Dark with mouse and keyboard. Set up a sim match against one of those ai that has near perfect accuracy. Than tell me how it works out.

The fucking levels themself where not designed for players or guards do have perfect accuracy. There's no cover anywhere and you have tons of hitscan weapons that have virtually no recoil and massive damage. There's almost no long-distance fire fights so the target is always easy to hit. It really just becomes about who gets the drop on who, which means when faced with a perfect or dark sim it's just about abusing exploiting it's path following.

Player/enemy movement is also not balanced around everyone having amazing accuracy. You move fucking slow, have no way to use cover, you have no defensive options because neither you are the ai were designed to face something that has very good accuracy.

"Just move them move faster you say" well now you have fast moving characters in levels designed for slow movement

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 21:12:03 2017 No.4474030 >>4474018 >>4473951 >blah blah blah words words spelling and grammar mistakes galore Man, fuck you both and play the remake then.

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 21:28:24 2017 No.4474070

>>4474018
>It breaks nearly all the challenge.
What challenge? the only time you're vulnerable is when you're reloading. Headshotting guards was never an issue when you could just hit "fire" until they fall down. Anyway my argument is that it would make the game more fun and accessible by giving the player more control, rather than keeping the players hands tied by garbage console fps controls.

>Player/enemy movement is also not balanced around everyone having amazing accuracy. You move fucking slow, have no way to use cover, you have no defensive options because neither you are the ai were designed to face something that has very good accuracy.

theres plenty of cover in goldeneye, except they fucking explode when shot at and damage you lol. it actively discourages using real tactics and would rather you just shoot till dead like doom. ehhhh man i love the games and have beat them countless times as is, I'm only making the case that a m+kb version and gameplay built around that would stand the test of time way better, in fact combined with the kickass missions, story, and music would have made it even more awesome than it was

>>4474030
>spelling and grammar
adults are speaking passionately here, nitpick elsewhere

>>	Anonymous Wed Dec 20 21:31:46 2017 No.4474078 >>4473951 >mario 64 camera Opinion discarded. M64 handles the camera better than any other 3d mario

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 21:37:07 2017 No.4474091

>>4474070
Why don't you just download it and see for yourself.

https://archive.org/details/1964-60FPS-Edition

Yes it's more fun with a mouse and keyboard but it really does make things cheesy. You can talk about what would happen if the game was designed from the start to run on the PC (aka if all the graphics, sound, level design, mechanics, and multiplayer were totally diffenent and Rare had a completly different staff, wasn't contractually bound to Nintendo, etc) but that just sounds like hypothetical question that leads nowhere. You're talking about a totally imaginary game made by an imaginary company.

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 21:46:01 2017 No.4474110
File: 27 KB, 400x300, carl-b.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>4474078
oh i love spending half the game lining up the shitty ass camera to make what should be a simple and intuitive jump and in the end theres a wall in the way that physically stops the camera >>4474091
I will try it. And I get it, I can't change what's already happened and I'm making up a totally hypothetical situation, so you win there, and I agree. Thank you for the link and for indulging me, perhaps I will come to see it your way, or perhaps not.

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 22:02:01 2017 No.4474138

>>4473164
As opposed to what which you would have the mission involve instead? You have to actually photograph the satellite, 'rescuing' the scientists simply involves not letting too many of them die, and the bomb planting causes the whole mission to be timed, meaning all the other tasks add difficulty by having to be done during the bombing.

I have no idea what you are complaining about.

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 22:09:29 2017 No.4474152

>>4464838
fucking a I wish it was on PC, I can't find a good control scheme for my controllers to work on n64 unless it uses the d-pad like Kirby Crystal Shards
used a gameshark to randomize enemies in a level, it crashed so often, one time I got a bunch of Jaws in the snow level. or i'd use infinite ammo and shit, use the laser watch.
you guys ever throw all the mines on the TVs in Bunker, set them off, and play around with floating knives/rockets?

Anonymous Wed Dec 20 22:21:40 2017 No.4474178

>>4474138
There's no depth to it. For instance multiple ways to complete the objectives or some sort of special mechanic. They arn't even particularly interesting parts of the game's world.

Contrast it with the way Hit Man gave you many approaches or even just how Perfect Dark had cool stuff like using a cleaning robot to by pass security.

Admittedly some objectives were better than others but most just filler like filler. Some stages feel like they don't even need objectives at all, like the one's that are just fucking straight lines. All the objectives do there is make it so if you miss a widget or interact point you have to back track a little.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 04:00:31 2017 No.4474570 >>4464838 The AI isn't smart enough for mouse precision aiming to be on PC. I mean, I love the game, but its so damn easy with mouse injector.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 04:02:28 2017 No.4474574 >>4474078 >M64 handles the camera better than any other 3d mario >There are people that actually believe this Mario 64 is great, but to say its camera is the best in the series is beyond laughable.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 04:45:52 2017 No.4474612

>>4474152
>you guys ever throw all the mines on the TVs in Bunker, set them off, and play around with floating knives/rockets?
Lmao, imagine having to occupy yourself like this instead of just playing Perfect Dark and having actual challenges, simulants, custom weaponsets and hundreds of features to enjoy.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 04:52:40 2017 No.4474618

>>4470645
I always love these kind of comments because it makes it super easy to spot the retard. N64 had dozens of great games, probably the highest ratio of quality to total library of any console ever made. Just because you are unwilling to play them doesn't mean they don't exist.

I was probably playing PC games when you were in diapers, but Quake doesn't suck on the N64. In fact, it's pretty fucking awesome. Quake 1 is much more atmospheric, moody and difficult than the PC counterpart, and Quake 2 is better in almost every way. Q2 on PC doesn't even have fucking muzzle flash because it was such a rushed hack job, whereas Q2 on N64 was built from the ground up for the platform.

The only legitimate excuses I ever see for why PC is such a "superior" platform to console boils down to two things: control method and mods. The fact is, while mouse might be more precise, it's rigid and twitchy and uncomfortable, nothing will ever beat a gamepad, and moreover, I don't give a fuck about playing things that virgins came up with in their spare time. Get over yourself and welcome good games into your life.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 04:57:09 2017 No.4474619

>>4474618
I had a n64 and even I realized that you're dealing with a very limited library. You had the Nintendo 1st and 2nd party and everything beyond that was kind of meh. Stuff that might be serviceable but isn't that great, stuff that really isn't thinking about much if you owned PC or PS1.

The PC always has the largest library of games, the best graphics, and the most options for how to play. If you own a PC the only reason to own a console is for the exclusives.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 05:06:43 2017 No.4474620

>>4474619
The fact you bring up PS1 tells me you're a Sony cockroach, so no big surprise that you're pretending the N64 didn't have a ton of great games. No, it didn't just have "1st and second party games", it had a ton of great Nintendo and Rare games, a ton of great exclusives from 3rd party developers and the best versions of almost every multiplat. Games like Ocarina of Time and Super Mario 64 revolutionized 3D gaming, and beyond that you had the likes of Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Doom 64, Banjo-Kazooie, Mario Kart 64, Diddy Kong Racing, F-Zero X, Jet Force Gemini, Ogre Battle 64, Paper Mario, Super Smash Bros., Majora's Mask, Star Fox 64, Killer Instinct, Tetrisphere and dozens more that brought home the bacon. That isn't even including games like Gauntlet Legends, Harvest Moon 64, Quake 2, Rayman 2 that were all better on the N64 than other consoles of the era. What did the PS1 have again? Oh yeah, a bunch of autistic turn-based JRPGs, wannabe SM64 knockoff platformers like Spyro, movie games and, uh, uh.... Medievil, the one legitimately good game on the platform.

Also, to state that PC was better at everything is retarded and disingenuous. For $200, the N64 provided an experience that was comparable to a $1000 PC and still had better exclusives.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 05:28:03 2017 No.4474634 >>4474620 You're a complete neruotic aren't you. One mention of the ps1 and you act like it's witch hunt. And your game list is exactly what I described dude a bunch of 1st and 2nd party and than some meh games.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 05:43:07 2017 No.4474649

>>4474634
>You're a complete neruotic aren't you.
Nope, but you're a complete retard. I'm not "acting like it's a witch hunt", I'm simply basing my argument off your statement that the "PC and PS1" are somehow better than the N64, which, especially in the case of the PS1, is a fallacy to anyone with a triple digit IQ. Also, you're making a blatantly retarded argument that most Sony ponies tend to make, which is that, if there are "1st and 2nd party" games on the system, that somehow makes them bad. Dude, who gives a fuck who makes the games? If there are good games on the system, there are good games. Moreover, I listed plenty of games that weren't 1st or 2nd party, so your abortion of an argument is null. Just because you call them "meh" doesn't make them bad, it means you either A) have shit taste, or B) haven't played them, probably both.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 05:57:16 2017 No.4474662

>>4474649
You had to list off Tetris and Killer Instincts as an examples of the great games of the n64 just to fill the list LOL. Seriously. Ray man 2? A port of Quake 2? A shitty port of Gauntlet? A couple more levels of Doom? Jet Fore Gemini? Did anyone care about this stuff that owned other consoles? I had an n64 and even I didn't give a shit about anything that wasn't Mario, Zelda, Starfox, Banjo, or multiplayer with my friends (and it wasn't because the multiplaye was so great but that it was the only thing we all had available).

Listen. If someone doesn't think the n64 "revolutionized 3D gaming" they aren't a secret Sony Nigger.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 06:05:38 2017 No.4474665 File: 526 KB, 826x738, Why though?.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4474618 >>4474620 >>4474649 You okay?

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 10:20:18 2017 No.4474906

>>4474662
>You had to list off Tetris and Killer Instincts as an examples of the great games of the n64 just to fill the list LOL.
Uh no, I listed them because they're great games. I repeat, just because you haven't played them doesn't make them bad.
>Seriously. Ray man 2? A port of Quake 2? A shitty port of Gauntlet? A couple more levels of Doom?
How bad is your reading comprehension exactly? I simply listed a few good multiplats on N64, adding the hefty list of exclusives. I can also take for granted the fact that you haven't played any of these games, because calling Gauntlet Legends on N64 a "shitty port" is laughable when it's literally the best version of the game available. And no, not a "couple more levels of Doom" you fucking retard, Doom 64 is a totally different game made exclusively for N64.
>I had an n64 and even I didn't give a shit about anything that wasn't Mario, Zelda, Starfox, Banjo, or multiplayer with my friends (and it wasn't because the multiplaye was so great but that it was the only thing we all had available).
Lmao, yet again, the "I haven't played it so it sucks" argument. Dude, I don't care. Just because you have shit taste and didn't bother to explore the library doesn't mean the games aren't there.
>If someone doesn't think the n64 "revolutionized 3D gaming" they aren't a secret Sony Nigger.
No, but it does make you literally retarded given that SM64 and OoT alone influenced every single 3D game which came after.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 12:26:21 2017 No.4475107 >>4465048 this. i only had 6 N64 games growing up

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 12:50:47 2017 No.4475139 >>4464868 Video games were a billion dollar industry when this came out. There is literally nothing more normie than playing games

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 17:48:24 2017 No.4475557 >>4465030 I was born in 1985, upper middle class with a couple of rich friends also. Literally nobody had 20 games for any given console. Those shits were like $80 apiece.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 18:31:19 2017 No.4475630

>>4474906
>SM64 and OoT alone influenced every single 3D game which came after.

What? We got a major influence on 3D platforming and on adventure games. Not on 3D as a whole. What part of Crysis was influenced by these games?

>The n64 game library
You realize there are entire genres that are either not represented or represented very poorly

-Shmups: Do not exist
-Side scrollers (I think the only one is mischief makers. There's no Megaman x4, Klonoa, and SoTN)
-Beat em ups: Do not exist.
-Survival horror, the hot new genre: I think there was like one port of a RE game....
-RPGs: I think the only one peopled cared about was due to having the Mario IP while the other console is flooded with them.
-Stealth games: The genre just got hit with Metal Gear Solid on the other console
etc.

Meanwhile is there any genre the n64 actually excelled in? It had better FPS (although you have way better FPS selection in both single player and VS on the PC so the n64 is still only second place here).

It did have better 3D platformers, although the PS certainly wasn't starving for them with stuff like Crash Bandicoot.

It had Zelda. That's definitly it's biggest claim to power. It's the only thing that has no equivelent on the PS or the PC.

I grew up with an n64 but it was definitely the weakest of the generation. If I had a better gaming PC and a PS1 at the time the only games from the n64 I would have cared about would be Zelda and Starfox. I'd probably have still played the multiplayer games with my friends but it wouldn't be something I'd feel nessiary to own. I played my SNES backlog more than my n64 that generation. There were some great games on the console that I really enjoyed but man I wish I grew up with PS instead.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 18:32:41 2017 No.4475636 >>4475557 It was more like 20 games spread out of all your friends. You'd coordinate things. One guy has Smash Brothers and will let you play it with him if you let him play Golden Eye.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 18:39:07 2017 No.4475643 >>4475630 the genre n64 excelled was arcade racing

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 18:39:35 2017 No.4475646

>>4475557
Used market. It wasn't as cut-throat as it is now. There were way way less scalpers on the internet, there were more game stores than game-stop which kept competetion high and prices low, and people were much more laid back.

I got 5 games and a spare console controllers with 3 controllers for $80....

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 21:31:24 2017 No.4475890 >>4465565 >No one wanted to play this 4 player. bullshit fucking bullshit EVERYONE wanted to fucking play this multiplayer

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 21:35:59 2017 No.4475896 >>4467785 name a PS1 game then that also did moving and aiming in 1997 like GE did. most people didn't even USE that way too, they just used the stick to move and used the R button to aim.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 21:39:27 2017 No.4475901

>>4475896
Niggah who cares about shooting on the PS1? The PC was the game with the best shooting experience. You only cared about the console shooters if you didn't have a PC. No one bought a console because they wanted to play FPS games. This isn't the xbox 360 era.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 22:01:39 2017 No.4475937

>>4475901
nah, faggot

PC is in its OWN realm
it ALWAYS was or hell, used to
PC used to have shit tons of unique shit that would never have been on consoles

and fuck you, i had a damn nice PC in 1996
i had lots of shooters for it too
i had everything between me and my friends, asshole. im sorry you didn't have friends that each bought a different system so you could play all the fucking games.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 22:10:57 2017 No.4475943

>>4475937
>PC is in its OWN realm
What he hell does this mean? There are good games some are on console some are on the PC. That's it.

My point is that the library of shooters on PC was much better, if you want shooters you get a PC. If you want survival horror, jrpgs, SoTN etc you get a PS. If you want Nintendo 1st party you get a N64 etc.

Console shooters were largely jsut something people contended with if they didn't have a PC. No Unreal Tournament means all you had was Golden Eye and Perfect Dark on split screen. If you couldn't play shooters at their most fun, with a mouse, you had to play stuff like Golden Eye and Turok which were designed around analog input.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 22:31:01 2017 No.4475962 What are some PC FPSs comparable to Goldeneye that came out before it?

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 22:44:56 2017 No.4475978 >>4475962 Nothing. It had a huge impact on PC FPS developers and the whole industry was and is basically dominated by games that took after its conventions.

Anonymous Thu Dec 21 22:50:16 2017 No.4475982

>>4475962
I think we already went over it. It's that Golden Eye was poorly executed. Shoddy aiming/shooting/movement, ugly environments, and an objective system that had no depth to it, with a lot of them feeling like filler. You had a lot of the same concepts done better with Tomb Raider, System Shock, and even sort of Ultima Underworld. Not exactly FPS though but a year a year later Half-life happens and becomes the first good FPS to take things in a more realistic feeling direction.

The best you can say is GE prototyped some ideas, was better than the other consoles shooters until PD hit, and was one of the best multiplayer VS experiences on the n64.

>>	Anonymous Thu Dec 21 23:00:09 2017 No.4475987 >>4475978 historical revisionism.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 01:43:47 2017 No.4476157

>>4475987
It’s historical revisionism to say otherwise. While there already were shooter-like RPGs like System Shock (and before anybody says it was an FPS, the developers themselves said it was an RPG first and foremost) Goldeneye was the first non-Doom clone FPS to achieve any real measure of commercial success. Hell, it outsold the early Doom and Quake games combined. With that level of sales, other developers wanted in on the ‘realistic FPS’ bandwagon.

System Shock was released in 1994, so where were the stream of non-Doom clones after that? They didn’t follow. Yet after Goldeneye came out in late 1997, Doom-likes were immediately passé in the games industry.

This guy is just fucking insane, comparing Goldeneye to Tomb Raider lmao >>4475982

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 01:59:13 2017 No.4476170 >>4476157 I'm pretty sure what made things switch over away from doom like things was half-life. And no Half-life was not inspired by Golden Eye. The Tomb raider and system shock comparison is valid because they ended up giving influence to FPS.

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 02:17:50 2017 No.4476190 >>4476170 >hmm...was it the game released earlier and sold better...or was it the game released later and sold worse

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 02:31:26 2017 No.4476202 >>4476190 Where's the influence in Unreal? In Unreal Tournament? In Half Life 2? In Halo? In Quake 3? In Blood? In Shadow Warrior? In Hexen 2? In Tribes? In Counter Strike? You know the games made after Golden Eye that were big things.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 02:36:22 2017 No.4476204

>>4476202
This is dumb as fuck. Even something as basic as manually reloading gun was first popularized by Goldeneye. The game was so deeply influential, that it defined the template of modern shooters itself, more so than any particular and obvious gimmicky gameplay element.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 02:42:44 2017 No.4476212

>>4476204
Didn't System Shock have reloading?

What's "dumb" is "Doom-likes were immediately passé in the games industry."

When looking at the games that came after Golden Eye they are still making games in the style of Quake. Unreal is Quake, it was the fucking rival to Quake. All the build engine games were quake (or doom). The big move away from quake happens with valve and Halo (which didn't feature a protagonist that looked like James Bond, it featured a guy that looked like Doom).

What you are doing is historical revisionism and it's not even clever revisionism. You can't even fucking point out how Golden Eye influenced the games I listed when asked to.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 02:46:24 2017 No.4476214

>>4476212
>Didn't System Shock have reloading?
Yeah, you had to open up a menu and from there load ammo into your gun. Every game does this now because it was so influential and intuitive.

>When looking at the games that came after Golden Eye they are still making games in the style of Quake. Unreal is Quake
Unreal was already too far into development to change directions when Goldeneye came out.

>You can't even fucking point out how Golden Eye influenced the games I listed when asked to.
Because your list was the work of an intellectually challenged individual. Blood came out before Goldeneye for example.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 03:13:11 2017 No.4476235

>>4476214
There was reloading in railshooters. System shock had limited ammo. It really just sounds like you're saying Golden Eye was the first FPS, not rail-shooter, to have a dedicated reload button. Which isn't saying much. That's not exactly 'influencing all FPS afterwords' more like a piece of trivia.

>Unreal was already too far into development to change directions when Goldeneye came out.
So is that the excuse you're going for the rest of the video game library? Most stuff that came after Golden Eye was still quake clones, not Golden Eye clones. Valve, Halo, and Medal of Honor were the big pushes in different directions and what the non-quake/doom clones all the shaped themself after.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 03:18:40 2017 No.4476239

>>4476235
>Which isn't saying much. That's not exactly 'influencing all FPS afterwords' more like a piece of trivia.
Yeah, it's not like being able to reload your weapons has any strategic purpose or anything. It's not like it has any bearing on a game's balance of guns.

>So is that the excuse you're going for the rest of the video game library? Most stuff that came after Golden Eye was still quake clones, not Golden Eye clones
Nope. I'd just like you to name some other single player "Quake clones" that came after Goldeneye.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 03:44:25 2017 No.4476281

>>4476239
>Yeah, it's not like being able to reload your weapons has any strategic purpose or anything. It's not like it has any bearing on a game's balance of guns.

How the hell does this relate to game's after Golden Eye? I'm asking you what it influenced not for a fucking treaty on reloading.

The defining games of the late 90s and early 00s when Golden Eye hit were Unreal games, Valve games, and the first wave of military FPS. You also had the last of the build engine games and I think the last Hexen game and Serious Sam, which was pretty much the last innovation in the Doom/Quake lineage throwing out the exploring and focusing entirly on it's combat. None of these can be said very much to be influenced by Golden Eye. Even the spy theme was rarely used outside of console gaming.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 03:54:34 2017 No.4476289

>>4476281
All you're doing is just restating the same shit over and over without any evidence.

And the reason the spy theme wasn't often used is obvious. Not many companies had the balls to compete with the James Bond IP.

Hexen is an RPG-like and Serious Sam plays more like a parody of Doom than anything.

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 04:15:23 2017 No.4476296 >>4464838 this is like saying would you like shit or sprinkles with your ice cream

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 04:57:20 2017 No.4476334

>>4476289
>All you're doing is just restating the same shit over and over without any evidence.
I'm asking you where Golden Eye's influence is and this is your fucking come back? You havn't backed up any of your points while I've been over the major shooters with you twice, and you still can't find any connection between them and Golden Eye. I think that means you're having trouble establishing that it influenced much.

>Not many companies had the balls to compete with the James Bond IP.

How would they be competing with the IP? Golden Eye was only on one fucking console. It was competition to Turok but not to anything on the PC and certainly not the games that followed from the next gen.

You're talking like people stopping buying Unreal, Serious Sam, Half Life, Medal of Honor clones, and Halo to play fucking Golden Eye.

>Serious Sam plays more like a parody of Doom than anything.
Are you confusing the dialogue for the "play"? Serious Sam is basically the Doom/Quake combat with 95% of the exploring axed.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 07:53:43 2017 No.4476490

>>4476334
>I'm asking you where Golden Eye's influence is and this is your fucking come back? You havn't backed up any of your points
The relevant points have already been made in this thread by me and by others. There's a post above on how Goldeneye was one of the biggest influences on Thief for example.

>How would they be competing with the IP?
Any attempt to produce a "spy" game would immediately get compared to James Bond. That's why unless you're doing the real James Bond, you need to put some kind of twist on it. NOLF did the 007 parodies, Perfect Dark set it in the future, Thief made you a thief instead of a spy in a steampunk world, etc. The former developers of Goldeneye (Free Radical) simply abandoned the spy theme for Timesplitters while continuing the same multiplayer style, but substantially changed up the single player.

>You're talking like people stopping buying Unreal, Serious Sam, Half Life, Medal of Honor clones, and Halo to play fucking Golden Eye.
I don't think *anybody* pro-Goldeneye in this thread has ever said this. It seems to me that you're taking a combative Highlander-style mindset, when people here are simply trying to say Goldeneye was a highly influential game not just on console but also on PC.

>Serious Sam is basically the Doom/Quake combat with 95% of the exploring axed.
Hah, no. In reality, Serious Sam has more in common with SmashTV than Doom.

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 08:12:57 2017 No.4476505 >>4476296 What kind of shit and what kind of sprinkles are we talking here?

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 08:16:50 2017 No.4476506 >>4476490 Not him but this post is complete codswallop.

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 08:21:25 2017 No.4476510 >>4476506 Thanks for your valuable contribution to this thread

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 09:55:02 2017 No.4476576

>>4476490
>Hah, no. In reality, Serious Sam has more in common with SmashTV than Doom.
DoomQuake monsters (kleers are fiends, gnaars are pinkies, frogs are shitty versions of spawn, etc.; of course, the monsters don't correspond 1 to 1, but rather remix DoomQuake's monster abilities), DoomQuake guns (even the cannon is pretty much a glorified grenade launcher), half of the levels are very bad Quake ripoffs. Also, Quake DID use spawns from thin air, although, yeah, SS uses them for, like, 98 percent of monsters on any level.
SS is pretty much DoomQuake, made into a rhythm game (shit spawns around you, you deal with it as quickly as possible via using correct guns against correct monsters in correct order - meaning prioritizing). It's really banal and repetitive, once you get to the core of it, too.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 09:58:14 2017 No.4476578

>>4476576
>SS is pretty much DoomQuake, made into a rhythm game (shit spawns around you, you deal with it as quickly as possible via using correct guns against correct monsters in correct order - meaning prioritizing).
Also, with very, VERY shit level layouts. Of course Serious Sam Alpha had, like, one of the worst leveldesigns I've ever seen in games, and the release version is a legit improvement on all fronts, compared to that abomination, but, despite all the attempts to tighten the levels with all the spawn triggers, they a still a horrendous chore to get through.

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 09:59:07 2017 No.4476579 >>4476576 I don't disagree that many elements of it were inspired by Doom/Quake. It just doesn't really play like them. I've always thought of it more like SmashTV with some Doom/Quake mechanisms.

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 11:39:45 2017 No.4476764 >>4465005 It's popular. Everything popular is automatically hated on 4chan no matter how actually good it is.

>>	Anonymous Fri Dec 22 13:33:34 2017 No.4476947 >>4475630 >What part of Crysis was influenced by these games? Goldeneye and Turok were influencial as fuck though

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 19:02:28 2017 No.4477457

>>4476490
>Goldeneye was a highly influential game not just on console but also on PC.

Thank you for finally coming out admitting Golden Eye's "influence" extended only to console FPS. Which in the pre-Halo era is about as historically relevent as influencing the PC only platformers. All that huffing and puffing you did was over that LOL.

This is the most important thing you've said and I think we can now finally put the subject to rest and agree. Golden Eye was only relevant in the world of console games, it's influence on the PC was of minor importance. Which really just affirms what everyone else who was familiar with PC gaming has been trying to communicate about the game. It's a great game by console standards but not very interesting compared to the world of PC FPS which was always the superior platform for the genre.

>There's a post above on how Goldeneye was one of the biggest influences on Thief for example.
I already went over this with you. Thief's biggest influences were Ultima Underworld and System Shock. Two games that you tried to say aren't allowed in the equation LOL. Golden Eye's influence by the developers own word's only amounted to how they tweaked the difficulty settings.

>Hah, no. In reality, Serious Sam has more in common with SmashTV than Doom.
LOL

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 19:07:51 2017 No.4477465

>>4476579
Smash TV is an overshooter. Serious Sam is an FPS. All they really have in common was that they are swarm based. It's not like Doom and Quake didn't have parts where you fought swarms, they just had fewer dudes in the swarm and they didn't last nearly as long. This is escpially true when you look at mods.

Serious Sam just took those parts and cut 90% of everything else. It kept the secret hunting and had a few corridor shooting parts inbetween the swarms. There's even a key-card or switch hunt every once in awhile.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 22:45:46 2017 No.4477873

>>4477457
>Thank you for finally coming out admitting Golden Eye's "influence" extended only to console FPS.
Counter Strike was heavily influenced by GoldenEye. The CS beta even had GE weapon sounds and remakes of GE maps.
>I already went over this with you. Thief's biggest influences were Ultima Underworld and System Shock.
System Shock 2 borrowed GE's weapon reload system.

Anonymous Fri Dec 22 23:53:12 2017 No.4477954

>>4477457
>Thank you for finally coming out admitting Golden Eye's "influence" extended only to console FPS
Reading comprehension much? lol it’s almost like you’re reading what you want to read as opposed to what is actually there

>Thief's biggest influences were Ultima Underworld and System Shock.
Which didn’t even have stealth systems. Kind of essential for a game about thieving isn’t it?

>Two games that you tried to say aren't allowed in the equation LOL
Which I never said anywhere...

>Golden Eye's influence by the developers own word's only amounted to how they tweaked the difficulty settings.
Notice how they didn’t use the word ‘only’ like you did?

In conclusion, you are schizophrenic, and most likely brain damaged as well.

>>4477465
>Smash TV is an overshooter. Serious Sam is an FPS.
Yes, and the difference substantially amounts to s change in perspective.

>they just had fewer dudes in the swarm
Fewer dudes is a massive understatement.

>Serious Sam just took those parts and cut 90% of everything else
What makes Doom *Doom* is the level design though. It’s what separated it primarily from Wolf3D.

>It kept the secret hunting and had a few corridor shooting parts inbetween the swarms
You also move from room to room in SmashTV.

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 01:59:49 2017 No.4478076

>>4474662
>You had to list off Tetris and Killer Instincts as an examples of the great games of the n64 just to fill the list LOL. Seriously. Ray man 2? A port of Quake 2?
Quake II was an original game made specifically for the N64. Rayman 2 was the original version. The PS1 port is kinda shit and full of cuts.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 02:14:14 2017 No.4478093 >>4471815 Half life 2 is the most overrated game ever. It has terrible gunplay, terrible level design, boring puzzles, and people praise it because it has scripted events. It was literally the begining of the cancer that became the modern FPS market.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 02:15:53 2017 No.4478094 >>4464868 >PC already had vastly superior shooters by the time this came out No it didn't, and I was a PC gamer back then. Stop lying to yourself and to others.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 04:13:41 2017 No.4478190 >>4464838 I like Perfect Dark more

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 04:51:19 2017 No.4478206

>>4477954
>Fewer dudes is a massive understatement.
No it isn't. SS1 only let you combat, like, 20 dudes at the same time (and that's in Really Big Fights, like the one at the Metropolis square), maybe more in harpia and frog swarms, but that's it. And only spawned new waves as you've dealt with the old ones.

In comparison, Doom2 in particular DID have swarms (especially on some of Petersen's maps) which clocked 20 or 30 consecutive enemies easily - and in contrast to SS1, Doom2 doesn't have to SPAWN its enemies, they are already on the level (although some of the monsters reside in inaccessible rooms with teleporters).

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 04:54:10 2017 No.4478210

>>4478206
>Doom2 doesn't have to SPAWN its enemies
Meaning, you enter the room, you HAVE to take on everything there is PLUS the shit that manages to hear you PLUS the shit that teleports in from inaccessible rooms connected to that room.

Hell, Spear of Destiny had swarms with WAY more enemies at the same time, than Serious Sam 1 waves have.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 04:57:45 2017 No.4478214 >>4478206 >rocket launcher >all dead

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 04:57:56 2017 No.4478216

>>4477954
>Which didn’t even have stealth systems. Kind of essential for a game about thieving isn’t it?
The thieving system in particular was designed by Doug Church (Thief is basically HIS game) and Ken Levine (before he went to Irrational).
Ken's side of the story could be heard here: http://gambit.mit.edu/podcasts/lgs/podcast5_kevin_levine.mp3
Doug's side of the story (and that is BY FAR the most coherent story about Thief1 development you'll ever hear) could be heard here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uQEBSgf_cU

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 04:59:16 2017 No.4478217 >>4478214 >pinky teleports in your face

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 05:00:35 2017 No.4478218 >>4478216 Spoiler: neither of them even as much as mentions GoldenEye.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 05:01:51 2017 No.4478219 >>4478206 >And only spawned new waves as you've dealt with the old ones. Unless, that is, you proceed further into the level, as you fight, thus triggering new unrelated shit (which is always stupid).

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 05:03:33 2017 No.4478221 >>4465875 Brain damage or bait?

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 05:10:21 2017 No.4478231

>>4478218
Also, the first first-person stealth game I'm aware of, is Alien vs. Predator (1994, the Jaguar one), Predator campaign. That's 3 years before GoldenEye.

Also2, Halo's roots are Pathways into Darkness (which is its direct progenitor as a game with checkpoint/sandbox/arena-based gameplay design) and Marathon games (which are more of attempts to tell Doom whut's whut).

Also3, point&click shooting interface akin to GoldenEye (and which is much more fit for mouse or touchpad, rather than for gamepad or a flight stick), has already been featured in numerous PC games, like Ultima Underworld, CyClones, System Shock 1 and Realms of the Haunting.

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 06:38:38 2017 No.4478328

>>4478218
Which games do they mention other than they ones they helped make? IRC Spector once said that the three games most influential for Deus Ex were Dark Forces, System Shock, and GoldenEye 007. He wasn't involved with two of those.

>>4478231
>the first first-person stealth game I'm aware of, is Alien vs. Predator (1994, the Jaguar one)
Moving the goal posts. Remember we're talking about influence, not "who did this exact mechanic first". I've never played that Jaguar game so I couldn't tell if you if it really had a proper stealth system, but from what I've gathered you just have a cloaking ability that makes all enemies ignore you.

That's very different from what we know as a "stealth" game which is about controlling amount of noise you make, avoiding security cameras, stopping guards from pulling alarms, etc.

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 06:58:06 2017 No.4478336

>>4478328
>Which games do they mention other than they ones they helped make?
Well, gameplay-wise, Levine, AFAIK, researched IRL submarine and anti-submarine warfare tactics in order to approach Thief as a sound management game. I don't think he mentioned any particular influences in terms of gaming.
Doug seemed to be a pretty big Nin aficionado at the time (see his Gamasutra article), but other than that. Well, I mean, he is basically 90s' Jonathan Blow, he is too much of "I am so very smart, much theoretician, very brains" and full of himself to outright copycat anyone. And I mean, ANYONE. OF COURSE, there are no directly inherited elements in Thief (be it from SuperMario64 or GoldenEye007), other than from other games Doug did. Best you can count on are _references_, and I don't think Thief has even those from his side.

Besides, Levine split to Irrational in May 1997 and Spector ALREADY BEGUN PREPRODUCTION FOR DX1 in Ion Storm in August 1997 (meaning, he wasn't working on Thief already).

At least, for those two it's pretty fucking clear their work on Thief had NOTHING TO DO with GoldenEye007.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 06:59:21 2017 No.4478338 >>4478336 >it's pretty fucking clear their work on Thief had NOTHING TO DO with GoldenEye007. um >>4470648

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:04:37 2017 No.4478342

>>4478338
So? It's pretty clear "the team" doesn't include either Spector or Levine, since they both has split prior to Thief release, and I very much doubt Doug would even consider copying GoldenEye007 before copying SM64, and let's just say Thief doesn't have all that much of SM64 in it.

I mean, yeah, GoldenEye007 influenced Thief's mission design. That's a fact. But that doesn't mean it influenced any of its core mechanics. Now THAT is something that need to be proven with concrete evidence before being accepted.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:05:41 2017 No.4478343 >>4478342 >both have >that needs

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:05:44 2017 No.4478345
File: 22 KB, 480x360, pcgame1997.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

many people were still using 486's when goldeneye was released and most didn't have 3d cards yet and the playstation was still using digital control. There was nothing on pc that did everything as well goldeneye at the time until half life years later.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:06:44 2017 No.4478346 >>4478342 >prior to GoldenEye007 release

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:12:45 2017 No.4478350 >>4478345 May I inquire what does Half-Life have to do with GoldenEye? In concrete terms? HL is basically an attempt to marry Quake with Another World in semi-realistic environments. It doesn't play anything like GoldenEye.

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:12:59 2017 No.4478351

>>4478342
>Now THAT is something that need to be proven with concrete evidence before being accepted.
Since we can't read minds and thus can't "prove" anything, a better way to do it would simply be through the process of elimination.

Can you name an first person game released before Thief that has a stealth system more similar to Thief than Goldeneye? If not, then by process of elimination we can say that Goldeneye was the *most likely* influence for its stealth system.

That of course is not to say Goldeneye necessarily had the first "stealth" system in a first person game (Strife, released earlier, had a sort of stealth system) but that its system most closely resembled the one used in Thief (or rather, the one in Thief most closely resembled Goldeneye's).

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:16:35 2017 No.4478356 >>4478345 >There was nothing on pc that did everything as well goldeneye at the time until half life years later. Jedi Knight 1 was released a month after GoldenEye007 was. HL1 was released a year and three months, not "years", after GoldenEye007.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:18:33 2017 No.4478359 >>4478351 >Since we can't read minds and thus can't "prove" anything, Presumption of innocence. >through the process of elimination Circumstantial evidence.

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:25:59 2017 No.4478362 File: 47 KB, 600x808, bond.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4478359 This isn't a court of law friendo

>>	Anonymous Sat Dec 23 07:28:35 2017 No.4478363 >>4478356 just saying that its not like people who play the old games on modern hardware, you couldn't put the resolution to the max and get 60 fps on most pc's of the time. N64 seems like blurry and jerky now but a pc was so expensive.

Anonymous Sat Dec 23 19:13:30 2017 No.4479206

>>4478356
>Jedi Knight 1 was released a month after GoldenEye007 was.
Drastically different kind of game.
>HL1 was released a year and three months, not "years", after GoldenEye007.
HL1 was scrapped and built from scratch. By weird coincidence, the game was scrapped a month or so before GE released.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 00:30:47 2017 No.4479634 will we ever see a streets 1:12 on pc? no https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYmqJl4MoNI

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 03:10:11 2017 No.4479795

>>4479206
>Drastically different kind of game.
More different than Half-Life is? Oh you. Also, what about Dark Forces 1 as possible influence at GE's mission design?
>HL1 was scrapped and built from scratch.
Doom was scrapped and built from scratch.
Duke 3D was scrapped and built from scratch.
Marathon was scrapped and built from scratch TWICE.
Thief was scrapped and built from scratch (the first version was called Dark Camelot).
Quake 1 was scrapped and built from scratch ("just slap some Doom guns on it").
HeXen 2 was scrapped and built from scratch (the first version was called Hecatomb).
Messiah was scrapped and built from scratch (the first version was called Terminus and had voxel characters).
Serious Sam was scrapped and built from scratch (and rightly so, see Serious Sam Alpha).
Daikatana was scrapped and built from scratch due to engine switch. Also, half the team split after the reboot right after the switch and managed to build KISS Psycho Circus, while Daikatana was rebooting, and release it less than a month after actual Daikatana came out.
Prey was scrapped and built from scratch AT LEAST twice.
Powerslave was scrapped and built from scratch TWICE (PC version is actually the second iteration, Sat version is the third iteration, and PSX version is the modified third iteration).
Duke Nukem Forever - well, there's no telling, just how many times it was scrapped and built from scratch.
And yes, all of that happened specifically because of GE's miraculous influence. Serious Sam and Daikatana reboots first and foremost.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 03:12:41 2017 No.4479801 >>4479795 Except Half-Life was rebuilt to make it more realistic and less Quake like. Which pretty much perfectly matches the industry trend that Goldeneye heralded.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 03:20:10 2017 No.4479809

>>4479801
Do you have any other "examples" of this "trend"? Like, I dunno, do MGS and Trespasser also own their eventual looks to the GE's existence, in your opinion?

Also, I've seen developer demos of HL Alpha - and the decorations in particular didn't look all that different from the final game. If anything, the very point of those demos seemed to be showcasing the various ways environment could be used while in combat (which, to be frank, I didn't use NEARLY to the same extent even while playing HL2, lol), which is already drastically different to what Quake (even in Petersen's interpretation, meaning E4) was aiming for.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 03:46:43 2017 No.4479832

>>4479809
>Do you have any other "examples" of this "trend"?
I think the better question is: do you have any counter examples? Which other FPS released in 1997 would you say heralded the shift to a more realistic style?

>do MGS and Trespasser also own their eventual looks to the GE's existence, in your opinion?
The former isn't an FPS. As for the latter, I'd say GE's success emboldened the developers of Trespasser with their batshit crazy ambitious plan to make a 'realistic' dinosaur game.

>the decorations in particular didn't look all that different from the final game
Well, obviously, they weren't going to dump all of their assets and concept art. But it's pretty clear the Alpha plays far more like Quake than the more realistic final product (e.g. notice how there's no reloading weapons). I do agree though that the level design was pretty different to Quake. I think that was going to be their selling point. Yet, Duke had pretty different level design to Doom and yet had fairly similar gameplay.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 04:56:02 2017 No.4479886

>>4479832
>the shift to a more realistic style?
WHAT shift? Which games in particular do you mean, as prime representatives of that "shift"? Which ones of them specifically were released, let's say, before 2000, so that their "shift" couldn't be attributed to HL1 instead?
Is Delta Force considered a part of that "shift" by you? Is Rainbow Six part of the "shift"? Is Kingpin part of the "shift"? Is Blood 2 part of the "shift"? What IS that "shift" you are talking about - and when exactly did it start in more or less massive numbers?
>I'd say GE's success emboldened the developers of Trespasser with their batshit crazy ambitious plan to make a 'realistic' dinosaur game.
Trespasser was helmed by the person who made physics engine for System Shock 1. Trespasser development took three years. The game was ultimately released as buggy broken mess with heaps of cut content. You know, I kind of suspect that the year between GE's release and TP's release was spent on things other than aping GE. On crunches, for example.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 05:10:36 2017 No.4479893

>>4479832
>I'd say GE's success emboldened the developers of Trespasser with their batshit crazy ambitious plan to make a 'realistic' dinosaur game.

yeah, nah, you're just making shit up here. tresspasser was made by seamus blackley, an ex-looking glass guy with a boner for simulation. that game's ambitions come from a very distinct school of design that started with ultima underworld and have nothing to do with goldeneye.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 05:17:13 2017 No.4479896

>>4479832
>I think the better question is: do you have any counter examples?
Ungrounded speculations aren't worth disproving, in my opinion.
>Which other FPS released in 1997 would you say heralded the shift to a more realistic style?
"Heralded" doesn't mean "caused". Since that is the case, I am free to name any "literally what?" "realistic decorations" game I'll manage to remember.
Assassin2015. Malice for Quake. TekWar. Also, both versions of Killing Time, to some extent.
>e.g. notice how there's no reloading weapons
Actually, I don't remember where manual reloading originated (Marathon's guns and Duke's pistol did have reloading, but it was all automatic).
Oh, yeah, SystemShock1 had it, for one.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 05:22:46 2017 No.4479904 Actually, the only two GoldenEye clones I can remember (other than Perfect Dark) are the original Medal of Honor games.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 06:25:59 2017 No.4479949 >>4479904 >clones

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 07:07:07 2017 No.4479981 >>4479949 Metal of Honor was created because Spielberg saw his son playing GoldenEye. Syphon Filter was created because the team behind Bubsy 3D had a boner for GoldenEye. Project IGI was created because the devs wanted to make GoldenEye for PC.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 07:14:53 2017 No.4479987

>>4479886
>Is Delta Force considered a part of that "shift" by you? Is Rainbow Six part of the "shift"? Is Kingpin part of the "shift"? Is Blood 2 part of the "shift"? What IS that "shift" you are talking about - and when exactly did it start in more or less massive numbers?
These games are part of the shift that Goldeneye started.

>>4479893
Notice how I used the word ‘emboldened’ rather than ‘influenced’? They have very different meanings. Goldeneye’s success would have given the developers of Trespasser confidence their own radical departure from Doom might not flop.

>>4479896
>Assassin2015. Malice for Quake. TekWar. Also, both versions of Killing Time, to some extent.
For something to be a herald it actually has to be seen and noticed, unlike those games.

>Oh, yeah, SystemShock1 had it, for one.
Yes. From a menu.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 07:39:49 2017 No.4480012 >>4465005 It's cool to hate it. Pretty soon there'll be posts about how LttP was a "shit game" and "basically just a remake of Adventure for Atari".

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 08:10:46 2017 No.4480030

>>4479987
>Notice how I used the word ‘emboldened’ rather than ‘influenced’? They have very different meanings. Goldeneye’s success would have given the developers of Trespasser confidence their own radical departure from Doom might not flop.

notice how you retreaded from talking about concrete game features into baseless speculation about the inner feelings of some people you don't know? failing to show any actual influence on the game you simply choose to believe in an imaginary impact that cannot possibly be measured. that's pretty weak.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 09:11:11 2017 No.4480098

>>4479987
You know what.
I was actually browsing YouTube now, looking for major E3'97 videos and shit. I managed to find, like, 10 20+minute videos of it, digitizations of ancient VHS tapes and shit. Along with small snippets showcasing HL, SiN, etc. I was ready to dive into all of that shit full head on. You know, to find the footage from games that showcased realistic style (and were featured on E3'97, hence clearly being uninfluenced by GE, for which E3'97 also was a first major showcase), to present to you concrete timestamps to back up that such and such yadda-yadda bla-bla.

I funny thought occured to me while I was sort of preparing to dive in, and ripping all those videos from YT to my computer (for the ease of use).

I am not getting paid for this shit. And I definitely don't care about the origins of some shitty speculative realism trend 20 fucking years ago. For Christ's sake, I don't even LIKE speculative fiction. YOU do, and YOU care. And yet I was about to waste some fucking hours of my personal time to provide you, for free, mind you, with some information you couldn't be fucking arsed to dig up yourself.

You know what? I don't fucking care what you happen to fucking believe. It really and truly is none of my business, whether or not you happen to see Jesus' second coming in GoldenEye007's release. Not it is none of my business, it is also something that just doesn't interest me, and isn't about to interest me in any foreseeable future regardless of how much you are going to continue running in circles spouting shit akin to "Dem goldeneye invented gammin as we know it! Every game since owns it to goldeneye existence! Yadda-yadda-yadda". What you do with your free time is your own fucking business - and you know what? What I do with MY fucking time is MY fucking business - and you are NOT getting a free pass on my free fucking time.

You care about history of realism trend and extent of GE's factual influence? Go and fucking research it yourself.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 09:33:26 2017 No.4480115 Me and my friends played the hell out of this game and smash bros. I really don't get the hate. Maybe it was vastly inferior in terms of vydia, but man the game was fun.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 09:46:44 2017 No.4480131

>>4480030
It's the common consensus that Goldeneye kicked off the realistic FPS trend in the mainstream. I don't know why so many people here are trying so hard to lie to themselves and others.

The position some of you are trying to take is hilarious. "You can't prove it with 100% timestamped video evidence therefore it's not true! FUCK YOU!". Like, lmao, people have been convicted for murder on circumstantial evidence because there literally is no better explanation for how that person got killed, and yet the standard isn't good enough for the deluded mustards here.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 09:59:01 2017 No.4480139 Lmao or no lmao, consensus or no consensus, no arguments = no discussion, deal with it.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 10:01:48 2017 No.4480143 >>4480139 It's the best-fit argument. Occam's razor and all.

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 10:06:14 2017 No.4480149 >>4480143 You have a vivid imagination, don't you?

>>	Anonymous Sun Dec 24 17:39:49 2017 No.4480838 >>4479795 >Also, what about Dark Forces 1 as possible influence at GE's mission design? GE stole its mission structure from Mario 64.

Anonymous Sun Dec 24 17:49:40 2017 No.4480854

>>4480098
Let's be clear about something. GoldenEye wasn't specifically trying to be "realistic". Its core ambition was something called "cinematic realism". You don't really find this in any FPS game predating GoldenEye. The game is built to function like a movie. You shoot glass once. A bullet hole appears. You shoot it some more, and it explores into a shower of shards. Bullets "zing" past your head. When you fire a gun, there's a whole world of layered sound effects and particle effects being used to make it feel punchy, tactile, and responsive. Prior to GoldenEye, you didn't really have films attempting to mimic film foley effects to such an extent.

GoldenEye was a revolution. There'd never been a game quite like it that so completely rejected the underlying design of Doom. Oh, it was influenced by Doom, sure, but it was the anti-thesis of Doom. You play other 1997 FPS titles like Blood and Shadow Warrior and Redneck Rampage and Quake 2, and they're nothing like it.

GoldenEye represented more than simple "realism". It represented an attempt to bring a cinematic mentality to FPS design.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 00:22:40 2017 No.4481314 >>4479981 I was one of the scourges of the MoH:AA servers. My trusty Kar98k rifle often got me accused of hax. My pistol bash ratio was 100:1. I was... \|SS\| IronCross

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 08:24:15 2017 No.4481635 >>4464932 Doesn't matter. The question was would it have been better, yes and by far. They also could have done more with it. It would have been better just for resolution and mkb alone. Would it be better than most FPS, probably not.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 08:25:48 2017 No.4481637 >>4466470 Eh, much of the speed comes from optimizations, and Carmack hired out a lot of that for example with Abrash.

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 09:44:02 2017 No.4481685

>>4480854
>Its core ambition was something called "cinematic realism". You don't really find this in any FPS game predating GoldenEye.
Realms of the Haunting.
Cybermage, to some extent.
Doom was created with Romero literally oogling at the stuff like Aliens and Evil Dead.
>Its core ambition was something called "cinematic realism".
Now, the problem is, not every movie tries to be realistic. Bond movies in particular do, they in particular are kitschy and speculative, and try to mix their fiction with exotics, basically trying to serve a sort of a "virtual tourism" function. In other worlds, Bond movies are trying to ENHANCE reality, to make it seem that the reality AROUND THE VIEWER is much less boring and routine, and is much more exciting, than it might seem to the viewer. The problem is, they do via infusing it with the stuff that simply doesn't exist, that has no place whatsoever in the context it's depicted in, and so sooner or later, the illusion they create in the viewer is invariably recognized as fake, and the charm of the movie dissipates as quickly as it appeared.
>There'd never been a game quite like it that so completely rejected the underlying design of Doom.
Except for games that appeared BEFORE Doom? You know, Battlezone (arcade), Ultima Underworld, Pathways into Darkness?
>You play other 1997 FPS titles like Blood and Shadow Warrior and Redneck Rampage and Quake 2, and they're nothing like it.
And then I open Assassin2015 on youtube - and my jaw drops down. Also, Quake2 is pretty fucking cinematic. The deaths in particular.

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 09:53:16 2017 No.4481702

>>4481685
Stop fucking lying to yourself. Those games are NOTHING like Goldeneye.

So everybody can point and laugh at this mentally handicapped individual, I'm linking the games he says did Goldeneye before Goldeneye.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzT27LXpoyc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23v9na6Mv5c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymrYkbEbnEQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKNLjgUZzfo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVri9T8XeTI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHhgjKaLHJw

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 09:57:09 2017 No.4481707
File: 93 KB, 640x480, Quake_46.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>4466485
>Just a pixelated, brown mess.
Oh, fuck off.
>Whereas (much later game I know) Unreal looks beautiful in software rendered mode.
Unreal wasn't made for DOS with 256 color limit to adhere (Quake had 16grade lighting to, which effectively limited its palette to 15-16 colors).
Also, Unreal in software mode has ugly as fuck forced dithering.

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:00:17 2017 No.4481708

>>4481702
> I'm linking the games he says did Goldeneye before Goldeneye.
DarkForces was doing Goldeneye before Goldeneye.

As for the games I've named, I've named them specifically as either games with pronounced cinematic sensibilities (Realms of the Haunting, Cybermage, Doom, Assassin2015), or the games that were markedly non-Doom due to being released before Doom (Battlezone, Unreal Underworld, Pathways into Darkness). You either can't read for shit, or intentionally trying to twist my words.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:01:20 2017 No.4481710 >>4481708 >Ultima Underworld

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:06:23 2017 No.4481720

>>4481708
Neither are what he meant. You've linked games that are either cinematic in style (or adventure game like) or have RPG-elements.

Goldeneye was special for its time because it was all real-time action like Doom (no adventure game elements or story shit) yet integrated cinematic action into the gameplay itself, and also had no RPG elements whatsoever. Not a single game on your list is like that.

They might have bits and pieces here and there, but Goldeneye is still distinguished from them.

>DarkForces was doing Goldeneye before Goldeneye.
and lol, this is still a complete joke

Dark Forces is Doom + storytelling + environmental gimmicks. Still a great game of course. But not Goldeneye before Goldeneye.

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:06:50 2017 No.4481721

>>4481708
>DarkForces
Meaning, DarkForces, and, later, JediKnight, were related to StarWars movies (attempt to emulate the movies within FPS framework to the fullest extent possible) in EXACTLY the same way, as GoldenEye007 was related to the Bond movies, or TRON2.0 later was related to the TRON movie, or Escape from Butcher Bay was related to the Pitch Black and Chronicles of Riddick movies.

It's called licensed fucking media.

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:12:25 2017 No.4481731

>>4481720
>Goldeneye was special for its time because it was all real-time action like Doom (no adventure game elements or story shit) yet integrated cinematic action into the gameplay itself, and also had no RPG elements whatsoever.
Well, that trend has obviously originated with Another World. Why should Goldeneye take the credit for that?

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:15:38 2017 No.4481737 File: 85 KB, 241x259, doggo.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4481731 Are you being deliberately stupid? Cause last time I checked, Another World wasn't an FPS.

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:19:22 2017 No.4481739

>>4481737
So? It was "real-time action", it "intergrated cinematic action into the gameplay itself, and also had no RPG elements whatsoever". Point is, it was a game that played like a movie. Sure, Goldeneye and Half-Life brought that to the first-person perspective, but neither of them INVENTED (well, maybe only in "reinventing the wheel" sense) that way of gameplay-story integration, they have merely ADAPTED it to a different genre.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:22:16 2017 No.4481742 >>4481739 I think with your posts we have now hit everything on this list, your contribution being #4.

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:23:34 2017 No.4481743 File: 165 KB, 757x662, 14099920715153.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4481739 I think with your posts we have now hit everything on this list, your contribution being #4.

Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:37:57 2017 No.4481764

>>4481743
Actually, come to think of it, non-intrusive scripting in 90s games, and its origins, is an interesting (at least, to me) topic, and I feel, that it was quite a hot theme back then. I mean, that's what Half-Life and arguably Goldeneye are most famous for, that's the main thing The Last Express had going for it, that's the thing that still differentiates SuperMetroid (the bits with neutral elements) from any other Metroid game. Well, Another World and Heart of Darkness too, obviously.
Any other notable examples?
Ecstatica had a wandering monster - does that count as well?
Do games that tried to be full blown system simulation games (like Sentient - if we forget that it was almost unplayable) count too?

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 10:39:00 2017 No.4481768 >>4481764 >(the bits with neutral ANIMALS)

>>	Anonymous Mon Dec 25 20:05:12 2017 No.4482656 >>4481685 I don't think you understand the term "cinematic realism". You should watch the post-mortem on the game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdsDVJwROVU

Advanced search
Text to find
Subject [?]Search by post subject. Leave empty for any.
Username [?]Search for user name. Leave empty for any user name.
Tripcode [?]Search for tripcode. Leave empty for any.
Email [?]Search by email. Leave empty for any.
Filename [?]Search by image filename. Leave empty for any.
From Date [?]Enter what date to start searching from. Format is YYYY-MM-DD
To Date [?]Enter what date to start searching until. Format is YYYY-MM-DD
Image hash
Search in	All Posts OPs Only
Deleted posts	Show all posts Show only deleted posts Only show non-deleted posts
Internal posts	Show all posts Show only internal posts Show only archived posts
Order	New posts first Old posts first
Capcode	All Posts Only by Users Only by Mods Only by Admins Only by Developers
Results	Posts Threads
Action	[ Simple ]

/vr/ - Retro Games