/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.420436]

Why do people say Project 64 version 1.6 is better than version 2.0. I am confused on that, version 2.0 doesn't have the annoying menu problem in Zelda OoT or Majora's Mask.

BTW - Whats the best N64 emulator for WIndows 7?

[Anonymous No.420453]

>Whats the best N64 emulator for WIndows 7
they're all shit

[Anonymous No.420791]

>>420436

Project 64 2.0 is being developed without the help of Jabo, who created the main graphics and audio plugins for Project 64.

As such, 2.0 has plugins which are worse than the 1.6.1 plugins Jabo released independently back in 2011.

When you say menu problem, do you mean the brief pause, or the graphics corruption?

Project 64 1.6.1 (An update on 1.6 released by Jabo) is generally more stable than 2.0, since 2.0 is a bit of a mess, and some plugins have compatibility issues.

You should also get the latest Unoffical RDB for Project 64. It fixes a few issues.

[Anonymous No.420987]

>>420791

OP Here

So if I am understanding correctly Project 64 1.6.1 is better than 1.6 and 2.0 and is the best version?

I was referring to the brief pause with the menu. I believe there was a fix that you could enable through a cheat code but I don't remember clearly.

[Anonymous No.421020]

>>420436
My 2.0 just straight blue screens when I try to play games, thats the only reason im using 1.6 right now

[Anonymous No.421030]

I know that 1.6 is the only version that has the Jabo plugin with proper widescreen support

Does 2.0 have any kind of widescreen?

[Anonymous No.421052]

>>420987
Subscreen delay fix. Check cheat menu (CTRL+C) while game is running.

Only use (U) region Zelda roms. (E) region ones run slower.

Project 64 1.6.1 fixes some graphics problems in Majora's Mask.

And make sure you get the Unofficial RDB.

[Anonymous No.421059]

>>421052
Too bad 1.6 doesn't recognize Master Quest properly so I can't apply the cheat.

[Anonymous No.421078]

>>421030
Glide64 can force 16/9, and AFAIK it does that sort of thing better than Jabo. But the plugins used in 2.0 ATM are utter crap. The advanced settings menu doesn't work last time I checked. The reason is that they don't have Jabo anymore, meaning the 1.6.1 update by Jabo, released on his own, is much better than the "official" plugins inside 2.0

[Anonymous No.421094]

>>421059
Firstly, get 1.6.1, then google for an updated Cheat Database. They exist.

And PJ64 won't recognise Master Quest without the Unofficial RDB (Rom Database.)

[Anonymous No.421102]

>>421094
Too much effort, I'd rather just call the emulator shit on the internet.

[Anonymous No.421119]

>>421030

Outside of stretching, not really

[Anonymous No.421153]

>>421119
What about "Force 16/9?"

And there may be more options under advanced.

I'd honestly be wary about PJ64 2.0's jabo plugin, since it seems to be based on jabo 1.7 beta, which is inferior to Jabo 1.6.1 for reasons which involve jabo getting fed up with the PJ64 team and unceremoniously quitting the project.

[Anonymous No.421252]

>>421153
>And there may be more options under advanced.

No there isn't

[Anonymous No.421275]

How well does it emulate DK64?

Last time I ran it on P64 it ran like garbage.

[Anonymous No.421280]

>>421252
That's the general settings. You have to go to the ones for the plugin itself.

[Anonymous No.421336]

>>421275

Ran ok but the screen shot is with the Force 16/9 aspect ratio. LOL

[Anonymous No.421393]

>>421336
I'm always amazed just how shit N64 textures were.

[Anonymous No.421417]

Every time I try to run a game with PJ64 2.0, I BSOD. I don't have this issue with the same games in other emulators.

[Anonymous No.421434]

>>421393
looks fine for the hardware. what do you expect?

[Anonymous No.421435]

>>421393
I feel the same way about PSX. Fucking grainy, pixelated shit.

[Anonymous No.421448]

>>421435
I was surprised when I played the Playstation version of Rayman 2 recently, and I saw how much it looked like the N64 version I'm most familiar with. It's like there was no difference between the two, despite the major hardware gap.

[Anonymous No.421494]

>>421275
DK64 requires game to be synched to audio.

Honestly, ignore 2.0 unless you're desperate. It does almost ZERO things 1.6.1 doesn't do better.

[Anonymous No.421558]

>>421448
I believe that's because the N64 Rayman 2 came first. The game doesn't particularly stress the hardware. So the PSX version looks more or less the same, just without perspective correction.

Same with Toy Story 2. Key difference between versions is texture wobbling on PSX.

[Anonymous No.421583]

>>421558
Is texture wobbling that weird aliasing in PSX games?

I'd take N64s smoothed textures over that shit any day. PSX games look disgusting in motion.

[Anonymous No.421625]

>>421583
that weird texture was because PSX did not have perspective fix for textures. So, there.

[Anonymous No.421657]

>>421494
>DK64 requires game to be synched to audio
Why?

[Anonymous No.421682]

>>421583
Texture wobbling doesn't mean the fact that the pixels weren't smoothed. The textures also jumped around all over the place depending on your perspective.

[Anonymous No.421803]

>>421682
>>421583

Playing some Playstation games now makes me feel like i just took acid, breathing walls and shit

[Anonymous No.422710]

I don't know what you guys are on about 2.0's plugin not supporting widescreen. It does, it's just that it's disabled by default in a lot of games, mostly because they have issues with pop-in at the sides. You can easily override that setting if you wish.

Still, it's buggy as hell and I do not recommend it over 1.6.1.

[Anonymous No.422732]

>>421435
The N64's textures are just as bad if not worse due to its incredibly small texture cache. This fact is covered up by texture filtering, however, which the PS1 did not do. Remove the filtering, however, and...

[Anonymous No.422735]

>>420436
>Whats the best N64 emulator for WIndows 7
Windows 7 is shit.
Use an OS that respects your freedom.

[Anonymous No.422746]

>>422732
Wow.
That looks way better.
I'll take pixelated shit over blurry shit any day.

[Anonymous No.422753]

>>422732

kinda has a spyro vibe now.

[Anonymous No.422782]

>>422753
I'd say Spyro has better textures.

[Anonymous No.422795]

>>421393
Same here, but I really don't mind them

[Anonymous No.422830]

>>422732
It kinda would look better if the textures flowed together instead of being random squares

[Anonymous No.422869]

>>422830
These textures were meant to be filtered so they looked ok on the real system. I just turned off the filtering by force to expose them for how the actually look like.

[Anonymous No.422879]

Emulators are won the best things ever invented. Thank you , whoever invented them, for inventing them.

[Anonymous No.422906]

>>422869
Ah yeah that makes sense. Maybe someone could do a re-texture to make the game look better untextured? Would be interesting.

[Anonymous No.422932]

>>422735
Seriously?

>translation: use an OS where you need to use Wine/tricks to get all the good shit

Windows 7 is fucking awesome btw, call 8 shit all you want, I have no special affinity for Microshit, but 7 is like the greatest OS of all-time, barring FreeBSD.

[Anonymous No.422970]

>>422735
What? Windows 7 is on par with XP for greatness. It's 8 that is absolute shit.

[Anonymous No.423048]

>>422932
What, precisely, is "all the good shit"? I haven't run dual-boot in years, and I've missed nothing.

[Anonymous No.423050]

>>422735
Get out Stallman.

[Anonymous No.423079]

>>423048
>dual-boot
>Wine/tricks
>anything in common

wtfamireading.exe

[Anonymous No.423075]

>>422735

OP Here

I use Linux on my laptop so fuck off

[Anonymous No.423096]

>>423079

Correction

wine wtfamireading.exe

[Anonymous No.423107]

>>422906
There's a bunch of hi-res texture packs, but they either suck, or they clash with the game's art style and look nothing like the original textures.

[Anonymous No.423112]

>>423096
Touche.

[Anonymous No.423120]

>>423079
>Booting into windows to run windows programs
>Running windows programs through a compatibility layer
>Not related
The point is that I haven't needed to run a Windows executable in years.
Windows is a fucking mess, and isn't even relevant on the enterprise space anymore (unless you're a secretary or work in a call center). Have you ever programmed with Windows APIs? It's a goddamn nightmare.

[Anonymous No.423141]

>>423120
>Have you ever programmed with Windows APIs?
Yes. If you're talking C#/.NET then yeah, it's pretty bad, I'll agree with you there.
Some Windows stuff is nice though, like SQL Server.

>enterprise
Sometimes it's good to know the audience you're speaking to. I don't get how the discussion just switching to enterprise/programming anyway.

[Anonymous No.423142]

>>423096

Even better

#include <stdio.h>
int main()
{
puts("wtfamireading");
}

[Anonymous No.423186]

>People saying Project64 has ever been better than Mupen64Plus

[Anonymous No.423191]

>>423141
I was speaking of the C/C++ APIs. They even break the C standards.
Windows SQL server is fucking awful. Postgres beats it in literally every single way. Hell, even MySQL beats MSSQL now.
And enterprise gravitates toward things that are faster, easier, and more secure.
It's worse to use for a consumer, unless you are accustomed to Win Cludgery and are afraid of change, it's worse to use if you value security, transparency, or performance, and it's worse to use if you're a programmer.
Literally the only valid reason to use Windows is "This program I need only runs on it".

[Anonymous No.423202]

>>423142
>C
>empty main parameter list
>puts
>no line break
>no return from int function
I hope you don't fancy yourself a programmer, or at least not a C programmer.

[Anonymous No.423212]

>>423202

[Anonymous No.423215]

>>420436
>2.0 doesn't have the annoying menu problem in Zelda OoT or Majora's Mask
Neither did 1.6. You just don't know how to set up your emulator.
And Majora's Mask never had the problem to begin with.

[Anonymous No.423224]

>>423202
>not liking C

>>423142
>terrible syntax
0/10 code, wouldn't compile

>>423212
>being a fagot

[Anonymous No.423219]

>>423202

LOL

I am better at Java and web programming, I am learning C.

Want to do embedded actually.

[Anonymous No.423231]

/g/ PLS FUCKING GO
/g/ BITTE LASSEN

[Anonymous No.423262]

Why cant they just put all the best from the different emulators and make one with online support. Have to use 3 different emulators based on what you wanna do. Its annoying as fuck

You want to play this game? Use this one
You want to play multiplayer online? Use this other one
The game isnt working right? try this emulator with a dif plug in

Its fucking annoying, I fucking hate n64 emulators, I just want to play n64 games with proper widescreen support in online multiplayer that wont desync crash everyone.

fuck life.

[Anonymous No.423278]

>>423262
Then fork them yourself, if you think it's so easy, damn it.

[Anonymous No.423284]

>>423262
Because the main dev of PJ64 is a colossal dickburger and he bitches out anybody who tries to make a different emulator. If somebody surpasses him, how will he keep his e-fame?

[Anonymous No.423294]

>>423278
Because I dont into emulator creating

N64 emulators have been around for fucking 10 years, a lot more progress should have been made by now from people who know the shit.

I never said it was easy, I asked why cant they. So dont give me that do it yourself shit, faggot.

[Anonymous No.423304]

>>423294
But why don't you?

[Anonymous No.423306]

>>423284
Is that why Jabo left?

[Anonymous No.423312]

>>423224
I love C. The first line was putting the rest into scope.
No pun intended.

[Anonymous No.423314]

>>423306
Probably. That's why, despite being the lead dev of the most popular N64 emulator around, he's been banned from most online emulation community.

[Anonymous No.423317]

>>423314
communities*

[Anonymous No.423343]

>>423314
>>423284
Are you talking about mudlord? He's not the main developer of PJ64, Zilmar is. Mudlord did some coding and developed a few plugins IIRC, but he's hardly in charge. He's just a huge faggot who apes PJ64 and harasses anyone who one-ups it.

[Anonymous No.423376]

Sometimes Castlevania Legacy of Darkness crash when you are rotating the camera too much

Someone know what kind of problem is this?

[Anonymous No.423450]

>>423294
They can't because it's not very easy to.
Way to not infer.

[Anonymous No.423610]

>>422906
Sure, dude. There have been a number of texture projects, some of them rather impressive.

On another note, many people on here don't realise is that some N64 "textures" were not what they appeared. Mario 64 is an excellent example, uses extensive gouraud shading. (A technique which smoothly maps a colour across a surface. Mario's body is largely textured using this method, rather than with proper textures.) A majority of Goldeneye's textures were monochrome, with colour added via shading.

The 4kb texture cache issue wasn't really solved until late in the N64's life. Comparing Majora's Mask to Ocarina of Time or Banjo Tooie to Banjo Kazooie shows how much methods improved.

[Anonymous No.423731]

>>421102

[Anonymous No.424229]

>>423262
You do realise how mind-fuckingly complicated multiplayer emulation is, right? Even the ones which do work can't handle stuff like Perfect Dark.

>>423107
>>There's a bunch of hi-res texture packs, but they either suck, or they clash with the game's art style and look nothing like the original textures.

Depends on the pack. Some of them are genuinely good.

>>422732
>>The N64's textures are just as bad if not worse due to its incredibly small texture cache.

OoT is a poor example. Does anyone have unfiltered screenshots of Perfect Dark, Majora's Mask, etc?

[Anonymous No.424285]

Majora's Mask unfiltered. Not GREAT, but better than OoT by a significant margin.

[Anonymous No.424293]

>>424285
>stretched

[Anonymous No.424298]

Perfect Dark unfiltered textures. Pretty good, IMO. Only thing seriously noticeable is the coronas not being blended correctly.

[Anonymous No.424312]

>>424293
Whoops. I forgot to change the setting after running Perfect Dark, which is natively 16\9

Here's another unfiltered PD screenshot.

[Anonymous No.424328]

>>424293
>>424312
Hey, wait, I take that back. The screenshot was taken with 16\9 forced, so it's not stretched at all. It's just rendering in 16\9.

[Anonymous No.424342]

>Playing goldeneye using the 1964 60fps hack with mouse and keyboard support

[Anonymous No.424353]

>>424342
>mouse and keyboard support
WHERE
DOES THIS WORK FOR JFG AS WELL?

[Anonymous No.424345]

>>424298
>>424312
>>424285
Go on, everyone, tell us how the N64 had textures which were shit smeared across toasted bread slices.

[Anonymous No.424347]

>>424312
God, these screenshots actually look worse than the how it looked on the real system.

[Anonymous No.424360]

>>424347
Way to miss the point. The texture filtering is disabled. Texture filtering is a pretty important part of rendering, but it masks low quality textures. However, N64 games released towards the end of the console's life had much better textures and texture mapping techniques, and the 4kb texture cache became less of an issue.

[Anonymous No.424363]

>>424353
sadly no, it only works for Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, and Goldeneye X fanhack.
http://www.shootersforever.com/forums_message_boards/viewtopic.php?t=5373

[Anonymous No.424403]

havent updated 1.6, playing with a ps3 controller, how does /vr/ configure there button layout? what do you all play with?

[Anonymous No.424428]

>>424360
Did the Expansion Pack play a part in boosting the system's graphical capabilities?

[Anonymous No.424449]

>>424403
I use a mouse-keyboard for FPS games.

And an Xbox 360 controller for some others, or keyboard.

Just map the buttons to their N64 versions, using the Gamecube as an example.

C Buttons = Right Stick.
Stick = Stick.

LR-Shoulder buttons. L-1 and R-1
Z- probably R-2?

D-pad = D-pad.

A and B can go to CROSS and CIRCLE or whatever you please. On an X360 controller, just map them to A and B.

[Anonymous No.424478]

>>424428
Slightly. It did allow more room for textures. But the basic problem of the N64 only being able to render one 64x64 texture at a time had to be solved via layering and stitching lots of little textures together. Which is one reason they look so bad unfiltered. The filtering helps the smaller textures blend together without a patchwork effect.

However, Conker's Bad Fur Day didn't use the expansion pack, despite being released in 2001. Rareware instead streamed textures and assets off the game cart in real time.

[Anonymous No.424485]

>>424449
Use R2 for R and L2 for Z, since they're more used than L.
L goes on L1.
Figure out the ecksbawks names for these buttons for yourself. I don't know them. Never had one.

[Anonymous No.424489]

>>424478
And CBFD is one of the best-looking games on the console. Why didn't more developers use that method?

[Anonymous No.424502]

>>424485
Fine advice, dear chap. Yes, I forgot that the N64 rarely uses the L button. It's probably a good idea to reverse those mappings, so R2 is Z and L2 is R, since Z is the n64 trigger button, and most consoles use R instead of L for firing weapons.

[Anonymous No.424516]

>>424502
Hmm, Alright. I just got done playing CBFD and am currently on Banjo-Kazooie (Currently working through a N64 Backlog) and that button config worked well. Hold R2 to aim, tap L2 to fire.

[Anonymous No.424529]

>>424489
>>Why didn't more developers use that method?

Because they ran out of time. Conker was one of the last games for the console, it took years to get N64 graphics to that level, and most developers lacked the raw coding skill to design such elegant software solutions to the N64's hardware limitations.

One notable exception was Factor 5, who made the Star Wars games and the Indiana Jones game, which looked better than the PC version.

It's very much like the PSX's texture wobbling due to lack of perspective correction. In truth, there were methods which could be used to counter it, but very few developers had the chops to do it.

[Anonymous No.424547]

>>424529
>Conker was one of the last games for the console
Conker, incidentally, kinda looks shit unfiltered. Not because the textures are particularly bad - they're passable - but because the game's special effects require filtering to render correctly. Conker's shadow looks terrible unfiltered.

[Anonymous No.424581]

Conker's textures are uneven. Good example:

[Anonymous No.424601]

And here's a bad example:

(That said, it still looks better texture-wise than most N64\PSX games.)

[Anonymous No.424602]

>>424547
IMO the game looked really bad because most of the game was dirt and old wood textures. It used a really good method that would've looked good with any other texture. The matrix level is a really good example. When you have a texture that's supposed to look bad and then fill your whole game with it...

[Anonymous No.424606]

And here's an iconic shot. Unfiltered, of course.

[Anonymous No.424617]

Question: Are there any good plugins with Antialiasing? I can't find the option in Glide64

[Anonymous No.424618]

>>424602
Note if you will, though, how beautifully the green is mapped onto the wall on the right? That was not an easy effect to achieve - layering vegetation textures over a cliff like that.

[Anonymous No.424625]

>>424617
I'm pretty sure there's a good reasons for that. I think AA might screw up the framebuffer. If you really want it, use Jabo 1.6.1

[Anonymous No.424661]

Has anyone done anything good with the source code yet? Can anything good be done with it?

[Anonymous No.424693]

>>424661
>Can anything good be done with it?

The problem isn't the source code. PJ64's core emulation is passable. Sure, it has some bugs I'd like to see fixed, but that's not the real problem.

The real problem is the fact that video plugin development has been stalled for years. Glide64 is great, but it's still got issues and has been abandoned since 2012, and Jabo quit the scene meaning that his plugin won't be updated.

Honestly, this same issue haunts PCSX2, since the graphics plugin has more or less stalled on that, too.

[Anonymous No.424730]

Is there a better Sega emulator than Gens Plus?

[Anonymous No.424752]

>>424730
Yes there is. Gens is shit. Use Kega Fusion

[Anonymous No.424757]

>>424730
Fusion

[Anonymous No.424759]

>>424730
Depends on which Sega console you're trying to emulate, which platform you're emulating it on. (Windows, Linux, etc.)

[Anonymous No.424774]

>>424752
>Gens+
>Not updating to the new constantly-maintained Gens/GS

[Anonymous No.424808]

>>424730
no, not really.

[Anonymous No.424796]

>>424774
Which sadly is still not as good as Fusion.

[Anonymous No.424815]

>>424796
What does Fusion do better?

[Anonymous No.424819]

>>424815
Pretty much everything. Emulation quality is much higher.

[Anonymous No.424820]

>>424759
Windows7, sorry forgot to mention. And I was hoping to emulate multiple systems to keep things simple on a htpc I'm putting together for emulating games.

>>424752
>>424757
Nice didn't know about this one. I was hoping for a multi system emulator like plus and this seems to fit the bill.

>>424774
How does GS compare to Fusion?

[Anonymous No.424842]

>>424820
It isn't as good. It isn't as accurate in any aspect of emulation.

[Anonymous No.424941]

>>424842
It's very flexible and runs faster though...

[Anonymous No.425047]

>>424941
If you have a computer from the 90's i guess gens is better to use.

[Anonymous No.425080]

>>424819
I haven't run into problems with Gens, though.

What are some games that Gens doesn't run correctly?

[Anonymous No.425101]

>>424774
How is Gens+ GX core for RetroArch in terms of emulation?

I'm just asking because it's the only emulator I have that can run Pier Solar with the Sega CD music and still save just fine. IIRC, some version of MESS does it too, but it's a pain to use.

I'm just wondering because I'm still using Kega as my main, but I wouldn't mind switching over fully to another emulator if it did what I needed better. Otherwise, I'll just keep RetroArch around for the few weird games.

[Anonymous No.425129]

Do you get better performance with texture filtering turned off?

[Anonymous No.425130]

>>425101

It's Genesis Plus GX, it's not related to Gens rather it's a continuation of Genesis Plus.

It's Genesis and Sega CD emulation is very comparable to Kega Fusion, and it's been ported to a lot of platforms thanks to RetroArch

[Anonymous No.425151]

>>425130
So, basically, it's pretty good.

Alright, thank you.

[Anonymous No.425530]

>>424693
Glide64 has a continuation in Glide64mk2 for Mupen64plus. However, I've read they're approaching the limitations of what's possible through Glide or something, so a better OpenGL plugin might be something worth pursuing.

That said, I kinda just want a plugin that renders the N64's video output natively and accurately. Jabo's 1.7 plugin for PJ64 2.0 does have such a capability, but, well, it's buggy as all shit.

[Anonymous No.425549]

>>425530
Oh, and I believe Jabo's plugin could be improved, since the source code for it is included along with 2.0's source code. Who knows, though, since I haven't looked at it much and maybe it's poorly documented, so only Jabo could make heads or tails out of it.

[Anonymous No.425562]

>>425101
>>425130
Only thing that I've seen Kega do better than Genplus GX is that the latter doesn't have 32X compatibility.

[Anonymous No.425585]

>>425549
Are you sure about that? I'm pretty sure Jabo never let the PJ64 team see his source code. Last time I checked, "not even Zilmar has seen it."

So why would it be included with PJ64 2.0?

[Anonymous No.425642]

>>425585
I could be wrong. I remember I saw code for a video plugin in the source code, but it might have been something else. If that's not it, then I guess that's that.

Why is Jabo so fucking protective of his code, anyway? Even his shitty NES emulator (which is apparently super popular for some reason) is closed source. Not to mention his decision to release an update to his plugins and PJ64 itself, but without accompanying code. I mean, that's kind of a bro thing to do and all, but is he so vain that absolutely no one can see how it really works?

I don't understand this mentality, especially when it comes to free software. Why hide your code unless you're plagiarizing or commercializing it?

[Anonymous No.425741]

>>425642
>Why is Jabo so fucking protective of his code, anyway?

Because he knew that just about everyone else involved in PJ64 were greedy. The moment he released his source, Zilmar and the others could have made him redundant. Keeping his source closed allowed him to keep their fuckwittery in check... for awhile. But eventually he got fed up and left.

It's complicated, really. Open Source isn't always as good as it sounds, especially when half the people who will contribute are egotistical money-hungry asshats.

[Anonymous No.425770]

>>425741
Good point. I don't know why that didn't occur to me.

Still, what the hell is this code for a video plugin I'm seeing in the 2.0 code, then?

[Anonymous No.425773]

>>420791
Could you post a pack with 1.6.1 and all the good stuff you mentioned? Please?

[Anonymous No.425825]

>>425773
http://www.moddb.com/members/ambient-malice/blogs/improved-project-64-10

You'll have to install each part manually, though.

[Anonymous No.425850]

>>425825
>http://www.moddb.com/members/ambient-malice/blogs/improved-project-64-10

Easy enough, thanks!

[Anonymous No.425878]

2.0 is fine but there are a few games that don't play well that you'll need 1.6 for. so you'll just have to switch between them when one gives you trouble.

[Anonymous No.425879]

>>425770
>Still, what the hell is this code for a video plugin I'm seeing in the 2.0 code, then?

Post a screenshot. It's possibly just the plugin in precompiled form.

[Anonymous No.425942]

>>425879
Hmm, it refers to loading stuff from the plugin, so I'm guessing this isn't the plugin's source.

Welp.

[Anonymous No.426373]

>>425562
Alright then. I'll just keep around RetroArch + Genesis Plus GX core. I don't play any 32X games anyway and the functionality will probably be added sometime in the future.