/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.4178994]

Which JRPG has the most interesting battle system?

[Anonymous No.4178997]

>>4178994
None. Now, if we are talking about tactics jrpgs ...

[Anonymous No.4179005]

>>4178994
I think the Grandia and Romancing Saga games are two good examples of retro JRPGs with well done, engaging battle systems. A milder example is Super Mario RPG and Breath of Fire 4.

Beyond that, I can't think of many others.

[Anonymous No.4179008]

Vagrant Story

[Anonymous No.4179010]

SMT: Nocturne

[Anonymous No.4179012]

Hybrid Heaven. It's basically Vagrant Story with wrestling moves.

[Anonymous No.4179014]

>>4179010

What's interesting about it? It's pretty much the same formula of most Megaten games

[Anonymous No.4179040]

>>4179014
It was the debut of Press Turn.

[Anonymous No.4179046]

Treasure Hunter G, Mahjong Taisen, Final Fantasy II, Vandal Hearts 2
non-retro - Baten Kaitos Origins

[Anonymous No.4179068]

>>4178994

Eh, let's not get ahead of ourselves OP. It's basically FF6 with a interesting spell combination system. Other than that the game is garbage.

[Anonymous No.4179102]

>>4179046
>Vandal Hearts 2

Ew, nope.

[Anonymous No.4179109]

>>4179102
>shit taste

Ew, kys

[Anonymous No.4179110]

>>4179012
This, Dark Half and maybe Live A Live

[Anonymous No.4179112]

>>4179008
This and the Parasite Eve games.

[Anonymous No.4179118]

>>4178994
SMRPG

[Anonymous No.4179128]

Nothing special here but it's kinda different from the usual turn-based JRPG battles:
https://youtu.be/rOnd9r2Y3Y4

[Anonymous No.4179129]

Legend of Legaia has a very interesting battle system. Its basically a turn-based street fighter sort of system.

[Anonymous No.4179130]

Grandia: Parallel Trippers

[Anonymous No.4179136]

>>4179046
Final Fantasy II doesn't really have a different battle system from Final Fantasy I. Are you confusing character growth mechanics with battle mechanics?

[Anonymous No.4179145]

No Xenogears?

[Anonymous No.4179149]

>>4179136
character growth is tied directly to the battle system, or rather the actions you take during battle
a character can't just do nothing during battle and expect to get a certain amount of EXP and level up

[Anonymous No.4179154]

>>4178994
Chrono Trigger, Paper Mario, Mario RPG and FF VI.

[Anonymous No.4179176]

>>4178994
Breath of Fire IV in my opinion, sadly the game is pretty easy so it most is undermined until the last couple hours.
>>4179010
Really solid if simple system, but not retro.

[Anonymous No.4179185]

>>4179154
>FF VI.
it's basically ATB from FFIV
Chrono Trigger cleverly took Palom and Porom's twincast gimmick and based their entire battle system around it
square shoud've based VI's battle system around Sabin's blitzes

[Anonymous No.4179214]

>>4179185
>square shoud've based VI's battle system around Sabin's blitzes

Why would anyone want this

[Anonymous No.4179221]

>>4179214
because they're by far the most fun part of the battle system
too bad the samurai shodown rpg is never getting translated because it had the same idea

[Anonymous No.4179231]

>>4179145
this isnt the least interesting battle system thread

[Interesting game mechanics No.4179263]

>>4178994
Pokemon

[Anonymous No.4179269]

Really liked Valkyrie Profiles battle system, very exciting and rewarding when you get the timing of your multi character combo just right

Unrelated but some of the attacks are just beautiful too

[Anonymous No.4179270]

>>4179263

in before someone who's never battled another actual player scoffs at this post.

[Anonymous No.4179284]

>>4178994
My favorites are SaGa Frontier and Lufia 3.

[Anonymous No.4179313]

Bushi Seiryūden: Futari no Yūsha's turn-based platforming system

[Anonymous No.4179382]

magna braban, it's sort of like FFXII but more involving since you have to switch between A.I. settings

[Anonymous No.4179390]

Panzer Dragoon Saga was a lot of fun and unique.

[Anonymous No.4179406]

>>4179005
Grandia. I loved the system. Timing was really key. You did not just mash attack the whole time. You could counter, or even cancel enemy attacks when timed properly. You could also forego attacking, or defending and chose to move your character out of harms way. Very engaging, and keeps the game fresh.
>>4179008
VS had a good system. A modern version would be great. Somehow it's too slow. I always liked the idea of battle mode, being slow motion instead of everything stops.
>>4179154
Chrono Trigger? I would disagree. Your guys just walk around randomly and might line up for a tag team move. Other than that it;s every other rpg of the era battle wise.

[下げ No.4179437]

>JRPG
>good gameplay

Oxymoron.

[Anonymous No.4179476]

44179437
>namefag
Opinion invalid, not giving the (You).

[Anonymous No.4179513]

>>4179270
isn't pokemon full of autistic min/maxing and broken mechanics

[Anonymous No.4179517]

>>4179185
Not retro, but you'd probably like LISA the painful. Most all melee party members have blitz commands. There are several instances where the main character can choose to lose an arm and it causes the commands and available moves to change accordingly.

[Anonymous No.4179518]

>>4179149
It is kind of hard for your character to do nothing during battle.

[Anonymous No.4179529]

>>4178994
how much hate will I get for saying undertale?

[Anonymous No.4179530]

FFX

[Anonymous No.4179532]

>>4179529
You'll just be called a dumbass for recommending a shmup in an RPG thread.

[Anonymous No.4179540]

>>4179529
it's the only reason I finished it

[Anonymous No.4179563]

>>4179540
honestly though, I really liked Undertale, what killed it for me was the fanbase and lack of replay value

[Anonymous No.4179568]

>>4179518
yeah, but in most other rpgs you can skip turns and it doesn't really matter what your chatacters do during battle (if they do anything at all) or how often they do something
all they have to do is stay alive at the end of the battle and they'll get some exp
in a way, the character development system and battle system are one and the same in FFII

[Anonymous No.4179585]

>>4179568
I cannot think of a lot of old JRPG's in which you can skip your turn. Sure there are some, but it doesn't seem common. You couldn't do that in the first Final Fantasy so it just carried over the battle mechanics from the first one which made it so the growth mechanics went well with it.

Not to say that you won't be making certain decisions in battle to facilitate growth for your characters like keeping them at low HP rather than healing them to have the possibility of HP growth. It is just that the battle mechanics are fairly standard. Though if I remember correctly not a lot of JRPG's used elemental weaknesses and resistance on enemies at the time so it had a leg up on that.

[Anonymous No.4179589]

>>4179563
I was tempted to drop it during the fight with the faggot guards and the date with the gay fish
there's only so much dumblr pandering I can stand, if it didn't have the battle system I would've dropped it

and that's all I have to say about undertale

[Anonymous No.4179649]

>>4178994
Not sure if this counts, but, hybrid heaven, maybe?

[Anonymous No.4179668]

>>4179129
I fucking love legend of legaia. One of my favorite rpgs

[Anonymous No.4179728]

>>4178994
Romancing SaGa 2.

[Anonymous No.4179736]

>>4179118
I enjoy how it actually rewards reflexes and timing and makes moving around between battles actually fun.

[Anonymous No.4179815]

>>4178994
SaGa games for sure, there's nothing that can approach the level of depth, originality and desire of innovation of that series.

That said, there are some other great games too, Gunparade March also has a very neat command script based battle system and is possibly one of the deepest in its subgenre together with a few other games like Front Mission 2, Hybrid Heaven is also another game with a really interesting take on battle systems.

[Anonymous No.4179925]

The Legend of Dragoon

[Anonymous No.4179934]

>>4179269
> Valkyrie Profile
This. Best retro combat system.

[Anonymous No.4179949]

Also Tales of Destiny and Tales of Eternia

[Anonymous No.4180104]

>Retro
SaGa series.

>not retro
MMBN doesn't get enough credit for being unique in this area.

[Anonymous No.4180114]

>>4178994
Good system that encourages experimentation and diverse tactics. Sadly it never really sees it's full potential due to the low difficulty.

[Anonymous No.4180120]

>>4180114
>Sadly it never really sees it's full potential due to the low difficulty.
Chrono Cross is in the same boat, even though it has no leveling.

[Anonymous No.4180376]

Romancing SaGas

[Anonymous No.4180461]

>>4179406
The issue with Grandia games is that both 1 and 2 are literally mash X to win. You only need to think a bit with bosses.

Grandia 3 ramped up the difficulty quite a bit however. Its my favorite one too, I dont see why its so hated.

[Anonymous No.4180476]

>>4179589
it makes me sad that it gets this reaction when it's obvious that the dev team intentionally purposefully downplayed the lgbt themes and elements, most likely as a result of being cautioned by the distributors

and people still get all fragile butterfly about it making them upset because they have to deal with the dreaded gay

people call you a nazi when you act all homophobic and anti gay, but it's always the abrahamic trinity that's to blame, which makes nazis kind of pro-lgbt when you think about it

[Anonymous No.4180507]

>>4180476
your post has nothing to do with this thread's topic and the game you're discussing isn't even retro

>>>/co/
>>>/lgbt/
>>>/trash/

[Anonymous No.4180512]

>>4179005
>>4179728
>>4179815
>>4180104
>>4180376
>SaGa
>/vr/ is still trying to force this meme

[Anonymous No.4180534]

>>4180507
discussion of homosexuality is perfectly on topic for a JRPG thread

[Anonymous No.4180585]

>>4179513
It's full of minmaxing, but the mechanics aren't broken since everyone has acess to them. It's at least less broken than infinite combos on fighting games.

[Anonymous No.4180591]

>>4180512
which anime is that? looks like the kind of late 80s/early 90s thing i'm in the mood for right now.

[Anonymous No.4180594]

>>4180591
Bubblegum Crisis, it's extremely 80s.

[Anonymous No.4180608]

>>4180512
>posting on /vr when your power-level is this low
holy shit are you an actual girl or something or just retarded

[Anonymous No.4180914]

>>4180512
>Shitting up a polite and peaceful thread
>Shitting on a great series
>VLC
>worst bubblegum
The textbook definition of tryhard plebeian.

[Anonymous No.4180934]

>>4178994
dark souls

[Anonymous No.4181169]

not retro
also
>using auto

[Anonymous No.4181214]

>>4180914
Nothing wrong with VLC. I see you've fallen for that mplayer may-may.

Regarding the topic of this thread, I would say that the most fun I've had has been with Tales of Phantasia's Linear Motion Battle System. Makes grinding those 1000+ battles a breeze and allows for some fun cheesing. Its only flaw is that the magic casting pauses the action and makes battles a time consuming chore in the long run.

[Anonymous No.4181287]

>>4181214
VLC kind of ruins some anime since even I can see the pixelization (or whatever you call it when the image is partly blocky in the sections it gradually changes colors), and I'm usually the guy who doesn't see diference between 720p and 1080p.
It's a good player to keep for when my crappy toaster has difficult decoding things for mpc, since it's able to lightly run most shit, but youtube is equally as good for that if you can find the anime you want to see in it.
Now, to keep in topic, I'm casting a vote for persona 1 and 2, because it has the whole "talk to demons" fad but you can see your character's sprites (and I was never much into the first person turn-based rpg fad dragonquest and smt had).

[Anonymous No.4181707]

>>4179949
I thought it was brilliant how you can keep only two ultimate magics at a time.

[Anonymous No.4181741]

>>4179476
>he doesn't know moon for "sage"
lol EOPcucks

[Anonymous No.4182606]

>>4179145
Xenogears combat is wasted potential. Could have been better if the moves had additional effects and not just "deals damage".

[Anonymous No.4182636]

>>4178994
I really loved the original Baten Kaitos
each character has access to a deck with unique attack cards, shared support cards, differing defense cards based on race
You can get higher chances of getting a limit break card depending on how you interact with the character you control and using different cards in certain combinations gives you an entirely new card
I think my favorite mechanics have to be the way the game uses the time mechanic. most games seem to ignore it as nothing but a record of how long you took to beat the game, but this one use the shit out of it. certain cards change depending on how long you have them (ex: fire swords become normal low-quality swords if you hold them too long, ice melts, food spoils, etc) and there's even a mission in the game where the reward deteriorates to a lower quality if you take too long

[Anonymous No.4182638]

>>4179046
I'm fairly certain gamecube counts as retro by this point

[Anonymous No.4182651]

>>4179530
controversial opinion, but I liked the battle systems in both X and X-2
X was very much a tried and true formula with turned based combat, everyone's got their own section of the grid and can branch out to everyone elses, etc. I just wish Khimari got a better deal (if anything because you've actually gotta solo a two-on-one boss fight with him)

X-2, on the other hand, seemed more like something out of FFV with everyone doing different jobs and leveling those up independently of their own personal levels. it's a game where it actually sucks to be a mage because ethers are in short supply and your best healer is item based rather than mana
now if only the story was better. and the voice acting. and the villain

[Anonymous No.4182657]

>>4181169
too bad this franchise is hard to get for under $50 each

[Anonymous No.4182661]

>>4182657
just emulate koudelka and skip the rest they're pretty generic

Nocturne just takes a huge steaming humiliating dump all over both shadow hearts games, and then they made DDS too

[Anonymous No.4182673]

>>4182661
you can like both game m8
also while i love nocturne, the battles system didn't really do much for me as much as the setting did.

[Anonymous No.4182680]

>>4182673
Press turn is a pretty nice system. It's simple but there is a strategy to it. Abusing a boss' weaknesses on all fpur turns to get an entire extra four turns is always satisfying. Maybe try IV:A, best combat by far but worse story and cast as well. Overall I still think nocturne is the best.

[Anonymous No.4182683]

>>4182661
>just emulate koudelka and skip the rest they're pretty generic
eh?
other than the third game, i'd say it's pretty original.
the first game still tries to hold onto the horror koudelka had, and makes a decent effort of it.
the second game, while much less "horror themed", had nice characters and a great story while improving the combat.

3 is just terrible in comparison, but as a game it's still playable.
also shania

[Anonymous No.4182689]

>>4182683
aren't there 3 shadow hearts games after koudelka, or am i mistaken?

[Anonymous No.4182691]

>>4182680
i just got a 3ds so i intend to jump all over the smt games on there, soul hackers in particular.
feels nice to finally catch up.

[Anonymous No.4182698]

>>4182606
Same deal with Legend of Legaia.

Everyone having a less timed version of Blitz peters out when you know all the combos. Then you have the tedium issues of Legend of Dragoon.

[Anonymous No.4182702]

>>4182689
yeah, SH, SH covenant, and from the new world.
the first two are worth playing.
the third, i'm not sure what they were thinking, but they decided to go full weird and the tone is mostly different.
also people were a bit put off with the new main character.
we went from a cool but rude older guy, to your usual young protagonist.

[Anonymous No.4182714]

>>4182651
X-2 would've been best job system if the rest of the game actually used all the functions. The positioning mechanic for example.

We still have V and Tactics though.

[Anonymous No.4182760]

>>4182651
>controversial opinion
it really isn't, X's CTB system is praised and used in tons of rpg maker games
too bad square never revisited it, all those ATB games but they drop CTB after just one

[Anonymous No.4183780]

>>4180120
>Chrono Cross is in the same boat
There's a difficulty romhack. Also, there's leveling in CC:
-after a boss fight you get a summoning star and stat boosts to all playable characters
-there are optional stat boosts for characters in current party if you fight normal battles after the "star" fight
-optional stat boosts are limited to one or two times
-AFAIK you can interchange characters in your party so the new ones will gain stats too
-winning a new "star" fight will reset available optional stat boosts

[Anonymous No.4183840]

Star Ocean: The Second Story. Its not the most complex system, but its a ton of fun to battle in, and despite some people insisting there's no point in using anything but two moves on each character, there's many different killer move combinations that can help you on universe (basic difficulty is steamroll easy, never played second but universe feels just right once you get to Cross)

IT BUUUUURNS

[Anonymous No.4183874]

>>4183780
If they had made it harder it would have been perfect. I wish more RPGs would do this, the developers would have way more control over important encounters

[Anonymous No.4184587]

Amon Saga

[Anonymous No.4184623]

>>4182661
>just emulate koudelka
Koudelka combat system is the worst I've ever seen in a JRPG.

[Anonymous No.4184639]

Like 10 years ago I would have said Legend of Dragoon but I'm replaying it now and jesus christ is it awful

[Anonymous No.4184680]

>>4184639
Additions are the best, the translation and audio quality are not.

[Anonymous No.4184737]

>>4184680
>Additions are the best

The idea is okay, but the execution not so much. There's almost no depth to the combat in LoD, you essentially do nothing but additions, they're always your best option. The end up far and away outdamaging anything else and there's almost no buff/debuff management in the game at all. So every encounter is just mashing out the same additions over and over and over

[Anonymous No.4184752]

>>4184737
BUT DUDE WHAT ABOUT THOSE ENEMY COUNTERS?!

[Anonymous No.4184753]

>>4184737
I agree that is does get a little monotonous.
If they made a sequel, I think putting in different inputs that would cause different additions and with different effects like status effects or stat boosts instead of just a pure increase in damage would be the best way to improve the game without throwing out the key mechanic.

[Anonymous No.4184759]

>>4184680
Even without the monotonous combat, Legend of Dragoon's translation is so awful it turns me off the game. It's just unpleasant to read.

[Anonymous No.4184801]

>>4180914
>>worst bubblegum

[Anonymous No.4184810]

>>4184801
I dont know about you homie but I like my shows with an ending

[Anonymous No.4184838]

>>4184639
Fucking this.

It's one of those games I see say they love but in reality it's just that they played it as kids. It's god awful but it's nothing special in any regard. I admire that they seemed to want to make the combat interesting but ot just wears off and gets to a point where it just isn't fun or enough to keep you playing.

[Anonymous No.4184972]

>>4184639
I can understand people liking this, I played it for the first time recently and the only things that bothered me were the translation and disc swapping
what I don't understand is the praise that the combat in xenogears and legend of legaia get
I mean if your combos don't rely on timing then why even have them?
I'd understand if the games used ATB so you were under pressure to pull them off before the enemies attacked, but the way combos work in those games is kinda lame

[Anonymous No.4185049]

>>4179046
Kudos for mentioning Treasure Hunter G, as it's a game people seem to forget. Their take at grid based battles was original.

>>4179269
So much this. Even dungeon exploring is fun in VP thanks to platforming and puzzles.

As for non /vr/ games that try original stuff, games by Sting takes the cake imo, with Riviera and Yggdra Union, culminating in the weirdness that is Knights in the Nightmare.

[Anonymous No.4185073]

Gotta love Genius of Sappheiros.
17 characters each with tons of unique skills, interesting battle mechanics like cooldowns and react skills, formation bonuses, all-or-nothing tactics involving the bomb resource. The difficulty is just right, too. The closest retro equivalent is Romancing SaGa 1-3 and Frontier, which heavily inspired that game.

And, it has something so many RPGs lack: skippable animations.

[Anonymous No.4187316]

>>4178994
Mario rpg

[Anonymous No.4187419]

>>4178994
Vagrant Story and Breath of Fire V. They're my two go-to dungeon crawlers

[Anonymous No.4189524]

>>4178994
Not this one

[Anonymous No.4189534]

>>4179128
I love this game but don't even know why. The combat is pretty bad (even though I never got bored by it).

[Anonymous No.4189646]

The GBC lufia had a pretty interesting combat system.
You can have up to nine characters at a time on a 9x9 formation, but only one character per column can attack per turn.
Also depending on your formation you had different stat bonuses and skills.

[Anonymous No.4189652]

>>4189646
technically you can use any skill in any formation once learned, but the IP cost is increased by 50% when the SF requirement in a formation isn't met.

[Anonymous No.4189805]

>>4185073
It's translated?

[Anonymous No.4189824]

>>4189805
yeah, for several years now.
https://mega.nz/#!Ddg00YCQ!VZYQvli4fMjy9Q1GDdsabnWp2t1_Bs8O1tlhTlxSZPA

[Anonymous No.4189825]

Sugoro Quest.

Dice are for real men