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/vr/ - Retro Games


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4171183 No.4171183 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

What went wrong?

>> No.4171190

>>4171183
You making this thread.

>> No.4171191

Consumers like plug and play.
All addons to every console never did well.

>> No.4171203

Darxide looks rather impressive. What exactly was this thing capable of? I've always wanted one for shits and giggles, but they're like $40+ online.

>> No.4171279

>>4171183
They chose to focus on making new 3D games for it which took long to develop and looked like junk compared to those on the PS and SS which would release within a year.

They should have just ported 2D arcade games onto it and made it a Neo Geo killer. 32X had no 3D acceleration chip and arcades were still going strong in 94.

Imagine if the 32X was discontinued in 98 instead of 96 and had a library of 100 arcade games on it that loaded instantly unlike the Neogeo CD. That would have been the Genny's edge that would tip the favor and settle 4th gen console flamewars once and for all.

>> No.4171305

>>4171279
how did the 32x measure up to the neo spec wise?

>> No.4171309

>>4171203
>they're like $40+ online
You say this like it's a big sum.

>>4171279
It sounds very niche and not profitable enough. They should have focused on the Saturn.

>> No.4171310

>>4171183
Shoving Chaotix out the door too early certainly didn't help.

>> No.4171312

>>4171183
New installation requirements.
Extra cost.
Extra clutter.
Lack of advertising.

>> No.4171321

>>4171203
Not to troll you, but Keio is $700+, Snatcher is $250+ and that's just for the disk alone. $40+ is a pittance by comparison.

>> No.4171323

>>4171309
>>4171321
$40 is a lot to pay for something of a novelty.

>> No.4171325

Internal gook corporate culture competing with each other to produce bullshit.

>> No.4171329

>>4171190
first post best post

>> No.4171332

It just didn't need to exist with the Saturn around the corner. Waste of resources.

>> No.4171338

>>4171323
By that logic you don't by modern day games either or engage in any hobby that cost $40+? Video games and hobbies as a whole are a generally little more than novelty after all.

>> No.4171348
File: 125 KB, 1024x776, J8alvO0.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4171348

>Know what I really want? Another addon for MD
Said nobody ever

>> No.4171370

At least we got that Kolibri joke out of it.

>> No.4171384

>>4171305
Worse in everyway except 3D rendering, but still good enough to compete with its lower priced hardware and games as long as the gameplay/mechanics were not gimped during the porting process.

Even if Sega pumped out many arcade ports for the 32X it still would have died because the 3D meme was then spreading like wildfire.
Consider that many normies in the 90s looked at beautiful 2D games like Gex and said "That's lame, my SNES could do that!".

>> No.4171385

>SEGA was pretty much about to launch saturn at the time
>Requires a bunch of cables for video and another fucking AC adaptor to plug into a power strip, meaning you need 2, one for the Genesis/Mega Drive, and one for this shit, add another extra if you want SEGA/Mega CD
>Only about about a few games got released for it, and only a handful are even good
>Didn't last too long, as it was practically dead on arrival
There's really no point in having one, besides maybe Knuckles Chaotix or Doom

>> No.4171389

>>4171323
No because that's not money lost. You own a $40 asset that could be sold for that amount.

And it's not even the cost of a meal at a decent restaurant, for Sonic's sake.

>> No.4171393

>>4171384
Donkey Kong Country is not that far from Gex though.

>> No.4171438

>>4171385
>There's really no point in having one, besides maybe Knuckles Chaotix or Doom

I these and Metal Head are the only things I used to own on 32x

>> No.4171449

Was the Sega Power Base well received?

>> No.4171451

>>4171449
It was in Europe. They did make a second model for the Mega Drive II.

>> No.4171479

>>4171183
>What went wrong?
The fact that it came out literally less than a year before the Saturn
It's an addon, not a standalone
The fucking price
Barely any game support

They should have just said: "MegaDrive has been out for a while now, Next gen console, cartridge or CD?" I mean hell, even the MegaCD was a waste of time but at least that came early enough and had some decent features to make it worth making. SEGA should have just created the Saturn as a more powerful MegaCD and allow for MegaCD backwards compatability. Then at least the MultiMega would have been worth picking up

>> No.4171547

>>4171183
Weren't RPGs a big selling point for games systems in Japan in the 90's? Was the 32x designed to try to appeal to the western market while not giving a shit about Japan? If so I think it would actually be the first time the Japanes put the West above its own market. I'm actually curious as to how many of these things sold in japan vs the west.

>> No.4171570
File: 519 KB, 2448x1836, White saturn.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4171570

>>4171183
It wasn't canned before release. Games such as Virtua Fighter, Darix, its version of Virtua racing, Star Wars Arcade port, Knuckles Chaotix, and Doom should have been taken, reprogrammed/recoded for either the Genesis with SVP chip support, Sega CD, or the Sega Saturn(along with a name change for a couple of the aforementioned titles).

>> No.4171585
File: 787 KB, 2592x1944, Like_you_imagined_when_you_were_young.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4171585

>>4171183
I guess I would blame modern day internet with its youtube videos promoting the add-on. However that is a double edged sword, as I didn't know Kolibri was a good game. It was great when everything was cheap for it, but now Kolibri runs $50 for cartridge alone.


>>4171323
I did pay in total over double that for all I have for this addon and the games. I cannot afford the $40 it commands just for the addon itself now either. It is not easy earning barely over minimum wage and only 4 days a week being full time, I've been thinking maybe I can get a 2nd job part time at the local Walmart but my main job leaves me so drained of energy. Fortunately there's emulation which does the 32X very well.

>> No.4171692

>>4171393
DKC running on the SNES pushes 256x224=57344 pixels.

Gex running on the 3DO pushes 320X240=76800 pixels.

57344/76800=.74666666

DKC only has 3/4 of the resolution of Gex and Gex has visual effects that the SNES would be hard pressed to do.

That's not even getting into the high resolution audio and 12mins of voice clips which are clear and unambiguous (4th gen voice clips= whaise fwomm youua gwaave!).

But it was 2D when 3D was hot so it got shat upon by the normies.

>> No.4171734

>>4171692
4th gen voice clips are better than 2nd and 3rd gen voice clips. Oh, and even in consoles from the same Generation, quality varies. Typically, in terms of Voice clip quality: Mega CD>32X>PC Engine CD>Neo Geo>SNES>Genesis/Mega Drive on its own>Standalone PC Engine

>> No.4171749

>>4171183
This fucking meme again. Go watch some fucking e celebs on YouTube and it will tell you all the juicy details. That or read the book playing at the next level.

>> No.4171752

>>4171183
Everything. It was a dumb waste of resources that could have been spent on making the Saturn cheaper for consumers and easier for developers to work with.

>> No.4171785

>>4171305
The 32x could barely churn out a decent port of Mortal Kombat 2

>> No.4171797

>>4171585
>No Kolibri

You're not done Anon.

>> No.4171801
File: 550 KB, 650x971, gonna get huge.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4171801

>>4171692
>(4th gen voice clips= whaise fwomm youua gwaave!).

If you said that to my face I'd go all POWER UP on your ass.

>> No.4171818

>>4171734
Pc engine hucard had some pretty good voice samples

Listen to the street fighter 2 port

>> No.4172302
File: 143 KB, 637x221, cd32x.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4172302

I was a Sega kid during the early 90's and still have my Genesis with a 32X and SegaCD attached to it. It just didn't have any fucking games.

I do have a question that I'm legitimately curious about. Which has the potential for better graphics, the 32X or SegaCD? SegaCD wins in the audio department due to CD quality sound, hands down, but which had better graphics? What was the true potential of the rare "32x cd" game?

Quite honestly, with the exception of the rare gem, both the 32X and SegaCD had garbage game libraries. Sega CD just ran with the novelty of FMV games.

>> No.4172329

>>4172302
The shitty loading time on the sega cd killed it.

>> No.4172361

>>4171692
>But it was 2D when 3D was hot so it got shat upon by the normies.
This is very true i had a retard normie cousin who could not separate any 2d games in his head and saw it all as the same dated thing whilst convincing himself the blocky ugly shite on ps1 was somehow amazing.

>> No.4172374
File: 711 KB, 2592x1944, Sonic_Mania_and_SNES_mini_news_to_dote_over.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4172374

>>4171797
I know, it has gotten so expensive. That's why I was considering a 2nd job at Walmart today. For the time being I can use my Chinese bootlegs in the 32X to enjoy the game.

>>4171818
I was also very impressed with the voice samples in Soldier Blade, all from a Hu-Card game.

>> No.4172670

>>4172329
Okay, why didn't the later models and the JVC XX Eye get at least slightly better loading times in the OS? Why not even 2x or 3X?

>> No.4172689

>>4172670
*JVC X Eye

>> No.4172734

>>4171183
Shoulda just been special chips in the specific games.

>> No.4172757
File: 67 KB, 614x384, segagenesis.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4172757

>>4172302
Obviously the 32X. The SegaCD did nothing but add shitty FMV and nice music, it boasted no meaningful additional hardware, and the graphics were nothing more than the Genesis drawing everything with the same amount of graphical fidelity as any other 16 bit game.

>> No.4172775

>>4172757
Idiotic post. The Sega CD added a faster 68000 CPU, a boatload of RAM and a scaling/rotation DSP. Still weaker than 32X though.

>> No.4173894

>>4171183
Literally everything, and I own one

>> No.4175865

There was absolutely no reason for it to exist when the Saturn literally came out the next day in Japan.

Also, it has one of the worst library of games I have ever seen in my life.

>> No.4175885

>>4171279
>32X had no 3D acceleration chip and arcades were still going strong in 94.
32X didn't have a 2D accelerator either. It was all software rendering. That would have been fine, except:
>It used a SuperH running at 20MHz
>SuperH is a RISC machine
>To run full-screen, full-speed [email protected], you're looking at about 4.3Mpixels/s
>That means, in the absolute best case, you've got just shy of 5 instructions to move a pixel
>Without special ops or accelerators for graphics, you're left with just the SH2 ISA
>You've got to load a texel from the cart (or hopefully cache), store a pixel in the framebuffer, increment the cart pointer, and increment the framebuffer pointer.
>That's 4 instructions for the absolute tightest possible loop

The math just doesn't work out. You'd need to have graphics which parallelized perfectly across the two SuperH CPUs, and run them both full-tilt just on pixel-copying to get reasonable (2 layers or more) fullscreen graphics out of it.

>> No.4175889

>>4175865
this

>> No.4176092

>>4171279
The way the 32x worked was that it was a couple SuperH processors and a framebuffer that could layer video over or behind the Genesis video. Most games used the 32x for sprites and the Genesis for backgrounds and levels since it could do smooth scrolling, unlike the 32x which rendered everything in software. That way you could have your sprites in high color and do fancy effects with them but you're stuck with the Genesis's 64 color limit for your levels and backgrounds. Due to the way it works, arcade conversions would be on the level of Genesis conversions of Neo Geo games but with better sprites (you wouldn't even be able to do scaling effects on the whole screen like on the Neo Geo because you're using the Genesis for backgrounds).

>> No.4176121

>>4176092
>or behind
These are bullshit lies. The 32X manual says it can "reverse the priority" of the video overlay, but it's just inverting the alpha bit of the 32X framebuffer. There's no way to have the Genesis video signal supply the switching. (In other words, the 32X always has the final word on which picture shows through - so if you want the Genesis "on top", you need to make the cut-outs in the 32X framebuffer anyway.)

>> No.4177485

>>4175865
This.

Also I still can't believe they released 6 games that required both a sega cd and 32x to function properly.

>> No.4177517
File: 25 KB, 641x530, 1500965020687.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4177517

>>4172374
>considering a 2nd job at Walmart today.

>> No.4177547

>>4172302
Mega CD is at the very least a tier or two above 32X because it has a semidecent ammount of good exclusive content. 32X had what, KC, Kolibri and Tempo?

>> No.4177720
File: 721 KB, 2048x1152, IMG_20170808_144121.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4177720

So i got my 32x today but for some reason its not reading my everdrive, are these things known for being unreliable? Any tips?

>> No.4177752

>>4177547
Don't forget Darix and The Star Wars arcade game.

>> No.4177756
File: 721 KB, 2592x1944, LOOK_RARE_portable_console_HTF.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4177756

>>4177517
I live in the middle of nowhere in the USA, so our whole town is centered around the local Walmart. Many local businesses have been priced out and eventually work there. I mean it's great that everything is more affordable with it around, but sadly my tastes in videogames lean towards the expensive stuff like Nintendo, Sega, NEC, SNK, Sony, Bandai, Microsoft, etc. which is beyond my current pay flipping burgers "full time" on top of an anthill. This is at my local Goodwill behind glass, this is what is considered a valuable gaming system in my area.


>>4175865
I actually think the 32X has a lot of potential. I love the games I got for it. Granted I love the Saturn more, as I have more games for that system than any other, but there are some games on the 32X that plays so much better than the Saturn version like Virtua Racing. So much potential: https://youtu.be/mxJAI2omTsA


>>4177485
I wish more games had utilized SegaCD 32X style of games. Imagine all the extra audio and color offered by the 32X, with the CD's music and storage utilizing the faster Motorola 68000.

>> No.4177784
File: 41 KB, 291x398, 1476285080389.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4177784

>>4177720
Clean the pins (top and bottom) thoroughly with rubbing alcohol or a deoxidization agent and make sure the everdrive is securely in the 32x. Not tilted back, and not forward either, you want it neutral. It's picky about that sort of thing because the connection isn't really tight up there. You know how the SNES kind of locks the game in place and has a nice eject button? Well, the 32x kind of defies logic and delivers high quality colorful 2D graphics and reaches the 3D finish line at an ever so adorable last place. Now that you own one of these big dirty dust collectors it's now your job to maintain it as well.

Typical household objects that could reach inside the top of the 32x
>Flattened cottonswabs
>A nice damp cotton rag
>A dampened credit card with a piece of paper over it
>Pencil eraser (I've never done this, take with a grain of salt)
>If you want you could open the thing and clean it that way but I'd advise not to damage anything or displace the white ribbons

Congrats, your cleaning item of choice should look like someone wiped their ass with it. If you're wondering what this foretells then that means you did a good job. After letting the thing settle for a bit you should be able to play all 5 of the fucking games the thing has. That includes
>Magic Dancing Grasshopper
>Knuckles but No Sonic: Development Hell Edition
>Doom: Holy Shit The Deadline is tomorrow Edition
>Kolibri
>John Deadcorn's Revenge
>Mortal Kombat 2 again
>Oh no, Dr.Connor's class
>Really late port of an awesome arcade game (seriously take your pick)
>Shadow Squadron: It's your typical space adventure but HAHA DID YOU SEE THAT? THEM SHIPS SURE BLOW UP REAL GOOD 10/10

>> No.4177795
File: 730 KB, 444x376, 1400728205728.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4177795

>>4177784
and one more thing!

Your photo appears to show a Sega Model 1. The 32x uses a different connector for the Model 2 and Model 1. Hopefully you have the right one.

>> No.4177853

>>4177795
I appreciate it friendo, and dont worry, got new wires just for it. Will try your suggestions tonight.

>> No.4177859
File: 123 KB, 1000x1000, trashcan.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
4177859

>>4171190
fpbp

>> No.4178030

>>4177720
If that guy's stuff doesn't fix your problem, I had a similar issue (the 32x would read most games but not Sonic 3 and Knuckles) and here's how I fixed it:
If you open your 32X and take off the RF shield (mine was rusty af and had a bunch of dead spiders in it but ymmv) you'll see a couple ribbon cables that hook up the main 32X board to the sub-board where the cartridge port and AV ports are. These ribbon cables are the cause of 95% of 32X problems. What you need to do is unplug the ribbons, clean the contacts with rubbing alcohol, and plug them back in. Try the 32X with the cover off, sometimes it takes a couple tries to get them seated right.

>>4177784
you forgot the best 32x game there is
https://youtu.be/tEOr60rxUic?t=8s

>> No.4178071

>>4176092
>you wouldn't even be able to do scaling effects on the whole screen like on the Neo Geo because you're using the Genesis for backgrounds).
Genesis can easily do anything Mode 7 can do in software as long as the cartridge supplies an extra 4 KB of RAM to cache the background effects.

>> No.4178139

>>4171183
Saturn was coming out in a year's time, supply issues, and lack of games killed what hype it had.
It was ultimately a mistake.

>>4171305
Fairly worse, since the Neo has full hardware acceleration for sprite drawing and downscaling.
In contrast, the 32X has zero hardware acceleration beyond a fast hardware memset feature. No sprites, no polygons, no sound chip. A pair of SH2 CPUs, a block of RAM that's largely for the high-color framebuffer, and a pair of PWM DACs to play samples on (again, software driven).

That being said, the Neo's architecture makes it 100% utterly unsuitable for doing any kind of software based drawing at all (polygon games are literally unfeasible on Neo, and not because of the machine's clockspeed, you couldn't even do stuff like the handful of polygon Genesis games on the Neo), while the 32X is entirely designed to do just that.

>>4172302
32X had power. Full software drawing. It's ultimately optimized for flat-shaded polygon games (hardware memset is convenient here), but you could do all of the Sega CD's rotation/scaling stuff in software and do it faster with more colors (see: BC Racers).
technically, the Sega CD can scale more, but you're ultimately limited in terms of getting it onto the screen due to slow transfers into Genesis VRAM being required (which can be reduced with some heavy wizardry -- see Soul Star for an example)
CD's biggest advantage is CD music.

>>4175885
The thing was intended to run polygon games at like 15-30fps, and large amounts of drawing are being done via said hardware accelerated memset in that case instead of fiddly individual pixel plotting. Scaling is also helped a bit too.
The design fully expects the Genesis to provide backgrounds. Chaotix is mostly drawn by the Genesis, with the 32X providing shit like the hud, sprites, and special effects.
I will say that the lack of a proper VDP on the thing was retarded, replacing the second SH2 with a video chip of some variety would have made more sense.

>> No.4178160

>>4171183

Pretty simple really, SEGA tried to push out this, the Mega-CD, and the Saturn in far too short a span of time, and as a result both pissed off consumers and were totally unable to give any of them the focus they deserved. Then, in steps Sony and somehow they've got a full-on killer app with an assload of must-have games.

>> No.4178191

>>4178160
>both pissed off consumers
[citation required]

>Then, in steps Sony and somehow they've got a full-on killer app with an assload of must-have games.
Ridge Racer and what other launch games?

>> No.4178225

>>4178191
The 32X launch right before the Saturn announcement pissed off a lot of people, dude, use some common sense. The fact they completely dropped 32X support after barely a year later pissed off people even more.

>> No.4180173

>>4177784
>>4178030
Thanks guys these tips worked incredibly well its up and running now.

>> No.4180719

MUH!! GRAPH!!! IC!!!! S!!!!
is what went wrong.

>> No.4180826

>>4171183
How well could the 32x and Sega CD work together? Would it have been possible to make something a full Doom experience on the Sega CD with the 32x attached?

I know they had some games that used both but they were crappy FMV games.

>> No.4180837

>>4178191
The T-Rex on the demo cd alone convinced a ton of people that the PSX was the future.

That and the Saturn lineup was a joke, Panzer Dragoon was the only decent looking game and it ran at 15fps.

>> No.4180931

>>4180719
The 32x had more problem than graphics, it was literally released right when SEGA was getting ready to launch their next console that was not only 32 bit but CD based, and many people didn't really want to buy the 32x when it pretty much required a Genesis and was yet another dumb add on that this time was just absolutely pointless. Most people who wanted a 32bit SEGA experience were holding out for a saturn and didn't want a 32x, and of course the whole 32x CD shit was just an absolute fucking useless joke that rubbed salt on all the wounds.

At least the SEGA CD made sense as NEC had one for their console and it did at least add CD functionality, the 32x's added 32bit power was just useless and at best you had pretty glorified Genesis games and ugly 3D that would be blown out of the water in a couple months anyways with hardware that was actually stand alone. The 32x is a fucking mistake and a joke, and there's really not that much point in owning one other than Chaotix, Virtua Racing, and maybe Doom, but even then you'd be better with PC Doom.

>> No.4181092

>>4171183
Lack of advertising support. Seriously, I never saw a commercial or magazine ad for the 32x, or Saturn. There were a few for DC but even commercials for that seemed rare. It almost seems like Sega gave up on advertising after Genesis.

>> No.4181153

>>4180826
>How well could the 32x and Sega CD work together?

They didn't work together at all. When either system was sending data to the Genesis (which they had to, to do things like reading the controller), they hogged the bus and the other system couldn't talk to it. Also, there were no interrupts between either of the 3 components, so you had to set up complex, timed lock-step systems.

The lack of interrupts to main system was generally not an issue for the 32x, since it was primarily running on its own, only delegating some menial tasks to the genny. But having it talk to the Genny, while the Genny talks to the Sega CD, then waits for the Sega CD to respond, all the while the 32x is waiting for the Genny to respond to him.

It's why you only got FMV games. You have fixed data size and therefore fixed timing to transfer shit in those, and 1 driver could run any amount of games.

>Would it have been possible to make something a full Doom experience on the Sega CD with the 32x attached?

32x could've done a full Doom experience, if they didn't rush the shit out of it, and maybe if it wasn't limited to 4mb cart only. Using a CD would've allowed for CD Audio, but then you have huge loading, and have to fit all levels into RAM without being able to stream gfx from cart.

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