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2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/vr/ - Retro Games

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File: 907 KB, 1280x5579, 1490398297720[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3881221 No.3881221 [Reply] [Original]

Called Wavebeam.

http://wavebeam.blogspot.ca/2017/03/wavebeam-nes-palette.html

>> No.3881323

Eyy, that's not too bad!

>> No.3881325

I wish the NES had more reds, with that it will be perfect for pixel art.

>> No.3881864

>>3881325
It doesn't even have a proper yellow.

>> No.3882130

That's some autism you have there, OP

>> No.3882149

Brown still looks like shit. NES mini has the better one.

>> No.3882260

>>3881221
That's not bad, I'm not really a fan of Firebrand's palettes so I'm down for alternatives. Is there a common 'name' the Playchoice-10 palette is referred to as now?

>> No.3882468

>>3881221
That looks pretty accurate to what I see on my CRT.

>> No.3882472
File: 46 KB, 512x512, palette-EGAdots.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3882472

>>3881325
The NES palette is a clusterfuck. In the long run that might have been a good thing, since it gives NES graphics a very distinctive look, but it's just the first in a long line of questionable technical decisions made by Nintendo. They could have at least used all 64 colors.

Why didn't they do something like pic related?

>> No.3882473

>>3881325
The NES has such a shitty color palette. I really wonder how that came to be.

>> No.3882490

I assume OP is just trying to shill his own custom palette, as if anyone on /vr/ actually cared about this. It honestly doesn't look any better than YUV.

>> No.3882593

>>3882490
But that's wrong.

YUV still has purple skies.

>> No.3882708
File: 3 KB, 258x200, RGB_6bits_palette_color_test_chart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3882708

>>3882472
EGA is pretty crappy as well. There's no good skin tone so everyone looks seriously ill.
Using an even distribution like 6bit RGB is the best choice.

>> No.3882813

>>3882708
>There's no good skin tone
There is if you like everyone to be a nice chocolatey #AA5500 :^)

I see your point though.

>> No.3882828

>>3882593
Purple skies are in fact correct thoug.

>> No.3882830 [DELETED] 

>>3882813
I hope you die so much.

>> No.3882864

err.. can I use this palette with nestopia emulator?

>> No.3882929

>>3882830
Why? You got something against #AA5500 boys and the girls who love them?

>> No.3882934

>>3882929
Little #AA5500 girls are the best!

>> No.3882946
File: 211 KB, 958x376, 1490449859026[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3882946

>>3882828
>Purple skies are in fact correct thoug.

lol

>> No.3883020

>>3882828
>>3882946

>2. The Super Mario Brothers "blue sky color". In this case, the voltage level on the blue channel sent from the original NES consoles falls outside the range of analog RGB. A maximum RGB value of 255 on the blue is only about 75% of the strength of the blue needed to reproduce the color you see from the composite NES feed. In this case, there was no choice but to set the blue channel at 255, and approximate the hue and brightness with the remaining red and green channels. This color will always look dull compared to composite NES, and there's no getting around that. It's either retain the brightness of the color as best as possible, or lose the brightness level in favor of saturation, in which case, the color becomes considerably darker than it is supposed to appear. There are a couple of other color entries right near this blue color on the NES palette that suffer from the same out-of-range blue voltage, but the effect is considerably less noticable.

>> No.3883036
File: 171 KB, 1024x768, tGqLJqo[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883036

>>3883020

LOL

>> No.3883038
File: 120 KB, 888x500, WP_20131211_016[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883038

>>3883036

>> No.3883041

>>3883036
>red ground

Nice incorrect hue

>> No.3883046
File: 299 KB, 888x500, WP_20131211_017[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883046

>>3883041

>If I dig deeper I won't have to correct myself

>> No.3883051

>>3883038
Wasn't that pic from a guy who was modding a consumer set to accept RGB? That looks like the Playchoice-10 PPU colors.

http://hackaday.com/2014/09/21/component-video-input-hack-is-a-master-hack-for-crt-televisions/

>> No.3883057

>>3883046
The ground should be dark brown like in the YUV palette. The sky just needs to be very deep blue instead of purple.

>> No.3883067

>>3883046
Nice, now try calibrating your TV to NTSC standards and get back to me.

>> No.3883074
File: 374 KB, 1024x768, 6168494768_7cc6296f43_b[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883074

>>3883067
>>3883057

>It's wrong because it conflates with my autism

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVaWSiuncY8

>> No.3883074,1 [INTERNAL] 

Geez Nintendo, calibrate your TVs!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSgTB-tKrNk

>> No.3883098

>>3883074
What's your point? I can jack up the tint and hue to make the game look like, it doesn't change the fact that it's objectively wrong. On a properly calibrated set it's purple.

>> No.3883102

>>3883074
So we should use palettes that simulate NES colors on non-calibrated televisons?

>> No.3883110
File: 1.67 MB, 1898x908, post-18-0-62707400-1474327366[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883110

>>3883102
>>3883098

>palette based on a fully reverse engineered chip produces the same colors
>but this is wrong for <reasons>

>> No.3883128

>>3883110
Yeah, every TV set displays color differently, which is why picture adjustments exist. To adjust it back to the NTSC standard. You're still objectively wrong no matter how much you greentext. :^)

>> No.3883154
File: 9 KB, 250x188, IMG_3773.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883154

>>3883110
>it's incorrect! You're autistic! There should be more blue!

>> No.3883163
File: 26 KB, 267x200, IMG_3774.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883163

>>3883154
>this is correct because I say so!

>> No.3883170

>>3882260
Playchoice 10 palette has always been RGB
>>3882593
The sky in mario 1 is meant to be slightly purple. Confirmed by the actual artists that worked on the game.

>> No.3883392
File: 2.23 MB, 4032x3024, SMBPC10 1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883392

>>3883170
I know, I just want to know if there's a common palette file for emulators or whatever that's based on the PC-10 palette. The PC-10 palette is the only 'accurate' RGB palette (well also the Shard Titler but whatever.) There's all sorts of fake RGB palettes for the NESRGB etc, and that bothers the shit out of me. Pic related, PC-10 cabinet at a local arcade.

>> No.3883398

>>3883392
what game is that?

>> No.3883406

>>3883398
Doki Doki Panic

>> No.3883430
File: 3 KB, 768x682, itsasecret.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883430

>>3883398

>> No.3883873

>>3883392
"Garish" on the NESRGB is supposed to be based on the Playchoice Palette, but I'm not sure how accurate it is either.

>> No.3883924
File: 62 KB, 800x400, Super_Mario_Maker_09[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3883924

>>3882828
>Purple skies are in fact correct thoug.
>>3883170
>Confirmed by the actual artists that worked on the game.
Say what?

>> No.3883982

>>3883924
The end product is being displayed on a TV, not a piece of paper

>> No.3884007

>>3883982

And it still looks blue on the T.V.

>> No.3884036
File: 598 KB, 450x266, 1463032207980.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3884036

>>3883982
If it's blue on the TV, blue on the paper, and is specifically categorized as blue in the development documents, I don't see why it wouldn't be blue.

>> No.3884070

>>3884036
see
>>3883128
>>3883154
>>3883163

>> No.3884123

Sony CXA2025AS looks best on all pictures.
Why is that? Which TVs have that chip?
It's awesome.

>> No.3884147

>>3881221
Fuck that shit. It's not part of the NESRGB system so fuck it.

>> No.3884156

>>3884123
And this is how a meme is born

Just adjust the picture on your TV till it looks like that, moron

>> No.3884505

>>3884147
>it's not part of the FPGA I stuck inside my NES so I can use inaccurate emulator colors

>> No.3885541
File: 199 KB, 1024x2000, FirebrandX.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3885541

>> No.3885550

Jeez, and here I'm happy as long as I can just play something.

More power to you I guess

>> No.3885559
File: 3 KB, 256x240, Super Mario Bros. (Japan, USA)-170326-202812.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3885559

Does the NES really look like this on PAL?

This is the PAL palette from puNES

>> No.3885563
File: 3 KB, 256x240, Super Mario Bros. (Japan, USA)-170326-202829.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3885563

>>3883392
Nestopia's PC-10 palette

>> No.3885568
File: 3 KB, 256x240, Super Mario Bros. (Japan, USA)-170326-202839.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3885568

I'm a fan of BMF's Final 2 palette. BMF's Final 3 was too saturated IMO

>> No.3885578
File: 228 KB, 1550x816, 5NUrm6U-1-.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3885578

>> No.3885586

>>3882472
Hardware that displays less colors = less needed PPU memory = cheaper to produce
It was surely just another business decision

>> No.3885993

>>3884070
Why should I give a shit what some standard that no TVs followed was? That's like saying 4k isn't 3840x2160 but 4096x2160.

>> No.3886004

>>3884007
Not every tv has the same colour reproduction. This argument is 100% retarded.

>> No.3886112

>>3885993
Are you fucking retarded? Literally every non-PAL TV followed those specs.

>> No.3886118

>>3886112
Not him, but NTSC was a very loose standard.
Different manufacturers had different ways of interpreting how to display NTSC colors, and this even changed from model to model.
That's why we have so many different NES palettes that different people consider "correct".

>> No.3886121

Which palette does Super Mario Bros. Deluxe on the Game Boy Color use?
Would that not be the definitive palette to use?

>> No.3886124

>>3886118
No, it really wasn't. You don't seem to understand what a standard is. NTSC color has specific wavelength values that when set properly will display the skies as purple.

>> No.3886129

>>3886124
Sorry, but you're wrong.

>> No.3886130

>>3886129
Good point

>> No.3886134

>>3886118
You really think TV manufacurers really said "What value should we make blue? Whatever just wing it, close enough"

>> No.3886135

>>3886134
Manufacturers wanted their sets to look the best, so more vibrant colors were generally preferred. But if you have to oversimplify it in order to understand it, don't let me stop you.

>> No.3886142

>>3886135
Yeah which is why TVs would have the brightness and color maxed on the showroom floor...done via the picture controls. Which has absolutely nothing to do with industry standards in picture displays, so...

>> No.3886145

>>3886135
>>3886142
https://www.itu.int/dms_pub/itu-r/opb/rep/R-REP-BT.476-1-1974-PDF-E.pdf

I'll just leave this here. Don't bother responding, it's not a good look

>> No.3886149
File: 2 KB, 320x288, file.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3886149

>there are still people who think SMB has purple skies

>> No.3886150

>>3886112
>Are you fucking retarded?
I was about to respond to this but then you said
>Literally every non-PAL TV followed those specs.
Are you fucking retarded?

>> No.3886156

Why isn't Consumer default? Seems to be the only "real" palette that doesn't produce weird colors.

>> No.3886157

>>3886121
>Would that not be the definitive palette to use?
I haven't seen it but probably not. Developers would over-saturate the colors on handheld games to compensate for their shit displays.

>> No.3886159

>>3886156
Because it's wrong, for starters.

>> No.3886163

>>3886157
That's certainly not the case on the Game Boy Color. Very often, palettes seemed incredibly under-saturated. Just look at the second generation Pokemon games.
The Gameboy Advance is the only handheld I can think of that has such a shit display that game palettes had to be overly bright.

>> No.3886172

http://emulation.gametechwiki.com/index.php/Famicom_Color_Palette

>> No.3886181

>>3886157
>to compensate for their shit displays
And you think the sky being purple when display data is pulled directly from the chip wasn't to compensate for RF?

>> No.3886203 [DELETED] 

>>3886159

>it's wrong because of autism.

>> No.3886234
File: 133 KB, 1183x924, Do not use fbx palettes.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3886234

>> No.3886361
File: 146 KB, 1280x558, smb.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3886361

>>3885559
No, it doesn't. I captured the left image from a PAL NES on composite.

>> No.3886369

>>3886121

The palette on the nes classic would be the new definitive one.

>> No.3886379

>>3886361

Are you saying you took both from the same system? Which means that it OUTPUTS a purple sky, which ends up being blue sky on the crt?

>> No.3886505

>>3886379
No, it outputs a certain voltage which the CRT translates to blue and then displays.

The capture card takes that same voltage and tries to tanslate from composite colorspace to RGB colorspace.
Naturaly, they don't line up and some values from the composite colorapace are out of bounds of the RGB colorspace.
The blue sky color is one of those cases.
Then that color gets translated, the blue value is truncated, leaving it as a purple-ish color in RGB.

>> No.3887352

>>3886505
Translates to purple, you mean.

>> No.3887467
File: 77 KB, 474x474, Gamut-CIE_sRGB_NTSC.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3887467

>>3887352
No, truncated.

The big colorful thing represents all colors one can see, the black triangle represents all colors possible within the RGB color space, and the white triangle represents all colors possible within the NTSC color space.

Raw NTSC is capable of a blue-er blue than RGB, so when modern TVs or a capture card receive the NTSC signal and try to translate the color values, the blue gets truncated, because it's outside of the RGB color space, leaving it being slightly purple.

>> No.3887481

>>3885563
Nice, thanks anon.

>> No.3887484

>>3886369
It's a pretty nice palette too, I was impressed.

>> No.3888316

>>3887467

yo thanks for the knowledge bomb dawg.

>> No.3888331

>>3887467
But what about PAL?

>> No.3888509

>>3887484

Same. Really like the brown on the classic.

>> No.3888637
File: 275 KB, 564x569, Figure-2-Color-Gamut-with-RGB-NTSC-PAL-and-SMPTE-C-color-standard.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3888637

>>3888331
It's a little low rez, but I managed to find this:

PAL is surprisingly close to the RGB standard.

>> No.3889343

>>3888637
damn NTSC really is GOAT, PAL is just so limited in comparison. I want all the colors.

>> No.3889758

>>3887467
>>3888637
Huh, that would explain why NTSC always looks a little green to me.