/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.3074364]

Why was Chrono Cross such a terrible follow-up to Trigger?

[Anonymous No.3074365]

>>3074364
Because the alternate dimension thing was just an excuse to reuse assets. It had good waifus though so fuck you.

[Anonymous No.3074374]

>>3074365
>waifufags on /vr/
this place has gone full cancer

[Anonymous No.3074389]

>>3074374
>Liking a girl character is cancerous
>Making a thread for the pure purpose of bitching about a game that anon didn't like isn't
You got it.

[Anonymous No.3074428]

Why is she so perfect?

[Anonymous No.3074441]

>>3074389
nothing is more pathetic than swooning over fictional characters, sorry

[Anonymous No.3074442]

>>3074364
Such a fantastic game.

Only retards who enjoyed Chrono "Babby's first RPG" Trigger complain about the masterpiece that is Chrono Cross.

[Anonymous No.3074448]

>>3074442
I guess 77% of /vr/ are retards then.

http://poal.me/t566xf

[Anonymous No.3074451]

>>3074448
>I guess 77% of /vr/ are retards then.
Sounds about right.

[Anonymous No.3074457]

>>3074442
This.

[Anonymous No.3074520]

>>3074442
>>3074457
Quit samefagging, the only 'fantastic' thing about CC was the music.

[Anonymous No.3074527]

>>3074520
>(You)

[Anonymous No.3074550]

>>3074364
the hero's design was just really lame

[Anonymous No.3074567]

>>3074448
I've been on 4chan for 7 years and some of the dumbest fucking things I've read in that time have come from this board.

I don't why /vr/ thinks so fucking highly of itself.

[Anonymous No.3074584]

>>3074567
The first 6 months of this board was the best experience I had on 4chan in years.

Now it's dank memes and /v/ migrates. Was funny. You can look back in the archive and see threads being derailed just because some kid said "lel".

[Anonymous No.3074590]

>>3074584
It started going to shit after moot allowed gen6 (Dreamcast) on this board, frankly.

[Anonymous No.3074597]

>>3074590
It was going to happen either way. The only thing that could had prevented it was actual moderation and word filter/auto bans.

I got a warning and multiple threads deleted talking about XRGBs so the janitors they had weren't very much up on retro stuff to begin with.

[Anonymous No.3074620]

The cliff notes:

>Weak links to Chrono Trigger
It's there, and it's clearly a sequel to the events of Chrono Trigger, but it's very unclear about it until halfway through the game at the earliest with the Dead Sea, if not later.

>Poorly presented story
Contrary to what a lot of people have said to me, I do actually understand the story. My issues with the story are the way it's presented, and it's McGuffin chasing nature. The exposition is almost all in huge blocks which makes it difficult to be engaged and digest everything that's being thrown at you. The game also feels quite disjointed, with you doing various seemingly meaningless or unrelated things. I blame a lot of it on the transition from Serge to Lynx and then back again, it just feels strange. A lot of it is just really boring, and there are so many characters, and the potential choices like to go to Hydra Marsh to save kid vs. not to or how to infiltrate Viper manor feel worthless.

The level and combat system makes fighting random battles feel meaningless and a chore, even though they are less frequent. The combat system is hit or miss at times. The element grid and elements system itself are alright, but it feels awkward and isn't explained particularly well. My first 2 playthroughs I didn't even know about dual or triple techs, and never was able to get a summon off. Level ups being random stat bonuses sucks, because you can "miss" your level ups if you're going from boss to boss with minimal battles.

So it's just really not that interesting story or gameplay wise. It's not as offensive as something like Xenogears, but it's definitely not as enjoyable as something like FF7-9, and it's not unique like Legend of Legaia to be really note worthy.

[Anonymous No.3074632]

>>3074620
>and never was able to get a summon off
Use the field elements, you can even allocate them on your level 2 grid.

[Anonymous No.3074671]

Now seriously.
The biggest mistake of Chrono Cross was to have a 3 members party.
Yeah, the history progression is fucked up, but that's something you can only see in retrospective, the game mechanisms were there from the start and could be modded anytime during the development, and yet during all those years no one realized that a 3 members party in a game with dozen of playable characters was a waste.
Should be at least 5.

[Anonymous No.3074759]

>>3074671
That was one of the most damaging things that FF7 did to the industry, was to set the 3-member party as the standard.

[Anonymous No.3074780]

>>3074374
there have been waifufags here since the creation of /vr/. you must be new here.

[Anonymous No.3074807]

>>3074590
Time passes. In other news water is wet film at eleven

[Anonymous No.3074810]

I'm a CT fan and I found CC to have an unattractive story with some silly characters and wasted potential.

The music and art were unbelievably great though.

[Anonymous No.3074895]

>>3074807
Don't tell me you're one of those idiots that thinks PS2 and GBA will eventually get accepted on /vr/.

[Anonymous No.3074998]

>>3074895
When I first heard about retro gaming, Snes and Genesis were barely passable as retro.

[Anonymous No.3075027]

>>3074364
Chrono Cross had the Evangelion syndrome.

[Anonymous No.3075048]

With chrono cross I suspect they were trying to "break the mold" since chrono trigger was so different from other popular rpgs of the time. In the end it just turned out to be too much of a good thing

"You like minimum grinding and lots of combat?"
>CONSIDER IT DONE
"you like convoluted stories?"
>HAVE THE MOST COMPLICATED ONE
"oh and you like lots of playable characters in your rpgs?"
>HERE HAVE 50

Every chapter felt like it belonged to a completely different game and by the end I was begging them to not give me any new characters.

[Anonymous No.3075059]

>>3075048
>that pic
what the fuck man

[Anonymous No.3075072]

>>3075059
I forgot to spoiler it ;)

[Anonymous No.3075073]

>>3074364

>Different art design
>has no connection with the Chrono Trigger world or characters
>Looks just like another bland 32-bit j-rpg
>battle system takes a step backwards

Here is what it should have been:

>Parasite Eve battle system
>2D backgrounds 3D characters
>characters move around during battle
>Dragon ball artist returns
>Takashi Tokita, Yoshinori Kitase, Akihiko Matsui return
>KISS mindset: More or less a remake of CT on the Playstation
>Story is either new but similar or a direct remake
>Lots of time travelling

[Anonymous No.3075074]

>>3075072
sure you did

[Anonymous No.3075090]

>>3074364

fuck you

[Anonymous No.3075095]

>triggerniggers

[Anonymous No.3075145]

>>3075095
>Cross fans

[Anonymous No.3075149]

>>3075073
>>has no connection with the Chrono Trigger world or characters
Did you play the game or even look at OP's pic?

[Anonymous No.3075156]

>>3074620

I agree with this.

those issues aside, I think Cross could've been a good game, but it's a bad sequel to Trigger. it should've been a standalone.

[Anonymous No.3075185]

>>3075048
Do me a solid and give me a sauce on this? Pref. the uncensored version

[Anonymous No.3075192]

>>3075185
don't fap to mai waifu

[Anonymous No.3075194]

>>3075095
>its off of deviant art
>what is reverse image search

[Anonymous No.3075207]

>>3074895
Any system introduced more than 15 years ago is retro no matter what the fag mods here say.

[Anonymous No.3075214]

>>3075207
PS2 got official games into the 2010's. That sure as hell ain't retro.

[Anonymous No.3075303]

>>3075192
Holy shit, either kill yourself or see a therapist.

[Anonymous No.3075305]

>>3074364
it wasn't. it was pretty fucking cool. of course, the best parts were in the beginning of the game. splitting dimensions, robbing mansion antics.

there needed to be fewer characters and a more focused plot. but replaying CT made me realize the CT dialogue is actually even thinner than in CC.

[Anonymous No.3075316]

I recently replayed both CT and CC and I found that CC was overall better. CT is great, but CC is just better. If you go into CC expecting a new game in the Chrono world instead of CT2 then it's easier to accept and enjoy.

Also, Riddel best girl. I would want to have tea with her out in the open and be her friend.

[Anonymous No.3075319]

>>3075305
>thinner dialogue
"Deep"/convoluted writing wasn't the point of CT. It was just about a fun time-travel adventure, which is why it's infinitely superiour to Cross, unless you're a pretentious pseudo-intellectual.

Brevity > Verbosity

[Anonymous No.3075335]

>>3075214
Wow, and I just read a post in another thread saying how there's a shitposting brigade that tries to claim the PS2 isn't retro because of a tiny number of releases late in its life and I thought he was a conspiracy nut.

BUT LO AND BEHOLD.

[Anonymous No.3075338]

>>3075319
CT was a lighthearted adventure. CC started off lighthearted (Robbing a palace) with a similar schtick, universe instead of time

parallel worlds is too cool to not delve into some interesting ideas.

CT isn't some work of art. its brevity is really just a lack of material. it is charming, but you can't say every game should be like it.

if they thought CT2 would work, they would have made it. it's obvious CT hasn't aged as well as its fans think.

[Anonymous No.3075343]

>>3075214
You do know that stuff like Pier Solar (from 2010) is considered retro per this board's rules?

Also games like Oracles of Seasos are allowed (rightfully so) while we can't discuss The Sims because it's months away from the abritrary cutoff date. A cutoff date put in place so that we can include the dreamcast.

[Anonymous No.3075357]

>>3075303
Ikr, all I wanted was fap material and this nigga went full retard.

[Anonymous No.3075361]

>>3075357

Harle waifufags are annoying as fuck.

[Anonymous No.3075398]

CC wouldn't be criticized as harshly if it wasn't a sequel. On its own, it is a mediocre JRPG with a mess of a story, flawed in general but playable. However, as a follow up to one of the greatest games on SNES, sorry, it's a piece of shit.

It's all a matter of context. We forgive Xenogears and Legend of the Dragoon for having issues and feeling a bit clunky at times because they're not ruining a perfectly good story we care for.

[Anonymous No.3075464]

It's an excellent sequel way ahead of its time. But genius is hardly appreciated by the unwashed plebs.

[Anonymous No.3075468]

>>3075464
I wouldn't say it's genius. people like you sound like fedoras

but on the other hand people who say it's awful just sound kind of dumb. when I was 12 and playing cc, the shit in it was MINDBLOWING. they probably just weren't very smart 12 year olds when they played it.

as an adult, it has serious flaws, but it's pretty cool existential stuff to introduce to kids in a fun format. the naysayers who hate this still play Miku Panty Adventure #6. they just don't like feeling dumb.

[Anonymous No.3075639]

>>3075303
why? lol
>>3075361
woah rood

[Anonymous No.3077087]

>>3075192
Your waifu?! She is my waifu! I hereby challenge you to a duel.

[Anonymous No.3079525]

>>3074374
for real

[Anonymous No.3079528]

>>3075145
taste is subjective. you'll learn that when you get older, little guy.

[Anonymous No.3079530]

>>3079528
>Cross fan talking pretentiously
figures

[Anonymous No.3079538]

Radical Dreamers was better.

[Anonymous No.3079542]

Crosshitters really need to get off their high horse, CC's story wasn't that good nor does it redeem the game's clunky, slow battle engine and mostly worthless cast.

[Anonymous No.3079549]

>>3077087
I'll fuk u up m8

[Anonymous No.3079778]

CC isn't a followup to CT, it's a followup to Radical Dreamers

[Anonymous No.3079807]

>>3079778
And RD was a follow-up to CT. It even had Magus and the Epoch in it.

[Anonymous No.3080902]

I have never beaten CT or even played CC

[Anonymous No.3082670]

>>3074567
because it's become the place where /v/ dumps their retard elitist trash- I literally went on /v/ for the first time in years today, and then came here, and found this place to be the equivalent of Australia to the rest of the white world- literally a shithole where we dumped our trash, and allowed it to fester into self-righteous trash

[Anonymous No.3082727]

I just like both of them. Is that okay? Do I have to pick a side? :'(

[Anonymous No.3082749]

>>3074567
>I've been on 4chan for 7 years and some of the dumbest fucking things I've read in that time have come from this board.
I've got 9 years and this board is ok.

[Anonymous No.3082764]

>>3082670

imo /vr/ started off great, and the quality has steadily declined over time.

[Anonymous No.3083106]

>>3074810
>>3075027

True, the art and music were top notch. The story just kind of fell off.

Part of the problem was too many characters, and too many nonsense characters. It also just got convoluted for convolusions sake (worse than FF7 even).

I still liked it. I enjoyed the combat system, and story, but a top tier game could have come out of it with some more work and editing.

[Anonymous No.3083335]

>>3082670
>I literally went on /v/
Is there any other way to do it?

[Anonymous No.3083337]

>>3083106
>Final Fantasy 7
>convoluted
Are you fucking retarded something? Your tiny brain can't keep up with the incredibly simple plot of FF7?

[Anonymous No.3083357]

>>3083335
You can temporally go to /v/ if you're an esper.

[Anonymous No.3083361]

>>3075027
If by "Evangelion Syndrome" you mean that it drew from an already popular source material and hacked it up and misused a lot of words it clearly didn't understand for the sake of being deep and edgy, then yea.

I say that as someone who likes NGE (show, not this 1.11, 2.22 bullshit)

Coincidentally, I like NGE but think the bible is trash where as I think Chrono Cross is trash and I like CT.

[Anonymous No.3083363]

>>3083357
I usually electronically go to /v/.

[Anonymous No.3083934]

>>3074620
Those issues really make it seem like it was a game originally being developed as a new IP, then halfways through development decided they wanted to find a way to market it better, and someone had the bright idea of tying it into a popular and marketable name - Chrono Trigger. Then they started cutting up some of their story beats and replacing them with mcguffins they could call whatever they wanted as long as it leads back to chrono trigger in some way, but due to that it just feels like it's just all throw away plot that doesn't matter and ends up making it a weaker product, along with the later DS remake of chrono trigger adding in an extra "canon" ending to tie it together with chrono cross that was piss poor and mainly just an excuse as to why magus was cut from the game.

Also when they invoked the chrono name I felt like the dimension hopping mechanic would have been more impactful than it was, chrono trigger you could enact change upon the timeline that you could see as history progressed and sometimes resulted in some meaningful changes.
Chrono cross's world hopping felt incredibly limited with just 2 mirrored worlds, that had no real impact on eachother, and the only real diffrence between the worlds is that one was people were more racist than the other. I think more than anything else I was burned on that.

[Anonymous No.3084635]

It's too long. CT is 20 hours if you really want to stretch it and it's really straight to the point about what you need to do, CC has lots of padding because that's pretty much the norm in JRPGs and really RPGs in general.

Trigger is nothing more than a kids' game done very well. Cross is an edgy fanfiction of Trigger with a battle system that requires a more involvement than spamming physical based techs all the time.

[Anonymous No.3086313]

>>3074364
You're probably only complaining about it right now because Vinny's playing Chrono Trigger and will play Cross afterwards.

[Anonymous No.3086329]

>>3083934
>2 mirrored worlds, that had no real impact on eachother
The worst part is when you can have Leena meet her alternate dimension version and neither of them have any special reaction.

[Anonymous No.3086332]

>>3086313
Who?

[Anonymous No.3086337]

>>3074442

The real retards are the ones who can't enjoy both. Trigger is a stellar, top of the line RPG, and Cross is a fantastic game of its own. There's no reason to vehemently hate one or the other, even if you prefer one specifically. They're both excellent games.

[Anonymous No.3086432]

>>3086337
Considering them both as independent games, I loved Trigger and hated Cross. I felt cross was diluted and convoluted. There was so much happening but nothing that really fucking mattered. You want 100 characters, fine. Whatever. Here. Suikoden did that too and I don't consider that good content or a good game. Frankly, I got bored with Cross rather early and slugged through the rest of it. It also suffered from the same thing that FF9 did. "The world is in peril! Save it!" "... why? I don't like it, nor do I feel a connection to these characters. What the fuck is there to save here?"

As a series? Trigger was a great start and Cross was the sequel it never needed. Connecting them was labored at best.

[Anonymous No.3086604]

I really enjoyed the 1000 characters and the story line that had nothing to do with ct except use chrono in the title of the game. Cross was shit and a large disappointment when it came out. That's why we never saw a remake like trigger or a third title in the series.

Fight me.

[Anonymous No.3088163]

>>3074671
>The biggest mistake of Chrono Cross was to have a 3 members party.
The 3-member team worked just fine, it was a mistake to have a fuckhuge playable cast with effectively no outstanding members.

Honestly, I found the best moment was picking up Ozzie, Flea, and Slash with Sprigg.

[Anonymous No.3089619]

>>3074671
The biggest mistake was Masato Kato adding 80 hours of nonsensical filler to a 5 hour VN.

[Anonymous No.3089704]

>>3074364
It's terrible there wasn't a third game to complete the best trilogy to have ever been made.

[Anonymous No.3090087]

>>3074364
>terrible
This game was rated a 10/10 by pretty much everyone when it came out. You're an idiot.

[Anonymous No.3090098]

>>3090087
You're the idiot for arguing ad populum as if that meant anything.

[Anonymous No.3090102]

>>3090098

Oooh, someone broke out Wikipedia!

[Anonymous No.3090113]

>>3090102
>there are people who had so little of an education that they think "ad populum" is fancy talk

[Anonymous No.3090114]

>>3090098
The word terrible still doesn't apply, sorry you didn't like it, you whiny bitch.

[Anonymous No.3090126]

>>3090114
What if he did like it, but didn't find it to be an acceptable sequel to the masterpiece that is Trigger?

CC fans are so defensive.

[Anonymous No.3090132]

>>3090126
Not a fan. Don't really care for either, tbqh, but that doesn't make either of them terrible. There are hundreds of shitty RPGs out there and CC isn't one of them. Maybe if based Yuji Horii had something to do with the game it would have been better.

[Anonymous No.3090381]

>>3075073
I despise Dragon ball style. Can't play Dragonquest because of it and managed to endure it through CT. Chrono is a kid, yet he looks like full grown frikking goku!
>glad to see it gone in CC.