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/vr/ - Retro Games

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2861940 No.2861940 [Reply] [Original]

This is the best RPG of all time. Prove me wrong.

>> No.2861961

Can't be very good if I've never heard of it before.

>> No.2861967

>>2861940
>opinion

>> No.2861968 [DELETED] 

>>2861961
I don't even like Daggerfall, and nigger are you literally retarded?

>> No.2861973
File: 30 KB, 390x408, 1111.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2861973

>>2861940
I'm not sure about this

>> No.2862003

>>2861940
I've always preferred Morrowind but, ya know, not retro so...

>> No.2862061

>>2861940

Them bugs tho

>> No.2862063

>>2862003

Still? This board is almost two years old, and all those "not retro" games have to be retro sometime.If the cut off date was 1999 two years ago it makes sense for it to be 2001 now.

>> No.2862070

>>2861973
>not liking the best operating system microsoft ever owned.

Bill gates bought that system from a computer genius so it's not even remotely related to garbage current gen shit Microsoft os's.

In fact it's the closest to Linux and UNIX Microsoft ever was. Plus who the fuck doesn't like command prompt based operating systems? Fucking amateurs , that's who.

>> No.2862073

>>2862063
No it doesn't. I will try and explain this one more time.

The years decide upon for the systems on this board was not a rolling system. It was static. So the same systems will remain retro forever, and the same systems that aren't will remain so forever. It will never change and we will never add more. Do you understand now?

>> No.2862078

>>2862073

>The not retro systems will remain not retro forever
>The Dreamcast was 15 years old when this board was made
>The PS2 is approaching 14 years old
>But that doesn't matter, it'll never be retro, not even in a hundred years.

No I don't understand, it's utter madness. Moot really had no idea what he was doing toward the end there.

>> No.2862080

>>2862078

Actually now I think of it, the PS2 is approaching 16 years old.

>> No.2862090

>>2862080
Your not reading the sticky properly either. The systems were not chosen because of their age alone. It's not a 15 year or 10 year thing. It is a developer and company thing. Games from those systems and times were created in a different process for a different audience. Those same principals are not applied to games or systems anymore. So no, those games will never be retro. No matter how bad you want it. It is not an age thing, it was a specific Point in time thing. Classic cars don't become more classic and then have younger cars becoming classics later on. Classic cars are always the same ones.

>> No.2862093

>>2862090
>+1 to this

Game companies didn't have anywhere near the amount of employees or assets to make their games so they had more heart and emotion in them. The team was more closely knit together. You had to be more creative because you had less graphic power to represent something. Times were better then, and will never return again...

>> No.2862095

>>2862090

Well I haven't read the sticky in nearly two years, so I probably don't remember it all. Still makes no damn sense to me though since retro just denotes things from the past (and we're talking about retro games, not classic games, though you bet your ass some modern games will be considered classics in the future, and, yes, retro, eventually, no matter how much you don't want it). The specific point in time thing however does make sense, though the just looking at the title of the board, one wouldn't expect it. Should have just called it 70s-90s gaming or something.

>> No.2862101

>>2862095
>Should have just called it 70s-90s gaming or something.

Absolutely.

But that would just be too fucking easy now wouldn't it

>> No.2862105

>>2862095
Retro definition: imitative of a style, fashion, or design from the recent past.

Nowhere in that definition does it say a time period. It is just a descriptive word for a style. Your point remains unproven . However you are correct in one aspect. We should rename it to the 60's -99 game period, and call it classic games. And no, a modern game will never be a classic just like a modern car never will be.

>> No.2862114

>>2862105

>Nowhere in that definition does it say a time period

No shit, Sherlock, I wasn't the one who brought up the time period thing, you or someone else did. And since you decided to whip out the dictionary:

Classic: judged over a period of time to be of the highest quality and outstanding of its kind

Classic things don't stop after a certain period. There is most definitely going to be vehicles designed after the 50s-80s that will be considered classic in decades to come, just like some video games made after 1999 will be and are considered classic. Sure, I think modern gaming is irredeemable shit, there are some good games still coming out but they're ridiculously rare these days. Even then, I don't think I'd consider any new game I've played in a long time to be a classic, but that's not up to me, and it's not up to you. That's up to future generations. If you don't think anyone will consider anything past Deus Ex a classic game 40 years from now, you're frighteningly deluded.

>> No.2862121

>>2862114
So you get it now? Nothing past dream cast will be retro here. If you want to talk about the other shit, find another board or website. For you it appears /v/ would be best judging by your inability to grasp simple concepts.

>> No.2862131

>>2862121

That definition was for classic, not retro, that's something else entirely, that's just relating to the past or old-fashioned. In fact, retro doesn't even have to BE old, it can be imitative of the old. Not that I'm saying modern games are imitative of the old at all, heavens no. You're stuck on "classic" for some reason. This is called Retro games, not classic games. Honestly, you seem to be the one who can't grasp simple concepts. I've had an answer to everything you've thrown at me and all you can do it insult my intelligence and recommend me to /v/.

>> No.2862136

>>2862070
>ms dos was good
how much memory do need senpai? 640k should be plenty forever lol

>> No.2862145

>>2862131
Not him, but we are just tired of people not reading the sticky and constantly asking when ps2 will be retro. So both of you fuck off. Read the sticky , if your system isn't in there don't talk about or bitch about it. The end.

>> No.2862146

>>2862136
>Not realizing you can add kernels to the os which allow for more ram.

>> No.2862147

>>2862145

>Telling people not to bitch on the internet

Good luck with that, mate.

>> No.2862150

>>2862145

>With the release of the 8th generation of consoles, the Sega Dreamcast will now be considered "retro", though the remainder of the sixth generation (Xbox, PS2, GameCube) will not.

>will now be considered

Sounds like a change of what was accepted was made because of the passage of time. I don't frequent this board, but I do certainly remember Dreamcast discussion not being allowed, people always got so mad when it was brought up. Then the mods decided it was retro one day.

>> No.2862157

>>2862150
Doesn't say it was added because it aged. It was added because we all voted on it in a thread with moot after we later decided it should be.

>> No.2862158

>>2862157

Ah okay. It's not really clear. The whole "with the release of the 8th gen consoles" thing makes it sound like a new gen stared and Dreamcast was pushed back intro retro territory.

>> No.2862498

>>2861940
>Controls like fucking crap

>> No.2862589

>>2862063
>>2862078
>>2862080
>>2862095
>>2862105
>>2862131
>>2862150
>>2862158
The ps2/gamecube/xbox survived as far as 2013, that was two game generations. /v/ would flood this board with "retro" games like halo or games made recently if we let 6th gen past the dreamcast in here. Honestly, ask again in another 20 years and maybe it will be old enough to be considered.

>> No.2863001

>>2862589
The PS2 and later consoles will never, ever, be on the same world as the one from 5th gen and back. It's like asking for movies from the 70's to be included in the Classical Cinema period. It won't happen. Several eras, early cinema, silent era, black and white era, they all are part of Classical Cinema. 300 years from now, Classical Cinema will be this period from the '60s and back. It's another age, with different concepts.

Same principle applies here. The design, concepts, ideas, they're all different. The 5th gen is the transition from "ancient games" to "modern style".

We could clear up this confusion calling this the CLASSIC games board.

>> No.2863028

Please not again

>> No.2863046

>>2862078

>Moot really had no idea what he was doing toward the end there.

I'm pretty sure moot ended up utterly despising everything about 4chan. I wouldn't count on him ever coming back as a regular user like he alluded to. He's fixated on being "successful" now.

>> No.2863062

>>2862136
>not realizing 640k is an IBM/x86 platform limitation.

>>2862146
wat?

>> No.2863098

>>2863001
>When will baroque music by considered classical?
For people that care it never will be.

For 99% of people it already is.

In 100 years we will be hanging out and discussing this on the same board as other 'classic' systems like the xbox720 and ps6. We will all know that they are vey different thoug.

... And right now they are too cancerous to be allowed on.

Stop making /vr a pedantic argument. We don't want those generations here. This isn't the board for them. Make another if they want, but it is legitimately different.

>> No.2863103

That Shiet

>> No.2863113

It's not the best, but it's the most ambitious RPG I've ever played, with features and possibilities that disappeared in Morrowind/Oblivion/etc, map is actually 1:1 and not a resize, the buggy climbing, etc.
Probably too ambitious for its own good, we all know about bugs, glitches and repetitiveness in quest, dialogues, etc.

>> No.2863736

>>2863062
Someone doesn't know how to code... Tisk tisk. There were many of us giving our computers more ram. In fact even Windows 98 dos mode could detect more ram in dos .

>> No.2863793

>>2863001

>The PS2 and later consoles will never, ever, be on the same world as the one from 5th gen and back

Wait another ten years, gramps.

>>2863046

Ain't that the truth. I remember when he said something about 4chan being great for its anonymity, and then a few years ago he said it was never about the anonymity or something. And then he started censoring things.

>> No.2863846

>>2863793
>wait another ten years

Lol , no, I'm sorry, never will your terrible post retro systems ever be retro. Sorry. You might as well leave now.

>> No.2863861

the fact you think the glitchy mess daggerfall over well refined classics like Might and Magic 4 or Ultima Underworld just proves your a bethesda faggot.

>> No.2863867

>>2863846

I'm here to talk about old games. On the occasion I want to talk about post 90s gaming, I do it elsewhere. I'm just pointing out your retarded arguments is all. Oldfags in the 50s probably didn't expect what was then modern cars to ever be considered classics either. Let me break it down in a way you probably won't be able to understand because you're trying so hard to deny reality.

>You played games as a kid
>You grow up
>Games you remember fondly from the old days are considered retro, because they're old.
>Retro is a retarded word for this, but hey, gamers are, by and large, retarded.
>Kids playing Xbox 360 games grow up
>Remember the games from their youth fondly and consider them classics
>We get too old to matter, no one cares what we think, we stop writing the lists of best/classic games.
>These kids take our place and talk about classics like Gears of War
>Gears of War is considered retro because it's 30 years old and part of "the good old days".

>> No.2863876

>>2863867
Still wrong. Retro refers to a specific style, which in turn comes from a specific time period. Which is not what modern games or ps2 games attempt to be like . Sorry you don't understand the definition of retro, but you'll just have to deal with it nerd.

>> No.2863879

>>2863876

>Retro refers to a specific style

ret·ro1
ˈretrō/
adjective
adjective: retro

1.
imitative of a style, fashion, or design from the recent past.

Sure gramps, whatever you say.

>> No.2863934

>>2862070
>Bill gates bought that system from a computer genius
Had to look up the dude to see what he did, and I've already forgotten his name.

>it's the closest to Linux and UNIX Microsoft ever was.
Yeah, nah. Superficial similarities.

Still, I am in agreement that DOS is the best thing MS ever managed to shit out. With it's simplicity there's not as much they can do wrong. MS-DOS is the easiest OS to learn and use for PC. People who think that a command-line is automatically harder than a GUI-driven OS really think about these things the wrong way. DOS can be mastered in a day.

>> No.2864213

>>2862070
>In fact it's the closest to Linux and UNIX Microsoft ever was.
No. That would be xenix.

>> No.2864240

>>2862063
Stop it. There is already a thread, go there.

>> No.2864290

>>2863793
>>2863867
That's not the point, you dumb fuck. Of course everything will be old one day, the point is the radically different game design philosophy that existed in early 5th gen and before that.

It's not about denying reality and it's not about any sense of nostalgia or "the good old days". When did I ever said anything remotely similar to that? I'm talking an objective analysis on how the industry was and how it is, not the subjective experiences of the people. What does that have to do with anything?

>> No.2864301
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2864301

>>2862070
>Liking MS-DOS

>> No.2864407

>>2863736
Are you referring to XMS? That doesn't really count as "more ram" as far as DOS is concerned. UMB/HMA, maybe, but even then 1.06 MB is the hard limit.

>> No.2864434

Is this the new /dagger/ general?

>> No.2864437

>>2861940
ultima IV says differently

>> No.2864702
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2864702

>thread about Daggerfall
>everyone is raging about the board rules

To actually contribute something: DaggerXL is seeing progress again. The developer Lucius now works on it almost daily and a 100% gameplay-complete version is scheduled to be out early next year.

>> No.2866114

>>2864702
Reminder that last time Lucius promised a DaggerXL 100% gameplay complete beta was during October 2012 or something (maybe even Oct 2011), and he said it'd be out by Christmas that year. Which means that with the work he had already done and the rate he had been working on it he thought it would have taken 2 months~ since that point to get it done.

He's a lying cockbag is what I'm saying, basically. There's more hope of Daggerfall Tools for Unity being finished in a realistic amount of time from scratch than Lucius getting off his lardy fat ass and finishing DaggerXL.

>> No.2866158

>>2862073
>I will try to explain this one more time
>position placing retro as a set timeframe
>Do you understand now?
pedantic retards plz go

>> No.2866178

>>2866114
Duh, it's not that he's being lazy, but rather the oppposite, he's got too many other projects. Also my statements were simply true - there is progress (check the github repository) and the beta 1 is -planned- to be released early next year.

Or did you ever make a video game or program something worthwhile?

>> No.2866214

>>2866178
I know enough about programming and video game development to know that if you project something to be done in 2 months it should never under any circumstances take 3-4 years. Stop being a fucking idiot.

>> No.2866295

>>2866214
Ever dealt with hobby projects? It's something entirely different when there is a group of people payed to work full-time on a project. From what I've heard Lucius is a single guy with a demanding job-life.

I myself develop video games as a hobby, and due to studying I haven't been able to complete a game that was meant to be done months ago (while initially planned to take 1-2 months).

>> No.2866353
File: 22 KB, 640x1200, Daggerfall Sucks by Anonymous, value 580 gold, weight 2 grams.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2866353

>>2861940
>Prove me wrong.
Okay.

>> No.2866370

>>2866353
This . Starflight was more fun.

>> No.2866375

>>2866370
It's weird to think that there was a time when seeing "Electronic Arts" on a box meant you were buying a quality product.

>> No.2866378

Nice Daggerfall thread cunts

>> No.2866403

>>2866370
I just started playing Starflight (PC version). It sucks. It's like Star Control 2 except all the fun action parts are removed and everything takes 10 times as long. Even navigating the menus has a pointless time-wasting animation.

Is the Genesis version any better?

>> No.2866414

>>2866403
Star Control 2 IS Starflight made better.It's also larger. Compare their starmaps.

Genesis version is pretty and has a cutscene ending but it's shit and broken in every other way. Endurium is too expensive and used up like 100X faster than in the PC version, and they kept the time limit too. Weapons have more variety but they're mostly shit and use up too much endurium too.

Starflight 2 is probably more fun than SF1, because trading and more aliens to talk trash to. But trading can be broken by buying a resource at low prices, then haggle a small amount to an obscenely high price, then sell off the rest for max profit.

>> No.2866574

>>2866414
I don't get how you can spend 15 man-years making a game this bad. It's not like game design as a whole was too primitive back then - the game is younger than Super Mario Bros. Everything is painfully slow and frustrating. I started playing because I heard the story and worldbuilding is great, but so far I have found only one alien who had nothing interesting to say. Star Control 2 gives you multiple interesting conversations before you even leave your home star system. Also it seems minerals respawn if you take off and land again, so you could grind your way to a maxed out ship with zero risk. The sad thing is this wouldn't be much more boring than doing it the proper way. I've literally played ZX Spectrum games that are more entertaining. I'll read a let's play and not waste any more time on this.

Star Control 2 is probably in my top 20 games, and Starflight no SC2.

>> No.2866724

>>2866114
>Waaahh, that lazy fucking lardass won't do what I want for free, why doesn't he quit his job the selfish fucking cunt, I've been sitting here waiting for years, my fee fees have been hurt by the insensitive fucking cockbag, I hate him so fucking much for even attempting this!
I bet you're an absolutely wonderful human being and a real success in life anon.

>> No.2866740

I know this isn't a daggerfall thread, but I'm gonna ask anyway:

Is there any reason to use short blade or any other melee weapon besides long blade? Enchantments aside, long blade seems to be the best option.

>> No.2866846

>>2866740
Aside from roleplaying purposes, I think not. But of course if you only go for whats most useful for a "power character" you'll always end up as some sort of warmage, wearing plate armour, specialized in destruction and restoration while swinging long blade weapons.

My current character (which I made some 5 years ago) is like that, but desu dungeon crawling has become really easy, only ancient lichs and the like can really hurt me anymore. So if you're in for a challenge and/or care about actually playing a self-designed character, set up limits for yourself. Try playing as a merchant/scholar only capable of some short weapon skills and language/streetwise, don't wear armour, etc.

>> No.2866854

>>2861940
I won't, OP.
Because you are right.

Daggerfall is the best game in the world.
Played it to death and still play it sometimes.

>> No.2866917

>>2864702
Will it include a modding API, so that we can make an actually fun game out of it?

>> No.2866926
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2866926

>>2866846
>of course if you only go for whats most useful for a "power character" you'll always end up as some sort of warmage, wearing plate armour, specialized in destruction and restoration while swinging long blade weapons.

So, basically Lina?

>> No.2866949

>>2866574
I read a plot summary, and the big plot twist is good, but not as good as the history of the Ur-Quan in SC2, and definitely not worth the days of tedious farming it would take to discover it legitimately.

>> No.2867683

>>2866917
Yes, it's planned. It won't be in the first beta release, but it's definitely a planned feature (I've asked Lucius himself about this)

>>2866926
No idea who she is, sorry.

>> No.2867758
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2867758

>>2861940

I cannot.

>> No.2867760

>>2866926

What does Daggerfall have to do with a DotA hero, you dummy?

>> No.2868195

>>2867760
>B8
I'll bite. The Slayers is pretty much an anime parody of D&D tropes.

>> No.2868204

>>2866574
Ah c'mon . SF2 was better than SF1 in every way. Dialogs were also almost as fun as SC2, and pretty cool but grindy time travel plot that ties in with SF1's plot.

>> No.2868902

>>2862078
It would make better sense to create a new retro subdivision each time a new time-period gets re-classed as retro, rather than lumping them in together with the pre-existing retro crowd. 90s gamers don't want filthy 00s gamers spoiling their refined gaming discussions. You'll understand when 10s gamers start trying to get their games included. The only problem is the board's title. LIke how Smells Like Teen Spirit is quite an old song today, but you won't hear it played on "oldies" radio stations because "oldies" implicitly means music from a certain period, not according to any constantly rolling cut-off.

>> No.2869042

>>2861940
The randomly generated dungeons are a pain in the ass, and quest targets should always be placed within a reasonable distance of the entrance. If that were to be fixed, then it WOULD be the best RPG. Morrowind still tops it.
That being said, I still love Daggerfall and will play it for years to come

>> No.2869062

Badly named board is badly named... Should be called 5th gen and back

>> No.2869102

>>2862073
Bro, no one actually fucking cares. Stay bootyfuzzled tho

>> No.2869150

>another thread ruined by anons arguing semantics over what does "Retro" mean.

>> No.2869196

>>2862121
That's pants on head retarded. 6th gen is absolutely, objectively, factually retro. Grow up.

>> No.2869197
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2869197

I prefer Arena instead.

It is simpler with less game breaking bugs and I feel the artstyle is better.

>> No.2869198

>>2862589
Halo IS retro now, dumbass.

>> No.2869202

>>2863001
What's it like, picking a fight when your standpoint is factually invalid?

>> No.2870720
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2870720

Just played daggerfall again... it still rocks. It doesn't have this themepark feel like the later games, it's just a huge world with a huge amount of places to go and near total freedom for the player.
And the dungeons are scary, oh boy.

>> No.2870798

do you ever get the feeling the NOT RETRO posters are the insane ones

>> No.2870843

>>2870720
The elder scrolls game pre skyrim were always spooky in dungeons. In oblivion it scares the hell out me where a zombie comes out of nowhere SPRINTING at me, and in Daggerfall the ambiance is great

>> No.2870851

>>2870798
Yes. At this point I ignore them. They're as cancerous as the people they're trying to stop. Proof? This thread.

>> No.2871113

>>2870720
>themepark
God I hate this term so much. Having every dungeon look exactly the same is NOT a positive, fuck you.

>> No.2871123

>>2861940
Alter Ego had more depth and it was all text.

>> No.2871294

>>2861940
It's not the best RPG of all time by a long shot, but it's probably the best Elder Scrolls game.

>> No.2871441
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2871441

>>2871113
For me they don't look or feel the same, it might be different for other people. The room arrangement, the textures, the ambient music, the enemy types... to me, the dungeons in Oblivion felt more repetitive, by far. The less the game shows (e.g. due to old graphics), the more is left for your imagination to fill up.

>> No.2872984

>>2866926
Why'd she stop using a sword after the first season? Second season onward she started using a dagger and just became a mincing helpless weakling without her magic.

What happened? Did the DM make her re-roll as a pure wizard because her character was too munchkinned?

>> No.2873072

Is there any penalti for wearing full plate with mages?

>> No.2873393

>>2873072
No. Just that most of the standard (pre-made) magic classes can't equip it. If you make a custom class that can, or if you play as a battlemage or (IIRC) a spellsword, then go right ahead, it'll have no effect on your magic.

However, I would say that there's no reason to wear full plate unless you're planning on being a melee fighter. It's heavy, so you won't be able to carry as much other gear, you'll have to devote points to strength (which means less points can be devoted to intelligence), you'll (IIRC) move slower, use more endurance, and not be able to jump as high (though that can be circumvented with levitation), and you'll sink like a stone in water unless you use a Water Walking spell.

>> No.2874015

>>2866353
With the exception of world design in Morrowind, TES has always had the worst implementation of it's feature list possible.
You can be a mighty fighter! The melee sucks. You can be a skillful ranger! The archery sucks too. Or you can be a stealthy assassin! The stealth is broken. Or a mage! Then the magic is boring...
They've never been good games. I can't even call Morrowind a good game despite it's world design being some of the best.

>> No.2874342

>>2872984
I think I remember some swordplay from Lina in Revolution. Been a while; I could be misremembering.

>> No.2874805

>>2873393
Would I screw myself over wearing only clothes?

>> No.2874831

>>2874805
You wouldn't screw yourself over -- as a spellcaster, you should be avoiding melee combat in general -- but I personally wouldn't. I like using light armor, personally, for a bit of extra protection when you do end up in melee range. It's not much, but it's light enough that it barely affects your encumbrance even as a weak girly-armed mage, and that little bit of extra defense can potentially mean the difference between life and death.

Now, granted, it's best to just not let the enemy get within melee range, but shit happens and I like to be prepared.

>> No.2875516

>>2863876

>refers to a specific style

by the current definition, E.T. for the Atari and Metal Gear Solid are both retro while MGS2 is not.

If you can identify what the first two games have in common (other than being pre-2000) that the last two don't, your argument might have some merit.

Also, "I played both as a kid" doesn't count either.

>> No.2876347

>>2869202
This is factually dumb and extremely unfunny.

Kill yourself.