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/vr/ - Retro Games

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2361247 No.2361247 [Reply] [Original]

Hey /vr/,, what are some of your favorite first person dungeon crawlers?
Been playing Wizardry V on SNES and started the English translated SMT on SNES, but I crave more.
Give me your best console/pc first person dungeon crawlers!

>> No.2361270

>>2361247
Anybody know a good free program for drawing maps

>> No.2361276
File: 20 KB, 320x221, mcd991.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2361276

>>2361247
There's approximately one billion of these on Japanese computers like the 9801 and MSX. All untranslated, of course.

>> No.2361302
File: 53 KB, 472x334, sha1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2361302

Shining the Holy Ark, Sega Saturn

>> No.2361545

>>2361247
The rom translation for Wizardry VI is even better.

>> No.2361679

>>2361545
Would you patch I and upload it? I can only download the emuparadise one but that's version 0.30or something

>> No.2361694
File: 30 KB, 642x402, 03969.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2361694

>>2361276
>There's approximately one billion of these on Japanese computers
Can confirm this number is accurate.

>> No.2361697

>>2361270
http://www.davidwaltersdevelopment.com/tools/gridcart/

I'd say Wizardry VI and VII for DOS are a good start if you can't stand the first wireframe ones

>> No.2361732

What's a good first person crawler with auto-map for either the Mega Drive or Saturn?

>> No.2361759
File: 62 KB, 269x295, 44667061.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2361759

>>2361732
>Mega Drive
Madou Monogatari... but I don't remember if the MD version is translated or not.

>> No.2361769

>>2361759
Language isn't a barrier for me. I did have my eye on Madou Monogatari for while.

>> No.2361771

>>2361247
SMT II and KMT of course

I always liked em more than Wizardry, I think it was just the atmosphere

>> No.2361779
File: 214 KB, 458x415, 1eb75d40.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2361779

>>2361769
You should check it out then. The combat might throw you off some (it uses real time button combination inputs for spells and reactions to enemy attacks), but I think it's really fun once you get used to it.

It's pretty lighthearted compared to a lot of titles in the genre, but it also has a really unique feel, and the Madou Monogatari universe is just plain fun.

>> No.2361790

>>2361270
free as in free beer
or free as in freedom

>> No.2361797

>>2361771
Personally its the fairness that stops me from enjoying the early Wizardry games. Early Wizardry games just kept forcing you to reset because of how much death the game throws at you. I know that's how the games where back then but I just can't do them nowadays.

Phantasy Star 1 is pretty enjoyable. The maps are fair simple so maybe not what you are looking for.

>> No.2361816

>>2361679
You are welcome.

http://www46.zippyshare.com/v/lM9w8sey/file.html

>> No.2361849
File: 1.40 MB, 1063x1515, 1420546460570.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2361849

>>2361816
Thanks!
Have a cute anime girl as a reward

>> No.2361880

>>2361732
Wizardry 1-3 on Saturn is the same as the PS1 version as far as I've seen.

Wizardry 6+7 are interesting on the Saturn because they used the extended the system from 7 to 6 after the PS1 had skipped 6. I didn't play that far to see how the transition between 6 and 7 worked out. There's no English language option or translation patch so even knowing Japanese you get the weird sensation of playing a translation.

>> No.2362320

>>2361694
So there's Dragon Master Silk 2 from 95 and Dragon Master Silk Episode 2 from 92 but I can't find anything about a possible Dragon Master Silk 1 before that, only later releases like for the Saturn.
Is it a spinoff or something?

>> No.2362336

I know its not retro but SMT Strange Journey is the shit when it comes to dungeon crawling.

>> No.2362343

Grimoire

ITZ COMING

>> No.2362350

>>2361247
Shining in the Darkness is a good dungeon crawler for the Genesis. It's pretty casual in the sense that there's preset characters, overall a good experience, not too hard, but not easy either.

>> No.2362354

>>2361247
>Wizardry 5

Mah nigga. Japanese or American version? Tell us a bit about your party!

>> No.2362357

>>2361276
Alot of which are mediocre, right?

>> No.2362358
File: 87 KB, 540x700, advanced_dungeons___dragons_2nd_edition__dungeon_hack_.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2362358

I played the hell out of Dungeon Hack as a kid. Although I was a pussy and maxed my stats, and removed true-death. I should figure out how to put this onto my mac.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab1ZIyLGKKA

>> No.2362368
File: 442 KB, 1944x2592, IMG_20150423_171657.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2362368

>>2361697
>Not making your own maps as you go

Step it up sempai

>> No.2362373

>>2362320
Episode II is the first game.

>> No.2362381

>>2362354
American, although when I bought it, I did some research on the series and read the article on HG101 about the censorship differences. Jesus the FM Towns artwork is glorious.
My team consists of two fighters, a their, a mage, a wizard, and a cleric.
They're all like level 2-3 right now and my thief has died twice, which I named Garret, and I haven't bothered to bring him back to life yet since my party is fine at the moment, but still it pisses me off that he died twice.

>> No.2362396

>>2362381
Bishops (wizards for NoA for whatever bizarre reason) are fairly useless. They get spells a lot slower than priests or mages and don't have combat skills like samurais or lords. in 1-3 they can identify items but in 5 they hindered that by getting them frightened until the next battle.
Thieves on the other hand are vital since you need them to get better items and more money. In 5 they aren't as dead weight since they can attack from the rear.

>> No.2362421

>>2361697
Looks helpful thanks

>>2362368
Shit dude I can't find my graph paper and I don't want to puss out and use a guide

>>2361790
I want stuff I don't have to pay for, not stuff that must be paid for with the blood of brave Americans

>>2362343
It will forever grow closer yet never arrive

>> No.2362434

>>2362357
Telenet dungeon crawlers are inconsistent, but those from Hummingbird Soft (Laplace no Ma), Artec (Dark Wraith), Glodia (Alvaleak), and Falcom (Dinosaur), among others, are interesting and garner praise on Japanese websites AFAIK.

>> No.2362446

>>2361302
So damn good.

>> No.2362456

>>2362368
Where are your coordinates?
How did you handle the larger levels?
I used double sheets and even then had to start some levels over because they took other turns than I anticipated. I'd rather have stuck to mapping with fixed size and wraparound.

>> No.2362457
File: 48 KB, 640x400, 111101_052411.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2362457

>>2361694
I love the DMS games. Good, campy dungeon crawling fun.

>> No.2362469

Are there any games like this on the game boy that are in English?

>> No.2362484

>>2362469
>game boy
>English
lmao
m
a
o
Stop being an EOP.

>> No.2362506

>>2362469
There's at least 8 different Wizardry games available in english on the GB.

>> No.2362527

>>2362484
Some people just don't like kana only games.

>> No.2362731
File: 294 KB, 760x901, C__Data_Users_DefApps_AppData_INTERNETEXPLORER_Temp_Saved Images_1401800135976.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2362731

How the fucking HELL do I get rid of the Doom status in Wizardry V!?
Google shows NOTHING and the temple doesn't let me do NOTHING and I just started the game and fought like three fights and my fucking warrior is fucking DOOMED!!

>> No.2362741

I finished Persona 1 a month ago, normally don't like FP Dungeon Crawlers but it was alright.

>> No.2362848

>>2362456
I found I don't really need coordinates since I seem to have a pretty good sense of orientation. Which is odd because IRL i get lost pretty fucking easily.
Regarding the bigger levels - I still can't get ahold of some decently sized graph paper.
Also my characters are still too weak or the lower levels of the Maelstrom. So that'll have to wait for a sec. Meanwhile I'm grinding with my Good Party for a Lord.

>> No.2362856

>>2362731
I'll hack up a savestate and tell you how to remove taht.

>> No.2362890
File: 311 KB, 401x481, wp_ss_20141207_0001.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2362890

>>2362856
Wow, y-you don't have to, I can just wait and if nobody knows I'll just make a new character tomorrow

>> No.2362904

Arcana for the SNES is a blast. Your party is preset, though. Combat has a big emphasis on elemental affinity.

>> No.2362923

>>2362506
Where? Were they not released stateside? All I see on ebay is japan imports.

>> No.2362985

>>2362890
Apparently Doom is Dead in the american release of the game.
So remove your character from the party, and go to the temple of Cant STAT.

>> No.2363436

>>2362434
I must be mistaken, then. Know any other good ones?

>> No.2364330

>>2362848
It's not just about getting lost, which tends to happen once teleporters and the like come into play. When mapping corridors and the like it's quicker to run toward the end and confirm the length via Dumapic than manually count each step.

How's the mapping in Kyuuyaku Megami Tensei? From what I've seen the original had a minimap spell but no automap.

>> No.2364547
File: 181 KB, 600x600, C__Data_Users_DefApps_AppData_INTERNETEXPLORER_Temp_Saved Images_1429326535488.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2364547

>>2362985
Swell
Have an internet hug as thanks

>> No.2364553

>>2362985
How did they censor ashes and lost?

>> No.2364576

>>2362336
Which SMTs are dungeon crawlers?

I think:
1-4 (4 is not grid-based)
Strange Journey
Soul Hackers

>> No.2364686

>>2364576
you can't really call SMT 4 a dungeon crawler when it only has 1 dungeon that isn't RNG based and its right at the start of the game

>> No.2364721

>>2361697
>stand the first wireframe ones
Am I the only guy who always sets the graphics to wireframe when available

>> No.2365043

>>2364721
Nope, criticize me if you wish but sometimes I prefer the aesthetic of wire frames.

>> No.2365461

>>2364721
>>2365043
I think the computer version of Wiz 6 would look a lot better with wireframe instead of those EGA castle walls for every location, be it castle, mountain path, mine, temple. underground river, swamp, forest or ship.
It also tends to be easier to map.

>> No.2365490
File: 39 KB, 644x403, SMT98.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2365490

>>2364576
Megami Tensei 1 & 2
SMT 1, 2, if, 3
Megami Tensei Tokyo Mokushiroku (PC98)
Soul Hacker, Devil Summoner, Persona 1
Strange Journey

Off the top of my head.

>> No.2365661
File: 73 KB, 640x400, megaten.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2365661

>>2365490
Digital Devil Story

>> No.2365674

>>2365490
I'm not sure if you should add Nocturne or not. All the dungeons are grid based but they allow for free movement within them.

>> No.2365705

>>2365674
Dungeon crawlers aren't limited to being grid based or a particular perspective.

>> No.2365967

>>2365674
I think I might be more lenient on Nocturne due to how the recent SMT games had horrible dungeons. Plus on New Game+ you can change the perspective to first person.

>> No.2365973

>>2365661
I thought I included that with Megami Tensei
Unless their is another DDS I'm not aware of.

>> No.2365990

>>2365973
That original for computers. It's a Gauntlet style game, not a first person crawler like the Famicom one.

>> No.2365993
File: 19 KB, 324x291, Miss Tomobiki.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2365993

I finished a Game Boy dungeon crawler recently called "Urusei Yatsura: Miss Tomobiki o Sagase!" Mostly just bought it because it was obscure and there wasn't much info about it online.

Still able to play it with limited Japanese knowledge and little dungeon-crawling experience. Simple plot involving taking pictures of girls for a beauty contest - you have to hunt around for a girl on each of the 7 floors, and she'll send you to beat a boss or two before you can move to the next one. A guy will pop in during random encounters to give you hints on the location by column and/or row. Didn't realize you could cast spells until I had almost beaten the game, though. It was pretty okay - felt really grindy, but I think that's sort of a given.

The weirdest thing is that it was based on an anime, and the series' poster girl doesn't appear anywhere but the title screen, intro, and last level.

>> No.2366060
File: 103 KB, 712x476, unfor1_large.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2366060

>> No.2366062
File: 2.70 MB, 1650x2100, Legacy_of_the_Ancients_Poster_resize.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2366062

Best game on the C64

>> No.2366498

>>2365461
I loved Wizardry 6 but that drove me crazy. The castle section was super long too, so I was expecting to see at least 1 new graphic for the other sections. If it was wireframe or at least a simpler design I could've just used my imagination to picture the other areas, but nope just the exact same dingy gray bricks for the entire 20+ hours I spent on that game.

>>2366060
Moraff's, right? I remember that game being really weird, although that could've just been because I had the colors set up wrong so everything looked like an acid trip.

>> No.2367170

>>2362358

Fuck yes!

>> No.2367176

>>2364553
Ashes and lost are Ashes and Lost, thank god.

Also does anyone know on what stats is Identify based on?

>> No.2367538

>>2362343
If the demo he put up is representative of the final game I don't even want it to come, it played like ass.

>> No.2367567

Eye of The Beholder 1, 2 & 3 will rock your socks off. They're the heaviest influence on Grimrock, IMO.

>> No.2367576

>>2366498
Moraff's World is more playable but you'll have to buy it from the lazy dev who never bothered to port it to modern systems, so it kind of sucks. DOTU has weirder controls, and retarded lolwut currency,but there used to be a downloadable full version available somewhere.

>> No.2367580

>>2367176
I don't think it's based on any stat, only the level of the bishop.

>> No.2367590
File: 2.87 MB, 320x240, 1378994530596.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2367590

>>2367567
>real time first person dungeon crawlers

>> No.2367605

>>2367590
There's nothing wrong with realtime dungeon crawling, there's some good games like Ultima Underworld and King's Field. Keeping you on a grid while in real time, however, is fucking retarded.

>> No.2367629

>>2362368
Autism

>> No.2367650
File: 91 KB, 350x262, 1278333086240(2).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2367650

>>2367590
>calling EoTB a real time dungeon crawler

>> No.2368463

>>2363436
The Screamer, a post-apocalyptic first-person dungeon crawler (with proto-fighting game battles), was translated for the Sharp X1 recently. That and The Black Onyx are two old-school (1984/85) examples worth checking out.

>> No.2369016

>>2367590
>>2367605
So we don't like Dungeon Master then

>> No.2369113

>>2368463
Just played The Screamer because you mentioned it.
God damn, permadeath, hard as shit, and no music to relax me.
But the setting is so amazing I might just bust out the graph paper to try and beat this.

>> No.2369120

>>2369113
Oh shit, fights can happen even if you stand still, this is going to be tough as shit.

>> No.2370024

>>2361247
Probably Waxworks and Elvira II. Both have point and click + survival horror elements so they are interesting games. Very difficult though.

>> No.2370731

>>2361247
What's the best one of these games for someone who has never really played one before?

>> No.2370845

>>2370731
Might&Magic World of Xeen

>> No.2371124

Are any of the console ports of M&M worthwhile compared to the originals?

>> No.2371161

>>2371124
NES port of M&M1 looks better and there are some balance tweaks, console ports of M&M2 look better.

>> No.2371554

>>2371124
Macintosh ports are pretty good.

>> No.2371563

Mordor: Depths of Dejenol for Windows 9x

The guy reused art more than Dragon Quest but I adore it still.

>> No.2372554

>>2369113
>>2369120
How's this going for you?

>> No.2373427

>>2369113
And DAT FUCKING ENDING.

>> No.2375320
File: 13 KB, 83x105, Terrygarou.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2375320

Anyone know a FPS Dungeon Crawler with good graphics? I'm looking for something that at least have well animated enemy sprites. An example would be Dragon Quest's sequels where the sprites animate when they're attacking.

I can't really handle static sprites these days, except a few exceptions.

>> No.2375989

What are some games that let you import your party from one game to the next, like Wizardry 6-8? Does that work on SNES Wizardry I-III? (it would be pretty dumb if it didn't...) What do you get to keep when you import?

>> No.2376002

>>2375989
Wizardry 3 (Legacy of Llylgamin) doesn't have a real import. You play as descendants of your original characters which means you have to begin from level 1. 5 has a similar system.
1 and 2 allow for full import. It's actually possible to import a party from 5 to 1. Also worth noting is that 2 and 3 originally didn't have an option to create new characters so importing them was the only way to play.

Might and Magic 2 lets you import your party from 1, with the level cut to 6 or 7 depending on whether you completed it.
Bard's Tale has a full transfer for the series. Dragon Wars is also supposed to allow BT imports.
Ultima 4-6 allow you to keep your avatar though you lose levels and stats.
Realms of Arkania has full transfers.

>> No.2376004

>>2375320
The Elder Scrolls: Battlespire.

>> No.2376017

>>2375989
If you're interested in JRPGs:

>Arc the Lad Collection
Characters, their stats, their equipment, and opens several side-quests.

>Suikoden series
Some of the recurring characters who join your party keep their equipment and get a level boost based on their level in the previous game. Some side-quests are unlocked, too.

>> No.2376019

>>2375320
Ultima Underworld series

>> No.2376030
File: 4 KB, 279x192, Dark-Heart-of-Uukrul_03.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2376030

This site kicks ass: http://weekendwastemonster.net/crpgs/directory.html

It's a long list of dungeon crawlers, including downloads/manuals for some of them

Even though it says "crpg" it includes non-computer games in the style, Atlus' DS games

The web design is also very retro

>> No.2376791

>>2362457
what game is this?

>> No.2376815

>>2376791
Dragon Master Silk

>> No.2376973

Was there Dark Designs series any good?

They were John Carmack's first games ever... look like Wizardry clones. Battle is like overhead, though... blah.

>> No.2377065

>>2365993
What emulator do you use to get that nice greenish pallette?

>> No.2377764
File: 1.07 MB, 1047x1458, crystalkeep.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2377764

http://macintoshgarden.org/games/citadel

>> No.2377820

I just started playing Wizardry I on SNES. It seems actually managable here, which is nice.

I'm strongly tempted to use the TurboFile option as a savestate when my party gets wiped out, though. I don't know.

>> No.2378679

>>2361247
Favourite retro dungeon crawler? Eye of the Beholder 1.
Legend of Grimrock 1 and 2 are my favourite modern dungeon crawlers though.

>> No.2378752
File: 26 KB, 624x389, there doesnt seem to be any any key.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2378752

This game is so hard I can't even get past the title screen

My dosbox doesn't have a character disk halp :(

>> No.2378758

>>2378752
I would like to know how to do that too so I can play 2400 AD

>> No.2378789

>>2378752
You can mount disk images as drives. What kind of version do you even have that requires a disk? The IBM port had harddrive support and that was its main strength. Nowadays you should play the Amiga or Apple IIGS version.

>> No.2378803

>>2378789
was the ms dos version

I just pulled it out of here: http://weekendwastemonster.net/crpgs/bard/bard.html

but the Apple IIGS version is there too so I will try that thanks

>> No.2379501
File: 21 KB, 619x369, bring the wookie to me.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2379501

Resurrect or reincarnate?

>> No.2379525

>>2371124
They are prettier and sound better, but giving up on keyboard control is mental suicide. So no.

>> No.2379528

>>2379501
Resurrect is for faggots

>> No.2379530

>>2376030
That site is missing a ton of the amiga dungeon crawlers tho

>> No.2381167

>>2362457 >>2361694

It's a shame. There doesn't seem to be a translation for any of the games.

>> No.2381287
File: 341 KB, 1020x660, Stonekeep.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2381287

one of the best

>> No.2382704

In Shining in the Darkness, do you lose anything at all for dying? Somehow, the fact that I apparently didn't sapped more motivation to play the game than making me continue from my last save would have.

>> No.2382726

>>2381167
Such is life on the PC-98. Your best options are to learn moon or have a translation tool on hand. It's a bit of an arduous process but thankfully turn based games give you all the time in the world.

>> No.2382734

>>2382726
What translation tools?
Kanji Tomo tends to work but without Japanese knowledge it seems useless.
Dungeon crawlers aren't always that complicated so you just need to figure out the menus and screw all dialog and information.

>> No.2384626

>>2367629
GraphpapermapAnon here, you've hit the nail right on the head.

>> No.2386372

I missed out on first person dungeon crawlers back in the day and been wanting to get into them lately.

Figured i'd start with Wizardry, so i'm wondering what's the best way of getting about playing 1-4 on a modern system?

>> No.2386378

>>2386372
There's a Japanese 32 bit Windows release for Wizardry 1-3 and 4+5 though it seems a bit hard to get a hold of nowadays. The rest is emulation.
I'd recommend starting with 5 since it's a bit more forgiving. Some versions will also allow you to export characters for 1-3.

>> No.2386382

>>2386372
Applewin emulator
SNES with translation patch

The DOS version has some significant bugs/changes that make the game even harder.

>> No.2386384

>>2386378
>>2386382
Alright, thanks!
I'm under the impression that you can't transfer your party in the SNES version which is a shame because it looks great otherwise, so i guess i'll go with Applewin.

>> No.2386420

>>2386384
The SNES compilation contains the first three games and the characters are transferrable obviously.

There is however some weirdness where the second game is actually the third game, and apparently the monsters are scaled to level 1 or something.

The benefit of playing the Apple or DOS versions would be mostly that you can import your chars in many later games.

>> No.2386423

>>2386420
I mean, many games outside of Wizardry*
For instance you can import chars from Wizardry I into the Bard's Tale, released much later. It's kinda cool

>> No.2386424

>>2386382
There is no DOS version of Wizardry 1. The IBM and PC-98 versions are booters.

>> No.2386669

I hate it and I hate posting

>> No.2386678

>>2386420
>>2386423
Shame about the SNES compilation issue, although being able to transfer my party to other games sound pretty sweet so Apple it is then.

>> No.2386726

>>2386420
Legacy of Llylgamyn is supposed to be started with level 1 characters descendant from the heroes of the previous games.
Knight of Diamonds should be level 13 onward. You need to cast Malor to reach the lower levels.
The SNES and other late ports added the ability to create new characters that wasn't present in Wizardry 2 or 3.

>> No.2387816

Ok so I've never played any dungeon crawlers in my life before where I had to draw my own map (except Etrian oddyssy which still draws 50% of the map for you so it doesn't really count)

I'm playing the first phantasy star and I realized I'm drawing my maps wrong. I don't know what mistakes I am making but they arn't accurate. I think I fuck up on on realigning my character after the turns.

Any tips on how to draw accurate maps for a noob?

>> No.2387896
File: 24 KB, 646x426, i11.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2387896

>>2386424
Booters? The Wizardry 1 - 5 games I have run from and exit to DOS.

>> No.2387907

>>2387816
All I can recommend is not bothering. I played PS1 recently and the mazes are just not that tricky. I think it's more fun when you have to rely on your sense of direction (compass never really helped me) and memory.

In any case, don't forget about the compass item. It never helped me because my direction sense works like "the entrence was that way" instead of North, South, East & West but it probably helps most people & you'll need it if you want to do maps.

>> No.2388156

>>2387896
That's just a tool to boot the disks via DOS. Can't you see all those .dsk images?

>> No.2388217

>>2387816
In games like Wizardry you get location spells that you should cast whenever you feel insecure.