I genuinely cannot find any flaws with this game

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Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:26:03 2015 No.2200445 [Reply] [Original]

I genuinely cannot find any flaws with this game

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:28:18 2015 No.2200449 >>2200445 Sonic runs too fast, you can't see far enough ahead and the levels are cluttered with stuff. The idea of Sonic games is going fast and you just can't.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:28:34 2015 No.2200451 Biggest flaw: it's not Sonic 2.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:29:42 2015 No.2200453 >not playing complete Yes there are a few. They are minor though, unless you're using Knuckles underwater or turning into super sonic. Oh I'm sorry, you meant for there to be some sort of shit parade. Then refer to this post. >>2200451

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:30:59 2015 No.2200457 >>2200453 Is all the recent shitposting caused solely because /qa/ said we're a good board, or is this because of that advertisement?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:33:02 2015 No.2200461 >>2200457 What happened? I don't follow shit outside of the /vr/. I'd say the shit posting has been a long time coming. We got almost daily "Why can't I have 6th gen shit here".

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:34:36 2015 No.2200468 >>2200457 >muh shitposting This is blatantly a thread to discuss the old Genesis sonic games. If you don't want to do so, leave.

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:41:07 2015 No.2200482

>>2200461
In the whole "moot's leaving" event someone said we're elder god tier or something, we picked up a little over that weekend from it. Minor, but we've been seeing a little more than a normal Monday too.

>>2200468
I think he thinks the OP is looking for a sonic vs sonic general. There's already a sonic and genesis thread so I could see where he's coming from. No offense.

>>2200445
S3&K is my favorite. I like S2 as well, but once you gear it up with Complete it feels like the best thing since sliced bread. It also has a cutscene style that I wish more games did. You feel like you're all in one area and everything's connected, but at the same time it doesn't feel like a slog by staying around too long.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:46:13 2015 No.2200493 >>2200461 Will 6th gen ever become retro? Or retro is about the time where games were mostly abstract due the system limitations, and 6th gen is mostly what we have now with just less polygons?

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 16:53:15 2015 No.2200504 [DELETED]

>>2200493
I differentiate it by two main things. DLC and wide spread Internet. Both of which 6th gen basically started.
XBOX live being the big DLC and all the consoles having some kind of modem and lan capabilities.

Lots of other differences too but those are the main two for me.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 17:01:20 2015 No.2200524 >>2200468 Alien Soldier FTW

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 17:12:32 2015 No.2200553 [DELETED]

>>2200493
>>2200461
I've only seen people wanting to mention GBA games, which I agree, alot of ports were done for it and sequels of retro games that follow the same design as opposed to 3D HD remakes

Anything else is shitposting and Youtube generation

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 17:22:40 2015 No.2200575

>>2200445
All the levels are long as hell and offer barely any difficulty, and even less variety.

The game is good, but honestly? It's just not exciting.

Sonic CD had the same problem as well, except that that one forced your to explore due to the time travel gimmick (and you had less "mandatory" levels).

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 17:29:09 2015 No.2200587 [DELETED]

>>2200493
6th gen was a transitional era. It is the point where we had enough hardware power to fuel near endless creativity, and while we had internet and HD loading and online play, it has yet to become the horseshit it is today (like releasing half a game, unlocking the other half with a dlc, fixing all the bugs to make it playable half a year later).

It was both the pinnacle of oldschool gaming and the genesis of modern gaming. It would be hard to classify it for either generation, since we only got improved graphics, experimental (read: shit) control methods, and hyped up digital distribution and DLCs since then.

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 17:33:00 2015 No.2200601

>>2200449
>The idea of Sonic games is going fast

This is false. Classic Sonic is about physics manipulation, not speed. GO FAST was simply a marketing gimmick.

When people say that old Sonic games such because you can't go fast, it's like saying old Mario games suck because "He doesn't really jump THAT high." You're judging th egame based on what you assume it should be rather than what it is.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 17:39:59 2015 No.2200613 >>2200601 True that but the kiddies on /vr/ didn't grow up playing sonic 1 and watching the cartoons,he was marketed as being super fast but that was just marketing

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 18:29:39 2015 No.2200757 >>2200445 I can. >the Carnival Night barrel >Sandopolis Zone 2 >the S&K half in general

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 18:31:52 2015 No.2200768 >>2200601 >>2200613 >Chemical Plant Zone was just marketing I mean I know the platforming stuff was there, but it just makes me scratch my head when people say this

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 18:47:42 2015 No.2200816
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>>2200449
>The idea of Sonic games is going fast and you just can't.
Wrong. The idea of Sonic games, originally, was to play the levels until you learned how to go fast through them.

Besides, the original SMB was a much faster game; Sonic games *appeared* to be faster when playing at full speed, because everything was bigger, filling up the screen more, and the levels tended to have many ways to maneuver through the stage, i.e. loops, tubes, spirals, etc which made the screen move in all directions, rather than only right.

The point being, you had to be good to speedrun through Sonic games. Nowadays all you have to do is hold one button to boost, maybe occasionally move left or right.

This "gotta go fast" bullshit only truly started post-Heroes, and there's a reason why every single game since that one including have been unplayable, un-fun garbage. When was the last fucking time Sonic was allowed to go underwater?

No, Generations didn't count, it was still shit.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 18:49:51 2015 No.2200823 >>2200445 >any flaws My battery doesnt save progress anymore

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 18:50:43 2015 No.2200829 >>2200493 >Will 6th gen ever become retro? Yes. In the 22nd century.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 18:52:30 2015 No.2200839 >>2200823 >My battery doesnt save progress anymore Pssst. You can replace that shit. http://pineconeattack.com/2008/03/28/how-to-replace-the-game-saving-battery-to-a-sega-genesis-cart/

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:05:34 2015 No.2200882 >>2200757 >not loving Flying Battery and Death Egg Zone Nigga, is you cray?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:06:52 2015 No.2200885 File: 1.92 MB, 2592x1944, SDC11344.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2200839 I tried it. the new FRAM chips are too big.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:22:00 2015 No.2200915 >>2200885 Anon what the fuck ?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:22:32 2015 No.2200916 Sandopolis Zone

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:24:51 2015 No.2200921
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>can't find any flaws in S3&K

It's a phenomenal game, but I have to go with the infamous carnival zone barrel. People all too often complain about game mechanics saying stuff like "omg, how was I supposed to know that" but this is a 100% legitimate example of that complaint being valid. There's no indication that standing on it and holding up makes it move up and vice versa. And it moves slightly when you land on it, so it's far more reasonable for players to assume they need to keep jumping on it in order to make it move enough, but this doesn't work. Had they put arrows on the barrel or set up some way that would indicate to the player what they need to do, it'd be okay. But they didn't.

It's a minor flaw in level design in an otherwise perfect game.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:28:34 2015 No.2200929 File: 2.07 MB, 2592x1944, SDC11342.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2200915 I called the company who made the orginal chip and they said this was the latest revision and sent me a free sample.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:31:12 2015 No.2200937 >>2200929 >>2200885 Am I the only one wondering wtf this guy is doing?

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:35:24 2015 No.2200947
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>>2200937
Is this new to you? Sonic 3 uses an FRAM chip to store the saves. After so many writes (or 20 years), the chip can no longer save states. There are plenty of people who have done what I tried to do. Just look it up. You thought it was just a button cell in there?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:41:24 2015 No.2200964 >>2200947 Never opened one.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 19:55:27 2015 No.2201003 >>2200601 I agree with all of this. Here's some proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnAgjTBH_R8

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 20:02:28 2015 No.2201016 >>2200929 then get the old model?..

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 20:10:22 2015 No.2201036 >>2201016 They dont make a 20 year old chip any more. A little basic intelligence would be nice before you posting shit.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 20:32:28 2015 No.2201072 >>2200816 Generations DOES count and you're a shit

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 20:58:32 2015 No.2201120

>>2200601
>This is false. Classic Sonic is about physics manipulation, not speed. GO FAST was simply a marketing gimmick.

Classic Sonic had lots of go-fast sections that connected the platforming and puzzle sections. The levels prefer speed over control at some points, and control over speed on others. It's fair to say that the whole game isn't fast, but much of it is, especially when you get to Sonic 2 and later.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 21:43:05 2015 No.2201202 Sandopolis act 2 /thread

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 21:49:29 2015 No.2201218 File: 191 KB, 256x349, chaotix.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Step aside, here's the true flawless Sonic game.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 21:50:00 2015 No.2201220 >>2200482 While I don't really thing a Sonic game needed story progression quite so much, I love how they handled it. I wish we had more games to do it in the way Sonic 3 did, not long drawn-out cutscenes where they sometimes aren't needed.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 21:51:24 2015 No.2201225 >>2201220 *think

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 23:03:04 2015 No.2201385 Why do you even need to save in Sonic 3? I've been playing S3&K in one sitting since I was a kid.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 26 23:05:58 2015 No.2201394 >>2201385 It's handy in portable. It also makes it easier to obtain the emeralds.

Anonymous Mon Jan 26 23:59:16 2015 No.2201485

>>2200445
Sonic's Insta-shield attack trivialises nearly every boss in the game.

Knuckles didn't have any full levels exclusive to him.

Carnival Night Act 2, and Sandopolis Act 2 are a drag to play on.

The knuckles cutscene at the beginning of Mushroom Hill Act 1 wasn't necessary. They could've introduced the new special stage sphere through level design instead.

Far too many extra lives.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 00:00:21 2015 No.2201491 >>2201218 Its on 32X

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 00:03:35 2015 No.2201504 >>2201036 >basic intelligence >From the guy who tried to force a clearly oversized chip. Sorry bro, you don't get to insult anyone after that.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 00:09:01 2015 No.2201524

>>2200601
I do agree with you, but the point about Sonic 3 being too cluttered is still valid. There were so many obstacles in non-intuitive areas that I felt like the optimal method of control was a slow, plodding pace so that I'd stop losing my fucking rings and momentum. It doesn't fit alongside with the sections designed to give you speed.

The only time I felt an excess of obstacles was OK was Sonic CD because the levels were so huge that you needed your speed to reach certain areas, and the levels were designed for you to go fast when you want to and explore when you need to.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 00:32:28 2015 No.2201564 >>2200445 The S&K levels feel shoehorned in and are obviously not as good as the S3 levels.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 00:39:14 2015 No.2201578 >>2201564 ....what.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 00:59:59 2015 No.2201623 >>2201564 Lava Reef and Death Egg alone are better than the entirety of S3 In fact, Angel Island zone is the most pissweak first level a 2D sonic game has ever had.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:00:04 2015 No.2201624 >Knuckles didn't have any full levels exclusive to him. Finally the first real flaw about S3&K. Wasn't Carnival Night Act 2 even cut out entirely for Knuckles? His final boss compared to Sonic's sucked, too.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:07:18 2015 No.2201637

>>2201623
Angel island was just misguided. It's not a Green Hill Zone or an Emerald Hill Zone and instead sought to be a median between them. In effect it ended up reflecting the huge ambition the Sonic 3 team had for the game, and it's eventual inability to deliver on all that buildup.

That being said, S3&K is still an amazing game.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:13:46 2015 No.2201651 >>2200445 I've been playing it for over 20 years. C'mon man, you act like you're never even gotten stuck in a wall before.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:14:54 2015 No.2201654

>>2200445
All the S&K levels feel really unnatural, even as places fucked up by robotnik, and I can't really get behind any of them as an actual world that Sonic lives in, and not just a videogame that he's trapped in.

If you look to most of the other games it's the opposite, with Sonic CD being a highlight, you get the feeling that that these were actual places and Sonic was passing through, not that they were 100% obstacle courses that exist for no other reason than his passage through them.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:20:12 2015 No.2201674 >>2201654 I've never felt any Sonic level as natural. What with all the loop-de-loops and all.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:23:10 2015 No.2201683 >>2201674 I kind of figured that was just what people did for fun in their world. Like everyone can turn into a ball and springs and loops and pinball/rollercoaster type shit was just part of their culture

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:26:47 2015 No.2201693 I always felt like the level in 3K were too goddamn long. I'll take shorter and better designed levels over long shitty levels filled with goofy gimmicks. The art was fantastic however. I like 3 a lot but compared to 2 its level design was inferior.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 01:37:40 2015 No.2201732 >>2201683 But then I don't know how Mushroom Hill, Sandopolis, and Lava Reef would feel unnatural to sonics world.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 02:01:53 2015 No.2201779

>>2201732
I thought mushroom hill was awful, the colors and the weird see-saw pulley gimmicks and the fact that all of the scenery was just fucking mushrooms

it didn't even feel like a forest it was just fucking mushrooms everywhere

sandopolis was actually one of the better levels even thought it felt so dry and samey (gameplay wise)

lava reef was pretty good but it had awful colors like mushroom hill

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 02:05:13 2015 No.2201786 >>2200816 >When was the last fucking time Sonic was allowed to go underwater? Colors.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 02:17:58 2015 No.2201798 It does have a flaw. It created a shitfest on how to pronounce "Hydrocity Zone".

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 02:26:20 2015 No.2201806 >>2201798 >It created a shitfest on how to pronounce "Hydrocity Zone". Protip: there is no "a" or "ah" in Hydrocity. It's High-dro-city. "Dro" as in "drone".

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 02:30:12 2015 No.2201809 >>2201806 Well yeah but there ain't no "ah" in Velocity either and "Hyr-dra-city" just sounds cooler so phooey on you.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 02:32:27 2015 No.2201812 >>2201798 >>2201806 >>2201809 Further protip: it is a submerged ancient city, hence: Hydro-City

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 02:39:50 2015 No.2201816 There is almost no difference between the Carnival Night Act 1 and Act 2 themes.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 03:13:02 2015 No.2201848 >>2200451 But not being Sonic 2 is its best feature...

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 03:25:05 2015 No.2201853

>>2200601
>sonic
>not being about going fast

The fuck is wrong with you. The entire point of the fucking game was about clearing the levels as fast as possible, not about autisticly solving non-existent puzzles or any make believe "physics manipulation".

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 04:01:05 2015 No.2201876 >>2201853 >The entire point of the fucking game was about clearing the levels as fast as possible No it wasn't ,have you ever played through sonic 1? its a pretty typical platformer with some fast bits in it.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 04:35:18 2015 No.2201891
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1. It's too long and becomes a chore. Split into 2 games it's more bearable.
2. The stages start to feel uninspired and "samey" compared to the previous titles. For Example Carnival is just a shitty rehash of Casino.
3. Sonic's new look is a step down from earlier games there's no need to make him look like a Donkey Kong Country character
4. It's technically 2 games so the price for this "game" is doubled.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 05:03:55 2015 No.2201902
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>>2200445
I don't like the art style! I know its a personal thing, but seriously: The sprites look worse, because they tried to do more. More shiny and realistic effects didn't do the game well. Sonic 1 & 2's style is far superior. Sonic 2 was the first game I ever played, and it's my favourite Sonic game to this day.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 05:33:12 2015 No.2201920

>>2201072
>Generations DOES count
But Generations was shit.
>>2201786
>Colors.
But Colors was shit.

Any game in the series that follows the "gotta go fast" model is instantly shit by default. That boost button is a constant reminder that it's not the player speedrunning through the stages, it's sanic. So don't give me shit about Colors and Generations, go fuck yourself. Do you actually like playing games? Then why the fuck do you get a game that basically plays itself?

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 11:58:16 2015 No.2202254 >>2201920 Colors is actually pretty slow. The levels are designed more like Marble and Labyrinth Zone with a lot of blocky platforming.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 13:00:25 2015 No.2202312

>>2200445
It lacks a Time Attack mode. And the Knucles fight is lame when it should have been epic.

>>2201218
Only 5 worlds, somehow empty levels, random character selection, random level selection, Charmy Bee, and the two trap characters. That's more than enough flaws.

But it has the best song in a pre-DC Sonic game. That Door into summer...

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 16:51:12 2015 No.2202646

>>2200445
- Worse graphics. Tried to be detailed and ended up being too busy and ugly.
- Worse music. The Michael Jackson project was a failure (they should've had him do Sonic CD's US music instead) and Drossin, while good, isn't as good as Nakamura.
- Hidden Palace and the Knuckles boss fight were stupid and meaningless. Should've been added as part of Lava Reef 2 with a better boss fight.
- Re-using bosses in Sky Sanctuary was stupid. All they did was highlight the changes in gameplay by turning the previously challenging Metropolis boss into an easy curbstomp.
- On that note, Sonic's shield abilities including the insta-shield were neat, but made the game too easy. They fucked themselves by making the shields temporary, which meant they couldn't base level design around having them, which meant the levels are broken by players who keep their shields.
- I personally didn't have an issue with the barrel but still recognize that it was a minor point of bad game design.
- Doomsday was neat, but easy, and started the trend of every main series game having a stupid Super Sonic boss fight that wasn't broken until fucking Colors.

The game as a whole felt that they added more everything, but didn't bother refining it down into a better overall product.

>>2201920
Stop bitching about games you haven't played.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 17:00:10 2015 No.2202660 >>2202646 >they should've had him do Sonic CD's US music instead That would have been the tightest shit.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 17:28:41 2015 No.2202723 >>2201876 The game has a timer that counts upwards. The point is to beat it as fast as possible. That's why so many of the hazards are cheap, you're supposed to play it many times to learn where everything is, like >>2200816 said.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 17:39:20 2015 No.2202745 >>2202723 >The game has a timer that counts upwards. The point is to beat it as fast as possible. Same with most platformers.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 17:49:57 2015 No.2202768

>>2202646
>Worse graphics. Tried to be detailed and ended up being too busy and ugly.
This is only an issue with the first zone due to all the foliage and burning animations, you're kidding yourself if you think the rest of the game looks anywhere near that bad.
>Worse music. The Michael Jackson project was a failure (they should've had him do Sonic CD's US music instead) and Drossin, while good, isn't as good as Nakamura.
This is an opinion, i thought both styles were pretty seamless, i like the idea with the Sonic CD bit though.
>Re-using bosses in Sky Sanctuary was stupid. All they did was highlight the changes in gameplay by turning the previously challenging Metropolis boss into an easy curbstomp.
So you would rather they have just one boss at the end? There's nothing wrong with referencing earlier games, and the Metropolis boss was never hard, get real.
>On that note, Sonic's shield abilities including the insta-shield were neat, but made the game too easy. They fucked themselves by making the shields temporary, which meant they couldn't base level design around having them, which meant the levels are broken by players who keep their shields.
Valid but difficulty should rarely ever be an excuse to fault a game.
>I personally didn't have an issue with the barrel but still recognize that it was a minor point of bad game design.
Valid.
>Doomsday was neat, but easy, and started the trend of every main series game having a stupid Super Sonic boss fight that wasn't broken until fucking Colors.
Another opinion, Sonic 1's final boss was infinitely worse than this trend could ever be, i think it's was great way to make Super Sonic actually useful other than "i'm invincible during the levels time to steamroll".

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 17:57:22 2015 No.2202780

>>2202768
>So you would rather they have just one boss at the end?
For a one-act zone, absolutely. Just have Mecha Sonic show up and let the rest of the zone be seamless gameplay instead of "stop what you're doing and fight this easy piece of shit" twice. Every other zone the actual bosses are at the end of every act instead of breaking the act up.

>and the Metropolis boss was never hard, get real.
Relative to the standards of Sonic bosses, it was challenging. The Sky Sanctuary version was just a curbstomp though because of insta-shield.

>Valid but difficulty should rarely ever be an excuse to fault a game.
Disagree; making a game too easy means it's less fun since you're just breezing through it.

>Sonic 1's final boss was infinitely worse than this trend could ever be, i think it's was great way to make Super Sonic actually useful other than "i'm invincible during the levels time to steamroll".
Agreed on both points, but Doomsday was a letdown after both Death Egg Robots from S2 and S3&K. The final boss should feel like the most challenging part of the game IMO and Doomsday wasn't.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 18:03:48 2015 No.2202798

>>2202646
>Stop bitching about games you haven't played.
I did play them. Stop pretending anything I said was a lie.

I'd love to argue about how wrong you are about everything you said about Sonic 3 as well but I haven't played it in a very, very long time, so as to not sound like an idiot.

However, I will counter argument your comment about the shields. They did not make the game easier. Not really. They made Sonic a little more worth playing because Tails can fly, and Knuckles can scale walls. The shields are the only way Sonic can do anything unique. They make the game no easier than it is to play as either one of the two other characters.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 18:04:27 2015 No.2202803 >>2202745 No, most platformers count down.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 18:06:49 2015 No.2202810 >>2202798 >"Here's a completely retarded statement about a game that doesn't in any way line up with what's actually in the game." >"I totally played that game!" Sure thing buddy.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 18:12:57 2015 No.2202819 >>2202803 That's even worse because they give you a hard time limit, pressuring you to complete the level quickly.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 18:28:05 2015 No.2202850 >>2202810 >Sure thing buddy. Believe whatever you want to believe. Play any game you want to play. But don't put fucking words in other people's mouths.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 18:31:09 2015 No.2202859

>>2202850
All I know is you said something completely retarded that isn't backed up by the actual gameplay. If you actually did play the games and are this delusional in spite of it then fine, just at least admit it instead of pretending the games are how you describe them.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 19:11:55 2015 No.2202910 >>2201853 Speed is an indicator that you're maintaining momentum--which is the real display of skill. The games are all about momentum and pinball physics, speed is a result of them.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 20:49:34 2015 No.2203050 It was low on retro feel factor.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 21:07:20 2015 No.2203081 >>2203050 That makes zero sense

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 21:09:27 2015 No.2203085 >>2203081 It's hard to explain. It just doesn't have that retro "feel", you know?

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 21:14:13 2015 No.2203095 >>2201485 >Knuckles didn't have any full levels exclusive to him. The final boss, and some levels were almost completely different due to alternate routes.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 27 21:16:24 2015 No.2203098 >>2202646 >Drossin, while good, isn't as good as Nakamura. Drossin did like one or two songs in S&K only, and sonic games aside he is easily one of the best performers on the Megadrive.

Anonymous Tue Jan 27 21:28:01 2015 No.2203118

>>2202780
>Agreed on both points, but Doomsday was a letdown after both Death Egg Robots from S2 and S3&K.

Not really. Well, only in size. But I think it was kind of awesome: you had the Death Egg 2 boss, then Robotnik runs into a robot so damn big you can only see its head and fingers. Then once you destroy both hands, and then the super emerald powered laser torso, and the entire base is falling apart, you have to still get Robotnik so he doesn't run away with the emerald. And after THAT, the place explodes and you are flying around in an asteroid field over the planet, something totally new and unseen in a Sonic game - plus it changes the gameplay mechanics too; you are invincible but living on borrowed time and the level is focused on slowing you down.
So then you have to destroy this spaceship by leading the homing rockets to hit the spaceship instead (the only similar boss in a Sonic game I remember right now was that intelligent trap in Flying Battery, and that one was boring as hell).

And then after you blew up all of Robotniks stuff on the ground, then all the stuff in his Death Star, then his bigger than ever super robot, and then his escape ship, the dude STILL has ONE MORE robot up his sleeve and he is literally carrying the emerald by hand at this point and oh crap you have like 10 rings left and the music sped up to twice speed now shit you got to get him fast.

Neither of the bosses were challenging if you knew what to do (even if you faced the Death Egg ones with no rings), but god damn Doomsday was an extremely adrenaline pumping final level that was dropped in your face completely out of the blue.

The huge robots in S&K and S2 were just trying to intimidate you.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 06:41:46 2015 No.2203739 Some really down-right lazy level design that moves into the copy paste territory

Anonymous Wed Jan 28 07:15:29 2015 No.2203751

>>2203095
Yes, but Knuckles playthrough is shorter than Sonic and Tails because he skips through most of Carnival Night, only has a Boss battle in Sky Sanctuary, and completely misses out on Death Egg.

And the amount of paths he had werent really enough. Angel Island Act 1, Hydrocity, Marble Garden Act 1, Launch Base Act 1, and Flying Battery have hardly any knuckles-only paths (none at all in regards to Hyrdocity Act 1, and Flying Battery). Then theres Sandopolis where most knuckles way are completely optional.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 07:22:15 2015 No.2203756 >>2203751 >he skips through most of Carnival Night, And that is a problem... how?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 07:25:48 2015 No.2203761 >>2203756 You're missing the point. I'm saying Knuckles should've had a couple entire levels to himself to make up for the shorter game. I agree that missing out on Carnival Night isnt that big a deal. Act 2 is an absolute drag as Sonic.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 19:56:59 2015 No.2204747 >>2201202 I thought it was pretty cool, I got stuck at THAT part and went in circles 20 times in a row because I was retarded. I loved the tension the darkness and the ghosts created.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 20:27:49 2015 No.2204832 >>2200453 PSA: DO NOT PLAY COMPLETE SUPER SONIC CAN'T GET SPEED SHOES AND CONSEQUENTLY HYPER SONIC CAN'T GO FAST

Anonymous Wed Jan 28 20:43:37 2015 No.2204849

>>2200601
Uh huh... You know sonic 2 had no saving whatsoever on the cartridge.

Sega didn't just design the early levels for store demos. They were designed knowing that people would be replaying the game multiple times before they got good enough to beat the last levels.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 20:45:48 2015 No.2204853 >>2204832 So?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 20:57:53 2015 No.2204878 >>2204832 >implying this is a bad thing >>2201485 >insta-shield I thought I was the only one. They should have made attacks by bosses either ignore the shield or a little bit wider to compensate for the shield.

Anonymous Wed Jan 28 21:00:39 2015 No.2204882

-while it was neat that knuckles' story was after sonic's, not being able to go through deathegg and missing out on other content sucked.
-tails needed more areas built for him.
-knuckles is missing his abilities in multiplayer.

I really wish sonic 3 built on sonic 2's multiplayer, and then somehow made all the stages have splitscreen. co-op in sonic is basically impossible unless on bosses...which die too early anyways.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 21:05:17 2015 No.2204895 >>2204882 Tails really should have had more made for him. He feels like an afterthought sometimes.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 21:09:37 2015 No.2204902 >>2204882 Knuckle's Run takes place after the events of Sonic, where the deathegg, and most of sky sanctuary were completely destroyed. An underwater Deathegg ruin level might have been a cool idea, though.

Anonymous Wed Jan 28 22:10:07 2015 No.2205013

Whats' your favourite zone in 3&K, and what's your favourite zone in 2?
I noticed that can provide some insights on our tastes.
Personally I go with chemical plant for 2 and hydrocity for 3&K, they have both excellent level design. Special mention for lava reef.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 22:19:08 2015 No.2205029 >>2205013 Aquatic Ruin Hydrahcity

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 22:23:12 2015 No.2205037 >>2205013 Hill Top Zone and Mushroom Hill Zone. For completely different reasons.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 22:23:34 2015 No.2205039 >>2205013 Metropolis Sandopolis

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 22:27:32 2015 No.2205046 >>2205013 Chemical Plant Hydrocity/Flying Battery

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 28 22:31:40 2015 No.2205056 >>2205013 2: Chemical Plant 3&K: Flying Battery Zone Sandopolis can eat a dick CPZ has the best mix of "Look how fast Sonic can go" and actual platforming fun, FBZ is just fun in general

Anonymous Wed Jan 28 22:41:28 2015 No.2205068

>>2205013
Chemical Plant and Mushroom Hill Zones. Mushroom Hill especially because it epitomized S3K's strength of path branching to me; the whole game is very easy compared to the S2 but still finds increased depth and replayability in the way it presents tiered level paths. It's a game more about options, themed level gimmick and interesting running paths that aren't about encouraging you to go fast solely to punish you with a hazard like S2 does.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 02:05:59 2015 No.2205353 File: 155 KB, 358x296, 1411256569522.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2201798 Hydrocity, (hi-dros-ity) pronounced like "Velocity", a pun on an underwater city and speed. Not hard when you think about it.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 02:16:13 2015 No.2205361 >>2200445 MJ couldn't be allowed to finish the complete Sonic 3&K OST or take credit for his music because he diddled kids. There's a pretty big flaw.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 08:49:43 2015 No.2205637 >>2205361 I'm pretty sure the reason why he wasnt credited was because he was disappointed with the sound quality, and thus didnt want his name attached to it.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 08:54:52 2015 No.2205640 That mushroom zone was shit.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 13:13:16 2015 No.2205873 >>2205637 Both Drossin and the STI director at the time claimed it was because of the scandals that they wanted to distance themselves from MJ. The chiptune quality argument doesn't make sense either, because MJ was fine with the Moonwalker BGM.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 14:04:02 2015 No.2205924 >>2205873 Do you have an actual source on that?

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 15:27:30 2015 No.2206037 >>2205924 http://info.sonicretro.org/Howard_Drossin_interview_by_SageXPO_%28August_2008%29 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFgnUa1v8uA&t=10m1s

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 15:43:37 2015 No.2206062 >>2202312 >Charmy Bee, and the two trap characters Charmy and Heavy together actually make the game pretty easy.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 15:49:20 2015 No.2206068 >>2200449 Have you played through the 2D titles? The game is essentially a platformer.

Anonymous Thu Jan 29 15:54:05 2015 No.2206072

OP hasn't read the manual and run into any of Robotnik's traps.

"Dr. Robotnik has created many diabolical traps which take advantage of Sonic's ultra-fast speed. Watch out for traps that Sonic cannot escape. If you fall into the wrong trap, you might have to reset the game (by pressing the RESET button) and start again at the beginning of the Zone you were last in. When Sonic is flashing (after being hit) don't let him travel too quickly."

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 29 17:12:43 2015 No.2206192 >>2200451 shut the hell up

Anonymous Thu Jan 29 17:17:54 2015 No.2206198

>>2200445
You didn't notice how glitchy it can be in parts? Maybe they found a way to fix these parts when locking in S3 with S&K, but the manual for S3 specifically states that you will get stuck in walls if you're not careful when going fast.

And you know that S3 Robotnik fight where Tails is carrying you in the air? One time I started that fight while standing in a spot that I guess was "wrong" because at that point the fight was unplayable. I had to wait until the timer ran out before trying again.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 30 00:23:31 2015 No.2206834 a bit too many "ride into this loop to win"

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 30 00:35:12 2015 No.2206853 >>2200445 watch literally ANY speed run then come back and say that. If you do we know you are fucking lying out your ass.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 30 00:36:23 2015 No.2206856 >>2201218 The music in this game is pretty fucking top tier. Like.. chronocrossian levels.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 30 18:06:28 2015 No.2208253 >blue spheres >blue spheres everywhere seriously that was the most un-sonic and boring minigame ever in a sonic game fuck those levels other than that I think the game is really well made

Anonymous Fri Jan 30 20:14:29 2015 No.2208578

>>2200757
The S&K half has the best stage in the game (Lava Reef) and the worst (Sandopolis Act 2 -- Act 1 is okay).

that being said, the dumbest thing about Sonic 3 is the spike chain balls in Marble Garden

>tfw know they're there
>tfw hear the sound
>tfw still get hit

>>2201218
>literally unfinished with awful stage design

but it's really pretty and has amazing music and the physics keep it fun anyway

>>2201485
>not an issue (really, the insta-shield is probably the best thing ever), I don't think any Sonic game has had good bosses anyway
>yeah, that bothers me
>yes
>true, but really, really minor
>yes

Anonymous Fri Jan 30 20:31:58 2015 No.2208608
File: 260 KB, 5760x512, soz-2.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Legit question, why does everyone hate Sandopolis 2 so much? I thought the level design flowed decently well and the combination of the ghosts and two rising sand bits forced the player to keep on their toes. Only problem I had was the lack of branching routes and the length (first act I ever timed out on) but I'd rather have a longer stage than one that can be beaten in a minute.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 30 20:37:45 2015 No.2208625 >>2208578 >Marble Garden For me that's the worst Sonic stage only second to Wacky Workbench.

Anonymous Fri Jan 30 20:37:52 2015 No.2208626

>>2208608

Pulling levers, blocks and light switches isn't very fun in a Sonic game, plus the stage being too long and sometimes confusing, I often die from time over.

Sandopolis 1 is a great level though.

And both of them have really bitching, spooky music.

Anonymous Fri Jan 30 21:04:25 2015 No.2208702

>>2208625
I actually want to like Wacky Workbench, but hot damn. It's really the worst. That stage has very literally no flow to it. It's just
>spring into air bullshit
>get shoved into area designed to make it a pain to go back down
>repeat until stage cleared

disgusting

>>2206198
>tfw that fight as Tails alone

holy fucking shit, this is probably the second hardest way to fight a boss in all of Sonic history

the hardest is Sonic 2's final boss as Knuckles (moderate challenge as Sonic, HOLY FUCK WHY as Knux)

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 30 22:39:14 2015 No.2208871 >>2206198 This is what complete is for.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 30 23:04:24 2015 No.2208927 >>2200445 Sonic 3 Complete is the best Sonic game ever made.

Anonymous Sat Jan 31 00:19:05 2015 No.2209112
File: 26 KB, 320x224, anisonicgame.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

So I just replayed Sonic 1 after all these years. Is it just me, or does the game become kinda shitty after Spring Yard Zone? Everything afterward is just frustrating and slow.

Anonymous Sat Jan 31 03:01:34 2015 No.2209298

>>2208608
Carnival Night Act 2 is what I'd call awful. Its a drag not just because its long, but also the fact there's almost never any speed, and a lot of the obstacles were more about slowing you down and wasting time, than hurting you.

I actually quite like Sandopolis Act 2, though. Its length never bothered me because the speed and platforming felt much more balanced in comparison. And the challenge felt more right.

>>	\|\|D.\|\|.\|\|\/\|\|.\|\|D Sat Jan 31 07:12:14 2015 No.2209461 >>2209112 >Everything afterward is just frustrating and slow. I get that for Labyrinth zone, but Star Light and Scrap Brain are pretty fun imo

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 31 07:42:35 2015 No.2209471 >>2209461 Scrap Brain is one of the best zones in the entire series, like Top 3 good. From the music to the atmosphere and the routes, it's all types of platforming fun.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 31 08:22:48 2015 No.2209489 CWC: The Thread

Anonymous Sat Jan 31 08:28:20 2015 No.2209492

>>2200816
>Nowadays all you have to do is hold one button to boost, maybe occasionally move left or right.
Dude, go watch some speedruns of Generations' Modern Stages, yeah, boost makes you go fast, but only someone who has spent time learning the stage can maintain it the whole way.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 31 09:23:03 2015 No.2209523 sonic sucks you can't see whats ahead of you in a game about running fast controls are clunky

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 31 09:35:45 2015 No.2209532 >>2209523 o_O

Anonymous Sat Jan 31 09:44:08 2015 No.2209539

>>2209461
Starlight has a bunch of enemies that you can't effectively attack, and those fans greatly inhibit the ability to explore. Scrap Brain is fun in some parts, but there's always some fire or a disappearing platform to prevent you from getting any speed up.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 31 23:43:46 2015 No.2210705 >>2200445 red barrel

>>	Anonymous Sun Feb 1 15:04:50 2015 No.2211515 here's a flaw the invincibility music when going super or hyper becomes very annoying

>>	Anonymous Sun Feb 1 15:15:27 2015 No.2211532 >>2211515 Sonic 3 Complete fixes that by giving it an unused theme from the PC version.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 2 02:05:52 2015 No.2212518 >>2200445 Its not Mario

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 03:12:07 2015 No.2214131 Every "flaw" in this thread is factually a nitpick.

Anonymous Tue Feb 3 03:14:10 2015 No.2214132

>>2206198
The game being glitchy has nothing to do with the lack of bugtesting or anything, it's purely because the game is so big, the Genesis can't really handle it. The guy who made Sonic 3 Complete said it's impossible to remove a lot of the glitches without adding new ones or risking the game crashing.

Anonymous Tue Feb 3 04:53:45 2015 No.2214180

theres a bug in launch base zone where u can get stuck under a ramp. that and the fact that while the special stages where improved, not being able to replay them from the same place if failing them still annoys me. they should be harder to get to but stay in place if you lose a life. otherwise its a perfect game imo.

Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:04:02 2015 No.2214186

>>2200601
agreed, at least partly. i think that what made the genesis games good isnt that sonic always went fast, because he didnt, but that he had the abillity to if the player was skilled enough. the player could speed through levels they already knew, and the better they were at controlling sonic the more momentum they would be rewarded with. while sonic could probably make a good racing game if done right, it isnt, and speed is the reward for being able to make precise jumps, avoid obstacles and defeat enemies like in practically any other platformer. (562 characters jeez can u tell i like game design)

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:09:09 2015 No.2214189 >>2200816 agreed, but colors is an exception imo. it kept the long range homing attack but did everything else right. it was genuinely fun and id place it inbetween sonic 2 and 3&K tbh

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:13:05 2015 No.2214194 >>2208253 >>2208253 i thought it was better than in sonic 2. more about reaction and quick thinking and less about learning the stage layout. the speeding up was annoying though

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:15:09 2015 No.2214195 >>2201485 luckily i never figured out how to use the insta-shield, so i loved the boss fights (unsure about marble garden tho)

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:21:23 2015 No.2214197 >>2201220 i also agree. it felt kinda like half life imo

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:22:58 2015 No.2214198 >>2201485 good thing adventure 1 and 2 had knuckles exclusive stages

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:28:44 2015 No.2214204 >>2202819 sonic has a hard time limit. 10 mins

Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:40:22 2015 No.2214210

>>2205013
hill top zone because of how balanced it was. fast, but not breackneck speed with no control, branching, but not a maze.
lava reef because it was challenging but didnt have any difficulty spikes, id rarely die in the same place twice. it was also hectic and adrenaline pumping without feeling like some geometry dash trial and error.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:45:14 2015 No.2214213 >>2206072 i love that they handwaved that

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:49:53 2015 No.2214215 >>2208608 pulling levers isnt that fun, but i like the rest of it. the ghosts feel annoying but in a good way, it should feel tense

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 05:51:26 2015 No.2214217 >>2209112 mainly labyrinth zone imo, it sucked. the underwater levels in 2 and 3 where way better

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 06:48:15 2015 No.2214283 >>2209112 Why does every video and screenshot I see of the Sonic 1 title screen have him in front of the logo like this? That's never happened to me before.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 17:14:23 2015 No.2215015 >>2200921 fucking this I tried to clear the barrel by having my sister play tails and we would alternate jumping up and down.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 17:54:36 2015 No.2215056 >>2214283 emulation

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 17:57:40 2015 No.2215063 >>2215056 I've played Sonic 1 on multiple emulators, never had that issue.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 18:02:24 2015 No.2215067 >>2200445 I can find one: The fanbase it spawned.

Anonymous Tue Feb 3 19:09:04 2015 No.2215146

>>2205013
Casino Night in 2. Lava Reef in 3&K (I think this is the best 2D Sonic level of all).

>>2204882
The primary issue is that every stage bar one in Sonic 3 has water (in Sonic 2, any stage with water outright cannot be used in 2P, even if you go and change the 2P select screen to point to one).
I can't remember the exact reason for this being an issue (is 4 palette changes on a screen an issue? would 2P with water just be super fucking slow?).

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 19:15:29 2015 No.2215151 >>2204882 There are too many scripted events for that to be possible.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 19:33:58 2015 No.2215178 >>2215067 We're not talking about Sonic Adventure here.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 3 21:11:27 2015 No.2215308 >>2215063 Some really old emulators had issues like that. Any remotely recent/decent one shouldn't have that problem though.

Anonymous Wed Feb 4 19:09:44 2015 No.2216842

>>2200816
>This "gotta go fast" bullshit only truly started post-Heroes

What about Sonic 2 where loops were impassable unless you used a spindash or were going fast

What about in Sonic CD where the only way to take advantage of time travel was going fast

What about all of Sonic's stages in SA1 and 2

What about the cartoons that boasted that he went faster than the speed of sound

What about the theme song of Sonic CD which was literally "sonic boom" with an animated version of Sonic moving so fast he ran over water and went into outer space with nothing but the power of fast?

>>	Anonymous Wed Feb 4 23:22:33 2015 No.2217193 Why does everyone play DX and 2 Battle when the original Dreamcast versions are superior in pretty much every way?

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 01:00:39 2015 No.2217316

>>2214195
>play Sonic 3 for the first time
>think Tails and Knuckles are better because you can glide and fly while Sonic seemed to have nothing
>turns out sonic is usually better because he can jump higher, run faster, and have a instant invincibility move

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 01:03:49 2015 No.2217318 >>2201564 it's the other way around only good Sonic 3 level was the Snow Cap zone

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 01:04:06 2015 No.2217319
File: 111 KB, 800x598, Sonic1364801443124.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2217193

2 battle is better. More multiplayer modes, slightly better graphics, better/expanded chao garden functions, etc.
It's pretty much a god update on the original.

I agree SA DX wasn't as good as the original though.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 01:18:01 2015 No.2217329

>>2217319
The cutscenes got fucked in the ass though with tons of audio issues, plus the levels were changed in several ways that made them less fun (City Escape roads are completely covered in cars this time making them very hard not to hit). The game doesn't really look better either: the lighting is way better in the original and there are also more graphical effects in the original too.

I will admit it has better multiplayer and Chao Karate, but that's basically the only things it has going for it.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 01:19:41 2015 No.2217330

>>2217193
Adventure runs at a locked 30 frames per second on the Dreamcast (And why a Sonic game of all titles was like the only goddamn launch game to not run at 60fps is anybody's guess). If nothing else, that alone makes the Gamecube version better than it, even if it is uglier and suffers from slowdown.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 01:28:00 2015 No.2217339 >>2217330 Early demos of Sonic Adventure even shows the game running at 60 FPS on the Dreamcast. Why it wasn't like that in the final product is beyond explanation.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 01:28:38 2015 No.2217341 >>2217330 It originally did run at 60 fps, but the system couldn't handle it. Not even the Gamecube could handle it, the game is so unstable. It fluctuates between 30 and 60 and it's because of this that DX has a SHITLOAD more bugs than the original.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 02:17:51 2015 No.2217415 >>2217319 Isn't there a PC port of SA? How does it compare?

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 02:23:02 2015 No.2217417 >>2201816 CN, IC, and LB all had their Act 2 music essentiallly being a stripped down version of the Act 1 music

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 02:27:53 2015 No.2217424 >>2217415 It's the same as the Gamecube DX, except with mods.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 03:10:25 2015 No.2217450 >>2200929 Do they provide a pin out diagram? Maybe some can be combined, or aren't needed at all?

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 03:26:06 2015 No.2217458 >>2200445 That's because you've played it enough times to memorize the levels, unlike newcomers who'll constantly be caught off guard by hazards they couldn't possibly have anticipate.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 03:30:09 2015 No.2217464 >>2201218 >sonic game >knocklus

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 03:31:08 2015 No.2217468

>>2200816
When I was a kid sonic said "way past cool" in the cartoons and nothing in the games. I was a huge sonic faggot until the end of the dreamcast and i cannot remember him prominently saying "gotta go fast" in any of the adventures or the booklets of the older games, but i see that sentence spammed everywhere on /v/ when people shitpost about sonic. Sorry it is not /vr/ but does sonic really say that in later games?

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 03:32:47 2015 No.2217469 >>2217468 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pk6AobT_SDo

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 03:52:22 2015 No.2217485

>>2201485
>>2201624
I think we should get some perspective about Knuckles "levels". Back in the day you had basically Sonic (and Tails, which before Sonic3 was the same as Sonic). The game was about Sonic beating the levels, which were big and full of skatepark stuff and that got us awed. Sonic 3 blew my mind when I discovered you could use Tails to navigate the level in a different way and later Knuckles abilities were unexpected but really cool as well. The levels were even huger than the previous games and there were many places only Tails or Knuckles could reach (or places you'd discover with them and then go back with Sonic). The game would have been complete with only Sonic and (by s3&k) you had the three characters with different moves and the levels were taking all the characters into account. Some compromises were made, yes, but I hardly think anyone thought Knuckles not having his own unique levels was a flaw. I think they made everything nice enough in that regard if you take into account rom capacity.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 03:56:26 2015 No.2217487 >>2217469 Ok I had only watched the first 10 episodes in japanese so I didin't know it. There was on tv here (europe) but as far as i remember the opening was some generic beats and "sonicx" shouting from time to time.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 04:12:54 2015 No.2217498

>>2215015
Are you me? I didn't know what to do with that bareel and I tried jumping among other stuff and since the automatic tails would jump later he would fuck my tries. My sister would play tails sometimes so I called her to see if she could help me with this and there we were doing synchronised jumps and other shit.

>>2201798
That's a feature

>>2201202
>>2200757
>>2200916
>>2201485
Am I the only one who likes sandopolis 2? Except for the looping slides it is a very good endurance level, the atmosphere is brutal and the tension is very well achieved with the light/darkness, the sand filling and the time (which always was like 9 minutes for me when i reached the boss so I was fucked). It's like a water level without the slowdown and a bit like hill top zone from sonic 2.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 04:19:03 2015 No.2217503 >>2200921 read the manual

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 05:01:18 2015 No.2217541 File: 32 KB, 111x139, I WISH THIS WAS HIM.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2217469 That kid on the bottom right...

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 05:05:06 2015 No.2217543 File: 59 KB, 1825x1485, family.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2215015 >>2217498 That's actually kinda sweet. It's nice to think someone had a family bonding moment over the most irritating parts of that game.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 05:53:13 2015 No.2217576 >>2217498 I like Sandopolis Act 2 aswell. I was >>2209298

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 06:02:42 2015 No.2217583 >>2217487 Yeah, Europe had a different opening the the US.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 07:37:00 2015 No.2217642
File: 14 KB, 320x224, sonic2vsarz.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2215146
Yeah I never understood the water issue myself. You can't force it on the beta either.

>>2215151
The levels would have to be edited and basically some sections ruined but it would have been amazing back then.

Its fun to think about the layout changes every act needs for splitscreen.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 08:16:55 2015 No.2217663

>>2215146
>The primary issue is that every stage bar one in Sonic 3 has water

Carnival Night and Ice Cap could've easily had their water removed. Especially Ice Cap since the water in it is so far below in Act 2, that you could easily never encounter it to begin with.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 08:40:58 2015 No.2217673

Sonic 3 isn't bad but for some reason art style change was felt off-putting for me and music felt somewhat dry, compared to Sonic 2. That is just my opinion.

I still liked the game and i absolutely loved Sonic and Knuckles even though it was very close to Sonic 3. I loved Sky Sanctuary and following Ship Zone.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 09:00:25 2015 No.2217686 How do some of you get timed out? Even on CN 2 and SO 2, I never took longer than 5-6 minutes. And this is without even trying.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 11:54:29 2015 No.2217832

>>2217673

I agree, I remember as a kid I thought Sonic 3 was dull-looking, the color palette was more realistic compared to all the trippy, vibrant colors of the first 2 games, Sonic's sprite looks like they wanted to make it semi 3D. It was a game released in 1994 after all, the same year DKC was released.
Sonic looks much cooler on Sonic 1 and 2 as well, his face on Sonic 3/K's sprite looks a bit silly, IMO.

And yeah, lastly the music, it took some time for me to get to liking it. Took me some time to appreciate themes like Carnival Night or Launch Base, even Angel Island sounded a bit boring to me, compared to the iconic and catchy Green Hill Zone or Emerald Hill Zone music.
Hydrocity and Ice Cap were always great though.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 12:28:58 2015 No.2217854 File: 1.94 MB, 266x148, 1389042713308.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Sonic CD was here, 3&K a shit

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 12:44:23 2015 No.2217863 Look up, have Tails take flight, jump and catch his arms before the screen re-orients, then pass through a solid object below you. Flaw found.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 13:02:05 2015 No.2217881 >>2217854 Sonic CD wasn't any better mind you.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 15:12:59 2015 No.2218000 >>2217686 I was retarded and got stuck in a Knuckles route in SO2 somehow.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 15:13:05 2015 No.2218002 >>2217854 Sonic CD had poor level design. It required speed for the trime travelling mechanic, yet most of the level designs made it very difficult to gain any speed.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 15:18:04 2015 No.2218010

>>2218002
Actually there is usually one or two paths near the posts where if you do it right you can time travel.
Speaking about level design, there is a ROM hack called Sonic 2 Retro Remix that has superb level design, offering you both time and exploration challenges.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 15:23:09 2015 No.2218021

>>2216842
>What about Sonic 2 where loops were impassable unless you used a spindash or were going fast
Oh no, a single part of the game design requires you to be at a (actually not that high) minimum speed. How terrible.

>What about in Sonic CD where the only way to take advantage of time travel was going fast
Yeah, and the stage designs actively placed obstacles in your way, requiring skill to time travel a lot of the time, unless you found something that looped you or bounced you back and forth infinitely.

>What about all of Sonic's stages in SA1 and 2
Still based more on 3D platforming than just going fast.

>What about the cartoons that boasted that he went faster than the speed of sound
>What about the theme song of Sonic CD which was literally "sonic boom" with an animated version of Sonic moving so fast he ran over water and went into outer space with nothing but the power of fast?
About as relevant as the blast processing gimmick.

Sonic's top speed wasn't actually that much higher than Mario's top speed in the SNES Mario game, what made Sonic stand out wasn't just speed, it was about smooth movement though a fully 2D environment. Hell, Sonic 1 was basically a tech demo for the vector-based slope physics.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 15:24:10 2015 No.2218024 >>2200445 It's a 2D Sonic game, so it's automatically unplayable shit.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 15:32:12 2015 No.2218039

>>2218002
That's not poor design, that was the point of the game. It was an exploration challenge to find the spot where you could pick up speed. That's also why there are so many Future signs everywhere.

I've seen complaints like yours come from many a Sonic fan before. I don't know how people didn't pick up on this.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 15:37:09 2015 No.2218045

>>2218039
I think the main issue is that CD was the only classic Sonic game that rewarded exploration that much. Aside from that the most was finding S3&K's special stages and that was nothing by comparison.

Plus there's no actual need to use the time traveling gimmick since you can just beat the special stages to get the time stones anyway.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 16:31:56 2015 No.2218110 >>2218039 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isZJyXU7R5o Where Sonic 2 rewards skill with speed and punishes failure with slow, Sonic CD punishes speed with walls and interruptions, and rewards going slow by letting you progress at all.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:11:05 2015 No.2218151 >>2218045 Well, you can go to the past if you're better than in the special stages, but what's the point of the two futures?

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:14:09 2015 No.2218154 >>2218039 >That's not poor design For a Sonic game, Yes it is.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:17:59 2015 No.2218158

>>2218151
>but what's the point of the two futures?
It's just good ending vs. bad ending. If you're at the bad future then you fucked up and need to go back to the past and blow up the thing to make a good future.

>>2218154
The game started development immediately after Sonic 1 so your line of thinking is completely retarded. If Sonic Team decided to go more like Sonic CD and less like 2/3&K when transitioning to 3D then "it sucks as a Sonic game" would be arguments against 2/3&K.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:26:25 2015 No.2218168 >>2218158 Sonic 1 itself was literally about gaining momentum to go fast. Sonic CD being before 2 and 3 doesn't mean shit.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:28:53 2015 No.2218171 >>2218168 Literally never actually played Sonic 1.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:29:01 2015 No.2218172 >>2218158 Yeah but you know when you destroy the machine so why would you ever need to travel to the future apart from curiosity?

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:29:35 2015 No.2218173 >>2218171 So why are you arguing?

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:30:40 2015 No.2218174 >>2218172 Aside from mandatory Act 3 futures, just curiosity or accidentally hitting a future post. >>2218173 I thought "I know you are but what am I" stopped being clever in elementary school.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:33:35 2015 No.2218182 >>2218174 Huh? I genuinely thought you said you never played Sonic 1. I played Sonic 1 all the time as I kid. Half the game was speed, and half the game was platforming. But it was all about momentum, and didnt require exploration to gain it.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:38:27 2015 No.2218190

>>2218182
>Half the game was speed, and half the game was platforming
Not really, there was a lot more platforming than that. More speed was added with 2 and then refined further in 3&K. CD added more platforming, so it was really just a split focus. Sonic 1 is in between CD and 2 in terms of gameplay, not farther from CD as you seem to think it is.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:40:25 2015 No.2218193 >>2218190 >Not really, there was a lot more platforming than that. Yes really. If you couldn't speed through Green Hill, Spring Yard, and Starlight, then you're terrible at the game.

Anonymous Thu Feb 5 17:52:44 2015 No.2218207

>>2218193
Green Hill I'll give you because it's the first zone and designed to be easy on purpose, Starlight I'll give you since the zone is pretty much the only one that caters almost exclusively to pure momentum, but Spring Yard had plenty of places where trying to just speed through it could fuck you up, along with plenty of waiting for moving platforms segments.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 18:06:54 2015 No.2218219 >>2218002 Sounds like you need to git gud!

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 5 18:14:05 2015 No.2218220 >>2201003 That is a really impressive speedrun. Gotta go fast indeed.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 01:13:00 2015 No.2218854 >>2200445 I'd believe you if you had posted a picture of Sonic 2. Even then, I'm pretty sure that game has some issues.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 03:42:20 2015 No.2218949
File: 279 KB, 500x400, 1421882515094.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2205353
Because this is the dumbest argument ever: http://info.sonicretro.org/File:Sonic3_jp_manual_40_41.gif

Ha-I-Do-Ro-Shi-Te-I. Hydro City.

But feel free to pat your ten-year-old self on the back for being so clever, good for you.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 03:49:19 2015 No.2218952 File: 49 KB, 803x688, well meme'd.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2200445

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 03:50:38 2015 No.2218953 >>2218949 Excuse me sir, but Romaji is not at all an indication of how it's pronounced in English. They pronounce Leviathan as "Le-vee-uh-tun" there, but that's obviously not how we pronounce it.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 04:00:10 2015 No.2218959 >>2200445 I can. It's no Super Mario World.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 04:21:39 2015 No.2218978 [DELETED]

File: 137 KB, 1280x960, lates.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2218953
You'd be right if that wasn't literally the purpose of kana, translating English (Hydrocity) into Japanese, or to be more precise, the pronunciation itself. Transliteration, I believe it's called. Pic for reference, if I can't make this any clearer.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 04:24:20 2015 No.2218980
File: 137 KB, 1280x960, lates.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2218953
You'd be right if that wasn't literally the purpose of katakana, translating Latin characters into Japanese, or to be more precise, the pronunciation itself. Transliteration, I believe it's called. Pic for reference, if I can't make this any clearer.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 04:29:04 2015 No.2218983 zone 1 + 2 owned 3 and 4 sucked ice cap was wicked air base was ok

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 05:29:36 2015 No.2219009 >>2200451 This. Sonic 2 was a lot more fun to play overall. Only complaint of mine is that it didnt continue the 3 act system outside of Metropolis (i like 3 acts, which is why I consider not-retro Advance 3 as underrated).

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 05:35:29 2015 No.2219016 >>2219009 >liking 3 acts Nigger do you even pacing?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 06:33:27 2015 No.2219048 >>2219016 3 acts felt more rounded to me. And acts in Sonic 1 and 2 were short anyhow. I can understand not doing 3 acts in 3k, because each act was 4-6 minutes long, rather than 0.5-2 minutes long

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 06:38:53 2015 No.2219049

>>2219048
3 acts is too long to me. Metropolis Act 3 wasn't meant to be part of the level originally, rather as its own separate zone. By the time I get to act 3 I start thinking that I want the level to end, and that's not good. Most people had that reaction with Sonic 1.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 06:43:41 2015 No.2219053 >>2219049 three sonic 1 acts werent even the length of one S3k act though. I don't understand the problem.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 06:51:56 2015 No.2219060

>>2219053
The problem is there's 3 "Yay you beat the level!" screens before you're done with it. At a certain point it's like the game is telling you "...now do some more." At least with Sonic 3 there were enough level gimmicks and variance in design to where they didn't SEEM that long.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 07:02:13 2015 No.2219067

>>2219060
But I liked that sense of "yay i beat the level" after speeeding through a 1 minute long act. Sonic 3k acts could sometimes become a drag. This was especially the case with Carnival Night, and Sandopolis, where most of the obstacles were about padding the level.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 15:25:47 2015 No.2219505 >>2200768 mate i get lost in chemical plant zone it isn't just goan fast, you also need to navigate

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 15:34:23 2015 No.2219516

>>2200768
Chemical Plant Zone had one part where you went fast enough to shoot past the camera, but beyond that it was mainly platforming. It was intentionally the "wake up level" where you needed to navigate well after the easy intro stage of Emerald Hill, they just added a few go-fast segments as breathers. Spring Yard and Hydrocity took the same approach: platforming with the occasional go-fast breather.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 15:40:04 2015 No.2219521
File: 13 KB, 321x306, 1382155240834.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2219516
>basic pacing and player teaching any competent platformer would do
>marketing

I often say that /vr/ is much better than /v/. And then they say stupid shit like this.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 15:42:57 2015 No.2219524

>>2215146
>I can't remember the exact reason for this being an issue (is 4 palette changes on a screen an issue? would 2P with water just be super fucking slow?).

I think they just didn't bother with it. It should be possible, you just need some tighter timing with the raster interrupts so the game doesn't vomit on itself. But it would've been extra work and it was simpler to just not fucking bother because they had a deadline coming.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 15:43:46 2015 No.2219525 >>2219521 Marketing was taking the go-fast segments and using them in advertising to make the game as a whole seem faster than it normally is, you dumb illiterate mouthbreather. Nobody said pacing and platforming are marketing.

Anonymous Fri Feb 6 15:51:30 2015 No.2219535

>>2219516
>Chemical Plant Zone had one part where you went fast enough to shoot past the camera,

Actually there are about 5 parts where that happens, double zips boost you past camera scrolling speed and there were a bunch of long stretches after a few platforming sections

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 6 16:47:31 2015 No.2219618 Only real flaw I can think of is that some of the levels were just too long. Don't get me wrong, altogether I like how S3&K had longer levels, but sometimes (notably carnival and sandopolis) they just seemed to dragon on for-fucking-ever.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 07:11:09 2015 No.2220669 >>2217458 it was fun in palmtree panic, but after that it just got obnoxious, and the fact that there were points of no return and a limited amount of signposts just fucked it up imo

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 07:14:50 2015 No.2220672 >>2218949 where to stress tho

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 08:15:18 2015 No.2220793 File: 114 KB, 772x224, In case he doesn't get it.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2220672 No stress, syllables. Posting OC because this ends now.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 08:36:34 2015 No.2220828 >>2220793 It's "haidoroshiti". The last two signs are one kana "ti". You're right, though.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 08:42:11 2015 No.2220831 >>2220828 But that's how it appears in the manual. It's literally in the manual. Ice Cap is now Icecap.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 09:47:42 2015 No.2220898 >>2220793 u would spell velocity the same way tho, ve ro shi te i

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 10:00:22 2015 No.2220907 >>2220898 Maybe if it was typed ベロシッティー, or ブロシッティ. So you're wrong. Now if I may point out, >>2220793 Is directly from the Japanese Sonic 3 manual. Nice try though.

Anonymous Sat Feb 7 10:19:44 2015 No.2220927

>>2220898
No, that is not how the katakana was spelled.
Maybe if it was typed ベロシッティー (be ro shi te i), or ブロシッティ (bu ro shi te i). Notice that it's spelled ハイドローシッティ (ha i do ro shi te i) in the manual: http://info.sonicretro.org/File:Sonic3_jp_manual_40_41.gif

Nice try.

Anonymous Sat Feb 7 12:48:09 2015 No.2221071

>>2218949
I hope this is a fucking joke. I bet you're one of those faggots who says gattsu and gurifitsu as well.

moonspeak is very strict with how syllables and words may be formed, and isn't capable of differentiating between the difference stresses of hydro-city and hydrocity.

I bet the japanese pronunciation of sandopolis is something like "san-duro porisu" but that doesn't mean the pronunciation of sandopolis in english is "sando polis" it's still sand-OP-olis with emphasis on the second syllable.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 12:54:35 2015 No.2221079 >>2200445 I can't play this game. I know Sonic's character was meant to be fast, but holy shit, Sonic runs too fast. This game is unplayable for me.

Anonymous Sat Feb 7 13:05:55 2015 No.2221103
File: 266 KB, 520x627, UiBYJdc.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2221071
No I'm not, but thank you for the sentiment.

I'm aware there's no enunciation, because you don't enunciate syllables. They-are-all-syl-a-ble-s.

Oh, and there's no "aw" noise in the japanese language. And just to rub it in, サンドーポーリス(sa n do po ri su). Come on, say it out loud.

Dickhead.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 13:40:09 2015 No.2221145 >>2221071 >isn't capable of differentiating between the difference stresses of hydro-city and hydrocity. ハイドラシテイ

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 13:50:35 2015 No.2221167 >>2221145 See? This guy gets it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 7 17:32:38 2015 No.2221496 Sonic 3 Complete > Sonic 3 & Knuckles info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_3_Complete_(hack)

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